Gen 1 Gyarados (OU) [QC 2/2] [GP 1/1]

[Plague von Karma]

Approved by Big Man Amaranth

[OVERVIEW]

Gyarados clings to RBY OU relevance thanks to a combination of massively inflated stats, expansive coverage in moves like Thunderbolt and Blizzard, and a unique typing that makes it the only Water-type immune to Ground, letting it switch in on a predicted Earthquake with impunity. That typing lets it synergize with Pokemon like Chansey, Gengar, and Jolteon, which not only appreciate this immunity, but also help patch up its own Thunderbolt weakness. Gyarados's attacking stats are extremely high, allowing it to achieve feats such as 2HKOing Tauros and 3HKOing Snorlax with Hydro Pump, letting it win against them one-on-one. Plus, it's bulky to the point that even a Thunderbolt from Starmie fails to OHKO it without a critical hit. It's not exactly slow relative to RBY OU either, outrunning Pokemon like Cloyster, Dragonite, and Victreebel while threatening them with its coverage. Overall, Gyarados can be seen as a battering ram that blows past paralyzed teams.

However, while it may have been a big threat in the early days of the generation, Gyarados fell out of favor due to its typing giving it some horrendous weaknesses. While its Ground immunity looks enticing to switch in on Rhydon, it also takes huge damage from Rock Slide: its bulk isn't as good as it looks. It also gets a quadruple weakness to Thunderbolt and neutrality to Blizzard and Psychic, making it hard for Gyarados to get in against the special attackers of the tier and forcing teams to make up for it. If paralyzed, this gets even worse, as Gyarados's lack of reliable recovery makes it very easy to wear down as is. Even offensively, because of a criminal lack of physical STAB moves, Gyarados struggles to damage specially bulky Pokemon like Chansey and Gengar. Finally, Gyarados has issues distinguishing itself from Lapras outside of its typing and superior Attack, which has the same coverage and higher overall bulk. As a result of these flaws, Gyarados is a very rare sight in RBY OU, often requiring extensive support from a dedicated team to function properly, but it remains a serviceable pick in the hands of an experienced player.

[SET]
name: Wallbreaker
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Thunderbolt / Blizzard
move 3: Body Slam
move 4: Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Gyarados's Hydro Pump is no joke, letting it potentially 3HKO Snorlax and 2HKO Tauros, winning against them one-on-one. However, it should be remembered that Hydro Pump's inconsistency can and will lead to wasted turns. Additionally, Thunderbolt Tauros can tear Gyarados apart anyway, so it must be scouted for first. Thunderbolt gives Gyarados a fighting chance against all Water-types, most importantly Starmie, Cloyster, Slowbro, and Lapras. However, Blizzard can be used to 3HKO Exeggutor instead, which Gyarados otherwise struggles against. Body Slam allows Gyarados to scout for switch-ins while threatening with paralysis, making use of its great Attack stat in the process; this also prevents Starmie, Alakazam, and Jolteon from switching in safely, and it allows Gyarados to pressure Chansey with significant damage on a critical hit. To top it off, Hyper Beam blows past non-Reflect Chansey and Alakazam, KOing them from 58% and 63.5% onwards, respectively, which Body Slam can set it up for.

Gyarados functions as an early- or mid-game wallbreaker that forces the opponent into making predictable decisions. It can be brought in early on a predicted Rest from Snorlax—a common sight in the early-game in RBY—then threaten it with Hydro Pump from there to force damage onto the opposing team. Gyarados's high Special and Water resistance make it one of the best Clamp absorbers in the game too, so it's very capable of switching in on a predicted one from Cloyster. Outside of this though, due to its typing, Gyarados's switch-in opportunities are quite limited, mostly being reserved to generic methods like pivoting with partial trapping, gambling on full paralysis, and Explosion. However, Gyarados's typing makes it well-equipped for double switching against Earthquake, allowing it to ease in Pokemon like Jolteon and Chansey if the situation calls for it.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Surf can be used if Hydro Pump's consistency is problematic, but this reduces Gyarados's immediate threat level. Worse still, it's not that much better than Blizzard in practice damage-wise, making it largely redundant. Thunder is a serviceable option to 2HKO Starmie and Slowbro, but its criminally low accuracy and lack of benefit outside of this make it mostly suboptimal.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Gengar**: Gengar can switch in on Gyarados and KO it with Thunderbolt if it's taken even a modicum of damage. However, it can't repeatedly switch into Hydro Pump, lest it get 3HKOed in the process.

