Mafia vs Village ELECTRO Mafia - Aquanauts Win! Postgame P4

Endgame conversation between us and myself:
[18:14] <UncleSam> you there
01[18:14] <penguin344> yes
[18:14] <UncleSam> if we both survive this night
[18:14] <UncleSam> get ready to bumrush this lynch
[18:14] <UncleSam> depending on who dies
01[18:14] <penguin344> alright
01[18:16] <penguin344> who are you thinking right now
[18:17] <UncleSam> im thinking eagle4
[18:17] <UncleSam> depends who dies though
01[18:17] <penguin344> yeah I just want an idea
[18:17] <UncleSam> also someone might be silenced
[18:17] <UncleSam> probably me xD
01[18:17] <penguin344> yeah
01[18:18] <penguin344> it would be dumb to silence someone other than you
[18:18] <UncleSam> pls no moar :(
01[18:18] <penguin344> save for a kill on you, of course
[18:18] <UncleSam> ya
01[18:19] <penguin344> the rolls we have
01[18:19] <penguin344> don't make sense :/
01[18:19] <penguin344> *roles
[18:19] <UncleSam> nothign about this game
[18:19] <UncleSam> makes sense
01[18:19] <penguin344> equally true
01[18:25] <penguin344> who
01[18:25] <penguin344> eagle4 is on thread
[18:26] <UncleSam> we wait
[18:26] <UncleSam> to see if
[18:26] <UncleSam> aopsuser regens

