Gen III Battle Frontier Discussion and Records

[submenceisop]

Reporting an ongoing streak of 105 at the Battle Tower with Mence, Skarmory, Umbreon. I'm going to update it when I lose.
Team building process
Salamence is usually my lead (change it to Skarmory on the Anabel round) which provides intimidate support against mixed attackers and allows me to immediately set up on passive threats(ex double team venu, shuckle). My Salamence is rather bulky, as it has 180 hp evs, which allows Salamence to hit 193 hp, a really nice 16+1 leftovers number. It has 140 speed evs for outspeeding Adamant Heracross and Modest Suicune and outspeeds the entire tower at +1. The rest is dumped into attack, which is the bare minimum for getting 2koes against Skarmory.

Here's the damage calc
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 170 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (50.4 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (47.3 - 55.6%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO

The Skarmory spread is AdeAde's, with Skarm being the phaser, defensive pivot against physical attackers and provides torment support. There's enough bulk to tank non stab electric and fire moves if you don't get crit.

Umbreon is the special wall on the team, with only 2 weaknesses, which are checked by Skarmory and Salamence. You can go Blissey here, but the main reason why I use Umbreon is because of Wish support and the reliable accuracy reducing move in sand attack. Wish support is really nice because it isn't too difficult to pass a wish to Skarm and Mence. I again invested 180 hp for 193 hp (16+1 leftovers number), 166 speed to out pace the 105's (Nidoking+ friends), with the remainder in special bulk). It's been pretty reliable for me, although the drop in bulk from Blissey is rather noticeable. It also doesn't have natural cure, so you need Lum berry not to get crippled by status.

Charizard calc- 252+ SpA Charizard Fire Blast vs. 180 HP / 164+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 168-198 (44.6 - 52.6%)
Edit: Going to be switching out Umbreon for Blissey from 105 onwards. Umbreon isn't bulky enough. Also will be running 196 attack as per Kommo-O.

Strategy: Cripple/PP stall to allow Mence to set up.

Potential threats
Avoid Status/Don't lose Mence.
Charizard 3
Ampharos(2 and 3 with fighting coverage)
Electabuzz 3 and Golduck (Mixed Cross Chop users)
Roar users, esp Articuno 1
Armaldo/Marowak/ Aggron
Mixed Fighting Types (Machamp, Hariyama can muscle past Skarmory with crits)
Lives a +6 hit= Suicune, Aero, Skarmory, Zapdos/ Regice
Clear Body- Mixed Metagross, Regice, Quick Claw Regirock/ Registeel
Dangerous water types: Lapras, Whiscash 4, Haxrein, Dewgong

https://pokepast.es/492b95fb24ae24dd

86 bright powder sets/ 86 quick claw/ 49 Fully Evolved Focus Band users
+6 200+ Atk Salamence Hidden Power Flying vs. 255 HP / 255+ Def Regice: 188-222 (100.5 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO- Can consider over aerial ace

 

[Kommo-o]

Reporting an ongoing streak of 105 at the Battle Tower with Mence, Skarmory, Umbreon. I'm going to update it when I lose.
Team building process
Salamence is usually my lead (change it to Skarmory on the Anabel round) which provides intimidate support against mixed attackers and allows me to immediately set up on passive threats(ex double team venu, shuckle). My Salamence is rather bulky, as it has 180 hp evs, which allows Salamence to hit 193 hp, a really nice 16+1 leftovers number. It has 140 speed evs for outspeeding Adamant Heracross and Modest Suicune and outspeeds the entire tower at +1. The rest is dumped into attack, which is the bare minimum for getting 2koes against Skarmory.

Here's the damage calc
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 170 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (50.4 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (47.3 - 55.6%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO

The Skarmory spread is AdeAde's, with Skarm being the phaser, defensive pivot against physical attackers and provides torment support. There's enough bulk to tank non stab electric and fire moves if you don't get crit.

Umbreon is the special wall on the team, with only 2 weaknesses, which are checked by Skarmory and Salamence. You can go Blissey here, but the main reason why I use Umbreon is because of Wish support and the reliable accuracy reducing move in sand attack. Wish support is really nice because it isn't too difficult to pass a wish to Skarm and Mence. I again invested 180 hp for 193 hp (16+1 leftovers number), 166 speed to out pace the 105's (Nidoking+ friends), with the remainder in special bulk). It's been pretty reliable for me, although the drop in bulk from Blissey is rather noticeable. It also doesn't have natural cure, so you need Lum berry not to get crippled by status.

Potential threats
Avoid Status/Don't lose Mence.
Mixed fire and electric attackers
Fake Tears Jynx
Articuno 1 ( has 2 ice moves and roar)
Skarmory/Zapdos- walls your stabs, but you can muscle through it if you set up
Clear Body- Mixed Metagross, Regice, Quick Claw Regirock
Umbreon doesn't have a lot of pp compared to something like growl blissey- be careful with pressure users

https://pokepast.es/492b95fb24ae24dd

Considering that I also used Aerial Ace Salamence, my recommendation would be to drop the HP investment to 172 HP and put the remainder on Attack. 78.5% chance is not a good enough chance because otherwise you're giving Skarmory 3 a 22% chance of surviving, setting up Curse and reverse sweep you where you are going to be forced to do some Intimidate shuffling and if it is the remaining Pokemon on the list, you'll end up throwing away your chances.

The difference:
+6 196+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 255 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 84-99 (48.8 - 57.5%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO

While you miss out on the Leftovers number +1, 192 HP still gets the advantage of having the HP lost by a Substitute restored in 4 turns and 196 Atk EVs hit a jump point which grants you an additional extra Attack point and buffs it up to 198 Attack. Unfortunately, I have to say that Aerial Ace constrains EV spreads a lot since it needs a considerable amount to guarantee OHKOs and 2HKOs even at +6.

 

[DrDimentio]

Congratulations on the Gold Symbols! I would definitely would love to hear more about your Tower, Dome and Pike teams!

Alright, these were my teams:

Battle Pike 151 rooms (Open Level, retail, ended streak)

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Metagross @ Choice Band
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 148 HP / 244 Atk / 16 Def / 6 SpD / 96 Spe
IVs: 31/31/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Facade
- Aerial Ace

Salamence @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

For the Pike, Starmie once again held a Lum Berry for extra status protection along with Natural Cure, which makes it one of the safest sweepers to use here. Also convenient how it one-shots wild Sevipers with Psychic. Metagross was given Facade, as another way to mitigate status issues. Aerial Ace was mainly for BrightPowder / Double Team users. Salamence made good use of Chesto Rest + Dragon Dance to set up, and also to remove status.

My Pike strategy was to enter rooms that were more likely to be wild Pokemon areas, avoid any rooms that were likely to inflict status ailments (even if there was a chance of healing when I needed it), and always take a chance by entering rooms that are most likely to have an idle NPC.

Lucy’s Gold Symbol team was a pushover; it was quite amusing when her Steelix use -2 Explosion on my Metagross switch-in (I was shuffling Salamence’s Intimidate). Thanks to that, I didn’t have to risk any potential BrightPowder hax.

My loss was in a Double Battle (not much of a surprise), as I expected Starmie’s Surf to only be reduced by 25% like in later generations - another case where I lost due to my lack of focus. I guess it’s better than losing to hax.

