Gastrodon (Memento)

[Lee]

original post

A set I've been meaning to post for a while and will finally do so now that Rolf has nudged me into it.

See this post for some extending reading on the set basics - http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2882218&postcount=775

[SET]
name: It's a Trap!
move 1: Block
move 2: Yawn
move 3: Memento
move 4: Earthquake / Surf / Ice Beam
nature: Careful / Calm
item: Rindo Berry
evs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]

- this set sacrifices Gastrodon to allow another sweeper one completely free turn to do as he sees fit (provided no Sleep Talk or unexpected Lum Berry)

- Gastrodons good typing and bulk allow him many chances to switch in and begin the set up which usually goes like (not an actual log but I've done this countless times against high quality players...I'm sure most of you already get the gist here but I'll spell it out really simply in case anybody doesn't.)

Gastrodon switches in on [Pokemon that will flee]
Opponent switches in Venusaur
Gastrodon uses Yawn
Venusaur becomes drowsy
Venusaur switches out and out comes [Different Pokemon]
Gastrodon uses Block (on the switch)
[Different Pokemon] hits Gastrodon
Gastrodon uses Yawn
[Different Pokemon becomes drowsy]

Now Gastrodon should select Memento to seal his fate. At this point it doesn't matter if the opponent kills Gastrodon or Gastrodon kills himself, the end result is the same. You'll bring in your set-up sweeper just as the opponent nods off guaranteeing you one free turn of set up.

- move 4 is there to break Substitutes and should be selected to fit your teams needs as well as allow you to bluff that you're using the Bulky Water set early on.

- Leftovers for survivability, Rindo Berry allows you to secure a Yawn on physical Venusaur if it hits the fan (LO Power Whip - 84-99%) while also protecting you from random Hidden Power Grass (max SpA LO Blaziken does 54% on avg).

Counters / Partners:

- Lum Berry users mean Gastrodon dies for nothing so be sure to scout your opponent's team well before trying this. Similar thing for Sleep Talk/sleep absorbers (i used this when Honchkrow was around, total nightmare)
- Taunt/Sub users force you to play a little riskily. Rather than Blocking the switch you'll have to Yawn again to force them back out.
- U-turn/Baton Pass users as they can escape your Block.
- Phazers can come in on the Block and Roar as you Yawn but momentum would still be in your favor in that instance as they'll be forced to switch due to Yawn.
- Explosion

- Linoone is the ideal partner as there is arguably no other Pokemon on the game that can do as much with one turn of set up.
- Charizard I suppose (BellyZard sucks)

[SET]
name: It's a Trap!
move 1: Block
move 2: Yawn
move 3: Memento
move 4: Earthquake / Surf / Ice Beam / Waterfall
nature: Careful / Calm
item: Rindo Berry / Lum Berry
ability: Sticky Hold
evs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>This set capitalises on Gastrodon's unique access to Block, Yawn, and Memento to allow one completely free turn for a teammate, making it a perfect support Pokemon for sweepers such as Linoone and Charizard. The idea is to use Block as the opponent switches out of Gastrodon, then absorb the incoming hit (Rindo Berry will allow it to survive all but the most powerful of Grass-type attacks) and use Yawn. From there, Gastrodon should use Memento to ensure your next Pokemon gets in for free, just as the opposing -2 Atk / -2 SpA Pokemon falls asleep due to Yawn. The final moveslot is primarily to break Substitutes, which can be quite annoying for this strategy.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Obviously this Gastrodon needs a very specific kind of teammate - namely one that can take that one free turn and use it to cause as much damage as possible. With that in mind, Linoone is the ideal partner because, thanks to the combination of Belly Drum, ExtremeSpeed, and Gluttony, Linoone can arguably accomplish more in a single turn than any other Pokemon in UU. Charizard is also an option as it can use the free turn to set up a Substitute and, on the following turn, use Belly Drum to simultaneously activate its Salac Berry and max out its Attack.</p>

<p>Since any team using this Gastrodon will ultimately be relying on it (and the subsequent sweeper) to secure victory, it's important to be aware of the threats that might thwart Gastrodon's set-up attempts. Substitute has already been mentioned as a potential thorn in the side, so be aware of that when a common Substitute user such as Mismagius switches in. In this situation, Gastrodon can either use its attack to break the Substitute, or predict the initial switch-in and use Yawn instead of Block to force it back out again. Explosion is also a huge concern, as not only will it deal hefty damage to Gastrodon, but it will also cause the opposing Pokemon to faint, preventing you from getting that crucial free turn. It is also vital that, when using this set, you scout the opposing team well for Lum Berry users as they can absorb the Yawn and make Gastrodon's sacrifice a lot less effective.</p>

 

[kd24]

I used this set with Lee in UU for a while and it is really the perfect set-up tool for Linoone. I really wouldn't mention Bellyzard because he is very easily stopped by Scarfers/Priority, but Linoone can just use ExSpeed to beat all of them.