Session Start: Sun Jun 29 18:31:57 2014
Session Ident: UncleSam
01[18:32] <penguin344> so I just had
01[18:32] <penguin344> a brown out
[18:32] <UncleSam> i think we lynch von
01[18:32] <penguin344> can aops not regen
[18:32] <UncleSam> though i will give him an opportunity to godkill himself
[18:32] <UncleSam> idk
[18:32] <UncleSam> we will see
01[18:33] <penguin344> do you want the vote placed now or later
[18:34] <UncleSam> later
[18:34] <UncleSam> actually
[18:34] <UncleSam> now
01[18:34] <penguin344> you sure?
01[18:36] <penguin344> y/n
01[18:36] <penguin344> unclesam
[18:36] <UncleSam> wait
[18:36] <UncleSam> two minutes
01[18:37] <penguin344> ok
[18:37] <UncleSam> for me to see his results
01[18:37] <penguin344> are you silenced?
01[18:37] <penguin344> also, if I leave irc, assume my power went out
01[18:49] <penguin344> i was not silenced
[18:49] <UncleSam> yo are not magma
[18:49] <UncleSam> i take i
01[18:49] <penguin344> nop
01[18:51] <penguin344> von's asking if I'm mafia
01[18:51] <penguin344> do you want me to try to fake him out at all
[18:51] <UncleSam> sure go for it
01[18:58] <penguin344> i did not respond to him btw
01[18:58] <penguin344> claiming either faction wouldn't work
01[18:58] <penguin344> von probably isn't the magma
01[18:59] <penguin344> and I can't claim the magma
[18:59] <UncleSam> why not
01[18:59] <penguin344> hrm
01[19:00] <penguin344> my thought was he would just run to the chan with a log
01[19:01] <penguin344> but if he's aqua and I claim magma he might push harder that I'm moling village
01[19:01] <penguin344> then again aquas and magmas almost have to be in contact
01[19:01] <penguin344> otherwise there would have been more crossifre
01[19:02] <penguin344> huh
[19:12] <UncleSam> k
[19:12] <UncleSam> von is last magma
[19:12] <UncleSam> ditto and eagle4 are aquanauts
01[19:13] <penguin344> can you show me logs
[19:13] <UncleSam> added to logs doc
01[19:15] <penguin344> this is the worst role
01[19:15] <penguin344> that could have moled
[19:15] <UncleSam> janitors to clean his own inspects
[19:15] <UncleSam> ugh
[19:20] <UncleSam> i think we lynch ditto
[19:20] <UncleSam> imo
[19:20] <UncleSam> lets plan this out
[19:20] <UncleSam> only two real options here
[19:20] <UncleSam> no lynch or lynch ditto
[19:20] <UncleSam> if no lynch we maybe convince the aquanauts to kill von
[19:20] <UncleSam> but they can silence us
[19:20] <UncleSam> and take majority
[19:20] <UncleSam> sans a lightning strike by me
01[19:22] <penguin344> did zorbees ever claim role
01[19:22] <penguin344> I forget
[19:23] <UncleSam> ya
[19:23] <UncleSam> he claimed lux the 1/2 hooker
[19:23] <UncleSam> i knew he was villager
[19:23] <UncleSam> however if von is telling the truth
[19:24] <UncleSam> we may have one great trump card
[19:24] <UncleSam> the aquanauts killed aopsuser last night
[19:24] <UncleSam> and ditto is maybe aquanaut
01[19:24] <penguin344> o
[19:26] <UncleSam> ok lets play out scenarios
[19:26] <UncleSam> which roles other than zorbees
[19:26] <UncleSam> could von have doctored
[19:26] <UncleSam> i feel that currently
[19:26] <UncleSam> he is lying about doctoring upside
[19:26] <UncleSam> and wants us to think aquanauts have 2
[19:26] <UncleSam> when they only have one
[19:26] <UncleSam> i think lynching von would still be good
[19:27] <UncleSam> it risks instalose though
[19:27] <UncleSam> hmm
01[19:27] <penguin344> yeah
[19:27] <UncleSam> either way we can try to bumrush lynch
[19:27] <UncleSam> tomorrow
01[19:27] <penguin344> yeah
[19:27] <UncleSam> but silencer will 100% be on
[19:27] <UncleSam> and they can kill me potentially
[19:27] <UncleSam> oh wait
[19:27] <UncleSam> their last is silencer
[19:27] <UncleSam> kill me silence someone
[19:28] <UncleSam> if skarm is aquanaut its insta gg
[19:28] <UncleSam> no counterplay
[19:28] <UncleSam> its highly risky to lynch von
[19:28] <UncleSam> however i legitimately believe that
[19:28] <UncleSam> vons doctor was a one timer
[19:28] <UncleSam> and upside was aquanaut
[19:29] <UncleSam> wait wtf am i saying
[19:29] <UncleSam> if there is one aquanaut left
[19:29] <UncleSam> there are FOUR villagers
[19:29] <UncleSam> not three
[19:30] <UncleSam> lets lynch von
[19:30] <UncleSam> you ready?
01[19:30] <penguin344> wait a sec
01[19:30] <penguin344> lightwolf was the only mafia that flipped
01[19:30] <penguin344> who didn't have two roles
[19:30] <UncleSam> why would von doctor that
[19:30] <UncleSam> also how could he
01[19:31] <penguin344> it's still strange
01[19:32] <penguin344> i feel like something is off
[19:32] <UncleSam> if lightwolf wasnt mafia
[19:32] <UncleSam> then lynching von
[19:32] <UncleSam> is even better
[19:32] <UncleSam> also lightwolf more or less confirmed
[19:32] <UncleSam> von was mafia
[19:32] <UncleSam> err
[19:32] <UncleSam> confriemd he was mafia
[19:32] <UncleSam> in #clandestine
[19:32] <UncleSam> you ready
[19:33] <UncleSam> you going to post
01[19:33] <penguin344> i'm thinking
01[19:33] <penguin344> also you arne't silenced
[19:34] <UncleSam> no im not
01[19:34] <penguin344> oh
01[19:34] <penguin344> wait
01[19:34] <penguin344> aops
01[19:34] <penguin344> just ressed
[19:34] <UncleSam> ya wait one second
01[19:34] <penguin344> i'd edit your lynch
01[19:34] <penguin344> while we figure it out
[19:35] <UncleSam> i mean
[19:35] <UncleSam> lets just see what yeti posts
[19:35] <UncleSam> shold only take a minute
[19:35] <UncleSam> to post if he is regended
01[19:36] <penguin344> von just saw the thread btw
01[19:37] <penguin344> expect angry messgaes
01[19:42] <penguin344> um
01[19:42] <penguin344> not good
[19:42] <UncleSam> ya i felt if it was 4/1/1
[19:42] <UncleSam> you were a likely aquanaut
[19:42] <UncleSam> with von
[19:42] <UncleSam> so i didnt cut you in
01[19:42] <penguin344> oh
[19:42] <UncleSam> however it looks like he wasnt lying
[19:42] <UncleSam> guess ditto and eagle4 are the aquanauts
01[19:42] <penguin344> gotta be
[19:43] <UncleSam> shinyskarmory will ofc protect me
[19:43] <UncleSam> be ready to be online at deadline
[19:43] <UncleSam> to bumrush a lynch if skarm dies
01[19:43] <penguin344> did aops not res then
[19:43] <UncleSam> he did not
[19:43] <UncleSam> apparently eagle4 murdered him
[19:43] <UncleSam> rather than ditto
01[19:43] <penguin344> disappointing
[19:44] <UncleSam> ok who should shinyskarmory target
[19:44] <UncleSam> ok ya
[19:44] <UncleSam> shinyskarmory is 100% legit
[19:44] <UncleSam> otherwise this game woul db eover
01[19:44] <penguin344> yeah
01[19:44] <penguin344> so he targets you
01[19:45] <penguin344> we flip a coin
[19:45] <UncleSam> if he targets me
01[19:47] <penguin344> he can't target anyone else
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:47] <Eagle4> who martyr
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <UncleSam> penguin
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <UncleSam> he an ditto are the aquanauts
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <Eagle4> ta
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <UncleSam> wait no
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <UncleSam> sec
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:48] <UncleSam> fuk me its skarm and ditto
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:49] <UncleSam> this is too confusing qq
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:49] <Eagle4> just make your mind up i need to sleep
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:49] <UncleSam> uh
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:49] <UncleSam> martyr skarm
[19:47] <UncleSam> [19:49] <Eagle4> ok
[19:47] <UncleSam> im so bad lol
[19:47] <UncleSam> forgot skarm couldnt self target
[19:47] <UncleSam> lets just bg me
[19:47] <UncleSam> they will put silencer on someone
[19:47] <UncleSam> if it snot on me
[19:48] <UncleSam> i can stealth it
[19:48] <UncleSam> they will probably kill you
01[19:49] <penguin344> do we know if they know who has what role
[19:49] <UncleSam> they probably do not
[19:49] <UncleSam> they might just kill skarm
[19:49] <UncleSam> in which case i think its gg
[19:49] <UncleSam> unless i stealth the silencer
[19:50] <UncleSam> and tehy are retarded
[19:50] <UncleSam> and dont kill me
01[19:50] <penguin344> killing skarm might not be gg
[19:50] <UncleSam> na hit 100% is
[19:51] <UncleSam> its blocked kill or you die
[19:51] <UncleSam> or bust
01[19:51] <penguin344> they will assume skarm has a bg if anyone
[19:51] <UncleSam> post restrict
[19:51] <UncleSam> eagle4
[19:51] <UncleSam> actually ditto
[19:51] <UncleSam> with as much AIDS as yeti allows
[19:51] <UncleSam> to make it at least difficult to post a vote
[19:51] <UncleSam> before i stealth
01[19:53] <penguin344> what if I don't submit an action
01[19:53] <penguin344> until ditto isn't on
01[19:53] <penguin344> that way actionsline doesn't happen
01[19:53] <penguin344> also I won't be on irc until at least 6 tomorrow
[19:53] <UncleSam> oh
[19:54] <UncleSam> thats a good idea
[19:54] <UncleSam> skarm has to be online
[19:54] <UncleSam> to submit though
01[19:54] <penguin344> oh yeah
01[19:55] <penguin344> what timezone is skarm
[19:55] <UncleSam> no clue
[19:55] <UncleSam> yeti might
[19:56] <UncleSam> just mark his action down though
01[19:56] <penguin344> maybe
[19:57] <UncleSam> i think this is over
[19:57] <UncleSam> barring extreme shenanigans
[19:57] <UncleSam> sorry i let you down
01[19:57] <penguin344> it's fine
01[19:57] <penguin344> it didn't help that I had the scummiest pm ever
01[19:58] <penguin344> in both of yeti's games the village leader thought I was scum
01[19:58] <penguin344> when I had claimed an innate role
01[19:58] <penguin344> not innate
01[19:59] <penguin344> non-useful
01[20:04] <penguin344> i'm thinking ditto will have to write a new shakesperean and an italian sonnet in perfect traditional form

