Arcanine

Status
Not open for further replies.

tondas

This hennessy is gonna be the death of me
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus

[OVERVIEW]

  • Arcanine struggles to find a place in the underused metagame.
  • While Arcanine has some appealing factors such as a useful ability in Intimidate, access to Will-O-Wisp and recovery in Morning Sun, it's often hard to justify using over Moltres as a defensive Fire-type, which sports a better typing, a more consistent form of recovery, and higher overall stats.
  • Despite Arcanine's ability to check popular threats such as Scizor and Serperior, a weakness to Stealth Rock means it usually can't reliably pivot into these attackers. Other pokemon such as Fightinium Z Swords Dance Cobalion and Choice Band Infernape can simply power through Arcanine, even after Intimidate.
  • Furthermore, its general passiveness makes Arcanine complete setup fodder to Pokemon such as Gliscor, Latias and Togekiss, which all take little from its attacks and easily beat it in return.
  • Morning Sun's low PP and decreased health withdrawal by 25% in sand makes this a rather inconsistent form of recovery, further worsening its matchup versus teams with Hippowdon.
  • Lastly, Arcanine is completely outclassed by Infernape, Moltres, Chandelure, and Volcanion as an offensive Fire-type due to their superior offensive stats and typing, relegating Arcanine's role strictly to a defensive pivot.

[SET]
name: Defensive Pupper
move 1: Flare Blitz
move 2: Toxic / Wild Charge
move 3: Will-O-Wisp
move 4: Morning Sun
item: Leftovers / Rocky Helmet
ability: Intimidate
nature: Impish
evs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

  • Flare Blitz is Arcanine's best STAB attack, which can do considerable damage even without investment courtesy of Arcanine's decent natural Attack. However, its hefty recoil can make using this move risky.
  • Toxic cripples bulky switch-ins such as Mega Slowbro and Hippowdon by putting them on a timer.
  • Alternatively, Wild Charge can be used to 2HKO Water-type Pokemon including Mantine and Primarina, which do not appreciate taking an Electric-type move from the physical side.
  • Will-O-Wisp burns and cripples physical attackers, making Pokemon like Krookodile and Mega Aerodactyl think twice about directly switching in.
  • Morning Sun provides Arcanine with a source of HP recovery, keeping it healthy throughout the match, but its watered down usefulness under sand should be taken into account.
Set Details
========

  • 248 HP and 244 Defense EVs with an Impish nature allows Arcanine to check physical attackers as best as possible in tandem with Intimidate, in addition to minimizing damage taken from Stealth Rock and maximizing health recovered from Leftovers.
  • 16 Speed EVs lets Arcanine outpace Adamant Scizor, allowing it to attack Scizor before it can pivot out with U-Turn.
  • Leftovers provides Arcanine with residual recovery while also alleviating its weakness to entry hazards and the recoil taken from its attacks.
  • Rocky Helmet is an alternative option that punishes users of U-Turn such as Scizor and Infernape.
  • Intimidate lowers the foe's Attack stat upon switching Arcanine in, giving it the functionality of a pivot versus physical attackers.

Usage Tips
========

  • It's important to assess Arcanine's weakness to Stealth Rock before switching in, as losing 25% of its health decreases its time on the field considerably. Keeping its HP relatively high strengthens its ability to function as a check to physical attackers.
  • Arcanine can make use of Intimidate to pivot into attackers such as Choice Locked Scizor and Alolan Muk to weaken their attacking power. This can be used as an opportunity to fire off a Flare Blitz, cripple an opposing Pokemon with a status move, or heal off damage taken with Morning Sun.
  • Morning Sun, not only being ineffective under sand, has a low PP count of 8, meaning Arcanine's chances of recovery are limited. Using this move only when necessary such as predicting an opponent to switch out is key, as losing access to Morning Sun is detrimental to Arcanine's survival.

Team Options
========

  • The removal of entry hazards is necessary, as Arcanine's weakness to all forms of hazards hinder its ability to be a consistent check to physical attackers. Users of Defog such as Latias and Mantine keep entry hazards off the field; the former appreciates Arcanine being able to dispatch Pokemon like Scizor.
  • Powerful Electric- and Grass-type Pokemon such as Mega Manectric and Serperior threaten the numerous Water-types that can beat Arcanine like Suicune, Alomomola, and Volcanion. Mega Manectric can function as an additional pivot, softening physical attackers with its own Intimidate, and can use Hidden Power Ice to target Pokemon like Gliscor.
  • Arcanine is often setup bait to bulky setup sweepers like Gliscor, Latias, and Togekiss, so powerful answers to these threats such as Gengar, Mega Altaria, and Kyurem can be used to power through them, as their removal enhances Arcanine's performance.
  • Specially defensive walls such as Blissey and Sylveon appreciate Arcanine's ability to check physical attackers, particularly those who are threatening to these walls like Breloom and Scizor. In return, these special walls can sponge powerful special attacks directed at Arcanine, or use Heal Bell to cure Arcanine of any troubling status conditions.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

  • Arcanine can attempt to run an offensive Life Orb set putting its other attacks into use like Close Combat and Extreme Speed. However, this competes heavily with Pokemon like Infernape, Moltres, and Mega Houndoom, which boast better offensive stats and typing, allowing them to usually perform an offensive role far better. Even uncommon choices like Entei and Darmanitan offer more as an offensive Fire-type thanks to access to Sacred Fire and Sheer Force, respectively.
  • Hidden Power Ice or Grass can be utilized to lure and 2HKO Gliscor or Swampert. Unfortunately, Arcanine has a hard time fitting these moves onto a set, given the utility provided by its other moves.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ground-Types**: Pokemon such as Gliscor, Nidoking, and Krookodile outspeed and hit Arcanine hard with their respective Ground-type moves. It should be noted that Gliscor is undoubtedly the greatest counter to Arcanine, as it's immune to both of Arcanine's status moves thanks to Poison Heal, takes pathetic amounts of damage from Flare Blitz, and threatens to either set up with Swords Dance, or cut off Arcanine's access to recovery with Taunt. Hippowdon is another notable example, as Sand Stream reduces Morning Sun's recovery and negates Leftovers recovery, but Hippowdon itself does not appreciate being afflicted with status.