I'd also like to throw in the possibility of Waterfall as the attacking move (This is what I used) because it lets you confront Mismagius and her Substitutes, which can really mess up a Yawn/Memento set.

 

[Flashrider57]

- Charizard I suppose (BellyZard sucks)

Trust me, Lee, you aren't going to say BellyZard sucks after you've been swept by one. Unless you mean as a partner, in which case it does suck.

Anyway, I've also seen this set on the Creative Moveset thread (which is where I presume you got this off of). It looks interesting, and I'll test it out...the thing is, I don't really prefer suiciding with Memento, but now is as good as any other time to get out of that comfort zone.

 

[Random Pizzaman]

I think Protect deserves a slash or at least a mention, so that you'll always be able to pull this off (unless there's Taunt or Sub, of course). Without it, you'll be 2KOd by any Grass type, and you won't be successful against things like Hitmonlee, Alakazam etc.

 

[Rolf]

I used Protect to 1) ease prediction with Yawn and 2) allow for a possible second setup if you run two setup mons with it. With screens it's really not required to Memento and gastrodon is bulky enough to plug along and do its job a second time with an added Memento. Surf could easily work though as a move to not get you completely shut down by Taunt.

I definitely think this set deserves an analysis though. I used this with both Belly Drum Linoone and Belly Drum Hariyama to amazing success. It's just nasty in it's ability to give you, no matter what, a free turn on anything at all.

EDIT: I think Protect is the better option with Leftovers and Surf with Rindo Berry.

 

[whistle]

what exactly do the EVs do? I don't feel like reverse engineering them, but there might be a better spread since the one you have now was made god knows how long ago (more than a year probably; I remember that Lemmiwinks post around this time last summer lol).

my first thought on seeing the massive slashes in the last slot was what kd said - where's Waterfall? hitting Mismagius and Rotom (especially Scarf Rotom if you run Adamant Linoone) seems enough for a slash. Ice Beam doesn't seem all that useful, cause if Venusaur switches in it's going to be setup bait for you anyways. if you keep in mind that Gastrodon only needs to attack as a last resort, Surf doesn't seem that useful either - Waterfall has less power, but hits two specific threats.

in any case, these are just pretty minor concerns and you obviously know what you're doing...

QC Approved 1/2

 

[Despotar]

I would add something that can take out things that typically switch into Gastrodon, as well as setup, so as to have a even easier sweep.
(I.E Bulk up Grumpig or Calm Mind Entie)

 

[Leman]

Please tell me you meant Calm Mind Grumpig, anyway why would Entei switch into Gastrodon and potentially get nailed with a Ground or Water-type attack (assuming your opponent doesn't know what set your running). Anyway, even if someone were to switch-in either of the two Pokemon you mentioned; that's what Yawn is for making a set up attempt pointless. Finally, seeing as Grumpig isn't even making the top 100 in the UU useage stat for June 2010, I doubt it's going to be a big problem.

He meant those Pokemon to be Pokemon who could take advantage of the Grass-types that Gastrodon lures in.

 

[breh]

Although this sounds like a gimmick (and inferior to Charizard), is Magmar worth mentioning? It has great attack (93, which is far better than 84 or 70), a lesser weakness to SR than Zard that allows it to switch in without subbing, and Cross Chop to work with instead of EQ (BD being incompatible with Mach punch hurts though... not unlike azumarill and AJ :()

Oh and seconding CM Restalk Entei; great special venusaur counter (providing it gets lucky with sleep talk, lol)

 

[Nexus]

He meant those Pokemon to be Pokemon who could take advantage of the Grass-types that Gastrodon lures in.

oh sorry the wording through me off, as well as the bulk up grumpig comment.