One day, I will have a useful role in a yeti mafia.


tag walls, punch fascists
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
I won't lie, the Magmas probably would have won with better luck, but I think with our roles (lack of info-gathering other than an alliance check while the other scumteam had a role check really made it hard for us to pick solid kill targets) all we could really do was try to mole for a bit and then brute force our way through endgame. GG all, and apologies to my team and to von for my 2 days of inactivity (RIP dead drop).


/me huggles
is a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Dear Ditto,
You are Storm.

The black x-man. Go ZAP ZAP!

If a knowledgeable Electro dies before you, you will pick up their lightning rods and take their place.

You are allied with the Electros. You win when all threats are eliminated.
This game was super fun if only because of how fast-paced Palpatine's role made it. I assume I got lynched because I was supposed to target Paperblade and he ended up dying that night. Still not entirely sure how my role worked, since Paperblade actually ended up dying.


is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
I just want to say that UncleSam's role was one of the coolest I've seen in a mafia game in a long time. DEFINITELY not overpowered while at the same time being new and interesting and useful. It also sped up the game, making it not lag or rely on villager activity in a major way.

I warned US against inviting the inspectors to his sheet, but he did anyway. Look who was right, perfect_village_leader_UncleSam.
Upside: I wasn't actually bg'd, we thought you were maf beforehand so Sam told you a different target from who we bg'd to try to trip maf up

Also kind of agree with aska, I thought it was a little questionable but by the time I was in a position to say/do anything about it it was too late so I didn't bother


Leading this village
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
lol I hated my role in Everybody Votes (well, I hated my lack of a role more like)

However I do agree that my role in this game, Electro Mafia, was definitely unique and helped this mafia not lag at all!
lol I hated my role in Everybody Votes (well, I hated my lack of a role more like)

However I do agree that my vote in this game, Electro Mafia, was definitely unique and helped this mafia not lag at all!
shut up I'm trying to do my schoolwork and I didn't notice the thread title. your role in EVM was the reason we couldn't get rid of you you pest

I beat you in fantasy LCS tho it all ok


Leading this village
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Upside that was 100% my fault there was no reason for me to hammer that lynch immediately; unfortunately, your claim was pretty weak and had errors in it, and I was overconfident at that point in the game

PS: Wow apparently I'm a pest :(


Chwa for no reason!
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
US's role was definitely unique but I don't like roles that are almost 100% clean.

Also US is a dumbo and didn't let me godkill myself in time, which Yeti confirmed would have shown my real pm.

US is also a dumbo for believing there were two inspectors and adding them both to the sheet.

I stopped following this game when I died but US is a nooberton


dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus

I don't want to tl;dr a ton but I do want to post stuff for everyone to see.

First of all, the sheet:

I began this game after AQUANAfia, which was also a small game with very small mafia teams and odd/unusual village roles to let the mafia claim easier and work around their tiny numbers. I think it's an interesting format because the village has to have their essential roles, but they must be gimped or altered in some fashion as well as giving the mafia legitimate roles, even if they're fakes, to claim with.

After assigning request-based roles, I placed Blue_Tornado and ginganinja as the double cops because they are ALWAYS mafia. I wanted to mix things up but give them suspicious clone-roles and see if anyone would lynch them based off the meta-gaming. I RNGed the playerlist and dropped them onto the sheet, however Aura Guardian and Ditto were originally switched. I gave the Mag Magmas AG and the Aquanauts Ditto, though I did regret always-scum Ditto was scum this game as well.

