Battle Maison Discussion & Records

Wow, what a thread. Really takes me back to the Battle Tower days. These streaks and analyses are as impressive as ever.

A request to those who have gotten some of those higher streaks: do you think you could post QR codes for the Pokemon you used? I'd love to try out some of them for myself, but I don't have the dedication to RNG and train my own stuff anymore.
 
I was really looking forward to turskain hitting 7000, since I doubt most gamers have bothered to attempt or do that. That loss is extremely disappointing for its point in the streak.

Maybe have another go at the Trick Room randoms? You seemed to really enjoy that.

Tombstoner, using generated pokes via the exploit is not a wise subject to breach in this topic, especially in the context of streaks.
 
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Is it not? Well, I'll wait and see. Generation V Wi-Fi was all about Pokecheck which does effectively what the exploit does (though it did add to the 'Dex), and Battle Tower/Subway mons were easily downloadable. This thread's a ranking for how high a streak someone can get, which isn't just how good a team they can build, but also how they use it. Sharing QR codes would be analogous to posting an importable Showdown team.
 
The problem is that QR codes can and are used to generate illegal pokes, and because they don't have to pass legitimacy checks to be used in the Maison, it severely taints the team's credibility.

There's nothing stopping you from using a Flash Fire Entei with its Gen IV event moves (Extremespeed, Flare Blitz, etc.) The ability is unreleased until who knows when, but the game won't stop you from entering it. Granted, because its other ability is Pressure, anyone watching a replay would immediately notice the lack of Pressure's warning upon entry, and you'd be flagged for cheating regardless, but that was just an example.

Besides, it's already been said elsewhere that generated pokes aren't allowed when submitting a team/streak.
 
My team has fairly strong synergy. Feraligatr covers fire weakness of Scizor. Garchomp covers electric and fire weaknesses of Feraligatr and Scizor respectively. Scizor covers grass and ice/fairy weaknesses of Feraligatr and Garchomp, respectively. If I noticed my team struggling against one type of pokemon in particular, it would be water. I had no super effective moves for water pokemon, and DD Gyarados was particularly scary. Taking those down usually involved multi-boosting my own pokemon and hoping I could take it down before fainting.

Can any Maison pros suggest different teammates that may prove better alongside Feraligatr?

I look forward to seeing if anyone else can have success with Sheer Force Feraligatr. I can see moderate success in Super Singles, but it may be better in doubles or triples as a strong filler to a strong core.
Metagross learns Thunder Punch and has a Mega that is arguably better than Scizor's. Sadly, no SD, but still has Bullet Punch. I leave it to someone else to suggest the best moveset, though, as Zen Headbutt as a STAB leaves much to be desired - plus, I gotta run.
 
Metagross learns Thunder Punch and has a Mega that is arguably better than Scizor's. Sadly, no SD, but still has Bullet Punch. I leave it to someone else to suggest the best moveset, though, as Zen Headbutt as a STAB leaves much to be desired - plus, I gotta run.
MegaGross does have a bit of 5MSS. The set I've been using was Iron Head/Ice Punch/Thunder Punch/Bullet Punch, but I really want to squeeze Earthquake in there somewhere. Problem is BoltBeam is such good coverage, and Bullet Punch is extremely useful for revenging the turn you Mega up. If you have other options to deal with Fires/steels, you should be fine.
 

NoCheese

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While I think we should avoid opening the door to any sort of Pokemon generation hijinks potential with QR codes, it's always nice to see an older name returning. Welcome back, Tombstoner!

Also, I've updated the leaderboard through here (felt sad removing the * from turskain's streak), so please let me know if there are any errors or omissions.
 

turskain

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For a proper wrap-up: 6840 wins in Super Triples.

Lucario/Greninja for Triples (#0001 - #3303)
Greninja/Charizard for Triples V4 (#3304 - #3820)
Mega Gardevoir with Triple Fake Out (#3821 - #4540)

Greninja/Charizard for Triples V5/V6 (#4541 - #4777)
Mega Gardevoir with Triple Fake Out V2 (#4778 - #5000)

Greninja/Charizard for Triples V6 (#5001 - #5060)
Lucario/Greninja for Triples (#5061 - #5120)
Greninja/Charizard for Triples V6 (#5121 - #5200)
Mega Gardevoir with Triple Fake Out V2 (#5201 - #5300)
Lucario/Greninja for Triples (final) (#5301 - #6841)

Total win counts:
4903 wins using Lucario/Greninja for Triples
894 wins using Greninja/Charizard for Triples
1043 wins using Mega Gardevoir with Triple Fake Out
Battle video: #1665 - LX8W-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8T vs. Alakazam/Trevenant/Dusknoir/Mismagius/Claydol/Spiritomb

Nearly lost battle against Anastasia.



Battle video: #3186 - N/A

Video no longer up due to the battle video upload limit, but the write-up details it.



Battle video: #3805 - LJRW-WWWW-WWWA-CX3M vs. Latias/Regigigas/Terrakion/Raikou/Zapdos/Thundurus



Battle video: #4694 - G99G-WWWW-WWWY-47UC vs. Registeel/Landorus/Latias/Entei/Heatran/Terrakion

Nearly lost battle with Greninja/Charizard for Triples.



Battle video: #5723 - RM7G-WWWW-WWX6-K3FR vs. Landorus/Moltres/Articuno/Regigigas/Zapdos/Latios

Moltres used Tailwind. Battle ends in Garchomp facing off versus Zapdos2 one-on-one, and missing a lethal hit with Bright Powder - thankfully, no further hax occurred.



Battle video: #5800 - DMXG-WWWW-WWX6-K3CB vs. Garchomp/Ferrothorn/Tyranitar/Gliscor/Dugtrio/Excadrill

Rasmus sends out Garchomp3 with Sand Veil in the right-side position. Misplay on Turn 1 against Ferrothorn1. Ends up being one Sand Veil miss away from losing. "Regular/hidden ability ratio being 2/1 on 2-abilitiers sucks."



Battle video: #6727 - GNYW-WWWW-WWXE-YDBE vs. Articuno/Entei/Regice/Zapdos/Terrakion/Cresselia
Write-up



Battle video: #6841 - 9WYW-WWWW-WWXG-HSB6 vs. Zapdos/Virizion/Landorus/Tornadus/Latios/Entei

The loss.



This is seven battle videos; the other three that are still up are the losses of my best streaks in other modes.
AI trainer is a Set1-2 Veteran.





Turn 1

Switch Rotom-W for Garchomp
Lucario Protect
Landorus Focus Blast Greninja - miss
Greninja Ice Beam Landorus - KO
Virizion Leaf Blade Greninja - 60%
Zapdos Double Team

AI sent out Tornadus in the right-side position






Turn 2

Switch Lucario for Talonflame
Greninja Ice Beam Tornadus - 40% + freeze, Yache activates
Virizion Leaf Blade Greninja - KO
Garchomp Dragon Claw Tornadus - KO
Zapdos Heat Wave - Garchomp burnt

I send out Rotom-W to replace Greninja in the right-side position
AI sends out Latios to replace Tornadus in the right-side position






Turn 3

Garchomp Protect
Talonflame Brave Bird Virizion - KO
Latios Draco Meteor Garchomp - Protect
Rotom-W Volt Switch Latios - bring in Lucario
Zapdos Double Team

AI sends out Entei to replace Virizion in the center






Turn 4

Switch Garchomp for Scizor
Brave Bird Entei
Aura Sphere Entei - survives with 5%
Latios Draco Meteor Scizor
Entei Flamethrower Lucario - KO
Zapdos Charge Beam Talonflame - KO, SAtk increased

Turn 5-10
The loss is all but guaranteed; Rotom-W's odds of beating Zapdos are extremely low, and would require a Thunderbolt hit followed by a crit, which doesn't happen.

This battle was simple, short, and not worth a full warstory. The following factors led to the nearly automatic loss:

1. Garchomp getting burnt by Heat Wave on Turn 2. +0 Heat Wave does not KO Lucario and it is not a particularly likely move from Zapdos2; maybe 50-50 between it and Double Team.

2. Latios2 as the AI's fifth Pokémon sent out at the end of Turn 2. Talonflame/Garchomp/Rotom-W is a very strong field with cross-field Brave Bird, free Earthquake usage, and even the option to use DisQuake, with Rotom-W knocking out Suicune and Articuno that would threaten Garchomp; with Virizion out of the pool due to it appearing already and the trainer being Set1-2 (Specs Latis are not possible), there is no Pokémon a Veteran could send out that would threaten Rotom-W in a big way. The only Pokémon in the pool that walls Rotom-W are Latios and Latias; in this situation, the Lax Incense-carrying Set1 would have been a much better match-up and likely avoided the loss. Regice would also be a poor match-up, but it would also have been a better MU than Latios2 in this situation.

Sending out Rotom-W on this turn could be counted as a mistake with knowledge of the AI's team - but in 95% of cases, sending out Rotom-W to run Talonflame/Garchomp/Rotom-W is the best option. All in all, with Set1-2 Veterans running 40 sets, the probability of either Latios2 or Latias2 being on its team was slightly below 2/40 - discounting Pokémon that were already sent out and conflicting items, maybe around 2/30. Not that unreasonable.

3. Entei2 as the AI's last Pokémon. Talonflame and Lucario together can KO a very large number of enemies outright; these include Moltres (127/128 chance to KO), Heatran, Entei1, Musketeers - most Pokémon that could appear in this situation that would have a guaranteed KO on Lucario. Landorus2 had already been shown, so Scarf sets were not possible - the only Pokémon that outspeeds the Talonflame + Lucario murder team is Raikou, which would target Talonflame over Lucario.

There was exactly one set in the pool that could have gotten the non-crit OHKO on Lucario on Turn 4 - which is Entei2. Everything else either does not have a chance to KO, or is KO'd by Talonflame and Lucario focusing it before they move, or is Protect baited by Talonflame. The appearance of this perfect set as the last Pokémon was maybe around a 1/25 probability with 5 species and several item conflicts ruled out.

252 SpA Adaptability Mega Lucario Aura Sphere vs. 170 HP / 170 SpD Entei: 102-120 (48.3 - 56.8%)
252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 170 HP / 170+ Def Entei: 87-103 (41.2 - 48.8%)

0 SpA Entei Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Lucario: 126-150 (86.8 - 103.4%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

Entei2 does not always use Flamethrower on Lucario; I'd estimate Flamethrower versus Calm Mind/Will-O-Wisp is around 50/50, not unlike Zapdos2's odds of using Heat Wave. There is also a chance for CH and burn on the Flamethrower, so the chance to KO is higher; assuming Flamethrower is used around 50% of the time and including the chance that Aura Sphere + Brave Bird KOs it outright (88.8 - 104.3% combined damage), I'd wager the probability of Lucario dying on this turn is around 15% - if the Entei is Set1 instead, it would be KO'd outright.

If the fifth Pokémon had been anything other than Lati@s2, Garchomp could attack Entei for a guaranteed KO on Set2. The fast Latios sets are the only Veteran Pokémon that outspeed and OHKO Garchomp; anything else than this in the slot, and Entei is triple targeted without fail.



So what were the odds? Zapdos2 and Landorus2 are bad lead MUs. Virizion combined with other threats Lucario out, which forces switching and unavoidably gives Zapdos2 space - it also needs to be KO'd ASAP as it has Stone Edge for Talonflame and Leaf Blade for Rotom-W (which does not OHKO). Tornadus as the 4th was a favorable Pokémon for me. Lati@s2 and Entei2 as the last two Pokémon were the ideal sets for the AI in that situation - if either of them was Set1, I am likely to win barring Lax Incense hax from Lati@s1. If either of them is any other species, I win. If the Heat Wave burn didn't happen, I can prioritize killing Latios and play for a Garchomp endgame against Zapdos with a high likelihood of winning. If Flamethrower was not used on Lucario or it survived the attack, I can use Nasty Plot while the opposite Zapdos pounds at Rotom-W/Garchomp/Scizor and 2HKOs Zapdos2 at +4 with Aura Sphere from across the field.

While the lead MU was less bad than Regice4, the back-up matchups were really bad. Contrast #3186, which had an extremely bad lead match-up and a horrible 4th Pokémon, but had Cobalion and Raikou as favorable last Pokémon that allowed a comeback; in this battle, the lead match-up was not as bad (but still a lot worse than average) and the last two Pokémon were the worst match-ups possible - with a 10% Heat Wave burn and ~15% Lucario death on top to prevent the Garchomp/Lucario comeback.



Overall, I'm satisfied with this loss. I played well for the brief duration of the battle - better than in the other close battles I've posted about that would have required much less hax against me to cause a loss. A possible winning play may have been Protecting on Lucario on Turn 4 against Flamethrower; if Entei2 used Calm Mind instead or it was Entei1, it would have been worse.
 
Okay I'm giving the ORAS Maison a go now. Initially I was waiting to see if they'd release the Frontier but it seems like that's not happening so let's get on with it. I've been playing VGC15 a bit over on Showdown and that leads to my new "core" in this team (calling it a core is a bit of a stretch). Anyway (for Super Doubles):

Gardevoir
Trace -> Pixilate @ Gardevoirite
Modest
4HP/ 252SpAtk / 252 Speed
-Hyper Voice
-Psyshock
-Shadow Ball
-Protect

Arcanine
Intimidate @ Leftovers
Impish
248HP/ 250Def/ 8SpDef
-Will-o-Wisp
-Extreme Speed
-Helping Hand
-Protect

Those are the two I wanted to work with. The other two are my Aegislash and Togekiss from earlier but I'm looking to replace them. I was thinking along the lines of a Dragon (Hydreigon?) and a Steel type (preferably not Aegislash I'm sick of him) becuase FAIRY/FIRE/DRAGON/STEEL is some vicious defensive and offensive synergy. That said this is the first time I'm really exploring doubles (for XY, I just copied a prominent team) and I don't know the biggest threats in the ORAS Maison (is that Tyrantrum still a thing?) and if I could cover some prominent threats instead of my type synergy thats probably more important, so let me know.
 
Okay I'm giving the ORAS Maison a go now. Initially I was waiting to see if they'd release the Frontier but it seems like that's not happening so let's get on with it. I've been playing VGC15 a bit over on Showdown and that leads to my new "core" in this team (calling it a core is a bit of a stretch). Anyway (for Super Doubles):

Gardevoir
Trace -> Pixilate @ Gardevoirite
Modest
4HP/ 252SpAtk / 252 Speed
-Hyper Voice
-Psyshock
-Shadow Ball
-Protect

Arcanine
Intimidate @ Leftovers
Impish
248HP/ 250Def/ 8SpDef
-Will-o-Wisp
-Extreme Speed
-Helping Hand
-Protect

Those are the two I wanted to work with. The other two are my Aegislash and Togekiss from earlier but I'm looking to replace them. I was thinking along the lines of a Dragon (Hydreigon?) and a Steel type (preferably not Aegislash I'm sick of him) becuase FAIRY/FIRE/DRAGON/STEEL is some vicious defensive and offensive synergy. That said this is the first time I'm really exploring doubles (for XY, I just copied a prominent team) and I don't know the biggest threats in the ORAS Maison (is that Tyrantrum still a thing?) and if I could cover some prominent threats instead of my type synergy thats probably more important, so let me know.
Your arcanine won't be covering the steels with that moveset though. Overheat or flamethrower over hh?
 

cant say

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Why would you get rid of Helping Hand? That + Hyper Voice is the whole idea (I'm guessing). I would drop Will-o-wisp since it's too innaccurate, and doesn't make sense when you want to just kill things as quick as possible with Hyper Voice, so the benefit of burning the opponent is mostly moot...
 