**Chansey**: Chansey can effortlessly take Gyarados's special coverage; Reflect sets are also depressing to fight against. Additionally, Chansey's access to Thunderbolt and Thunder Wave makes it very risky for Gyarados to contest unless its moveset has already been successfully scouted. However, Gyarados can KO Chansey with Hyper Beam from 49.3% onwards if Reflect isn't active—even above 75% with Body Slam + Hyper Beam—which makes a paralyzed Chansey very possible to beat.

**Starmie and Lapras**: While it gets Thunderbolt, Gyarados struggles to deal with Starmie and Lapras due to their Hydro Pump resistance and ability to simply outdamage Gyarados with their own coverage. Starmie is of particular note because of its access to Thunder Wave, which firmly shuts down Gyarados. However, it has to risk Body Slam paralysis when switching in, which can potentially incapacitate it for the rest of the game.

**Electric-types and Electric-type coverage**: Any Pokemon with Thunderbolt is automatically a Gyarados check. Jolteon and Zapdos cleanly OHKO Gyarados with their STAB Thunderbolts. If Tauros and Persian run Thunderbolt, they can 2HKO Gyarados off the bat, the latter of which is arguably more threatening because of its high critical hit rate. However, all of these Pokemon would rather avoid taking direct damage, as they have mediocre bulk; they win one-on-one, but they are not reliable defensive answers by any means.

**Exeggutor**: If not running Blizzard, Exeggutor resists both of Gyarados's special coverage options and threatens with massive damage or sleep in return. Even with Blizzard in the equation, a Special drop from Psychic can instantly ruin any chance of Gyarados actually winning. However, Exeggutor doesn't want to take a Blizzard, as it often wants to save its bulk for more pressing matchups, particularly Rhydon and Snorlax.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353]]
- Quality checked by: [[Enigami, 233818], [Amaranth, 265630]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Finland, 517429]]

 

[Enigami]

In Other Options:
"Surf can be used if Hydro Pump's consistency is problematic, but this drastically reduces Gyarados's threat level, making Pokemon like Snorlax and Alakazam more than capable of walling it out with their recovery moves."

Alakazam takes more damage from Body Slam than it does Hydro Pump, Surf has no bearing on Gyarados' ability to threaten Alakazam.


Other than that, all I can think of is maybe explicitly mentioning Gyarados' synergy with Earthquake-weak Pokemon like Jolteon, Chansey and Gengar that in turn can help check Thunderbolt users in the Overview as part of the explanation of why you'd use it on a team. It's the number one reason to use Gyarados over its fellow Water competitors (atleast for me) but that isn't required if you feel that's inferred enough already.

Once the Surf/Alakazam thing is fixed QC 1/2 from me

Edit: Oh, and by the way:
Gyarados Surf vs. Snorlax: 133-157 (25.4 - 30%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
Snorlax can't wall out Gyarados even if Gyara brings Surf unless Gyara is paralyzed, since Lax will get caught in a Rest loop until Gyara lands a critical hit and breaks through RestLax

 

[Plague von Karma]

QC 1/2

Implemented both of these.

I specifically added this in regards to the second bit, as I strongly agree that I didn't emphasise it enough, especially when it's basically why you use it;

Gyarados clings to RBY OU relevance thanks to a combination of massively inflated stats, expansive coverage in moves like Thunderbolt and Blizzard, and a unique typing that makes it the only Water-type immune to Ground-type attacks, letting it switch in on a predicted Earthquake with impunity. That typing lets it synergize with Pokemon like Chansey, Gengar, and Jolteon, which not only appreciate this immunity, but also help patch up its own Thunderbolt weakness.

 

[Amaranth]

It also gets a quadruple weakness to Thunderbolt and neutrality to Blizzard, making it hard for Gyarados to get in against the special attackers of the tier and forcing teams to make up for it.