The Electros

Upside: Reverse Safeguard

I don't think this role was very well understood, and Sam lynched it based on its suspiciousness plus the fake PM von provided. What it was supposed to do was ensure any Electro actions on its target would succeed, if the target was also an Electro. So if shinyskarmory was hooked, but targeted Sam, along with Upside, shinyskarmory would complete it anyway. Unfortunately while ss often targeted Sam along with Upside, ss was never hit by a hook to prove the reverse SG, nor did he ever roll SG himself. I think this role has the potential to be VERY strong because you can clump every good village action onto someone and have the reverse SG ensure they all succeed no matter what, but it only impacts those who target one user.
Upside was unfortunately too slow getting on IRC to protest his lynch, as Sam ended a couple lynches just plain too early. However he always sent his action in and he didn't cause any trouble for the village leader system, since only von was a mole. He was just unlucky von chose him to frame, and rightfully so because his role never had a discernible effect and I think was not properly understood.

penguin344: Post Restrictor
This role was originally a Question Asker and I had a couple different restrictions on what it could and couldn't ask, it wasn't the strongest QA (no usernames/rolenames I don't think), but I decided 2 village cops and an inspector AND a QA was too much info if the village leader(s) figured out how to utilize them. As such it was a last-second change (the role PM in my role PM doc is still QA) to PR, a glorified vanilla. But it did open the possibility of godkills! Never utilized, but still present. And it adds a little humor to the game.
penguin was never trusted because of his flavor which people couldn't tell if it was legitimate Magma flavor OR too trolly to be non-Electro. If anyone googled shiny Helioptile, or was in #tf2 when I hatched mine and bragged about it for eons, they'd know it was just a funny Electro flavor. However Sam did realize he was Electro by the end of things and he survived to the end while being active enough, though often one of the last Electro actions sent in.

UllarWarlord: Reverser (non-kill)
I don't think this role ever got used? Or did anything? Before it died. It was supposed to turn mafia night roles, except their kills which were too vital for them to lose, back on them. So Walrein could alliance check himself, Ditto could silence himself, LW would watch himself, and so on. It could also have been used to make shinyskarmory bodyguard himself, which he otherwise would not have been able to do.
Ullar was on and stuff but he died early, I really don't remember much of note. The role didn't play out to what I had thought it might due to its early demise. Again, it was supposed to be a provable but slightly odd village role that gave them some power without being a true nightly-hooker or rev-mar.

AOPSUser: Rogue --> Mayor
Unlike most of my rogues, this rogue could only resurrect if he targeted THE user that killed him, not a user on the faction that did. I think this makes sense because the game is so small - he should be rewarded for good play and the village leader should be rewarded for smart rogue aiming. The role gained 3 votes after a successful resurrection, which was hidden upon its death. This was the only vote role the village had, and it was situational. But it was also more than a standard mayor.
AOPSUser surprised me - he was on IRC every day and never missed his action. I believe this is his first game? Usually newbies are not so active, but I hope he keeps playing because he was active this game! He also didn't burn any bridges, so I am sure the community would love to see him more. I feel like he was never super trusted due to being a rogue, the truest of true unprovable roles until it dies. And unfortunately Sam picked Ditto over Eagle4 for him to rogue the night he died, so he did not get the resurrect. All in all, standard rogue play anyone expects and good activity for a new player.

UncleSam: Day Shortener
I played around with putting this role on a mafia, making it limited use, making it more situational, etc. I think I did intend to have it be a Very Suspicious Role, maybe even on a miller who turned up scum on inspect, or not daily, but somewhere along the line I forgot how I would change it and left it as such. This is probably the most innovative/distinct role of the game because we don't often see roles that so regularly can impact a deadline. However, it gave days a very fast pace and kept things moving - when the village leader was decisive, the role would be swiftly deployed. I intended for it to be given to a suspicious user/newbie perhaps, but I realized it would be perfect for a village leader to have, so I gave it to Sam after his blue balls over not being able to lead a village were giving him True Agony. Don't say I never do anything nice (or naughty) for you ^.~
UncleSam proved to use the role both to his team's advantage, and its disadvantage. I think that was ultimately the most interesting way for the role to play out and gave it a double-edged-sword dynamic. Twice he used the role too soon - once when zorbees could have godkilled himself to let them lynch another target, as the janitor role did not cover godkills and he'd be proven-town, and another when he ended it before Upside got on to protest his lynch/state his case. Both of these turned out to be janitor lynches as opposed to actual-scum lynches. He also took a risky gambit lynching LightWolf D1 to prove his role and hope LW was scum, based on BAD FLAVOR LOGIC BADBADBAD nobody follow this example it makes village leaders LOSE my games, like Walrein did before lynching his own rogue. While Sam's D1 lynch was good, he did mislynch twice due to von's fakes. He was very efficient at ordering the town around and trying to find scum/use aska's role. I think this role has potential to be in other village vs mafia games in some incarnation - variants of it with more restrictions, etc.

