Why not simply create a new ORAS section above the current X/Y section, regardless of the amount of modes it will have? :).
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Battle Maison Discussion & Records
- Thread starter NoCheese
- Start date
Why not simply create a new ORAS section above the current X/Y section, regardless of the amount of modes it will have? :).
Thanks for updating. I was so happy to finally get all those trophies. :D
But...
Does my Super Multi-Battle with AI record not count? I mean, I understand if it doesn't, I suck, butbutbut........
Also wondering if I am the only one that Tru-Ant doesn't work for at all? The AI switches on me.
Nope, your streak is fine. I just messed up and only added you to the trophy hall of fame, not the AI multi battle leaderboard. That's been fixed.
As for TruAnt, that seems very unusual. The AI normally only switches in a very small set of circumstances, and being locked into loafing every other turn isn't one of them. Was this a one battle thing, or does it keep happening? If it does, I know I'd love to see some videos so we can try to figure out what's going on.
Thanks! :D
I'll have to try it again to see if it does it consistently, or if it was just a freak occurance. I just remember the one time I tried to use it, it switched when it had no reason to (like you said, TruAnt shouldn't trigger it to switch, and I'm pretty sure nothing else was in play that would have caused it to). It was a long time ago and I didn't save the video.
But yeah, I'll try it again and see what happens. Can't really lose either way. ;)
The AI will still switch if it has no moves that can hit the Pokemon out. For example, if CB Gogoat uses Earthquake against Durant, you won't be able to set up a Gyarados.
I know. I just could have sworn it did it to me when it wasn't a situation like that at least once. xP
Like I said, I'll have to try it again and see what happens. xD
I've done a handful of battles with Truant Durant and haven't seen anything out of the ordinary. It may have been a set you didn't expect that had no moves that can hit your Pokemon (e.g. a Worker Rasmus set with a Sand Veil Pokemon that could have been all four sets, for example). I don't know if you were using some weird Truant + status combination, but occasionally, if a Natural Cure Pokemon is affected by status, it will switch out.
Yeah, when I read that you had copied Team Suizorus at all to build your streak my first feeling was annoyance, lol. In the mind of the leaderboard-topping team creator, "uh, of course you got a big streak with my team. It's awesome...which is why I used it, and posted it, and posted about it in great detail. Surely those seeing this guy's post will recognize that?". I feel that way every single generation, for reasons that are pretty easy for everyone to understand—I bust my ass to make, use, and post in great detail about all my accomplished teams. And all three of those, like "used, posted, and posted about in great detail" above are very separate things.
We do need all of those separate things to authenticate streaks, though, and "team stealing" is just one of the cons of how records need to be authenticated. I have thought about just posting teams without going into detail, even though I am very much the mad genius who can't wait to divulge his plans for world domination to anyone within earshot. And if there were a way to prove that I used a different team from turskain to get to 2,500 in triples or whatever, I would consider that if only to prevent team stealing of the "best" team, since we're judged on records after all.
But we're judged by more than that, of course, like it or not. If I had posted a record of 1,300 in singles by taking a video of the whole "Battle 1,301 is next!..." sequence to where the foe sends out the first, singular poke (to prove that it's a singles streak)...ok? I have the record...good job bro?
Now think of if someone else did that, someone without my singles track record and documented "mad-genius" syndrome. Again, his or her streak would be 100% legit, but...something would be missing, right? Right. Now, that person may care less about explaining him- or herself and predominantly be motivated by just having a top(-three) streak, which is where my own motivations and inclinations usually serve to sell me short. Recognition is a big, BIG deal to me in every walk of my life, probably bigger than it should be but whatever.
Which brings me to NoCheese and his posts farther down that page (82) about Specs Sylveon in Triples and even not leading with it. (And, upon editing, seeing that the Blastoise idea floated just posts later is being employed right now as of this page!) My same value of recognizing inclines me to say "oops!" even though I (know I) have done nothing wrong but be perpetually behind in this thread. I can benefit from his suggestion to use 12 HP EVs cause speed only needs to be 111 just as much as he may benefit from my own idea to use Swift as a secondary move on Sylveon. All in all recognition AND detailed posts go a long way to making this thread awesome...as does the posting of awesome original ideas.
Battle 370 (369 wins)
NU7W-WWWW-WWWA-4KEM
Hiker Choss, lead Rhyperior4
Turn 1: Flash, EQ hits (75%)
Turn 2: Taunt, EQ hits (75%)
Turn 3: Entrainment, EQ hits and gets a critical hit (4.69%). It was also a maximum damage roll on top of the crit, but Durant's EVs allow it to survive regardless.
Turns 4-39: Glalie sets up for as long as it wants without ever having to take a hit while not behind a Sub, KOs Rhyperior and Hariyama (completely hax-proof)
Turn 40: Unaware Quagsire comes out (1/3 of a Pokemon out of the 49 [0.68%] this trainer could have had come out 2nd or 3rd) and breaks my Sub
Turn 41: Quagsire gets a critical hit
Turn 42: Quagire uses Curse as I use Protect to get out of critical hit KO range
Turns 43-45: Quagsire attacks the rest of its turns, surviving Durant's desperation X Scissor thanks to the +1 Defense it got from the clairvoyant use of Curse.
If I had used Frost Breath instead of Protect on turn 42 Durant would have had a higher chance of KOing +1 Quagsire depending on the damage rolls leading up to it, but the other 5 or so times I've faced an Unaware Quagsire without having a healthy Durant to switch in it used Curse/Amnesia at least one of its first 2 turns out.
NU7W-WWWW-WWWA-4KEM
Hiker Choss, lead Rhyperior4
Turn 1: Flash, EQ hits (75%)
Turn 2: Taunt, EQ hits (75%)
Turn 3: Entrainment, EQ hits and gets a critical hit (4.69%). It was also a maximum damage roll on top of the crit, but Durant's EVs allow it to survive regardless.
Turns 4-39: Glalie sets up for as long as it wants without ever having to take a hit while not behind a Sub, KOs Rhyperior and Hariyama (completely hax-proof)
Turn 40: Unaware Quagsire comes out (1/3 of a Pokemon out of the 49 [0.68%] this trainer could have had come out 2nd or 3rd) and breaks my Sub
Turn 41: Quagsire gets a critical hit
Turn 42: Quagire uses Curse as I use Protect to get out of critical hit KO range
Turns 43-45: Quagsire attacks the rest of its turns, surviving Durant's desperation X Scissor thanks to the +1 Defense it got from the clairvoyant use of Curse.
If I had used Frost Breath instead of Protect on turn 42 Durant would have had a higher chance of KOing +1 Quagsire depending on the damage rolls leading up to it, but the other 5 or so times I've faced an Unaware Quagsire without having a healthy Durant to switch in it used Curse/Amnesia at least one of its first 2 turns out.
A loss with a good team is painful enough. A loss with a team that fights battles really slowly is worse. And a loss on turn 45...well that just rubs salt in the wound. Oof. Still, awesome to see all the success you've had in three separate runs with such a unique squad, GG Unit! Glalie and Sableye...perhaps the unlikeliest of Maison heroes!
I appreciate that GF blatantly designed that thing for Trick Room. That speed, that spread in general, and abilities made for doubles, particularly Taunt blocking, one of TR's most important checks. Anyway, good job!
3000!
Battle video: #3000 - VZQW-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8G vs. Skarmory/Archeops/Honchkrow/Hawlucha/Zebstrika/Togekiss (previous Triples videos and the Sharpedo losses removed)
Team writeup: HERE (slightly updated)
Two close calls from earlier in the streak:
Battle video: #2730 - MG5W-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8L vs. Raikou/Zapdos/Terrakion/Thundurus/Latias/Registeel
Zapdos2 appears in the center and dodges a ridiculously high amount of attacks while Raikou keeps boosting with Calm Mind. If the back-up to come out first was anything more threatening than Registeel, losing would have been possible.