Your arcanine won't be covering the steels with that moveset though. Overheat or flamethrower over hh?
Why would you get rid of Helping Hand? That + Hyper Voice is the whole idea (I'm guessing). I would drop Will-o-wisp since it's too innaccurate, and doesn't make sense when you want to just kill things as quick as possible with Hyper Voice, so the benefit of burning the opponent is mostly moot...
It's a couple of things. The worst thing about MegaVoir is her Defence is terrible, hence Arcanine Intimidate and Will-o-Wisp. I've seen the Helping Hand Hyper Voice OHKO some of the steels so far and things like Bronzong and Metagross ( don't know if hes in the Maison just my experience from Showdown) get OHKO'ed by Shadow Ball. Is there a specific threat I should be considering with Flamethrower cos there was a Defiant something that probably wouldve sweeped me if I didn't burn it. That's also one reason I was thinking Hydreigon as a Steel check, with Flamethrower/Earth Power/Dark Pulse/Dragon Pulse.
 

NoCheese

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Helping Hand certainly can be effective. But relying on an 85% accurate WoW to patch Gardevoir's defenses just isn't going to fly over the course of a long streak. So I'm with cant say on this and definitely support replacing it, preferably with a strong 100% accurate STAB move. Also note that you'll want to be sure that your team can handle Soundproof Wide Guard Bastiodon4.
 
Sounds like a plan. At the moment I've switched out Aegislash and Togekiss for a Scizor and Hydreigon, becuase I've hit 40 streak and I need Earth Power on my Hydreigon to handle the incoming Heatran army.
 

The Dutch Plumberjack

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If it's still relevant, I'd like to submit my contribution to the recent discussion about lead Greninja in Super Singles.


#811: 76CW-WWWW-WWXH-7FK4
I'm a bit unsure how to feel about this one. I lost in a rather dumb way, because of a suboptimal play in a really tight spot + a Heat Wave burn and Toxic miss on that exact same turn - I'm the one to blame if my plan around one of my team's top threats isn't sound, though. On the other hand, this number is just... crazy, nothing less. When I first thought up this team, I wasn't sure how good it was; using lead Ninja hadn't resulted in batshit insane streaks thus far - the longest one being atsync's impressive and remarkably early 302 win streak with Specs Greninja, Ferrothorn, and Dragonite - and while it looked structurally sound, I could easily come up a lot of scenarios where I'd at least be backed into a corner, and as I went along it never exuded that same aura of seeming invincibility that I noticed in team Clockwork Angels. I expected it would make it to 50 easily, 100 shouldn't have been a problem either, 200 was possible, maybe even beating my X record of 330 (with MegaKhan/Aegislash/Dragonite) if I lucked out - but 810 just doesn't make any sense at all, lol. The team is the same one that I posted in my five trophy post - I promised I'd go into more detail if I managed to net a proper streak with it, and I guess I did.


Rael (Greninja) @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
Nature: Timid
IVs: 31/5-6/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot
-Dark Pulse


Harlequin (Scizor) @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 31/31/31/24-25/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe
-Bullet Punch
-Bug Bite
-Swords Dance
-Roost


Little Nicky (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Nature: Careful
IVs: 31/31/31/10-11/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Atk / 36 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
-Substitute
-Protect
-Earthquake
-Toxic

The genesis of this team actually sort of stems from resentment towards my XY singles streak, heh. When I first started playing the XY maison, with barely any track record in battle facilities, I naturally started with singles because I knew squat about the other formats, but it proved to be a tough nut to crack. It probably makes sense that I wanted to try Pokemon I liked at first (seemingly viable ones of course lol, Raichu is one of my old favourites but it didn't remotely cross my mind to try him - well actually he can function as a poor man's Mega Manectric in team Clockwork Angels, but that's not what this post is about) so the first hopefully legit team I thought up consisted of physical attacker EBelt (cause fuk recoil) Infernape / special attacker and revenge killer Sash Zam / wall/pivot Ferrothorn... it worked like I had in mind, but it was just so damn weak and lost at 37 to Volcarona4 (heh).. Anyway, anybody who's ever been stuck in the first ten/twenty battles knows just how haxxy and cheap those sets are, so by then I had gotten tired of singles - fortunately it was around then that I found a youtube vid of a Greninja/Mega Blaziken lead in doubles, so now I had a starting point for that format and tried that one (rather more successfully, although I'm still hoping to one day find the appropriate backups for those two lol), leaving singles behind for then. However, I naturally returned after winning the doubles and triples trophy (rotations and multi seemed even more daunting), turning to a lead with a better track record than Infernape in Cloyster. A thrown together team of Cloyster / WoW/Fake Out absorber Chandelure / powder/paralysis absorber Mega Venusaur brought me to battle 49, where I lost due to a slightly unfortunate matchup and horrible chokes. Then I had had enough, thought 'fine if this how you like it meet a pile of broken shit', "built" a team of Mega Kangaskhan / Aegislash / Dragonite (i.e. literally just the three most powerful singles mons), got the trophy, and eventually brought that streak to 330. However, as I've stated several times in my posts regarding that team, if that's how you come up with a team, that can't help but leave a bitter taste in my mouth. The most enjoyable streaks are obviously those where you like the mons/team (nah), the team is fun to play with (that it actually was sort of, but w/e, not amazing), and easily the most important bit: where you have an actual story to tell about the team's genesis (yeah lol right).

So it was around November that I started thinking about what I wanted to use in the ORAS singles maison. The problem with singles goodstuffs teams is that the pool of viable pokemon is rather narrow (much more narrow than in doubles/triples at the very least), but at least there were a few Pokemon that I really liked and certainly felt like trying out: that one badass bug that sets up to +6 all over more than half of the maison and I had already used a bit on Platinum in Suizomence... Scizor... the modern Starmie, which had played an integral part in my extremely enjoyable doubles and triples teams but was supposedly also terrific in singles... Greninja... and last but not least, the backbone of the most successful super singles goodstuffs team in Jumpman's Kangliscune as well as one of my very favourites altogether ever since it was introduced... Gliscor. Anyway, if you want to build a good singles team you have to have a powerful lead as well as two backups that can switch in on what threatens him, so I thought up a team of Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor. As for Gliscor, with his Ground typing he can naturally switch in on Thunder Waves, one of the status conditions that cripple lead sweepers. The other one is obviously burns, so I thought it would be fun to use a lead sweeper immune to burns in Mega Charizard X. With his juggling with defensive typings (and his initial Earthquake immunity), you basically only need something that can beat users of strong Rock-type moves such as CB Aerodactyl... Suicune. However, I shelved them both: Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor looked a bit too inconsistent because it sort of lacked a backbone, not to mention that sort of thing/lead DNite has kinda been done to death - XZard/Suicune/Gliscor actually looked kinda cool for the novelty of using Charizard X, but it was basically an inferior Kangliscune, not to mention that Hurrrnadus would become a huge pain in the ass because XZard doesn't draw in Focus Blast. It probably would have been manageable still, but whatever. When contemplating those teams, I did notice Greninja/Mega Scizor's excellent defensive synergy, with MegaZor switching in on Bug/Grass/Fairy/generally strong physical attacks and Greninja covering Fire. That did leave Electric and Fighting, which are naturally covered by... Gliscor. Sure, why the fuck not. It sounded in theory like those three would work just fine on a team, so I set out to fill in some more specifics. The first question was obviously 'Greninja/MegaZor: to lead or not to lead?' I sort of liked the idea of a lead Scizor and it has already been done successfully in Aircraft Cemetery's 480 win streak with MegaZor/Garchomp/Azumarill; however, what I liked even more was Mega Scizor's Roost shenanigans on more than half of the maison, and I felt he wouldn't be able to perform those optimally in the lead position, especially when the opposing lead is called Magnet Pull Magnezone, lol. The decisive argument in lead Greninja's favour was this:
161 | Tyrantrum4 | Adamant | Choice Band | Crunch | Dragon Claw | Earthquake | Head Smash | Atk/Spd
... yeah, that exact same thing why I vehemently swear by Adamant Earthquake for lead Kangaskhan (unless you're that terrified of Mismagius4 I guess -definitely not underestimating that one though if it comes off like that- because that's really the only one where Crunch is the one attack you need, but w/e). Imo every goodstuffs singles team must have either a switch-in to this monster (good luck with that ehehe) or a lead that beats it. The one 'ideal scenario' for this team was a game I theorymonned against Nita. She'd lead off with Landorus, so Greninja would naturally switch to Gliscor - then Gliscor would SubProtect away all those measly five Focus Blast PP, and then Scizor would switch in and set up three Swords Dances as Landorus Struggled to death and proceed to sweep her entire team. Needless to say I was pleased as punch when that exact scenario occurred: MYBQ-WWWW-WWX5-3KTR (re. the different Scizor, that's a shiny one I RNG-bred on Soul Silver because a friend of mine wanted a shiny Scizor and I needed a perfect Scizor for team Suizomence on Platinum anyway lol, and I had been too lazy/eager to try the team to breed and train one on OR just yet. However, red >>> green and I wanted to nickname it, so I switched around battle 135 to a regular, OR-native one).
The sets are straightforward for the most part. Greninja's moveset provides the best super effective coverage; Extrasensory could have been an option over Dark Pulse, but fighters are Gliscor bait so I preferred Dark Pulse. atsync used Choice Specs rather than Life Orb in his streak - while there are certainly some cases where the added power would be preferred (*cough*Gyarados4*cough*) the lock-in would be far more detrimental in most cases, especially when a Fire-type comes out as a second mon on an Ice- or Grass-type Greninja. Scald could have been an option over Surf to thaw freezes and is flat-out mandatory if you're using Greninja as a switch option, but I'm still not sure which one is better for a lead. Obviously thawing freezing comes into play far, far less if Greninja leads, but on the other hand there are hardly any clear-cut cases where the added power matters. There was one battle I would have lost if I had been running Scald over Surf (when last-mon Volc came in against a weakened Greninja and I had already lost Gliscor; Scald+BP doesn't KO, whereas Surf+BP does); on the other hand, there was one extremely close battle due to a freeze on Greninja (which wasn't enough to convince me though because the freeze was due to misplays and Scald wouldn't have helped enough).
#508 5GTW-WWWW-WWXH-546J: Lead Bastiodon4, which mandates a switch into Gliscor because you have to attack it from behind a sub because Metal Burst is dumb. However, I don't have a sub up when finishing it off (misplay #1), presumably because it used Curse, which makes Rock Slide always break Gliscor's Subs and obviously makes it harder to kill, so I didn't want to waste too many PP. Out comes Electivire4. Well, fuck. Ice Punch for Gliscor, Fire Punch for Scizor, STAB Thunderpunch for Greninja. However, whenever I face it in the lead position, I kill it with GK+Surf, so I switch into Greninja to do just that (misplay #2)... and it freezes Greninja. Obviously this wouldn't have happened if I had pivoted it in via Scizor, but that's not helping anymore, lol. Greninja doesn't unfreeze and dies, I send in Gliscor. I legit don't recall my thought process here but it can't have been that much because I had sort of given up already the very moment Greninja got frozen... However, since Gliscor apparently survives EVire's Ice Punch, I click Earthquake and see it deal around 50%. I know I need to keep Gliscor alive if I somehow make it to the mystery last mon and that turns out to be Jolteon or something, so I switch out to Scizor, who obviously takes the Ice Punch. At this point Scizor has 150 HP remaining; as I run the calc for Fire Punch, I see that a max roll deals 152 damage, whereas the next highest roll deals 148 damage. Seeing as I 'have to' take the hit anyway because BP doesn't KO (unless I'm gonna rely on a crit) and I don't know what that mystery last mon is gonna be, I click Swords Dance. No hax, and Scizor lives with 18 (low roll lmao) HP. BP KOes Electivire. The mystery last mon is Tyrantrum4. Am I glad I clicked SD (and that GameFreak didn't give EVire more powerful coverage moves).
(tbqf though the Surf + BP guaranteed KO on Volcarona is probably too big to give up; if it ever were to come out on Scizor it'll obviously claim at least one kill, and since it occasionally uses Bug Buzz on Greninja for obvious reasons it would make sense to just take the guaranteed KO in a scenario like this, especially because Greninja might have been weakened already)
Scizor is completely standard; Superpower might have been an option over Roost, but Roost is kinda what makes Scizor so powerful... He legit doesn't give a shit about anything that can't 2HKO him and sets up to +6 on so much.. (a Protect lead such as Bouffalant is basically a guaranteed +6 Scizor at full health, lol, as are Trick Room setters such as Slowking, Bronzong, and Aromatisse). The 44 Spe EVs put Scizor at 101 Spe, one point above the crowded 100 tier that also contains notorious annoyances such as Shiftry4 (hurrah for outprioritising Sucker Punch) and Mandibuzz4. Gliscor's moveset is completely standard; I used a specially defensive Gliscor because he prefers to outslow opponents anyway in order to maintain a sub at all times, the previous streaks with Gliscor, such as Jumpman's, kinda demonstrated he's gonna have to take on a lot of special attackers, and his natural physical bulk is already excellent without much investment. As such, I used a Careful nature with full SpD investment, while 212 HP EVs provide the highest Poison Heal number. I only run 4 Spe EVs because that puts Gliscor at the only empty tier within its reach. Of the remaining 40 EVs, 36 are invested into Defense, and because the remaining 4 wouldn't do anything in that stat they're put into Attack.

As for the loss, well, to quote the person who holds the longest Greninja streak altogether in singles:
turskain said:
VOLCARONA SAYS HI.
While Volcarona is a notorious asshole, it isn't /that/ high on my shitlist because Greninja obviously handles it (2HKOes with Surf, chance to OHKO even, while it doesn't outspeed after a single QD) and it also loses if it comes out against Gliscor (it's got seven turns before it succumbs to Toxic damage, which is nowhere near enough to muscle through it); however, spit obviously hits the fan if it comes out against Scizor. That's what happened in the lost battle. Black Belt Tyrell sent out Poliwrath, so I set out to 2HKO it with Grass Knot; surprisingly, it used Circle Throw - whereas it always used Focus Punch against Ninja the gazillion times I faced it prior - and brought in Scizor. Because it probably likes to throw out setup sweepers and I don't want to have get Greninja OHKOed by switching it back in on a Focus Punch or Circle Throw, I just KO it with Bug Bite + Bullet Punch - out comes Volc. Now, the plan I thought out prior in case this ever were to happen was to switch to Gliscor and Toxic it - because I auto-lose if it QDs on the switch to Ninja and it's an unpredictable asshole - so that's what I do (in hindsight sacking Ninja or Scizor was probably more prudent because it's for like 99% guaranteed to use Heat Wave anyway). On the switch, Heat Wave burns Gliscor, and Toxic misses. I've had several lucky breaks on this streak (how else could it have gotten this long lol) but there was no coming back from something like that and I don't really feel like typing out the following turns because it should be pretty obvious how the rest played out, lol.