Blue_Tornado: Naive Cop
I changed the specific interactions of the two cops over the course of the game. They were supposed to be conflicting roles that would maybe lead to one being lynched, but they were also quasi-twins. A village leader could think either way. Originally, if they targeted the same user, they would both get a Sane result for that night. Then I changed aska's role, and they could get temporary sanity from it. Additionally, when one died, the 'twin' would become Sane. BT was Naive - he got everyone as Good! regardless of their true alliance. There was also a little confusion on whether the cops should get the ACTUAL alliance or just the Good/Bad result, but that was necessary for the Paranoid cop.
BT died early as well but his N0 result of Good on ginga when ginga got Bad on Sam was hilarious. He must have been so confused. He sent in his actions before dying, so there is not much to say due to him not being alive super long. And I think ginga was more trusted/polarizing than him.

ginganinja: Paranoid Cop
The always-Bad! result cop twin, this one could lead to a lot more chaos than the Naive cop, due to getting a N0 result like he did on Sam. I feel like I made it TOO obvious in the rules/thread that there were questionable sanities and I sort of wish I had let things play out with a bit more confusion on whether their results were genuinely trustworthy, especially if they targeted the same aliases. Due to outliving the Naive Cop, this one became Sane after BT died. However I forgot to mention that with the results from BT dying because ginga had been hit by aska, and then I did the next night, but I edited it in like a minute after I posted 'vonFiedler is: Bad!' and ginga did not see that, nor did he see it the next night. That was my mistake to not simply make a second post in the conversation, however, let's be real, how many people check their result THAT quickly? Still it was unfortunate.
ginga was pretty active and this is probably his only Standard he's actually been trusted in. Unfortunately he missed my edit of his role and I think I should have been a bit more clear he should recheck his results to see his sanity. That wasn't really anyone's fault in particular just unfortunate timing. I was pretty pleased with ginga's contributions until his death this game.

Paperblade: Inspector
The only starting-Sane info role on the village, the Inspector got a full role PM, but only every other night to make up for having two cops, one of which could be turned Sane. He gained the ability to inspect every night after both cops died, but Paperblade died between them, so this was never activated. The frequency was how it was nerfed to make the game a bit easier for the mafia and limit the possible info influx, but I think it was still a useful role.
Paperblade was wary of adding von to the sheet when Sam did and I think was always suspicious there was a mole on it. Unfortunately I forgot the village channel since I was invited to it on not-my-laptop at first, so I am not sure how involved he was in planning Sam's actions, but I know he was in THE CIRCLE of village leadership and did some things. Good activity overall, just a shame he could never convince Sam von was badman. Paperblade had requested a leader role with the stipulation he might have time problems, so I gave him inspector - a village classic to lead - but put Sam as the primary 'I prove myself and lead role' and fortunately Paperblade got into the village circle, so I hope the role was to his liking. I felt he should have been the one targeted by shinyskarmory, not Sam.

zorbees: Hooker
The second of the village's 'completely standard except every-other-night' power roles. zorbees was nothing more than a standard hooker, but due to the existence of the Reverser, which could be used as a hooker, I made him every other night. I think the hooker could have gone to nightly after certain village roles died, but I never went through with that.
zorbees, zorbees, zorbees. Everything about his actions and words reeked village - but Sam had a role PM posing him as Mad Magma. Unfortunately zorbees drew the attention of von N0 as his first janitor/fake inspect target, and Sam only realized he could have zorbees godkill himself to prove he's village on that day about 15 seconds after he called deadline. But I think due to the nature of Sam's role I could not allow him to recant the day end, if he messed up he had to be stuck with it due to using the role too hastily to balance it. I felt bad for zorbees because he did act very town but was the target of the Mad Magma Bus. However he did make a VERY questionable borderline-deadtalk post about Walrein being Aquanaut after he died. Walrein and von were both concerned by the post and I don't think Sam knew how to take it and I had to no-comment it. It would have been fine if more people were joking about the Walrein-is-Aquanaut gimmick this game but zorbees wasn't in numerous company with the old meme.

shinyskarmory: Switchguard
The return of a role I introduced in AQUA, with a twist. This switchguard could not control whether it BGed or SGed the target, and I would randomize which it did every night. It rolled 2 for BG the first 3 nights, leaving Sam to be silenced repeatedly, then rolled 1 twice - which was unfortunate because if the Aquanauts had not hooked or killed him the BG would have won the Electros the game. I think I would return to having a strategic switchguard, IE the village leader can decide if he wants BG or SG on odd nights, instead of the random guard, especially with only having one.
shinyskarmory was slow sending in actions sometimes but he got them in. I don't think he was ever allowed into the village leader circle despite being the only claim of a bodyguard OR safeguard-proper for the village. Which was interesting because no mafia tried to CC and he didn't have a twin (anymore). I think switchguard is an interesting role but it should involve strategic picking of when BG/SG go without being able to change it, instead of hoping you roll the necessary action. That said I do think Sam misused the role keeping it on himself all game - he was never targeted for a kill, only the silence the role didn't stop until like D5. It would have been better utilized on a higher-priority village target.

askaninjask: Sanity Doctor
This was originally the Switchguard's twin - instead of a Duoguard like I had last game, this role would also be a switchguard, however it would be SG or BG, so they would trigger on alternate nights. For some reason I decided that was too much/too strong and changed the role entirely, also altering the twin cops' sanity requirement. The Sanity Doctor became a role that at first glance looks like a fake/hard to prove/suspicious, but once used on one of the 3 village roles it impacted would give a very definite result. He made either cop Sane for the night, and if used on the switchguard, shinyskarmory could have picked BG or SG the next night. Unfortunately I don't believe anyone ever realized/thought Sanity Doctor also worked on SwiGuard, just the cops who were a more 'typical' view of sanity in mafia.
askaninjask was more active this game than von's (smh) I think, but he also died earlier than I hoped for the role. It never got used on BT or shinyskarmory, but due to being Paperblade's N0 inspect aska was let into Sam's circle. This was a good decision but letting in two inspectors was probably not. To his credit I think aska was always suspicious of the double inspectors.

