Metagame Chimera 1v1 [Leader's Choice]

Trick and Switcheroo are now banned, logic, but is there any way to know the patch dates of ps?

Torment + Encore + Perish Body, why isn't it banned already ? prevents too many play style, perish body needs 1 condition to work, be slower than your opponent which is so easy to do.

Water Bubble, no need to ban, every tanky pkm that resist it is safe.

V-Create, no need to ban, every pkm that resist it is safe. contrary v-create sucks hard.

Electrify, should be banned,it's like Perish body, too easy to use, 2 weaknesses dark and ground and thats all.
 
Just adding my thoughts to the ban conversation.

I kinda think you need to avoid banning anything. Almost every ban you implement is going to result primarily from the fact that players struggle to team build in this metagame. There is of course a time and place for bans, huge power and wonderguard, for example, should never be allowed. However, almost everything else has a reliable counter, if you can only manage to make a team built for it and wait for players to adapt.

Most players run around with 1-2 different strategies at most, and so of course they're going to struggle vs superior offence or stall when all they have is their gorilla tactics, choice band attack, or water bubble, water spout. Why not encourage players to incorporate things like magic guard, teravolt, sturdy, water absorb, protect, klutz, toxic, encore, and so on to overcome particularly annoying strategies like trick, hyper-stall or uber offence?

That's the spirit of a game mode like this. The entire game mode is about team building, and very little about skill. By the time you've selected your mon on preview, most of the game is decided. You can't avoid having OP strategies rise to dominance, and each time you remove something, you are weakening the game mode. In a 1v1 format, you just need to accept that some strategies aren't viable and that some games aren't winnable. You can't avoid that, and it's senseless to ban a single strategy when the meta can easily just adapt to overcome it, usually just with a single compromise to incorporate an ability, like klutz or teravolt. Sure, it might make your team less viable against other strategies, but that's just what team building is about, that's what a 1v1 format does. It's when a combination of strategies provide an unbeatable team (Winning against teams that are designed to counter it) that you need to start banning things.

You have to just accept that players need to be proactive with their team building. People who dislike spending a long time team building, or hate playing against busted strategies and can't adapt, probably shouldn't be playing a meta that is designed around the idea of extensive team building and busted, uber/hackmons strategies.

Any Chimera 1v1 team should fit atleast 3 viable strategies, ranging from hyper offence to stall, to gimmics. And every team requires some serious planning beforehand. If your one-trick pony team got beat by stall or hyper offence, and you don't even try a new team to counter that, that's kinda just your fault. If you specifically attempt to build and counter that team, verse that team again and still find you can't beat it, well then your complaints might be justified.

It's just not a metagame well designed for limitations and competitive teams. Embrace that.

Side note: Can someone tell me why FEAR (Specifically using level 1 Pokemon) doesn't work? I didn't see anything banning it, yet it automatically takes stats from a level 100 version of my pokemon, despite being taken from a lvl 1 Mew's stats? Is the level forced to be 100? or is the level being taken from a different Pokemon (Not the 4th/stat giver)
 
Side note: Can someone tell me why FEAR (Specifically using level 1 Pokemon) doesn't work? I didn't see anything banning it, yet it automatically takes stats from a level 100 version of my pokemon, despite being taken from a lvl 1 Mew's stats? Is the level forced to be 100? or is the level being taken from a different Pokemon (Not the 4th/stat giver)
The fear needs to be your 1st pokemon, as it uses it's lvl.

There was a time where the 4th mon donated the lvl 1 HP stat, but the rest were 100, so a draining move will heal you up to full if you deal move than double your HP stat. But it got fixed.
 
:ss/alakazam::ss/klefki:
Due to its overcentralizing nature, Trick and Switcheroo are now banned. Its ability to instantly win against most setup and stall sets, as well as its sheer splashability, makes it an unhealthy presence in the metagame. tagging Kris to implement

Other items on the watchlist:
Torment + Encore + Perish Body is a strategy that takes only a couple turns to setup and ends with the opponent struggling every other turn. Combine it with Perish Body and a very slow stat donor, and if the user can live at least one hit from the opponent, they have an almost guaranteed win. Perish Body being allowed is an oversight by me so it's likely that it will be banned soon, as it has a very good matchup with a physically bulky stat donor against most physical sets, but Torment + Encore is already a formidable strategy so I might be banning Torment as well.