In spite of the teambuilding process that was obviously far more present is this team than in my XY one, there are still several key threats that I really don't like facing. There are ways around them, but these are the foes where you reeeaallly don't want to get haxed.

889 | Gyarados4 | Careful | Chesto Berry | Dragon Dance | Aqua Tail | Earthquake | Rest | HP/SpD
This one takes the cake, easily:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados: 83-99 (41 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO - meaning it uses Greninja as setup bait if it feels like it. Resists both Scizor's STABs and has Rest to counter Toxic. The plan is basically to just spam Grass Knot. It doesn't outspeed Greninja after one DD, so the first two are guaranteed to land, and it 'has to' use Rest if it wants to survive a third one (doesn't OHKO Grass-type Greninja at +2). If Gyarados picks its moves right, which is DD - DD - Rest - DD or attacking move - attacking move, it beats Greninja but can be picked off by Scizor's BP. If it misplays only once though, Greninja beats it no sweat. Fortunately that did occur frequently. For some reason it really likes to use Earthquake against Greninja right after it comes in (e.g. #567, CHLW-WWWW-WWXH-7G4V) and I also once beat one that Dragon Danced three times after showing up (like what the hell, unfortunately I forgot to save that vid). If it does pick its moves right, however, I lose a Pokemon, and if it crits on top of that... let's say I don't wanna think about that. This very mon is an argument in favour of lead Specs Greninja in the lead if ever I've seen one (unfortunately I've seen tons of arguments to the contrary) or a fast Gliscor (which stalls out its attacking PP, but unfortunately there's this calc:
252+ SpA Vaporeon Shadow Ball vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 39-47 (22 - 26.5%) -- possible 7HKO after Poison Heal
(39, 40, 40, 41, 41, 42, 42, 43, 43, 44, 44, 45, 45, 46, 46, 47)
i.e. a 2/3 chance not to break my Sub, and if I want to beat this thing I don't have enough SubProtect PP to stall out three moves)

853 | Aerodactyl4 | Jolly | Choice Band | Stone Edge | Aerial Ace | Earthquake | Crunch | Atk/Spd
Jumpman16 already identified this thing as public enemy #1 for lead Greninja, and while I'm even more scared of Gyarados (because that one simply sweeps my entire team if it gets past Ninja), I stand a very high chance to lose a Pokemon to it; however, if that happens, my workaround results in a +6 Scizor too, so it could be worse. If it comes out against Greninja, I switch in Gliscor and spam Protect. If nothing out of the ordinary happens, it goes switch in Gliscor and eat a Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and eat a second Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and die. At that point, however, it has wasted all of its Stone Edge PP, so I switch in Scizor and use Swords Dance three times and Roost once while it Struggles to death. Add on to that that between the odds of a double Protect succeeding and Stone Edge's accuracy, the odds of Gliscor surviving are actually not half bad, so it's far from an auto-loss against this thing even though I flat-out don't have a counter to it...
Another option is to simply switch in Scizor and OHKO it with unboosted BP, but this calc kinda advises against it:
252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Scizor on a critical hit: 316-373 (94.6 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
because well, this is Stone Edge we're talking about and things do get icky if this single crit occurs, and it's not the brightest idea not to opt for a more 'reliable' (for lack of a better word) strategy in that case. If, on the other hand, Gliscor is the one getting crit and he doesn't manage to make Aero waste all of its PP, this calc looks a lot better: 252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO
This comes down to spamming Roost after the safe MEvo and setting up to +6 anyway. Scizor probably won't exactly be at full health, but hey, the die rolled against you against a ridiculous Aerodactyl set, what're you gonna do.
#424 99RG-WWWW-WWXH-7G7X Double Protect succeeds
#701 TCJW-WWWW-WWXH-7FT8 Gliscor is crit; still, I needed Scizor at +6 simply in case of a Jolteon backup.

744 | Empoleon4 | Calm | Petaya Berry | Surf | Substitute | Blizzard | Whirlpool | HP/SpA
Like Aerodactyl, this set outright loses when it comes out against a boosted Scizor or against Gliscor; it's in the lead position that I'm worried about it, because the combination of Petaya Berry and Torrent is kind of really scary. The most reliable way around it I've found thus far is to open with Grass Knot (it will Surf or Sub), switch to Scizor (it will Blizzard or Sub), set up an SD (it will Surf or Sub), Roost until you're back at full health (252 SpA Empoleon Surf vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Mega Scizor: 69-82 (40.1 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO ehehe) and it has a sub up (unless Scizor has only been hit with Blizzard because then that's gonna be the highest HP you're gonna be at), and then 2HKO by breaking the Sub and finishing it off. With these plays it's not all that unpredictable and, more importantly, I'll keep it out of Torrent Petaya range. The worst that can happen (aside from a Blizzard freeze lol) is a crit right after you break the sub, in which case Gliscor gets a free switch and beats it. It's convoluted for sure, but fortunately it isn't the auto-loss I first made it out to be.
#709 lead Emp4 E8RG-WWWW-WWXH-7FMY

891 | Kingdra4 | Modest | White Herb | Draco Meteor | Surf | Blizzard | Protect | HP/Spd/SpA
Again, something that I can't hit for that much damage and is wildly unpredictable. A cool trick is to have it bop its White Herb via switch stalling, but Protect kinda complicates that, lol. If it Protects on the switch to Scizor, it often does so every other turns and I can take advantage of that by setting up to +6 (Surf does under half), otherwise I set up on it after bopping its White Herb or juggle with Protean (both Grass Knot and Ice Beam hit it for fair damage) but I had a really close call against it (#681 XL7W-WWWW-WWXH-7FUL) when I misplayed by not spamming Roost as liberally as I should and I lost Scizor on what looked like a high damage roll - if the final mon had been more threatening than (non-Sturdy!) Avalugg, that number in the pic above would have been a lot lower.
This mon is another argument for a speedier Gliscor, but again, I can't really spare any bulk for Vap4 among others...
23/05 edit: it's a good idea to use a straight Bug Bite if Scizor switches in on Protect, just to bring it in Greninja's KO range if Scizor were to eat a Sniper crit.
If Kingdra comes in on a Grass-type Greninja (or if it Protects as you use GK on an unknown Kingdra lead lest you be swept by a DD / Swift Swim rain dance set), you can just 2HKO with Ice Beam because Blizzard can't freeze Ice-types :3 (I already knew this when I first posted this, but can't hurt to mention it explicitly lol)

These are easily the ones I'm most afraid of... Situational threats obviously occur once something that I haven't covered fully shows its face at the wrong moment (damn you Volcarona); Fire-types in general are something I'm a tad scared of, because if they show up at the wrong moment two of my three members are weak against them (think Darmanitan4, that one is a huge reason why I prefer to kill something with Surf over Ice Beam if it's all the same otherwise - luring out Electrics for Gliscor to humiliate is not half bad either). Huge annoyances are bulky/not super effectively hit opponents that Greninja can't OHKO and thus considerably dent him in return while I don't have anything that I can reliably switch into it (think Heatran, maybe Latios/Latias although I usually switch Gliscor into those out of fear for the worst case scenario - (Specs) Thunder - while Gliscor either beats most sets or renders them setup bait for Scizor). Naturally there are also the traditional ones, such as Walreon4 (barely not OHKOed by Greninja so that's unfortunate and dangerous, fortunately Gliscor handles it perfectly and hand-delivers it to Scizor for a free +6, e.g. #608 KHFG-WWWW-WWXH-7GWF) and Pinsir4 (damn that thing, fortunately it kinda drowns in options it has to OHKO lead Greninja. Whenever I faced it as a lead, it picked the distinctly less harmful X-Scissor/Close Combat over Guillotine and was rendered setup bait by Gliscor.) A special mention is reserved for this one (these?)

920 | Tornadus1 | Timid | Life Orb | Hurricane | Grass Knot | Focus Blast | Dark Pulse | Spd/SpA
940 | Tornadus2 | Modest | Yache Berry | Substitute | Double Team | Focus Blast | Hurricane | HP/SpA
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 103-122 (58.1 - 68.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 87-103 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 11.3% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 157-187 (106.8 - 127.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 133-157 (90.4 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tornadus: 205-244 (133.1 - 158.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Yache Berry Tornadus: 103-122 (55.3 - 65.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Greninja obviously beats Torn1 but loses to Torn2, but good luck telling them apart, lol - and Gliscor renders Torn2 setup bait for Scizor if it manages to get a Sub up (even if you somehow would manage to miss thirty Bullet Punches through its +6 Evasion before landing a mere two, it's started Struggling before that point, lol. Torn2 is one of the most tedious PP stall+setup victims, but if that Sub goes up it always works). Problem is... yes, even Torn2 can and will use Hurricane against lead Greninja, especially if it comes in second after Greninja has killed an opposing lead. My strategy against lead Tornadus is essentially 'click Ice Beam + pray' lol, because unless I'm missing something it's a pure guess anyway, the odds are in Greninja's favour if I stay in (also taking accuracy and the like into account), and Gliscor is more valuable against Veterans.

May add more if I remember more/somebody reminds me of more. May also add one of those fancy 'how to play against lead X' lists if I feel like it 23/05 edit: lol I actually got round to doing this

Pretty rough and will probably be editing this from time to time (e.g. I'm starting to think that a Gliscor behind a sub may be a more advantageous setup than a +6 Scizor against veterans), but this should be sufficient to show how the team generally operates (i.e. try to set up Scizor, possibly after having Gliscor PP stall a couple of threatening moves, or try to get Gliscor behind a sub, and if those aren't possible, have Greninja OHKO the foe; 2HKOing the lead with Greninja is highly discouraged) and how to take on some more threatening foes. It's not entirely comprehensive (again, I may add more stuff later), but it covers all set 4 mons + legendaries as well as a couple less straightforward less common foes. If you just realise setting up Scizor/Gliscor is preferred over having Greninja attack it's all really straightforward anyway, so here goes.
(re. Surf / Ice Beam / GK KO if multiple moves will OHKO: try not to become a Grass-type against a trainer that might have Gyarados4 because then it's really guaranteed to start DDing if it comes in, and try to become a Water-type if possible against a trainer that might have Darmanitan4 / Entei3 / Heatran4 in order to deter them from coming in or at least from using Flare Blitz in Darm's case. On the other hand, don't hesitate to become an Ice- or Grass-type against a set1/2 Veteran because you outrun all of their Fire-type legendaries and the sooner you lure in and get rid of those the better)
29/08 edit: more patient/reliable approach for Gengar4/Latias1/Latios1

