ORAS LC Corphish Balance

[tazz]

I've been playing lc for a while with some tournament success (top 8 in most normal forum tours, reached the finals some lc tours recently, will hopefully be playing in the lc invitational if I remember to come back in january). I haven't been as successful as i could be due to my inconsistency when battling, but I have made some fairly successful teams during this time. I'm going to showcase one of my most successful teams.

Also I'd like some of Corporal Levi's EV spreads
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I believe that, instead of only being concerned with each team member's functionality, it is more important to think how the team functions together. The main goal of this team is to weaken the opposing team by using a combination of knock off, trapping, and hazards. At the same time, the team has the ability to defend and control the course of the battle. Ultimately the goal is for the opposing team to be weakened to the point that it is impossible to stop corphish from tearing apart the opposing team. I built this team a couple months ago, when bulky balance dominated the meta, and when corphish was probably one of, if not the most anti-meta pokemon available. However, it does still have a good matchup spread in the current meta, which, from what I can tell, is much more offensive.
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Corphish @ Eviolite
Ability: Adaptability
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Atk / 76 Def / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet
- Crabhammer

The star of the team. Corphish has never really received as much credit as it deserves, but it is and should be a consideration for every team of every playstyle, because otherwise it will stomp you. This set is fairly standard, taking swords dance over dragon dance for wall breaking power. The ability to 1HKO spritzee after one turn is too much to pass up. The EVs give it 13 speed, enough to outspeed and stop a weakened fletching (without speed creep), as well as almost always stopping porygon from taking it out. When I use this team, I usually decide how I will use corphish at the start of the battle. It functions as either a mid game wall breaker, or a late game sweeper, denting holes in any team. Usually corphish doesn't have to SD when facing most teams, and is only really used when facing semistall, bulky balance, and hyper offense. The former two have an incredibly difficult time stopping it because their walls are useless, and the latter is torn apart with +2 aqua jet.

Gothita @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
Level: 5
EVs: 240 SpA / 28 SpD / 240 Spe
Modest Nature
- Psychic
- Trick
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Corphish's partner in crime. Gothita's function is to put insane amounts of pressure on pokemon that give this team problems, including foongus, ferroseed, fighters, and poison types. Gothita also gives this team much a much needed scarfer, it's lack of power being somewhat amended by my powerful priority in corphish and pawniard. Everything on the set is somewhat obligatory, choosing thunderbolt as coverage to pressure vullaby and archen. Trapping is, in general, insane in LC, and gothita is the perfect trapper for this team.

monkey (Mienfoo) @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 196 Def / 76 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Taunt

The king of LC. I have, and have had for a long time, as nasty habit of slapping mienfoo on basically every team. Luckily, this habit isn't a bad one to have, as mienfoo has the extraordinary ability to be slapped on almost any team and be ridiculously good, and this team is no exception. Mienfoo functions as my pivot, constantly coming throughout the match, crippling through knock off, and not dying thanks to regenerator and drain punch. I chose taunt as my 4th move because this team has no means of removing hazards, and taunt is the best way for me to have some means of preventing hazards form going down.

Pawniard (M) @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 196 Def / 76 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Iron Head

Pawniard is the second part of my knock off core, while also being able to to massive damage with STAB knockoff and iron head, as well as setting stealth rocks. Pawniard shares a lot of synergy with the individual members of this team, becoming even more of a menace to many teams with gothita applying constant pressure to the opposing team's fighting type, the main answer to pawniard normally. It also wears down many threats that aren't steamrolled by corphish, which is very nice for this team.

Ferroseed @ Eviolite
Ability: Iron Barbs
Level: 5
EVs: 84 HP / 36 Atk / 188 Def / 148 SpD / 36 Spe
Careful Nature
- Spikes
- Bullet Seed
- Thunder Wave
- Knock Off

Ferroseed was not my first choice for this team, and I was messing around with different pokemon in this slot when I started to use ferroseed almost by accident, starting to like it a lot. Eventually it became a permanent member of the team, functioning as excellent glue. Ferroseed's job is to cripple, wall, and die. Gothita and hazards slowly wear down the pokemon that naturally threaten ferroseed, allowing ferroseed to freely knock off, paralyze, and lay down spikes. Ferroseed is also a powerful weapon against semi stall and bulky balance teams, as I can spike stack as fast as they can, forcing them to defog or rapid spin, where their hazard remover will be instantly trapped or killed. It can also sponge hits very well vs offense.

dog (Snubbull) @ Berry Juice
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 36 HP / 196 Atk / 116 Def / 116 SpD / 36 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thief
- Play Rough
- Earthquake
- Heal Bell

The final addition to my team, one of my favorite fighting checks for balance and offense. Originally spritzee took up this spot, but it just gave up momentum so ridiculously easily for it to be worth the wishes it would pass. Snubs can still act as a cleric and fighting check, while being able to dent holes and threaten switchins at the same time. And, once again, many of the mons that it can't threaten while switching in are killed by gothita, making it all the more threatening. I chose mad0ka's berry juice thief because it can not only give itself more longevity, potentially multiple times, but also threaten more bulky pokemon through thief. I chose earthquake over fire punch because I don't need to hit ferroseed.

