CAP 23 CAP 23 - Part 2 - Typing Discussion

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I'm going with Ground / Fighting. The main things about it that you need to know about this type combo is that it resists Rock, Dark and Bug, is immune to Electric, and is weak to Ice, Psychic, Flying, Grass and Fairy. I personally think that it is pro-concept because it resists or is immune to key types that are used as pivoting / hazards. It also is weak to Fairy and could easily run Anchor Shot. However, it could also run Spirit Shackle to handle Psychic-types. It also resists Stealth Rock and lets it more easily switch into bulkier teams that use it. The only real downsides are the weaknesses to Grass and Flying, as Tangrowth and Tomohawk are simultaneously Pokémon we may wish to aim to trap and also either a Grass or Flying-type. However, we have easy ways to build around that, be it something like Smack Down or Ice Punch, etc. Ground is also an extremely powerful offensive typing and so is Fighting. Ground in particular is a very powerful type in CAP, as everyone and their mom runs HP Ground. It takes out Naviathan, Crucibelle, Cyclohm (if its offensive or you have Earth Power), etc.

I also give support to Ghost / Dragon and Ground / Fairy.
Wow, amazing subs guys, I gonna give my opinion on some of them

I already said that in my first post on the topic but I think it is really important to be able to bypass Tomohawk. Dugtrio cannot trap it, Heatran is pressure by fighting moves. Tomo is the king of CAP, it is the most used and viable mon in the tier and it is exactly what we want to trap. Add an other trapper unable to manage him due to a weakness to one of his stab seem quite dangerous for the viability of Cap23 and reasons to use it instead of usual trappers. Typings fighting or steel without a secondary typing which helps to handle a weakness flying/fighting does not really fit to Cap23 in my opinion. Sure, theses typings are interesting, nice volturn absorbers and good hazard resists, but I think the ability to get rid of Tomohawk is more important than to come often on the board. We want a trapper, not a pivot.

Others submissions :

Dragon/Ghost : Nice ! I do not think a weakness to himself is especially an issue. It looks original and fun to play around. I like it, one of my favorite.
Dragon/Flying : A Stealth Rock weakness does not matter much in my opinion considering that an offensive trapper has to come one or two times by battle. It is boring, of course, but not eliminatory. The fact that his dual stab is unable to go through steel is on the other hand more alarming.
Ghost/Ground : Good. I see well a trapper having this typing. Good coverage offensively. I like your submission man.
Flying/Ground : I like it as well, very good coverage offensively. Landorus should start to fear, his child is coming to trap him.
Fairy/Ground : Awesome coverage offensively. Only Celeestela/Skarmory resists his dual stab in the usual threats. Unfortunately, his coverage is just too good to use a trapper set on him in my opinion. I do not see how to make profitable Sand tomb even with a new ability.
Dark/Ghost : Bella ciao Tomo. Great, just great. You are able to use a variety of support moves without fearing Haze or taunt Prankster thanks to the dark typing. No worries to the lack of resistance of stealth rock, I do not understand why people want to get one, it is not mandatory to a trapper.
Ghost/Fairy : Again a ghost, it looks to be a good typing to Cap23. Ghost/Fairy looks to be fun to play around, it threats well Tomo. His disability to bypass Celeestela is though an issue. Your submission stays though really nice.
Ghost/Normal : Wow, terrific. An immunity to ghost, fighting and normal is so good defensively. This typing gonna help our job of trapper. I like it.
Flying/Steel : As explain above, to be weak to volt-switch is a bad idea for a trapper. It stays a good defensive typing with a lot of resistances however but I am not a fan of the electric weakness.

Nice job guys !
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I know subs are open but I started so I'm going to bloody well finish

1) What qualities in a typing compliment the trapping effect? Note that I am referring to the "status" of being trapped and trapping mechanics themselves. I am not asking about powering up individual trapping moves. Feel free to discuss the trapping effect in general and you may use existing Pokemon with trapping moves / abilities if you need to illustrate a point about the overall trapping effect. Do some existing trappers trap well because of their typing and which qualities of their typing are important?

Well it really depends on which way we take it. We can use our bulk, with notoriously bulky types like Steel, or focus more on offense, where types with good coverage and a large scope for super effective attacks like Ice can really work well. If we look at Heatran, as many have already, we see a stellar defensive typing with two immunities, albeit one thanks to an ability. This gives Heatran a lot of scope to trap and harass Pokemon as it doesn't get hit by as many moves as other Pokemon. However, in the long run this might be seen as obsolete as Heatran can simply force the switch to another Pokemon who doesn't mind getting trapped, but we've already discussed that. What also needs to be addressed about TrapTran first rose to large popularity in ORAS with the iconic Bulky Water Lure, which only got better with Z-Moves and is now expected by any decent player, making its role as a lure null and void. We would need to avoid this with our typing to make it less one-dimensional offensively. This is shown by Heatran's stellar defensive typing but slightly lacking offensive typing. I'll discuss this in more detail within the next question.

An interesting thing to note is that the first documented use of TrapTran was actually in Black and White with the weather trapping Heatran, which was very interesting. This set tried to lure in opposing weather setters like Politoed and trapped them. Heatran would then set the sun back up, weakening Scald and 1v1 the Politoed, putting the opposing rain team at a disadvantage. This is a very interesting use of trapping and one that we could possibly look into further with regards to typing, but to do this, we will need to give TrapCAP a versatile typing.

2) Do some trappers still seem to function well despite having qualities in their typing that don't fully help their goal? If so, what qualities does the mon have that allow it to overcome their typing? And even if the typing doesn't help with the trapping mechanic, does it still help with providing pressure to help with the "trapping game" of trying to trap something of value? (I originally had this as part of Question 1 but I feel it is worth being separated).

What also needs to be addressed about TrapTran first rose to large popularity in ORAS with the iconic Bulky Water Lure, which only got better with Z-Moves and is now expected by any decent player, making its role as a lure null and void. We would need to avoid this with our typing to make it less one-dimensional offensively. THis is shown by Heatran's stellar defensive typing but slightly lacking offensive typing.
Because of Heatrans naturally defensive typing, having an immunity (I won't be counting abilities from now on), five quadruple resists and four other resistances means that Heatran can reduce damage taken by 10 types via its typing alone. This means Heatran is extremely versatile with its resistances and switching, allowing it to come in on a plethora of Pokemon to perform its role well. In one sense this creates Heatran to be a very good trapper, allowing him to pivot in on a lot of situations and narrow down what a team can do to Heatran. There are only three weaknesses which haunt Heatran and he can lure two of them (Water and Ground) wth his Z-Solar Beam meaning that defensively, Heatran is covered, but this is where the problems start.