Venusaur4 – switch to Scizor, fully set up
Charizard1234 – straight Surf because Belly Drum + Salac from Zard1 is lol
Charizard4 – go to Gliscor, stall Heat Wave, Toxic at some point afterwards
Blastoise4 – switch to Gliscor, stall Waterfall, KO with Earthquakes and don't waste too many subs because it can't touch you anyway and Gyarados or Kingdra might show up
Raichu4 – switch to Gliscor, straight Toxic; it can't touch you but will use Encore so yeah. After three turns, switch back and forth to Scizor, and set up a free Sub on the turn Raichu succumbs to Toxic damage.
Nidoqueen4 – switch to Gliscor, Earthquake KO, make sure you come out on top with sub
Nidoking4 – switch to Gliscor, Earthquake KO, make sure you come out on top with sub. Scizor can set up easily if not Rivalry, but how would you know lol
Ninetales4 – probably switch to Gliscor and Toxic; definitely do so in case of Drought, otherwise Surf 2HKO is a possibility I guess, but urrrgh still not too sure on this one.
Vileplume4 – Ice Beam KO
Dugtrio4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Arcanine4 – Surf KO
Poliwrath4 – Grass Knot 2HKO
Alakazam4 – Dark Pulse KO (you could switch to Gliscor and stall Focus Blast I guess, but in triples at least it's not 100% guaranteed to use Focus Blast and Trick would suck)
Machamp4 – switch to Gliscor, Sub/Protect until burn damage brings it in EQ KO range while it fails to break the sub or just Sub/Protect until it dies
Victreebel4 – Ice Beam KO because holding off on Mega Evolving with Scizor does not allow you to regain Technician after MEvo lol
Tentacruel1234 – scout set with Dark Pulse, KO offensive sets, set up Scizor on defensive
Tentacruel4 – switch to Scizor, fully set up
Golem4 – just go to Scizor, it usually blows up so you don't want it to have Sturdy
Rapidash4 – Surf KO
Slowbro4 – switch to Scizor, Roost spam through TR and fully set up
Dewgong4 – switch to Scizor, fully set up
Muk4 – switch to Scizor, fully set up
Gengar4 – go to Gliscor, stall Shadow Ball, switch-stall Sludge Bomb and Thunderbolt between Scizor and Gliscor, fully set up Scizor on Struggling Gengar
Electrode4 – switch to Gliscor, Sub, Earthquake KO (even Sub at risk of Taunt because if it Taunts that turn you'll at least burn one of your Taunt turns)
Exeggutor4 – Ice Beam KO
Marowak4 – Ice Beam KO
Weezing4 – initially try muscling through it with Greninja (Surf 2HKO); if it uses Stockpile + Rest, switch to Scizor and set up fully; 30 BP PP is enough for a crit, which from a +6 Scizor OHKOes even when burned x_x (or if all else fails, enough to PP stall Rest in tandem with Scizor's other moves)
Kangaskhan4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Starmie4 – Dark Pulse KO
Mr. Mime4 – switch to Scizor, try to set up fully but attack immediately in the event of a SpD drop (which usually happens lol)
Jynx4 – Dark Pulse KO
Pinsir4 – switch to Gliscor; if Guillotine, pray; if CC, PP stall and fully set up Scizor on struggling Pinsir; if X-Scissor, straight switch to Scizor and set up fully
Tauros4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Gyarados – spam GK, see threatlist
Lapras4 – GK OHKO/2HKO
Vaporeon1234 – just go to Scizor, set up once or fully (depending on set) and BB KO
Vaporeon4 – switch to Gliscor, stall Ice Beam, then Toxic as soon as you get the chance and Sub/Protect until it faints
Jolteon – switch to Gliscor, immediate Sub (even in case of Swagger because lol what's it gonna do)
Flareon1234 – Surf, pray for opportune set / move
Flareon4 – switch to Gliscor, Earthquake KO at unbroken subs
Aerodactyl34 – switch to Gliscor, go to Scizor and set up fully in the event of Aero3
Aerodactyl4 – switch to Gliscor, spam Protect and hope for hax; if you lose Gliscor, switch in Scizor and set up fully (see threatlist)
Snorlax4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Articuno12 – go to Scizor, set up fully against set 1, pray that set 2 doesn't use Mind Reader / hit with Sheer Cold; Gliscor can stall its Sheer Cold / Ice Beam PP though
Articuno1234 – go to Scizor, proceed accordingly
Articuno34 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Zapdos12 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Zapdos1234 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Zapdos34 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Moltres12 – Surf KO
Moltres1234 – Surf KO
Moltres34 – Surf KO
Dragonite4 – Ice Beam KO
Meganium4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Typhlosion4 – Surf KO
Feraligatr4 – Grass Knot KO
Crobat4 – Ice Beam KO, pray it doesn't do anything dumb; it usually uses Taunt though, hurrah for the AI not distinguishing between singles and doubles
Lanturn34 – go to Gliscor, stall set 3, set up Scizor on set 4
Lanturn4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully, use Bug Bite, Roost off damage and 2HKO as it sleeps
Ampharos4 – switch to Gliscor, Earthquake KO with unbroken sub
Politoed4 – switch to Gliscor, stall all attacking PP, fully set up Scizor
Quagsire4 – Grass Knot KO
Espeon4 – Dark Pulse KO
Umbreon4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Slowking4 – switch to Scizor, Roost spam through TR and set up fully
Forretress4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Steelix4 – Surf KO, if Sturdy + Swagger switch to Gliscor for free Sub
Granbull4 – switch to Scizor, KO with unboosted BP (needs one round of LO recoil)
Scizor4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Shuckle4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Heracross4 – switch to Gliscor, Toxic
Ursaring4 – probably just go to Gliscor and Earthquake 3HKO (it doesn't use Return fsr), Scizor /can/ set up but Quick Claw sucks
Skarmory4 – Dark Pulse 3HKO, don't take too much recoil
Houndoom4 – Surf KO
Kingdra – lol, see threatlist
Donphan4 – switch to Gliscor, stall Stone Edge, Toxic
Porygon2 – switch to Gliscor, stall Tri Attack, Toxic
Miltank4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Blissey4 – switch to Gliscor, Toxic (can't touch Gliscor at all and Scizor doesn't like Mud Bomb acc drops)
Raikou12 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Raikou1234 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Raikou34 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Entei12 – Surf; if Entei2, 2HKO, if Entei1 (which will generally use Flame Charge), go to Gliscor, stall dangerous moves a bit, and KO
Entei1234 – Surf, see above for 1 or 2
Entei34 – Surf, pray for no funny survival from set 4
Suicune12 – GK 2HKO, never seen set 2 use Mirror Coat :x
Suicune1234 – GK 2HKO
Suicune34 – GK 2HKO, if set 3 uses Protect go to Scizor I guess?
Tyranitar4 – switch to Gliscor, Superpower stat drops prevent Rock Slide from breaking subs, KO with Earthquakes
Sceptile4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Blaziken – Surf KO
Swampert – GK KO
Ludicolo4 – GK 2HKO
Shiftry4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Gardevoir4 – if Synchronize/Telepathy: switch to Scizor, SD once, BP KO; if Trace: cry, switch to Gliscor while pivoting via Scizor, PP stall Moonblast + Psychic + Focus Blast and KO with Earthquake
Breloom4 – Ice Beam KO
Slaking4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Exploud4 – still gotta figure out something reliable here but switch stalling Focus Blast between Gliscor and Scizor while squeezing in a Roost might make sense, don't think I played that well against this one the few times I faced it x_x
Hariyama4 – Surf + GK KO (so as not to invite BP)
Aggron4 – switch to Scizor, steal berry and bop Sturdy, switch to Gliscor, Sub, Earthquake KO
Medicham4 – either switch back and forth between Greninja and Gliscor and KO with Surf after 2 rounds of LO recoil or Sub/Protect until it dies from recoil (more rewarding but also more risky)
Manectric4 – switch to Gliscor, Sub as it switches out; may rarely use Switcheroo, which kinda blows but a speedy Earthquake against a Scientist / Roller Skater can come in kinda handy so w/e
Flygon4 – Ice Beam KO
Altaria4 – Ice Beam KO (fuck Sing)
Whiscash4 – switch to Gliscor, stall Muddy Water + Fissure, switch to Scizor and set up fully
Claydol4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Cradily4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Armaldo4 – Surf KO
Milotic4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully (I guess? Speed tie kinda blows; otherwise GK 2HKO)
Absol4 – Surf (possible) KO
Walrein4 – GK KO; if you miss the OHKO and Sheer Cold / Fissure hits, go to Gliscor, stall OHKO moves, go to Scizor and set up fully
Salamence34 – Ice Beam KO
Metagross4 – switch to Scizor and set up fully
Regirock12 – go to Gliscor, Sub / Protect until set 2 explodes or just Toxic stall set 1
Regirock1234 – go to Gliscor, proceed accordingly
Regirock34 – go to Gliscor, Toxic stall set 3 after stalling Ice Punch or Sub / Protect until set 4 explodes
Regice12 – still not too sure but probably go to Gliscor... obviously stall set 1 out of Ice Beam and then Toxic, if set 2 (which is likely to use Icy Wind on Greninja), go to Scizor, use SD once, and BP KO, Gliscor can't beat it because of Rest
Regice1234 – go to Gliscor, proceed accordingly
Regice34 – go to Gliscor, if set 3 go to Scizor and set up fully, if set 4 stall Blizzard and Toxic stall
Registeel12 – go to Scizor, set up fully because can't break through set1 otherwise
Registeel1234 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Registeel34 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Latias12 – go to Gliscor. If set 1, PP stall Dragon Pulse + Mist Ball and fully set up Scizor, if set 2 go to Scizor to lower its SpA and then try recovering back as much health as possible with Sub/Protect and use Toxic at some point
Latias1234 – go to Gliscor, proceed accordingly
Latias34 – go to Gliscor; Toxic stall set 4, set up Scizor on set 3 locked into Draco, or Sub as it locks into Thunder and switches out
Latios12 – ew. go to Gliscor; if set 1, PP stall Dragon Pulse + Luster Purge and fully set up Scizor, if set 2 go to Scizor to lower its SpA and then try recovering back as much health as possible with Sub/Protect and use Toxic at some point
Latios1234 – go to Gliscor, proceed accordingly
Latios34 – go to Gliscor, pray; Toxic stall set 4, set up Scizor on set 3 locked into Draco, or Sub as it locks into Thunder and switches out
Torterra1234 – Ice Beam KO
Torterra4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Infernape4 – switch in Gliscor on CC / Fake Out, don't Protect cuz Encore, switch back to Greninja as it breaks its own Sash with Flare Blitz, Surf KO
Empoleon4 – GK, switch to Scizor, proceed appropriately (see threatlist)
Staraptor – Ice Beam KO
Luxray – switch to Gliscor, stall Ice Fang, Toxic
Roserade4 – Ice Beam KO
Rampardos4 – Grass Knot KO
Bastiodon4 – switch to Gliscor, 2HKO from behind a Sub
Vespiquen4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Floatzel4 – Grass Knot KO
Gastrodon4 – Grass Knot KO
Ambipom4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Drifblim4 – go to Gliscor because 0 SpA Drifblim Shadow Ball vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 36-43 (20.3 - 24.2%) -- possible 8HKO after Poison Heal, Toxic
Lopunny4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Mismagius4 – Dark Pulse 2HKO
Honchkrow34 – Ice Beam KO
Skuntank4 – lol. Just go to Gliscor I guess, this piece of shit even uses Fire Blast against a Water-type Greninja...
Bronzong4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Spiritomb4 – Dark Pulse 3HKO
Garchomp1234 – kekeke, probably straight Ice Beam, which KOes sets 1 and 2 while set 4 after all is likely to use Swords Dance and set 3 should be handled easily by Scizor or Gliscor, depending on which move its locks itself into x_x
Garchomp4 – Grass Knot + Ice Beam KO cause may use Earthquake
Lucario4 – go to Gliscor, stall Stone Edge and either Earthquake KO or stall Aura Sphere and set up Scizor (preferably Earthquake KO against Black Belts / Battle Girls because a Fire-type might show up)
Hippowdon4 – go to Scizor, set up as much as possible
Drapion4 – go to Gliscor, stall Night Slash, switch between Gliscor and Scizor to stall Earthquake PP, fully set up Scizor
Toxicroak4 – go to Gliscor, Sub (to burn your first Taunt turn if nothing else), Earthquake KO
Abomasnow4 – go to Gliscor, stall Blizzard, go to Scizor, set up fully; switch back and forth to Gliscor in the event of a FB SpD drop
Weavile4 – break Sash with Surf, switch in Scizor on Night Slash, BP KO. Similarly to Crobat it's Taunt happy against Greninja, so an Ice Punch freeze should be really rare.
Magnezone4 – switch to Gliscor, stall Flash Cannon and Tri Attack (may fail to break Sub if not Analytic), Earthquake KO
Lickilicky4 – switch in Scizor and hope that it doesn't blow up right away I guess... Should be hesitant to blow up if Scizor gets in safely so that you can set up / Roost spam, but yeah x_x
Rhyperior4 – Grass Knot / Surf KO (against Pokemon Rangers and Black Belts, respectively)
Tangrowth4 – Ice Beam KO
Electivire4 – Grass Knot 2HKO
Magmortar4 – Surf KO
Togekiss4 – Ice Beam likely KO, seems to prefer to use Dazzling Gleam over Aura Sphere so no huge deal if you miss it
Yanmega4 – Ice Beam KO
Leafeon1234 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Leafeon4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Glaceon4 – go to Scizor, set up a bit, BP KO
Gliscor4 – go to Scizor, bop Sash, set up fully
Mamoswine4 – Grass Knot KO
Porygon-Z4 – go to Gliscor, stall Tri Attack, Toxic (finish off with Earthquake because gets Recover happy at the end)
Gallade4 – switch back and forth between Gliscor and Greninja twice and KO with Surf after two Close Combat SpD drops; otherwise stall Psycho Cut + Close Combat and fully set up Scizor, but beware of Chandelure / Fire-type backup
Probopass4 – go to Gliscor, Earthquake KO
Dusknoir4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Froslass1234 – Dark Pulse KO; if set 4, proceed below
Froslass4 – Surf to break Sash and take resisted damage from Icy Wind / Blizzard, switch in Scizor, set up fully and Roost while PP stalling Destiny Bond, BP KO
Heatran12 – Surf 2HKO
Heatran1234 – Surf 2HKO/OHKO on set 4
Heatran34 – Surf 2HKO/OHKO on set 4
Regigigas12 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Regigigas1234 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Regigigas34 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Cresselia12 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Cresselia1234 – go to Scizor, proceed accordingly
Cresselia34 – go to Scizor and set up fully on set 4; bit dry on set 3 because no experience, but going to Gliscor after Swagger SHOULD be safe since it outruns Scizor and as such is unlikely to use Icy Wind, and even then 0 SpA Cresselia Icy Wind vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 60-72 (33.8 - 40.6%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Poison Heal so yeah lol some trial and error should be possible to an extent
Serperior – Ice Beam KO
Emboar – Surf KO
Samurott – Grass Knot KO
Musharna4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Unfezant4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Zebstrika34 – go to Gliscor, Sub, Earthquake KO
Gigalith4 – go to Gliscor, stall Rock Slide, Earthquake KO
Excadrill – Surf KO
Conkeldurr4 – go to Gliscor
Seismitoad4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Throh4 – go to Gliscor, Sub/Protect until it dies from burn damage or you can KO it with EQ
Sawk4 – go to Gliscor, stall Stone Edge as much as possible and kill with EQ at some point (verry dangerous though; not sure on this one re. the optimal play, this kinda relies on it using Taunt at some point)
Lilligant4 – Ice Beam KO
Krookodile4 – Surf KO
Darmanitan4 – go to Gliscor, stall Superpower, fully set up Scizor
Scrafty4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Cofagrigus4 – Dark Pulse 2HKO
Carracosta4 – go to Scizor, bop Sturdy, set up fully (beware of Aqua Jet after potential crit)
Archeops4 – Surf KO
Zoroark4 – lol
Gothitelle4 – Dark Pulse 2HKO; if hit by Flatter + no STag: switch to Gliscor, stall Psychic, KO
Reuniclus4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Vanilluxe4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Escavalier4 – go to Gliscor, Sub / Protect, 4HKO with Earthquake when given the chance
Ferrothorn4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Klinklang4 – go to Gliscor, Earthquake 2HKO, don't bother too much trying to maintain a sub because its Protect usage is too erratic to do so without wasting basically all your PP
Eelektross4 – go to Gliscor, Toxic
Chandelure4 – Surf 2HKO
Haxorus4 – Ice Beam, if attack KO, if DD (which it usually does) go to Scizor + BP KO
Beartic4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Cryogonal4 – go to Scizor, set up until it blows up
Accelgor4 – go to Gliscor, you'll get Encored but it can't touch you so just spam Toxic, after three turns switch back and forth to Scizor and Sub as it succumbs
Mienshao4 – go to Gliscor, Sub / Protect until HJK kills it
Druddigon4 – Ice Beam KO
Golurk4 – Grass Knot KO
Bisharp4 – no real 'optimal' strategy as far as I've figured out, but probably just go to Gliscor and Earthquake 2HKO
Bouffalant4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Braviary4 – Ice Beam KO
Mandibuzz4 – Ice Beam; if not Swagger, KO; if Swagger, go to Gliscor, Toxic, and find something more interesting to do for the next twelve or so turns; if it Subs on the switch or Toxic misses, cry and get creative
Durant4 – switch to Scizor, set up fully
Hydreigon4 – Ice Beam KO
Volcarona4 – Surf 2HKO
Cobalion12 – go to Gliscor; if set 1, stall Iron Head and Earthquake 3HKO if given the chance; if set 2, Sub, spam Earthquake, and 3HKO during its second Rest
Cobalion1234 – go to Gliscor and act accordingly
Cobalion34 – go to Gliscor and act accordingly, set 3 is too erratic to reliably stall out of Iron Head though as far as my experiences go
Terrakion12 – go to Gliscor, if set 2 stall Sacred Sword and set up Scizor, if set 1 stall Stone Edge + wait for unbroken Sub to KO with Earthquake
Terrakion1234 – go to Gliscor and act accordingly
Terrakion34 – Surf KO
Virizion12 – go to Gliscor; if set 2, straight Toxic and Sub / Protect; if set 1, go to Scizor and BB + BP KO
Virizion1234 – go to Gliscor, immediately Toxic stall sets 2+3, go to Scizor on set1 and act accordingly, not sure on set 4
Virizion34 – x_x probably go to Gliscor and immediate Toxic to kill set 3, not sure at all what to do against set 4 but Scizor can probably kill it if you force it into a Rest
Tornadus12 – Ice Beam, pray; if set 2 kills Greninja, go to Gliscor, stall Hurricane + Focus Blast, go to Scizor, set up fully, wait until it uses all its Sub PP, BP KO
Tornadus1234 – Ice Beam, pray; if set 2, see above
Tornadus34 – Ice Beam, pray
Thundurus12 – go to Gliscor, sub; set 2 will switch out, while set 1 will spam Protect, so force it into a Rest twice via Toxic, go back to Greninja, Ice Beam 2HKO
Thundurus1234 – go to Gliscor, proceed accordingly; not too sure what to do against set 4 because never faced it with Gliscor, but probably wait until it wastes all of its Focus Blast PP, proceed to switch stall between Scizor and Gliscor until it's out of Taunt PP, and Toxic it)
Thundurus34 – Ice Beam KO
Landorus12 – go to Gliscor, stall either Smack Down + Fissure or Focus Blast, go to Scizor, set up fully
Landorus1234 – go to Gliscor; if set 1 or 2, act accordingly, otherwise Sub and stall set 3's Rock Slide while proceeding to switch stall Earthquake and fully set up Scizor or Sub / Protect set 4 until it blows up
Landorus34 – Ice Beam KO
Chesnaught4 – Ice Beam KO
Delphox4 – Surf KO
Greninja4 – Grass Knot KO
Talonflame4 – Surf KO
Pyroar4 – Surf KO
Florges4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Gogoat4 – Ice Beam KO
Aromatisse4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Slurpuff4 – go to Gliscor, Sub / Protect / Toxic
Barbaracle4 – Grass Knot KO
Clawitzer4 – go to Gliscor, stall Aura Sphere, go to Scizor, set up fully
Tyrantrum4 – Ice Beam KO
Aurorus4 – go to Gliscor, Sub / Protect, Earthquake KO on recharge turns
Sylveon4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Hawlucha4 – Ice Beam KO
Carbink4 – go to Scizor, set up fully
Goodra4 – go to Gliscor, stall Blizzard, Toxic when Sub isn't broken
Trevenant4 – Ice Beam KO
Gourgeist4 – Ice Beam KO
Avalugg4 – tbh I'd probably just GK, dunno what it'd do if it were to have Sturdy... but obviously I don't want Gliscor to handle it and Scizor doesn't like taking multiple crits I reckon.
Noivern4 – Ice Beam KO



