Alternate EV Spread for Empoleon in AC

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Aeron Ee1

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Running a Timid Nature with an EV Spread of 60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe will outrun +1 neutral based 100s. There are just about no hindrances of running Timid over Modest because you still OHKO everything you used to OHKO just that you need a little residual damage which you're gonna have anyway (most of them are from 100-100 to 95-100). Just surprised this isn't on-site yet since outspeeding Scarf Jirachi (who you still OHKO) and Scarf Flygon (especially) that skimp on speed might prove game breaking. It may not be suggested as the main EV spread but it should still at least get a mention.
 
Instead of saying that the power drop is insignificant, I would definitely post some calculations to prove that you don't miss out on any KOs. So, unless the power drop does end up being significant, this seems like a good idea I guess. However, you might also want to mention that with extra speed that Timid nature gives you, you get to outspeed Timid max speed Scarf Rotom-A which is usually used to revenge kill Empoleon after an Agility.
 
I was thinking it would say something like what is says on Lucario's analysis:

"Whether you choose an Modest (Adamant) or Timid (Jolly) nature depends on your team. Modest (Adamant) gets important OHKOs against Jirachi, Celebi and Shaymin (Bronzong and Skarmory), but a Timid (Jolly) nature allows Empoleon (Lucario) to outspeed important Scarf-ers such as positive natured Rotom-A, Heracross and Offensive Suicune that got Trick-ed a Scarf as well as neutral natured Flygon and Jirachi (Jolly Gyarados, Timid Suicune, and Timid Rotom-A)."
All of Which can potentially end your sweep.

Here are the calcs anyway though:

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 252/0 Rotom-A
96.7% - 113.8%

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 4/0 Flygon
123.9% - 145.8%

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 4/0 Heracross
107.6% - 126.9%

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 252/0 Machamp
93.2% - 109.9%

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 216/56 Swampert
80.8% - 95.8%

+1 Timid Grass Knot at 136/0 Starmie
90.8% - 107.1%

So yeah, all of them will still die to your triple boosted Surfs after a switch-in to Stealth Rocks or something... Grass Knot may miss the OHKO on 252/0 Starmie even with Stealth Rocks however.

You also STILL 2HKO:

252/0 Suicune with Grass Knot
156/0 Gyarados with grass Knot

A little mention of the importance of Stealth Rocks when running Timid may need to be put in as well.The very slight added bulk can also help in a few places though I have yet to feel it tbh.. You could also just run max speed to outpace Jolly 252 EVs Breloom before an Agility. Basically what I'm trying to say is that Timid at least deserves a mention SOMEWHERE in Empoleon's entire analysis.

The loss in power affects things such as:

+1 Timid Torrent Surf at 4/0 Jirachi
91.2% - 107.3% (no OHKO even with a switchin to Stealth Rocks)
+1 Timid Ice Beam at 0/4 Shaymin
80.9% - 95.6% (Lose the guaranteed OHKO with Stealth Rocks, still kill him after a turn of Life Orb though so at least its a tie =\)
+1 Timid Ice Beam at 252/0 Celebi
68.8% - 81.2% (lose the small chance to OHKO with stealth rocks completely)
+1 Timid Ice Beam at 156/0 Gyarados
37.3% - 44.3% (small chance to miss the 2hko)
 
Aeron Ee1 said:
252/0 Suicune
101.5% - 120.7% (A full powered Grass Knot followed by one to +1 SpD factoring in 1 turn of Lefties)
Click to expand...

i dont know where you got that because suicune takes 43.1% - 51% from the timid set. which is not a garunteed 2HKO, whereas the modest set does 47.5% - 55.9%, which is a higher chance of a 2HKO. (like 85%+ or something im too lazy to do the math)
 
(64.4% -> 75.7%) + (43.1% -> 51%) =
(107.5% -> 126.7%) - (6% leftovers recovery) =
101.5% -> 126.75%

=.=
Don't tell me you're switching this into Suicune? Cuz' it would go something like this, even if it is Modest:

Switch in
Suicune used Calm Mind
----
Empoleon used Grass Knot
Suicune used Calm Mind
-----
Empoleon used Grass Knot
Suicune used Rest
...
Suicune gets +6/+6 and sweeps your team...

you don't deserve to use the same avatar as RaikouLover =.=

EDIT: Sorry, get really angry at these kind of posts...
EDIT2: WOOPS!
 
He is raikoulover....

The really annoying thing about Empoleon is that it will never be fast enough to outrun +Spe scarf base 100s, and from my experiences a lot of people run Jolly on Jirachi and Flygon to at worst tie with opposing variants. While this spread is very helpful for teams that run scarf Rotom and Adamant 100 scarfers, it still fails against Jolly versions. Still worth a mention I feel.
 
Even with Salamence gone, I am still running Jolly on my Scarf Jirachi and Scarf Flygon. I suppose outrunning Scarf Rotom is pretty cool, but outside of that, the Timid set does not really pose any other benefits, except outrunning random mons before the Agility.
 
Like a few people have already said, most users opt for +Spe on their Choice Scarf base 100's. That being said, I still wouldn't mind seeing a Timid option in AC just for Scarf Rotom, who is becoming more and more popular.

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