SS LC Looking for feedback on a porygon team!

[CharizardChamp450]

Porygon @ Berry Juice
Ability: Download
Level: 5
EVs: 36 Def / 236 SpA / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Ice Beam
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt

Diglett @ Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpD / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Memento
- Protect
- Sludge Bomb

Magnemite @ Salac Berry
Ability: Magnet Pull
Level: 5
EVs: 36 Def / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Charge Beam
- Flash Cannon
- Rest

Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Fake Out

Grookey @ Eviolite
Ability: Grassy Surge
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 Def / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

Koffing @ Eviolite
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Level: 5
EVs: 76 Def / 196 SpA / 76 SpD / 156 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Memento

I just got knocked out of the LC open whilst using this team. I'm still fairly new to the meta, so was hoping to get some thoughts from more experienced players on what does/doesn't work.

Porygon:
The main focus of the team. After one agility, it outspeeds the entire tier, except for niche picks like scarf diglett. Giving up on tri-attack means it loses a some amount of raw power, but the ice/electric/psychic coverage means that the only mon that resists all three moves is magnemite. After a download boost, it can OHKO most matchups, except for bulkier picks like ferroseed or foongus. It also struggles against knock off users it doesn't OHKO, particularly pawniard because of berry juice and/or sucker punch.

Diglett:
My usual choice for a lead. Typically sets up rocks, lives a hit thanks to the sash, then mementos to give porygon an easier switch-in and a free turn to use agility. Protect is there to stop the focus sash being broken by fake out or first impression. Sludge bomb was picked because it can help to weaken or KO grookey, but I'm tempted to switch to EQ for more favourable matchups against steel types.

Magnemite:
Mostly here as a ferroseed counter. Can trap it with magnet pull, then spam charge beam to build up SpA buffs. Uses sub just before killing Ferroseed to avoid getting revenge killed by diglett. Flash cannon can be used for good neutral coverage against most of the tier. Maybe I'm just using it wrong, but I find that I very rarely want to click rest, and that salac berry is too finnicky to activate to be worth it. Thoughts on a 4th move and/or item would be much appreciated.

Mienfoo:
It's a gen 8 LC team. 'Nuff said.

In seriousness, it's particularly helpful as a check to steel types, particularly pawniard. Knock off is always appreciated for removing bulk from eviolite users. It's a bit of a "jack of all trades, master of none" mon.

Grookey:
This might be the member I'm least sure about. It's nice to switch in if an opposing foongus tries to spore porygon, but otherwise, it's very rarely my first choice. I have been considering switching it out for a parting shot user, to give porygon or magnemite chances to switch in without sacrificing a team member. I threw together a quick meowth-alola set to see what you think:

Meowth-Alola @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
Level: 5
EVs: 76 Atk / 196 SpA / 196 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Fake Out
- Hyper Voice
- Shock Wave
- Parting Shot

Koffing:
I picked this for my mienfoo counter, because I really like being able to prevent regenerator. The only unusual part of this set is memento as the 4th move, which is there as a backup in case diglett gets KOd before a good candidate for porygon setup comes out. If you think it's not worth that "plan for the worst" mentality, or a different mienfoo counter might be better, let me know (I should mention that after a SpA boost from download and an agility, porygon can outspeed and OHKO mienfoo. Koffing is here in case mienfoo doesn't come out until after porygon's fainted).

Thanks for reading! Any thoughts or feedback would be much appreciated. If you want to use this team, you are absolutely free to do so.

 

[CharizardChamp450]

Just replying to use my one bump.

 

[DC]

Hey ya, the team has a good starting point but needs some fine tuning to be much more consistent into the current LC meta. While I do get the idea of using both Salac Berry Magnemite and double Memento users to help Porygon, it sacrifices too much into other matchups. Here are the ways I would change your team to be more meta-friendly.