 

[FlareBlitz]

Have you thought about slashing Recover in with Memento and renaming the set to "supporter"?

I mention this because I don't see Memento being very useful when shit is asleep, and using Recover gives you multiple opportunities to aid the team. I suppose one-turn sleeps suck, but honestly the ability for this to perform its role multiple times seems useful.

 

[Thund91]

I'm with Flare in that theres no point in putting a Pokemon to Sleep and then Mementoing it; you still get the free turn regardless. I can see this set being played by putting a Pokemon to sleep, switching out, and than switching back in against another Pokemon, and Mementoing it to set-up another Pokemon. This way you have one of your opponents Pokemon asleep and another one Memento'd ready to be set-up on. It gives 2 sweepers an opportunity to set-up. This should be mentioned in the set.

 

[Head Smash]

I'm with Flare in that theres no point in putting a Pokemon to Sleep and then Mementoing it; you still get the free turn regardless. I can see this set being played by putting a Pokemon to sleep, switching out, and than switching back in against another Pokemon, and Mementoing it to set-up another Pokemon. This way you have one of your opponents Pokemon asleep and another one Memento'd ready to be set-up on. It gives 2 sweepers an opportunity to set-up. This should be mentioned in the set.

Having tested this set, I'm opposed to the slashing of Memento and Recover, for a few reasons.

First, Lum Berry on random Pokemon is pretty common, and it can ruin the free turn that you set up if Gastrodon is on the verge of dying to the follow-up hit. Rest + Sleep Talk works in the same fashion and can be run on almost any relatively defensive Pokemon. Memento lets whatever is coming in at least take a soft hit (Linoone takes like 27% or so from Milotic Surf after a Memento for example), so it helps to guarantee the free turn.

Second, there is a chance that whatever Pokemon you've just Slept and Blocked will wake up, and your switch will be wasted. It's not just one turn--it's two! One turn after Gastrodon switches, and one turn during which whatever you brought in sets up. That's two turns, so it's quite likely (33% chance or something?) that the Pokemon will wake up. Memento guarantees, once again, that Linoone or whatever else that comes in willl get that free turn.

Third, sometimes I don't even use Yawn, depending on what I've scouted of my opponent's team and what I'm trying to set up, and go straight for the Memento. A slow Memento is something that Uxie can't provide, and this is a very useful characteristic that this set possesses, aiding in its ability to guarantee one free turn of setting up.

Basically, I think it would run counter to the nature of the set to include Recover over Memento. The change wouldn't let the set do so excellently what it is intended to do--guarantee the set-up.

 

[Thund91]

I never said to slash Recover anywhere, just that the set should say "don't Memento right away because with both Yawn and Memento you can set-up two Pokemon instead of just one."

 

[Head Smash]

I never said to slash Recover anywhere, just that the set should say "don't Memento right away because with both Yawn and Memento you can set-up two Pokemon instead of just one."

Sorry, I meant to quote FlareBlitz.

 

[JabbaTheGriffin]

Yeah this seems like a lot of effort just to get 1 free turn which still doesn't guarantee anything. And I mean shit I'm usually against saying "something is outclassed" and then kicking it to the curb but seriously Jumpluff learns Sleep Powder and Memento which lets it do almost the same shit without having to think at all. And it is much much faster. This just seems like forcing a set because a Pokemon has the moves

 

[whistle]

well the primary difference that i see is that with jumpluff, it sleep powders something but you have no guarantee the other person will stay in. sometimes they will if your sleep powder hit like a venusaur or something and they're expecting the leech seed set, but if they switch out while you memento, you've got a -2/-2 pokemon but its awake and most likely will be able to mess up linoone's setup. i think the addition of block to ensure that the opposing active pokemon is sleeping and also potentially mementoed means it's worth having this set.

 

[JabbaTheGriffin]

It's really only going to mess up the setup if it has status which isn't as likely as you'd think.

Also from what I've gathered from people touting this set that the only viable partner for this set is Linoone pretty much. Is there any point to writing up an entire analysis for a Pokemon that does nothing but setup one other mon. Wouldn't it be more productive to post in the Linoone analysis "To almost guarantee a Linoone setup use a Gastrodon with the set of Yawn/Block/Memento/Attack" That seems much more logical.