Battle video: #1665 - LX8W-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8T vs. Alakazam/Trevenant/Dusknoir/Mismagius/Claydol/Spiritomb
Anastasia sends out Trick Room, and large misplays with some hax result in an extremely close battle, ending with Rotom-W locked into HP Water against Dusknoir3 (Double Team). With luck, Rotom-W lands the decisive HP Waters and wins the duel with 2HP left. You could say I was "supposed" to lose, but Rotom-W's bulk and power were just enough to barely enable the victory. It was still lucky, to be sure, but any less bulk and it wouldn't have survived for as long as it did.
Edit: actually watched the battle again (it's been a while), seems like I misremembered a bit. Rotom-W's HP didn't matter, since it only took burn damage throughout the battle, and Talonflame was there to help against Dusknoir in the end before dying to Toxic (its Brave Bird hitting was crucial, though if it missed it would have survived longer thanks to not taking recoil damage). The misplays were horrid: forgetting the possibility of Claydol3 targeting Lucario, forgetting Alakazam is outsped by Mega Lucario under TR and KO'd by cross-field Aura Sphere after being weakened, Earthquaking Scizor critically when Dusknoir using Protect every other turn was "obvious". Turn 1 also set the tone for the battle with big misplays, as Trevenant4 is KO'd by Flash Cannon + Thunderbolt and Alakazam could just be ignored most of the time (Alakazam4 using Trick on Turn 1 is ultra rare, though) and if Dusknoir4 were to set up TR, it would do nothing anyway. Attacking Alakazam later was also a mistake, as it didn't have Specs anymore, making its damage irrelevant.
Well, it's been 2000 battles since the initial write-up. The team continues to look invincible, outside large hax and misplays. The speed of the team is around 20 battles per hour, so I'm around 150 hours into the streak now. The streak has yielded ~21000 BP so far, which is enough to max the BP counter at 9999 twice over and buy 437 Rare Candies. I've also gone 1500+ battles without changing Scizor, which means the team's been unchanged for the majority of the streak now!
Battle video: #3000 - VZQW-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8G vs. Skarmory/Archeops/Honchkrow/Hawlucha/Zebstrika/Togekiss (previous Triples videos and the Sharpedo losses removed)
Team writeup: HERE (slightly updated)
Two close calls from earlier in the streak:
Battle video: #2730 - MG5W-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8L vs. Raikou/Zapdos/Terrakion/Thundurus/Latias/Registeel
Zapdos2 appears in the center and dodges a ridiculously high amount of attacks while Raikou keeps boosting with Calm Mind. If the back-up to come out first was anything more threatening than Registeel, losing would have been possible.
Battle video: #1665 - LX8W-WWWW-WWWA-4Q8T vs. Alakazam/Trevenant/Dusknoir/Mismagius/Claydol/Spiritomb
Anastasia sends out Trick Room, and large misplays with some hax result in an extremely close battle, ending with Rotom-W locked into HP Water against Dusknoir3 (Double Team). With luck, Rotom-W lands the decisive HP Waters and wins the duel with 2HP left. You could say I was "supposed" to lose, but Rotom-W's bulk and power were just enough to barely enable the victory. It was still lucky, to be sure, but any less bulk and it wouldn't have survived for as long as it did.
Edit: actually watched the battle again (it's been a while), seems like I misremembered a bit. Rotom-W's HP didn't matter, since it only took burn damage throughout the battle, and Talonflame was there to help against Dusknoir in the end before dying to Toxic (its Brave Bird hitting was crucial, though if it missed it would have survived longer thanks to not taking recoil damage). The misplays were horrid: forgetting the possibility of Claydol3 targeting Lucario, forgetting Alakazam is outsped by Mega Lucario under TR and KO'd by cross-field Aura Sphere after being weakened, Earthquaking Scizor critically when Dusknoir using Protect every other turn was "obvious". Turn 1 also set the tone for the battle with big misplays, as Trevenant4 is KO'd by Flash Cannon + Thunderbolt and Alakazam could just be ignored most of the time (Alakazam4 using Trick on Turn 1 is ultra rare, though) and if Dusknoir4 were to set up TR, it would do nothing anyway. Attacking Alakazam later was also a mistake, as it didn't have Specs anymore, making its damage irrelevant.
Well, it's been 2000 battles since the initial write-up. The team continues to look invincible, outside large hax and misplays. The speed of the team is around 20 battles per hour, so I'm around 150 hours into the streak now. The streak has yielded ~21000 BP so far, which is enough to max the BP counter at 9999 twice over and buy 437 Rare Candies. I've also gone 1500+ battles without changing Scizor, which means the team's been unchanged for the majority of the streak now!
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So I guess a Dragon Dancing mono-attack Dragon is going to be viable on a crippler team again?
Salamence@Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate -> Aerilate
EVs: 252Atk/212SpD/44Spe
Lv. 50 stats: 171/216/150/126/137/146
(Base Stats: 95/145/130/120/90/120)
Nature: Adamant
~ Return
~ Dragon Dance
~ Substitute
~ Roost
Okay, so this thing's Aerilate Return is almost 10% stronger than Haxorus's Outrage. That's pretty dumb, considering that the reason mono Dragonite can't sweep the whole Maison is because of Fairies that wall Dragon Claw. The EVs give it enough speed to outpace all Gardy, Medicham, Togekiss and Altaria at +0 speed, should that ever matter (it shouldn't on a traditional and well-built crippler team). Rest of the EVs in SpD because why not: you're only OHKOed by Starmie4's IB 5/16 times (3/16 if you decide to just max SpD at Speed's detriment).
For some numbers:
0 Def Bastiodon: 85-101 (50.8 - 60.4%) -- 91.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
This is Bastiodon4. Quad resist, 168 Base Def, STAB SE move, Metal Burst, and a Sitrus Berry to top this seemingly-shit cake. Except you can literally never lose to this pokemon even if you're not subbed at +6: Metal Burst does 151 HP max damage (you have 170 HP), its could-not-be-stronger Rock Slide does 47% max, and you just Roost the next turn giving no fucks about anything. Aggron is actually probably worse because of Taunt, but you do 55% min (and it does less with Metal Burst since 180 > 168).
There's actually merit to Double Edge if you wanted to be obnoxious too, but let's be realistic lol. If we did use DE, it would necessarily mean we would only have to get to +4 any time, because we just saw that the biggest walls we can face can't be OHKOed anyway, and that's before a possible (probable, lol #MurphysLaw) Sturdy which completely renders getting to +6 moot. Speaking of Sturdy, this next calc starts to get at why the SpD EVs are actually useful in a pinch:
252 Def Magnezone: 72-85 (49.6 - 58.6%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
212 SpD Salamence: 75-88 (44.1 - 51.7%) -- 10.2% chance to 2HKO
That chance for Zone reduces to literally 1/256 if we max our SpD. Obviously we're way more worried about being CHed or statused in general, but these numbers are frankly why I love this game.
Sash and Sturdy are the main barriers to this since Salamence doesn't have Dragonite's Multiscale (or Leftovers), so maybe Stealth Rock could fit on a, like, Uxie lead, especially with the knowledge that Salamence absolutely doesn't need to get to +6 to sweep the floors of the Maison.
