Mega Gengar (revamp) [QC 2/3] [WRITTEN]

ryo yamada2001

ryo yamada2001
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#94 - Gengar
Overview
#######
- Its Mega evolution has a great niche with Shadow Tag, as Gengar is one of the very few viable Shadow Tag users, which allows it to trap opponents which have a tough time harming it, which can benefit set up users. Mega Gengar also has a unique assortment of support and disruption moves such as Taunt and Will-O-Wisp that it can use in conjunction with its high Speed, enough to outrun the unboosted metagame except for Deoxys-A and Mega Aerodactyl.
- Mega Gengar can also function as a powerful special attacker with its high Speed and Special Attack. In conjuction with its high Special Attack, it has the ability to deal a lot of damage against most Trick Room setters with its powerful Ghost STAB attack.
- As Gengar still has high Speed, a Ghost-typing which is beneficial against Normal- and Fighting-type attackers, a useful immunity to Ground with Levitate, decent offensive potential with relatively high Special Attack, and aforementioned supportive moves and Icy Wind let it effectively function as a utility check to numerous threats in the metagame, such as Mega Kangaskhan and Landorus-T.
- Gengar is very frail and gets KOd by many attacks it doesn't resist, and is almost guaranteed to get OHKOd by super effective hits. Gengar is also weak to speed control such as Trick Room and Tailwind and faster attackers due to its frailty. Because of this, Gengar usually has to use a Focus Sash in order for it to not faint quickly.

[SET]
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Sludge Bomb
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Will-O-Wisp / Taunt
move 4: Protect
item: Gengarite
ability: Levitate
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
==========
- Sludge Bomb is a powerful STAB attack, which deals a lot of damage to anything that does not resist it.
- Shadow Ball is Gengar's second powerful STAB attack that it can use to hit opposing Ghost-types such as Aegislash super effectively, as well as other Psychic-types such as Cresselia and Jirachi. Shadow Ball also has better general coverage, as it hits more typings for effective damage.
- Will-O-Wisp can cripple physical attackers which in conjuction with Shadow Tag make them unswitchable liabilities on the field.
- Taunt also works to put a stop to Trick Room, or to avoid anything else from going up, such as Tailwind from Zapdos, and redirection moves such as Rage Powder from Amoonguss.
- Substitute shields Mega Gengar from status moves such as Thunder Wave, priority attacks, and other attacks that would normally threaten to deal significant damage to it.
- Protect is an important move in the Doubles metagame, as this allows it to protect itself from taking damage while its partner deals with the opponent, or being able to stall out other field conditions such as Tailwind and Trick Room.

Set Details
==========
- The spread is to allow Gengar to go as fast and deal as much damage as possible.
- Timid allows Gengar to outspeed Weavile after Mega evolution, as well as having more Speed in general. Pre Mega evolution, you can speed tie with other base 110 Speeds, such as Mega Diancie and Latios.

Usage Tips
===========
- Mega Gengar's trapping ability prevents foes from switching, which can apply pressure to the opponent, as being unable to switch can often be crippling when the foe has two liabilities on the field.
- Mega Gengar, is most commonly used in the early and mid-game, where it can trap and remove threats to the team with Shadow Tag and powerful STAB attacks.
- Mega Gengar also does very well in the late game, being able to clean up teams with high Speed and Special Attack. However, faster threats and threats with priority have to be removed, and the opponent has to be weakened, because of Mega Gengar frailty.
- Protecting upon Mega evolution can be important in some cases, because upon Mega evolution it gets extra Speed.