Neutrality to Psychic should also be mentioned here surely, if neutrality to Blizzard is worth mentioning then all sorts of stabs from Zams and Eggys and some Mies are also worth mentioning

Gyarados's Hydro Pump is no joke, letting it potentially 3HKO Snorlax and 2HKO Tauros, winning against them one-on-one. However, it should be remembered that Hydro Pump's inconsistency can lead to Gyarados taking unnecessary damage — sometimes even opening it up to Thunderbolt Tauros — so it should be used carefully.

TB Tauros tears Gyara apart regardless of whether it hits his pumps or not, I'd reword this entirely. Hydro Pump's inconsistency can make Gyarados waste turns, which is very bad on a pokemon with no means of healing status nor damage; it's very bad pretty much in any circumstance

Thunderbolt gives Gyarados a fighting chance against Pokemon like Cloyster and Lapras; it also helps against paralyzed Starmie, which gets KOed by Thunderbolt + Hyper Beam.

This is straight up untrue, TB+HB is 85.7-101.1% rolls, with the extra damage from HB being hardly noticeable at all on Mie (TB is 42.4-50.1, HB is 43.3 - 51). Just change it to "...a fighting chance against all Water-types, most importantly Starmie, Cloyster, Slowbro, and Lapras"

Body Slam allows Gyarados to scout for switch-ins while threatening with paralysis, making use of its great Attack stat in the process; this also prevents Starmie and Jolteon from coming in safely, which are otherwise some of its biggest threats.

I feel like the damage on Chansey should be mentioned here; HB is nice and all but 28-33 roll is no joke to set up for it. And as Enigami said the damage on Alakazam is good too. If you're really feeling like expanding the list of things, Slam also hits all the same threshholds on Jynx without risking misses - Pump does about 2% more but Slam still 3HKOs and sets up for Slam->HB kill all the same. Also Gyara's best option to hit Exeggutor if Blizzless.

Thus, a well-positioned Gyarados in the later stages of the game can be an effective win-con.

Dunno if I'd quite say this, I think you're hard pressed to call any pokemon that's outsped by Tauros and can't paralyze it nor Agility past it a true lategame wincon. It's more of a midgame wallbreaker tbh, takes down one or two mons and maybe forces the opponent to revenge it with their bull and take damage on it, but endgame cleanup? ehhh. Feedback applies to the whole paragraph before this as well

Thunder is a serviceable option to 2HKO Starmie, but its criminally low accuracy and lack of benefit outside of this make it mostly suboptimal.

Might as well mention 2HKO on Slowbro as well while we're at it

**Chansey**: Chansey can effortlessly take Gyarados's special coverage and takes surprisingly little damage from its physical attacks, which makes Reflect sets particularly depressing to fight against. Additionally, Chansey's access to Thunderbolt and Thunder Wave makes it very risky for Gyarados to contest it unless its moveset has already been successfully scouted. However, Gyarados can KO Chansey with Hyper Beam from 49.3% onwards if Reflect isn't active, which makes a paralyzed Chansey very possible to beat.

I really wouldn't call Chansey dying from >75% to SlamBeam "surprisingly little damage", Gyarados is pretty nasty at breaking through Chansey. But you are correct in that a healthy Chansey only has to fear a Slam crit switching in and is completely safe if it switches on any non-Slam attack, so it's a decent check.

**Starmie and Lapras**: While it gets Thunderbolt, Gyarados struggles to deal with Starmie and Lapras due to their Hydro Pump resistance and ability to simply outdamage Gyarados with their own coverage. However, Starmie should be careful if it's paralyzed, as it's 2HKOed by Thunderbolt + Hyper Beam. It also has to risk Body Slam paralysis when switching in, which can potentially incapacitate it for the rest of the game.

See above, the calc is a straight lie. Starmie is great into Gyarados, TWaving this mon is as good as OHKOing it and Gyarados can't outdamage Recovers at all (unless Thunder but then you're trying to hit consecutive 70%s through para)

**Electric-types and Electric-type coverage**: Any Pokemon with Thunderbolt is automatically a Gyarados check. Jolteon and Zapdos cleanly OHKO Gyarados with their STAB Thunderbolts, though Jolteon specifically doesn't want to take a Hydro Pump and is easily beaten if caught using Rest. If Tauros runs Thunderbolt, it can 2HKO Gyarados off the bat, though it doesn't want to stomach a Hydro Pump unless the Tauros mirror has been accounted for. Similarly, Persian can use Thunderbolt to 2HKO Gyarados, which is arguably more threatening because of its higher critical hit rate.