Heatran's dual typing of Steel and Fire also hold up well offensively, only having two resistances in Fire and Water, and he can lure one with Z-Solar Beam and straight up beat the other with Earth Power.This might seem attractive at first, but then you look at this from an offensive point of view and you start to see why Heatran isn't S or A+ rank. Heatran's dual STAB typing is super effective against Bug, Fairy, Grass, Ice, Rock, and Steel. The rest of the types are neutral, which means that although Heatran is excellent, his typing doesn't make the cut offensively which means that Heatran isn't seen primarily as a trapper, more of a Pokemon who can set up rocks and pressure removers alongsde his excellent ability to trap.

If we apply this here, we see that we need TrapCAP to have a versatile defensive typing like Heatran, but with more offensive capabilities to score important KOs. We can also take this another way and focus on an offensive typing similar to Heatrans but also work with more setting up moves. This focuses us towards a more defensive typing, but one which has to hit a lot of Pokemon and ideally has no immunities or quad-resistances. This allows us to take a slower, more bulkier approach to trapping but it doesn't inhibit the offensive momentum that you've gathered.

I've looked over my... essay and I've answered Q3 and 4 already so I'm going to end the questions here.

I'm also on board here with Ingus in the fact that if we take typings with the need for a strong resistance to VoltTurn we're making a very defensive trapper, which the community seemed to be against. Whilst I am all for a bulky trapper if we focus our typings on resistances over our offensive capabilities, we run the risk of having more restricted stats and move pools to cater for our more defensive stats. Saying this, having a trapper which can discourage U-Turn and Volt Switch would be a good shout, but I'd be more interested in doing this in a more offensive way as opposed to resistances and immunities.


Mercy Main Btw
I want to make a consideration on Dragon type, outside of the signature moves (Core Enforcer, Dragon Hammer and Clanging Scales), the are only two powerful moves: Draco Meteor and Outrage, but they can't be spammed because of their downsides.
Yes, you can cover these with the Z-crystal, but you can do this only one time. So, unless you have to trap only one Pokemon, or use a signature move, I don't think that Dragon type can be a good idea.

Also I don't like Fairy type, because, unless CAP23 will be a special attacker, Play Rough has not a perfect accuracy and that's not a good thing, since the trapped Pokemon will use an extra move.
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Deck Knight

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One thing I wanted to mention about Dragon and trapping specifically, is that trapping mitigates many of the downsides of several moves. Let's take three, Rest, Gastro Acid / Worry Seed, and Outrage. If your opponent is trapped and cannot 3HKO you without major crit-hax, Rest is a quick and easy way to depleting your enemy of PP of their most threatening move. Pokemon such as Chansey who are trapped that cannot 3HKO with Seismic Toss will invariably lose to Toxic stall, because Toxic has more PP than Heal Bell.

Gastro Acid and Worry Seed are in pretty much the same boat, but basically their biggest weakness is they are removed upon switch. Several CAPs are quite reliant on their abilities, Colossoil and Naviathan in particular who would hate for Guts to be removed, especially their Flame Orb sets. The same could be said about Magic Guard, although Krilowatt's access to Volt Switch makes that pointless in its regard, and Ground typing is just asking for Water STAB to smack CAP up.

Outrage's chief drawback is that an opponent can switch to a Fairy and your Dragon type is then basically fodder. Without that weakness, Outrage not only does immense damage but it's effective PP is double or triple it's actual value (which is quite large), and while the self-confusion effect is undesirable, confusion got nerfed this gen too.

The typings of most concern to me are the ones that have the biggest issues with Tomohawk and Landorus-T, which are omnipresent pivots. Although people could come back and say Colossoil is the greater threat (to my proposed Ghost/Dragon typing), consider the following: Colossoil can't recover, Tomohawk can. Pursuit is a very weak move if you are not switching out, Knock Off is not nearly as potent against Z-Crystal's, and arguably the biggest problem Colossoil presents is Sucker Punch. Flying weakness is not necessarily a deal-breaker, but we should be very wary of giving Tomohawk and Landorus-T excuses to switch into CAP.

As far as U-turn / Volt Switch, a weakness should be avoided at all costs but a resistance is not required. When they just do chip damage it is a livable issue, when CAP is actively weak to them then its trapping abilities will be severely inhibited.


Copying deli meat to hard drive
Gonna throw some support behind dragon types in general for a few reasons (some already mentioned):
  • Resistance to a lot of common pivots' main STABs: water for toxapex/slowbro/insert_bulky_water_here_not_named_fini, grass for tangrowth/amoongus, fire for heatran/mollux
  • Access to STAB moves that have large drawbacks that are mitigated by trapping, like outrage, or to a lesser extent Draco Meteor
  • Anchor Shot, while not a STAB for dragon types, hit its Dragon's one immunity for super effective damage, scaring away a bunch of extra crap we don't want switching in on us like Kerfluffle or Clefable.
  • High base power moves make it easier to check U-turners and V-switchers even without a resist and dissuade them from switching in

Here's a list of some of the pivot mons Dragon typing doesn't particularly help with that we still probably can think about in some capacity:
  • Fini
  • Chansey
  • Tomohawk
  • Celesteela/Ferrothorn/Other bulky steels
  • Potentially, ground type pivots like Lando-T and Colossoil (some who have access to U-turn) might get a free switch in if we don't hit them hard enough with a drag STAB
We don't need to stop EVERY pivot ever, but some of these could be handled with typing alone. I haven't formed an opinion on what the best secondary type to help with Dragon's strengths toward the concept are so I don't really have any input in that direction so far.

But dragons are good. I like dragons.

Also, shameless plug for a tool that might be helpful for people who have issues figuring out what types work against what: link
It's updated for S/M current CAP metagame, so that's nice.
I'm advocating for Pure Electric myself:


-Super-Effective STAB against Toxapex, Tapu Fini, Skarmory, Celesteela and Tomohawk, among others.
-Pure Electric only has one weakness, limiting which offensive mons can switch into it (the primary way of handling trapping moves).
-Electric resists itself, Steel and Flying, which, while not stellar, still cover a handful of mons.
-Some Ground-Types can be dissuaded from switching in with Hidden Power Ice (mostly Garchomp and Landorus-T).


-Ground-Types without an x4 weakness will be much more trouble - not to mention that many physical attackers can learn Earthquake.
-Resisted by Grass, which is a fair bit of a problem. Most Grass-Types have access to recovery, which makes wearing them down difficult.
-Anchor Shot or Spirit Shackle hardly provide any meaningful coverage.


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I'm a big believer in Dragon typings being extremely well matched to this concept, for several reasons.

Dragon has high-powered moves on both the physical and special sides that go great with trapping and make great z nukes (Outrage and Draco Meteor), meaning we don't tie ourself to one stat build too early in the process. It possesses obvious switch-ins, and we can pick and choose which ones wall us easily through our choice of coverage movepool. Both Spirit Shackle and Anchor Shot provide very good coverage for Dragon STAB, assuming the stats fall right for it. Dragon is a great defensive type in its own right, especially on the special side. It's basically perfect for this concept, very useful and clearly balanced.