I've been thinking long and hard about what exactly makes this team stand out from the previous lead Greninja teams. While I still don't quite understand how I of all people managed to do so much better than they did, one thing I did notice was the sheer resiliency of my backups. While Scizor is not quite the best setup sweeper available, it has (close to) the best defensive typing as well as reliable recovery and as such basically only dies if you allow it to or get sloppy; and Gliscor is, well, Gliscor n_n We all know consistency is the most important thing for long maison streaks, and a frail kill-or-be-killed lead like Greninja doesn't really check out in that department; as such, its teammates will have to make up for a lot in this regard. Both of the teammates I chose had reliable/consistent recovery and a great defensive typing, and that can't possibly have hurt. That's also the reason why Jumpman's Greninja/Mega Salamence/Gastrodon sounds structurally sound to me; even with my subpar maison teambuilding skills I see those backups have the reliability a lead Greninja needs, not to mention Gastrodon does beat Gyarados/Aerodactyl/Empoleon :p
I also found the team rather easy to play - there aren't a lot of ambiguous plays, as long as you make sure to set up Scizor whenever possible (e.g. set up against lead Seismitoad rather than kill it with GK) and simply be patient and diligent. I'm still not sure if a lead Greninja team can ascend to the same heights as a team with a lead setup sweeper - obviously those have to set up only once and can then pummel through the backups, whereas a lead Greninja team is essentially back to square one after sniping the opposing lead - but I don't think the gap is as big as I made it out to be initially. Or maybe it's exclusively the Gliscor factor, who knows.

Seriously guys, thanks. Without all of your inspiring stories and all of you challenging each other to push the envelope further and further, I never would have been writing a post about a streak like this using three of my favourite mons. I honestly would have been happy just to beat or get close to my XY streak, but to do it with a margin like this and with so much fun in the process... it's just insane and I'm still sort of waiting until I wake up, lol. I know I probably lucked out with the matchups I got, I know the occasional suboptimal play 'should' have ended my streak sooner, I also know I should have played better in the losing battle, but I don't think overthinking the what-ifs, maybes, and might-have-beens is gonna accomplish anything of value, so I'll just try to let this sink in and resume the triples grind sooner or later ^^

turskain you can keep the longest Greninja streak, I'll hold on to the trophy of longest lead Greninja streak until Jumpman16 inevitably snatches it away from me n_n
 

Attachments

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If it's still relevant, I'd like to submit my contribution to the recent discussion about lead Greninja in Super Singles.

View attachment 37325
#811: 76CW-WWWW-WWXH-7FK4
I'm a bit unsure how to feel about this one. I lost in a rather dumb way, because of a suboptimal play in a really tight spot + a Heat Wave burn and Toxic miss on that exact same turn - I'm the one to blame if my plan around one of my team's top threats isn't sound, though. On the other hand, this number is just... crazy, nothing less. When I first thought up this team, I wasn't sure how good it was; using lead Ninja hadn't resulted in batshit insane streaks thus far - the longest one being atsync's impressive and remarkably early 302 win streak with Specs Greninja, Ferrothorn, and Dragonite - and while it looked structurally sound, I could easily come up a lot of scenarios where I'd at least be backed into a corner, and as I went along it never exuded that same aura of seeming invincibility that I noticed in team Clockwork Angels. I expected it would make it to 50 easily, 100 shouldn't have been a problem either, 200 was possible, maybe even beating my X record of 330 (with MegaKhan/Aegislash/Dragonite) if I lucked out - but 810 just doesn't make any sense at all, lol. The team is the same one that I posted in my five trophy post - I promised I'd go into more detail if I managed to net a proper streak with it, and I guess I did.


Rael (Greninja) @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
Nature: Timid
IVs: 31/5-6/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot
-Dark Pulse


Harlequin (Scizor) @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 31/31/31/24-25/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe
-Bullet Punch
-Bug Bite
-Swords Dance
-Roost


Little Nicky (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Nature: Careful
IVs: 31/31/31/10-11/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Atk / 36 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
-Substitute
-Protect
-Earthquake
-Toxic

The genesis of this team actually sort of stems from resentment towards my XY singles streak, heh. When I first started playing the XY maison, with barely any track record in battle facilities, I naturally started with singles because I knew squat about the other formats, but it proved to be a tough nut to crack. It probably makes sense that I wanted to try Pokemon I liked at first (seemingly viable ones of course lol, Raichu is one of my old favourites but it didn't remotely cross my mind to try him - well actually he can function as a poor man's Mega Manectric in team Clockwork Angels, but that's not what this post is about) so the first hopefully legit team I thought up consisted of physical attacker EBelt (cause fuk recoil) Infernape / special attacker and revenge killer Sash Zam / wall/pivot Ferrothorn... it worked like I had in mind, but it was just so damn weak and lost at 37 to Volcarona4 (heh).. Anyway, anybody who's ever been stuck in the first ten/twenty battles knows just how haxxy and cheap those sets are, so by then I had gotten tired of singles - fortunately it was around then that I found a youtube vid of a Greninja/Mega Blaziken lead in doubles, so now I had a starting point for that format and tried that one (rather more successfully, although I'm still hoping to one day find the appropriate backups for those two lol), leaving singles behind for then. However, I naturally returned after winning the doubles and triples trophy (rotations and multi seemed even more daunting), turning to a lead with a better track record than Infernape in Cloyster. A thrown together team of Cloyster / WoW/Fake Out absorber Chandelure / powder/paralysis absorber Mega Venusaur brought me to battle 49, where I lost due to a slightly unfortunate matchup and horrible chokes. Then I had had enough, thought 'fine if this how you like it meet a pile of broken shit', "built" a team of Mega Kangaskhan / Aegislash / Dragonite (i.e. literally just the three most powerful singles mons), got the trophy, and eventually brought that streak to 330. However, as I've stated several times in my posts regarding that team, if that's how you come up with a team, that can't help but leave a bitter taste in my mouth. The most enjoyable streaks are obviously those where you like the mons/team (nah), the team is fun to play with (that it actually was sort of, but w/e, not amazing), and easily the most important bit: where you have an actual story to tell about the team's genesis (yeah lol right).

So it was around November that I started thinking about what I wanted to use in the ORAS singles maison. The problem with singles goodstuffs teams is that the pool of viable pokemon is rather narrow (much more narrow than in doubles/triples at the very least), but at least there were a few Pokemon that I really liked and certainly felt like trying out: that one badass bug that sets up to +6 all over more than half of the maison and I had already used a bit on Platinum in Suizomence... Scizor... the modern Starmie, which had played an integral part in my extremely enjoyable doubles and triples teams but was supposedly also terrific in singles... Greninja... and last but not least, the backbone of the most successful super singles goodstuffs team in Jumpman's Kangliscune as well as one of my very favourites altogether ever since it was introduced... Gliscor. Anyway, if you want to build a good singles team you have to have a powerful lead as well as two backups that can switch in on what threatens him, so I thought up a team of Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor. As for Gliscor, with his Ground typing he can naturally switch in on Thunder Waves, one of the status conditions that cripple lead sweepers. The other one is obviously burns, so I thought it would be fun to use a lead sweeper immune to burns in Mega Charizard X. With his juggling with defensive typings (and his initial Earthquake immunity), you basically only need something that can beat users of strong Rock-type moves such as CB Aerodactyl... Suicune. However, I shelved them both: Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor looked a bit too inconsistent because it sort of lacked a backbone, not to mention that sort of thing/lead DNite has kinda been done to death - XZard/Suicune/Gliscor actually looked kinda cool for the novelty of using Charizard X, but it was basically an inferior Kangliscune, not to mention that Hurrrnadus would become a huge pain in the ass because XZard doesn't draw in Focus Blast. It probably would have been manageable still, but whatever. When contemplating those teams, I did notice Greninja/Mega Scizor's excellent defensive synergy, with MegaZor switching in on Bug/Grass/Fairy/generally strong physical attacks and Greninja covering Fire. That did leave Electric and Fighting, which are naturally covered by... Gliscor. Sure, why the fuck not. It sounded in theory like those three would work just fine on a team, so I set out to fill in some more specifics. The first question was obviously 'Greninja/MegaZor: to lead or not to lead?' I sort of liked the idea of a lead Scizor and it has already been done successfully in Aircraft Cemetery's 480 win streak with MegaZor/Garchomp/Azumarill; however, what I liked even more was Mega Scizor's Roost shenanigans on more than half of the maison, and I felt he wouldn't be able to perform those optimally in the lead position, especially when the opposing lead is called Magnet Pull Magnezone, lol. The decisive argument in lead Greninja's favour was this:
161 | Tyrantrum4 | Adamant | Choice Band | Crunch | Dragon Claw | Earthquake | Head Smash | Atk/Spd
... yeah, that exact same thing why I vehemently swear by Adamant Earthquake for lead Kangaskhan (unless you're that terrified of Mismagius4 I guess -definitely not underestimating that one though if it comes off like that- because that's really the only one where Crunch is the one attack you need, but w/e). Imo every goodstuffs singles team must have either a switch-in to this monster (good luck with that ehehe) or a lead that beats it. The one 'ideal scenario' for this team was a game I theorymonned against Nita. She'd lead off with Landorus, so Greninja would naturally switch to Gliscor - then Gliscor would SubProtect away all those measly five Focus Blast PP, and then Scizor would switch in and set up three Swords Dances as Landorus Struggled to death and proceed to sweep her entire team. Needless to say I was pleased as punch when that exact scenario occurred: MYBQ-WWWW-WWX5-3KTR (re. the different Scizor, that's a shiny one I RNG-bred on Soul Silver because a friend of mine wanted a shiny Scizor and I needed a perfect Scizor for team Suizomence on Platinum anyway lol, and I had been too lazy/eager to try the team to breed and train one on OR just yet. However, red >>> green and I wanted to nickname it, so I switched around battle 135 to a regular, OR-native one).
The sets are straightforward for the most part. Greninja's moveset provides the best super effective coverage; Extrasensory could have been an option over Dark Pulse, but fighters are Gliscor bait so I preferred Dark Pulse. atsync used Choice Specs rather than Life Orb in his streak - while there are certainly some cases where the added power would be preferred (*cough*Gyarados4*cough*) the lock-in would be far more detrimental in most cases, especially when a Fire-type comes out as a second mon on an Ice- or Grass-type Greninja. Scald could have been an option over Surf to thaw freezes and is flat-out mandatory if you're using Greninja as a switch option, but I'm still not sure which one is better for a lead. Obviously thawing freezing comes into play far, far less if Greninja leads, but on the other hand there are hardly any clear-cut cases where the added power matters. There was one battle I would have lost if I had been running Scald over Surf (when last-mon Volc came in against a weakened Greninja and I had already lost Gliscor; Scald+BP doesn't KO, whereas Surf+BP does); on the other hand, there was one extremely close battle due to a freeze on Greninja (which wasn't enough to convince me though because the freeze was due to misplays and Scald wouldn't have helped enough).
#508 5GTW-WWWW-WWXH-546J: Lead Bastiodon4, which mandates a switch into Gliscor because you have to attack it from behind a sub because Metal Burst is dumb. However, I don't have a sub up when finishing it off (misplay #1), presumably because it used Curse, which makes Rock Slide always break Gliscor's Subs and obviously makes it harder to kill, so I didn't want to waste too many PP. Out comes Electivire4. Well, fuck. Ice Punch for Gliscor, Fire Punch for Scizor, STAB Thunderpunch for Greninja. However, whenever I face it in the lead position, I kill it with GK+Surf, so I switch into Greninja to do just that (misplay #2)... and it freezes Greninja. Obviously this wouldn't have happened if I had pivoted it in via Scizor, but that's not helping anymore, lol. Greninja doesn't unfreeze and dies, I send in Gliscor. I legit don't recall my thought process here but it can't have been that much because I had sort of given up already the very moment Greninja got frozen... However, since Gliscor apparently survives EVire's Ice Punch, I click Earthquake and see it deal around 50%. I know I need to keep Gliscor alive if I somehow make it to the mystery last mon and that turns out to be Jolteon or something, so I switch out to Scizor, who obviously takes the Ice Punch. At this point Scizor has 150 HP remaining; as I run the calc for Fire Punch, I see that a max roll deals 152 damage, whereas the next highest roll deals 148 damage. Seeing as I 'have to' take the hit anyway because BP doesn't KO (unless I'm gonna rely on a crit) and I don't know what that mystery last mon is gonna be, I click Swords Dance. No hax, and Scizor lives with 18 (low roll lmao) HP. BP KOes Electivire. The mystery last mon is Tyrantrum4. Am I glad I clicked SD (and that GameFreak didn't give EVire more powerful coverage moves).

Scizor is completely standard; Superpower might have been an option over Roost, but Roost is kinda what makes Scizor so powerful... He legit doesn't give a shit about anything that can't 2HKO him and sets up to +6 on so much.. (a Protect lead such as Bouffalant is basically a guaranteed +6 Scizor at full health, lol, as are Trick Room setters such as Slowking, Bronzong, and Aromatisse). The 44 Spe EVs put Scizor at 101 Spe, one point above the crowded 100 tier that also contains notorious annoyances such as Shiftry4 (hurrah for outprioritising Sucker Punch) and Mandibuzz4. Gliscor's moveset is completely standard; I used a specially defensive Gliscor because he prefers to outslow opponents anyway in order to maintain a sub at all times, the previous streaks with Gliscor, such as Jumpman's, kinda demonstrated he's gonna have to take on a lot of special attackers, and his natural physical bulk is already excellent without much investment. As such, I used a Careful nature with full SpD investment, while 212 HP EVs provide the highest Poison Heal number. I only run 4 Spe EVs because that puts Scizor at the only empty tier within its reach. Of the remaining 40 EVs, 36 are invested into Defense, and because the remaining 4 wouldn't do anything in that stat they're put into Attack.