Battle Dome 21 tournaments (Open Level, retail, ended streak)

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Slaking @ Choice Band
Ability: Truant
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 30/31/29/19/31/31
- Return
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Beam

Salamence @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

Against most teams, I led Slaking with Starmie in the back. Starmie had Lum Berry due to the limited switching potential in 2v2. Slaking was a fairly obvious choice based on the success of other players on the leaderboard here, so there’s not much to say about it - it was always fun to one-shot Tucker’s Swampert with Double-Edge, which he led with every time. Speaking of Tucker, he always seemed to spam Protect with his Metagross in the back, which allowed my Salamence to easily beat it with 2 Earthquakes due to failed Protects. Salamence used the Rest + DD set because I figured certain hax-based sets would be harder to deal with in 2v2, e.g. Double Team + recovery, or status inflicters. Since you get a team preview in this facility, having only 2 attacks is less of an issue.

My loss was also caused by a lack of focus, as I made a decision that caused me to end up with Slaking locked into Double-Edge against Curse Regirock as the second enemy - a hopeless matchup. Clearly, the key with CB Slaking in the Dome is to make sure it never gets locked into a move that would be ineffective against the second enemy Pokemon.

Battle Tower 78 wins (Open Level, retail, ended streak)

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Metagross @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 148 HP / 244 Atk / 16 Def / 6 SpD / 96 Spe
IVs: 31/31/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Agility
- Explosion

Salamence @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

With Starmie again, Lum Berry is very good for a lead, even when you have Natural Cure as well - after all, switching can lose a lot of momentum and it gives the opponent more chances to set up or inflict some kind of hax. Metagross had Leftovers to help with Intimidate shuffling between Salamence; most commonly done against Earthquake users. Agility + Explosion is a combo I’ve found very useful ever since I used it in the Arena. Deciding whether to use Agility sometimes depends on the possible sets used by the trainer you’re facing, e.g. it’s worth using it if there could be Fire-types or strong Earthquake users waiting to be sent out. That way you can safely Explode on them after finishing off the first Pokemon that was facing Metagross. Salamence used the DD + Rest set because I’ve found it very useful against status ailments, and the DD boosts are important when using a weak move like Aerial Ace.

As mentioned earlier, I lost because I wasn’t focused - used Explosion when Metagross was my last Pokemon.

 

[Kommo-o]

My loss was in a Double Battle (not much of a surprise), as I expected Starmie’s Surf to only be reduced by 25% like in later generations - another case where I lost due to my lack of focus. I guess it’s better than losing to hax.

This was also something new to me as well. Spread moves in Gen 3 had completely different mechanics from the changes done in Gen 4 (25% power reduction) and haven't changed since. The main reason why I realized this was on one of my runs of the Pike Bugs. I realized comparing to the damage calculator that Rock Slide was doing less damage while Earthquake was doing Singles damage. Turns out that spread moves like Surf and Rock Slide, that do not damage your partner, have their power reduced by a 50%. Heart-breaking but true and is the main reason why I can fully understand Waterfall existed as a special widespread move for Waters in Gen 3. For moves that do damage your opponent like Earthquake and Explosion, there is no spread nerf. As a matter of fact, it is the same damage as in Singles and Earthquake retains its base 100 power.

Having said that, 151 is a great record for a non-Blissey Pike team and that's refreshing to see. Blissey is so overpowered on Pike, in a similar way Slaking is for Dome, that makes this facility a joke.

Battle Tower 78 wins (Open Level, retail, ended streak)
View attachment 253418

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Metagross @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 148 HP / 244 Atk / 16 Def / 6 SpD / 96 Spe
IVs: 31/31/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Agility
- Explosion

Salamence @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

With Starmie again, Lum Berry is very good for a lead, even when you have Natural Cure as well - after all, switching can lose a lot of momentum and it gives the opponent more chances to set up or inflict some kind of hax. Metagross had Leftovers to help with Intimidate shuffling between Salamence; most commonly done against Earthquake users. Agility + Explosion is a combo I’ve found very useful ever since I used it in the Arena. Deciding whether to use Agility sometimes depends on the possible sets used by the trainer you’re facing, e.g. it’s worth using it if there could be Fire-types or strong Earthquake users waiting to be sent out. That way you can safely Explode on them after finishing off the first Pokemon that was facing Metagross. Salamence used the DD + Rest set because I’ve found it very useful against status ailments, and the DD boosts are important when using a weak move like Aerial Ace.

As mentioned earlier, I lost because I wasn’t focused - used Explosion when Metagross was my last Pokemon.

I really like Lum on Starmie and it's an item I've used myself on Starmie too. Not losing momentum due to an obligated Natural Care switch-out sometimes is very counterproductive and loosing momentum sucks specially for a fast Pokemon like Starmie.

Have you used your Substitute tutor already? I feel it's more at home with your Salamence since I've been recently tinkering with bulky DD and from personal experience it has been pretty great on Tower. Neverless, Chesto DD is a cool set and as someone who used it but on Gyarados (mostly becuse I already had a Substitute user on the team), it is a good replacement in case you don't have access to the tutor anymore.

Thanks for sharing and hope to see more about your conquests!

 

[DrDimentio]

Having said that, 151 is a great record for a non-Blissey Pike team and that's refreshing to see. Blissey is so overpowered on Pike, in a similar way Slaking is for Dome, that makes this facility a joke.

Thanks, I might actually try for a better Pike streak now that I won't forget the gen 3 doubles mechanics again! The lack of Blissey was because I have very limited Pokemon options on my cartridge; no games to trade with. That's why I've been limited to 5 main Pokemon across all facilities: Starmie, Metagross, Salamence, Slaking and Latios (a Calm one with mediocre IVs).

And yes, unfortunately I've used the Substitute tutor already - it was so dumb that these older Pokemon games have so many moves you can lose permanently. I think Rest actually works better for my playstyle though.

 

[dgice]

So I was testing Slaking-Salamence-Struggle Snorlax in the palace and it was winning battles but not getting streaks; I guess it’s weak to regirock since it’s all physical attackers and regirock has clear body. I noticed one of the weaknesses of switching to snorlax from salmence is that salamence baits out ice moves, then you get frozen and die. Registeel surviving explosions could be a good reason to use it as a struggler instead, also I've been trying protect hasty slaking but I don't think thats good enough.
I got frustrated and just did a test run with the previous team and ended up going really deep which inspired me to just go for it on retail to be cathartic.

Of the six 49 streaks I posted earlier only 2 are live still sitting at 49. Three of them ended below 60 with one losing on battle 51 -_- But I did have one epic run that filled me with joy and excitement like I hadn’t felt in years!

Record

Done at level 100

One Loss was to Zapdos, another loss to marowak, Then one where donphan beat salamence, gardevoir crit suicune and golduck chopped snorlax. The big loss was to swords dance scizor. There were multiple times I just got lucky. There are a lot of trainers out there who just aren't as hard to beat and so getting lucky against a few hard trainers can add 10 wins to your streak each time.

Here’s the video of the entire post 49 gameplay, it’s 8hrs of footage there is no commentary and there are lots of pauses. Recorded on GC gameboy player with elgato capture card.

If it was a 100 streak I may have considered doing commentary and editing it to be watchable because there were several plays that felt clever and took some probability calculation, but right now I’m just not that interested.
Interestingly Swampert with curse counter rest earthquake is a free win for salamence because swampert will use curse many times before it considers using counter (they are both support moves). Since Swampert has a move of each type it never chooses outside it’s nature and therefore abides by the ai incentives found in the tower to use curse over counter.