Major Changes:
->

Pawniard @ Berry Juice
Ability: Defiant
Level: 5
EVs: 156 Atk / 36 Def / 196 SpD / 116 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Stealth Rock

I would swap Magnemite for Pawniard. Salac Berry Magnemite has fallen in usage completely, as Pawniard becomes the preferred Steel-type over Ferroseed (which makes using Salac Mag very very inconsistent). Pawniard makes the team less weak to Natu and gives a crucial Psychic immunity, provides the team with a Stealth Rock setter, and provides Knock Off. You can even experiment with going Thunder Wave over Sucker Punch if u feel like it, since your team does have double priority already.



Diglett @ Life Orb
Ability: Arena Trap
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Earth Power
- Sludge Bomb
- Beat Up
- Memento

Although you don't really need to use Sludge Bomb, I didn't want to stray too far from the original concept that you have. The original Diglett set that you were using was suboptimal in terms of trying to role compress too hard. This Diglett set is more catered towards supporting Porygon by trapping Psychic-types, providing Memento, and can bluff physical with Beat Up to lure in Grookey. This set is a bit more difficult to pilot then Focus Sash special Diglett, so if u feel more comfortable using it, try that instead (just swap Beat Up with Protect and change the nature to Timid).

Minor Changes:


Koffing @ Eviolite
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Level: 5
EVs: 76 Def / 196 SpA / 76 SpD / 156 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Pain Split

Sludge Bomb is better than Sludge Wave because the poison chance is more useful than a minimal amount of rolls that the extra base power changes. Pain Split is necessary on Koffing to reliably check Mienfoo and Grookey, and running double Memento was unnecessary.



Porygon @ Berry Juice
Ability: Download
Level: 5
EVs: 36 Def / 236 SpA / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Tri Attack
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Keep Tri Attack on Porygon; it is usually the best attack to spam. Psychic is not as great due to having more resistant and immune foes.



Grookey @ Eviolite
Ability: Grassy Surge
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 Def / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

This one isn't really a change, but more so to notify you that you have options on Grookey. Swords Dance is a viable fourth option over U-turn if u want a secondary sweeper, while Wood Hammer over Knock Off or U-turn provides a nuke to hit stuff like Koffing and Mareanie hard.

These are my suggestions. Feel free to try them out and experiment with changes that I also mentioned!

 

[CharizardChamp450]

Hey ya, the team has a good starting point but needs some fine tuning to be much more consistent into the current LC meta. While I do get the idea of using both Salac Berry Magnemite and double Memento users to help Porygon, it sacrifices too much into other matchups. Here are the ways I would change your team to be more meta-friendly.

Major Changes:
->

Pawniard @ Berry Juice
Ability: Defiant
Level: 5
EVs: 156 Atk / 36 Def / 196 SpD / 116 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Stealth Rock

I would swap Magnemite for Pawniard. Salac Berry Magnemite has fallen in usage completely, as Pawniard becomes the preferred Steel-type over Ferroseed (which makes using Salac Mag very very inconsistent). Pawniard makes the team less weak to Natu and gives a crucial Psychic immunity, provides the team with a Stealth Rock setter, and provides Knock Off. You can even experiment with going Thunder Wave over Sucker Punch if u feel like it, since your team does have double priority already.



Diglett @ Life Orb
Ability: Arena Trap
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Earth Power
- Sludge Bomb
- Beat Up
- Memento

Although you don't really need to use Sludge Bomb, I didn't want to stray too far from the original concept that you have. The original Diglett set that you were using was suboptimal in terms of trying to role compress too hard. This Diglett set is more catered towards supporting Porygon by trapping Psychic-types, providing Memento, and can bluff physical with Beat Up to lure in Grookey. This set is a bit more difficult to pilot then Focus Sash special Diglett, so if u feel more comfortable using it, try that instead (just swap Beat Up with Protect and change the nature to Timid).

Minor Changes:


Koffing @ Eviolite
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Level: 5
EVs: 76 Def / 196 SpA / 76 SpD / 156 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Pain Split

Sludge Bomb is better than Sludge Wave because the poison chance is more useful than a minimal amount of rolls that the extra base power changes. Pain Split is necessary on Koffing to reliably check Mienfoo and Grookey, and running double Memento was unnecessary.