Would maybe move the quote about Jolteon to the end and change it to something like "all of these mons would rather avoid taking direct damage from Gyarados though, as they are not the sturdiest; they can win the 1-on-1 and their sweeps likely won't be stopped by a Gyarados, but they should not be treated as reliable defensive answers long term"

A lot of imprecisions to tweak out, will check again when implemented

 

[Plague von Karma]

A lot of imprecisions to tweak out, will check again when implemented

Implemented this to the best of my ability, thank you!

 

[Amaranth]

In set description, saying that body slam prevents chansey from switching in safely isn't quite right, she's fine if healthy bar Slam crit. Would reword that bit to say 'prevents Starmie, Alakazam, and Jolteon from switching in safely, and allows Gyarados to pressure Chansey with significant damage" or something to that effect.

In C&C Chansey, it's above 75%, not around 75%
In C&C Starmie and Lapras, I feel like stating that Starmie can severely shut down Gyarados's chances to do much with a single TWave is very important and the main reason why it'd be considered a strong check (it certainly doesn't win 1v1 if tboltless otherwise, but twave+recover make it beat gyara regardless of coverage choice)
In C&C Electrics, the sentences about Tauros and Jolteon not wanting to eat a pump are redundant with the ending sentence and should be cut


QC 2/2 when implemented

 

[Plague von Karma]

QC 2/2 when implemented

Sorted, ready for GP

 

[Adeleine]

Add/Fix Remove Comment
(AC): Add Comma

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[OVERVIEW]

Gyarados clings to RBY OU relevance thanks to a combination of massively inflated stats, expansive coverage in moves like Thunderbolt and Blizzard, and a unique typing that makes it the only Water-type immune to Ground-type attacks, letting it switch in on a predicted Earthquake with impunity. That typing lets it synergize with Pokemon like Chansey, Gengar, and Jolteon, which not only appreciate this immunity, but also help patch up its own Thunderbolt weakness. Gyarados's attacking stats are extremely high, allowing it to achieve feats such as 2HKOing Tauros and 3HKOing Snorlax with Hydro Pump, making it capable of winning letting it win against them one-on-one. Plus, it's bulky enough to the point that even a Thunderbolt from Starmie fails to OHKO it without a critical hit. It's not exactly slow relative to RBY OU either, outrunning Pokemon like Cloyster, Dragonite, and Victreebel while threatening them with its coverage. Overall, Gyarados can be seen as a battering ram that blows past paralyzed teams.

However, while it may have been a big threat in the early days of the generation, Gyarados fell out of favor due to its typing giving it some horrendous weaknesses. While its Ground immunity is enticing when wanting looks enticing to switch in on Rhydon, it also takes huge damage from Rock Slide: its defensive bulk isn't as good as it looks. It also gets a quadruple weakness to Thunderbolt and neutrality to Blizzard and Psychic, making it hard for Gyarados to get in against the special attackers of the tier and forcing teams to make up for it. If paralyzed, this gets even worse, as Gyarados's lack of reliable recovery makes it very easy to wear down as is. (removed hyphen) Even outside of this, offensively, (is this what you were thinking or otherwise checking out?) because of a criminal lack of physical STAB moves, Gyarados struggles to damage specially bulky Pokemon like Chansey and Gengar. Finally, Gyarados has issues distinguishing itself from Lapras outside of its typing and superior Attack, which has the same coverage and higher overall bulk. As a result of these flaws, Gyarados is a very rare sight in RBY OU, often requiring extensive support from a dedicated team to function properly, but it remains a serviceable pick in the hands of an experienced player.

