Old Gens [GSC OU] Heracross

Ashbala

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:gs/heracross:

Heracross @ Leftovers
- Megahorn
- Seismic Toss / Curse
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

Heracross is a top bug in the GSC metagame with its powerful STAB Megahorn. Seismic Toss gives it consistent damage for Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory, but Curse lets Heracross deal with Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross, boosting its already good Attack and bulk. Its typing allows it to check offensive threats such as Nidoking, Machamp, and Tyranitar, assuming they aren't carrying a Fire-type move. Especially with Curse, Heracross struggles against Skarmory, Steelix, and Zapdos, so Self-Destruct Snorlax is a good partner to lure them in and wear them down to set up Heracross for success. Raikou makes a good partner to deal with Zapdos, while Heracross switches into Ground-type attacks comfortably.
 
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Megahorn, hitting Raikou, Tyranitar and Jynx
I think selecting pokemon here is too arbitrary. I would change it to "Megahorn, hitting anything hard that doesn't resist it".

Leftovers adds to Heracross' longevity.
I would leave that out. Leftovers is the standard item in GSC.

I would restructure the rest of the analysis.
Why does Starmie checking Machamp and Nidoking make it a good partner for Heracross as the latter already deals with them well as you said?
I would combine the explanation for Rest and Sleep Talk and mention that it makes Heracross one of the best checks for Nidoking (assuming it lacks a fire move which is usually the case), you can also list Tyranitar here if you want. I'd add that either of these three (Nido, Tar, Champ) could carry Fire Blast which changes the matchup (from dominant to unclear). Curse allows you to sometimes overcome Zapdos against which you can't make progress with just Seismic Toss, so listing Zapdos as target for Seismic Toss is misleading to me. You can also state that Curse is the better move against other Heracross (Curse Hera beats S-Toss Hera) as well as giving you better odds in fighting CurseLax.
Snorlax is used on all teams but you should talk about what kind of sets it can use on teams with Heracross. Body Slam, Earthquake, Curse and Self-Destruct is a common choice, especially with Curse Heracross, as often Skarmory is the only counter for that set on stall teams so you can lure it in and take it out. Seismic Toss Hera can overcome Skarmory as it gets 4HKO'ed if it switches in asleep after Rest without having burned any sleep turns, so a lure for it is less necessary (but still a good option regardless).
Raikou makes a good partner for Heracross (walls Zapdos while Hera can switch into ground attacks).
 

Ashbala

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I think selecting pokemon here is too arbitrary. I would change it to "Megahorn, hitting anything hard that doesn't resist it".


I would leave that out. Leftovers is the standard item in GSC.

I would restructure the rest of the analysis.
Why does Starmie checking Machamp and Nidoking make it a good partner for Heracross as the latter already deals with them well as you said?
I would combine the explanation for Rest and Sleep Talk and mention that it makes Heracross one of the best checks for Nidoking (assuming it lacks a fire move which is usually the case), you can also list Tyranitar here if you want. I'd add that either of these three (Nido, Tar, Champ) could carry Fire Blast which changes the matchup (from dominant to unclear). Curse allows you to sometimes overcome Zapdos against which you can't make progress with just Seismic Toss, so listing Zapdos as target for Seismic Toss is misleading to me. You can also state that Curse is the better move against other Heracross (Curse Hera beats S-Toss Hera) as well as giving you better odds in fighting CurseLax.
Snorlax is used on all teams but you should talk about what kind of sets it can use on teams with Heracross. Body Slam, Earthquake, Curse and Self-Destruct is a common choice, especially with Curse Heracross, as often Skarmory is the only counter for that set on stall teams so you can lure it in and take it out. Seismic Toss Hera can overcome Skarmory as it gets 4HKO'ed if it switches in asleep after Rest without having burned any sleep turns, so a lure for it is less necessary (but still a good option regardless).
Raikou makes a good partner for Heracross (walls Zapdos while Hera can switch into ground attacks).
checks implemented :blobthumbsup:
FriendOfMrGolem120 sry for the tag Earthworm Siatam (sry for the tag as well) can u qc on behalf of FriendofMr.Golem pls :)
 
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Siatam

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First off, disclaimer: I'm not actually on GSC OU QC team, but I'm sure EW has no problems deputizing me to QC this.