Slim Guldo: Vigilante
I changed the kill requirements on this role a bunch of times and I think I actually sent the role PM with the wrong number I decided on after I wrote the role a while ago. It was very hard for me to determine if the role would destroy the mafia too hard, be needed if the village spiraled very quickly, or perhaps be a misfire. Ultimately he would get 3 shots maximum, the third being if he was the FINAL Electro. My other big option was 1/5, giving him 2 shots total, but more slowly. von realized this role could undermine his janitor role due to Slim receiving a shot with only 3 Electros visibly dead, however 2 Electros were dying the night it would have hit 4, so there would have been 4 visible/5 total.
Slim was active early on but he died very quickly. I was sort of sad he died the night he would have been activated because I was very curious as to who Sam would shoot. Vig can be a bad thing for the village if the leader misfires. Unfortunately poor Slim never got a chance to REALLY LIVE.

General thoughts about the Electros:
They win the game 100% of the time IF they do not mislynch. The mafia cannot possibly outkill them even hitting 2 Electros a night if the village lynches a mafia member each day if my math was right, of course when the second kill vanishes is a factor. Thus they had to have weaker/off-power roles and Suspicious Things about their own roles, such as those with seemingly no way to prove them or no impact.
Thanks to some excellent, risky gambit play from vonFiedler, the Electros mislynched twice: once with zorbees, which could have been saved by a godkill-->relynch, but still took them down a man, and once with Upside, where Sam ended the day before he got on, though he did try to react very quickly upon seeing he was a target. This allowed the mafias to eventually get the numbers close enough one could win, despite von killing Walrein, something I was very wary about harming his chances.
I would not say the Electros played poorly - they were all active. The only time I updated without an action was when aska was dying so I just called it a moot point as death outprioritized the action anyway and at the end when someone was being hooked/killed. This was definitely a more lively village! Unfortunately they were being moled, not by their leader but by one of two inspectors he added to the sheet. You can 'blame' me for telling von to make it 1/2 nights instead of every, but I said in the rules I would help with fakes to make them as seamless as possible, including giving proper village flavor for a BG/hook/inspect/etc.
UncleSam was trusted by all once the ginga situation was settled due to his role, but he used it too quickly to the town's detriments. He was also too trusting of a double inspector AND a double cop. I can only imagine it would have been infinitely better for the town if QA was in as well to make him wonder why they had 5 info roles.
Sam did not trust that von's role was two time and thought Upside was legitimately Aquanaut, leading to him lynching von over Ditto or Eagle4 believing it was 4-1-1, not 3-2-1. When it was 3-2, they still had a chance, IF the mafia botched their silence/hook/kill targets and shinyskarmory RNGESUSed. The kill could have been blocked, OR Sam could have stealth-lynched the second deadline came up and lynched one of them when it was 2-2 if he wasn't silenced. I was uncertain why Sam WASN'T the one silenced because he was the one in charge of the Day role. That being said I think I updated a little too early for Sam/penguin to strike, though penguin was silenced. However, I do not believe Sam would have been able to post his lynch AND PM me before at least one of the two Aquanauts got their lynch post in, and the village only had 1 vote due to who they silenced. The Aquanauts were both waiting to post their lynch and I had all relevant actions due to hooks/death. If Sam had ended it when only one Aquanaut got the post, the tie ended the game anyway due to the mafia killing a villager then 2v1 lynching the silenced last one. It was 'up in the air' a bit but if anyone believes Sam could post then switch to IRC and PM me before TWO people who were both aware they needed to post asap (and remember, only one needed to post before I got the 'end day pls' PM on IRC) they are welcome to debate that. I think the village's loss came earlier from the mislynches/hasty day ends and Sam being moled by von for so long.
Ideally, they never would have been in this position if not for misplays, but I think they still were a good, active village. Just fooled SO HARD.

The Aquanauts

Eagle4: Martyr Faker/Hooker

I had some Problems properly giving results for the martyr faker. I botched N0 and thought he was a reverse martyr which for some reason I had thought fairly often while planning the game and gave the Mad Magmas more results than they should have had. I also sort of confused myself on how to give results to people he actually faked when they were supposed to go missing but that was suspicious? Additionally I must apologize to Eagle for apparently never actually using the zapzap flavor when giving the results for his role. I don't know how I forgot but his flavor was just like, not aqua OR electric, just sort of HELLO MARTYRED. I should have had a more solid idea how to execute the role - I think it should have been an actual martyr but it gets weird results if it hits an info role to let him hide. That being said it was a good fake role because of Zap Plate vs Splash Plate letting him have actual zapzap results... if I ever used them.
Eagle4 hasn't played a mafia for a while but he joined this game. He was RNGed to the Aquanauts and I figured I would give it a shot - I had plenty of people on the sub list. After Walrein died/went mia Eagle4 took over doing actions. He attempted to follow what Sam told him for the martyr while being wary of what he'd get revealed. I think he did good sending in the actions because they benefited his team. He tried to get Ditto's attention to help him plan but it didn't seem like Ditto was on/active to help, but he was able to hook up with Walrein. Overall I was pleased with his performance, and he talked to me a bunch about his thoughts on the game/if moled how moled, etc. He was super confused by Upside dying though!