So anyways heres the team:

Team

https://pokepast.es/3f3e761b3648e7d8
Salamence (F) @ Lum Berry
IVs: 21 Def
EVs: 8 HP / 244 Atk / 72 SpD / 184 Spe
Ability: Intimidate
Hasty Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Brick Break
- Dragon Dance

Suicune @ Chesto Berry
IVs: 30 HP / 19 Atk / 14 Def / 2 SpA / 26 SpD / 20 Spe
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Ability: Pressure
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Rest
- Ice Beam
- Calm Mind

notDIESAL (Snorlax) (F) @ Leftovers
IVs: 25 Atk / 30 Def / 20 SpA / 20 Spe
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Ability: Immunity
Hardy Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Return
- Curse
- Earthquake

So I might as well address it now, that is a 5 iv salamence that I hatched breeding without rng manip a few years ago. I was just trying to get 3 iv’s and a few good ones and I felt like I won the lottery because iirc it’s like a 1 in 100,000 chance even with the 3 and 2 iv parents. I’ve probably hatched 5000 bagons, but I have hatched at least 100,000 pokemon the last 5 years (got a shiny treeko and snorlax i wasn’t even looking for!) I will leave my gameboys on overnight just to make sure I’m accepting the eggs on new frames. And I can hatch eggs without looking by listening for the music since it changes everytime you load the route but if you’ve hatched something it stops you in place and the music keeps playing, so if you've hatched an egg you actually hear the end of the tune. If you’ve seen my resetting for suicune prep video, I already had an elaborate setup ready to go, but I lowered my standards quite a bit when I realized modest really was the exact nature I wanted to get on suicune, I also just went for 255 255 because it was easier and already missing so many points. (Suicune’s original trainer’s name is Suicune lol)


Salamence is Ev’d specifically for special hariyama and electabuzz spdef wise to live one shot and hit back. It’s an old set I didn’t think about adjusting the spread for this team. You don’t want to risk salamence on the first pokemon in case you need it for intimidate support against the back two. You mostly stay in against just fighting or grass types and swords dancers. Snorlax is great in that you want to get it to set up and just plow through the follow up pokemon but it’s got a limited lifespan, very rarely does snorlax not kill before leftovers can finish healing. It’s here to battle psychic types. Suicune is very stally and will survive for a long time before firing off a +6 surf, which is fine because it’s stll alive but it invites hax. Ice beam is because opposing salamence is scary. Snorlax with intimidate support handles flygon pretty well though so maybe icebeam isn’t so important, though having two attacks increases odds of an attack being randomly used especially above 50% health in the opening turns against swords dancers.
Against shear cold if they have high odds of attacking you can try and drain the pp faster with suicune, even one dodge raises your odds of winning a lot because of pressure. But a lot of the time you just use snorlax and pray. (check out one such battle at 4:46 in the video)


At level 50 I will switch brick break with rock slide. There is no tyranitar and you end up seeing more legendary birds because of it.

One of the strengths of this team is that there are redundancies for things are really threats. Like I don't carry much redundancy for the easy to beat trainers, but for threats like regirock, registeel, salamence, latios, metagross at least 2 if not all 3 pokemon are ready to jump in the ring and tag team them.

Closing thoughts

My goal has always been records of 100 wins in every frontier challenge. So losing at 99 was a little rough but maybe it’s a blessing as it will keep my interest in palace as I have some more work I want to do on it. For now though, I realize that my lower round teams are less than optimal and I want to balance the most time saving and highest winrate teams for the lower rounds. To that end I have made setdexes to plug into Turskain’s calc that are of just 1 trainer or ranges of trainers and I hope I can find something to exploit about the lower iv’s and limited pokemon sets by studying them. And I will look a little bit more into struggle sets


With everyone’s recent streaks and my practice on emulator I wasn’t very surprised when I made it to 99. I was excited but not surprised. But it has now hit me, I made it to 99 wins in the battle palace. Oh my god, I have been trying to do that for so long, I am proud of this. I think my team from 2016 included trying things like gentle slowbro, sassy flygon, brave latios, rest mudslap kangaskhan lol. I know plenty of people like the battle frontier but I think it’s still underrated because it has a high barrier for getting started. These battle challenges are such novel puzzles and provoke years worth of trying new strategies and discussion.

 

[DrDimentio]

Reporting an ongoing Battle Pyramid streak: 70 wins (Open Level, retail)


Now I can see why people just report ongoing streaks; not only is this facility tedious, it's also hard to imagine how one could actually lose, since you can stock up so many Hyper Potions, Revives, etc. Not to mention that the trainers other than the boss all fight you 1v3... I was probably quite lucky to find a Choice Band and Shell Bell very early in my run, considering that I used Slaking's Shadow Ball and Earthquake against many of the wild Pokemon. As of the 70th battle, I have around 10 Hyper Potions, 8 Revives, 1 Max Revive and 5 Lum Berries.

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry / Shell Bell / BrightPowder etc
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Slaking @ Choice Band
Ability: Truant
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 30/31/29/19/31/31
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Beam

Salamence @ Chesto Berry / Lum Berry / Shell Bell etc
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

The above 3 Pokemon I used in most rounds, but I also used the following for some rounds where they had a better matchup with the wild Pokemon:

Metagross @ Chesto Berry / Lum Berry / Shell Bell etc
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 148 HP / 244 Atk / 16 Def / 6 SpD / 96 Spe
IVs: 31/31/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Rest
- Aerial Ace

Latios @ Lum Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 7/9/12/31/25/17
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt

Metagross was used in the Explosion round and the Ice round, while Latios was only used for the set leading to the Gold Symbol battle, for a better matchup against Brandon. But it didn't matter, as I was hilariously lucky in the Gold Symbol battle: I led with Starmie, got a Thunderbolt full-paralysis on his Articuno (1/40 chance), then his Zapdos missed with Thunder. As such, Starmie swept his whole team - my team took no damage in the battle. A rather anticlimactic way to complete the Emerald Frontier...

It was only a few weeks ago that I started breeding my Frontier mons from scratch, now I finally have all 7 Gold Symbols:


My next goal is to finally make a serious attempt at getting the one Gold Print I'm missing in the 4th-gen Frontier: the dreaded Factory.

 

[Kommo-o]

Been keeping this on hold for a while since I've been waiting for a time to finally reach a notable benchmark and that happened today. I am glad to announce that GUCCI GANG is now at 50 Tournament wins at the Battle Dome, Singles, on retail Emerald.

Picture Proof on original retro-smoothness

 

[DrDimentio]

Updating my ongoing Battle Pyramid streak (Open Level, retail) to 140 floors:


In every other facility I kept going past the Gold Symbols until a loss, but in this case my goal was just to clear all 20 different rounds and then stop. It was as easy as I expected. My team once again varied depending on the round:

Team

Starmie @ Lum Berry / Shell Bell
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 30/16/27/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Slaking @ Choice Band
Ability: Truant
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 30/31/29/19/31/31
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Beam

Salamence @ Lum Berry / Shell Bell
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

The above 3 Pokemon were used in most rounds, but I also used the following for some rounds where they had a better matchup with the wild Pokemon:

Metagross @ Choice Band / Lum Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 148 HP / 244 Atk / 16 Def / 6 SpD / 96 Spe
IVs: 31/31/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Rest
- Aerial Ace

Latios @ Lum Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
IVs: 7/9/12/31/25/17
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt

Round 20 (Normal-types) was the toughest one for my team - would've been easier if I had access to a Gengar. For that round I mainly led with Metagross, often switching to Salamence for the Intimidate and Earthquake avoid. However, even after that round I still have plenty of Revives, Max Revives, Hyper Potions and Lum Berries, so this streak could potentially go on almost forever if I wanted it to. But this facility is too tedious to justify continuing...