**Water-Types**: Arcanine can't do much to Pokemon such as Suicune, Mega Slowbro and Alomomola besides prolonging their setup time with Toxic, and these Pokemon in return can use Arcanine as an opportunity to use either Calm Mind or Wish.

**Rock-Types**: Mega Aerodactyl, Terrakion and Nihilego all pressure Arcanine with their super-effective Rock-type attacks, while Pokemon like Nihilego can set up Stealth Rock to take advantage of Arcanine switching out.

**Residual Damage**: A weakness to all forms of entry hazards, particularly Stealth Rock, wears down Arcanine quickly, often forcing it to use Morning Sun in crucial situations. Toxic is another threatening prospect for Arcanine, as it puts it on a timer and nullifies the residual recovery provided by Leftovers.

**Special Attackers**: Arcanine's Special Defense without any investment is decidedly average, giving Specially offensive attackers such as Hydreigon, Chandelure and Latias leeway; these Pokemon are also usually free to switch into Arcanine due to its general passiveness.
 
Last edited:

teachable

Banned deucer.
hi just some stuff I noticed x3, don't implement anything unless QC says to.
[OVERVIEW]
  • Arcanine struggles to find a place in the underused metagame. - make this harsher imo, give this shit to RU.
  • Mention Flame Body on Moltres
  • Mention Z Move Serp if you want, blows past you lol.
[SET]
IMO run 56 Speed Evs so you can last ditch toxic a Modest Volcanion
[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
  • Mention Toxic crippling Swampert.
Set Details
========
good
Usage Tips
========
  • mention Swampert with water types.
Team Options
========

  • Mention Latias liking that you also check Muk-Alola.
  • Remove Breloom

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

  • Mention Fire Blast/Special Set.


enjoy :333
 

A Cake Wearing A Hat

moist and crusty
is a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Battle Simulator Moderatoris a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnus
Random Battle Lead
amcheck, idc whether or not you implement this

-Consider adding Flamethrower as either a moves mention or a second slash to Flare Blitz; it does very noticeably less than Flare Blitz (e.g. failing to OHKO cobalion/serperior), but it lets Arcanine still OHKO scizor without its only attacks being recoil-inducing as a defensive pkmn, and if you're using arcanine you're using it specifically to beat scizor anyway, so it's definitely a viable option.

-Mention in overview that even though arcanine *can* theoretically switch into serp once it does kinda hard lose when trying to switch in when rocks are up either if the serp is meadow plate/normz or if arcanine has even a slight amount of chip; 252 SpA Contrary Serperior Leaf Storm over 2 turns vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Arcanine: 266-314 (69.4 - 81.9%); in other words, mention that arcanine can't actually reliably check serperior for a rather wide variety of reasons.

-To add onto Teachable's point about the spread, 60 Speed evs would let you outspeed and therefore somewhat more adequately handle Bewear, although it still does a lot a lot to you w rocks up. If anything, I'd put this as a set details mention with 16 speed remaining as the primary set.

-Arcanine can't really pivot in on or check much of anything aside from like Scizor, alomuk (which is walled by every fat mon anyway and arcanine hates being poisoned and having its item removed), non-fightinium Cobalion sometimes, and Tsareena. I wouldn't describe it as a check to or something that can pivot in on physical attackers in general because it really isn't. Either be more specific by replacing each instance of "check physical attackers" and "pivot into physical attackers" with the few examples of mons arcanine actually does check and/or pivot into, or reword entirely

-In team options, mention mons that struggle against scizor, because that's the only reason arcanine should really be used rn. Mega Altaria is a great one because it can also defog (with defog sets) and check certain fat waters like cune (with facade sets) + malt as a whole can check hydre and to an extent some other dragons which is really appreciated bc the best arc can do is toxic them. Togekiss and Mega Aero also pretty nifty partners as well; toge can break fat mons and heal bell sets can check mons like hippo and heal toxic off arc whereas mega aero can p handily answer gliscor thanks to ice fang, though maero compounds weakness to sr+pert.

-Mention spinners like pl8 tsar as well, which also doubles as a method to offensively pressure (note to whoever on the qc team is looking at this: i know it can't switch into scald and this is why i didn't say check) waters like pert and check fat grounds like hippo
 

tondas

This hennessy is gonna be the death of me
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
I'm gonna put this back in WIP for a couple days so I can redo this in wake of the drastic shift. I'm also largely unsatisfied with the effort I put into this so I'll try to optimize this to the best of my ability.
 
Don't know if it has already been stated but I wanted to let you know that you should remove any mentions of Serperior and Gliscor as they rose to OU last tier update :)
 

Eyan

sleep is the cousin of death
is a Top Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Hi, is this done? If so, do change the tag to Quality Control. I still see some outdated references, though, so do update it.
 
Last edited:

tondas

This hennessy is gonna be the death of me
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
i dont rlly feel like doing this, sorry to dissapoint you folks. someone else can take this up
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top