Walrein: Cop/Announcer
Though Walrein was not thrilled by only a cop as their info role I don't believe, this was equivalent to the Watcher of the other team. Neither mafia had strong info roles - they would be rewarded for moling or deception. The Aquanauts had two very good roles for moling - the Zap Plate martyr and the non-aquatic Announcer flavor (though Announcer is a suspicious role in and of itself). This was just a 'hope you can mole with announcer, ps get some info' role for this mafia team.
Walrein was the brains of the Aquanauts and put in a lot of effort/thought in earlygame. He got Eagle and Ditto to make their fakes as well. He was in charge of their actions until he died, upon which, though Confused by the Upside lynch and other things, he kept from any spoilers so he could strategize. Though he vanished for a cycle or two and left Eagle4/Ditto to their own devices, Eagle4 reconnected with him and they decided to sub Walrein back in for Ditto, who they could not reach, to let them both be on at the impending deadline to out-lynch Sam. I would have put in jumpluff for Ditto as she was my first sub but she wasn't on IRC at the time, and the team was willing to forfeit any lingering thought of whether Ditto was good or not, since all they needed was a warm body with an F5 key to vote. I think Walrein played the best of his faction, but he was run around by the Mad Magmas a lot and killed by von as part of his plan.

Ditto: Silencer
This was the single-role of the Aquanaut faction: a silencer. A pretty good mafia role especially as the numbers drop if it stays alive. Not much to say about it as a role, it was just a silencer, which meant they had to think up an alternative fake. They went with info role backup.
Ditto is always a crapshoot. Some games he is active, some games you put him as mafia because he's been around the block and he does nothing. Some games he gets a good fake, some games he doesn't. I moved him to this team but I was wary about him+Eagle4 and then Walrein as the brains. Turned out well in true, classic MAGMAfia idling-to-victory. This is indeed the second game in the series his team has won and he has not done a lot, though to his credit he did fakeclaim to Sam and then come back with the faked 'you got a role now!' flavor to keep up his act so I give him some props.

General thoughts about the Aquanauts:
To von's chagrin and Sam's lament as well, the Aquanauts were the Idlenauts. That wasn't entirely true, they always got their actions in. They were, however, repeatedly the stragglers to send once Walrein went down. Their luck was that they had less suspicious fakeclaims on N0/D1 for Sam to instalynch based off than Sam thought LightWolf's was, and then von kept killing people he thought were Aquanaut, but were unfortunately just suspicious village claims. He did get Walrein, though! And that was their only loss - to crossfire.
At the end, Walrein-for-Ditto and Eagle4 were both prepared to vote as quickly as they could after update, leading to their win. I think they put in more effort than the other teams give them credit for and certainly tried to maintain their fakes as long as possible, but it is true they were handed a beneficial position by the Mad Magmas and Sam's mislynches. It speaks to their credit they were able to hide as suspicious village fellows to cause von to kill villagers instead of them for as long as they did, and even at the end Sam was not certain if Upside truly was Aquanaut, if there were two, and who the two were.
I have seen less-deserving and worse winners in games, including Ditto's first win as wolf with Quagsires in one of the WORST kingmaker final-day lynches I've ever seen. That being said I do enjoy when my games come down to last-day 3-people lynch scenario type things and you're not quite sure if the mafia with the power to let themselves win by targeting correctly will pull it off or if the village will crap out a new heart for themselves. I also stopped putting wolves/neuts in games.

The Mad Magmas

Aura Guardian: Prio Lower/Inspect Block

Prio lower was a sort-of-hooker, it would work for certain things to make them irrelevant, like a bodyguard or another hook. Inspect Block could be used to frame other people as Mad Magmas (as it was used on Ditto) or to protect their own team if need be. I think this was a passable mafia role for a game like this but the Mad Magmas did struggle to find a proper fakeclaim for it and then prove it. The time they did try to prove it was with Eagle4's fake martyr so it just looked weird.
Aura Guardian was swapped for Ditto and von was very pleased with his team. AG got his fake after some debate on what to make it and communicated with the Aquanauts before von decided to go after them to try and sneak his own win out. There were a couple times where AG's actions/statements were like ? but until his death I think he was a helpful member of his team, or at least, his heart was trying.

vonFiedler: Janitor/Bodyguard
Ah, the most polarizing role of the game. zorbees said I misused the term janitor, but whatever, we'll call it that. This role would swap two Role PMs upon lynch-only (not nightkill or godkill) for fakes von or his team had written. von seized this role to fakeclaim inspector and pose his inspects as mafias. This was much more proactive than I had intended the role to be - I figured it would be a passive role wherein they fake a mafia as being a village BG, then the leader might be lynched, or the other BG claim lynched, etc. and they doctor that PM as well. How it played out was very aggressive. Bodyguard was standard and was open for self-use once AG/LW were dead. The counterplay to the janitor role was, of course, UncleSam's role. He could go after a target before von could get a fake ready/send in his request/know who Sam was going on, as von had to pick a user to fake, not just the day. von forced his way into the village circle to ensure he could get two uses of the role off as a 1/2 night inspector.
vonFiedler was a very aggressive, risk-taking player. I was nervous his gambit would result in his prompt lynching and subsequent Rough Times for the mafia, however Sam instantly seemed to trust any inspector with results. von was annoyed he couldn't get his zorbees role off D1 because that left another night for any more info roles floating to throw a wrench into things, but he got it off D2 - barely, because zorbees would have godkilled himself if he had another 15 seconds. von then got the Upside mislynch off, which Sam was less suspicious about, though the notion of a janitor role I think was in his mind for zorbees. Or DEATH MILLER. I was also wary about how quickly von turned aggressive on the Aquanauts because they needed their kills, and I saw a lot of speculation about von from other villagers, so he was not as safe as he believed. It ALMOST worked out for him, trying to fly solo as a well-moled 'wolf,' but Sam wound up not believing his role was 2x and lynched him over one of the Aquanauts, thinking there would only be one mafia left. A mistake. I was sad his gambit wound up not working out for his win because I think he did a lot more with the role than I expected from a more complacent player but he also really brought it alive. There were cries of "bs hax" about his role duping the two mislynches but can anyone really be salty/upset about it? I think the role was utilized beautifully to create chaos and let von mole and it added a new dynamic to the game that made Sam have to second-guess what he was doing/thinking when he began to be suspicious. Wake up village sheeple!!