Team Options
============
- Set up users such as Belly Drum Azumarill and Calm Mind Cresselia can work together with Mega Gengar because of its Shadow Tag ability. Gengar can easily trap threats that have a tough time dealing damage against opponents that are not threatening its partner.
- Fighting- and Fairy-types such as Keldeo, Terrakion, and Sylveon do a good job at getting rid of Dark-types that resist Mega Gengar's Shadow Ball.
- As Mega Gengar struggles against Earthquake from Landorus-T, Water-types that can deal with it such as Rotom-W are good partners.
- Wide Guard users such as Conkeldurr can support Mega Gengar by blocking incoming Earthquakes from Landorus-T.
- Talonflame checks such as Landorus-T, Thundurus, and Rotom-Wash are useful too, as Mega Gengar gets easily KOd by Talonflame's Brave Bird.
- Intimidate users such as Landorus-T and Scrafty are useful too, as Mega Gengar struggles against priority attacks such as Sucker Punch.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
- Disable prevents someone from using their lastly used move for a few turns, which combined with an Encore user, such as Whimsicott, can be very frustrating to play against due to Shadow Tag. Substitute and Disable is a good combination as well, as it can be very tough to break when the opponent's main attack is Disabled. It works especially well against Mega Kangaskhan, as Gengar can easily Disable its Sucker Punch and set up Substitute or KO it with Sludge Bomb.
- Focus Blast has the ability to OHKO Heatran and Mega Kangaskhan, and does more damage to Dark-types as a whole, but has terrible accuracy.
- Perish Song makes Gengar able to fit on PerishTrap teams, in which Shadow Tag comes in handy. It should, however, be noted that it is a very gimmicky strategy that is difficult to pull off and gets beaten by other common Ghost-types such as Aegislash and Gengar.

Checks and Counters
===================
**Typing Advantage**: Gengar has trouble dealing with Dark-types such as Bisharp, Hydreigon, and Hoopa-Unbound because of their ability to switch in to Shadow Ball easier and KO Mega Gengar in return. Bulkier Ghost-types such as Aegislash take a hit and KO in return as well. Ground-types such as Landorus-T can also simply just KO Mega Gengar with Earthquake.

**Speed**: Faster Pokemon such as Deoxys-A and Landorus-T can give Mega Gengar a tough time, as Deoxys-A simply KOs it with Psycho Boost and Landorus-T can be a nuisance with Rock Slide. Ludicolo and Kingdra in Rain can outspeed and KO Mega Gengar as well, but that is less of a threat when Rain isn't up. Talonflame can KO it with powerful priority Brave Birds. It also has to watch out for Sucker Punch from Mega Kangaskhan and Bisharp, but that can be avoided by simply burning them with Will-O-Wisp, which cripples and leaves them trapped at the same time.

**Speed control**: Mega Gengar does not like playing in opposing Tailwind from Talonflame and Zapdos or getting paralyzed by Thundurus as it takes away the speed advantage it has. Mega Gengar also dislikes other speed control, such as Icy Wind from Jirachi. Trick Room by setters such as Cresselia and Mega Gardevoir turns the tables against Mega Gengar, making it threatened by attackers in it, rather than threatening them outside of it.

[OVERVIEW]
With its stellar special attack and high speed in conjuction with its Shadow Tag ability which allows to trap foes which have a tough time harming Mega Gengar and the ability to threaten nearly all Trick Room setters with powerful Ghost STAB attack, Mega Gengar does very well as special attacker. Not only does it have powerful STAB attacks, it also has an unique assortment of support and disruption moves such as Taunt and Will-O-Wisp, which together with its high Speed allows Mega Gengar to be threatening utilitywise as well. As Gengar still has high speed, a Ghost-typing which is beneficial against Normal- and Fighting-type attackers, a useful immunity to Ground-type attacks with Levitate, decent offensive potential with relatively high Special Attack, and aforementioned supportive moves and Icy Wind let it effectively function as a check to numerous threats in the metagame, such as Mega Kangaskhan and Landorus-T. However, Gengar is very frail and gets KOd by many attacks it does not resist, and is almost guaranteed to get OHKOd by super effective hits. Gengar is also weak to speed control such as Trick Room, Tailwind, and faster attackers in general due to its frailty. Because of this, Gengar usually has to use a Focus Sash in order for it to not faint quickly.