As for the loss, well, to quote the person who holds the longest Greninja streak altogether in singles:

While Volcarona is a notorious asshole, it isn't /that/ high on my shitlist because Greninja obviously handles it (2HKOes with Surf, chance to OHKO even, while it doesn't outspeed after a single QD) and it also loses if it comes out against Gliscor (it's got seven turns before it succumbs to Toxic damage, which is nowhere near enough to muscle through it); however, spit obviously hits the fan if it comes out against Scizor. That's what happened in the lost battle. Black Belt Tyrell sent out Poliwrath, so I set out to 2HKO it with Grass Knot; surprisingly, it used Circle Throw - whereas it always used Focus Punch against Ninja the gazillion times I faced it prior - and brought in Scizor. Because it probably likes to throw out setup sweepers and I don't want to have get Greninja OHKOed by switching it back in on a Focus Punch or Circle Throw, I just KO it with Bug Bite + Bullet Punch - out comes Volc. Now, the plan I thought out prior in case this ever were to happen was to switch to Gliscor and Toxic it - because I auto-lose if it QDs on the switch to Ninja and it's an unpredictable asshole - so that's what I do (in hindsight sacking Ninja or Scizor was probably more prudent because it's for like 99% guaranteed to use Heat Wave anyway). On the switch, Heat Wave burns Gliscor, and Toxic misses. I've had several lucky breaks on this streak (how else could it have gotten this long lol) but there was no coming back from something like that and I don't really feel like typing out the following turns because it should be pretty obvious how the rest played out, lol.

In spite of the teambuilding process that was obviously far more present is this team than in my XY one, there are still several key threats that I really don't like facing. There are ways around them, but these are the foes where you reeeaallly don't want to get haxed.

889 | Gyarados4 | Careful | Chesto Berry | Dragon Dance | Aqua Tail | Earthquake | Rest | HP/SpD
This one takes the cake, easily:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados: 83-99 (41 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO - meaning it uses Greninja as setup bait if it feels like it. Resists both Scizor's STABs and has Rest to counter Toxic. The plan is basically to just spam Grass Knot. It doesn't outspeed Greninja after one DD, so the first two are guaranteed to land, and it 'has to' use Rest if it wants to survive a third one (doesn't OHKO Grass-type Greninja at +2). If Gyarados picks its moves right, which is DD - DD - Rest - DD or attacking move - attacking move, it beats Greninja but can be picked off by Scizor's BP. If it misplays only once though, Greninja beats it no sweat. Fortunately that did occur frequently. For some reason it really likes to use Earthquake against Greninja right after it comes in (e.g. #567, CHLW-WWWW-WWXH-7G4V) and I also once beat one that Dragon Danced three times after showing up (like what the hell, unfortunately I forgot to save that vid). If it does pick its moves right, however, I lose a Pokemon, and if it crits on top of that... let's say I don't wanna think about that. This very mon is an argument in favour of lead Specs Greninja in the lead if ever I've seen one (unfortunately I've seen tons of arguments to the contrary) or a fast Gliscor (which stalls out its attacking PP, but unfortunately there's this calc:
252+ SpA Vaporeon Shadow Ball vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 39-47 (22 - 26.5%) -- possible 7HKO after Poison Heal
(39, 40, 40, 41, 41, 42, 42, 43, 43, 44, 44, 45, 45, 46, 46, 47)
i.e. a 2/3 chance not to break my Sub, and if I want to beat this thing I don't have enough SubProtect PP to stall out three moves)

853 | Aerodactyl4 | Jolly | Choice Band | Stone Edge | Aerial Ace | Earthquake | Crunch | Atk/Spd
Jumpman16 already identified this thing as public enemy #1 for lead Greninja, and while I'm even more scared of Gyarados (because that one simply sweeps my entire team if it gets past Ninja), I stand a very high chance to lose a Pokemon to it; however, if that happens, my workaround results in a +6 Scizor too, so it could be worse. If it comes out against Greninja, I switch in Gliscor and spam Protect. If nothing out of the ordinary happens, it goes switch in Gliscor and eat a Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and eat a second Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and die. At that point, however, it has wasted all of its Stone Edge PP, so I switch in Scizor and use Swords Dance three times and Roost once while it Struggles to death. Add on to that that between the odds of a double Protect succeeding and Stone Edge's accuracy, the odds of Gliscor surviving are actually not half bad, so it's far from an auto-loss against this thing even though I flat-out don't have a counter to it...
Another option is to simply switch in Scizor and OHKO it with unboosted BP, but this calc kinda advises against it:
252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Scizor on a critical hit: 316-373 (94.6 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
because well, this is Stone Edge we're talking about and things do get icky if this single crit occurs, and it's not the brightest idea not to opt for a more 'reliable' (for lack of a better word) strategy in that case. If, on the other hand, Gliscor is the one getting crit and he doesn't manage to make Aero waste all of its PP, this calc looks a lot better: 252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO
This comes down to spamming Roost after the safe MEvo and setting up to +6 anyway. Scizor probably won't exactly be at full health, but hey, the die rolled against you against a ridiculous Aerodactyl set, what're you gonna do.
#424 99RG-WWWW-WWXH-7G7X Double Protect succeeds
#701 TCJW-WWWW-WWXH-7FT8 Gliscor is crit; still, I needed Scizor at +6 simply in case of a Jolteon backup.

744 | Empoleon4 | Calm | Petaya Berry | Surf | Substitute | Blizzard | Whirlpool | HP/SpA
Like Aerodactyl, this set outright loses when it comes out against a boosted Scizor or against Gliscor; it's in the lead position that I'm worried about it, because the combination of Petaya Berry and Torrent is kind of really scary. The most reliable way around it I've found thus far is to open with Grass Knot (it will Surf or Sub), switch to Scizor (it will Blizzard or Sub), set up an SD (it will Surf or Sub), Roost until you're back at full health (252 SpA Empoleon Surf vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Mega Scizor: 69-82 (40.1 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO ehehe) and it has a sub up (unless Scizor has only been hit with Blizzard because then that's gonna be the highest HP you're gonna be at), and then 2HKO by breaking the Sub and finishing it off. With these plays it's not all that unpredictable and, more importantly, I'll keep it out of Torrent Petaya range. The worst that can happen (aside from a Blizzard freeze lol) is a crit right after you break the sub, in which case Gliscor gets a free switch and beats it. It's convoluted for sure, but fortunately it isn't the auto-loss I first made it out to be.
#709 lead Emp4 E8RG-WWWW-WWXH-7FMY

891 | Kingdra4 | Modest | White Herb | Draco Meteor | Surf | Blizzard | Protect | HP/Spd/SpA
Again, something that I can't hit for that much damage and is wildly unpredictable. A cool trick is to have it bop its White Herb via switch stalling, but Protect kinda complicates that, lol. If it Protects on the switch to Scizor, it often does so every other turns and I can take advantage of that by setting up to +6 (Surf does under half), otherwise I set up on it after bopping its White Herb or juggle with Protean (both Grass Knot and Ice Beam hit it for fair damage) but I had a really close call against it (#681 XL7W-WWWW-WWXH-7FUL) when I misplayed by not spamming Roost as liberally as I should and I lost Scizor on what looked like a high damage roll - if the final mon had been more threatening than (non-Sturdy!) Avalugg, that number in the pic above would have been a lot lower.
This mon is another argument for a speedier Gliscor, but again, I can't really spare any bulk for Vap4 among others...

These are easily the ones I'm most afraid of... Situational threats obviously occur once something that I haven't covered fully shows its face at the wrong moment (damn you Volcarona); Fire-types in general are something I'm a tad scared of, because if they show up at the wrong moment two of my three members are weak against them (think Darmanitan4, that one is a huge reason why I prefer to kill something with Surf over Ice Beam if it's all the same otherwise - luring out Electrics for Gliscor to humiliate is not half bad either). Huge annoyances are bulky/not super effectively hit opponents that Greninja can't OHKO and thus considerably dent him in return while I don't have anything that I can reliably switch into it (think Heatran, maybe Latios/Latias although I usually switch Gliscor into those out of fear for the worst case scenario - (Specs) Thunder - while Gliscor either beats most sets or renders them setup bait for Scizor). Naturally there are also the traditional ones, such as Walreon4 (barely not OHKOed by Greninja so that's unfortunate and dangerous, fortunately Gliscor handles it perfectly and hand-delivers it to Scizor for a free +6, e.g. #608 KHFG-WWWW-WWXH-7GWF) and Pinsir4 (damn that thing, fortunately it kinda drowns in options it has to OHKO lead Greninja. Whenever I faced it as a lead, it picked the distinctly less harmful X-Scissor/Close Combat over Guillotine and was rendered setup bait by Gliscor.) A special mention is reserved for this one (these?)

920 | Tornadus1 | Timid | Life Orb | Hurricane | Grass Knot | Focus Blast | Dark Pulse | Spd/SpA
940 | Tornadus2 | Modest | Yache Berry | Substitute | Double Team | Focus Blast | Hurricane | HP/SpA
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 103-122 (58.1 - 68.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 87-103 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 11.3% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 157-187 (106.8 - 127.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 133-157 (90.4 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tornadus: 205-244 (133.1 - 158.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Yache Berry Tornadus: 103-122 (55.3 - 65.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Greninja obviously beats Torn1 but loses to Torn2, but good luck telling them apart, lol - and Gliscor renders Torn2 setup bait for Scizor if it manages to get a Sub up (even if you somehow would manage to miss thirty Bullet Punches through its +6 Evasion before landing a mere two, it's started Struggling before that point, lol. Torn2 is one of the most tedious PP stall+setup victims, but if that Sub goes up it always works). Problem is... yes, even Torn2 can and will use Hurricane against lead Greninja, especially if it comes in second after Greninja has killed an opposing lead. My strategy against lead Tornadus is essentially 'click Ice Beam + pray' lol, because unless I'm missing something it's a pure guess anyway, the odds are in Greninja's favour if I stay in (also taking accuracy and the like into account), and Gliscor is more valuable against Veterans.

May add more if I remember more/somebody reminds me of more. May also add one of those fancy 'how to play against lead X' lists if I feel like it


I've been thinking long and hard about what exactly makes this team stand out from the previous lead Greninja teams. While I still don't quite understand how I of all people managed to do so much better than they did, one thing I did notice was the sheer resiliency of my backups. While Scizor is not quite the best setup sweeper available, it has (close to) the best defensive typing as well as reliable recovery and as such basically only dies if you allow it to or get sloppy; and Gliscor is, well, Gliscor n_n We all know consistency is the most important thing for long maison streaks, and a frail kill-or-be-killed lead like Greninja doesn't really check out in that department; as such, its teammates will have to make up for a lot in this regard. Both of the teammates I chose had reliable/consistent recovery and a great defensive typing, and that can't possibly have hurt. That's also the reason why Jumpman's Greninja/Mega Salamence/Gastrodon sounds structurally sound to me; even with my subpar maison teambuilding skills I see those backups have the reliability a lead Greninja needs, not to mention Gastrodon does beat Gyarados/Aerodactyl/Empoleon :p
I also found the team rather easy to play - there aren't a lot of ambiguous plays, as long as you make sure to set up Scizor whenever possible (e.g. set up against lead Seismitoad rather than kill it with GK) and simply be patient and diligent. I'm still not sure if a lead Greninja team can ascend to the same heights as a team with a lead setup sweeper - obviously those have to set up only once and can then pummel through the backups, whereas a lead Greninja team is essentially back to square one after sniping the opposing lead - but I don't think the gap is as big as I made it out to be initially. Or maybe it's exclusively the Gliscor factor, who knows.

Seriously guys, thanks. Without all of your inspiring stories and all of you challenging each other to push the envelope further and further, I never would have been writing a post about a streak like this using three of my favourite mons. I honestly would have been happy just to beat or get close to my XY streak, but to do it with a margin like this and with so much fun in the process... it's just insane and I'm still sort of waiting until I wake up, lol. I know I probably lucked out with the matchups I got, I know the occasional suboptimal play 'should' have ended my streak sooner, I also know I should have played better in the losing battle, but I don't think overthinking the what-ifs, maybes, and might-have-beens is gonna accomplish anything of value, so I'll just try to let this sink in and resume the triples grind sooner or later ^^

turskain you can keep the longest Greninja streak, I'll hold on to the trophy of longest lead Greninja streak until Jumpman16 inevitably snatches it away from me n_n
This is awesome! So glad to see you putting up numbers worthy of your post history, and that post was an absolute joy to read. I'm glad you enjoyed the team so much too. It makes me wish I had something of this quality to post; unfortunately, I'll be posting nothing but bad (yet just barely adequate) teams until I finish my self-appointed goal for the Omega Ruby Maison :)

Also, just know that from what you've posted, I had WAY more insane match-up hax (and just regular hax) in my favor for my first #1 Singles streak (Togekiss/Mega Khan/Aegislash) and my formerly #1 Rotations streak than you had in this streak. So in my mind, the total number of wins seems entirely fitting of the streak.

In summary, Volcarona can go fuck off and die.
 
I just saw a Heatran use Will-o-Wisp to burn the Terrakion on his own team. Am I missing something here or is that as totally stupid as I think it is?
 
I just saw a Heatran use Will-o-Wisp to burn the Terrakion on his own team. Am I missing something here or is that as totally stupid as I think it is?
The AI Will-O-Wisping its own partner has been commonly documented. I'm playing Multi battles now (sigh...) and I think I've seen the AI burn their teammates just as much as they've burned my Pokemon.

I've also noticed some weird move targets, like Steven's Aerodactyl attacking an opposing Hariyama with Thunder Fang when the other opposing Pokemon is Feraligatr. I'm not sure what that's about (other than, you know, "the AI is dumb"). I'm guessing the AI has "preferred moves" for each opponent and some probabilistic function determines which one they'll attack, with the probabilities skewed in favor of the ones they'll hit harder, but not serving as a 100% guarantee for which opponent they'll attack.
 
The AI Will-O-Wisping its own partner has been commonly documented. I'm playing Multi battles now (sigh...) and I think I've seen the AI burn their teammates just as much as they've burned my Pokemon.

I've also noticed some weird move targets, like Steven's Aerodactyl attacking an opposing Hariyama with Thunder Fang when the other opposing Pokemon is Feraligatr. I'm not sure what that's about (other than, you know, "the AI is dumb"). I'm guessing the AI has "preferred moves" for each opponent and some probabilistic function determines which one they'll attack, with the probabilities skewed in favor of the ones they'll hit harder, but not serving as a 100% guarantee for which opponent they'll attack.
Is this different to XY? I have all 5 trophies there and it seemed like they always went for the most guaranteed kill, except some rare instances in which they'd go for a SE move instead, which is why Aron reks so hilariously?
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon
If it's still relevant, I'd like to submit my contribution to the recent discussion about lead Greninja in Super Singles.

