Ubers Lunala



[OVERVIEW]

* Lunala has decent Speed and good Special Attack stats, making it an ideal wallbreaker.
* It possesses good coverage between its STAB moves along with options like Moonblast and Focus Blast.
* Shadow Shield reduces the damage Lunala takes by half if Lunala is at full HP, and it is not affected by Mold Breaker abilities, which gives Lunala fantastic bulk at full HP.
* While good offensively, Psychic / Ghost is among the worst defensive typings in the game.
* Due to its 4x weakness and lack of a powerful STAB move to deal with them, Lunala hates Dark-type Pokemon for their ability to do huge damage to it with ease while preventing it from spamming its STAB moves, although it does have the coverage options to beat most Dark-types in certain situations.
* Despite this, the immunities it does have enable it to be a good Choice Scarf Pokemon and have a good matchup versus offense.
* Lunala suffers from being just slower than some common threats, most noticeably Yveltal and Adamant Mega Lucario.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Moongeist Beam
move 2: Psyshock
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Ice Beam / Moonblast
item: Choice Scarf
ability: Shadow Shield
nature: Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Lunala has perfect neutral coverage between its STAB attacks and Focus Blast.
* Moongeist Beam is strongest move Lunala has to use against most of the tier.
* Psyshock hits on the physical defense to cover specially defensive Pokemon.
* Focus Blast provides coverage to hit Dark-types and also helps Lunala check Extreme Killer Arceus.
* Ice Beam hits Salamence and Zygarde hard while also providing super effective coverage on Yveltal, allowing Lunala to check setup versions of the former two and hitting the latter hard.
* Moonblast is an option in the last moveslot to have a reliable way of hitting Dark-types without fearing a miss, as well as giving Lunala the ability to 2HKO Mega Sableye, but all Dark-types are hit hard by either Focus Blast or Ice Beam already.

Set Details
========

* Maximum Speed investment with a neutral nature is just enough to outspeed maximum Speed Deoxys-A when considering the Choice Scarf. Timid reaches no important Speed benchmarks, with the only difference being Pheromosa, which Lunala can take on one-on-one regardless.
* Modest also grants Lunala a bit more power, turning various rolls into Lunala's favor, such as against Zygarde-C and Extreme Killer Arceus.
* Choice Scarf is the item of choice to mitigate Lunala's otherwise poor matchup versus offense.

Usage Tips
========

* This Lunala set is designed to be more effective versus offense, reliably revenge killing most Arceus formes after Stealth Rock as well as outspeeding most Pokemon found on offense without a boost.
* Its natural bulk from Shadow Shield means very few offensive threats can OHKO it, even after setup, so Lunala can normally fire off at least two hits.
* Against bulkier teams, this can be used to pressure offensive elements (not sure what elements means here); however, it won't be sweeping without a lot of support, so it can be played quite recklessly.
* Avoid getting Lunala paralyzed as best you can, as Lunala loses all presence against offense and becomes much easier to revenge kill when paralyzed.
* If using Lunala to check Extreme Killer Arceus, bear in mind that +2 Shadow Claw will OHKO Lunala through Shadow Shield, so it is important to put Extreme Killer Arceus in range of either Focus Blast or Psyshock before using Lunala to check it, or to have another Pokemon that can finish it off.
* Choice Scarf Lunala outspeeds anything you'll find on a Psychic Terrain team, can OHKO every offensive Psychic-type after Stealth Rock, and can normally at worst 3HKO everything else. Avoid status conditions and Lunala will have a fantastic matchup against these teams, especially with the Psychic Terrain boosting Lunala's Psyshock too.

Team Options
========

* Defog or Rapid Spin is highly appreciated. Obvious examples of users are Excadrill and Cloyster for hyper offense teams and Giratina-O or support Arceus formes for balance teams.
* Hazard setters like Primal Groudon and Dialga are good teammates to rack up hazard damage on potential Lunala checks, as well as breaking potential Focus Sashes on Pokemon like Deoxys-A while also breaking opposing Lunala's Shadow Shield and Lugia's Multiscale.
* Strong wallbreakers like Mega Lucario are nice support for Choice Scarf Lunala due to its relatively poor matchup against slow bulky teams.
* Mega Lucario also comes in on some Dark-type Pokemon without fearing too much, and it can even gain an Attack boost through Justified on hits like Arceus-Dark's Judgment if it comes in before Mega Evolving.

