Omastar is a competent set-up sweeper that sets up on prevalent threats such as Ho-Oh and Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, and then continue to OHKO the majority of the metagame. It can be imposter-proofed somewhat easily with Ferrothorn, Amoonguss, Shedinja or Chansey. It can use Weak Armor boosts to come in on threats it usually can't switch into such as Zacian-C's Crunch/Play Rough and OHKO back. It can use Air Balloon to set up against Primal Groudon and Arceus-Ground, and then OHKO back with Max Quake/Max Geyser. It has little to no drawback, in the majority of matches I've brought it I find myself at least getting one important removal, and that's in the worst case scenario: Ditto. Generally, it's a better Mega Blastoise in a metagame that gets absolutely bombarded by Special Attackers. Teams don't prepare for these sort of threats and hence are overwhelmed rather easily. I implore people to check it out.how does this get ranked?
You have to keep in mind that I'm still very unfamiliar w/ the gen 8 meta and tbh have no idea what I'm talking about. Everything I said in the video was from observations I've had of a very small sample size.tttg's whole reasoning in the video for dropping ultra necrozma relied on not being able to set up dd with ultra necrozma? which seems more than silly to me, regardless, ultra necrozma remains potent enough for a-.
This is AG, people disagreeing with you is not good.the worst thing that happens is people disagree with your nomination,
I'm going to give this a bit of a pass, as I will assume said niches mentioned that Xern has was no referring to Yveltal lacking these qualities. But as I just stated, these supposed "niches" are not unique in any way to it, so I still fail to understand. Yes, it forces Dynamax. So does Yveltal. If the opponent fails to Dynamax vs Yveltal, they're likely losing multiple Pokemon, the same as Xerneas. The next point after this is implied from the first and my rebuttal so I won't cover it but I do feel like I need to explain why it is so insanely hard to justify using another offensive Dmax mon over Yveltal, something I only touched upon in my video.all seven of us believe s is accurate, not really outclassed by yveltal at all, sure it has stiff competetion as a dynamax sweeper but generally has niches like forcing opponents to dynamax to check it which can aid teammates, prevents opponents from using dmax yveltal or whatever dedicated sweeper they have and eases matchup.
I explained in quite a bit of detail about why Guss fails to check Xerneas, and why that isn't a reason for C rank anyway. I am quite tired of this line, as the argument falls apart once you look beyond the surface of "haha brrrr Clear Smog removes boosts brrrr". The "fairly easily" part is quite baffling to be quite frank, as this isn't even reflected on the VR slate, where Amoong only managed to stay C by one singular vote. I don't know how this is a blatant C rank mon if the council cannot even internally agree on it.amoonguss checks xerneas, ogre, groundceus, switches into most special threats with ease, you do what amoonguss does by now. it justifies c rank fairly easily, and sees use semi-frequently on serious teams.
I cannot disagree more strongly with this nomination. While prank haze is useful, it comes on such an otherwise useless mon that it should by no means be ranked. Murkrow dies in one shot to anything, and doesn’t even “check” geoxern since it dies immediately afterwards. I also disagree strongly with your other comments in this post. Geoxern should NEVER run psyshock, because it gives up the ability to damage either Ho-oh or NDM, both of which are more common than Chansey / Amoonguss. Geoxern also gets hardcountered by many things in a way that yveltal never is, making it dramatically less effective.I would like to nominate and share my opinion on other noms.
Noming Murkrow from UR to D
Murkrow's combination of prankster+haze is excellent in a meta where everything is broken and Geoherb Xerneas, Rock Polish Pdon, Ditto, Moody Smeargle are everywhere. As an offensive Dark-Flying type it's outclassed by Yveltal (I mean ofc it would since it's S+ Rank and also has taunt, defog, and swagplay) but Yveltal doesn't have Haze. That makes it a check to Xerneas, Pdon, and boosted Ditto. So it definitely has its niche over Yveltal and is worth using. C- or even C wouldn't be that bad either.
As for previous noms (these are the ones I mostly care about, so sorry no Arceus-Electric):
Xerneas from S to S-
The deer was and in my opinion still is one of the best Pokémon in the tier, shaping the metagame around it. I haven't seen things such as Chansey/Amoongus/NDM stall teams and it can handle them with Psyshock and HP Fire anyway, so it should stay where it is.
Deoxys-Speed from B to B+
The fastest unboosted SR lead and taunt user in the tier, not accounting for Prankster priority (Murkrow, Grimmsnarl etc.). Deoxys-Speed is indeed better than B. It can set up dual screens easily without getting destroyed by proactive Xerneas. I don’t think it should get past A- though. It’s also quite versatile.
Last post of this argument from me, but WHY THE FUCK are you running attacks on DEO-S it should under NO circumstances use any offensive moves beyond, say, knock off. If you want something fast with a lot of power, run Deo-A. You should NEVER run any non-suicide lead set on Deo-s, simply because its attacking stats are absolutely atrocious. Deo-s should never be used a revenge killer, because it doesn’t have the firepower to actually revenge kill ANYTHING. Also it kinda defeats the point of a suicide lead to run a 4 attacks set, don’t you think?Xerneas falls to Zacian-C and NDM after Haze, as it CANNOT geomancy twice. Murkrow is meant to shut down sweeps, not stay alive throughout the game and swagplay or do whatever as that’s outclassed by Yveltal. As for the HO rant...