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This team doesn't have many notable weaknesses, but sometimes it can be overwhelmed by offense if you're not careful. However, it does go even or better vs most teams.

Physical croagunk eats this team alive. However this set suffers extreme competition from other fighters, and is very rare.

Unfortunately I don't have any high level replays for you with this team. They do exist, but I lost them.

shoutouts

Brazilian Army and Star. Have shaped my playstyle more than any other users, I never would have built this without them.
anyone on the splc scrub team
Kingler12345 for winning lc open, sorry for dying halfway through :(
all the lc nerds n.n

 

[fran17]

Hey really cool team there :) It has no particular weakness and the members looks to have a nice sinergy between them. Swords Dance Pawniard can help you weaken things for Corphish, or just as a backup wincon if Corphish goes down for any reason. Acrobatics on Mienfoo will help you to sweep with more ease with both Corphish and Pawniard, luring fighting types that can be annoying, like Croagunk and Timburr.
This is all, I hope my suggestions will help you, good luck with your team :)

 

[tcr]

Hey man, strong team you have here! First things first, I can definitely see something like Chinchou just really messing you up, especially chinchou paired with something like Stunky Defog (or even a regular Defog, seeing as Gothita doesn't always OHKO things like Archen, especially if running an eviolite set, where thye can just PP stall you until you can't do anythign). Chinchou really impairs a Corphish sweep, since you fail to kill even half health Chinchou with a +2 Aqua Jet. It can easily stop something like Corphish, and unfortunately you cannot revenge or trap it with Gothita, since you fail to have anything to OHKO it with, allowing it to easily Volt Switch (or Volt Switch anyway since it is likely doing that to your team anyway). Ferroseed can help easily, but however it truly struggles to do anything to it aside from setting up Spikes. I think that swapping some of your sets around might help you out a bit. I don't think that HP Fire is really necessary on Gothita, since the only thing you hit is Ferroseed, which is already taken care of by Mienfoo. Putting Energy Ball on it might help you with trapping and beating Chinchou, since with simple SR and a bit of chip damage you can easily OHKO it (guaranteed OHKO with 2 layers of Spikes). This lets you feel free to put Fire Punch on Snubbull. I don't really think that EQ is the best on Snubbull, since you don't really hit anything bar Magnemite and Ponyta, neither of which should be really switching in on you (with Corphish you don't even really have a problem with Ponyta). Fire Punch allows you to lure in Ferroseed, who otherwise freely sets up Spikes on your own team, and is going to be a much more common switchin due to its bulk than something like Magnemite will be. Fire Punch still allows you to 2hko Pawniard with SR up, and has a very good chance to OHKO Magnemite with SR and Spikes. Chinchou isn't really ever switching in on Snubbull anyway, since it definitely hits hard with Play Rough.

That's really it for this team, kinda standard Corphish Offense that is done well! One thing that you could test out if wanted to was something like Cottonee over Ferroseed, since theoretically it would work extremely well with Corphish since you can easily Encore / Memento into Corphish for easy setups, but I'm sure the lack of a good wall might be something you don't want. Anyway, hope this helped you out a bit, good luck with your team!

 

[tazz]

Hey really cool team there :) It has no particular weakness and the members looks to have a nice sinergy between them. Swords Dance Pawniard can help you weaken things for Corphish, or just as a backup wincon if Corphish goes down for any reason. Acrobatics on Mienfoo will help you to sweep with more ease with both Corphish and Pawniard, luring fighting types that can be annoying, like Croagunk and Timburr.
This is all, I hope my suggestions will help you, good luck with your team :)

I probably should have slashed those with taunt and SR, I used those options for a while but consistently found that I preferred using taunt and having SR and spikes instead of just one. Thanks for the suggestion, i'll reconsider swords dance in the future. However, i'm going to have to disagree with you on using acro, as I already have gothita and it's really important for me to be able to stop hazard setters. I do often switch to acro if I suspect croagunk, however.