Dragon/Ghost specifically is crazy hard to balance. The fact that Ghost is neutral against both Fairy and Steel means that finding a good switch-ins would be really difficult even aside from trapping, and would put incredible pressure on us to get everything exactly right in the stat and movepool stages to not produce an absolute monster. Not only so, but Ghost completely eliminates Dugtrio and Revenankh (without Shadow Sneak, which isn't good on Revenankh anyway) as counterplay, which is a bad thing when you consider how amazing the pairing is offensively. I feel that other Dragon type combinations are far better suited for this concept, and much easier to guarantee from a balance standpoint.

I feel Dragon/Fighting and Dragon/Steel are each good typings for this concept. Each has obvious counters that we can choose to trap and kill or not via coverage movepool, and each works great either physically or specially. Both are strong typings defensively. The huge difference between the two is that Dragon/Steel is vulnerable to Revenankh and Dugtrio, while Dragon/Fighting is less so, which could be good or bad depending on how innately powerful you believe trapping is.

Aside from Dragon, I think Ground typings are also very suitable for this concept, with Ground/Fairy as the strongest choice. Almost every Pokemon we would want to trap is brought on by Ground attacks, and Fairy is another type that has good moves for z nukes. Balance would also be pretty easy to guarantee since Celesteela and Skarmory would be strong counters unless we give it coverage specially to beat them.

Incidentally, all three of these types happen to resist both Volt Switch and U-turn, and more importantly they each have ways to discourage Volt Turn users from switching in (except for Dragon/Fighting and Tapu Koko).

Finally, one special note on optics and Dragon types:

Prior to ORAS, Dragon/Fighting and Dragon/Steel would both have been insanely powerful, godly typings that would have sent out optics shockwaves. However, Fairies really gave changed the game that must, and we have more and more varied Steel types than ever. Dragon and Fighting, once the very best and most optimal types, are now just two more types, as compared to the incredible strength of Flying and Fairy.

tl;dr Dragon and Ground are the best offensive types for this concept, and the best combinations for this concept involve one of the two.
I am submitting Dragon/Steel

Fighting(2), Ground(2),
Resistances: Water(1/2), Grass(1/4), Electricity(1/2), Normal(1/2), Flying(1/2), Rock(1/2), Bug(1/2), Steel(1/2), Psychic(1/2)
Immunities: Poison

Dragon/Steel seems like a good option to me for the following reasons. Dragon is a very good type on its own, however it has a lot of threatening weaknesses. Luckily, steel is resistant to ice, dragon, and fairy therefore getting rid of the flaws of dragons. Secondly, though this is less about the game, dragon/steel provides explanations for all the different trap moves. The dragon side could create a ring of fire or a whirlpool. It could also cause sand to fall from the ceiling. The steel side could shoot string in the formation of a web, or shoot a mechanical arrow. Also anchor shot makes since but that is obvious. That is just to name a few but now back to the technicalities. Relating to the previous statements, dragon types can usually use many different types of moves so it does provide actual logic as well. Because Steel is a very defensive type, it could handle staying alive to be able to use traps. It can resist moves such as spikes, toxic spikes, and stealth rocks. Also it has 9 resistances! One of them is a 1/4 resistance, and an Immunity. dragon types also have a few moves that could work with traps such as clanging scales, dragon tail or dragon dance.

Dragon/Steel does have a few flaws but they are only minor. It has two weaknesses, but only two so not that bad. Also There are no dragon type trap moves. Finally neither volt switch nor u-turn fit with the typing. It is still possible to add them it is just very odd as it does not even fit their types or make since if the move was being used by a dragon/steel type.
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I am submitting Electric/Ghost
Resistances: Electric, Steel, Bug, Poison, Flying, Normal, Fighting
Weaknesses: Ground, Ghost, Dark
Hits Super Effectively: Ghost, Water, Flying, Psychic
Resisted By: Electric: Electric, Ground, Dragon Ghost: Dark, Normal

Pros: This typing is an absolute nightmare for two very common Pokemon, Tomohawk and Celesteela, as it either resists or is immune to their STAB, and while Celesteela may have earthquake, Tomohawk has nothing to hit an electric/ghost Pokemon with. It is also worth noting the favorable matchup against Toxapex as well, although that only means so much, as many Toxapex run shed shell. The Electric typing pressures many common Pokemon, such as Volkraken, Mega Charizard Y, Greninja, Arghonaut, and the Pokemon listed above. Another advantage of electric stab is how spammable it can become when paired with a Pokemon like Tapu Koko. Ghost stab hits many of the high ranked pokemon for neutral damage at best, but from A- up on the CAP VR, only 3 Pokemon resist ghost, Colossoil, Greninja(who doesn't appreciate an electric move), and Chansey (Technically an immunity). Dugtrio also cannot trap a ghost type, so it does not have to fear being trapped itself. Yet another advantage of the ghost type is stab in the move Spirit Shackle, allowing this Pokemon to trap and then deal with the threat at hand. Aiding in trapping is the ability to resist both of the pivot attacks; volt switch and u-turn, and also with being an electric type, the chance to use volt switch itself to go into the perfect counter to a tapped Pokemon, or thunder wave to cripple something that's already in rises. Although, I am getting ahead of myself here, I shouldn't be discussing moves as that step comes later.

Cons: The first glaring flaw in this typing is a little(not really) narwhal named Colossoil. Pressuring this type with SE stab, resistances to both types, and being able to snipe with pursuit, Colossoil is problem number 1. Resident skytiger Landorus Therian also scares this pokemon, threatening with earthquake and knock off, but not being able to trap with pursuit like Colossoil. Fat grass types like Tangrowth and Ferrothorn (that also carry knock off) also pressure this pokemon, being able to soak up hit after hit. Also having only one way to stab trap in spirit shackle can make this pokemon predictable, severely harming it in the long run.
Seeing the current subs and looking at a bit of the past discussion, I figured I might as well try and give this typing a go before someone else o.o

So, I'll be submitting Dragon/Fairy as a typing.

