Forme names in teambuilder and battles in PS

[Joim]

Hey there,
A long time ago, we saw a "problem" with the way names are presented for formes. While the "species" should remain as-is, the chosen name for a forme Pokémon should be the base forme name to stay true to the game. Reviewing all the stuff I never finished and things to do, I've tackled this issue again and I think this is something worth a discussion.

Thing is, when for instance you use a Rotom-Wash, teambuilder would show Nickname: Rotom, Pokémon: Rotom-Wash. In battle, this would be shown as Rotom (Rotom-Wash). So, the ideas are:

• Keep it as it is right now: Rotom-Wash, or Nickname (Rotom-Wash) [On tooltip, only shows nickname in battle]
  
• Show the forme name in parenthesis as if the base species name is a nickname: Rotom (Rotom-Wash) [On tooltip, would display Rotom in battle]
  
• Update PS so formes are shown below the name: Rotom Forme: Wash, Nickname (Rotom Forme: Wash) [On tooltip, battle keeps only showing nickname, it's a matter of style when showing the forme compared to the previous option]

For more info: https://github.com/Zarel/Pokemon-Showdown-Client/pull/92

Thanks for your input!

 

[Stratos]

I prefer option 2, which I've been pulling for for a while. Or maybe a slight variant on option 3 where the nickname is Rotom, and the name is Rotom Forme: Wash. Having the forme names on the line not only isn't true to the game but gets stupidly long in the case of something like Thundurus-Therian; on the rare case I'm not feeling lazy I always manually nickname my "formed" Pokemon to the base forme and i guess it'd be nice if PS did it for me.

pictured: why method #1 isnt ok

edit: i misunderstood #3, it would only display as "Thundurus" for the nickname but the tooltip would say the full thing

 

[DragonWhale]

I prefer option 2, which I've been pulling for for a while. Or maybe a slight variant on option 3 where the nickname is Rotom, and the name is Rotom Forme: Wash. Having the forme names on the line not only isn't true to the game but gets stupidly long in the case of something like Thundurus-Therian; on the rare case I'm not feeling lazy I always manually nickname my "formed" Pokemon to the base forme and i guess it'd be nice if PS did it for me.

pictured: why method #1 isnt ok

edit: i misunderstood #3, it would only display as "Thundurus" for the nickname but the tooltip would say the full thing

I don't think this is addressing changing the default nicknames (I thought so at first too). This is only addressing what would be displayed when you hover over the pokemon. The default names will still probably remain the same.

And if that's the case I don't think there needs to be a change. We already know that an Arceus-Ground's base form is an Arceus or that Thundurus-Therian's base form is Thundurus. I go with option 1.

But I agree with Stratos that the form names shouldn't be the default names, especially since as you said you want to "stay true to the game". Landorus-Therian are still displayed as "Landorus" in the games.

 

[Zarel]

We can use various methods to resize names so e.g. "Thundurus-Therian" still fits, if that's your only objection.

 

[Stratos]

that'd be great, though there is still the fact that in-game the default nickname of a pokemon with a forme is still just the species name

 

[Zarel]

Mostly, I'm fine with that, I just don't know how to phrase the messages in a way that makes it clear what forme it's in.

Like, currently, it's like:

name: Fluffy

Bob sent in Fluffy (Rotom-Wash)!​

name: Rotom-Wash

Bob sent in Rotom-Wash!​

name: Rotom

Bob sent in Rotom (Rotom-Wash)!​

How would you rephrase these messages if the default name were "Rotom" instead of "Rotom-Wash"?

 

[Stratos]

name: fluffy

Bob sent in Fluffy (Rotom-Wash)!

name: rotom-wash

Bob sent in Rotom-Wash (Rotom-Wash)! OR Bob sent in Rotom-Wash! <-either works depending on which you prefer/which doesn't require changing code

name: rotom

Bob sent in Rotom (Rotom-Wash)!

 

[antemortem]

Bob sent in Rotom-Wash (Rotom-Wash)! OR Bob sent in Rotom-Wash!

There's no reason to express a nickname if there isn't one; the latter is optimal. If you'd rather every forme be expressed as "Rotom (Rotom-Wash)", then that also works, but otherwise it's excessive.

 

[Zarel]

There's no reason to express a nickname if there isn't one; the latter is optimal. If you'd rather every forme be expressed as "Rotom (Rotom-Wash)", then that also works, but otherwise it's excessive.

The thing is, "Rotom-Wash" would be a nickname, since its real species name is "Rotom".

 

[Zarel]

Also why is this in PR? This is really mostly just a PS UI issue.

 

[Stratos]

I think we're crossing signals. The suggestion was for the species name to remain Rotom-Wash, but the default nickname to be set to Rotom; ie to decouple the default nickname from the species name with alternate-forme Pokemon so that the default nickname matches cart.

(Yeah we'd match cart even more closely if we changed the species name as well but having the species name be different is necessary for when sprites are broken and stuff)

 

[Joim]

Also why is this in PR? This is really mostly just a PS UI issue.

I thought this is the kind of change that triggers people, so I followed by "let's post on PR to see what people think and like".

 

[Kingler]

Yeah PS sprites break a lot so please leave it distinguishable, the slightly-closer-to-cart mechanics wouldn't be worth otherwise

 

[Zarel]

This has been implemented for a while now, by the way. I've heard no complaints so far.