Forretress (OU Revamp) Done

Oldamar999

Gutsman's Ass
is a Pre-Contributor
[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. It also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, which allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Skarmory. Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self-Destruct from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of Steel-types as a whole mean that it has a tendency to be lured in and KOed by Pokemon it would usually set up on, such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, and has STAB Surf, which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion-resistant, physically defensive Pokemon , something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, its lack of weaknesses outside of Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange of setting up or removing Spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking and even Raikou and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes plays an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress' side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher Speed while also checking Vaporeon and Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou. Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game-winning advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mind games as to whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy Rapid Spin users. Forretress hates Ghost-types itself, however, so Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them to prevent the opponent from spinblocking. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Snorlax that have Fire-type moves and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress's 4x weakness to Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard and RestTalk Moltres, such as Suicune, are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows many scary special attackers, setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and Perish Trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Hidden Power Bug isn't really good for much else, and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional Leftovers recovery and scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional Rapid Spin user, and without Rapid Spin, Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-types**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress. Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. Misdreavus can Perish trap Forretress to remove it, and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a Ghost-type teammate for support, opposing Forretress can set up Spikes, remove Spikes from the opponent's side of the field, and 2HKO Forretress with Hidden Power Fire.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Oldamar999, 453750]]
- Quality checked by: [[Earthworm.15210 ], [Lavos,129513]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Estronic,240732 ], [Eien,100418 ]]
 
Last edited:

FriendOfMrGolem120

aka. FOMG
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderatoris a defending SPL Champion
Moderator
HpBug is only occasionally used on Forretress and should never be a single main option. I would list two different sets: one with Spikes and Spin and one only with Spikes. The latter is usually Spikes, Toxic, HpFire, Explosion and only used in combination with another Spinner (mostly Starmie). The Spikes + Spin set is more common but also more complicated. Toxic, Giga Drain, Explosion, HpFire, HpGhost are the moves I think are most used. HpBug, Protect and Reflect are good OOs but not good enough to list them in the main set in my opinion. I am not entirely sure how I would put them but maybe
Toxic / Giga Drain / Hp Fire
Explosion / HpFire / HpGhost / Giga Drain
I think you can almost use any combination of these moves as long as the it has good synergy with the rest of the team.
 

Jorgen

World's Strongest Fairy
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion
Toxic should probably be on a Forretress set before HP Fire / Giga Drain. If you drop one of those for Explosion, it's the wimpy attacking move before the useful status move. As FOMG mentioned, it's also not a bad idea to slot Explosion over Spin (should you really want the former) to preserve 2 moveslots to support moves (HP Fire for other Forr, Toxic to wear down Cloy/Starmie and off-beat spinners like Donphan/Golem, but unfortunately you have nothing against Tentacruel).

As for possible OO material: A Curse set can stall out Curselax and Heracross while actually threatening to do something by attacking. HP Bug/Curse/Rest/Spikes would be the set. A Defense Curl/Toxic set can go even further beyond: more PP for the fight against Curselax, and it lets you nail Cloyster instead of just folding to it. And there's always Sandstorm too, which does 1/8 per turn in GSC instead of the 1/16 it does in other gens. Forry's moveset beyond Spikes is often fungible, so there aren't huge opportunity costs to gimmicks like that. Sandstorm probably works best on a full-on gimmick team designed around it, though.
 

Lavos

Banned deucer.
is a defending SPL Championis a Past WCoP Championis the defending ADV Circuit Champion
In most cases with Forretress there are only a few combinations of moves you're going to run. Giga Drain + HP Fire to cover your bases against opposing Cloy and Forre, Toxic + HP Fire to cover Starmie better while sacrificing the Cloy 1v1, Toxic + HP Ghost if you have a Ghost of your own to handle enemy Forre, or Giga/Toxic/HP Fire + Explosion if you're going all-in on matchup fishing. Forretress has a great movepool and there are theoretically uses for a lot of stuff (DCurl, Curse, Reflect, Protect...) but I haven't seen any of it used for years, and for good reason, it can't stand up against the fast-paced offensive teams that tend to dominate mid-level tournament play. I also don't think HP Bug is ever worthwhile, and you would only ever use Sandstorm on a dedicated TSS squad. It's fine if you want to be generous with Other Options but the best Forretress is generally going to stick with one of the few move combinations I listed above. And yeah, you can drop Spin for Explosion, but I'd only do it with Starmie in the back.
 