Also, my round 15 rematch with the boss Brandon was just as lucky as the Gold Symbol battle: First his Articuno missed 2 Blizzards on my Starmie, then his Zapdos missed Thunder again, and finally his Moltres' BrightPowder again failed to stop Starmie's Surf.

 

[submenceisop]

Reporting an ongoing streak of 105 at the Battle Tower with Mence, Skarmory, Umbreon. I'm going to update it when I lose.
Team building process
Salamence is usually my lead (change it to Skarmory on the Anabel round) which provides intimidate support against mixed attackers and allows me to immediately set up on passive threats(ex double team venu, shuckle). My Salamence is rather bulky, as it has 180 hp evs, which allows Salamence to hit 193 hp, a really nice 16+1 leftovers number. It has 140 speed evs for outspeeding Adamant Heracross and Modest Suicune and outspeeds the entire tower at +1. The rest is dumped into attack, which is the bare minimum for getting 2koes against Skarmory.

Here's the damage calc
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 170 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (50.4 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 188+ Atk Salamence Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Skarmory: 158-186 (47.3 - 55.6%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO

The Skarmory spread is AdeAde's, with Skarm being the phaser, defensive pivot against physical attackers and provides torment support. There's enough bulk to tank non stab electric and fire moves if you don't get crit.

Umbreon is the special wall on the team, with only 2 weaknesses, which are checked by Skarmory and Salamence. You can go Blissey here, but the main reason why I use Umbreon is because of Wish support and the reliable accuracy reducing move in sand attack. Wish support is really nice because it isn't too difficult to pass a wish to Skarm and Mence. I again invested 180 hp for 193 hp (16+1 leftovers number), 166 speed to out pace the 105's (Nidoking+ friends), with the remainder in special bulk). It's been pretty reliable for me, although the drop in bulk from Blissey is rather noticeable. It also doesn't have natural cure, so you need Lum berry not to get crippled by status.

Charizard calc- 252+ SpA Charizard Fire Blast vs. 180 HP / 164+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 168-198 (44.6 - 52.6%)
Edit: Going to be switching out Umbreon for Blissey from 105 onwards. Umbreon isn't bulky enough. Also will be running 196 attack as per Kommo-O.

Strategy: Cripple/PP stall to allow Mence to set up.

Potential threats
Avoid Status/Don't lose Mence.
Charizard, Ampharos
Magmar, Electabuzz, Golduck (Mixed Cross Chop users)
Roar users
Articuno 1(has 2 ice moves and roar)
Mixed Fighting Types (Machamp, Hariyama)
Lives a +6 hit= Suicune, Aero, Skarmory, Zapdos/ Regice
Clear Body- Mixed Metagross, Regice, Quick Claw Regirock/ Registeel
Dangerous water types: Lapras, Whiscash 4, Haxrein, Dewgong

https://pokepast.es/492b95fb24ae24dd

86 bright powder sets/ 86 quick claw/ 49 Fully Evolved Focus Band users
+6 200+ Atk Salamence Hidden Power Flying vs. 255 HP / 255+ Def Regice: 188-222 (100.5 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Electabuzz Ice Punch vs. 56 HP / 36 SpD Salamence: 160-192 (90.3 - 108.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Metagross Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 188 SpD Skarmory: 140-166 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Update: Reached 182 wins. I actually lost my streak 4x (Thunder punch Metagross , Whiscash 4, Focus punch Electabuzz, Breloom( effect spores me) in the 100s, so it's taken a week to build it back up. Since then I have made some adjustments. First, I am running more special defense on Skarm to avoid the 2ko from Metagross 6&7. Obviously the trade off is that Skarm is frailer on the physical side which can be a problem when having to eat boosted rock slides. In fact, the lack of a rock resistance makes crits particularly nasty versus Armaldo/Marowak( who are turn 1 whirlwind targets) and makes matchups versus Ruin Maniacs very difficult (hard to find a set up target).

252 SpA Metagross Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 188 SpD Skarmory: 140-166 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Umbreon has been swapped out for Blissey, who is superior in every way. Blissey hard counters special attackers, provides growl support which helps pp stall, checks mixed attackers and decreases struggle damage for Mence to set up.

Regarding Mence, I have made huge adjustments. I am still running 196 attack evs with the Adamant Nature, as Jolly is too weak to be viable. I have changed the spread to 220 speed evs, which out speeds Electabuzz 2, up to Houndoom. I definitely knew that I wanted to outspeed Electabuzz 2 at minimum, with everything faster than Mence not being ohkoed by an unboosted hit anyway and being checked by Skarm/Bliss.
The remainder went into 56 hp and 36 special defense, which ironically isn't much frailer on the special side than 172 hp. Obviously, the lack of hp investment makes it less practical to run leftovers (although this one still has the 16+1 leftovers number), so I am changing the item to lum berry, which helps for accidental status. The trade off is that you completely lack recovery, so you only really get one shot to sweep, which is a huge problem against roar users. I still plan to finish this run until I lose, but I wouldn't recommend running only Mence as your source of offence. Takes far too much support to set up and everyone and their mother has ice coverage. Even with torment, growl and t-wave support, Mence can still find it difficult to make it onto the field safely, which is a problem in itself. It's only 100% safe to set up on special attackers, who are at -6 attack while being paralyzed or against targets without any moves to hit you (double team spammers, mono grass mons(not that hard to stall out sludge bombs).

Also Electabuzz 3 completely takes a dump over this team. It's faster than Mence and threatens the 2ko on Blissey and ohko's Skarm. I narrowly avoided a loss to it with Blissey dodging cross chops+ growling it to stall out it's moves.
252 SpA Electabuzz Ice Punch vs. 56 HP / 36 SpD Salamence: 160-192 (90.3 - 108.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
https://pokepast.es/4ceba8179b932fdc

Edit: Got to 210. I was considering a Latios, Suicune, Snorlax team too, but I'm done. Don't really feel like playing.

 

[N1c69]

Hi. I reached streak 59 in battle arena lv50 on retail cart with the team below. I lost by my own mistake and hope to improve the team and reach for higher. The three turn limit makes it easier to deal with tower hax like evasion abusers and OHKO users.



Salamence

Jolly, max attack and speed ev's,

28 speed IV, 31 attack, 25-31 others

Choice band

Aerial ace

Earthquake

Brick break

Rock slide



Latios

Bold, max SpA and speed

Perfect IVs (ruby battle tower glitch)

Lum berry

Psychic

Thunder bolt

Ice beam

Memento



Kingdra

Lonely, max attack and speed

20-31 each IV

Left overs

Dragon dance

Substitute

Body slam

Surf



The strategy was all out offence relying on CB Salamence and Latios to take out the majority of the opponents team. This worked well since the two can 2HKO a lot of mons.



Salamence is Jolly mostly because I got lucky when breeding, but the added speed is nice, especially since battle frontier mons don't always run max speed. Its speed stat is 166. Soon I'll breed for a 31 speed IV but 28 ties with gengar 1 and outspeeds gengar (2-8), Flygon, Salamence, Lati@s, Starmie, etc). The only pokemon that outspeeds it and can KO is Starmie 3,4 and maybe Aerodactyl, so with a choice band and good coverage this Salamence set does exactly what is meant to do: outspeed and damage the opponent. Slaking would work and I may sub it in over Salamence when I breed one, however Salamence has perks: intimidate helps Latios and itself tank hits, stab aeial ace helps with evasion and you can attack every turn.