[SET]
name: Wallbreaker
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Thunderbolt / Blizzard
move 3: Body Slam
move 4: Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Gyarados's Hydro Pump is no joke, letting it potentially 3HKO Snorlax and 2HKO Tauros, winning against them one-on-one. However, it should be remembered that Hydro Pump's inconsistency can and will lead to wasted turns. Additionally, Thunderbolt Tauros can tear Gyarados apart anyway, so it must be scouted for first. Thunderbolt gives Gyarados a fighting chance against all Water-types, most importantly Starmie, Cloyster, Slowbro, and Lapras. However, Blizzard can be used to 3HKO Exeggutor instead, which Gyarados otherwise struggles against. Body Slam allows Gyarados to scout for switch-ins while threatening with paralysis, making use of its great Attack stat in the process; this also prevents Starmie, Alakazam, and Jolteon from switching in safely, and it allows Gyarados to pressure Chansey with significant damage on a critical hit. To top it off, Hyper Beam acts as a way for Gyarados to blow blows past non-Reflect Chansey and Alakazam, KOing them from 58% and 63.5% onwards, respectively, which Body Slam can set it up for.

Gyarados functions as an early to early- or mid-game wallbreaker that forces the opponent into making predictable decisions. It can be brought in early on a predicted Rest from Snorlax—a common sight in the early-game in RBY—then (removed spaces around both mdashes) threaten it with Hydro Pump from there to force damage onto the opposing team. Gyarados's high Special and Water resistance makes it one of the best Clamp absorbers in the game too, so it's very capable of switching in on a predicted one from Cloyster. Outside of this though, due to its typing, Gyarados's switch-in opportunities are quite limited, mostly being reserved to generic methods like pivoting with partial trapping, gambling on full paralysis, and Explosion. However, Gyarados's typing makes it well-equipped for double switching against Ground-type coverage, Earthquake, (if "coverage" should be preserved as a contrary to stab EQs often coming from STAB rock slide users, you either can preserve it or write around that some other way) allowing it to ease in Pokemon like Jolteon and Chansey if the situation calls for it.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Surf can be used if Hydro Pump's consistency is problematic, but this reduces Gyarados's immediate threat level. Worse still, it's not that much better than Blizzard in practice damage-wise, making it largely redundant. Thunder is a serviceable option to 2HKO Starmie and Slowbro, but its criminally low accuracy and lack of benefit outside of this make it mostly suboptimal.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Gengar**: Gengar can switch in on Gyarados and KO it with Thunderbolt if it's taken even a modicum of damage. However, it can't repeatedly switch into Hydro Pump, lest it gets 3HKOed in the process.

**Chansey**: Chansey can effortlessly take Gyarados's special coverage; Reflect sets are also depressing to fight against. Additionally, Chansey's access to Thunderbolt and Thunder Wave makes it very risky for Gyarados to contest it unless its moveset has already been successfully scouted. However, Gyarados can KO Chansey with Hyper Beam from 49.3% onwards if Reflect isn't active—even above 75% with Body Slam + Hyper Beam—which (removed spaces around both mdashes) makes a paralyzed Chansey very possible to beat.

**Starmie and Lapras**: While it gets Thunderbolt, Gyarados struggles to deal with Starmie and Lapras due to their Hydro Pump resistance and ability to simply outdamage Gyarados with their own coverage. Starmie is of particular note because of its access to Thunder Wave, which firmly shuts down Gyarados. However, it has to risk Body Slam paralysis when switching in, which can potentially incapacitate it for the rest of the game.

**Electric-types and Electric-type coverage**: Any Pokemon with Thunderbolt is automatically a Gyarados check. Jolteon and Zapdos cleanly OHKO Gyarados with their STAB Thunderbolts. If Tauros or and Persian run Thunderbolt, they can 2HKO Gyarados off the bat, the latter of which is arguably more threatening because of its high critical hit rate. Additionally, However, all of these Pokemon would rather avoid taking direct damage, as their bulk is mediocre; they have mediocre bulk; they win one-on-one, (AC) and won't be stopped by Gyarados, but they are not reliable defensive answers by any means.

**Exeggutor**: If not running Blizzard, Exeggutor resists both of Gyarados's special coverage options and threatens with massive damage or sleep in return. Even with Blizzard in the equation, a Special drop from Psychic can instantly ruin any chance of Gyarados actually winning. However, Exeggutor doesn't want to take a Blizzard, as it often wants to save its bulk for more pressing matchups, particularly against Rhydon or Rhydon and Snorlax.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353]]
- Quality checked by: [[Enigami, 233818], [Amaranth, 265630]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Finland, 517429]]

this may proceed with one check, 1/1

 

[Plague von Karma]

1/1

Implemented and uploaded!