View attachment 37325
#811: 76CW-WWWW-WWXH-7FK4
I'm a bit unsure how to feel about this one. I lost in a rather dumb way, because of a suboptimal play in a really tight spot + a Heat Wave burn and Toxic miss on that exact same turn - I'm the one to blame if my plan around one of my team's top threats isn't sound, though. On the other hand, this number is just... crazy, nothing less. When I first thought up this team, I wasn't sure how good it was; using lead Ninja hadn't resulted in batshit insane streaks thus far - the longest one being atsync's impressive and remarkably early 302 win streak with Specs Greninja, Ferrothorn, and Dragonite - and while it looked structurally sound, I could easily come up a lot of scenarios where I'd at least be backed into a corner, and as I went along it never exuded that same aura of seeming invincibility that I noticed in team Clockwork Angels. I expected it would make it to 50 easily, 100 shouldn't have been a problem either, 200 was possible, maybe even beating my X record of 330 (with MegaKhan/Aegislash/Dragonite) if I lucked out - but 810 just doesn't make any sense at all, lol. The team is the same one that I posted in my five trophy post - I promised I'd go into more detail if I managed to net a proper streak with it, and I guess I did.


Rael (Greninja) @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
Nature: Timid
IVs: 31/5-6/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot
-Dark Pulse


Harlequin (Scizor) @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 31/31/31/24-25/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe
-Bullet Punch
-Bug Bite
-Swords Dance
-Roost


Little Nicky (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Nature: Careful
IVs: 31/31/31/10-11/31/31
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Atk / 36 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
-Substitute
-Protect
-Earthquake
-Toxic

The genesis of this team actually sort of stems from resentment towards my XY singles streak, heh. When I first started playing the XY maison, with barely any track record in battle facilities, I naturally started with singles because I knew squat about the other formats, but it proved to be a tough nut to crack. It probably makes sense that I wanted to try Pokemon I liked at first (seemingly viable ones of course lol, Raichu is one of my old favourites but it didn't remotely cross my mind to try him - well actually he can function as a poor man's Mega Manectric in team Clockwork Angels, but that's not what this post is about) so the first hopefully legit team I thought up consisted of physical attacker EBelt (cause fuk recoil) Infernape / special attacker and revenge killer Sash Zam / wall/pivot Ferrothorn... it worked like I had in mind, but it was just so damn weak and lost at 37 to Volcarona4 (heh).. Anyway, anybody who's ever been stuck in the first ten/twenty battles knows just how haxxy and cheap those sets are, so by then I had gotten tired of singles - fortunately it was around then that I found a youtube vid of a Greninja/Mega Blaziken lead in doubles, so now I had a starting point for that format and tried that one (rather more successfully, although I'm still hoping to one day find the appropriate backups for those two lol), leaving singles behind for then. However, I naturally returned after winning the doubles and triples trophy (rotations and multi seemed even more daunting), turning to a lead with a better track record than Infernape in Cloyster. A thrown together team of Cloyster / WoW/Fake Out absorber Chandelure / powder/paralysis absorber Mega Venusaur brought me to battle 49, where I lost due to a slightly unfortunate matchup and horrible chokes. Then I had had enough, thought 'fine if this how you like it meet a pile of broken shit', "built" a team of Mega Kangaskhan / Aegislash / Dragonite (i.e. literally just the three most powerful singles mons), got the trophy, and eventually brought that streak to 330. However, as I've stated several times in my posts regarding that team, if that's how you come up with a team, that can't help but leave a bitter taste in my mouth. The most enjoyable streaks are obviously those where you like the mons/team (nah), the team is fun to play with (that it actually was sort of, but w/e, not amazing), and easily the most important bit: where you have an actual story to tell about the team's genesis (yeah lol right).

So it was around November that I started thinking about what I wanted to use in the ORAS singles maison. The problem with singles goodstuffs teams is that the pool of viable pokemon is rather narrow (much more narrow than in doubles/triples at the very least), but at least there were a few Pokemon that I really liked and certainly felt like trying out: that one badass bug that sets up to +6 all over more than half of the maison and I had already used a bit on Platinum in Suizomence... Scizor... the modern Starmie, which had played an integral part in my extremely enjoyable doubles and triples teams but was supposedly also terrific in singles... Greninja... and last but not least, the backbone of the most successful super singles goodstuffs team in Jumpman's Kangliscune as well as one of my very favourites altogether ever since it was introduced... Gliscor. Anyway, if you want to build a good singles team you have to have a powerful lead as well as two backups that can switch in on what threatens him, so I thought up a team of Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor. As for Gliscor, with his Ground typing he can naturally switch in on Thunder Waves, one of the status conditions that cripple lead sweepers. The other one is obviously burns, so I thought it would be fun to use a lead sweeper immune to burns in Mega Charizard X. With his juggling with defensive typings (and his initial Earthquake immunity), you basically only need something that can beat users of strong Rock-type moves such as CB Aerodactyl... Suicune. However, I shelved them both: Dragonite/Greninja/Mega Scizor looked a bit too inconsistent because it sort of lacked a backbone, not to mention that sort of thing/lead DNite has kinda been done to death - XZard/Suicune/Gliscor actually looked kinda cool for the novelty of using Charizard X, but it was basically an inferior Kangliscune, not to mention that Hurrrnadus would become a huge pain in the ass because XZard doesn't draw in Focus Blast. It probably would have been manageable still, but whatever. When contemplating those teams, I did notice Greninja/Mega Scizor's excellent defensive synergy, with MegaZor switching in on Bug/Grass/Fairy/generally strong physical attacks and Greninja covering Fire. That did leave Electric and Fighting, which are naturally covered by... Gliscor. Sure, why the fuck not. It sounded in theory like those three would work just fine on a team, so I set out to fill in some more specifics. The first question was obviously 'Greninja/MegaZor: to lead or not to lead?' I sort of liked the idea of a lead Scizor and it has already been done successfully in Aircraft Cemetery's 480 win streak with MegaZor/Garchomp/Azumarill; however, what I liked even more was Mega Scizor's Roost shenanigans on more than half of the maison, and I felt he wouldn't be able to perform those optimally in the lead position, especially when the opposing lead is called Magnet Pull Magnezone, lol. The decisive argument in lead Greninja's favour was this:
161 | Tyrantrum4 | Adamant | Choice Band | Crunch | Dragon Claw | Earthquake | Head Smash | Atk/Spd
... yeah, that exact same thing why I vehemently swear by Adamant Earthquake for lead Kangaskhan (unless you're that terrified of Mismagius4 I guess -definitely not underestimating that one though if it comes off like that- because that's really the only one where Crunch is the one attack you need, but w/e). Imo every goodstuffs singles team must have either a switch-in to this monster (good luck with that ehehe) or a lead that beats it. The one 'ideal scenario' for this team was a game I theorymonned against Nita. She'd lead off with Landorus, so Greninja would naturally switch to Gliscor - then Gliscor would SubProtect away all those measly five Focus Blast PP, and then Scizor would switch in and set up three Swords Dances as Landorus Struggled to death and proceed to sweep her entire team. Needless to say I was pleased as punch when that exact scenario occurred: MYBQ-WWWW-WWX5-3KTR (re. the different Scizor, that's a shiny one I RNG-bred on Soul Silver because a friend of mine wanted a shiny Scizor and I needed a perfect Scizor for team Suizomence on Platinum anyway lol, and I had been too lazy/eager to try the team to breed and train one on OR just yet. However, red >>> green and I wanted to nickname it, so I switched around battle 135 to a regular, OR-native one).
The sets are straightforward for the most part. Greninja's moveset provides the best super effective coverage; Extrasensory could have been an option over Dark Pulse, but fighters are Gliscor bait so I preferred Dark Pulse. atsync used Choice Specs rather than Life Orb in his streak - while there are certainly some cases where the added power would be preferred (*cough*Gyarados4*cough*) the lock-in would be far more detrimental in most cases, especially when a Fire-type comes out as a second mon on an Ice- or Grass-type Greninja. Scald could have been an option over Surf to thaw freezes and is flat-out mandatory if you're using Greninja as a switch option, but I'm still not sure which one is better for a lead. Obviously thawing freezing comes into play far, far less if Greninja leads, but on the other hand there are hardly any clear-cut cases where the added power matters. There was one battle I would have lost if I had been running Scald over Surf (when last-mon Volc came in against a weakened Greninja and I had already lost Gliscor; Scald+BP doesn't KO, whereas Surf+BP does); on the other hand, there was one extremely close battle due to a freeze on Greninja (which wasn't enough to convince me though because the freeze was due to misplays and Scald wouldn't have helped enough).
#508 5GTW-WWWW-WWXH-546J: Lead Bastiodon4, which mandates a switch into Gliscor because you have to attack it from behind a sub because Metal Burst is dumb. However, I don't have a sub up when finishing it off (misplay #1), presumably because it used Curse, which makes Rock Slide always break Gliscor's Subs and obviously makes it harder to kill, so I didn't want to waste too many PP. Out comes Electivire4. Well, fuck. Ice Punch for Gliscor, Fire Punch for Scizor, STAB Thunderpunch for Greninja. However, whenever I face it in the lead position, I kill it with GK+Surf, so I switch into Greninja to do just that (misplay #2)... and it freezes Greninja. Obviously this wouldn't have happened if I had pivoted it in via Scizor, but that's not helping anymore, lol. Greninja doesn't unfreeze and dies, I send in Gliscor. I legit don't recall my thought process here but it can't have been that much because I had sort of given up already the very moment Greninja got frozen... However, since Gliscor apparently survives EVire's Ice Punch, I click Earthquake and see it deal around 50%. I know I need to keep Gliscor alive if I somehow make it to the mystery last mon and that turns out to be Jolteon or something, so I switch out to Scizor, who obviously takes the Ice Punch. At this point Scizor has 150 HP remaining; as I run the calc for Fire Punch, I see that a max roll deals 152 damage, whereas the next highest roll deals 148 damage. Seeing as I 'have to' take the hit anyway because BP doesn't KO (unless I'm gonna rely on a crit) and I don't know what that mystery last mon is gonna be, I click Swords Dance. No hax, and Scizor lives with 18 (low roll lmao) HP. BP KOes Electivire. The mystery last mon is Tyrantrum4. Am I glad I clicked SD (and that GameFreak didn't give EVire more powerful coverage moves).

Scizor is completely standard; Superpower might have been an option over Roost, but Roost is kinda what makes Scizor so powerful... He legit doesn't give a shit about anything that can't 2HKO him and sets up to +6 on so much.. (a Protect lead such as Bouffalant is basically a guaranteed +6 Scizor at full health, lol, as are Trick Room setters such as Slowking, Bronzong, and Aromatisse). The 44 Spe EVs put Scizor at 101 Spe, one point above the crowded 100 tier that also contains notorious annoyances such as Shiftry4 (hurrah for outprioritising Sucker Punch) and Mandibuzz4. Gliscor's moveset is completely standard; I used a specially defensive Gliscor because he prefers to outslow opponents anyway in order to maintain a sub at all times, the previous streaks with Gliscor, such as Jumpman's, kinda demonstrated he's gonna have to take on a lot of special attackers, and his natural physical bulk is already excellent without much investment. As such, I used a Careful nature with full SpD investment, while 212 HP EVs provide the highest Poison Heal number. I only run 4 Spe EVs because that puts Scizor at the only empty tier within its reach. Of the remaining 40 EVs, 36 are invested into Defense, and because the remaining 4 wouldn't do anything in that stat they're put into Attack.

As for the loss, well, to quote the person who holds the longest Greninja streak altogether in singles:

While Volcarona is a notorious asshole, it isn't /that/ high on my shitlist because Greninja obviously handles it (2HKOes with Surf, chance to OHKO even, while it doesn't outspeed after a single QD) and it also loses if it comes out against Gliscor (it's got seven turns before it succumbs to Toxic damage, which is nowhere near enough to muscle through it); however, spit obviously hits the fan if it comes out against Scizor. That's what happened in the lost battle. Black Belt Tyrell sent out Poliwrath, so I set out to 2HKO it with Grass Knot; surprisingly, it used Circle Throw - whereas it always used Focus Punch against Ninja the gazillion times I faced it prior - and brought in Scizor. Because it probably likes to throw out setup sweepers and I don't want to have get Greninja OHKOed by switching it back in on a Focus Punch or Circle Throw, I just KO it with Bug Bite + Bullet Punch - out comes Volc. Now, the plan I thought out prior in case this ever were to happen was to switch to Gliscor and Toxic it - because I auto-lose if it QDs on the switch to Ninja and it's an unpredictable asshole - so that's what I do (in hindsight sacking Ninja or Scizor was probably more prudent because it's for like 99% guaranteed to use Heat Wave anyway). On the switch, Heat Wave burns Gliscor, and Toxic misses. I've had several lucky breaks on this streak (how else could it have gotten this long lol) but there was no coming back from something like that and I don't really feel like typing out the following turns because it should be pretty obvious how the rest played out, lol.

In spite of the teambuilding process that was obviously far more present is this team than in my XY one, there are still several key threats that I really don't like facing. There are ways around them, but these are the foes where you reeeaallly don't want to get haxed.