[SET]
name: Z-Hypnosis Sweeper
move 1: Hypnosis
move 2: Moongeist Beam
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Calm Mind
item: Psychium Z
ability: Shadow Shield
nature: Modest / Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Moves
========

* Z-Hypnosis gives a +1 boost to Speed and can let Lunala put a check to sleep.
* Moongeist Beam is the most solid STAB option Lunala gets, hitting a lot of Pokemon neutrally.
* Focus Blast gives very good coverage with Moongeist Beam, hitting everything at least neutrally. It is mandatory to hit Extreme Killer Arceus and Dark-type Pokemon.
* Calm Mind boosts Lunala's damage output and can allow it to sweep through unprepared teams.

Set Details
========

* Maximum Speed with a Modest nature gives Lunala the highest damage output, but Timid can be used to outspeed Pokemon like Rayquaza and Speed tie with Solgaleo before setting up, allowing Lunala to be potentially more effective throughout a game.
* Maximum Special Attack is used to maximize Lunala's wallbreaking prowess.
* Psychium Z allows Lunala to gain a +1 boost in Speed while putting a check to sleep, helping it set up with Calm Mind.
* A third attack can be used over Calm Mind if wanted, but three attacks Lunala struggles to break notable walls like support Arceus formes unless that Arceus is weak to one of Lunala's moves, and Calm Mind gives Lunala more general utility throughout the game.

Usage Tips
========

* With Z-Hypnosis only giving +1 Speed once per battle, do not try to set up too soon because you will not get a second opportunity.
* Calm Mind should mostly be used on the free turn when Lunala has put one of its checks to sleep.
* Consider whether Calm Mind is necessary before clicking it against on the sleeping Pokemon: if Lunala can 2HKO a check without a boost and the boost does not turn that 2HKO into an OHKO, it might be better to just attack.
* Yveltal is a big nuisance and should ideally be the target of the Z-Hypnosis.
* Against bulkier teams, the Speed boost from Z-Hypnosis isn't so important, so Lunala can be played more liberally.
* If there is an Alolan Muk on the opponent's team, try to weaken it with other members of the team before trying to sweep with Lunala, as Alolan Muk counters Lunala completely.

Team Options
========

* Paralysis, especially from the likes of Primal Groudon and Klefki, can help deal with many of Lunala's checks like Arceus-Dark and Yveltal (in the case of the former) and slow down otherwise offensive checks to Lunala (in the case of the latter).
* Defog or Rapid Spin is appreciated to preserve Shadow Shield; examples include Excadrill and Cloyster for hyper offense teams and Giratina-O or support Arceus for balance teams.
* Reliable Stealth Rock setters - such as Primal Groudon and Dialga are good teammates.
* A good Fairy-type like Arceus-Fairy, Xerneas, or Magearna can reliably deal with the likes of Arceus-Dark and Yveltal.
* Xerneas is also good for its ability to wear down common checks for itself and Lunala.

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Moongeist Beam
move 2: Psyshock
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Ice Beam / Thunder
item: Choice Specs
ability: Shadow Shield
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Moves
========

* Psyshock and Moongeist Beam are powerful STAB options with good dual coverage, only missing out on Dark-types.
* Focus Blast provides perfect coverage with Lunala's STAB moves, hitting Pokemon like Arceus-Dark and Tyranitar harder than anything else.
* Ice Beam OHKOes Salamence and maximum HP Zygarde, allowing Lunala to check them well. It also hits Yveltal very hard.
* Thunder hits all of Kyogre, Yveltal, and Ho-Oh in one slot but loses out on OHKOing Zygarde, and the mentioned Pokemon all get hit hard by one of Lunala's other moves anyway.

Set Details
========
* Choice Specs turns Lunala into a fierce wallbreaker, with perfect three-move coverage and Ice Beam to give it a bit more of a defensive niche.
* Maximum Speed investment with a Timid nature is used to Speed tie with other Lunala and Solgaleo, outspeed neutral-natured speed natured Yveltal, Rayquaza, and most support Arceus formes. Modest Lunala misses out on all of these and the extra power isn't worth the worse matchup versus balance teams.
* Maximum Special Attack investment is used to maximize Lunala's damage output.

Usage Tips
========

* This set is fairly prediction reliant against teams with both a Dark- and a Normal-type. You click Moongeist Beam against anything else, but depending on the Normal-type, you might want to click Psyshock instead of Focus Blast if it is incredibly specially defensive, and Yveltal, the best Dark-type thus far, fears Focus Blast a lot less than Ice Beam.
* Be mindful of Focus Blast's accuracy problems.
* Against offense teams without Yveltal, clicking Moongeist Beam is not advisable until you know what Arceus set it is. You don't want to give Extreme Killer Arceus free setup while it is also faster than Lunala so you cannot revenge kill it.

