Gen 3 Ho-Oh (ADV Ubers) [QC 0/2]

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bruh

[OVERVIEW]

According to the Pokedex, at the end of a rainbow is a wall. Ho-Oh’s gargantuan bulk lets it come in and check nearly any attacker and cripple it one way or another. Be it by taking more than half of Latios’s health with Shadow Ball, burning Groudon and Snorlax with its signature Sacred Fire, or putting Kyogre on a timer with bad poison from Toxic, or by knocking Deoxys-A out by doing any form of damage, Ho-Oh forces your opponent to switch to specific highly exploitable checks that Ho-Oh itself can break through with the right set. Ho-Oh is also the biggest winner of having the sun active. Defensively, Thunder's accuracy is now a coin flip and Water-type moves have their power reduced. On the offensive end, Sacred Fire's power is boosted, further dissuading Steel-types who think they can enter on a predicted Shadow Ball. Surprise offensive and Choice Band sets can wreak havoc on the rest of your opponent's team due to them being incredibly wary of Sacred Fire.

Ho-Oh is also the biggest loser of having rain up. Ho-Oh usually invites the rain-setter Kyogre to enter the field and OHKO it with a STAB and rain boosted Water-type move. It also is sat on by Kyogre's common teammate Blissey who scares it out with the prospect of being statused. Latios and Mewtwo, which Ho-Oh easily checks while the sun is shining, now threatens Ho-Oh with perfect accuracy Thunder. Independent of rain, Ho-Oh is also susceptible to incredibly strong physical attacks like Explosion, Rock-type moves, or attacks from opposing Choice Band Ho-Oh. Using Ho-Oh also reveals that you likely have Groudon as a teammate, allowing your opponent to plan out how to defeat your team.


[SET]
name: Wall
move 1: Recover
move 2: Toxic
move 3: Sacred Fire
move 4: Shadow Ball / Whirlwind
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Impish
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Recover makes Ho-Oh hard to chip down. Toxic cripples any potential switch-ins to Ho-Oh by putting them on a timer to break through it. Sacred Fire pairs with Toxic for excellent neutral coverage, being stopped only by Blissey or Latios. Shadow Ball allows Ho-Oh to hit Latios incredibly hard and break Substitute + Calm Mind Mewtwo’s substitutes. Whirlwind in lieu of Shadow Ball leaves you walled by Latios, but can force damage from Spikes onto Blissey and will always force out Mewtwo. With Ho-Oh’s special bulk already incredibly high, this set maximizes its weaker physical Defense while also outspeeding neutral max Speed Metagross and Magneton. With its Defense maxed out, Ho-Oh can take strong physical attacks like Deoxys-A’s Shadow Ball and Groudon’s Hidden Power Ghost. If it really needs to, it can even take a Rock-type attack.

Team Options
========
Groudon is a required teammate for any team that uses Ho-Oh. Not only can Groudon switch into the Electric- and Rock-type moves that Ho-Oh hates, it also sets up sun. With the sun out, the power of super-effective Water-type moves are decreased, Thunder’s accuracy is reduced to 50%, and Ho-Oh cannot be frozen, making hax more likely to be in your favor. Sacred Fire’s power is also increased, which changes some shaky rolls into guaranteed KOs. Alongside Groudon should be checks to Kyogre – Latios or Latias can easily switch in and threaten it out with the prospect of Thunder. The eon duo can also check opposing Groudon that want to use Rock Slide on Ho-Oh and can set up on Blissey, which walls this set. Blissey herself and the other special wall Snorlax can also come in and take attacks from Kyogre; Blissey can whittle away at the whale with Toxic and Seismic Toss while Snorlax threatens it with paralysis from Body Slam and the power of Self-Destruct. Spike support from Forretress and Skarmory lets passive damage rack up as Ho-Oh forces switches. Mewtwo and Deoxys-A appreciate Ho-Oh’s ability to remove Steel-types from the game; the residual damage from Spikes, and status also means that their other checks cannot stay on the field for long.



[SET]
name: Offensive
move 1: Hidden Power Flying
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Sacred Fire
move 4: Recover
item: Leftovers / Lum Berry
ability: Pressure
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe



[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Hidden Power Flying serves as a highly spammable STAB attack. Shadow Ball pairs with Hidden Power to be nearly unresisted by the entire game. The few Pokemon that can switch into either are cooked by Sacred Fire’s power or cannot risk being burnt by it. Recover keeps Ho-Oh able to dish out damage over the course of a game. While Leftovers lets Ho-Oh heal without using Recover, Lum Berry can be used to ignore status and break through a wall like Blissey.

Maximum Attack and Speed investment with an Adamant nature means that Ho-Oh can fire away as fast as it can. Do not use any natures that reduce Ho-Oh’s defenses; a sun-boosted Sacred Fire will meet its offensive benchmarks even with a hindering nature.

Team Options
========
The same teammates that work on the defensive set will work on the offensive set, though bulkier versions are best used to supplement Ho-Oh. Latias and tankier Groudon should be used to help sponge moves that Ho-Oh can’t take as well compared to its defensive sets. Substitute Mewtwo, and Calm Mind Latias can take on common barriers like Blissey, Kyogre, and Lugia. While Deoxys-A can’t take a hit to save its life, smart double switches can force your opponent into disadvantageous positions.


[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Hidden Power Flying
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Sacred Fire
move 4: Earthquake / Ancient Power
item: Choice Band
ability: Pressure
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe



[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========
Hidden Power Flying and Shadow Ball both hit incredibly hard and have few switch-ins. Sacred Fire torches anything that thinks that it’s free to come in. The final move is up to you - Earthquake does a better job into Metagross and Tyranitar, but Ancient Power does a significant amount to opposing Ho-Oh (between 80 and 95% to the listed defensive set) while also not letting in Latios and Latias for free.

