Espeon (Bulky Calm Mind) [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Delko

Delko

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Espeon

[SET]
name: Bulky Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Morning Sun
move 3: Psyshock / Psychic
move 4: Baton Pass / Hidden Power Fire
item: Leftovers
ability: Magic Bounce
nature: Timid
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Rather than being part of a dedicated Baton Pass team or acting as a stand alone sweeper, this Espeon variant aims to provide teammates a boost while also utilizing Magic Bounce to the fullest. This set works best on a sun team, as sun allows Morning Sun to recover more health, and powers up Hidden Power Fire. Espeon, in return, can prevent entry hazards from being set up thanks to its ability. Magic Bounce also prevents Espeon from being crippled by status, Encored, or phazed away by Whirlwind or Roar. Getting up a Calm Mind shouldn't be too hard, and after a couple of boosts, Espeon can pass them to a teammate or try to sweep. Psychic and Fire has decent coverage and with Espeon's pretty good Speed stat, it's definitely a force to be reckoned with.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The EVs are pretty straightforward: maximum HP EVs let Espeon take hits better and to set up on Pokemon with Seismic Toss or Night Shade more easily, while maximum Speed EVs allows the base 110 Speed Espeon outpace a surprising amount of Pokemon. The choice between Psychic and Psyshock depends on your preference; the former can hit the likes of Bulk Up Conkeldurr harder, while Psyshock makes it easier to win Calm Mind wars and to beat special walls, especially Chansey and Blissey. Hidden Power Fighting is an option to hit Tyranitar and other Dark-types, who are immune to Espeon's STAB move. A Life Orb can be used for more power, but Espeon would rather have the minor recovery every turn, which helps it in setting up.</p>

<p>Ninetales is almost a necessity for this set to be effective, as sun provides Hidden Power Fire with a pseudo-STAB and ensures that Morning Sun recovers 2/3 of Espeon's HP. When using Baton Pass, Volcarona makes an excellent recipient, as it can come on the Steel-types that bother Espeon lacking Hidden Power Fire; it can also use the boosts to take on Hydreigon and Tyranitar. Venusaur is a good teammate as well, as it appreciates a boost, and can take advantage of a weakened Jirachi, Latios, or Latias. Dugtrio can trap the likes of Jirachi and Tyranitar, making it easier for Espeon to sweep, but note that thanks to Baton Pass, Tyranitar cannot Pursuit trap Espeon.</p>
 
You can still be phazed with Dragon Tail and Circle Throw. (lol who uses CT)

But seriously, if you're talking about stallbreaking, you have to mention Dragon Tail Dragonite, who doesn't give a shit about Psyshock even IF Multiscale is broken.
 
Hmm, interesting set, Delko. I'd add Hydreigon as a counter to this set, as it is immune to Psyshock and take pittance from Sun-boosted HP Fire.
 
usually espeon beats hydreigon. assuming it switches on you as you use cm and in the next turn you use cm again, modest, life orb hydreigon with dark pulse deals 67% maximum to espeon. so assuming it switches in with sr in play hydreigon needs 6-7 turns to die from lo damage. hp fire in sun from a +2 espeon deals 26.38 - 30.98% to hydreigon so most of the times, after sr hydreigon will die after hitting espeon 6 times followed up by an hp fire. sets without dark pulse are just setup fodder. so it is not like hydreigon has an easy time with espeon. (sry for not using caps my caps key is broken)
 
alexwolf said:
usually espeon beats hydreigon. assuming it switches on you as you use cm and in the next turn you use cm again, modest, life orb hydreigon with dark pulse deals 67% maximum to espeon. so assuming it switches in with sr in play hydreigon needs 6-7 turns to die from lo damage. hp fire in sun from a +2 espeon deals 26.38 - 30.98% to hydreigon so most of the times, after sr hydreigon will die after hitting espeon 6 times followed up by an hp fire. sets without dark pulse are just setup fodder. so it is not like hydreigon has an easy time with espeon. (sry for not using caps my caps key is broken)
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Well, considering that most Hydriegon i've seen do not use Life Orb, but Expert Belt, Hydreigon will not be worn down by Life Orb recoil. Espeon also has to spam Morning Sun as a Modest Expert Belt Dark Pulse deals 52.4% - 62.3% after two Calm Minds, and 41.6% - 50.3% after three. Sure, low rolls will allow Espeon to survive, but it will need a large string of low damage rolls just to get a 4th Calm Mind in or to hit Hydreigon with Hidden Power Fire, which deals 39.9% - 47% with three Calm Minds. Thing is, Morning Sun has 8PP, while Dark Pulse has triple that, and a crit will just destroy any hopes of stalling at all. Choice Specs will just muscle through Espeon, as a Choice Specs Modest Dark Pulse does 65.3% - 77.8% after two Calm Minds, and 52.7% - 62.9% after three, a guaranteed 2HKO no matter what, and Espeon can't stall out Dark Pulse due to Morning Sun's pitiful PP. Timid Choice Scarf and Expert Belt have less of a chance, but they can still come out on top with a little luck.
 