Team Options
========

* Paralysis turns a lot of Lunala's checks into fodder. The one exception to this is Yveltal with Sucker Punch, but otherwise, making fast foes slow helps Lunala a lot.
* Hazards are good to pick up KOs, so Stealth Rock from Primal Groudon or Dialga and Spikes from Klefki or Ferrothorn are good.
* Fairy-types are nice to punish Dark-types, so Xerneas and Arceus-Fairy are good teammates. Klefki is also okay as a teammate, but not for its ability to take on Dark-types, which it cannot do well anymore.
* Special attackers like Xerneas and Arceus-Fairy both also appreciate Lunala's ability to break opposing special walls.
* Healing Wish from Shaymin-S, if you can fit it, restores Lunala's Shadow Shield, frees it from status, and gives it a second chance to break stuff. Shaymin-S is very difficult to fit on a team, though.
* Hazard removal is appreciated, but less so here than on other sets. This is meant to be a powerful breaker that can break down bulky teams, so it will not need to take as many hits to be useful.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* A defensive set with Will-O-Wisp acts as a pseudo-Lugia with its ability and can cripple physical attackers with a burn, which Lugia can't. However, then Lunala is an offensive Pokemon playing a defensive role and is generally inferior to Pokemon like Lugia and support Arceus formes, which are incredibly bulky even without being at full HP and also give other options to a team, namely Defog and Whirlwind.
* Ghostium Z can be used with a Calm Mind set to have a high-powered Ghost-type move that will do a huge amount of damage to anything that doesn't resist it, which is the majority of the tier, but this doesn't help Lunala beat many of its specific checks.
* Lum Berry could also be used on a Calm Mind set to avoid status if the Z-Crystal is already used on the team.
* Fightinium Z on the Calm Mind set gives Lunala a perfectly accurate Focus Blast to hit Arceus-Dark with and has a good chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock damage, but given that Lunala will almost always be outsped by Arceus-Dark, this it isn't as good.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Arceus-Dark**: Arceus-Dark takes on Lunala well most of the time, although Choice Scarf Lunala can 2HKO it on the switch and the Z-Hypnosis set can do the same after the +1 boost in Speed, taking advantage of the turns Arceus-Dark could be asleep.

**Yveltal**: Yveltal easily OHKOes Lunala with almost any Dark-type move unless Lunala has set up a Calm Mind and also has Shadow Shield intact, and it takes minimal investment for its Sucker Punch to OHKO Lunala. It can also Roost off most of the damage it takes from Ice Beam and then fire off powerful Dark-type moves.

**Alolan Muk**: Alolan Muk can take any attack Lunala goes for easily and can go for STAB Pursuit, doing a large chunk to Lunala if it switches out, or Knock Off, which has a good chance to OHKO Lunala after Stealth Rock damage.

**Tyranitar**: If Lunala is locked into a move other than Focus Blast on the Choice Scarf or Choice Specs sets, Tyranitar can Pursuit trap it. It forces Lunala to be played far more conservatively throughout the rest of the game as well.

**Arceus-Ghost**: Shadow Shield doesn't stop Shadow Force from OHKOing. However, Choice Scarf Lunala does not fear Arceus-Ghost, and Arceus-Ghost does not stop +1 Speed Lunala either.

**Entry Hazards**: Without Shadow Shield, Lunala is not nearly so bulky and is far easier to revenge kill.

**Mega Gengar**: Mega Gengar OHKOes Lunala after Shadow Shield is broken. While it can't trap Lunala due to Lunala being a Ghost-type, it is still capable of revenge killing non-Choice Scarf Lunala.

**Extreme Killer Arceus**: Extreme Killer Arceus outspeeds the Choice Specs and Z-Hypnosis sets, can set up on Choice Specs Lunala if it's locked into the wrong move, can take any one hit from the Choice Scarf set, and normally has Ghost-type coverage that can do massive damage to Lunala.

**Support Arceus Formes**: Lunala does not have the power to break support Arceus formes without being crippled by Toxic at the same time unless it opts for the Choice Specs set, which leaves it locked into Moongeist Beam with only 8 PP and only doing a maximum net damage of 8% per turn as they spam Recover. They can't switch in, though, unless they are heavily invested in Speed.
 