Maximum Attack and Speed with an Adamant nature is natural for a Choice Band set.

Team Options
========
Choice Band Ho-Oh really appreciates support from Forretress and Skarmory’s Spikes to further stack damage from its attacks. The eon duo and non-Substitute Mewtwo also loves this specific Ho-Oh for its ability to bait in Blissey and wreck it with Hidden Power. Paralysis spread by Groudon and Snorlax makes it harder for its checks to outspeed and threaten Ho-Oh out. Wish support from Blissey will be needed to keep Ho-Oh healthy since this set doesn't have Recover.


[STRATEGY COMMENTS]

Other Options
=============
Substitute can be used on the non-Choice Band sets to further make it difficult to threaten Ho-Oh, but fitting it onto a set is incredibly difficult due to the viability of the other moves listed. Calm Mind might be enticing due to Ho-Oh’s respectable Special Attack and excellent coverage with STAB Fire, Hidden Power Ice, and Thunder, but that is completely outclassed by other Calm Mind sweepers like Mewtwo, Latios, and Latias.




Checks and Counters
===================
**Kyogre**: Kyogre can switch in on any attack and immediately threaten it out with a rain-boosted Water-type move. Not only that, it sets up rain which leaves Ho-Oh much more susceptible to Thunder. However, poison from Toxic limits how many times it can come in on Ho-Oh.
**Groudon**: Groudon can come in when Ho-Oh uses Shadow Ball or Hidden Power and immediately force Ho-Oh out with the threat of an OHKO from Rock Slide or being crippled long-term by paralysis. It does have to watch out for status from Toxic or Sacred Fire.
**Tyranitar**: Tyranitar erases the sun and doesn’t mind coming in on anything aside from a banded Earthquake. It does have to mind a burn from Sacred Fire, but STAB Rock Slide will still hurt a lot.
**Lugia**: Lugia can take any attack and sit on Ho-Oh while stalling it out with Toxic.
**Blissey**: Blissey can come in on the defensive set and threaten Ho-Oh with Toxic. However, it does have to watch out for physical attacks from Ho-Oh’s offensive and Choice Band variants.
**Explosion**: Exploding on Ho-Oh will leave the defensive set unable to check your opponent's teammates, or knock out the offensive sets outright.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Sagdiyev, 548404]]
- Quality checked by: [[, ], [, ]]
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]
 
Last edited:
amqc

> Latios and Mewtwo, which Ho-Oh easily checks while the sun is shining, now threatens Ho-Oh with perfect accuracy Thunder.
should be 'check' and 'threaten' i think

> Independent of rain, Ho-Oh is also susceptible to incredibly strong physical attacks like Explosion, Rock-type moves, or attacks from opposing Choice Band Ho-Oh.
this sorta reads like rock-type moves are in the category of incredibly strong physical attacks. i also sorta think that hooh eating booms is a good thing not a bad thing generally.

> Using Ho-Oh also reveals that you likely have Groudon as a teammate, allowing your opponent to plan out how to defeat your team.
i feel like this isn't a big issue, you'll not too often have hooh out without groudon out first imo

> evs: 160 HP / 252 Def / 96 Spe
i'd basically always rather go 252 hp / 160 def personally, the extra special bulk is pretty important vs stray thunders and dclaws imo

> Toxic cripples any potential switch-ins to Ho-Oh by putting them on a timer to break through it.
i'd specifically call out ogre / hooh here, it's also not really *any* potential switchin

> The eon duo can also check opposing Groudon that want to use Rock Slide on Ho-Oh and can set up on Blissey, which walls this set.
idt i'd say that latis can set up on bliss barring the imo pretty bad cm refresh set; tios does wall bliss though

> Blissey herself and the other special wall Snorlax can also come in and take attacks from Kyogre; Blissey can whittle away at the whale with Toxic and Seismic Toss while Snorlax threatens it with paralysis from Body Slam and the power of Self-Destruct.
idt people switch lax into ogre. could mention that hooh helps bliss take on ogre by toxing subcm sets and letting bliss soft if needed instead of having to land a tox

> Mewtwo and Deoxys-A appreciate Ho-Oh’s ability to remove Steel-types from the game; the residual damage from Spikes, and status also means that their other checks cannot stay on the field for long.
hooh imo only really removes steels from the game if your opponent doesn't have a good hooh check and has to blow it up. i'd be more inclined to say that hooh removes ogre from the game.

> evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
incredibly minor detail but imo the 4 would go in hp or def

> The given speed outruns Reflect + Toxic Lugia, the remaining EVs are put into HP for a slight bulk boost.
lugia ime is basically always at least 280 spe, and often more. i'd also just call it defensive lugia.

> Wish support from Blissey will be needed to keep Ho-Oh healthy since this set doesn't have Recover.
wish is sorta nice but i wouldn't at all call it needed. i'd generally rather have a lax on this sorta team anyways.

> However, poison from Toxic limits how many times it can come in on Ho-Oh.
probably mention sfire burns as well

i'd talk a bit about how tios/m2 can go for the sun thunder if they're backed into a corner
i'd talk about hooh as a deoa check a bit more
i'd mention it checks heracross as well
probably say stuff with slide can lure it eg cbgross, hera, deoa
probably mention stall somewhere, and maybe hooh's tendency to eat booms and thereby protect teammates
i also sorta think subcm is worth a full set, but if not it should def be in oo
 
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