Berserker Lord said:
Well, considering that most Hydriegon i've seen do not use Life Orb, but Expert Belt, Hydreigon will not be worn down by Life Orb recoil. Espeon also has to spam Morning Sun as a Modest Expert Belt Dark Pulse deals 52.4% - 62.3% after two Calm Minds, and 41.6% - 50.3% after three. Sure, low rolls will allow Espeon to survive, but it will need a large string of low damage rolls just to get a 4th Calm Mind in or to hit Hydreigon with Hidden Power Fire, which deals 39.9% - 47% with three Calm Minds. Thing is, Morning Sun has 8PP, while Dark Pulse has triple that, and a crit will just destroy any hopes of stalling at all. Choice Specs will just muscle through Espeon, as a Choice Specs Modest Dark Pulse does 65.3% - 77.8% after two Calm Minds, and 52.7% - 62.9% after three, a guaranteed 2HKO no matter what, and Espeon can't stall out Dark Pulse due to Morning Sun's pitiful PP. Timid Choice Scarf and Expert Belt have less of a chance, but they can still come out on top with a little luck.
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True. That's why you have to see what Hydreigon u are facing first.
If it is Specs, LO or Expert Belt without Dark Pulse then gladly set up with Espy. If it is LO with Dark Pulse you still can outstall it baring a crit. But if it is Expert Belt with Dark Pulse or Specs with Dark Pulse then gtfo...
 
Opposing CM Latios could be a problem for this set as well. If the CM Latios doesn't carry HP Fire, then it can outspeed Espeon by 1 point and proceed to Psyshock. Especially in the rain since it would be able to switch on HP Fire. I think BP deserves a slash with Morning Sun. If Tyranitar can switch in so easily and take away the sun that this set relies on, this could be a potential liability to your own Sun team. Seeing as how this is being used on Sun teams, giving a free switch in to your opponents weather stater can give your opponent the advantage. Since sun is usually offensive, there shouldn't be a shortage of pokes to be able to baton pass to.

If you really want to dig down into counters, Houndoom is at the top but he's never used.
 
Ever think about adding Baton Pass? If I remember correctly, Baton Pass evades pursuit from Tyranitar and passing calm minds to Volcarona is pretty good.
 
I think Hidden Power [Fighting] is an option, it can do some dammages to Tyranitar and you are not force to use Baton Pass on it but you can't beat Scizor then.

Edit : Nevermind, didn't see it was in the option. By the way, I think it could be slashed.
 
Hey Delko

Can you provide non-cherry-picked logs of this working in a standard battle? By the looks of it, it's beginning to look like the standard CM sets on-site.
 
It kinda is, but it's bulkier and thanks to Morning Sun it can set up easier. Downside is that it needs Sun support.
 
I have used this set a fair bit, and played Delko abusing this set and its actually very good. As Delko pointed out, its useful really only in sun, however it does work very well in preventing hazards from putting the hurt on a Sun team. Morning Sun helps you switch into Ferrothorn a little better as you can heal off Power Whip damage and I found Baton Pass really cool in conjunction with Calm Mind, letting me pass boosts to a receiver like Venusaur or Volcarona late in the game whenever I got a free turn.

The set is very versatile and I believe it plays very differently to the "Offensive Calm Mind" set. Personally, I consider the current Calm Mind set in the analysis more of a sweeper, and consider this an excellent 'supporter' (for want of a better word), acting as a way to prevent Stealth Rock first, and then a sweeper second.
 
Won't Stored Power be good on this Espeon, seeing that after 2 CMs it will easily outpower Psychic and offering great power for CM wars, and I don't see any compatibility issues either.
 
AnyaAlstreim said:
Won't Stored Power be good on this Espeon, seeing that after 2 CMs it will easily outpower Psychic and offering great power for CM wars, and I don't see any compatibility issues either.
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Well, it would leave Espeon harmless without prior CMs, making him unable to revenge Terrakion, Conkeldurr, .. I also think that if you need to CM twice to make Stored Power as good as Psychic is (taking the sdef drop in count), it's useless. Most CMers wont go past +2/+3 anyway.
 
Just to add on to counters, Zoroark can prove to be a problem, tricking you to go for the psychic, and STAB for the kill. Other than that, this set look very intresting, I think I will try it in my next team, thanks c:
 
Hey Delko I'm here to QC your set xD

So, after using both the one you used on your Sun team (cm, psyshock, morning sun, hp fire) and another variant (cm, psyshock, morning sun, baton pass), I preferred the latter because it allowed me to always keep momentum and I'd usually pass the boosts to Volcarona when I saw a Ferrothorn, Forretress, or Scizor anyway so I never missed Hidden Power Fire. Therefore I think the set should look like this:

name: Bulky Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Psyshock / Psychic
move 3: Morning Sun
move 4: Baton Pass / Hidden Power Fire
item: Leftovers
ability: Magic Bounce
nature: Timid
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

  • Mention HP Fighting in AC for its ability to take Tyranitar out, something Sun teams love
  • Mention Volcarona as one of the best teammates for this set if you aren't using HP Fire. It can switch into the three Steel-types HP Fire is aimed for and sweep on its own thanks to the CM boosts and take on Hydreigon

After this:

QC APPROVED 1/3

Keep them coming Delko!
 
Yea, just saw this thing in action. I have to say, it's really effective. It helps sun teams by keeping hazards away, and it forces switches while setting up. Nice job man!
 
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