[SET]
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Sludge Bomb
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Will-O-Wisp / Taunt
move 4: Protect
item: Gengarite
ability: Levitate
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
==========
Sludge Bomb is an impressive STAB attack which deals a lot of damage to anything that does not resist it. Shadow Ball is Gengar's second powerful STAB attack that it can use to hit opposing Ghost- and Psychic-types such as Cresselia, Jirachi, and Aegislash super effectively. Shadow Ball also has general better coverage, as it hits more typings for effective damage. Will-O-Wisp can cripple physical attackers such as Mega Kangaskhan which in conjuction with Shadow Tag makes them unswitchable liabilities on the field. Taunt also works to put a stop to Trick Room, or to avoid other status moves from being used, such as Zapdos's Tailwind, and redirection moves such as Amoonguss's Rage Powder. Substitute shields Mega Gengar from status moves, priority attacks, and other attacks that would normally threaten to deal significant damage to it. Protect is a crucial move in the Doubles metagame, as it allows Mega Gengar to protect itself from taking damage, while its partner deals with the opponent, or being able to stall out other field conditions such as Tailwind and Trick Room.

Set Details
==========
The EV spread is to allow Mega Gengar to go as fast and deal as much damage as possible. A Timid nature lets Mega Gengar outspeed Weavile after Mega evolution, while having more Speed in general. It also lets Gengar to speed tie against other base 110s, such as Mega Diancie and Latios, before Mega evolution.

Usage Tips
===========
Mega Gengar's uncommon Shadow Tag ability prevents foes from switching out, which can apply pressure to the opponent as being unable to switch can often be crippling when the foe has two liabilities on the field. Because of the pressure Shadow Tag applies, Mega Gengar is often used in the early- and mid-game, where it can trap and eliminate threats to the team with Shadow Tag and powerful STAB attacks in conjuction with its high offensive stats. However, Mega Gengar also does very well in the late-game, where it is able to clean up teams with its powerful attacks. Despite it doing well in the late-game, faster threats and threats with priority attacks have to be eliminated, due to Mega Gengar's frailty which makes it easy to revenge kill.

Team Options
============
Due to Mega Gengar's Shadow Tag ability, set up users such as Belly Drum Azumarill and Calm Mind Cresselia work well together as Gengar can trap threats that have a tough time harming Gengar's partner. Fighting- and Fairy-types such as Keldeo, Terrakion, and Sylveon help eliminate Dark-types that resist Mega Gengar's Shadow Ball. As Landorus-T threatens Mega Gengar with Earthquake, Water-types such as Rotom-Wash and Keldeo that can deal heavy damage to it, or Wide Guard users such as Conkeldurr that can block Earthquake are good partners. As Mega Gengar gets comfortably KOd by Talonflame, checks such as Landorus-T, Thundurus, and Rotom-Wash are handy as well. Intimidate users such as Landorus-T and Scrafty are useful too, as Mega Gengar struggles against physical attacks such as Sucker Punch.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Disable prevent someone from using their lastly used move for a few turns, which together with an Encore such as Whimsicott, can be very frustrating to play against due to Mega Gengar's trapping ability. Substitute and Disable is a good combination, as it can be tough to break a Substitute when the opponent's main attack is disabled. It works particularly well against Mega Kangaskhan, as Gengar can Disable its Sucker Punch and then set up Substitute on it, or KO it with Sludge Bomb. Focus Blast can OHKO Mega Kangaskhan and Heatran, while also doing more damage to Dark-types such as Hydreigon in general, while having terrible accuracy as drawback. Lastly, Perish Song can be used on PerishTrap teams, in which the Shadow Tag ability comes in handy. It should, however, be noted that it is tough to set up, and common Ghost-types such as Aegislash and opposing Gengar can easily beat it, by ignoring Shadow Tag.