Salamence@Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate -> Aerilate
EVs: 252Atk/212SpD/44Spe
Lv. 50 stats: 171/216/150/126/137/146
(Base Stats: 95/145/130/120/90/120)
Nature: Adamant
~ Return
~ Dragon Dance
~ Substitute
~ Roost
Okay, so this thing's Aerilate Return is almost 10% stronger than Haxorus's Outrage. That's pretty dumb, considering that the reason mono Dragonite can't sweep the whole Maison is because of Fairies that wall Dragon Claw. The EVs give it enough speed to outpace all Gardy, Medicham, Togekiss and Altaria at +0 speed, should that ever matter (it shouldn't on a traditional and well-built crippler team). Rest of the EVs in SpD because why not: you're only OHKOed by Starmie4's IB 5/16 times (3/16 if you decide to just max SpD at Speed's detriment).
For some numbers:
0 Def Bastiodon: 85-101 (50.8 - 60.4%) -- 91.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
This is Bastiodon4. Quad resist, 168 Base Def, STAB SE move, Metal Burst, and a Sitrus Berry to top this seemingly-shit cake. Except you can literally never lose to this pokemon even if you're not subbed at +6: Metal Burst does 151 HP max damage (you have 170 HP), its could-not-be-stronger Rock Slide does 47% max, and you just Roost the next turn giving no fucks about anything. Aggron is actually probably worse because of Taunt, but you do 55% min (and it does less with Metal Burst since 180 > 168).
There's actually merit to Double Edge if you wanted to be obnoxious too, but let's be realistic lol. If we did use DE, it would necessarily mean we would only have to get to +4 any time, because we just saw that the biggest walls we can face can't be OHKOed anyway, and that's before a possible (probable, lol #MurphysLaw) Sturdy which completely renders getting to +6 moot. Speaking of Sturdy, this next calc starts to get at why the SpD EVs are actually useful in a pinch:
252 Def Magnezone: 72-85 (49.6 - 58.6%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
212 SpD Salamence: 75-88 (44.1 - 51.7%) -- 10.2% chance to 2HKO
That chance for Zone reduces to literally 1/256 if we max our SpD. Obviously we're way more worried about being CHed or statused in general, but these numbers are frankly why I love this game.
Sash and Sturdy are the main barriers to this since Salamence doesn't have Dragonite's Multiscale (or Leftovers), so maybe Stealth Rock could fit on a, like, Uxie lead, especially with the knowledge that Salamence absolutely doesn't need to get to +6 to sweep the floors of the Maison.
SDef EVs are good for Sturdy/Magnet Pull Zone, but it may also have an Analytic boost to negate the investment and 2HKO anyway.
I was also thinking of Mega Salamence, but in Doubles/Triples instead with a Hyper Voice set. Aerilate Hyper Voice is a decently powered spread attack (around 20% less powerful than Timid Mega Gardevoir Hyper Voice), the massive 120 base Speed outspeeds Froslass, Latis, Garchomp and others, and with Intimidate and its great bulk, it survives even Weavile Ice Punch (and pretty much any physical Dragon-type attack by extension, aside from CB Outrage). The power is lower than the usual spread monsters, but it has monstrous Speed and bulk to be able to function easily without Tailwind, while providing Intimidate for the team as well. Hyper Voice Mence's anti-TR coverage sucks for Bronzong and others (lol Carbink), though, so that might be a concern.
I was also thinking of Mega Salamence, but in Doubles/Triples instead with a Hyper Voice set. Aerilate Hyper Voice is a decently powered spread attack (around 20% less powerful than Timid Mega Gardevoir Hyper Voice), the massive 120 base Speed outspeeds Froslass, Latis, Garchomp and others, and with Intimidate and its great bulk, it survives even Weavile Ice Punch (and pretty much any physical Dragon-type attack by extension, aside from CB Outrage). The power is lower than the usual spread monsters, but it has monstrous Speed and bulk to be able to function easily without Tailwind, while providing Intimidate for the team as well. Hyper Voice Mence's anti-TR coverage sucks for Bronzong and others (lol Carbink), though, so that might be a concern.
For what, Stellar? Not over any of my current teams, since Teams Suizorus and Kangliscune both operate very well with their Megas. I'd probably put it over Suicune on Suizorus just because Scizor works just fine with Leftovers, but yeah, Mega Slowbro is ridiculous and basically plays itself with Surf/Psychic/CM/Rest with Calm and 252HP/252SpD EVs (Slack Off is viable too but you'll be FP enough to want Rest and then there's the part where Toxic dicks you over). If you don't want to deal with OHKO moves, you can BP speed from lead speed boost Blaziken that draws Psychic and Water moves on the BP that Slowbro won't care about, but this is assuming you won't just use it on a goodstuffs team like Suizorus.
GG Unit, I wouldn't be too worried about Skarmory4 since I'd want it to kill my other pokes as fast as possible then basically take my wind (Subbing before it can Toxic the 75% HP Salamence). That might take a while though but enough good leads get Taunt that this idea would still be feasible.
turskain, that's fine, the calc above is +4 Return on Magnezone anyway. +6 Return actually always kills Zone4 with a CH for what that's worth...you should really never be without a Sub anyway, and it was very rare that I ever was with Whimespronite back in BW. Love the Doubles idea, though I'd still want to use Tailwind since 120 base speed isn't quite fast enough, especially because "Turn 1". If we want to use Mat Block for Salamence can it can safely Mega Evolve while something else uses Tailwind (or Salamence itself does in Doubles though lol), then maybe, otherwise I'd definitely want Tailwind support anyway.
GG Unit, I wouldn't be too worried about Skarmory4 since I'd want it to kill my other pokes as fast as possible then basically take my wind (Subbing before it can Toxic the 75% HP Salamence). That might take a while though but enough good leads get Taunt that this idea would still be feasible.
turskain, that's fine, the calc above is +4 Return on Magnezone anyway. +6 Return actually always kills Zone4 with a CH for what that's worth...you should really never be without a Sub anyway, and it was very rare that I ever was with Whimespronite back in BW. Love the Doubles idea, though I'd still want to use Tailwind since 120 base speed isn't quite fast enough, especially because "Turn 1". If we want to use Mat Block for Salamence can it can safely Mega Evolve while something else uses Tailwind (or Salamence itself does in Doubles though lol), then maybe, otherwise I'd definitely want Tailwind support anyway.
Aah, this is so frustrating. I managed to get the trophies for all the maison modes but Multis, where I've hitten a roadblock. Out of all the AI teams I can use, Tierno actually seems to be the best one (disregarding the salac berry on the acrobatics Hawlucha), but at the same time I'm having trouble picking stuff that works well with his mons regarding weaknesses. Next time I'll try to use Excadrill in the front to deal with Electric stuff and Clefable in the back for support and we'll see how that goes.
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I lost a new Super Doubles streak at 159 wins. Still kinda bleh but it is an improvement I guess :\
Old team writeup here. While this team was pretty darn cool with good synergy, there was still a glaring defect in that one of the team members only had one reliable move, with rather redundant coverage, and that his job was more 'don't die' than 'kill stuff that the others can't'. While Rotom was pretty resilient, he just didn't add another level of depth to the team, so I felt it would be possible to improve the streak with a better team member in his stead. I did this streak alongside triples while I was trying out new stuff there in order to perfect my squad, and it died today. Enter the updated squad:
By-Tor (Greninja) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protean
Nature: Timid
IVs: 31/19/19/31/31/31
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Mat Block
-Dark Pulse
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot
Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Ability: Speed Boost -> Speed Boost
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 31/31/31/31/13/31
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
-Flare Blitz
-Low Kick
-Rock Slide
-Protect
Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
Nature: Jolly
IVs: 31/31/19/19/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Rock Slide
-Protect
Clawitzer @ Expert Belt
Ability: Mega Launcher
Nature: Modest
IVs: 31/13/31/31/31/31
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
-Water Pulse
-Dark Pulse
-Aura Sphere
-Protect
ReptoAbysmal I'm glad to say that your favourite shrimp has served me very well ^_^ Clawitzer was one of several things I had been trying in triples, and its coverage and Speed tier make it an excellent doorstop to opposing Trick Room teams. Because TR happens to be the bane of my existence I wanted to try a run in doubles with Clawitzer over Rotom; the synergy with the rest of my team would be similar (both hard-hitting, slow, semi-bulky waters), only this one would bring actual coverage and a lot more power, while being really nice to fall back on if I ever were to get caught in Trick Room. All in all, it worked like I intended it to.