Since there are only three turns before either Salamence KOs or is KO'd, the opponent has little time to set up or heal. This allows Latios to come in and finish off whatever KO'd Salamence, then wall break the next mon. Latios has great coverage with the above moves and can win most 1v1s especially when the battle is limited to 3 turns. If something that latios can't beat shows up, the strategy is to deal as much damage before using memento.



If memento has been used it is likely that at least 1 mon (usually 2) has been KO'd considering Salamence and Latios speed, move coverage, and the limited turns the opponent has to set up. This leaves Kingdra against a memento'd opponent. Depending on what the opponent is likely to do Kingdra can either use substitute to avoid status, stall, set up, wait for full paralysis with body slam or attack. This was the first time I used this set on a team and on paper it seems to work well.





How I lost

Salamence KO'd first mon (can't remember which one)

Regice is sent out

KO's Salamence (Salamence damages)

Latios uses psychic for 15-20% (don't remember)

Regice uses ice beam

Latios survives on like 1% and uses memento



Nothing happens because of clear body... If I used psychic again instead I may have caused enough chip damage for kingdra to KO but instead this happened:



Kingdra uses body slam

Regice uses thunderwave



Another moment where if I used substitute I may have been able to rely on the previous chip damage caused by latios or may have been able to stall out regice while recovering with lefties. Although Idk if I could've guessed it would choose twave over ice beam- doesn't cpu choose which ever move deals the most damage? Kingdra could also win here if it paralyzed with body slam. May require a lot luck against a regice but is easier against a memento'd opponent.



Regice 2 or 3HKO's Kingdra while taking little damage from body slam. It may have used rest but either way without a sub or a DD boost Kingdra would lose to the next mon.





Improvements



The team strat works well but there are some things I want to tweak and some calcs I want to check.

Slaking and Tauros may work better than Salamence but I may keep Salamence for its coverage and lack of truant.

The Latios set can be improved in different ways. A modest or timid nature would be ideal but considering I would need to soft reset a million times to get it using the ruby glitch I don't think I try it any time soon. If I had another emerald I could RNG it but that is even harder than the ruby glitch and doesn't have perfect IV's. Tbh I'm just stoked I got bold over something like adamant. I may change the EVs to increase its defense which will make it very bulky with intimidate. I don't think too much can be done to aide its match up against regice unless I run light screen and sacrfice speed for SpD. Although I could replace Latios with Alakazam. Thunderwave or calm mind may be a better moves than memento.

Kingdra can be improved or replaced by another sweeper such as snorlax. I mostly bred this set to have substitute available to be inherited by kangaskhan and sub + DD for Lapras. Nonetheless Kindra can make great use of substitute with its above average speed and defenses, one weakness to dragon type moves which are rare and can be checked with ice beam, access to body slam and smoke screen allowing it to scout and provide extra turns to set up DD or rain dance. This set is a clone and the original has flail over body slam. I tried flail once in tower doubles and it is hard to pull off, but it has the potential to be a very strong move when on 1hp and have used DD. If I choose to keep Kingdra over another sweeper I may breed for another nature and change the EVs. Extra SpD will help against regice and water types (being neutral to boltbeam is handy). I have a sassy horsea with octazooka (another cool niche) I may try. Sassy may even work with DD- after enough DD boost the sassy speed drop won't matter so much. Another option is a serious nature with evs equally distributed between stats. This is my go to for quick and easy pokemon sets but has proved helpful. No drop in offenses or defenses helps with mixed offenses and defences which works well for mons like Kingdra, Zapdos, Swampert. All this would be unessassary if Kingdra had better physical moves, maybe hp ground or fight. However surf and ice beam can KO key threats like dragons and rhydon and can be used along side return/body slam/flail to hit gengar. So many calcs to make on best natures, evs, moves.

Ps sorry for the bad pic, my phone camera is broken so I can take another

 

[Yak Attack]

So I've heard that the thing that keeps streaks from going in the Battle Tower are Quick Claw Sheer Cold, so I thought, "Why not make a team centered around Sturdy?"
So here's my team:
Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
The main member of the team, used to combat Walrein with great efficiency. Salac + Endure is used in situations where you could net the KO anyway, but want a speed boost.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Tail
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Explosion
Standard Curse Steelix is gone, so this thing just gets four attacks. Has a favorable matchup against most physical threats. If you don't have a good matchup, just explode and switch.

Gyarados @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 Atk / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Hidden Power [Flying]
- Earthquake
- Surf
This tech Gyarados covers the Fire and Ground weaknesses pretty well. Meant to get a favorable switch in and dish out the damage afterwards.
I haven't tested out this team yet, thoughts?

 

[TheNegotiator]

So I've heard that the thing that keeps streaks from going in the Battle Tower are Quick Claw Sheer Cold, so I thought, "Why not make a team centered around Sturdy?"
So here's my team:
Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
The main member of the team, used to combat Walrein with great efficiency. Salac + Endure is used in situations where you could net the KO anyway, but want a speed boost.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Tail
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Explosion
Standard Curse Steelix is gone, so this thing just gets four attacks. Has a favorable matchup against most physical threats. If you don't have a good matchup, just explode and switch.

Gyarados @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 Atk / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Hidden Power [Flying]
- Earthquake
- Surf
This tech Gyarados covers the Fire and Ground weaknesses pretty well. Meant to get a favorable switch in and dish out the damage afterwards.
I haven't tested out this team yet, thoughts?

Skarmory is the best sturdy pokemon by far. It's also worth noting that Gengar is immune to every OHKO move except Sheer Cold.

 

[submenceisop]

So I've heard that the thing that keeps streaks from going in the Battle Tower are Quick Claw Sheer Cold, so I thought, "Why not make a team centered around Sturdy?"
So here's my team:
Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
The main member of the team, used to combat Walrein with great efficiency. Salac + Endure is used in situations where you could net the KO anyway, but want a speed boost.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Tail
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Explosion
Standard Curse Steelix is gone, so this thing just gets four attacks. Has a favorable matchup against most physical threats. If you don't have a good matchup, just explode and switch.

Gyarados @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 Atk / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Hidden Power [Flying]
- Earthquake
- Surf
This tech Gyarados covers the Fire and Ground weaknesses pretty well. Meant to get a favorable switch in and dish out the damage afterwards.
I haven't tested out this team yet, thoughts?

The first main flaw with your team is your relative lack of speed and bulk. Your team is really slow, with Gyarados being the fastest member of your team, which is a problem when you are unboosted. Gyarados and Steelix actually is a solid combination, given that they resist each other's weaknesses, but if you plan to run these two together, you should run a defensive steelix torment set( which you can find here) or the band set. Your team also has a pretty large weakness to fighting types (many of whom carry a move that hits each member of your team super effectively. You can run Gyarados with DD chesto berry to help mitigate any chip damage or you can go substitute with leftovers or taunt/lum. Choose whichever one fits your play style the best. Also, don't run Hasty, run Adamant. As someone who has used DD Salamence(similar to Gyarados in a way, believe me when I tell you you need the power). Run Adamant with DD/HP/EQ with Adamant (max attack) and some speed (look at the speed tiers on page 1 and choose how fast you want to be before a DD). If you can get a Latios, that would be the ideal third member of your team instead of Magneton. There's a good spread a few pages back with Timid as the nature. Latios would provide speed control(only 3 mons faster than it) and would also destroy the fighting types that would cause you a lot of problems. You could also run Gengar as well, which would provide you with similar advantages+ great immunities, but is noticeably frailer than Latios. I would know because I've used Gengar in most of the facilities. Check my Battle Arena spread for reference. Just make sure not to run a 4 attack Gengar set. You should have destiny bond or Perish song as your fourth move(or even both which I have used).