Water Bubble boosts Water-type attacks to astronomical levels which when paired with moves such as Water Spout or Surging Strikes can easily break through resists (and as for Surging Strikes, it can easily break through Sturdy and Multiscale). Personally I would like Water Bubble and Surging Strikes gone because Surging Strikes breaking through Sturdy/Multiscale/Shadow Shield feels pretty unhealthy when those abilities are solid checks to the nuke sets that are common.

V-Create is an extremely powerful move with versatile abusers in Ho-Oh and Reshiram and viable donors in Rayquaza and Victini. It, paired with abilities like Drought, only serve to elevate its power even more. Contrary was mentioned but in my opinion that ability is more broken with moves like Fleur Cannon or Overheat, since V-Create doesn't lower offensive stats.

Electrify, when paired with Prankster (or Speed Boost), easily walls out any non-Dark type for 32 turns. With the aid of a Leppa Berry or even Recycle, any Pokemon that doesn't have faster priority is effectively PP stalled to death. It's pretty clear when someone's using it, though, so it's lower priority.

These are the main things I'll watch out for, mainly. Let me know if there's something else uncompetitive.
I dont think water bubble, water spout, surging strikes, v-create or contrary require a ban, they are pretty easy to predict and have a lot of counterplay, beyond the obvious water absorb, dry skin and flash fire you can beat them with anything bulky enough that can hit back, we are playing with uber stuff like Palkia, Rayquaza and Zekrom than easly fit on any offensive team and resists those moves and as soon as you can hit back water spout becomes nothing, surging stikes is a suicide move if you can fit a rocky helmet or iron barbs/rough skin on your team and anything than resist water, contrary just die to unaware, spectral thief, you can even fit a pressure mon (like most legendaries) on your team, protect and spite and win by default in two turns, and most of those hyper offesive strategies just die to any dumb gimmick you see on ladder like sturdy + metal burst, fake out + extreme speed, body press teams, or just something faster than hit for higher damage because this meta is full of them.

Electrify is not that hard to play against thanks to Boltund and Heliolisk making it obvious from the team preview, from there you can use mold breaker, sunsteel strike, moongeist beam to still deal damage, as you need volt absorb for it to be actually dangerous among other strategies like boosting first, using something faster or priority, if they use it with prankster and you dont want to use a dark type for some reason there is always magic bounce, status moves (im not even sure why you wouldnt just boost yourself or use toxic if the oppenent want to waste 32 turns using electrify to resist your hits instead of a good defensive mon), electrify is just a much worse encore + torment without volt absorb, there are better ways to pp stall someone to dead than electrify them for 32 turns.

Im fine with perish body leaving, like yeah you can see it coming if you see Cursola on the opposite team but cursola can go on different team slots thanks to a pretty good movepool, it has some good counterplay too but i guess thats a bit too much for most teams when you pair it with torment and other annoying stuff than can play around most of the supposed counterplay, useless you run Xatu and enough support moves to not attack and still win.
 

anaconja

long day at job
is a Tiering Contributor
Electrify is not that hard to play against thanks to Boltund and Heliolisk making it obvious from the team preview, from there you can use mold breaker, sunsteel strike, moongeist beam to still deal damage, as you need volt absorb for it to be actually dangerous among other strategies like boosting first, using something faster or priority, if they use it with prankster and you dont want to use a dark type for some reason there is always magic bounce, status moves (im not even sure why you wouldnt just boost yourself or use toxic if the oppenent want to waste 32 turns using electrify to resist your hits instead of a good defensive mon), electrify is just a much worse encore + torment without volt absorb, there are better ways to pp stall someone to dead than electrify them for 32 turns.
several caveats here:
  • electrify is currently seeing use on prankster ground types so mold breaker/sunsteel strike/moongeist beam are not effective
  • magic bounce does not block electrify and neither do ground types (as someone else tried to mention)
  • most prankster electrify mons use sub to evade status moves
  • electrify can easily be used with leppa berry + recycle (which can be safely executed behind substitute) which allows electrify to be used indefinitely
in conclusion i think electrify, while easy to spot, is nevertheless restricting on the teambuilder as it necessitates either an electric immune ability, a dark type, or strong priority.

:ss/cursola:
Similarly, Encore + Torment + Perish Body has very limited counters (Magic Bounce, Taunt, Aroma Veil), so Perish Body is now banned. I'll be looking at Encore + Torment itself later, since it is still a potent strategy that is normally limited in vanilla 1v1 due to the fragility of the users.
 
Ban or not ban w/e. I'm just happy to be playing Chimera 1v1 again :psyglad:

Broke 1500 so that's cool:
Screenshot_20210611-132322.png

Nvm it's not cool I cheated and used trick :psysad:
 
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