Every iteration of the team has been built around the Greninja/Mega Blaziken lead; when I first wanted to try Doubles, I didn't have any experience at all, and when I was looking around the internet for inspiration I came across this video. It looked fun and reliable and I didn't know squat about doubles anyway, so I went with it. The backups have changed numerous times, as have Blaze and Ninja's movesets (from Flare Blitz/Sky Uppercut/Rock Slide/Protect and Hydro Pump/Ice Beam/Extrasensory/Mat Block to their current iterations), but I've always used Greninja/Blaziken in Doubles. Mat Block + Speed Boost is simply a hilarious combo, on par with Mat Block + Tailwind and Mat Block + Volt Switch imo. Ideally, on the first turn Blaziken makes sure both opponents are in KO range, allowing me to take a 2-0 lead on the second turn when Blaziken outspeeds the entire unboosted maison. Then it's easy ^_^
The backups have gone through a long history, and I'm honestly still not sure that these are optimal. I started out with 'generic bulkmons with spread moves', i.e. AV Metagross and Togekiss; however, this gave me problems with bulky waters, making me swap out Togekiss for Rotom-W; later, I experimented with a more powerful Earthquake spammer with more reliable STAB moves, i.e. Garchomp, over Metagross. Currently, Rotom-W has also been swapped out for a mon with reliable STAB moves. At the moment Garchomp is the weakest link because Earthquake is kinda annoying to pull off in a team without fliers and even a mon without Protect, but I don't know what could replace him. That Earthquake also came in really handy occasionally in a pinch.
As for the movesets, Greninja's is what is generally considered most effective in triples in term of coverage, reliability, and utility. I've kept the same set in doubles because I honestly couldn't miss one of these attacks: Grass Knot is potentially Greninja's strongest move and just happens to reach its highest base power on the fat Ground-, Rock-, and bulky Water-types it's supposed to hit; Ice Beam has the best super effective coverage; and Dark Pulse is inexpensible for 2HKOing nearly every Trick Room setter in tandem with Blaziken. Blaziken's is standard (well I guess because I'm kinda the only one around here who uses Blaziken): Protect because it's Protect; Flare Blitz as the obvious Fire STAB move; Low Kick as Fighting STAB move because HJK is too reckless (pun intended) and Sky Uppercut is too unreliable and only rarely stronger; finally, Rock Slide is imo the best filler move available - the accuracy is a letdown, but it OHKOes the Fire/Flying-types that resist both STAB moves, while also hitting Gyarados and Chandelure super effectively. It's also useful for bringing both opponents into KO range on the Mat Block turn. Garchomp's is pretty much completely standard: Protect is Protect, Earthquake and Dragon Claw are STAB moves, and Rock Slide is the seldom used filler move. I chose it over Iron Head because Rock Slide's targets are generally more dangerous. Finally, Clawitzer's is also standard I reckon. Water Pulse is its strongest reliable STAB move, Dark Pulse murders opposing Trick Room teams - the reason to use Clawitzer in the first place - and Aura Sphere is preferred over Dragon Pulse because its super effective coverage is better and Dragon-types are already covered pretty well between Greninja's Ice Beam and Garchomp's Dragon Claw.
Anyway, swapping in Clawitzer has left Gyarados4 public enemy number one for this team. Due to its humongous special bulk Greninja and Clawitzer can't really hurt it, while it resists Blaziken's STAB moves and Rock Slide barely tickles it after Intimidate. The two times I faced it I overcame it with continuous offensive pressure but I don't really have a reliable answer anymore. Lanturn4 is mostly an annoyance; Greninja and Blaziken can't really hurt it, but it also can't really do much back in the first turns. Garchomp easily beats it, but I can't switch it in because 'whoops Ice Beam'. Usually I defeated all its teammates and then ganged up on it with Rock Slide+Dark Pulse. These two combined have a 41% flinch chance, and just a little bit of hax is enough to break it. Gale Wings Talonflame is also a huge threat for obvious reasons, and Trick Room is still dangerous. Fortunately, Greninja's Dark Pulse (Ice Beam on Aromatisse)+Blaziken's Flare Blitz KOes most setters, but if the setter's partner outruns and OHKOes Blaziken on turn 1 of if the setter's name starts with 'Slow' (or probably Cresselia too) I can't KO it. The positive thing is that Bro and King always preferred to OHKO Blaziken, but it's not really secure :\ Honestly, many problems would be solved if Blaziken learned Wild Charge :] I actually did not lose to Trick Room this time though! I lost against a set3/4 Veteran who led off with Latios+Cresselia, a horrible matchup. I automatically assumed Cresselia4, i.e. TR, so I double targeted it, because Protecting would have been futile; if Latios didn't opt to OHKO Blaziken on turn 1, it would do so on turn 2 in the supposed TR. Latios did OHKO Blaziken, and Cresselia revealed itself to be the Icy Wind/Swagger one. On turn 2 I double targeted Latios with Greninja and Clawitzer's Dark Pulses, but it switched out into Regirock (I don't know why! Clawitzer really doesn't appreciate taking a Specs Psychic, and seeing as I didn't even target it turn one it couldn't switch into an immunity, not to mention Regirock doesn't even have immunities); only Greninja's Dark Pulse hit though, because Clawitzer was Swaggered and hit itself. I swapped it out for Garchomp because I figured Clawitzer was more valuable, and while Greninja did kill Regirock, I had lost too much momentum and Cresselia's Icy Winding didn't help. I don't recall the following turns in great detail, but Greninja was killed, and the final backup was Balloon Raikou. The greatest ever 'fuck you' to Garchomp/Clawitzer. It was winnable by using Protect on Blaziken turn 1, hoping that Latios targeted Blaziken (it also likes to target Greninja with Specs Thunder) and Cresselia didn't Icy Wind, and Dark Pulsing Latios twice (leaving Garchomp not dead weight), but that required some outrageous prediction that I can't do if I don't even know the sets for sure :\ oh well.
