Jul-Aug-Sep Suspect Metagame General Discussion

[Gouki]

Let's get this going guys.

- Steel types seem to be used even more with the absence of Garchomp and Deoxys, particularly Jirachi, Heatran and Lucario. This is understandable, as Garchomp did an excellent job at stopping these Pokemon from sweeping.

- Salamence, and especially Dragonite, usage has gone up. These tend to be bulky stat boosters, attempting to fill the role that Garchomp occupied.

- Porygon 2 has perhaps seen the most dramatic jump in usage, although I'm not completely sure why removing Garchomp prompted this. It's definitely a useful Pokemon though, as its Trace Ability and relatively good defenses allows it to effectively counter major threats like Gyarados, physical Salamence and Heatran.

- Gengar will likely be the most used Pokemon when the new stats come out. It's not hard to see why, as it can cripple Pokemon with Hypnosis, hammer nearly everything with Shadow Ball and Focus Blast, and carries the threat of Explosion for special walls attempting to stop it. Substitute seems to be seeing a lot more use on it, as it makes Gengar much more difficult to revenge kill, and makes the incredibly popular Scarf Heatran a very shaky switch-in.

- Suicide leads are being used less, as a huge number of players have turned to using "anti-suicide" leads. Expect Tyranitar to be one of the most used leads, as it takes out Azelf immediately, and with the option of using bulky EVs, Chople berry, Lum Berry or Choice Scarf, it can often take out Gengar as well.

- Ambipom is seen more often, almost always leading, and nearly as often used by bad or mediocre players. While Fake Out, Pursuit and U-Turn does pretty well against Azelf and Gengar leads, there isnt much that this thing accomplishes after the first few turns.

- The infamous "Dual Screen" strategy is not seen very often at all, as players struggle to find a suitable replacement for Deoxys. However, SD/Rock Polish/Taunt/Baton Pass Gliscor is definitely here to stay, albeit with more limited usage, as it's very dangerous with or without the protection of Reflect and Light Screen.

- Rain Dance teams seem to be more popular than in Standard, despite the fact that Swift Swimmers were huge threats to both Deoxys and Garchomp. I suspect this is because people are now more willing to try different strategies, as many people felt there was no need not to base their team around the "overpowered" Garchomp and Deoxys.

 

[Fishin]

Definitely agreeing on the more Steel Pokemon point, though Scarf Heatran (a good Chomp stopper) seems to be more popular than ever. People seem to be much more eager to use Pokemon that would be dead weight against a +2 Garchomp, Jirachi especially. Porygon2's increase in usage could be attributed to this as well.

Hail teams seem to be a lot more popular now too, which could again be attributed to the fact that a lot of Hail Pokemon survive better in a metagame without Garchomp, though there could be other reasons too.

 

[darkie]

Porygon2's jump in usage is most likely because it can adequately counter the things that are attempting to fill the sweeper-void where Garchomp once ruled. This includes Gyarados, Salamence, and Heatran, all of which can be quite easily stopped by Porygon2.

 

[Taylor]

You would understandably believe, at first, that hail-based teams would work just as good with or without Garchomp, and perhaps even more because you have a larger ammount of Ice-type attacks at your disposal. I suppose that because Garchomp was much easier to use and was just a more effective strategy in the first place, meant that players immediately chose to base their new team around the ever-so popular Garchomp, or something closely related, instead of making an effort to try something uncommonly used and creative; in this case, hail teams. I would have to say I feel the same way with Rain Dance teams, especially considering they were capable of outspeeding Garchomp and Deoxys-S after the rain was executed. However, the following sentence may explain why these strategies are used and sighted more often; it's the only explanation I can conclude with. There's more variety with the first priority choices out of the window, simply illustrated. So, players who suspected more viable strategies once Garchomp was banished were indeed correct, or at least as it seems so far.

Gengar was an established threat before when Garchomp and Deoxys-S roamed free in the standard metagame, and since their departure, two who oftenly used Choice Scarf and Life Orb respectively to increase their power as well as outspeed Gengar, have given Gengar a little more room to breathe. Not only that, but Gengar was already a top two contender when Garchomp and Deoxys-S were apart of the standard metagame, and let's face it, was distancing itself between it and third place, is now the next best thing. Gengar was popular before and after, as shown by the usage statistics throughout the year so far, so it was practically a given that Gengar would arise to the top.

 

[Hipmonlee]

I think Taylors first paragraph sums up my views on this. I mean, the reason I used Jirachi, is because I needed a replacement sweeper that could use substitute effectively.

Some other observations:

I am surprised I havent seen more Rhyperiors or Machamps, though tbh I am also glad I havent seen many of these.

I havent seen a lot of Ambipoms tbh.

I agree with the people saying Heatran has made a huge jump in useage (which will also contribute to Porygon useage).

Also a lot more classic stall teams (of a similar style to ETs team). Which I think also may be contributing to the usage of Jirachi.

I havent seen many hail teams either actually.

Salamence seems to be using specs a lot more often.

I dont think I have seen many weaviles lately, nor many lucarios now that I think about it. At least not as many as I had been on standard. I dont think I've been seeing many Metagrosses.

Dugtrio is starting to be used, often with scarf.

Have a nice day.

 

[Articanus]

For some reason I find it more useful to use Priority moves in suspect than OU. I'm even using a Mamoswine with Ice Shard and the team can't do shit in OU.

But the stage has basically gone into a bit of stall since people don't have to worry as much about the "uncounterable" garchomp. I'm starting to see a lot more blisseys, but that's me, and sp. attackers are going down in that respect.

Edit: I'll add a bit more I guess.

More grounds in general are getting a bit more use. Flygon has yet to be seen except in the early stages of the ladder. Rhyperior is used more due to his fire+ rock resistance and electric immunity that made Garchomp useful. It also has an EQ greater to that of Chomp, so it's no slouch. Porygon2 got a huge boost without many pokemon running SD and 120 base power STAB moves. The closest thing is Salamence and Gyarados, whom DD and Intimidate themselves. Not to mention that they are promptly KOed afterwards. Porygon2 is also very helpful in taking down Heatran, especially the popular scarf versions who can't do shit to it.

Speaking of Heatran, it is LITERALLY on every team I see. Most tend to come in a a Yanmega counter also, and don't usually suspect HP Ground. The boost in Heatrans is because it doesn't have to worry about Garchomp's bulky ass from stopping it(though people could just run WoW to hit it really).

 

[Great Sage]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Heatran jump up to the top 3 most used Pokemon when the usage stats come out; like many have noted, the Scarf version is very useful at a range of tasks.

However, I haven't seen the use of suicide leads diminish, though I have seen an increase in the number of Tyranitar leads used. Azelf appears to be as common as ever from what I've seen.

 

[Tangerine]

I predict that "Bulky waters" will start pumping more SpA for dragonite - considering Dragonite can simply roost off damage now and DD in its spare time.

When I was laddering - I haven't seen too many Jirachis as people have claimed earlier. This might be because of the use of heatrans - considering heatran and many other steels totally wall Jirachi.

Suicide leads are still the new thing - but that applies to both metagames.

Metagross and Heatran seems to be top tier OUs :|

EDIT: Stats are out! Looks like Gengar/Heatran is the new "dominating force" - and yet even then, it is not as dominating as the Gengar/Garchomp relationship in standard. From the looks of it Suspect definitely has more variety in terms of top tier OU used - with Gengar edging out a bit (although not by much since there are many things that keep it in check)