In my opinion, HP Bug is good enough to appear on the main set. When used in tandem with Toxic, Forretress heavily pressure Starmie and keep Spikes up against it. It also allows Forretress to keep some defensive utility against non-HP Fire Exeggutor and Jynx, although HP Ghost might be enough to handle the second one. Besides, you'll be glad to pack HP Bug on some rare scenarios, like if you're facing a <15% Snorlax with Rest but Forry don't have / shouldn't use Explosion because it's still needed. All these perks make HP Bug good enough to appear on the main set if you ask me, but I'm fine if it doesn't. I think that it should definitely appear on additional comments though.

Good analysis so far!
 

Estronic

mechanical fever
is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
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[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. combining this with Forretress' Its also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, (AC) which that allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Toxic Skarmory. It's Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self Destruct from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take Explosions those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, pairing this with it's poor special defense and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of steel types Steel-types as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured by Pokemon it would usually set up on such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, Which which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, (AC) and its STAB Surf, (AC) which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion resistant Pokemon on their weaker Special side Special Defense, Something something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic special attack Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor too. its Its lack of weaknesses outside of fire Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange for setting up or removing Spikes (or to remove) spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking or and even Raikou or and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes play an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress' team side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic Wears wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher speed Speed and can also possibly surprise KO Zapdos and Raikou and lets it be an emergency option against Vaporeon or Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou (original sounded a bit awkward due to order of listing). Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game winning advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost Prevents prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to toxic Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mindgames mind games as to weather whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or use Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep spikes Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so the Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy rapid spinners (or "Rapid Spin users"). Forretress hates Ghost-types itself; (add semicolon) however, Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress' 4x weakness to fire Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard or and RestTalk Moltres such as Suicune are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows in many scary special attackers, set up setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and perish Perish trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, (AC) which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress, (RC) and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Starmie has declined in popularity (you generally don't want to reference how something is popular/unpopular in an analysis since it can very well change anytime fyi), (AC) and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. running Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important pokemon Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and it's its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional leftovers Leftovers recovery and let's it scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages (AH) leftovers Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional spinner, and without Rapid Spin, (AC) Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-Types Ghost-types**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress, (AC). (add period) Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. In return, Misdreavus can Perish Trap trap Forretress to remove it, or and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type moves Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves Such such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to a its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with flamethrower Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a ghost Ghost-type for support, opposing Forretress can set up spikes Spikes against it, (AC) and remove spikes Spikes on their side, (AC) and 2HKO your Forretress.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[oldamar999, 453750]]
- Quality checked by: [[, ], [, ], [, ]] (remember to fill this out)
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]
 