Battle code: 160: VDEW-WWWW-WWWA-5778
another one: 143: 6CKG-WWWW-WWWA-577B. This one featured an even horribler lead matchup (TR Aromatisse+Gale Wings Talonflame), and I only won because suicidal Skuntank was among the backups. Also had some outrageous misplays (even though there weren't really any 'right' moves to choose in a matchup like this) because I wanted to Rock Slide Talon a little too badly. Powerful Clawitzer saved the day though, and it was kind of fitting considering the identity of the last pokemon I faint :]
So, yeah. While this isn't a substantial improvement in terms of streak length, it is a substantial improvement in terms of team, and it was as fun to play as ever. I could write volumes about Greninja and Blaziken's truly terrific offensive synergy, and I've already done so in previous posts. The identity of their perfect backups is a puzzle I haven't yet solved though, but these two were 'adequate'. I would have liked to reach my fourth 200+ though :< I've had my fun here, but I'm not gonna try again soon (probably not until ORAS), because I'm too tired of being shit scared of Gyarados, and because I've got a more important calling right now in triples :) I think I've somewhat improved the team (no scratch that, it's pretty much mathematically better than its previous iteration and I'm confident it's not gonna get better anymore without a complete overhaul). I've done a lot of experimenting in the backups, but eventually I settled with the most obvious and simple fix, and the backups' former 'catastrophic' defensive synergy is now 'nearly perfect', while there's also some added utility. New member Eddie has joined team Clockwork Angels, and steadily cruising they've reached 90 by now; if I don't chime in again before naturally rebreeding it in ORAS, I've lost prematurely and am too disappointed to post ^_^
Old team writeup here. While this team was pretty darn cool with good synergy, there was still a glaring defect in that one of the team members only had one reliable move, with rather redundant coverage, and that his job was more 'don't die' than 'kill stuff that the others can't'. While Rotom was pretty resilient, he just didn't add another level of depth to the team, so I felt it would be possible to improve the streak with a better team member in his stead. I did this streak alongside triples while I was trying out new stuff there in order to perfect my squad, and it died today. Enter the updated squad:
By-Tor (Greninja) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protean
Nature: Timid
IVs: 31/19/19/31/31/31
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Mat Block
-Dark Pulse
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot
Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Ability: Speed Boost -> Speed Boost
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 31/31/31/31/13/31
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
-Flare Blitz
-Low Kick
-Rock Slide
-Protect
Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
Nature: Jolly
IVs: 31/31/19/19/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Rock Slide
-Protect
Clawitzer @ Expert Belt
Ability: Mega Launcher
Nature: Modest
IVs: 31/13/31/31/31/31
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
-Water Pulse
-Dark Pulse
-Aura Sphere
-Protect
ReptoAbysmal I'm glad to say that your favourite shrimp has served me very well ^_^ Clawitzer was one of several things I had been trying in triples, and its coverage and Speed tier make it an excellent doorstop to opposing Trick Room teams. Because TR happens to be the bane of my existence I wanted to try a run in doubles with Clawitzer over Rotom; the synergy with the rest of my team would be similar (both hard-hitting, slow, semi-bulky waters), only this one would bring actual coverage and a lot more power, while being really nice to fall back on if I ever were to get caught in Trick Room. All in all, it worked like I intended it to.
Every iteration of the team has been built around the Greninja/Mega Blaziken lead; when I first wanted to try Doubles, I didn't have any experience at all, and when I was looking around the internet for inspiration I came across this video. It looked fun and reliable and I didn't know squat about doubles anyway, so I went with it. The backups have changed numerous times, as have Blaze and Ninja's movesets (from Flare Blitz/Sky Uppercut/Rock Slide/Protect and Hydro Pump/Ice Beam/Extrasensory/Mat Block to their current iterations), but I've always used Greninja/Blaziken in Doubles. Mat Block + Speed Boost is simply a hilarious combo, on par with Mat Block + Tailwind and Mat Block + Volt Switch imo. Ideally, on the first turn Blaziken makes sure both opponents are in KO range, allowing me to take a 2-0 lead on the second turn when Blaziken outspeeds the entire unboosted maison. Then it's easy ^_^
The backups have gone through a long history, and I'm honestly still not sure that these are optimal. I started out with 'generic bulkmons with spread moves', i.e. AV Metagross and Togekiss; however, this gave me problems with bulky waters, making me swap out Togekiss for Rotom-W; later, I experimented with a more powerful Earthquake spammer with more reliable STAB moves, i.e. Garchomp, over Metagross. Currently, Rotom-W has also been swapped out for a mon with reliable STAB moves. At the moment Garchomp is the weakest link because Earthquake is kinda annoying to pull off in a team without fliers and even a mon without Protect, but I don't know what could replace him. That Earthquake also came in really handy occasionally in a pinch.
As for the movesets, Greninja's is what is generally considered most effective in triples in term of coverage, reliability, and utility. I've kept the same set in doubles because I honestly couldn't miss one of these attacks: Grass Knot is potentially Greninja's strongest move and just happens to reach its highest base power on the fat Ground-, Rock-, and bulky Water-types it's supposed to hit; Ice Beam has the best super effective coverage; and Dark Pulse is inexpensible for 2HKOing nearly every Trick Room setter in tandem with Blaziken. Blaziken's is standard (well I guess because I'm kinda the only one around here who uses Blaziken): Protect because it's Protect; Flare Blitz as the obvious Fire STAB move; Low Kick as Fighting STAB move because HJK is too reckless (pun intended) and Sky Uppercut is too unreliable and only rarely stronger; finally, Rock Slide is imo the best filler move available - the accuracy is a letdown, but it OHKOes the Fire/Flying-types that resist both STAB moves, while also hitting Gyarados and Chandelure super effectively. It's also useful for bringing both opponents into KO range on the Mat Block turn. Garchomp's is pretty much completely standard: Protect is Protect, Earthquake and Dragon Claw are STAB moves, and Rock Slide is the seldom used filler move. I chose it over Iron Head because Rock Slide's targets are generally more dangerous. Finally, Clawitzer's is also standard I reckon. Water Pulse is its strongest reliable STAB move, Dark Pulse murders opposing Trick Room teams - the reason to use Clawitzer in the first place - and Aura Sphere is preferred over Dragon Pulse because its super effective coverage is better and Dragon-types are already covered pretty well between Greninja's Ice Beam and Garchomp's Dragon Claw.
Anyway, swapping in Clawitzer has left Gyarados4 public enemy number one for this team. Due to its humongous special bulk Greninja and Clawitzer can't really hurt it, while it resists Blaziken's STAB moves and Rock Slide barely tickles it after Intimidate. The two times I faced it I overcame it with continuous offensive pressure but I don't really have a reliable answer anymore. Lanturn4 is mostly an annoyance; Greninja and Blaziken can't really hurt it, but it also can't really do much back in the first turns. Garchomp easily beats it, but I can't switch it in because 'whoops Ice Beam'. Usually I defeated all its teammates and then ganged up on it with Rock Slide+Dark Pulse. These two combined have a 41% flinch chance, and just a little bit of hax is enough to break it. Gale Wings Talonflame is also a huge threat for obvious reasons, and Trick Room is still dangerous. Fortunately, Greninja's Dark Pulse (Ice Beam on Aromatisse)+Blaziken's Flare Blitz KOes most setters, but if the setter's partner outruns and OHKOes Blaziken on turn 1 of if the setter's name starts with 'Slow' (or probably Cresselia too) I can't KO it. The positive thing is that Bro and King always preferred to OHKO Blaziken, but it's not really secure :\ Honestly, many problems would be solved if Blaziken learned Wild Charge :] I actually did not lose to Trick Room this time though! I lost against a set3/4 Veteran who led off with Latios+Cresselia, a horrible matchup. I automatically assumed Cresselia4, i.e. TR, so I double targeted it, because Protecting would have been futile; if Latios didn't opt to OHKO Blaziken on turn 1, it would do so on turn 2 in the supposed TR. Latios did OHKO Blaziken, and Cresselia revealed itself to be the Icy Wind/Swagger one. On turn 2 I double targeted Latios with Greninja and Clawitzer's Dark Pulses, but it switched out into Regirock (I don't know why! Clawitzer really doesn't appreciate taking a Specs Psychic, and seeing as I didn't even target it turn one it couldn't switch into an immunity, not to mention Regirock doesn't even have immunities); only Greninja's Dark Pulse hit though, because Clawitzer was Swaggered and hit itself. I swapped it out for Garchomp because I figured Clawitzer was more valuable, and while Greninja did kill Regirock, I had lost too much momentum and Cresselia's Icy Winding didn't help. I don't recall the following turns in great detail, but Greninja was killed, and the final backup was Balloon Raikou. The greatest ever 'fuck you' to Garchomp/Clawitzer. It was winnable by using Protect on Blaziken turn 1, hoping that Latios targeted Blaziken (it also likes to target Greninja with Specs Thunder) and Cresselia didn't Icy Wind, and Dark Pulsing Latios twice (leaving Garchomp not dead weight), but that required some outrageous prediction that I can't do if I don't even know the sets for sure :\ oh well.