 

[Rolf]

I don't know if you've ever tried this set Jabba, but it deserves an analysis. The recipient doesn't have to be Linoone - I've successfully ran teams with this + SD Quick Feet Ursaring, Belly Drum Hariyama, Belly Drum Charizard, pretty much any other BD sweeper or immensely powerful threat that needs just one turn to start wrecking. Nothing else creates an absolute free turn like this Gastrodon is able to accomplish, nothing else can do this job.

 

[JabbaTheGriffin]

The only thing is there are an insane amount of ways to get a free turn without resorting to using an entire slot just for getting one free turn in an entire battle. Ursaring can get free turns on double switches or post kill or whatnot. BDzard can get free turns on choiced attacks that do very little/choiced ground/support torterra (which is better imo because you don't have dedicate another teammate just for charizard since you already need a spinner). BD Hariyama is pretty terrible but once again can generate its own free turns fairly easily and that leaves Linoone as pretty much the only Pokemon that needs a free turn absolutely given to it or it has no chance of setting up. This isn't like Wobbuffet where it can do shit outside generating free turns. This can only setup free turns. For most things free turns are easy to come by if you play smart. I don't like the idea of a Pokemon that just does a role that smart play can accomplish for pretty much every mon but one.

 

[Oglemi]

As per Whistle's post, this has been:

QC Approved 1/2

However, Jabba expressed great disinterest in this set. Can I get some more opinions on this QC?

 

[Bluewind]

I've seen this being used succesfully in the past, and even though it's using a team slot for a setup and not foolproof, it does have merits. I'd just make Rindo Berry the main option and Leftovers the slash. Outside of that, approved.

 

[Lee]

I was soooo tempted to call this set 'It's a Trap!' but was worried it would end up being too similar to those goddamn awful set names you see over on Serebii's PotW so I'm playing it safe.

Anyway, this is done.

Someone should be a dear and add a mention of Gastrodon to Linoone's Team Options since it's currently just all about DualScreenMemento Uxie and I can say from a lot of experience that this is a much more effective method.

 

[Bluewind]

I like It's a Trap ._.

 

[Komodo]

Proofread

Red is remove
Blue is change / add
Explainations in bold

[SET]
name: Memento
move 1: Block
move 2: Yawn
move 3: Memento
move 4: Earthquake / Surf / Ice Beam / Waterfall
nature: Careful / Calm
item: Rindo Berry / Lum Berry
ability: Sticky Hold
evs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>(remove space)This set capitalises on Gastrodon's unique access to Block, Yawn, and Memento to allow one completely free turn for a teammate, making it a perfect support Pokemon for sweepers such as Linoone and Charizard. The idea is to use Block as the opponent switches out of Gastrodon, and (I think it sounds a little repetetive to the next part) then absorb the incoming hit (Rindo Berry will allow it to survive all but the most powerful of Grass-type attacks) and use Yawn. From here, Gastrodon should use Memento to ensure your next Pokemon gets in for free,(comma) just as the opposing -2 Atk / -2 SpA Pokemon falls asleep due to Yawn. The final moveslot is primarily to break Substitutes which can be quite annoying for this strategy.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>(remove space)Obviously this Gastrodon needs a very specific kind of teammate - namely one that can take that one free turn and use it to cause as much damage as possible. With that in mind, Linoone is the ideal partner because, thanks to the combination of Belly Drum, ExtremeSpeed, and Gluttony, Linoone can arguably accomplish more in a single turn than any other Pokemon in UU. Charizard is also an option as it can use the free turn to set up a Substitute and, on the following turn, use Belly Drum to activate its(it's = it is) Salac Berry.</p>

<p>(remove space)Since any team using this Gastrodon will ultimately be relying on it (and the subsequent sweeper) to secure victory, it's important to be aware of the threats that might thwart Gastrodon's set-up attempts. Substitute has already been mentioned as a potential thorn in the side, so be aware of that when a common Substitute user such as Mismagius switches in. In this situation, Gastrodon(talking about the Pokemon) you can either use your its attack to break the Substitute, or predict the initial switch-in and use Yawn instead of Block to force it back out again. Explosion is also a huge concern as not only will it deal hefty damage to Gastrodon but it will also cause the opposing Pokemon to faint, preventing you from getting that crucial free turn. It is also vital that, when using this set, you scout the opposing team well for Lum Berry users as they can absorb the Yawn and make Gastrodon's sacrifice a lot less effective.</p>

---------------------