Weaknesses: Fairy, Ice, Poison, Steel
Resistances: Bug, Dark, Electric, Fighting, Fire, Grass, Water
Immunities: Dragon
Hits SE: Dragon, Fighting, Dark
Resisted By: Fairy - Fire, Poison, Steel
Dragon - Steel, Fairy

So, what the heck does this typing do to even start making sense with the concept? Let's investigate, starting with the actual trapping moves themselves. In terms of the two elephants in the room, a Dragon/Fairy type can actually find quite good uses of each, as Anchor Shot allows it to hit any incoming Fairy Types for SE damage while also preventing the double swap. Spirit Shackle also has its use in that, along with Fairy STAB, the combo of Ghost and Fairy is unresisted (barring Pyroar, but like, who uses Pyroar in OU/CAP?). Plus, Fairy STAB itself is quite viable in the current metagame, meaning that if TrapCAP decided to try and run a binding move set, it would have a solid STAB to fall back on. In addition, this typing allows a STAB hit on one of the most prominent trappable defensive pivots in CAP: Tomohawk. Speaking of pivoting, this type combo resists both Volt Switch and U-turn, as well as takes neutral damage from attacks by Lando-T.

As for the negatives, it unfortunately doesn't carry a resistance to Stealth Rock (though it isn't weak either, so it's not terrible). The main drawback here is that this typing is really hardly broken by Steel types. Magearna being very prominent right now is especially a problem for this typing, due to Fleur Cannon and that beautiful Steel/Fairy typing, alongside the use of Celesteela, one of the mons that we may have wanted to trap (though by no means a necessity to trap). Furthermore, many of the common OU/CAP bulky pivots can get decent damage off on this typing, such as a Protean Greninja's Ice Beam, Magnezone's Flash Cannon, Scizor's Bullet Punch, &c., all of which puts more pressure on getting that call right.

In general, this typing bears a similar spread to the earlier suggested Dragon/Fighting, but trades the ability to hit common Steel types (Mage and Cele) neutrally as well as the SR resistance for the ability to hit, for STAB, a different set of mons. Not terribly sure if there's anything else I can add here, so any and all critiques that I can edit in are appreciated ^.^
Well, since we've had basically every other combination of the five types that people didn't criticise earlier in the thread (viz., Dragon, Fairy, Fighting, Ground, Steel), I'm proposing Fairy/Steel.

Resistances: Bug (x0.25), Dark, Fairy, Flying, Grass, Ice, Normal, Psychic, Rock
Immunities: Dragon, Poison
Weaknesses: Fire, Ground

- An awe-inspiringly resistant typing, with 9 resistances and 2 immunities overall:
- Immune to poison, so no Toxic damage.
- Resistant to Knock Off and Pursuit.
- 4x resistant to Bug, which means a solid U-turn resist.
- Resists Rock and thus takes reduced damage from Stealth Rock.
- No 4x weaknesses, which would prevent CAP 23 from being fodder for anything carrying the right coverage move.
- Depending on what we do with stats and movepool, a number of pro-concept stat spreads are possible: a decent Attack means that Anchor Shot and Play Rough would get some power behind them (with the compensation of low coverage and imperfect accuracy, respectively) while a decent Special Attack could give us access to solid STABs in Flash Cannon and Dazzling Gleam/Moonblast while keeping the power of Anchor Shot low (and thus ensuring that trapping-move-less sets are possible and making CAP 23 less easy to predict against).
- Matches up very favourably against Tomohawk (and, to a less significant extent, other Fighting-types).

- Weak to Ground, which does not exactly give us a favourable match-up against Colossoil and Landorus-T. (Against Colossoil, this is partially compensated by the fact that we would have super-effective STABs against it, but it's still hardly an ideal scenario).
- Among all those resistances, no resistance to Electric, so neutral to Volt Switch.
- We just did a Fairy-type with Kerfluffle.

Other points:
- Fairy/Steel is neutral to Steel itself, which puts us in a reasonable, but not ideal, position against species like Magearna and Celesteela. In essence, Fairy/Steel trades some other proposed typings' favourable match-ups against Ground-types for a truckload of resistances and a decent position against Steel-types.
- Neutral against most Ghosts and no immediately obvious options to use against them, which might limit effectiveness since Ghosts are immune to trapping. On the other hand, we have a solid position against the newly buffed Revenankh, which is something.
- As a stylistic thing, trapper isn't really a role that Fairy/Steel has taken before; we have the boosting bruiser in Magearna, the overpowered jaws of death in Mawile, and the status-move trickster with Klefki. Fairy/Steel wouldn't see us duplicating a role.

Commentary very appreciated! There are a number of very strong typings that have already been suggested and I look forward to seeing which one we'll pass on to CAP 23.


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I'm really intrigued by this discussion so far. Out of all the submissions submitted so far, there hasn't been one that's jumped out saying "this is the absolute perfect typing for this concept." Before you say "but snake the type I submitted IS the perfect typing," what I mean is that most any of these typings could very well work for this concept, which is great considering how targeted this concept might seem on the surface.

I think the best typings for this concept is a combination of some of Dragon, Fairy, Steel, Ground, and Fighting (though I'm not too keen on Ground/Fighting because their coverage overlaps really redundantly). These types in particular have good synergy in general with the offensive trapping moves and can balance defensive and neutral coverage extremely well. Ghost typing and Flying typing work too but generally suffer from defensive standpoint. I'll comment on the ones I like in particular:

Dragon / Fairy and Dragon / Fighting are remarkably similar: both have Dragon-typing that allows for strong neutral coverage, but their secondary STAB moves cover whichever common walls we'll target, some for supereffective damage and some for neutral damage. In general, these typings hold a great balance between defensive and offensive merit, which seems important for this concept.

Dragon / Steel and Fairy / Steel fall into the same boat, but to tackle down most walls, we'll need more coverage, and I'm not sure if we want to have CAP23 run only AOA sets purely because we need the coverage to make up for our STAB moves.

Ground / Fairy is very interesting because many good walls are lured in by Ground-type moves, and most of those same walls (but not all) are covered by Fairy-type moves. Fairy typing achieves the neutral coverage we want like Dragon does but lacks the high Base Power moves that Dragon has as well.

Ghost / Fairy goes more offensive rather than defensive, but it still works very well with the trapping moves available to us, and it does tackle the walls we want to target pretty well. Lack of resistances (despite the number of immunities) still hurts though.

These aren't the only typings that will work, but I see legitimate merit in these in particular. Right now, we have lots of posts with submissions. I encourage everyone to comment on typings they like or don't like. If you like or despise a certain typing, explain why. The more we discuss now, the better idea we'll have of the obstacles we might face later on in the process. It doesn't do any good to leave your concerns about a typing unaddressed now, then start talking about how A/B typing doesn't work once the poll starts. This is Typing Discussion not Typing Submission, after all. Don't be afraid to explain why a typing is bad for this concept. As long as you have sound reasoning for your dissension, the worst that can happen here is that someone shows why you might not have thought it out completely, and that's fine. We're all working on CAP23 together, so let's try to figure out which typings really work and which ones might not work as well.
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Master Procraster
is a CAP Contributor
Might as well say my thoughts.