Checks and Counters
===================
**Typing Advantage**: Gengar has trouble dealing with Dark-types such as Bisharp, Hydreigon, and Hoopa-Unbound because of their ability to switch in to Shadow Ball easier and KO Mega Gengar in return. Bulkier Ghost-types such as Aegislash take a hit and KO in return as well. Ground-types such as Landorus-T can also simply just KO Mega Gengar with Earthquake.

**Speed**: Faster Pokemon such as Deoxys-A and Landorus-T can give Mega Gengar a tough time, as Deoxys-A simply KOs it with Psycho Boost and Landorus-T can be a nuisance with Rock Slide. Ludicolo and Kingdra in Rain can outspeed and KO Mega Gengar as well, but that is less of a threat when Rain isn't up. Talonflame can KO it with powerful priority Brave Birds. It also has to watch out for Sucker Punch from Mega Kangaskhan and Bisharp, but that can be avoided by simply burning them with Will-O-Wisp, which cripples and leaves them trapped at the same time.

**Speed control**: Mega Gengar does not like playing in opposing Tailwind from Talonflame and Zapdos or getting paralyzed by Thundurus as it takes away the speed advantage it has. Mega Gengar also dislikes other speed control, such as Icy Wind from Jirachi. Trick Room by setters such as Cresselia and Mega Gardevoir turns the tables against Mega Gengar, making it threatened by attackers in it, rather than threatening them outside of it.
 
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notes:
I asked talkingtree and he said that Disable and Taunt could be checked as 3rd moves as well but for now I just went with Will-O-Wisp because I think everyone can agree that this is the best third move.

i don't know if i should put trick room in OO (Kyle used it once in SPL), but i think this is usually used for memes and i think most TR ghosts are better

not sure what else to put in for team options for regular gengar. regular gengar is extremely splashable and fits on anything that's like not TR. ttree said its fine like it is rn but i'd like more comment on it if its fine
 
Here goes another QC check lol. Implement for 1/3.

Overview
  • Explain that Gengar can stop TR going up as Shadow Ball OHKOes most setters, who are weak to Ghost.
  • "The Mega Evolution does even more damage."
  • Mention being outsped by Scarf Landorus-T. Also, "outsped by very few Pokemon".
  • Mention that Gengar is weak to speed control/faster threats due to its frailty.
Set
  • The new Move 3 is Will-O-Wisp / Taunt, with Substitute being in Moves without a slash.
Moves
  • Move the Taunt point to here after the Will-O-Wisp point.
  • Mention Substitute here after the above.
Set Details
  • Remove mention of megastone as it's unnecessary.
  • Mention that max Speed with Timid lets you tie with other base 110s pre-mega.
  • Mention that Modest leaves you slower than +Speed-natured base 100s and up pre-mega. Also mention that Modest lets Gengar OHKO Sylveon with Sludge Bomb.
Usage Tips
  • Remove the first point about using Sludge Bomb over Shadow Ball as it's common sense.
  • Mention that Mega Gengar's trapping capabilites are best used early- to mid-game, where it can trap and remove threats to your team.
  • Mention protecting while you mega evolve for the speed boost, especially for Modest.
  • Mega Gengar can clean late-game due to it's high Special Attack and Speed, however priority users need to be removed and the opponent's team weakened into range of its attacks due to Gengar's frailty.
  • Shadow Tag is still in effect even if Mega Gengar switches that turn, meaning that it can Protect on Pokemon which threaten it such as Scarf Landorus-T while a check is switched in, then Gengar can switch out safely while the foe is still trapped for a teammate to deal with that turn.
Team Options
  • Mention that setup mons appreciate Mega Gengar's trapping ability as it can trap mons that provide safe setup.
  • Mention Terrakion under Fighting-types as it is a great partner.
  • Remove mention of Rock Slide under Wide Guard as EQ is the real reason. Also remove Hariyama, as Conkeldurr is by far a better WG user and Hariyma is really only super niche and on Trick Room teams (unless you're Hashtag :P).
  • Mention that regular Gengar fits well on teams that need help against Mega Kangaskhan and Landorus-T.
  • Mention Landorus-T checks such as Rotom-W, etc.
  • Mention Intimidate users with examples due to Gengar's weakness to priority moves.
Other Options
  • Move Disable here and make a couple of changes. Firstly, Disable doesn't specifically stop the foe from using the same move twice in a row (that's Torment), it prevents them from using their lastly used move for a few turns, so make sure that's clear. Also, you could mention that one example of Disable being useful is using it against Mega Kangkaskhan as they Sucker Punch. Finally, mention Substitute + Disable being a good combination.
  • Mention that Focus Blast OHKOes Mega Kangaskhan and Heatran.
  • Remove Icy Wind, without Levitate you fayre far worse against Landorus-T, and you would be far better simply using one of your STABs against the Dragons (especially just OHKOing Latios with Shadow Ball).
  • Remove Taunt as it's on the set now.
  • Sludge Wave doesn't have a "big chance to poison" at only 10%, just say "a chance" or "a small chance". Also mention spread reduction.
  • Mention how perishtrap is gimmicky and difficult to pull off.
Checks and Counters
  • Add this section!!! ("exclamations make me excited!")
  • The tags you'd want to have are Typing Advantage (talk about Dark-types, also Aegis since it tanks a Shadow Ball and KOes in return), Speed (Scarf Lando-t and Deo-A, Kingdra and Ludicolo under Rain, also Talon and Sucker Punch users), and Speed Control (Tailwind, T-wave, TR etc.)
 