Good luck.

Latios/ Steelix/Gyarados
Gengar/Steelix/Gyarados

 

[N1c69]

PP stalling, substitute are good options to combat OHKO moves that work with a variety of pokemon. Some of my fav mons I find do this well are sub morning sun Moltress, Sub for Latios or other sweepers.
Forretress is one of my fav sturdy pokemon with its access to zap cannon for water types, giga drain for Swampert/Rhydon, EQ, counter and support moves. I've been theory moning a special or CB Forretress to compensate for its low offensive stats.
I could see Aggron and Donphan working in tower too. Though Aggron is OHKO'd by just about every fight, ground, or water move, those are it's only weaknesses, and you can count on cpu choosing those attacks, giving you a free switch to a flying or levitate mon. Aggron was a big help for me against Spencer's Lapras. I haven't used Donphan in fronteir but could imagine its 120 base attack would come in handy.

 

[dgice]

So I've heard that the thing that keeps streaks from going in the Battle Tower are Quick Claw Sheer Cold, so I thought, "Why not make a team centered around Sturdy?"
So here's my team:
Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
The main member of the team, used to combat Walrein with great efficiency. Salac + Endure is used in situations where you could net the KO anyway, but want a speed boost.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Tail
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Explosion
Standard Curse Steelix is gone, so this thing just gets four attacks. Has a favorable matchup against most physical threats. If you don't have a good matchup, just explode and switch.

Gyarados @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 Atk / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Hidden Power [Flying]
- Earthquake
- Surf
This tech Gyarados covers the Fire and Ground weaknesses pretty well. Meant to get a favorable switch in and dish out the damage afterwards.
I haven't tested out this team yet, thoughts?

I really like the concept of running two sturdy pokemon because we know for certain that one sturdy pokemon can't wall all ohko users due to things like walrein 3 with surf. The most successful plan we've had is to roar them away with our sturdy and hope we can set up otherwise and that the health loss isn't a problem. I like that you can scout if it's walrein 2 with endure. I worry about magneton pulling it's weight as the frontier has many different kinds of threats but I would love for someone to try it and report any challenges.

Does surf actually change any matchups that a move like rest or double edge wouldn't? feels like weakness wise it has a lot of overlap with earthquake.

 

[Yak Attack]

I really like the concept of running two sturdy pokemon because we know for certain that one sturdy pokemon can't wall all ohko users due to things like walrein 3 with surf. The most successful plan we've had is to roar them away with our sturdy and hope we can set up otherwise and that the health loss isn't a problem. I like that you can scout if it's walrein 2 with endure. I worry about magneton pulling it's weight as the frontier has many different kinds of threats but I would love for someone to try it and report any challenges.

Does surf actually change any matchups that a move like rest or double edge wouldn't? feels like weakness wise it has a lot of overlap with earthquake.

A glaring weakness I saw with my team was its weakness to Surf Walrein. I've revised it a bit.

V.2

Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
Same Magneton set. Can take advantage of a situation where you know you'll KO with Endure to get the speed boost. Metal Sound is for specially defensive mons.

Aggron @ Choice Band
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Brick Break
- Earthquake
- Aerial Ace
This replaces Steelix as it can OHKO Walrein 4 with CB HP Rock (and outspeed). Can do significant damage to Fighting types with CB Aerial Ace. Not sure what the speed tiers are, so it could maybe run more in Def and less in Spe?

Gengar @ Petaya Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 80 SpD / 176 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Fire Punch
- Perish Song / Explosion
the necessary fighting and ground resist, it can also do a significant amount of damage to Walrein with Thunderbolt. Pinch berry is useful along with Gengar's frailty. also is immune to 2/3 ohko moves. honestly not sure about perish song, I'd much rather be running Explosion, could someone explain why Perish Song is good?

 

[submenceisop]

A glaring weakness I saw with my team was its weakness to Surf Walrein. I've revised it a bit.

V.2

Magneton @ Salac Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 80 Def / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Thunderbolt
- Endure
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Metal Sound
Same Magneton set. Can take advantage of a situation where you know you'll KO with Endure to get the speed boost. Metal Sound is for specially defensive mons.

Aggron @ Choice Band
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Brick Break
- Earthquake
- Aerial Ace
This replaces Steelix as it can OHKO Walrein 4 with CB HP Rock (and outspeed). Can do significant damage to Fighting types with CB Aerial Ace. Not sure what the speed tiers are, so it could maybe run more in Def and less in Spe?

Gengar @ Petaya Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 80 SpD / 176 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Fire Punch
- Perish Song / Explosion
the necessary fighting and ground resist, it can also do a significant amount of damage to Walrein with Thunderbolt. Pinch berry is useful along with Gengar's frailty. also is immune to 2/3 ohko moves. honestly not sure about perish song, I'd much rather be running Explosion, could someone explain why Perish Song is good?

I've used Perish Song for the double team and CM rest spammers such as Suicune, Raikou, Entei, Gardevoir. It's also good for pressuring curse users and focus punch users( Focus punch/double team Golem, double team curse Miltank, double team shuckle, who will outstall your team. It can be a pain in the ass to try and break through these things. Explosion is not good. I've used it before and you need significant attack investment to make it work. If you want to force the double down, Destiny bond is what you want to use. Also there's no reason to be running so little speed. Gengar should be running 220 speed evs to outspeed as much as possible.

 

[iSoNkei]

Hello again it's been a while... I had some busy weeks but I finally managed to beat the Battle Tower. I was pretty lazy and I wanted to use a simple team both in terms of playstyle and breeding and since I already owned a Slaking the team I used was identical to the Dance Macabre Adedede so big thank's to him for crafting and sharing this amazing team!
I won't go into much details since most thing are analytically described in his post! Honestly it is a killer team and managed to get the gold symbol on my 4th try and the losses were actually only due to extreme HAX.

This journey comes to an end and I am really happy to have managed to get all the Gold Symbols. As I stated in my first post won't go for extreme streaks but will toy around with some unorthodox teams for the shake of it. Thank you everyone for this amazing thread it's been invaluable to me@

I am thinking totry out some Tower Doubles I had a brief search about teams and couldn't find anyone proposing some Skill Swap teams. Do you think it's worth a try? Obvious candidates are Slaking of course but I had be theorizing about maybe Skill Swapping Huge Power to something or maybe Serene Grace.

 

[wtset]

Hello again it's been a while... I had some busy weeks but I finally managed to beat the Battle Tower. I was pretty lazy and I wanted to use a simple team both in terms of playstyle and breeding and since I already owned a Slaking the team I used was identical to the Dance Macabre Adedede so big thank's to him for crafting and sharing this amazing team!
I won't go into much details since most thing are analytically described in his post! Honestly it is a killer team and managed to get the gold symbol on my 4th try and the losses were actually only due to extreme HAX.

This journey comes to an end and I am really happy to have managed to get all the Gold Symbols. As I stated in my first post won't go for extreme streaks but will toy around with some unorthodox teams for the shake of it. Thank you everyone for this amazing thread it's been invaluable to me@

I am thinking totry out some Tower Doubles I had a brief search about teams and couldn't find anyone proposing some Skill Swap teams. Do you think it's worth a try? Obvious candidates are Slaking of course but I had be theorizing about maybe Skill Swapping Huge Power to something or maybe Serene Grace.