Other than my own submission (which I doubt will go through), my support is fully behind Dragon/Fairy, with Dragon/Fighting not far behind. Both of these types have an incredibly balanced mix of both offense and defense and can greatly fulfill the concept in its fullest in my opinion, but what edges out Dragon/Fairy is the ability to take on possibly our biggest stop in general, Tomohawk, as well as having exploitable but not too exploitable weaknesses. Dragon/Fighting does have some great advantages, such as a better offensive typing and better utilization of both Spirit Shackle and Anchor Shot. Unfortunately, that 4x weakness to Fairy is hugely offputting if it is supposed to lure them in , as it may not even be able to survive a single Moonblast/Play Rough if the opponent can take the hit. Ground/Fairy also is interesting, as it also offers a great mix of offense and defense with its typing, but I can see it struggling generally against the bulkier mons we are targeting, with Grass and Water types notably giving it trouble, while Pyroak can have a bloody field day. Trapping also doesn't do anything too notable with the typing in my opinion.

On the other hand, I absolutely despise any Ghost type submission, with an extra special mention going to Dragon/Ghost. As good sir reachzero highlighted in his post, Dragon/Ghost is a type that has the potential to get very much out of hand because its STABs are pretty much unresisted by everything in the metagame except Bisharp, who is not viable in the current CAP metagame. Because of this, as well as the general spammability of Spirit Shackle (more on that later), the rest of the process would be a very delicate balancing act to try and not make the thing an absolute broken mess who cannot be controlled. I think that this would result in a massive headache for the other stages and generally can limit possible experimentation due to the fear of making the thing overpowered. So, in terms of that, Dragon/Ghost is literally a worst case scenario in my opinion.

As for my hatred for Ghost types in general, it has to do with the possible implications of STAB Spirit Shackle. If STAB Spirit Shackle was given to a Ghost type CAP 23 (which I bet I could almost guarantee) I believe that there would be no reason not to run Spirit Shackle on every set it would ever run. Here is why:

  • Spirit Shackle, by being a Ghost type move, has ludicrously good neutral coverage, only having one resistance and one immunity. Notably, these issues can both be fixed with a single coverage type.
  • Spirit Shackle is one of the strongest physical Ghost type moves in the entirety of the game. The only things with higher base power A) requires two turns to use without Never-Ending Nightmare B) is a Legendary/Mythical exclusive. The outlier here is Shadow Bone, but the difference in base power is so inconsequential that it barely makes a difference.
  • Spirit Shackle has an incredible secondary effect (AKA the trapping). This is a superior secondary effect to every other move of a similar base power, and Spirit Shackle would be run almost all the time due to this absolutely nuts secondary effect.
There is no physical Ghost type STAB that is in fact better than Spirit Shackle, and this move is unnaturally spammable, almost to the point of being riskless. This move also has extraordinary neutral coverage, meaning that you only ever have to run one or two coverage moves to be able to hit everything, which can usually be done through a secondary typing or a straight up coverage move. STAB Spirit Shackle is simply too good.

"But isn't this concept about trapping moves? Shouldn't we make the move as appealing as possible to make sure to use it?"

While, yes, we should promote the usage of trapping moves during this process since the concept is actually based on trapping moves, Spirit Shackle is too much. Take a look at this segment from snake's concept assessment post:
snake_rattler said:
4. Opponents should expect a trapping move set but fear a) the other moves CAP23 will run and b) non-trapping sets. (i.e. a) "Now that I've been trapped, is A, B, or etc. going to happen?" and b) "I've been playing around CAP23 like it's been running a trap move, but it's really not!")
As noted from this post, we should generally expect trapping moves to be run on CAP23, but we should also fear the possibility of variation through other moves to be run and non-trapping sets. This is what makes Heatran such an effective trapper with Magma Storm; people can expect it to be running a Magma Storm set, but there is also the chance that it could be running a Scarf set, meaning that your Excadrill can't come in safe to revenge kill it. Heatran can run these different sets and different moves because they each have thier benefits and uses over the other.

If we give STAB Spirit Shackle, we don't get this because there is no better move than Spirit Shackle. Spirit Shackle is just so good that it would find its way onto every set, no matter the role. Instead of becoming a mon that makes you think, "Oh, it probably will trap me, but there's the chance that it might not have that move" it will become the mon that makes you think "Oh, its going to try and trap me. Let me switch to Colossoil and I'll use Pursuit" It will become a predictable, uninteresting mon. It will become Decidueye.

P.S. Sorry If I went overboard, those are just my honest thoughts ;-;
Ghost / Dragon This is one of the ones I really like. Dragon has a lot of resistances and host gives it a couple more imunities making this a great defensive typing. It resists Volt-Turn and has been said, dragon STAB really benefits from trapping. The fact that both its STABs have immunities also mean that trapping becomes more important to prevent a switch into an immunity. Anchor Shot does SE damage to one of its weaknesses and it gets STAB on Spirit Shackle. And STAB Spirit Shackle can also help chase away the other Ghosts that are immune to our traps. Immunity to one of Tomohawk's STABs is also a bonus. The immunity to counter trapping is also nice. A dark weakness is a pity, but Pursuit and Knock-Off are going to be less of an issue when not switching out and when using a Z-crystal. In addition, I believe that Fairy-coverage is a good idea anyway to give a small niche to Fairium Z Fairy Lock users.

Offensively, dragon hits most things neutrally, and Ghost hits the Steels and Fairies that wall it neutrally.

Ground/Steel This is another one I really like. Steel is another great defensive typing that gives an important immunity to both a type, and an important status. It also provides STAB on Anchor Shot. Ground shuts down Volt Switch completely, meaning that a Ground typing traps more mon than any other. We also resist U-Turn. Ground is also an amazing offensive typing, especially in the CAP metagame. That said, there are those who are immune to it, making trapping to avoid switching into an immunity more appealing. We're also immune to sandstorm damage which can be helpful and get STAB Sand Tomb. We also quadruply resist Stealth Rock which makes coming in at the right time to trap much easier.

Offensively, Ground is an amazing typing, especially in the Cap metagame, and while Steel isn't an amazing offensive type, it hits the Flying and Grass types that wall Ground neutrally.

Dragon/Flying While this typing has benefits, I think that a 4x weakness, especially to such common coverage as ice, is very bad for a mon that has to take multiple hits to do its job properly.

While these are good offensive types, they are both walled by Steel, necessitating Fire/Fighting coverage which limits us.

Dragon/Fighting While not as bad as ice, especially with Anchor Shot availability, a 4X weakness to Fairy still does us no favours.

Offensively, these are great types, but both walled by Fairies, meaning that Anchor Shot is pretty much the only trap move that will be run.

Steel/Dragon This is another typing I really like. Steel and Dragon are both great defensive typings and an immunity to being poisoned is really helpful. As well as to the Poison type and sandstorm. We also get STAB Anchor Shot. The benefits of trapping to dragon STAB have already been discussed. A resistance to Stealth Rock is also great. As is a resistance to Volt-Turn.