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like OO it but what the fuck is it doing as a slash?

edit: cuz modest is fucking stupid
 
OV
  • A lot of your points here are, in all honesty, fluff. A good portion of the points here are pointless, obvious, or easily seen from the dex and don't prove and notable point or significant niche. I'll list some of them out for you:
- Great Speed and Special Attack allow it to function well as a special attacker.
- Poweful STAB attacks, being Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb.

As standalone and lead points, the two above are weak and useless. That and these points can easily be seen from the dex. Having powerful STAB attacks are hardly niches; we don't talk about Thundurus having access to Thunderbolt or Charizard having access to Heat Wave and Overheat. Ideally, you'd want these points to back up some other, more solid point.

- A great supportive movepool with moves such as Icy Wind, Taunt, and Will-O-Wisp, which makes its a great offensive support.

As a supporting point on how regular forme Gengar can function as a utility check to a good portion of notable threats, this would be good. On its own, however, this is just no, bro.

- Levitate is an useful ability that negates one of Gengar's weaknesses, Ground-type attacks.

fluff, get this out

- It also has a much better Speed stat, making Mega Gengar outsped by very few Pokemon such as Deoxys-A, Mega Aerodactyl, and Choice Scarf Landorus-T.

You don't have to mention / imply Mega Evolution boosting stats, that's both obvious and already seen from the dex. Simply saying that it's fast is enough.
  • Just, from the get-go state its biggest niche: Shadow Tag. How is it relevant? What makes it unique? In an overview, you have to out and present a mon's niches as best as possible. This applies for every mon.
  • Mention that along with its trapping capabilities, Mega Gengar "also has a unique assortment of support and disruption moves such as Taunt and Will-O-Wisp that it can use in conjunction with its high Speed, enough to outrun the unboosted metagame except for Deoxys-A and Mega Aerodactyl." This is where my earlier point about using statements to back up others comes into play. In one go, I managed to say the Gar is a trapper with access to support moves and has high Speed.
  • Also mention that Mega Gengar can take also function as an offensive threat while trapping things using its high SpA and that in particular, its Ghost STAB is often effective against Trick Room leads. In one go, you can manage to say that MGar has high SpA and has good STAB without being barebones.
  • You can have more lines about regular forme Gengar tbh. Say that as its still relatively high Speed, Ghost-typing, immunity to Ground, decent offensive potential, andaccess to already mentioned supportive moves and Icy Wind let it effectively function as a utility check to numerous threats in the meta such as Mega Kangaskhan and Landorus-T.
  • Mention that due to its frailty, Gengar is reliant on Focus Sash.
Moves
  • Change the order of the set. Sludge Bomb should go first, Shadow Ball follows.
  • You don't have to mention the poison chance on Sludge Bomb. Just state that it's a general strong STAB move.
  • State that Shadow Ball, while weaker than Sludge Bomb, has better neutral coverage and hits <whatever you mentioned>
  • Don't say that Will-O-Wisp is "a great move" as that's just simply fluff and tells the reader nothing. Your explenation is also a bit off and you don't have to mention Kang here. Just say that Wisp cripples physical attackers, which in conjunction with Shadow Tag makes them unswitchable liabilities on the field or something.