LightWolf: Watcher
Single mafia action. Watcher. Gave them info/targets. Also was good for a fakeclaim due to there being no village watcher or tracker and there being no flavor a target would get. Watcher is always a good mafia role to get them a lot of info and a mole.
LightWolf was unfortunately quicklynched D1 due to the role name I gave him to claim. I thought it was a great fake myself and I was Salty Sam did the same thing Walrein has done, except this time it actually WAS a mafian. A shame he never got to do more.

General thoughts about the Mad Magmas:
If a team 'deserved' to win, or a player, it was these guys/von. von had a very risky and aggressive gambit that I was delighted to see play out so well for a while, but of course, cracks in his armor began to show. If ginga's Sanity mishap had not happened, Sam would have lynched him long before he did and the second kill would have been gone, so I believe the Aquanauts would have lost as well unless Sam was REALLY confused on who the final villagers were. They tried to be thorough with fakes and such and get logs set up. I was impressed with the effort they put in to try and secure the win, especially von. I think he was a bit reckless with how much he wanted to hinder the Aquanauts, and he also did not really value AG due to thinking he was a bit safer than I feel he actually was. However, he had fun playing out his role and I think it was the best-utilized one of the game. Mad Magmas played hardball and went ham on the game. It wound up not paying off due to LW being the D1 target over one of the Aquanauts, and AG being revealed before Eagle4/Ditto, but it was fun to watch.

MVP: vonFiedler. His actions to mole the village and his very tricky play of his janitor role led to the village being crippled, even though he kept trying to kill Aquanauts and hitting shady village roles instead. A couple luck related things didn't go his way, but I don't think anyone can deny he had the single-largest role in the outcome of the game due to swinging it for the mafias by the two mislynches, moling so well, and using the janitor role very actively.

Hope everyone enjoyed the game! Even if you think 2x janitor was bs hax it was a very compelling use of the role. If anyone has any additional questions let me know and keep discussing. There are a couple interesting/new roles in this game for people to look at reusing or modifying for other games.

I don't know what I'll host next, I know there's other people who want to host so I will sit back for a while, settle into grad school, and then host something again maybe once I am in my swing of things.

Thanks for playing and nobody really idling! I think this wins most active game of the past 4 years.

I'm pretty sure we at least discussed the possibility that aska worked on SS. Either that or I thought it and never brought it up, which is also a very real possibility.

I remember US was totally convinced after zorbees's deadpost that zorbees was somehow village, based both on his play before dying and that there was no way he made that post as scum (since AG had just told us Walrein was an aquanaut).


Leading this village
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Ya I knew almost instantly that zorbees was villager the moment he offered to godkill himself; I tried to take it back immediately but, sadly (and fairly) Yeti did not. This game would have been easily won if I had realized the godkill potential of the Post Restrictor OR if Ginga had noticed the results change at any point, but these things happen. I made mistakes of my own and honestly if von had taken thirty less seconds to cp his role PM to me during the penultimate day I would have been ok with his role being two-timer; I figured, however, with the delay in his cping it, that he must have changed it from once to twice (and corresponding grammar) and that he was using the Upside lie (who I legitimately believed was Aquanaut) to cover the fact that lynching him would be an auto-win. Of course he was not lying, but it made perfect sense for him to be lying in that situation and circumstances were such with the slight delay that they tipped me just enough in the direction of believing he was lying and bussing Ditto (I was 100% certain he was telling the truth about Eagle4, Ditto would be the obvious second Aquanaut if he was telling the truth but I felt he was not). That being said letting von onto the sheet at all lost us this game, and I will say that the kills were so good that I should have pieced together that von was 100% mafia much earlier (as early as Day 3 I took von off the sheet's edit list and made him view only, but didn't have the balls to actually lynch him or do anything more than say 'I think you are a strong mafia suspect, stay tuned'). I was overly decisive in every case except for von's, and a number of unfortunate timing issues compounded upon that to cause our loss.


I Like Chopin
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
OMG what delay dude? I sent it to you immediately. You know this in hindsight now, don't blame your incredible paranoia on me. Like I lied to you all game and I still thought half the things you said were unreasonably paranoid (like the LW lynch).


dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
I apologize for the deadtalk, I thought it'd be obvious as a joke
I mean, I knew it was a joke, but several players were a bit concerned it might be taken too seriously. I think if more people had gone on the usual Walrein-is-Aquanaut train like in the original MAGMAfia it wouldn't have stood out so much.

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