Dragon is great offensively and Steel donks the Fairies that are immune to it. Admittedly, other Steels do give it issues, but I think that the other points make up for this.

Steel/Grass While a great defensive typing, a 4x weakness to a common offensive typing like fire does hurt.

Offensively, neither of these is an amazing type. They're both walled by Fire as well, for example.

Ghost/Ground This is my favourite typing for this concept. Immunity to Volt-Switch, 3 typings, and counter-trapping. A great offensive STAB in Ground. Both STABs have immunities to encourage trapping. STAB on both Spirit Shackle and Sand Tomb. STAB Spirit Shackle chases away other, untrappable Ghosts. Resistance to U-Turn. Immunity to one of Tomohawk's STABs. And, as said earlier, dark weakness is not too much of an issue.

As I said earlier, Ground is amazing offensively and Ghost hits Flying neutrally and as I said, we want to hit ghosts super-effectively if possible. Admittedly, Normal/Flying types wall us, but most of them aren't that relevant and can be dealt with with coverage.

Flying/Ground I've mentioned why I think a 4X ice weakness is a bad idea.

Offensively they're pretty great admittedly, doing SE damage to a lot of things.

Fairy/Ground This isn't bad. It does have all the advantages of ground I highlighted earlier and U-Turn resistance. Fairy also makes the Fairium Z set I mentioned more appealing. It also messes up Tomohawk, which is nice. And a resistance to dark is pretty nice. It also provides another immunity. I still prefer the advantages other typings give though.

Offensively, as said, Ground is great and Fairy's pretty strong too, with Ground covering its weak points.

Dark/Ghost While the reduction of U-Turn to a neutrality is there, this does offer the other benefits of the Ghost typing while also being immune to Tomohawk's prankster, which is nice. It also is not weak to Dark.

Offensively, they're a bit redundant admittedly.

Psychic / Fighting I'm a bit worried about a weakness to flying with Tomohawk and Lando out there.

Offensively, they are walled by other psychic types, though Fighting is a pretty good offensive typing that has some of its weaknesses, such as to Poison patched by Psychic.

ghost/fairy I've mentioned the advantages of both Ghost and Fairy already. Dark becomes a neutrality here. Not a bad choice.

Offensively, Fairy and Ghost are pretty good as well.

Ghost/Normal Three immunities is just lovely, especially when one is to the Ghosts that otherwise mess us up and we can hit them back Super-Effectively. Again, both STABs have immunities. I have been convinced that this is a pretty good choice.

Normal's offensive problems are also patched up by Ghost, with Ghost doing SE damage to the Ghosts that are immune to Normal and which we want to chase away.

Flying / Steel I really don't want a weakness to Volt-Switch if possible.

It's also walled by other Steels offensively.

Ground / Fighting Quadruply resistant to Stealth Rock, immune to Volt-Switch, resists U-Turn. Great offensive typing where both STABS have immunities. One of those immunities being Ghost is unfortunate though, and as I said earlier, as is weakness to flying.

Admittedly, it does struggle offensively against Flying, but they are pretty good offensive types otherwise.

Pure Electric I'm reasonably neutral on this one. It resists Volt-Switch and has a good STAB that has immunties and has a good defensive typing. Ground coverage is common though and it doesn't have a lot else going for it.

Electric is pretty nice offensively, but leaves us walled by Ground and Grass and makes carrying Ice coverage very predictable.

Electric/Ghost Well I've already discussed the benefits of both Electric and Ghost. They don't go badly together.

Ghost does patch up Electric's offensive shortcomings.

Dragon/Fairy A dragon that turns a weakness to an immunity and another to a neutrality is pretty good. I've already discussed the benefits of both typings and they go well together.

Offensively, however, Fairy doesn't really strengthen Dragon's shortcomings much, still being walled by Steel and other Fairies.

Fairy/Steel Fairy and steel have both been discussed and one of Fairy's weaknesses becomes an immunity here. It's a pretty good combo.

Offensively, however, it leaves us walled by Fire types.
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I wanna qualify a bit your post LucarioOfLegends.

If we have to be careful about the risk that the trapmove is spammable, there is an other point I would like to approach. It exists a strong move in the game which prevents switch-in. A move which has a base power of 90 and an accuracy of 100% with a nice typing. It is the best trap move in the game (except maybe magma storm). But this move is never used. This move is called Thousand Waves and it is the signature move of Zygarde.

Why have we never seen Thousand Waves in a battle ? Because Zyg gets so many good options to use instead of it (Thousand arrows in the first slot). Now, I have a question. How can you be sure that a trap move will be a minimum used on a Pokemon with an insane dual Stab ? You can imagine whatever you want, you must have a trapmove usually used but which hasn't to be always used. In my opinion, moves like sand tomb even with an extra ability won't be used on a mon which has an insane coverage like Fairy/ground. If you give for example, Anchor Shot on a Dragon/Fighting, you will have the same problem than Spirit Shackle : Anchor shot will be always used like a strong coverage move. To summarize, I think it is very hard to give a good trap move to an offensive trapper in being sure that the move will be used without getting it spammable.

However, there is a solution to this. Heatran is a good trapper not because it can have a scarf set without magma storm. Heatran is a good trapper because even with magma storm, it can run different options/sets. Heatran can have Taunt/Stealth Rock/Toxik/Z-Solar Beam/Protect/Earth Power/Substitute/Will-o-wisp. You cannot know in seeing Magma storm which set Heatran runs. Does it run a stallbreaker set ? An Offensive Set ? A stealth rock setter ? That is the strength of Heatran. Even if Spirit Shackle (Anchor shot or whatever else) is spammable, we can ensure that CAP23 has the possibility to run a set completely different than the classical set of trapper. I think it is the good approach to have an interesting CAP, to make a versatile trapper.
Personally, I don't think our trap move being spammable is a problem. In fact, I think that the more easily we can use the trap move, the better. Because we are meant to be defined as a trap-move user. The last thing we want is for the trap-move to barely be used. We want other sets to be viable, but only because the expectation of a trap move makes them harder to prepare for and the fact that they exist means that the trapping sets cannot be countered as safely. I still think that by far the majority of the time, it will use its trap move and we should want that trap move to be as beneficial as possible to the cap.

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People seem not to be able to decide if Ghost/Dragon would be so powerful it would break the game or so predictable based on Spirit Shackle's Spammability that it would be easily countered. Neither of these is necessarily true.

As I said, one of the chief drawbacks is CAP relies on neutral hits, and the CAP metagame is generally bulky enough where neutral hits score 3HKO's at most, and in CAP's case we're likely getting a KO based on neutral hit + breaking Z-Move, which will KO one member of the opponent's team at the cost of your Z-Slot. This is not a bad tradeoff, nor is it a bad tradeoff if CAP can repeatedly skirmish with a Draco Meteor or a Spirit Shackle (which, even after accounting for STAB is the same Base Power as unSTAB Close Combat or Brave Bird for comparison) and then switch out.