Last edited:
I'm no QC or anything, but I don't think LO is worth it even as an OO because, to me, it seems counterproductive when taking in to account Lunala's Shadow Shield ability, one of its signature positive traits that helps it deal with its horrid defensive typing. I'd rather run an Expert Belt set at that point to bluff a Choice set.
 

Fireburn

BARN ALL
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
Choice Specs is worth a set I feel

Moongeist Beam should not be slashed with anything on the CM set and should be listed before Psyshock on both sets - I can't really fathom why you wouldn't use that move on all of Lunala's sets since strong Ghost STAB is one of its best qualities offensively. I would rather slash the other coverage moves with Psyshock.

Ice Beam is better than Moonblast on both sets - it still kills Yveltal but also OHKOes Mega Salamence and does way more damage to Zygarde-C. Focus Blast already covers Arceus-Dark and a +1 Moonblast from the CM set won't kill it anyway.
 

shrang

General Kenobi
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
- Have you tried SubCM with either Leftovers or Salac Berry? I'm not saying you should give it a set yet, but an idea worth giving a go, IMO.
- Ekiller with its own spot in Checks and Counters IMO
 

Inspirited

Moving Ever Forward
is a Contributor Alumnus
Just a small personal deal, the Choiced sets can use Thunder in their least useful slots imo (usually the ice beam slot). It covers Ho-Oh + Yveltal + hits many other neutrally and reasonably hard. Idk where the QC want to put it if they want it included at all, but OO is a safe start imo.
 
SubCm, both with Salac and with Lefties, are highly matchup dependent, to a greater extent then the other sets, remove Shadow Shield and are generally not worth it. Salac I explicitly mention and explain why I dont feel it's that good (Lucario + Yveltal both being better than they've ever been).

Ekiller now has it's own spot.

Choice Specs now has Thunder and Ice Beam slashed following a discussion on Discord, Choice Scarf I have left as Ice Beam because it fits Scarf Lunala's role a lot better than Thunder does because of it being a reliable way of killing Mence. Ho-oh and Kygore aren't as relevant to Scarf Lunala's job and both are hit pretty hard by Psyshock anyway.
 
Mention or slash Lum Berry on CM. Avoiding status vs support formes and other passive mons is huge vs balance / stall.

Kasib Berry probably deserves an OO mention, since the damage reduction vs MGar Shadow Ball / Hex and Giratina-O Shadow Sneak keeps them from revenging Lunala effectively.

Outside of that, slashing and sets look good, so QC 1/3.
 
Last edited:
4 slashes in slot 4 for the CM set is mad and idk if the dex even supports it - drop one of Moonblast / Focus Blast to just the moves section - I'd say Moonblast cuz +1 Beam also 2hkos Sab whereas Tyranitar will Pursuit trap you without Focus Blast.

Spooky Plate is also an option in set details - im pretty lost on slashing for it as they are all pretty usable in their own right...

Leftovers / Ghostium Z with Spooky/Lum in set details as alternatives? Need more QC input on this one to come to a conclusion.

The usage tips is pretty well done - scarf could do with mentions about its effectiveness vs teams using psychic terrain as well.

Fightinium Z could go to OO for a perfectly accurate way to smack Arceus-Dark at +1 if it comes in and sets a CM on you - (Z-Focus Blast = +1 252 SpA Lunala All-Out Pummeling vs. +1 252 HP / 0 SpD Arceus-Dark: 368-434 (82.8 - 97.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock)

QC 2/3
 
Implemented ZF's and Nayrz's changes, I've just gone with the slashing Nayrz suggested with Calm Mind's items.
 

Perry

:)
is a Tournament Directoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Moderator
I might be wrong but you mentioned that Twave support from Klefki is appreciated in the CM set's Team Options but alas Prankster won't affect Dark-types anymore so maybe that needs to be looked at.
 
Lum Berry is a very good option for the CM set since Uber mons like to throw around Toxic and Thunder Wave too much. A lot of times, you can just CM on a Pokemon to bring it to your OHKO range while dodging the Toxic or Twave and proceed to spamming +1 attacks. Being inflicted by a status severely limits the amount of damage it can do balance teams.
 

Six Trails

formerly Analytic_
Perhaps slash Psychic with Psyshock on the Choice Scarf set? I'm on my phone and can't get any calcs, but I'm pretty confident that without a boosting item Psyshock isn't going to do too much to the Pink Blobs, and Psychic hits most other foes for more damage.
 