Oldamar999

Gutsman's Ass
is a Pre-Contributor
amcheck :blobthumbsup:
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[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. combining this with Forretress' Its also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, (AC) which that allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Toxic Skarmory. It's Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self Destruct from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take Explosions those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, pairing this with it's poor special defense and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of steel types Steel-types as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured by Pokemon it would usually set up on such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, Which which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, (AC) and its STAB Surf, (AC) which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion resistant Pokemon on their weaker Special side Special Defense, Something something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic special attack Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor too. its Its lack of weaknesses outside of fire Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange for setting up or removing Spikes (or to remove) spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking or and even Raikou or and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes play an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress' team side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic Wears wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher speed Speed and can also possibly surprise KO Zapdos and Raikou and lets it be an emergency option against Vaporeon or Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou (original sounded a bit awkward due to order of listing). Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game winning advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost Prevents prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to toxic Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mindgames mind games as to weather whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or use Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep spikes Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so the Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy rapid spinners (or "Rapid Spin users"). Forretress hates Ghost-types itself; (add semicolon) however, Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress' 4x weakness to fire Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard or and RestTalk Moltres such as Suicune are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows in many scary special attackers, set up setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and perish Perish trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, (AC) which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress, (RC) and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Starmie has declined in popularity (you generally don't want to reference how something is popular/unpopular in an analysis since it can very well change anytime fyi), (AC) and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. running Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important pokemon Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and it's its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional leftovers Leftovers recovery and let's it scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages (AH) leftovers Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional spinner, and without Rapid Spin, (AC) Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-Types Ghost-types**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress, (AC). (add period) Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. In return, Misdreavus can Perish Trap trap Forretress to remove it, or and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type moves Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves Such such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to a its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with flamethrower Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a ghost Ghost-type for support, opposing Forretress can set up spikes Spikes against it, (AC) and remove spikes Spikes on their side, (AC) and 2HKO your Forretress.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[oldamar999, 453750]]
- Quality checked by: [[, ], [, ], [, ]] (remember to fill this out)
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]
implemented, thanks :psyglad:
 

Estronic

mechanical fever
is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
woah!
add remove (comments)
[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. it It also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, which allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Skarmory. Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self Destruct from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of Steel types as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured in and KOed by Pokemon it would usually set up on such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, and its has STAB Surf, which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion-resistant (AH) Pokemon on their weaker Special Defense, Something something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor. Its lack of weaknesses outside of Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange of setting up or removing Spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking and even Raikou and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes play an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress's side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher Speed and an emergency option against Vaporeon or Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou. Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game winning advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mind games as to whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy Rapid Spin users. Forretress hates Ghost-types itself; however, Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress' 4x weakness to Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard and RestTalk Moltres such as Suicune are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows many scary special attackers, setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and Perish Trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Hidden Power Bug isn't really good for much else, and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional Leftovers recovery and scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional Rapid Spin user, and without Rapid Spin, Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-Typestypes**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress. Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. Misdreavus can Perish trap Forretress to remove it, and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type moves Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a Ghost-type for support, opposing Forretress can set up Spikes against it, remove Spikes on their side of the field, and 2HKO your Forretress with Hidden Power Fire. (assuming this since it's in the title of the section)


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Oldamar999, 453750]]
- Quality checked by: [[Earthworm., 15210 ], [Lavos, 129513]] (fixed this bit up)
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]

add grammar credits for me and that'll be 1/2 :blobthumbsup:
 

Oldamar999

Gutsman's Ass
is a Pre-Contributor
woah!
add remove (comments)
[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. it It also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, which allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Skarmory. Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self Destruct from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of Steel types as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured in and KOed by Pokemon it would usually set up on such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, and its has STAB Surf, which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion-resistant (AH) Pokemon on their weaker Special Defense, Something something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor. Its lack of weaknesses outside of Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange of setting up or removing Spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking and even Raikou and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes play an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress's side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher Speed and an emergency option against Vaporeon or Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou. Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game winning advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mind games as to whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy Rapid Spin users. Forretress hates Ghost-types itself; however, Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress' 4x weakness to Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard and RestTalk Moltres such as Suicune are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows many scary special attackers, setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and Perish Trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Hidden Power Bug isn't really good for much else, and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional Leftovers recovery and scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional Rapid Spin user, and without Rapid Spin, Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-Typestypes**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress. Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. Misdreavus can Perish trap Forretress to remove it, and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type moves Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a Ghost-type for support, opposing Forretress can set up Spikes against it, remove Spikes on their side of the field, and 2HKO your Forretress with Hidden Power Fire. (assuming this since it's in the title of the section)


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Oldamar999, 453750]]
- Quality checked by: [[Earthworm., 15210 ], [Lavos, 129513]] (fixed this bit up)
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]

add grammar credits for me and that'll be 1/2 :blobthumbsup:
Implemented, thanks. ready for GP 2
 
Last edited:

Eien

is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Battle Simulator Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
Monotype Leader
add
remove
comment
ac = add comma
rc = remove comma
ah = add hyphen

[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. It also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, which allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Skarmory. Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self-Destruct (AH) from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of Steel-types (AH) as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured in and KOed by Pokemon it would usually set up on, (AC) such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, and has STAB Surf, which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion-resistant, physically defensive Pokemon on their weaker Special Defense, something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor. (Fluff) its lack of weaknesses outside of Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange of setting up or removing Spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking and even Raikou and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes plays an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress's side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher Speed while also checking and an emergency option against Vaporeon or and Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou. Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game-winning (AH) advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mind games as to whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy Rapid Spin users. Forretress hates Ghost-types itself;, (remove semicolon, add comma) however, so Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them to prevent the opponent from spinblocking. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax that have Fire-type moves and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress's 4x weakness to Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard and RestTalk Moltres, (AC) such as Suicune, (AC) are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows many scary special attackers, setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and Perish Trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Hidden Power Bug isn't really good for much else, and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional Leftovers recovery and scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional Rapid Spin user, and without Rapid Spin, Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-types**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress. Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. Misdreavus can Perish trap Forretress to remove it, and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a Ghost-type teammate for support, opposing Forretress can set up Spikes against it, remove Spikes on their from the opponent's side of the field, and 2HKO your Forretress with Hidden Power Fire.


GP 2/2
 

Oldamar999

Gutsman's Ass
is a Pre-Contributor
add
remove
comment
ac = add comma
rc = remove comma
ah = add hyphen

[OVERVIEW]
Forretress finds a secure spot on many OU teams due to its ability to viably compress Rapid Spin and Spikes support. It also has excellent physical bulk and a fantastic Steel / Bug defensive typing that gives it useful resistances to Psychic-, Ice-, and Normal-type moves and an immunity to Toxic, which allows it to switch in and set up Spikes and use Rapid Spin on passive Pokemon with Toxic like Umbreon and Skarmory. Its resistance to Normal-type moves also allows it to tank Explosion and Self-Destruct (AH) from the likes of Steelix and Snorlax, making it a good choice to attempt to take those moves aimed at key teammates after Forretress has set up Spikes. However, Forretress has the lowest Special Defense of any fully evolved Steel-type, meaning that it can often be overwhelmed by strong special attacks. Forretress also has a terrible 4x weakness to Fire, and its poor Special Defense and the popularity of Steel-types (AH) as a whole means that it has a tendency to be lured in and KOed by Pokemon it would usually set up on, (AC) such as Hidden Power Fire Exeggutor and Fire Blast Snorlax. Finally, Forretress faces competition as a Spikes setter and Rapid Spin user from Cloyster, which is much faster, has a more threatening Explosion due to its higher Attack stat, and has STAB Surf, which allows it to offensively pressure all Explosion-resistant, physically defensive Pokemon on their weaker Special Defense, something that Forretress struggles to do with its pathetic Special Attack and bare offensive movepool. However, Forretress does have points in its favor. (Fluff) its lack of weaknesses outside of Fire means that it can choose to risk a strong neutral or resisted hit in exchange of setting up or removing Spikes against a wider pool of Pokemon, such as Nidoking and even Raikou and Zapdos. The strategy of wearing down Cloyster with Toxic that stall teams often use will also be ineffective against Forretress, making it a useful pick when trying to outlast them. Lastly, while Cloyster must drop a key move in Explosion in order to run Rapid Spin, Forretress is free to use both on the same set.