HO ISN’T bad in the current meta. Zacian-C is more common than ever, and so is Mega-Ray and Xerneas. After they setup, they are almost unstoppable unless you have a Ditto or something like that. Just because bulkier threats such as Ho-Oh, NDM, etc. etc. have also become popular DOESN'T mean that HO totally sucks. HO should never be underestimated. Deoxys-Speed is the fastest unboosted Pokémon, so even if you switch into a mon that doesn't care about Taunt (e.g. Zacian-C) it will still attack you first, and it has a lot of attacks (Psychic, Psyshock, Focus Blast, Thunderbolt, etc.) INCLUDING all HP variants. Excadrill doesn't have a SE move, neither it ohkos it with EQ, and if Deo has Focus Blast, it obliterates it. In case you think it is frail like Deo-Attack, it's not. Thanks for understanding!
So 95 base special attack is considered bad. Sure, it isn't as much as many other mons and doesn't even compare to the Primal Kyogre's 180 stat, but it's actually not that bad and definitely workable.
Deoxys-Speed @ Focus Sash
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Focus Blast
This set can beat Excadrill without completely sacrificing the suicide lead role.
A suicide lead is the definition of a lead with USUALLY low defenses that attempts to set up entry hazards while preventing the opponent from doing the same. Excadrill can't OHKO Deo-Speed with EQ. Deo obviously outspeeds so unless Focus Miss happens this set beats excadrill while still being effective as a suicide lead. What do you think?
I'm just going to completely ignore the use of Focus Miss over Superpower and just take your post as meaning "RUN FIGHTING COVERAGE". Beating excadrill is completely beside the point; in fact, Deoxys-S is already ranked higher than it and as you can see by my other linked post, other people have already considered that. A bigger problem, in my opinion, is the fact that it doesn't provide any other utility than hazards, and it often fails in even that because it often only gets one real shot at putting up hazards, and then something like HDB Ho-Oh (common) can just come in later and remove them without taking any damage from them in the process. Besides, almost everything that would be dealt with just with hazards runs HDB (looking at lunala/lugia).AG Set Compendium said:Deoxys-Speed @ Focus Sash
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave / Magic Coat / Superpower
HP fire turns into max flare, yes even now today.Looking back at my previous posts from a more serious perspective, they were absolutely laughable. Murkrow's Prankster+Haze niche is totally outclassed by Marshadow. It's outclassed by other Prankster users and Yveltal at everything else.
Geoxern's moveset should always be Geomancy-Moonblast-Thunderbolt-HP Fire as Psyshock means that while it can beat Chansey and AV Amoonguss, it can't beat more important threats such as Ho-Oh. Xerneas doesn't have to rely on Dynamax to sweep. In fact, sweeping with Dynamax is more unreliable because of the fact that HP Fire turns into Max Strike instead of Max Flare now. Pdon resists or is immune to all of its moves, so it MUST be removed before attempting to sweep with Geomancy. Almost every AG team has a Xern check without even thinking about it (Zacian-C, NDM, Ho-Oh, Amoonguss, Chansey, Pdon etc.). Maybe it should drop to S- after all.
Deo-S should either stay in B, or drop to B-/C+. HDB Ho-Oh can't defog if it gets taunted, which is very likely, but it can switch out and then back in when Deo faints unless Mega Gengar is on the same team. I should also point out that Deo is outclassed as a dualscreener by Grimmsnarl, which has a better typing and Prankster.
It's not a glitch! That's how Multi Attack works in-game (displaying as Max Strike included), so it was decided that that was the most cartridge-accurate way to interpret Hidden Power's mechanics as well, since Hidden Power itself isn't available to test. C:When I checked Xern's HP Fire Dynamax move it said "Max Strike", but using it results into Max Flare. It might be a glitch. Thanks for correcting!
Heyy fren I appreciate you outlining your thoughts, definitely think some of your reasoning is the best I've seen for a Xerneas drop. I do disagree with some points but I agree SpD Ho-Oh eases the matchup to a point where you sometimes can afford not to Dynamax + NDM primarily being used to check Zacian although I think this is only a pluspoint for Xerneas. I still think Xerneas is an S-rank presence, but nevertheless we will revote on it.
I disagree with this heavily. AG is a melting pot of innovation and new ideas, and for me D rank has always represented a place for out there strats that can succeed to reside. Part of the reason why I play AG is for the fun and creative aspects, and nuking D rank makes it feel more like some rigid VR for an official format, and not some basically Pet Mod one. Omastar and Genesect don't even fit the definition, idk why you're using Council ineptitude as a reason to remove stuff. It also doesn't make much sense as I'd probably see us having to divide up C rank cuz there is some clearly outclassed Pokemon there, which just creates more work for no reason.Remove D-rank:
It's not a secret that the lowermost echelon of the VR for this particular metagame is an extremely subjective and largely unnecessary part. The fact that we are forced to consistently rank Pokemon such as Omastar and Genesect solely because they fit the definition of this particular rank is just extremely arbitrary and subject to reconsideration on a constant basis. Therefore, I do not see the point of keeping this rank as it adds next to nothing contentwise to the VR and unnecessarily adds a layer of unwanted arbitrariness. We must of course revote on all D-ranks to C if this passes through, as I do think some of the D-rank Pokemon deserve a place in the VR.