I think given both Spirit Shackle and Anchor Shot, the two moves will still compete because of the strength of the Fairy Lure. SE Anchor Shot has 160 effective BP, Spirit Shackle has 120. Spirit Shackle is going to have a difficult time scoring 2HKOs because it will almost never see an "it's super-effective!" message, and it's equally true Ghost and Dragon don't synergize well offensively. The other type feels like an add-on in ways Dragon / Fighting or Dragon / Steel does not. Do you go for Ghost / Fighting + Dragon or Dragon / Ground + Ghost? There are benefits to Ghost/Fite/Drag but not against Magearna or Mega Mawile, which are much bigger threats than Colossoil, Voodoom, and Malaconda.

Overall the typing has many food targets like Mollux and Plasmanta, but that neutral hit reliance is kind of a form of "Electivire Syndrome" in typing form, which balances it considerably.


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People seem not to be able to decide if Ghost/Dragon would be so powerful it would break the game or so predictable based on Spirit Shackle's Spammability that it would be easily countered. Neither of these is necessarily true.

As I said, one of the chief drawbacks is CAP relies on neutral hits, and the CAP metagame is generally bulky enough where neutral hits score 3HKO's at most, and in CAP's case we're likely getting a KO based on neutral hit + breaking Z-Move, which will KO one member of the opponent's team at the cost of your Z-Slot. This is not a bad tradeoff, nor is it a bad tradeoff if CAP can repeatedly skirmish with a Draco Meteor or a Spirit Shackle (which, even after accounting for STAB is the same Base Power as unSTAB Close Combat or Brave Bird for comparison) and then switch out.

I think given both Spirit Shackle and Anchor Shot, the two moves will still compete because of the strength of the Fairy Lure. SE Anchor Shot has 160 effective BP, Spirit Shackle has 120. Spirit Shackle is going to have a difficult time scoring 2HKOs because it will almost never see an "it's super-effective!" message, and it's equally true Ghost and Dragon don't synergize well offensively. The other type feels like an add-on in ways Dragon / Fighting or Dragon / Steel does not. Do you go for Ghost / Fighting + Dragon or Dragon / Ground + Ghost? There are benefits to Ghost/Fite/Drag but not against Magearna or Mega Mawile, which are much bigger threats than Colossoil, Voodoom, and Malaconda.

Overall the typing has many food targets like Mollux and Plasmanta, but that neutral hit reliance is kind of a form of "Electivire Syndrome" in typing form, which balances it considerably.
I don't think people are undecided at all, so perhaps you meant the community is undecided. I am convinced, for instance, that is we go with a Ghost type, and in particular with Ghost/Dragon, it will become necessary to disallow Spirit Shackle entirely. I won't post a ton of calcs here because that would definitely involve some poll jumping, but Ghost is the best offensive type in SM, and Dragon, Ground, etc. cover the only type that resists it. Fairies wouldn't switch into a Ghost/Dragon at all, because the risk of being 2hkoed by, say, Spirit Shackle + Never-Ending Nightmare is just too great. Just using Choice Band and spamming Spirit Shackle is a very appealing option for Ghost/Colossoil coverage type, and that would be hellishly hard to balance. At that rate, I think disallowing Spirit Shackle would be the best and safest option for Ghost/Dragon, and I bet STAB Spirit Shackle is one of the main reasons people want it.

I think almost any combination of Dragon, Ground or Fairy with a good offensive complement works well in terms of this concept.
Okay, snake_rattler has asked for my thoughts on the offensive nature of the typing. As he pointed out, as we decided on an offensive trapper, so offensive typing is important.

That said, I still think that the defensive typing is very important on a trap move user due to the fact that they need to take hits to do their job and an accidentally trap a mon that is dangerous to them.

That said, as far as offensive nature is concerned, I believe we should consider the following:

1. We should try to scare away ghosts, if possible.

Ghosts are immune to trapping and so we want to keep them away from the Cap. This can be done defensively, but a ghost or dark typing on an offensive mon can really help scare away those that ruin our traps with their typing.

2. Our trap moves should be made appealing to use.

This can be done with abilities, but we don't want to constrain ourselves before we have to. As such, getting STAB on a trap move, particularly one with high BP like Anchor Shot or Spirit Shackle is helpful. As has been mentioned, finding a typing that appreciates ghost or steel as coverage also works.That would mean having moves that are resisted by, say, fairies or psychics for example. Also, encouraging multiple trapping moves is better as each has flaws (Spirit Shackle has been mentioned as spammable, but Normals are completely immune to it, for example) and it increases the unpredictability of sets while providing more opportunity to learn about trapping moves.

3. It is better if some mon are immune to our STABs.

This seems contradictory, but this encourages the Cap to trap instead of to just spam a move to sweep. When you think your opponent might switch in a mon that is immune to your powerful attack it becomes better to trap to ensure that your powerful move isn't wasted. This encourages typings like Ghost, Ground, Dragon, Fighting, Electric, Psychic and Normal, though abilities expands the list quite a bit. Ability based immunities tend to be rarer though. Also, resistances can still provide a similar effect.

4. Our STABs should hit a lot of pokemon, particularly a lot of relevant pokemon, hard

Some typings can do this partially through strong neutral coverage and availability to strong STAB moves. Dragon is a good example. Others do so through many mon having weaknesses to them. Cap has a reputation for being filled with Ground-weak mon, for example. As such, a Ground-typing, for example, gives strong offensive presence that is helpful. You can narrow down the list to focus on pivots, walls and any other mon that tend to give most of the meta a hard time to focus better. For example, something hurting Tomohawk, like a Fairy, is appealing. That said, we are not meant to counter specific threats, so that isn't quite as important, but we are designing for the Cap metagame and want to not be destroyed so easily that we are not viable at all there.

5. Trapping takes up a lot of moveslots

As such, needing coverage can make trapping less appealing. That said, we don't need to counter every mon and having perfect coverage available might be anti-concept itself, as it takes away the risk of using a useless move away, which makes trapping less worth it. In addition, sets using different coverage from each other might be preferable both to give a non-trapping option, ad to make the trappers less predictable and therefore, more viable.

6. It is better if our strong STABs are badly affected by others switching out.

Dragon's Outrage has been used as an example here. We want to encourage trapping, which means making our best moves harder to use without trapping.

As such, offensively, I really support Ground typings, followed by dragon, fairy and fighting typings. Then Ghost, dark and electric typings.