Congratutlations on getting all gold symbols! Actaeon has posted about a Skill Swap Tower Doubles Team. If you want to get into Tower Doubles you should definitely check out all his posts on the first few pages of this thread, as he's sharing some really well thought-out ideas there (he even mentions that one of the teams got to the tower reset after 1792 battles, way before anyone else was talking about it).

 

[Actaeon]

Thanks for the mention and sorry for my absence in general. I have been reading all of your posts though! Nice to see my Doubles teams are still looked into. After some IRL issues and releasing a YT channel about passionate mathematics (see 'Tycho's Wiskunde' on YT, although it's in Dutch), I have finally planned to do the live streak I was talking about with the monotype teams. I was thinking Saturday around 12.00, GMT +2 on either YT or Discord. What do you think?

 

[Aldoo]

Hi there! I've been trying out everyone's teams and badly making my own in the Frontier for the last month or so, and finally created a team that gave me some good results! It's similar to the teams dominating the Dome Singles leader board, however, I think this team is a little more hax-proof with the addition of Skarmory. As you can tell by how long this post is, I have a lot of time on my hands right now. Here's my team for Level 50 Dome (on emulator), with 52 wins.

The Team

GRAMMY (Skarmory) (M)
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Ability: Sturdy
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Calm Nature
- Protect
- Thief
- Whirlwind
- Sand Attack

HELLO (Suicune) @ Leftovers
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 140 HP / 124 Def / 244 Spe
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Timid Nature
- Protect
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Surf

KONG (Slaking) (M) @ Choice Band
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Ability: Truant
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Adamant Nature
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Beam

Strategy

The general strategy is very simple. Either lead with Skarmory, or if there are 2 pokemon that Suicune cannot handle (see threatlist below), send out Slaking. Over 90% of games can be simply covered by Skarmory and Suicune with very few issues. Scout the set with protect (or whirlwind if it's obviously a bad matchup), thief if there's a quick claw, or sand-attack away to help Suicune get setup. The strategy with Slaking is pretty simple, as everyone knows. Don't misclick, get the kill, switch (or stay in if you can take the hit or it's a positive matchup for Suicune). Hyper-beam is there for Gyarados and Salamence which intimidate me, just taking them out of DE range.

Threats

Pokemon faster than Suicune
None of these are directly very threatening to Slaking outside of some terrible luck, however, can be a problem as they force Slaking to be chosen in situations which are otherwise unfavourable e.g. QC Rhydon which is easily handled by Skarmory and Suicune.
Setup Pokemon
While some setup pokemon are harmless, such as SD users with only one attacking move that can be easily stalled out, dragon dance and agility are the two most dangerous moves for this team. Can usually be whirlwinded out by Skarmory, however, can be very dangerous and sweep if not handled correctly (see the loss for an unfortunate example).
Baton Passers
See above, however, can pass the boosts to even more dangerous pokemon. My Shedinja team got destroyed by a CM+ BP Espeon before I'd marked it as dangerous.
Water Absorb
Unfortunately, even a team designed to cripple quick claw users isn't immune to Lapras 8. A Lapras 8 lead with Water Absorb, though easily handled, can only be killed by PP stalling and thus leaves the team useless against whatever is behind it. Lapras is the sole reason that my Slaking is Adamant nature, when most others in the dome are Jolly. While the additional speed would be nice against faster enemies, the OHKO with Double-Edge is so valuable against Lapras.
Electric Types
A core facing 90% of games with a shared weakness is not fantastic, however, thunderbolts and thunders can be stalled out.

Experimentation

The team has gone several modifications, with varying levels of success. It initially started with Adedede's team, as I enjoyed using Destiny Bond Gengar in the Battle Tower. I found that I was either sweeping with Suicune (it's seriously so good), or taking a massive risk with hoping Slaking could kill and Gengar could get a Destiny Bond off. Admittedly, that happened the majority of the time, but it felt risky, and it proved so when Lapras 8 reared its ugly head.

So the next step was to find a solution to the Lapras problem, and possibly Water Absorb pokemon too. And the obvious choice was, of course

Shedinja.

I loved using Shedinja - seeing it on a team preview made me happy every time. It ran a pretty standard set of SD, Protect, Shadow Ball and Toxic (previously Silver Wind, and dropping this actually ended the run). It may not be the guaranteed kill that DB Gengar offered, but it walled the dangerous Lapras sets to Slaking/Suicune and at the very least gave it a reasonably free switch-in. I actually got to 48 wins with this team, but it felt so incredibly weak I decided not to even post it. Seeing the lati twins felt like a guaranteed loss as every set hard countered at least one team member.

I realised Suicune was carrying me through the vast majority of my battles, and my Shedinja, as wonderful as it was, wasn't even proving effective in stopping the OHKO users that threatened it. So I scoured every team report posted for a solution to my team, but everything felt vulnerable. Choice band tricking seemed a good supportive option for DD users that were also a problem for the team, but QC + OHKO felt like too big a risk to ignore. Sturdy seemed the only option, and I couldn't find any frequently used pokemon other than Skarmory and Steelix. I tried some random sets with these, but couldn't come up with anything I liked. Toxic and Chesto Skarmory felt too weak to go through any threats well, Steelix was great on exploding on the threats when they were the leads but lost to anything with a water move which isn't great when Lapras is on most water trainer teams. So I tried a Skarmory set used in Adedede's Battle Tower record team, just to see how a support pokemon would go.

TONY (Skarmory) (M) @ Chesto Berry
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Ability: Sturdy
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Bold Nature
- Protect
- Torment
- Whirlwind
- Rest

Unfortunately, it was entirely useless for the team. Whirlwind could phase out bad sets scouted by protect, but tormenting most opponents were useless, and Rest was used exactly 0 times in about 20 battles with it. So I checked Skarmory's moveset, scouring for anything useful that could possibly help the team. Toxic could be useful, but not really. Setting Skarmory up would be useless as it couldn't damage anything. But then I found Thief, and everything changed. Suddenly, Suicune's greatest weakness was nothing but an inconvenience. I also added Mud Shot, thinking that accuracy drops couldn't hurt. I replaced this with Sand-Attack after I almost killed a heracross trying to PP stall it, and I didn't want to switch Suicune into a +6 attack. Then I learned it hit flying types too which is nice (but also why GameFreak).

The last issue was Dragon Dance, which Skarmory or Suicune couldn't check. I tried using a max SpA Latios instead of Slaking, however, this was still leaving me vulnerable against Lapras which I couldn't OHKO but was forced to bring it in on, especially with QC Ice Beams. It also had the same problem as Slaking where I'd be forced to bring it even if the other two pokemon were bad matchups. I decided that an Adamant Slaking would better handle the biggest threats to the team, while also still being the best pokemon for Dome.

The Loss

When I saw this matchup, I had a bad feeling about it. Something just felt off, like it was the perfect combination of elements to ruin my day. Lapras, Salamence and Gyarados. One dancer spells trouble, two is a problem. Three is just excessive, even if Lapras only has one set with it, but Water Absorb doesn't help. Intimidate is also a problem which makes Gyarados and Salamence dicey. I take Slaking and Suicune, as Skarmory is useless without Suicune.