889 | Gyarados4 | Careful | Chesto Berry | Dragon Dance | Aqua Tail | Earthquake | Rest | HP/SpD
This one takes the cake, easily:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados: 83-99 (41 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO - meaning it uses Greninja as setup bait if it feels like it. Resists both Scizor's STABs and has Rest to counter Toxic. The plan is basically to just spam Grass Knot. It doesn't outspeed Greninja after one DD, so the first two are guaranteed to land, and it 'has to' use Rest if it wants to survive a third one (doesn't OHKO Grass-type Greninja at +2). If Gyarados picks its moves right, which is DD - DD - Rest - DD or attacking move - attacking move, it beats Greninja but can be picked off by Scizor's BP. If it misplays only once though, Greninja beats it no sweat. Fortunately that did occur frequently. For some reason it really likes to use Earthquake against Greninja right after it comes in (e.g. #567, CHLW-WWWW-WWXH-7G4V) and I also once beat one that Dragon Danced three times after showing up (like what the hell, unfortunately I forgot to save that vid). If it does pick its moves right, however, I lose a Pokemon, and if it crits on top of that... let's say I don't wanna think about that. This very mon is an argument in favour of lead Specs Greninja in the lead if ever I've seen one (unfortunately I've seen tons of arguments to the contrary) or a fast Gliscor (which stalls out its attacking PP, but unfortunately there's this calc:
252+ SpA Vaporeon Shadow Ball vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 39-47 (22 - 26.5%) -- possible 7HKO after Poison Heal
(39, 40, 40, 41, 41, 42, 42, 43, 43, 44, 44, 45, 45, 46, 46, 47)
i.e. a 2/3 chance not to break my Sub, and if I want to beat this thing I don't have enough SubProtect PP to stall out three moves)

853 | Aerodactyl4 | Jolly | Choice Band | Stone Edge | Aerial Ace | Earthquake | Crunch | Atk/Spd
Jumpman16 already identified this thing as public enemy #1 for lead Greninja, and while I'm even more scared of Gyarados (because that one simply sweeps my entire team if it gets past Ninja), I stand a very high chance to lose a Pokemon to it; however, if that happens, my workaround results in a +6 Scizor too, so it could be worse. If it comes out against Greninja, I switch in Gliscor and spam Protect. If nothing out of the ordinary happens, it goes switch in Gliscor and eat a Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and eat a second Stone Edge - Protect - fail to double Protect and die. At that point, however, it has wasted all of its Stone Edge PP, so I switch in Scizor and use Swords Dance three times and Roost once while it Struggles to death. Add on to that that between the odds of a double Protect succeeding and Stone Edge's accuracy, the odds of Gliscor surviving are actually not half bad, so it's far from an auto-loss against this thing even though I flat-out don't have a counter to it...
Another option is to simply switch in Scizor and OHKO it with unboosted BP, but this calc kinda advises against it:
252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Scizor on a critical hit: 316-373 (94.6 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
because well, this is Stone Edge we're talking about and things do get icky if this single crit occurs, and it's not the brightest idea not to opt for a more 'reliable' (for lack of a better word) strategy in that case. If, on the other hand, Gliscor is the one getting crit and he doesn't manage to make Aero waste all of its PP, this calc looks a lot better: 252 Atk Choice Band Aerodactyl Stone Edge vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO
This comes down to spamming Roost after the safe MEvo and setting up to +6 anyway. Scizor probably won't exactly be at full health, but hey, the die rolled against you against a ridiculous Aerodactyl set, what're you gonna do.
#424 99RG-WWWW-WWXH-7G7X Double Protect succeeds
#701 TCJW-WWWW-WWXH-7FT8 Gliscor is crit; still, I needed Scizor at +6 simply in case of a Jolteon backup.

744 | Empoleon4 | Calm | Petaya Berry | Surf | Substitute | Blizzard | Whirlpool | HP/SpA
Like Aerodactyl, this set outright loses when it comes out against a boosted Scizor or against Gliscor; it's in the lead position that I'm worried about it, because the combination of Petaya Berry and Torrent is kind of really scary. The most reliable way around it I've found thus far is to open with Grass Knot (it will Surf or Sub), switch to Scizor (it will Blizzard or Sub), set up an SD (it will Surf or Sub), Roost until you're back at full health (252 SpA Empoleon Surf vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Mega Scizor: 69-82 (40.1 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO ehehe) and it has a sub up (unless Scizor has only been hit with Blizzard because then that's gonna be the highest HP you're gonna be at), and then 2HKO by breaking the Sub and finishing it off. With these plays it's not all that unpredictable and, more importantly, I'll keep it out of Torrent Petaya range. The worst that can happen (aside from a Blizzard freeze lol) is a crit right after you break the sub, in which case Gliscor gets a free switch and beats it. It's convoluted for sure, but fortunately it isn't the auto-loss I first made it out to be.
#709 lead Emp4 E8RG-WWWW-WWXH-7FMY

891 | Kingdra4 | Modest | White Herb | Draco Meteor | Surf | Blizzard | Protect | HP/Spd/SpA
Again, something that I can't hit for that much damage and is wildly unpredictable. A cool trick is to have it bop its White Herb via switch stalling, but Protect kinda complicates that, lol. If it Protects on the switch to Scizor, it often does so every other turns and I can take advantage of that by setting up to +6 (Surf does under half), otherwise I set up on it after bopping its White Herb or juggle with Protean (both Grass Knot and Ice Beam hit it for fair damage) but I had a really close call against it (#681 XL7W-WWWW-WWXH-7FUL) when I misplayed by not spamming Roost as liberally as I should and I lost Scizor on what looked like a high damage roll - if the final mon had been more threatening than (non-Sturdy!) Avalugg, that number in the pic above would have been a lot lower.
This mon is another argument for a speedier Gliscor, but again, I can't really spare any bulk for Vap4 among others...

These are easily the ones I'm most afraid of... Situational threats obviously occur once something that I haven't covered fully shows its face at the wrong moment (damn you Volcarona); Fire-types in general are something I'm a tad scared of, because if they show up at the wrong moment two of my three members are weak against them (think Darmanitan4, that one is a huge reason why I prefer to kill something with Surf over Ice Beam if it's all the same otherwise - luring out Electrics for Gliscor to humiliate is not half bad either). Huge annoyances are bulky/not super effectively hit opponents that Greninja can't OHKO and thus considerably dent him in return while I don't have anything that I can reliably switch into it (think Heatran, maybe Latios/Latias although I usually switch Gliscor into those out of fear for the worst case scenario - (Specs) Thunder - while Gliscor either beats most sets or renders them setup bait for Scizor). Naturally there are also the traditional ones, such as Walreon4 (barely not OHKOed by Greninja so that's unfortunate and dangerous, fortunately Gliscor handles it perfectly and hand-delivers it to Scizor for a free +6, e.g. #608 KHFG-WWWW-WWXH-7GWF) and Pinsir4 (damn that thing, fortunately it kinda drowns in options it has to OHKO lead Greninja. Whenever I faced it as a lead, it picked the distinctly less harmful X-Scissor/Close Combat over Guillotine and was rendered setup bait by Gliscor.) A special mention is reserved for this one (these?)

920 | Tornadus1 | Timid | Life Orb | Hurricane | Grass Knot | Focus Blast | Dark Pulse | Spd/SpA
940 | Tornadus2 | Modest | Yache Berry | Substitute | Double Team | Focus Blast | Hurricane | HP/SpA
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 103-122 (58.1 - 68.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 212 HP / 252+ SpD Gliscor: 87-103 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 11.3% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Life Orb Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 157-187 (106.8 - 127.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 133-157 (90.4 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tornadus: 205-244 (133.1 - 158.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Yache Berry Tornadus: 103-122 (55.3 - 65.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Greninja obviously beats Torn1 but loses to Torn2, but good luck telling them apart, lol - and Gliscor renders Torn2 setup bait for Scizor if it manages to get a Sub up (even if you somehow would manage to miss thirty Bullet Punches through its +6 Evasion before landing a mere two, it's started Struggling before that point, lol. Torn2 is one of the most tedious PP stall+setup victims, but if that Sub goes up it always works). Problem is... yes, even Torn2 can and will use Hurricane against lead Greninja, especially if it comes in second after Greninja has killed an opposing lead. My strategy against lead Tornadus is essentially 'click Ice Beam + pray' lol, because unless I'm missing something it's a pure guess anyway, the odds are in Greninja's favour if I stay in (also taking accuracy and the like into account), and Gliscor is more valuable against Veterans.

May add more if I remember more/somebody reminds me of more. May also add one of those fancy 'how to play against lead X' lists if I feel like it


I've been thinking long and hard about what exactly makes this team stand out from the previous lead Greninja teams. While I still don't quite understand how I of all people managed to do so much better than they did, one thing I did notice was the sheer resiliency of my backups. While Scizor is not quite the best setup sweeper available, it has (close to) the best defensive typing as well as reliable recovery and as such basically only dies if you allow it to or get sloppy; and Gliscor is, well, Gliscor n_n We all know consistency is the most important thing for long maison streaks, and a frail kill-or-be-killed lead like Greninja doesn't really check out in that department; as such, its teammates will have to make up for a lot in this regard. Both of the teammates I chose had reliable/consistent recovery and a great defensive typing, and that can't possibly have hurt. That's also the reason why Jumpman's Greninja/Mega Salamence/Gastrodon sounds structurally sound to me; even with my subpar maison teambuilding skills I see those backups have the reliability a lead Greninja needs, not to mention Gastrodon does beat Gyarados/Aerodactyl/Empoleon :p
I also found the team rather easy to play - there aren't a lot of ambiguous plays, as long as you make sure to set up Scizor whenever possible (e.g. set up against lead Seismitoad rather than kill it with GK) and simply be patient and diligent. I'm still not sure if a lead Greninja team can ascend to the same heights as a team with a lead setup sweeper - obviously those have to set up only once and can then pummel through the backups, whereas a lead Greninja team is essentially back to square one after sniping the opposing lead - but I don't think the gap is as big as I made it out to be initially. Or maybe it's exclusively the Gliscor factor, who knows.

Seriously guys, thanks. Without all of your inspiring stories and all of you challenging each other to push the envelope further and further, I never would have been writing a post about a streak like this using three of my favourite mons. I honestly would have been happy just to beat or get close to my XY streak, but to do it with a margin like this and with so much fun in the process... it's just insane and I'm still sort of waiting until I wake up, lol. I know I probably lucked out with the matchups I got, I know the occasional suboptimal play 'should' have ended my streak sooner, I also know I should have played better in the losing battle, but I don't think overthinking the what-ifs, maybes, and might-have-beens is gonna accomplish anything of value, so I'll just try to let this sink in and resume the triples grind sooner or later ^^

turskain you can keep the longest Greninja streak, I'll hold on to the trophy of longest lead Greninja streak until Jumpman16 inevitably snatches it away from me n_n
This was a great read. I didn't even realise that my streak was the longest one involving lead Greninja haha. I guess I assumed that it had been beaten already, and I'm glad it has been now since your team looks more reliable than mine (Greninja/Ferrothorn/Dragonite can deal with most things under the right conditions but there are a lot of things that can screw you over when things are set up unfavourably against you).

It's funny that you mentioned Gyarados4 and Choice Specs: comparing my team to yours, my back-ups probably have an easier time with it than yours do, and yet I'm the one running Choice Specs lol. But my decision to run Specs was more dictated by availability than viability and I probably would have run Life Orb instead had I had one at the time. I'm currently making my way through ORAS Maison for the trophies so I may just try that.

Dark Pulse vs. Extrasensory would be team dependent but I imagine Dark Pulse would be preferred most of the time. In my case however...well, Ferrothorn often can't do anything against Black Belts/Battle Girls and Dragonite by itself is hardly the best counter to those trainers, so Extrasensory is my preferred option. I would kill for Dark Pulse too but I only have 4 move slots - just have to accept that Dry Skin Jynx4 is pretty much a streak-ender if Ferrothorn is dead :(
 
I've also noticed some weird move targets, like Steven's Aerodactyl attacking an opposing Hariyama with Thunder Fang when the other opposing Pokemon is Feraligatr. I'm not sure what that's about (other than, you know, "the AI is dumb"). I'm guessing the AI has "preferred moves" for each opponent and some probabilistic function determines which one they'll attack, with the probabilities skewed in favor of the ones they'll hit harder, but not serving as a 100% guarantee for which opponent they'll attack.
That's much easier to explain- when the AI has absolutely no moves that will KO a target, it selects both targets and moves randomly. It's also how you get those opponents that use Trick Room and then immediately shut it off the following turn.

Though the AI does also seem to have some "preference" in these situations. They love their spread moves, no matter how weak or its ability to KO their own partners, and we all know their penchant for exploding because it's *technically* their strongest option at the time. Taunt and Trick Room are also favorites when there are no KOs on the table.

The next time this happens, I should try to verify if the Will-O user has Flash Fire. I'm wondering if a bug in the programming causes the AI to acknowledge one of its pokes has Flash Fire and thus can be powered up, but stops at properly registering which one. I know I've seen this retarded misplay done by Chandelure (most frequent offender) Houndoom and Entei. And whaddya know, all can potentially have FF as an ability.
 

turskain

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That's much easier to explain- when the AI has absolutely no moves that will KO a target, it selects both targets and moves randomly. It's also how you get those opponents that use Trick Room and then immediately shut it off the following turn.

Though the AI does also seem to have some "preference" in these situations. They love their spread moves, no matter how weak or its ability to KO their own partners, and we all know their penchant for exploding because it's *technically* their strongest option at the time. Taunt and Trick Room are also favorites when there are no KOs on the table.

The next time this happens, I should try to verify if the Will-O user has Flash Fire. I'm wondering if a bug in the programming causes the AI to acknowledge one of its pokes has Flash Fire and thus can be powered up, but stops at properly registering which one. I know I've seen this retarded misplay done by Chandelure (most frequent offender) Houndoom and Entei. And whaddya know, all can potentially have FF as an ability.
Spiritomb4 and Cofagrigus4 also burn their allies that can't have Flash Fire - I'd speculate that there is some attempt to check for Flash Fire on allies which is broken in a way that results in all allies looking like good targets regardless of their ability. Very rarely, it manages to use Will-O-Wisp on an ally that has Flash Fire.

I've also seen the AI use Swagger on an ally that is holding Lum Berry on very rare occasions - that seems to work properly, as it happens only when the ally actually has a Lum Berry, unlike with Will-O-Wisp.
 
Hey guys, I just completed IR's main story and am thinking of maisoning a little bit for a change.

I looked at all the teams around for singles, I didn't see any Mega Pinsir around, is it that bad at Maison or just that no one has used it?I've always liked Pinsir, so I wanted to know if it was useful or not, if it is useful, what are potential good partners for it and if it isn't useful, then why?
 

The Dutch Plumberjack

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Hey guys, I just completed IR's main story and am thinking of maisoning a little bit for a change.

I looked at all the teams around for singles, I didn't see any Mega Pinsir around, is it that bad at Maison or just that no one has used it?I've always liked Pinsir, so I wanted to know if it was useful or not, if it is useful, what are potential good partners for it and if it isn't useful, then why?
The problem with Pinsir is that while it's exceedingly powerful in an average battle, it's just a tad too inconsistent/outclassed altogether between a dreadful defensive typing, good-but-not-great bulk, inability to hold Lum Berry as a safety net against status leads, no Mold Breaker/Parental Bond to ignore Sturdy and Focus Sash, etc, and there's no real reason to use it over something like Scizor. It kinda has Mega Blaziken syndrome really (which is also hardly seen on the singles leaderboards for similar reasons). You're not looking for something that's potentially as powerful as possible, you're looking for something that can still win even if the odds are against you.
While I'm unaware of anybody who has tried using it seriously, in theory it certainly seems usable if you want to try using it for the trophy/a just for fun run and don't care that much about a 200+ (or w/e) streak. As for teammates, assuming you're using it as a lead, you'll want something able to switch in on its weaknesses as well as status users and take advantage of them - some things that come to mind are Aegislash, Gliscor, and Suicune. Aegislash's defensive synergy with Pinsir seems alright at first glance, but in that case you're gonna need a Fire-resistant status absorber as your third poke, and the best (and for now only lol) thing that comes to mind is Suicune. Because Leftovers is basically mandatory on Aegislash you're pretty much locking yourself into Chesto Berry for Suicune so that's a bit unfortunate, but hopefully this should give you something to start with.
 
Nah, I'll just drop Pinsir then...

I just didn't wanna use stuff like Durant/Aron/Mega Khan, anything else is fair game.

Would Mega-Meta serve me well?No Cheese did a run with it and it seems great + it's a new Mega, what partners should I use?
 

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