  • Just say it stops said moves from setting up. Don't "hardstop" or whatever that is lol.
  • Explain Sub much more simply. Just simply state that Sub shields Gar from priority and attacks that normally threaten to deal significant damage to it.
SD
  • D O N T S L A S H M O D E S T
  • Remove the bit about Modest while you're at it.
UT
  • The first point is so horribly specific. Remove that l o l
  • Remove any mentions of Modest
  • Mention that in particular, Mega Gengar can help take out a specific threat in order to let a teammate clean up later. If you want an example, removing Amoong can help out BD Azu a lot.
  • Make a general first point about its trapping abilities and how it preventing foes from switching can apply pressure and shit.
TO
  • Remove Tailwind. Anything in general appreciates Speed Control so unless a mon needs it we shouldn't mention it. Mega Gengar is already fast so yeah.
  • Mention Thund or Rotom-W (or both) instead of Rhyperior when mentioning Talon checks.
  • Remove the last 4 points lol. You don't need those.
OO
  • When mentioning an Encore user on the Disable bit, mention Whimsicott.
  • Remove Sludge Wave it's H O R R I B L E
C&C
  • Mention specific Dark-types in Typing Advantage.
  • Speed: Mention Scarf Landog instead of Aero as the former is much more relevant. DONT MENTION SCARF HYDREI.
  • Instead of simply saying "outplayed" say that MGar can avoid Sucker by simply burning them with WoW, crippling and leaving them trapped at the same time.
  • Speed Control: Rework this section please. Just say that Tailwind and Thunder Wave takes away its Speed Advantage. Mention users. Trick Room turns the tables against it. Mention users. Icy Wind. Mention users.
2/3 once implemented but dear lord...
 
asked Memoric if he could check if I implemented it well. made a small change and it's 2/3 now so I'm going to write it up later.
 
I'm not an official C&C person but i suppose in other options (or EVs not sure where it would go?) I think that 12 HP / 80 Def / 164 SpA / 252 Spe is a better EV spread on the standard 2 attacks Mega Gengar to survive a Talonflame BB and a -1 EQ from Choice Scarf Landorus-T.
252+ Atk Life Orb Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 12 HP / 80 Def Mega Gengar: 222-263 (84 - 99.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
-1 252+ Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 12 HP / 80 Def Mega Gengar: 212-252 (80.3 - 95.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

I'm flattered that you brought up my Trick Room Gengar from SPL but I wouldn't put it here.

The last thing I wanted to bring up was that when you mention Perish Song you should probably include that it's used on bulkier Gengar and almost always with Disable.

sorry if the formatting for this was wrong :/
 
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i just realized that this isn't being done in the write format. Gengar utilizes 2 sets --> mega and sash non-mega and this doesn't account for the non-mega --> a full gengar revamp would be done with both sets but this is a full revamp being done with just one

QC reject 1/3
 
Between the confusing wording, the lack of distinction between the different Gengar forms, and the inconsistency of the information, I'm afraid I have to agree with shaian. There's too many problems here to be able to fix in one check.

QC Reject 2/3
 
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