Hey man, strong team you have here! First things first, I can definitely see something like Chinchou just really messing you up, especially chinchou paired with something like Stunky Defog (or even a regular Defog, seeing as Gothita doesn't always OHKO things like Archen, especially if running an eviolite set, where thye can just PP stall you until you can't do anythign). Chinchou really impairs a Corphish sweep, since you fail to kill even half health Chinchou with a +2 Aqua Jet. It can easily stop something like Corphish, and unfortunately you cannot revenge or trap it with Gothita, since you fail to have anything to OHKO it with, allowing it to easily Volt Switch (or Volt Switch anyway since it is likely doing that to your team anyway). Ferroseed can help easily, but however it truly struggles to do anything to it aside from setting up Spikes. I think that swapping some of your sets around might help you out a bit. I don't think that HP Fire is really necessary on Gothita, since the only thing you hit is Ferroseed, which is already taken care of by Mienfoo. Putting Energy Ball on it might help you with trapping and beating Chinchou, since with simple SR and a bit of chip damage you can easily OHKO it (guaranteed OHKO with 2 layers of Spikes). This lets you feel free to put Fire Punch on Snubbull. I don't really think that EQ is the best on Snubbull, since you don't really hit anything bar Magnemite and Ponyta, neither of which should be really switching in on you (with Corphish you don't even really have a problem with Ponyta). Fire Punch allows you to lure in Ferroseed, who otherwise freely sets up Spikes on your own team, and is going to be a much more common switchin due to its bulk than something like Magnemite will be. Fire Punch still allows you to 2hko Pawniard with SR up, and has a very good chance to OHKO Magnemite with SR and Spikes. Chinchou isn't really ever switching in on Snubbull anyway, since it definitely hits hard with Play Rough.

That's really it for this team, kinda standard Corphish Offense that is done well! One thing that you could test out if wanted to was something like Cottonee over Ferroseed, since theoretically it would work extremely well with Corphish since you can easily Encore / Memento into Corphish for easy setups, but I'm sure the lack of a good wall might be something you don't want. Anyway, hope this helped you out a bit, good luck with your team!

you're definitely correct in that chinchou is a problem for this team if I don't handle it well. I never thought of energy ball over hp fire, I'll definitely give it a shot as chinchou is much more common than ferroseed. Unfortunately this team does have problems with ponyta and using fire punch would make snubbull a liability. While ponyta won't be a problem late game with corphish being threatening, it can be incredibly dangerous if it gets a free switchin early to mid game. If I reveal fire punch and ponyta comes in for free, it will get a kill or cripple something before dying/switching out. sure I can play mind games with heal bell or corphish switchin, but I'd rather not have my wincon worn down by will o/flare blitz. Basically any team lacking chinchou or diglett is threatened by ponyta, and this team is no exception.

but I use diglett so much that nobody brings ponyta vs me n.n

 

[Star]

Thanks for the shoutout (I'm not completely dead). I like the team overall and there's really not much to change here. Energy Ball is worth a look on goth because you wear down ferro pretty easily with snubs and corphish anyway. I might also take a look at twave on snubbull over something like thief just because corphish with twave support is a savage.

 

[mad0ka]

This may seem like a very unorthodox suggestion, but have you considered using LO Gothita? LO Gothita has the niche of OHKOing Timburr, Mienfoo (who will more often than not be paralyzed because of Ferroseed), Foongus, and can even use sub in front of physical gunk. I don't have a damage calculator in front of me, but I believe that modest LO Goth OHKOs Ferroseed after 1 layer of spiles off the stop of my head too. I wouldn't normally suggest this, but your team honestly doesn't benefit that much from scarf, and the ability to better trap Corphish's checks like Croagunk, Lileep (can't just recover stall gothita now), Foongus (whom good players won't be letting get knocked off when they're facing a Corphish), and Ferroseed seems like it could make the niche set worth using. That's all I have to say, but if you don't think LO Goth would be a good idea, I do like TCR's suggestions. Gr8-9-10 team tho 0/10 would recommend facing it with sun. Also TY for the Snubbull set creds!!! uwu

 

[Corporal Levi]

hi, i like this team very much
If you really do want fast defensive pawn, adjusting the spread to 76 Atk / 196 Def / 36 SpD / 196 Spe nets you an Atk point for free, but it looks like you just copied Mienfoo's EV spread; I imagine you're just looking for a standard spread of 156 Atk / 36 Def / 116 SpD / 236 Spe (correct me if I'm wrong).
Moving 80 EVs from Atk or SpD to Def on Snubbull is enough to live 16 Atk Croagunk's gunk shot after Intimidate. It won't solve the issue single-handedly, of course, but as you mentioned, physgunk isn't a very common threat, so it may be all you need. 23/14 also helps to live U-turn from defensive foo followed by LO EQ from Diglett after SR.

In terms of actual sets, fran's/tcr's/doka's suggestions are all pretty sweet if you're looking to win a specific match-up. With that being said, I feel that your current choice of moves and stuff would perform most consistently overall.

Good stuff