Thugly Duckling

I play TCG now
  • Moongeist Beam can be used to hit Dark Types reliably without a fear of missing, but the extra power of Focus Blast is generally more appreciated.
Do you mean Moonblast here?
 

Fireburn

BARN ALL
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
I am unsure if Ghostium Z is the best option on the Calm Mind set. Does it get any specific KOes that are useful? Otherwise something like Spooky Plate might be preferred for the consistency.

Moongeist Beam should be the first move listed on Scarf and Specs.
 
Some calcs. Never Ending Nightmare set to 180 BP.

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Primal Groudon: 354-417 (87.6 - 103.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Yveltal: 231-273 (58.7 - 69.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock - 20% chip = you beat Yveltal. Also if people are running Rash it has a chance to ohko after rocks.
+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Arceus-Water: 391-462 (88 - 104%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Xerneas: 466-549 (102.1 - 120.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Celesteela: 454-535 (114 - 134.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 477-562 (75 - 88.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock - prevents phaze from zygardes with some chip damage, helpful if running Focus Blast.

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Arceus-Ground: 391-462 (102.6 - 121.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO, 2 EQs put u at 25%, and if multiscale is broken it 2hkos, so this is useful.

+1 252 SpA Lunala Never-Ending Nightmare vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Ho-Oh: 313-370 (88.6 - 104.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO


It might not be worth first option, but Ghostium Z gives you a one time nuke vs a lot of things that would otherwise give you trouble and cut down a potential sweep.

Also reordered choice sets.
 
**Tyranitar**: If Yveltal is not running Focus Blast on the CM Set, or if it is locked into any other move, Tyranitar can pursuit Lunala, and forces Lunala to be played far more conservatively throughout the rest of the game as well.
Is that supposed to say Lunala, or am I missing something?
 
I think Alolan Muk is worth if a mention in C&C. It takes little from any of lunala's attacks and can deal lots of damage with pursuit or OHKO it with knock off. You could slash it alongside with tyranitar as they work similarly.
 

Fireburn

BARN ALL
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
Alright this has sat around long enough.

I don't believe the listed CM set reflects what is actually used nowadays. CM Z-Hypnosis seems to be the most used one:

[SET]
name: Z-Hypnosis Sweeper
move 1: Hypnosis
move 2: Moongeist Beam
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Calm Mind
item: Psychium Z
ability: Shadow Shield
nature: Modest / Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

Straightforward set, use Z-Hypnosis to sleep a check and get +1 Speed, giving you a free CM. Focus Blast is mandatory for EKiller/Darkceus and grants perfect neutral coverage. Set details can mention using a 3rd attack over CM if wanted.

Ghostium Z and Lum Berry can be moved to OO. Remove LO/EBelt/Sub.

Make Choice Scarf the first set (its the most common set by far).

"Wants a bit more in either speed or special attack to be a huge threat - yveltal mention" - This bullet in the overview should be formalized I think. Could mention how it hates Dark-types (though it has the coverage to beat most of them).

C&C can be reworked a bit. The Faster Pokemon can be grouped with Deoxys-Attack into revenge killers. I wonder if there are better examples - Lucario can't OHKO Lunala even without Shield and will die to Moongeist Beam, same with Mence and Ice Beam. Support Arceus bullet can be changed into a general mention of Toxic - Specs and Z-Hypnosis both beat support Arceus and switching into Scarf can be dicey if its weakened.

Let's make these changes and see where we are at afterward.
 
  • Like
Reactions: zf
Fucking Bats man, that's like the 5th mix up between the two.

Did Fireburn's suggestions and removed the revenge killers section entirely (along with Deo-A) because it really doesn't apply to Lunala's two more used sets.
 

Fireburn

BARN ALL
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
"Despite this, it does have a few key immunities that can help mitigate it's poor matchup vs offense." - the first set is Scarf and Lunala is probably one of the best Scarfers in the tier atm so "poor" might be a strong word.

Usage Tips for Z-Hypno have some artifacts that need to be cleared up. Ghostium Z isn't mentioned and this particular set has a harder time dealing with Yveltal than Arceus-Dark.

I think Ice Beam is better than Thunder on Specs since being able to OHKO Zygarde + the reliably anti-Yveltal move is rly nice and Ho-Oh/Kyogre do not stand up to Specs Moongeist Beam too well.

QC 3/3
 
I'd move Tyranitar and Alolan Muk above Arceus-Ghost and Mega Gengar in C&C, scarfed Lunala can deal with both and isn't trapped by Shadow Tag if locked into a coverage move.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top