On the spammability of Spirit Shackle:

Firstly, there is an entire type that is completely immune to it. It's not exactly always going to produce desirable results to always use it. Secondly, if we want to be defined as a trapper, we have to make trapping moves as appealing as possible to use, and yes, that means that giving them STAB is a good idea if possible. Thirdly, Ghosts ruin our concept. Having a Ghost trapping move that does a lot of damage helps solve the viability of the idea.
I'm (somewhat obviously) still a big fan of Dragon/Steel, as an absolutely excellent defensive type. I feel somewhat leery of both Dragon/Fairy and Dragon/Fighting, because while they have good offensive/defensive balance; I feel like the Toxic immunity of Steel and the STAB on Anchor Shot is almost too good to pass up. Ground/Fairy is nice because of a great coverage combo, only being resisted by Flying/Steel and various Levitators, but possibly lacks the defensive resilience of some of the other types, notably the Steel types' poison immunities and the Dragon types' great defensive resistances. I also think making CAP23 Ghost type might be a bit too strong, Ghost is a very powerful offensive type, especially paired with Fairy for example.
My submission is ground/dragon.

Resistances: Fire, poison, rock
Immunities: elecrtic
Weaknesses: dragon,fairy,ice(X4)
STAB Hit SE : steel, dragon, electric, poison, fire, rock
STAB are rested by: none

Ground is a great typing for a trapper since it has an immunity to electric. Even if the nessecity to resist volt-turn has been disctuted, an immunity to volt switch is without contest usefull, since it prevent trapped volt-switchers from switching out. This type also give you a nice resistance to stealth rock. The problem of ground is that it can't touch flying polemon and is weak to water and grass, which are 3 common typing for pivots. There comes the dragon type, with it's resistance to water and grass and great neutral coverage.
Ground/dragon also benefit of trapping: if you want to use your STAB, your opponent could switch on an immunity (fairy for the dragon STAB and fly for the ground one). Trapping a pokemon protect you from such mind game and is a way to be sure of the move you should use. This is also applicable if you want to use outrage.
Now, lets have a look on the negative points of ground/dragon. Firstly, it doesn't get STAB on anchor shot nor on spirit shackel. Secondly, it is two times weak to ice, a very common offensive typing and to status ( it's only status immunity is thunder wave)
To sum up:
- volt switch immunity
- exelent neutral coverage
- can benefit of trapping
- resistance to stealth rock
- no weakness to volt-turn

- no STAB on spirit shackel/anchor shot
- vulnerable to status
- take 4X the damage of ice
- no resistance to U-turn

Note: i hope to be on time.
Other than my own submission (which likely is fucked ;~;), I really like Ground / Fairy. It simultaneously resists U-Turn, Pursuit, Stealth Rocks and is immune to Volt Switch while still packing some of the best offensive typings in the game, especially considering what we want to trap. The only things that I can think of that wall STABs + Anchor Shot are Cawm, Celesteela and Pyroak. The only concern that I have with the typing is that we would have to give TrapCAP abundant coverage in order to make Anchor Shot not required on every set, which I do not think is something we should box ourselves into. I'm not saying that we shouldn't do it period, but abundant coverage shouldn't be our only option in order to make Anchor Shot a possibility rather than an inevitability.

As for Ghost / Dragon, I am honestly worried like Luc that it would essentially be a balancing act to make sure it doesn't crush the metagame. Even if we only give Anchor Shot and not Spirit Shackle, it covers two weaknesses that Dragon has in Ice and Fairy. I do not think it could exactly fail at the concept, as the typing is amazing. Resisting Volt Switch and U-Turn, being immune to trapping itself, and immune to Rapid Spin all make it fantastic. The only downside is the Pursuit weakness. However, it seems like a slippery slope about making it balanced enough to where it doesn't break the game.
Well, I added some extra comments on the offensive nature of the typings I discussed.

Ground/Dragon While this is a great typing offensively and has all the advantages I mentioned for each of there types, a 4X weakness to a type as common as Ice attacks, means I cannot support it as much as combining either typing with certain other typings.


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I think that, with regard to STAB on the trapping moves, our goal is to make opponents fear the moves, not simply expect them. And there is a big difference between the two, even if we do end up seeing trapping moves on every set. Lets use my suggested Dragon/Fighting typing as an example:

Say we know Close Combat, Outrage and Anchor Shot. Those moves have fantastic coverage between them, but the useful trapping coverage move is different from your main STAB. As we are using a trapping move the opponent can choose who it wants to let potentially be trapped. So, in light of that, let us look at a situation where the CAP has gotten in on something it can easily scare with its STABs. The effect of the trapping move means that, even if you misdirect and they do not switch, so long as they do not KO you, you can just KO them the next round without any prediction, as they are now trapped. As such, there is very little reason for the opponent not to switch, unless they would rather sack the mon than let something else take a hit.

Now, lets just say that the opponent has a fairy, like Clefable, and something like Krilowatt, that really doesn't care at all about Anchor Shot. If the opponent assumes that you are going to use one of your strong STABs, they can just swap to Clefable, taking nothing, or next to it, and easily scaring the CAP away. What's more, Clefable is not trapped so it could even double switch and gain a further advantage. However, if they predict wrong and switch into an Anchor Shot, they are taking a very solid hit. Without knowing how strong we will be, its impossible to say how big a hit, but even if it is not putting it in KO range, it does do significant damage and prevents a double switch, letting you swap out to Heatran or something that really doesn't care about Clefable, with no risk. On the other hand though, if they think Anchor Shot is coming, they could instead switch to their Krilowatt. With its double resistance, it really doesn't care at all, and with Ice Beam in its arsenal, it becomes a real threat to the CAP. What's more Kril can be packing Volt Switch, allowing it to eliminate even the switch advantage. But, again, should they predict wrong, Kril is now switching into a neutral hitting STAB 120 BP Attack, likely putting it into KO range, if it isn't killing already.

This is an interesting situation because, even though the trapping element isn't necessarily letting you trap kill anything until the one of the checks is gone, it is forcing the opponent to think hard about switches, and grants you free switch advantage should you predict right with it. It is not a classic 50/50 with only two outcomes, and which choices give better odds is largely a function of the battle situation as a whole.

If, on the other hand, we are a type that gives STAB to the trapping move, especially if that type is ghost, things are entirely different. As reachzero pointed out, Ghost is one of, if not the single, best offensive type in the metagame. And Spirit Shackle is arguably the best offensive move of that type. In such a situation, Spirit Shackle becomes the trapping move and the powerful STAB all in one, and becomes endlessly spammable. There is far less for an opponent to think about in such a case. Everything would dislike being hit by that except normal types (good ones of which are few and far between) and Dark types that have Pursuit (and potentially Sucker Punch if they are not faster) or U-Turn/Volt Switch (aka Colossoil). Add in a secondary STAB that hits the few things that don't care about Spirit Shackle, and you have something that as reach said, "would be hellishly hard to balance."
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