Battle code: 160: VDEW-WWWW-WWWA-5778
another one: 143: 6CKG-WWWW-WWWA-577B. This one featured an even horribler lead matchup (TR Aromatisse+Gale Wings Talonflame), and I only won because suicidal Skuntank was among the backups. Also had some outrageous misplays (even though there weren't really any 'right' moves to choose in a matchup like this) because I wanted to Rock Slide Talon a little too badly. Powerful Clawitzer saved the day though, and it was kind of fitting considering the identity of the last pokemon I faint :]
So, yeah. While this isn't a substantial improvement in terms of streak length, it is a substantial improvement in terms of team, and it was as fun to play as ever. I could write volumes about Greninja and Blaziken's truly terrific offensive synergy, and I've already done so in previous posts. The identity of their perfect backups is a puzzle I haven't yet solved though, but these two were 'adequate'. I would have liked to reach my fourth 200+ though :< I've had my fun here, but I'm not gonna try again soon (probably not until ORAS), because I'm too tired of being shit scared of Gyarados, and because I've got a more important calling right now in triples :) I think I've somewhat improved the team (no scratch that, it's pretty much mathematically better than its previous iteration and I'm confident it's not gonna get better anymore without a complete overhaul). I've done a lot of experimenting in the backups, but eventually I settled with the most obvious and simple fix, and the backups' former 'catastrophic' defensive synergy is now 'nearly perfect', while there's also some added utility. New member Eddie has joined team Clockwork Angels, and steadily cruising they've reached 90 by now; if I don't chime in again before naturally rebreeding it in ORAS, I've lost prematurely and am too disappointed to post ^_^
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I came here to say two things:
1. Holy freaking shit. (3000)
2. I'm very happy to see Clawitzer has been the elite henchman/counter TR ops I hyped it as.
1. Holy freaking shit. (3000)
2. I'm very happy to see Clawitzer has been the elite henchman/counter TR ops I hyped it as.
Played up to battle 3200 tonight - the grind is on. Nearly lost a dozen battles prior, though:
Battle video: #3186 - YYKG-WWWW-WWWA-5S9Z vs. Latios/Zapdos/Regice/Heatran/Raikou/Cobalion
It was the closest battle yet that wasn't a total misplay fest like #1665 and was a nailbiter from beginning to end, so I decided to warstory it. Here goes:
Do not mistake means for goal. That is what my master taught me.
Start of battle
Veteran Saba sent out Latios (right), Zapdos (center) and Regice (left)!
I sent out Lucario (left), Rotom-W (center) and Greninja (right)!
VS
Possible Regice4 in the left-side position - I don't like the look of this at all. Zapdos may have Heat Wave to prevent Scizor from coming in to kill Regice and match up well against Latios, so I have to get it out of the way, even at the risk of Set4 using Detect. I attack Regice with Lucario assuming Set4 to get maximum value out of him before getting T-Waved - Garchomp, the only Electric-immune, cannot switch into Regice, nor unknown set Latios across the field for that matter, and Scizor cannot be sacrificed in its stead due to Zapdos possibly carrying Heat Wave.
Turn 1
Greninja used Mat Block
Latios used Draco Meteor
Mega Lucario used Aura Sphere on Regice - 50%
Rotom-W used Thunderbolt on Zapdos - 48%
Zapdos used Double Team
Regice used Thunder Wave! Lucario is paralyzed!
PRZ
VS
50%
52%
The Regice4 prediction turns out to be correct. Zapdos is Set2 using its worst move, which is really bad. Draco Meteor is no good, as the Specs set may run over Rotom-W while being unpredictable in its targeting - even the feared Set1 would be better, since it wouldn't pose an immediate threat at the very least. It could still be the very pleasant Set2, howewer.
I Protect on Lucario on a predicted Focus Blast from Regice, while focusing the +1 Evasion Zapdos with Ice Beam and Thunderbolt. This battle is going to hell in a handbasket with Regice4 and +1 Zapdos out and Lucario already as good as dead, so I need this Zapdos off the field right now so Scizor can come in to handle both Regice and Latios.
Turn 2
Mega Lucario used Protect
Greninja used Ice Beam on Zapdos - KO
Latios used Draco Meteor on Rotom-W - KO
Regice used Focus Blast on Lucario - Protect
I sent out Scizor (center)
Saba sent out Heatran (center)
PRZ
VS
50%
Greninja hitting Zapdos is very good, and somewhat lucky - Ice Beam on +1 Evasion Brightpowder Zapdos has a 67% chance to hit. If I missed here while Zapdos used Roost, losing would've been the likely outcome with how the battle turned out.
Latios turns out to be Specs, and targets Rotom-W instead of the Sashed Greninja. All in all, this is still not terrible with Zapdos being down, even if the casualties have been heavy and the score is 5-5 in Saba's favor with Lucario being as good as dead.
Heatran and Entei are the worst possible Pokémon to face as back-ups for this team in general, and of course he's got Heatran in the wings. There is still hope, howewer - if Heatran targets the tasty Scizor while I switch in Talonflame, the paralyzed Mega Lucario may be able to get off a free Aura Sphere while Regice uses Thunder Wave or fails with Focus Miss. There's not much choice anyway, as the situation is spiraling out of control rapidly.
In retrospect, sending out Scizor instead of Talonflame was a mistake in this case - but Talonflame does not enjoy -2 Specs Meteor with the recoil damage and possible Regice Thunderbolt it may have to take. I also lack solutions to many other Pokémon with Rotom-W and Lucario dead, so Scizor was arguably safer than Talonflame, as it "only" fears Heatran and Entei (with Zapdos out of the pool) and does decently against everything else, unlike Talonflame which may need to switch out while I lack a switch option for it, with Garchomp being unable to switch in to a possible -2 Meteor. With Scizor, there is still a switch option for the two Pokémon it fears in Talonflame.
Turn 3
Switched Scizor out for Talonflame (center)
Heatran used Magma Storm on Lucario - KO
Greninja used Ice Beam on Latios - 80%
Latios used Draco Meteor on Greninja - 80%
Regice used Thunder Wave on Talonflame! Talonflame is fully paralyzed!
I sent out Garchomp (left)
PRZ
20%
VS
50%
20%
And here's the "we lost" moment. Heatran, like Latios before it, turns out to be the worst set and targets the less attractive (but still KOable) target, negating the Talonflame switch play completely while Talonflame gets paralyzed and Greninja is set up for a Magma Storm KO on the next turn. At least Latios is at -4 right now, so he's no longer a threat outside crits - which I'm going to have to pray against from now on.
Talonflame has a high chance to KO Regice (48% minimum with Brave Bird), but the Thunder Wave from earlier put me in a bad spot, as it may get fully paralyzed, letting Regice grab Garchomp for free, all but guaranteeing a loss as he's my best bet at a comeback at this point. As such, I go for the safe play of Protecting on Chomp with the possibility of Talonflame surviving to try again on the next turn if it gets fully paralyzed. If I took the risk with Garchomp, I could've kept Scizor alive - but would it have been worth the risk of losing my best bet against a variety of mystery Pokémon with the possibility of a Swords Dance sweep? Seeing as I ended up having to risk paralysis anyway later, the answer is probably yes, but hindsight is 20/20.
Turn 4
Garchomp used Protect
Heatran used Magma Storm on Greninja - KO
Talonflame used Brave Bird on Regice - KO
Latios used Draco Meteor on Talonflame - 65%
Saba sent out Cobalion (left)
I sent out Scizor (right)
35%/PRZ
VS
20%
No full paralysis, sweet! Regice is finally gone, and the powerful Garchomp/Talonflame combination has very good odds against random Veteran Pokémon, KOing things like Articuno with double targeting and even doing OK against Latis with Talonflame 2HKOing the non-Set1s, with the possiblity of Protect+Tailwind in a desperate spot.