Turn 1 was the worst turn imagineable, and there's nothing that this team could do to prevent it. I click Double-Edge (actually a misplay, because the 81% chance to OHKO is lower than Hyper Beam's 90% change to hit, but I didn't actually realise this at the time) and it misses. There are two Salamence with Brightpowder and of course, these are two of the 3 sets with Dragon Dance. I thought my best chance from there was that I switch into Suicune, it uses Double-Edge and gets a critical hit, giving me a free switch into Slaking. Even with a crit, it's only a 31% chance of OHKOing Suicune. In hindsight, I probably had a better chance if I'd stayed in with Slaking and Salamence went for another DE. Regardless, a Dragon Dance would guarantee that I lose. The AI does the easiest win condition ever and uses DD. I have no choice but to switch and try and kill it ASAP with Slaking, and it Dragon Dances again just to rub it in. I now need it to Dragon Dance again, but it's a guaranteed OHKO even with Aerial Ace. Suicune's demise is inevitable after that, and the run is finished.

I'll try to post a video later once I figure out how!

Proof

If anyone has suggestions for the team, I'd love to hear them! Thanks for reading, and hopefully some of you find the team interesting!

 

[potatobagel]

Hello everyone!

I just discovered this thread and I thought I'd post my records and teams since I actually got all Gold Symbols about a year ago on cartridge. I just started playing Emerald again, I'm trying to get a 100 streak on the Battle Tower so I can get a Gold Shield to decorate my hideout lol. Anyways here are the teams!

Battle Tower

Salamence @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 60
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 22 HP / 28 Spe
- Aerial Ace
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Brick Break

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Level: 60
EVs: 168 HP / 252 Def / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 15 HP / 7 Atk / 10 Def / 4 SpA / 17 SpD
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Calm Mind

Snorlax @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Immunity
Level: 60
EVs: 200 HP / 52 Def / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
IVs: 20 HP / 23 Atk / 26 SpA / 30 SpD / 29 Spe
- Body Slam
- Curse
- Rest
- Shadow Ball

This Suicune is AWFUL lmao. I basically just used the first one I caught on Colo and I didn't realize how bad its IVs were until after finishing the game and I wasn't going to reset. One thing that's notable about my run was that I didn't use Latios at all, since I basically assumed it would have a bad nature/stats (I have no idea how to manipulate RNG), so I had tried a bunch of teams before settling on this one. Still, even a bad CM Suicune is pretty darn good; my average trainers cleared bumped up from the high 40s/low 50s to basically always being on streak 9 or 10 with this team.

Battle Arena

Metagross @ Quick Claw
Ability: Clear Body
Level: 60
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 26 Atk / 30 SpA / 13 SpD
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Explosion


Starmie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Illuminate
Level: 60
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 29 Atk / 12 Def / 26 SpA / 23 Spe
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic


Salamence @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 60
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 22 HP / 28 Spe
- Aerial Ace
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Brick Break

Arena is probably my favorite of the frontiers, because it's quick and it punishes the AI for being passive. Starmie is a must IMO for every team here; I can't think of a better offensive Water type to fill the all-important middle slot. I've tried Slaking for my last slot over Salamence for my last slot and I've realized two hits from Salamence is usually better than only one from a Slaking, plus Salamence has more resistances and STAB Aerial Ace, which is very useful here.

Battle Palace

Metagross @ Quick Claw
Ability: Clear Body
Level: 60
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 26 Atk / 30 SpA / 13 SpD
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Protect

Swampert @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
Level: 60
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 21 HP / 23 Atk / 27 Def / 16 SpD / 28 Spe
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Earthquake
- Protect

Zapdos @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 232 SpD
Docile Nature
IVs: 19 HP / 12 Atk / 26 SpA / 23 SpD / 21 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Drill Peck
- Toxic
- Rest

Palace is definitely the hardest of all the frontiers, since it's so luck based. My thought process was to give Metagross and Swampert Protect to try to cover at least 2 of the attack categories, so even if they weren't attacking they wouldn't be a punching bag. Even though it had bad IVs, Zapdos was a great glue pokemon for this team, since it switches into all Water types and won't take over 30-something percent from a Water move. It was also very clutch against Spenser since survived a Blizzard and killed his Suicune with two Thunderbolts.

Battle Dome

Gengar @ Lum Berry
Ability: Levitate
Level: 60
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 23 HP / 28 Def / 23 SpA / 23 Spe
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Destiny Bond

Metagross @ Quick Claw
Ability: Clear Body
Level: 60
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 26 Atk / 30 SpA / 13 SpD
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Explosion

Swampert @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
Level: 60
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 21 HP / 23 Atk / 27 Def / 16 SpD / 28 Spe
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Earthquake
- Protect

Dome was the first frontier I finished, and it still took me a while since I was being cheap and trying to save BP in the beginning. Originally it was a physical Salamence with Lum Berry, which was pretty useful for getting through 30 something opponents, but this team really needed a special sweeper. Destiny Bond Gengar is great in the Dome since it gives you another suicider alongside Metagross which you can choose based upon your opponent. You'll almost always get a chance to pull it off too, since Gengar is faster than almost all your opponents pokemon (even sometimes Jolteon and Aerodactlyl, interestingly).


For the Battle Pike, I just used the same team as for Battle Tower, and I always ran into the room that had a "distinct aroma of Pokemon wafting around it." This room is usually the safest, since it's either wild pokemon which you can flee from, or a CPU battle + heal.

For Battle Pyramid, I used several combinations of the Pokemon above + Milotic (Surf, Ice Beam, Recover, Hypnosis) + Moltres (Flamethrower, Aerial Ace, Toxic, Rest), depending on what the theme was. My strategy was to have a lead pokemon that could either OHKO the wild pokemon on the floor or recover safely against the pokemon on the floor, and try and save my items for the 10th streak. For my 10th streak I brought Metagross, Salamence, and Swampert.

Battle Factory was just luck lol. I swapped for the CM Latias (Calm Mind, Dragon Claw, Thunder Wave, Recover) early on in my last streak which basically guaranteed the win, so I was really happy about that.


Anyways, all proof of streaks are attached. Thanks for reading this long post and I wish everyone best of luck on their streaks!

 

[Purple Kecleon]

In every other facility I kept going past the Gold Symbols until a loss, but in this case my goal was just to clear all 20 different rounds and then stop. It was as easy as I expected. My team once again varied depending on the round:

Slaking @ Choice Band
Ability: Truant
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 SpD
Nature: Adamant
IVs: 30/31/29/19/31/31
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Beam

Salamence @ Lum Berry / Shell Bell
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Atk / 10 Def
IVs: 31/30/30/15/29/30
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Rest

Late reply as I haven't checked this thread in a while, but nice job clearing all 20 rounds! My goal with this place was also just to clear 20 rounds; the only things that could really threaten a streak here would be something like a lucky Curselax.

Very interesting that you opted for Double-Edge over Return on a Slaking; I'd be interested in hearing your reasoning behind that. I could see why the extra power is better for other facilities like the Tower and Dome, but wouldn't the recoil be troublesome to deal with given that there is no healing in the Pyramid? Unless maybe you are not using Slaking much for wild Pokemon at all and only occasionally for Trainer battles.

 

[Actaeon]

So tomorrow is the big streak (I hope!). I will start at 11.00, gmt +2, on Discord with username Actaeon8182 and provide the (hopefully) 4.5-hour streak with live commentary. I will use the teams in an estimated order of solidity, starting with the really shaky ones. That way if I lose too quickly, I might have one or two restarts. I hope to see some of you!