[SET]
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Explosion
move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ghost / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Spikes plays an incredibly critical role in GSC, limiting the opponent's ability to switch freely and creating countless potential plays and win conditions where they would otherwise simply not exist. Rapid Spin removes Spikes on Forretress's side of the field to prevent the same situation from happening to it. Toxic wears down most Pokemon that come in on it and is good against Pokemon like Cloyster, Tyranitar, Rhydon, and Snorlax. Although Forretress is slow, Explosion lets it be an emergency check to Belly Drum Snorlax thanks to its slightly higher Speed while also checking and an emergency option against Vaporeon or and Machamp if Forretress is healthy as well as allowing it to possibly KO Zapdos and Raikou. Hidden Power Fire threatens to 2HKO opposing Forretress, potentially a game-winning (AH) advantage, and does decent damage to Skarmory and Steelix. Hidden Power Ghost prevents Forretress from being completely defenseless against Gengar and is a solid alternative to Toxic against Misdreavus. Giga Drain is an alternative that has a chance to 3HKO Cloyster, giving Forretress a chance of beating it one-on-one and creating mind games as to whether Forretress will use Giga Drain again or Rapid Spin, and it has a chance to 2HKO Golem.

Team Options
========
Forretress wants to keep Spikes set up against the enemy as much as possible, so Ghost-types such as Gengar and Misdreavus make for good partners by blocking enemy Rapid Spin users. Forretress hates Ghost-types itself;, (remove semicolon, add comma) however, so Pursuit trappers such as Tyranitar, Umbreon, and Houndoom can take care of them to prevent the opponent from spinblocking. Forretress also appreciates Tyranitar's ability to take on Fire-type move Snorlax that have Fire-type moves and Umbreon's ability to better trap Starmie. Due to Forretress's 4x weakness to Fire, Pokemon that can take on Belly Drum Charizard and RestTalk Moltres, (AC) such as Suicune, (AC) are very valuable teammates. Forretress's passivity also means that it allows many scary special attackers, setup sweepers, and general threats such as Zapdos, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Gengar, and Perish Trap Misdreavus to switch in, so Raikou often makes a good partner with its reliable ability to beat these threats at least once.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Hidden Power Bug is Forretress's best STAB move, which threatens Starmie just enough so that it is unable to reliably remove Spikes against Forretress and also does big damage against Exeggutor and Jynx. However, Hidden Power Bug isn't really good for much else, and Toxic with Pursuit or Ghost-type support can also do the job of beating Starmie. Running Hidden Power Bug over Forretress's other coverage options also prevents Forretress from being able to beat important Pokemon such as Cloyster, Gengar, and opposing Forretress. Reflect doubles Forretress's and its partners' Defense, letting certain setup sweepers have an easier time setting up. Protect allows Forretress to gain additional Leftovers recovery and scout for moves like Fire Blast. Sandstorm is an option that out-damages Leftovers and pairs very well with Toxic and Spikes. Unfortunately, all of these options are very difficult to fit on the standard set, and while Sandstorm is very useful for chip damage, it can also have the adverse affect of wearing down Forretress's teammates, so this is important to consider when building a team with it. Forretress can drop Rapid Spin to free up space for another move like Toxic or Explosion; however, this can mean having to bring an additional Rapid Spin user, and without Rapid Spin, Cloyster is usually better.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Ghost-types**: Misdreavus and Gengar are some of Forretress's hardest counters, since they take negligible damage from most of its attacks barring Hidden Power Ghost, are immune to Explosion, and are able to spinblock Forretress. Gengar is also notable in that it is immune to Toxic. Misdreavus can Perish trap Forretress to remove it, and Gengar can simply overwhelm Forretress with Thunder. However, it is harder for them to counter Forretress if it runs Hidden Power Ghost.

**Fire-type Moves**: Any Pokemon that carry Fire-type moves such as Snorlax, Tyranitar, and Nidoking instantly pose a massive threat to Forretress due to its 4x weakness to Fire. Snorlax notably misses the OHKO with Flamethrower but guarantees an OHKO with Fire Blast. Naturally, all Fire-type Pokemon also threaten to OHKO Forretress.

**Enemy Hidden Power Fire Forretress**: If Forretress isn't also running Hidden Power Fire and doesn't have a Ghost-type teammate for support, opposing Forretress can set up Spikes against it, remove Spikes on their from the opponent's side of the field, and 2HKO your Forretress with Hidden Power Fire.


GP 2/2
thanks. this is ready for upload Oglemi Jellicent :v4:
 
Last edited:

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