Choice Scarf Heatran4 has been punishing me extremely after Rotom-W's early demise, and CB Scizor has no choice but to die. Other Heatran sets would've been OK, and Entei3, if it appeared, would have been even worse, probably causing a loss - though Brave Bird is fantastic for controlling it. Situations like this are where you wish you used Metal Coat with Protect instead, but the power of CB and a neutral Quick Attack are very useful for a lot of things. I think Metal Coat would be a viable alternative, but well - Choice Band has served me well for the last 3000 battles and it has its advantages, so while it looks terrible here, I wouldn't want to get rid of it, either.
Cobalion isn't good, as it outspeeds Garchomp and survives EQ while striking with LO Close Combat or even Metal Burst. But Garchomp can survive its attacks, so it could be worse. There is a ray of hope, howewer - Talonflame is probably in KO range for Cobalion4 Close Combat from eyeballing, so it can Protect bait the other threatening Cobalion set, while other sets don't threaten Garchomp, outside Swagger and Metal Burst. In a losing situation like this, I think going for the greedy Protect in the worst case (Set4) was the right call, as the other bad set, Set3, outspeeds and uses Swagger anyway. Metal Burst is a risk, but at this point, I'll take it for a chance to have both Chomp and Talonflame as alive and healthy as possible for the last mystery Pokémon.
Turn 5
Talonflame uses Protect
Scizor used Bullet Punch on Latios - KO
Heatran used Magma Storm on Scizor - KO
Garchomp used Earthquake on Cobalion and Heatran - Cobalion 85%, Heatran KO
Cobalion used Sacred Sword on Garchomp, it's a critical hit! 60 HP
Saba sent out Raikou (right)
60 HP
35%/PRZ (right position is empty)
VS
15% (center position is empty)
It's Cobalion2, and not using Metal Burst, which is great. The crit is very bad, though, as now Chomp is in KO range for a whole lot of things.
Raikou didn't announce Air Balloon, so it is either Set1 or Set2.
Howewer, as I find out doing the calcs after a brief moment of panic, Raikou Shadow Ball is 57 damage max, so there's a chance to win if Garchomp can get a Swords Dance - Set1 has Shuca and Set2 has Defense EVs that give it a chance to survive EQ, so I will need to Swords Dance on Chomp, KO Cobalion with Brave Bird, and hope that Raikou isn't Set2 and getting a Charge Beam SAtk boost on Talonflame while this happens, and that Talonflame doesn't get fully paralyzed. It's not looking good, but there's still a chance to win even after all the disasters so far.
Turn 6
Talonflame used Brave Bird - Cobalion KO
Garchomp used Swords Dance
Raikou used Thunderbolt on Talonflame - Talonflame KO
Auto-center!
VS
YES, Talonflame doesn't get paralyzed! Raikou isn't Set2!! We can do this!
Turn 7
Raikou used Shadow Ball - Garchomp lives with 5HP
Garchomp used Dragon Claw - KO
Garchomp takes Life Orb damage - KO
(empty)
VS
(empty)
I win
If your last Pokémon dies to recoil damage after KOing the opponent's last Pokémon, your Pokémon "dies last" and you win. Good thing, too - this is the first battle where I've encountered this interaction with Greninja/Lucario, in Doubles and Triples, though I've seen it before with Life Orb Infernape, and Talonflame in Singles.
For you to defeat me like this... What is the goal you strive for?
4000 wins, of course! It's still too early to lose, though with such a terrible match-up, bad luck, and minimal misplays, it wouldn't have been a bad way for the streak to end.
This battle is another close call where Swords Dance on Garchomp pulls through. I stand by it being the best 3rd move choice in general unless you really need Iron Head or the inaccurate Rock Slide for coverage - without it, I'd have lost twice already, with the earlier Swampert battle and now this one.
Battle video: #3186 - YYKG-WWWW-WWWA-5S9Z vs. Latios/Zapdos/Regice/Heatran/Raikou/Cobalion
It was the closest battle yet that wasn't a total misplay fest like #1665 and was a nailbiter from beginning to end, so I decided to warstory it. Here goes:
Do not mistake means for goal. That is what my master taught me.
Start of battle
Veteran Saba sent out Latios (right), Zapdos (center) and Regice (left)!
I sent out Lucario (left), Rotom-W (center) and Greninja (right)!
VS
Possible Regice4 in the left-side position - I don't like the look of this at all. Zapdos may have Heat Wave to prevent Scizor from coming in to kill Regice and match up well against Latios, so I have to get it out of the way, even at the risk of Set4 using Detect. I attack Regice with Lucario assuming Set4 to get maximum value out of him before getting T-Waved - Garchomp, the only Electric-immune, cannot switch into Regice, nor unknown set Latios across the field for that matter, and Scizor cannot be sacrificed in its stead due to Zapdos possibly carrying Heat Wave.
Turn 1
Greninja used Mat Block
Latios used Draco Meteor
Mega Lucario used Aura Sphere on Regice - 50%
Rotom-W used Thunderbolt on Zapdos - 48%
Zapdos used Double Team
Regice used Thunder Wave! Lucario is paralyzed!
VS
The Regice4 prediction turns out to be correct. Zapdos is Set2 using its worst move, which is really bad. Draco Meteor is no good, as the Specs set may run over Rotom-W while being unpredictable in its targeting - even the feared Set1 would be better, since it wouldn't pose an immediate threat at the very least. It could still be the very pleasant Set2, howewer.
I Protect on Lucario on a predicted Focus Blast from Regice, while focusing the +1 Evasion Zapdos with Ice Beam and Thunderbolt. This battle is going to hell in a handbasket with Regice4 and +1 Zapdos out and Lucario already as good as dead, so I need this Zapdos off the field right now so Scizor can come in to handle both Regice and Latios.
Turn 2
Mega Lucario used Protect
Greninja used Ice Beam on Zapdos - KO
Latios used Draco Meteor on Rotom-W - KO
Regice used Focus Blast on Lucario - Protect
I sent out Scizor (center)
Saba sent out Heatran (center)
VS
Greninja hitting Zapdos is very good, and somewhat lucky - Ice Beam on +1 Evasion Brightpowder Zapdos has a 67% chance to hit. If I missed here while Zapdos used Roost, losing would've been the likely outcome with how the battle turned out.
Latios turns out to be Specs, and targets Rotom-W instead of the Sashed Greninja. All in all, this is still not terrible with Zapdos being down, even if the casualties have been heavy and the score is 5-5 in Saba's favor with Lucario being as good as dead.
Heatran and Entei are the worst possible Pokémon to face as back-ups for this team in general, and of course he's got Heatran in the wings. There is still hope, howewer - if Heatran targets the tasty Scizor while I switch in Talonflame, the paralyzed Mega Lucario may be able to get off a free Aura Sphere while Regice uses Thunder Wave or fails with Focus Miss. There's not much choice anyway, as the situation is spiraling out of control rapidly.
In retrospect, sending out Scizor instead of Talonflame was a mistake in this case - but Talonflame does not enjoy -2 Specs Meteor with the recoil damage and possible Regice Thunderbolt it may have to take. I also lack solutions to many other Pokémon with Rotom-W and Lucario dead, so Scizor was arguably safer than Talonflame, as it "only" fears Heatran and Entei (with Zapdos out of the pool) and does decently against everything else, unlike Talonflame which may need to switch out while I lack a switch option for it, with Garchomp being unable to switch in to a possible -2 Meteor. With Scizor, there is still a switch option for the two Pokémon it fears in Talonflame.
Turn 3
Switched Scizor out for Talonflame (center)
Heatran used Magma Storm on Lucario - KO
Greninja used Ice Beam on Latios - 80%
Latios used Draco Meteor on Greninja - 80%
Regice used Thunder Wave on Talonflame! Talonflame is fully paralyzed!