Rest is good recovery alongside Curse, helping Heracross maintain its longevity against Snorlax and Zapdos while Sleep Talk allows Heracross to potentially not waste turns asleep.
No reason to specify Zapdos and Snorlax. Rest increases Heracross's longevity against everything and Heracross is not frequently switching into Zapdos/Snorlax.

Curse Heracross has its advantages in being able to deal with Zapdos more effectively than a Seismic Toss one and also matches up better against Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross while Seismic Toss lets Heracross get consistent damage across the board in the face of Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory.
I would clarify that Curse Heracross vs. Zapdos is still likely a losing matchup for Hera, while SToss Hera vs. Zapdos is always losing.

Its typing allows it to check offensive threats such as Nidoking and Machamp, respectively, assuming they aren't carrying a Fire move. The given set struggles against Skarmory, Steelix, and Zapdos so Snorlax is a good partner to lure them in and whittle them down with Body Slam and Self Destruct and set up Heracross for success. Raikou makes a good partner for Heracross as it deals with Zapdos while Heracross switch into ground attacks from Nidoking, Steelix and Snorlax comfortably.
Include Tyranitar after Machamp. Replace "The given set" with just "Heracross". I would specifically call Snorlax "Self-Destruct Snorlax" since it is not a common move on Lax and it a very distinct set. No need to specify Nidoking/Steelix/Snorlax for ground attacks, many other mons use them as well.

Assuming this is OK to be QC'd by me, tag me after these are implemented.
 

Adeleine

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Heracross @ Leftovers
- Megahorn
- Seismic Toss / Curse
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

Heracross is a top bug in the GSC metagame with access to a powerful STAB in Megahorn, hitting anything hard that doesn't resist it. Curse tunes up Heracross' already good Attack and bulk to high levels. Rest is good recovery alongside Curse, helping Heracross increases its longevity while Sleep Talk allows Heracross to potentially not waste turns asleep. Curse Heracross has its advantages in being able to deal with Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross while Seismic Toss lets Heracross get consistent damage across the board in the face of Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory. its powerful STAB Megahorn. Seismic Toss gives it consistent damage for Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory, but Curse lets Heracross deal with Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross, boosting its already good Attack and bulk. (the excluded rest/sleep talk information is fairly self-explanatory and should be known to most readers) Its typing allows it to check offensive threats such as Nidoking, Machamp, (AC) and Tyranitar, (AC) respectively, assuming they aren't carrying a Fire-type move. Especially with Curse, Heracross struggles against Skarmory, Steelix, and Zapdos, (AC) so Self-Destruct Snorlax is a good partner to lure them in and whittle them down and wear them down to set up Heracross for success. Raikou makes a good partner for Heracross as it deals with Zapdos while Heracross switch into ground to deal with Zapdos, while Heracross switches into Ground-type attacks comfortably.

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Ashbala

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Heracross @ Leftovers
- Megahorn
- Seismic Toss / Curse
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

Heracross is a top bug in the GSC metagame with access to a powerful STAB in Megahorn, hitting anything hard that doesn't resist it. Curse tunes up Heracross' already good Attack and bulk to high levels. Rest is good recovery alongside Curse, helping Heracross increases its longevity while Sleep Talk allows Heracross to potentially not waste turns asleep. Curse Heracross has its advantages in being able to deal with Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross while Seismic Toss lets Heracross get consistent damage across the board in the face of Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory. its powerful STAB Megahorn. Seismic Toss gives it consistent damage for Pokemon such as Steelix and Skarmory, but Curse lets Heracross deal with Curse Snorlax and opposing Heracross, boosting its already good Attack and bulk. (the excluded rest/sleep talk information is fairly self-explanatory and should be known to most readers) Its typing allows it to check offensive threats such as Nidoking, Machamp, (AC) and Tyranitar, (AC) respectively, assuming they aren't carrying a Fire-type move. Especially with Curse, Heracross struggles against Skarmory, Steelix, and Zapdos, (AC) so Self-Destruct Snorlax is a good partner to lure them in and whittle them down and wear them down to set up Heracross for success. Raikou makes a good partner for Heracross as it deals with Zapdos while Heracross switch into ground to deal with Zapdos, while Heracross switches into Ground-type attacks comfortably.

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done and thx for the big help :psyglad:
 

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