Porygon @ Berry Juice
Ability: Download
Level: 5
EVs: 36 Def / 236 SpA / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Tri Attack
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Keep Tri Attack on Porygon; it is usually the best attack to spam. Psychic is not as great due to having more resistant and immune foes.



Grookey @ Eviolite
Ability: Grassy Surge
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 Def / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

This one isn't really a change, but more so to notify you that you have options on Grookey. Swords Dance is a viable fourth option over U-turn if u want a secondary sweeper, while Wood Hammer over Knock Off or U-turn provides a nuke to hit stuff like Koffing and Mareanie hard.

These are my suggestions. Feel free to try them out and experiment with changes that I also mentioned!

First of all, thanks for the suggestions! I've played around with them for a bit, and thought I'd share my experiences and feelings.


Definitely a good call. I'd only been able to effectively use magnemite once or twice, and otherwise it was largely dead weight.


In hindsight, I totally agree with your comment that I was trying to cram too many roles onto one 'mon, especially a frail one that KOes itself as a key part of its job. The extra offensive pressure is nice, and Pawniard's rocks freeing up a moveslot for earth power is much appreciated in terms of matchups and raw power.


Pain split here makes sense. I'm not a huge fan of it personally, as I find it very temperamental, but it's still better than no recovery. I disagree with you on sludge bomb vs wave though. I find that burn or paralysis are, 9 times out of 10, more appealing statuses to spread than poison. As a result, I value the raw damage over the increased poison chance.


I really feel like my set doesn't miss out by not having tri attack. As far as I can tell, there are very few common matchups where it does significantly more damage than all of my coverage moves (even against 'mons that take neutral damage from my coverage, such as abra, tri attack often only has a chance to KO), and psychic is really nice for OHKOing mienfoo (tri attack only has a ~44% chance to KO after rocks damage, whereas psychic is a guaranteed kill).

Once again, thanks for your thoughts on the team. If you still feel like my decisions on porygon and koffing are dumb, please do let me know.

 

[DC]

First of all, thanks for the suggestions! I've played around with them for a bit, and thought I'd share my experiences and feelings.


Definitely a good call. I'd only been able to effectively use magnemite once or twice, and otherwise it was largely dead weight.


In hindsight, I totally agree with your comment that I was trying to cram too many roles onto one 'mon, especially a frail one that KOes itself as a key part of its job. The extra offensive pressure is nice, and Pawniard's rocks freeing up a moveslot for earth power is much appreciated in terms of matchups and raw power.


Pain split here makes sense. I'm not a huge fan of it personally, as I find it very temperamental, but it's still better than no recovery. I disagree with you on sludge bomb vs wave though. I find that burn or paralysis are, 9 times out of 10, more appealing statuses to spread than poison. As a result, I value the raw damage over the increased poison chance.


I really feel like my set doesn't miss out by not having tri attack. As far as I can tell, there are very few common matchups where it does significantly more damage than all of my coverage moves (even against 'mons that take neutral damage from my coverage, such as abra, tri attack often only has a chance to KO), and psychic is really nice for OHKOing mienfoo (tri attack only has a ~44% chance to KO after rocks damage, whereas psychic is a guaranteed kill).

Once again, thanks for your thoughts on the team. If you still feel like my decisions on porygon and koffing are dumb, please do let me know.

The issue with Sludge Wave is that the extra Base Power has minimal effect on most rolls (basically same damage as Sludge Bomb). The extra poison chance is more clutch here because poisoning something like Natu, which the team has issue switching into, and Trace Porygon is much more appealing. Tri Attack on Porygon is much better because it is more spammable; I understand the OHKO on Mienfoo, but Psychic is generally something you don't want to click in most scenarios due to the amount of immunities and resistances in the metagame. Plus, the secondary status chance of Tri Attack can swing a game massively in your favor if you get it on the right target (which is more likely cuz it is the attack you will usually be spamming).