I sent out Garchomp (left)
VS
And here's the "we lost" moment. Heatran, like Latios before it, turns out to be the worst set and targets the less attractive (but still KOable) target, negating the Talonflame switch play completely while Talonflame gets paralyzed and Greninja is set up for a Magma Storm KO on the next turn. At least Latios is at -4 right now, so he's no longer a threat outside crits - which I'm going to have to pray against from now on.
Talonflame has a high chance to KO Regice (48% minimum with Brave Bird), but the Thunder Wave from earlier put me in a bad spot, as it may get fully paralyzed, letting Regice grab Garchomp for free, all but guaranteeing a loss as he's my best bet at a comeback at this point. As such, I go for the safe play of Protecting on Chomp with the possibility of Talonflame surviving to try again on the next turn if it gets fully paralyzed. If I took the risk with Garchomp, I could've kept Scizor alive - but would it have been worth the risk of losing my best bet against a variety of mystery Pokémon with the possibility of a Swords Dance sweep? Seeing as I ended up having to risk paralysis anyway later, the answer is probably yes, but hindsight is 20/20.
Turn 4
Garchomp used Protect
Heatran used Magma Storm on Greninja - KO
Talonflame used Brave Bird on Regice - KO
Latios used Draco Meteor on Talonflame - 65%
Saba sent out Cobalion (left)
I sent out Scizor (right)
VS
No full paralysis, sweet! Regice is finally gone, and the powerful Garchomp/Talonflame combination has very good odds against random Veteran Pokémon, KOing things like Articuno with double targeting and even doing OK against Latis with Talonflame 2HKOing the non-Set1s, with the possiblity of Protect+Tailwind in a desperate spot.
Choice Scarf Heatran4 has been punishing me extremely after Rotom-W's early demise, and CB Scizor has no choice but to die. Other Heatran sets would've been OK, and Entei3, if it appeared, would have been even worse, probably causing a loss - though Brave Bird is fantastic for controlling it. Situations like this are where you wish you used Metal Coat with Protect instead, but the power of CB and a neutral Quick Attack are very useful for a lot of things. I think Metal Coat would be a viable alternative, but well - Choice Band has served me well for the last 3000 battles and it has its advantages, so while it looks terrible here, I wouldn't want to get rid of it, either.
Cobalion isn't good, as it outspeeds Garchomp and survives EQ while striking with LO Close Combat or even Metal Burst. But Garchomp can survive its attacks, so it could be worse. There is a ray of hope, howewer - Talonflame is probably in KO range for Cobalion4 Close Combat from eyeballing, so it can Protect bait the other threatening Cobalion set, while other sets don't threaten Garchomp, outside Swagger and Metal Burst. In a losing situation like this, I think going for the greedy Protect in the worst case (Set4) was the right call, as the other bad set, Set3, outspeeds and uses Swagger anyway. Metal Burst is a risk, but at this point, I'll take it for a chance to have both Chomp and Talonflame as alive and healthy as possible for the last mystery Pokémon.
Turn 5
Talonflame uses Protect
Scizor used Bullet Punch on Latios - KO
Heatran used Magma Storm on Scizor - KO
Garchomp used Earthquake on Cobalion and Heatran - Cobalion 85%, Heatran KO
Cobalion used Sacred Sword on Garchomp, it's a critical hit! 60 HP
Saba sent out Raikou (right)
VS
It's Cobalion2, and not using Metal Burst, which is great. The crit is very bad, though, as now Chomp is in KO range for a whole lot of things.
Raikou didn't announce Air Balloon, so it is either Set1 or Set2.
Howewer, as I find out doing the calcs after a brief moment of panic, Raikou Shadow Ball is 57 damage max, so there's a chance to win if Garchomp can get a Swords Dance - Set1 has Shuca and Set2 has Defense EVs that give it a chance to survive EQ, so I will need to Swords Dance on Chomp, KO Cobalion with Brave Bird, and hope that Raikou isn't Set2 and getting a Charge Beam SAtk boost on Talonflame while this happens, and that Talonflame doesn't get fully paralyzed. It's not looking good, but there's still a chance to win even after all the disasters so far.
Turn 6
Talonflame used Brave Bird - Cobalion KO
Garchomp used Swords Dance
Raikou used Thunderbolt on Talonflame - Talonflame KO
Auto-center!
VS
YES, Talonflame doesn't get paralyzed! Raikou isn't Set2!! We can do this!
Turn 7
Raikou used Shadow Ball - Garchomp lives with 5HP
Garchomp used Dragon Claw - KO
Garchomp takes Life Orb damage - KO
(empty)
VS
(empty)
I win
If your last Pokémon dies to recoil damage after KOing the opponent's last Pokémon, your Pokémon "dies last" and you win. Good thing, too - this is the first battle where I've encountered this interaction with Greninja/Lucario, in Doubles and Triples, though I've seen it before with Life Orb Infernape, and Talonflame in Singles.
For you to defeat me like this... What is the goal you strive for?
4000 wins, of course! It's still too early to lose, though with such a terrible match-up, bad luck, and minimal misplays, it wouldn't have been a bad way for the streak to end.
This battle is another close call where Swords Dance on Garchomp pulls through. I stand by it being the best 3rd move choice in general unless you really need Iron Head or the inaccurate Rock Slide for coverage - without it, I'd have lost twice already, with the earlier Swampert battle and now this one.
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NoCheese:
Haven't been playing Maison very much but it didn't take me long to get a video of the AI switching out on me under unusual circumstances.
Okay, it's not with a TruAnt, but here is an example of the AI switching on me when it has no "reason" to do so (twice in one battle, even):
WHRW-WWWW-WWWA-6EAE
As far as I know, the AI has no qualms about killing itself with its own moves, and does not switch to something just for the sake of becoming immune to an attack. Also, an attack being blocked by Protect/Mat Block/Wide Guard shouldn't switching... ..Or maybe I'm just wrong and those are situtations in which it's programmed to switch.
Note: Neither the Aggron nor the Bouffolant had Choice items/were locked into an attack.
So yeah.. I'm confused as to why the AI would have switched in either of the instances in that battle. Any insights as to what circumstances the AI is programmed to switch would be great.
Haven't been playing Maison very much but it didn't take me long to get a video of the AI switching out on me under unusual circumstances.
Okay, it's not with a TruAnt, but here is an example of the AI switching on me when it has no "reason" to do so (twice in one battle, even):
WHRW-WWWW-WWWA-6EAE
As far as I know, the AI has no qualms about killing itself with its own moves, and does not switch to something just for the sake of becoming immune to an attack. Also, an attack being blocked by Protect/Mat Block/Wide Guard shouldn't switching... ..Or maybe I'm just wrong and those are situtations in which it's programmed to switch.
Note: Neither the Aggron nor the Bouffolant had Choice items/were locked into an attack.
So yeah.. I'm confused as to why the AI would have switched in either of the instances in that battle. Any insights as to what circumstances the AI is programmed to switch would be great.
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The AI does like to switch into immunities to a move that was used on the previous turn (they always assume you're using the same move again the next turn), in this battle the opponent twice switched into a levitator after it had been targeted with Earthquake. I can't say I have ever noticed this in singles, but they do it all the time in doubles/triples (which I mostly play) ^_^ Could be there's a relation to spread moves (seeing as I've only ever noticed it here), idk, I've never paid that much attention to it because it has never really screwed me over.
It just seems weird to me that it would do this, because in most circumstances, you can Wide Guard several times in a row until they Earthquake themselves to death. Seems just as likely to me that they would just stay in and kill themselves, especially seeing as how it wasn't my move.
Is there a list of all the circumstances in which the AI switches anywhere?