Tournament National Dex Premier League - Announcement and Formats Discussion

[dhelmise]

(banner pending)​

Hello everyone! I am going to be one of the hosts for National Dex Premier League. Manager signups will go up in about a week, but we wanted some community feedback on the tier selection that we have so far, as well as suggestions to improve the layout if you have any, before going forward with signups.

Here is the current format selection we have:

• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• Best-of-3 National Dex OU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex AG

All formats are best-of-1 unless stated otherwise.

We would love to hear some discussion and feedback!

 

[UnbecomingDuck]

Can we get some NatDex BH rep pls

make BH great again

 

[tiasu]

Time to get drafted for 500

Jokes aside, been waiting for NDPL, and the format selection seems fine to me, maybe 1 more UU? Not sure about the stray bo3 as well but I'm all for it. Like the post above said maybe OMs for NatDex could be included as well?

 

[Avery]

i like the idea of including another uu and another ag match because i feel like they could use some more representation, otherwise it looks fine

e: if teams have the player count this works if not keep it as is

 

[ShionShadows]

Im definitely in for NatDex OM's. It would make PL more interesting(imo) along with allowing for those who gravitate towards OM's to be more interested in the PL and shine a bit more than they would normally

 

[Mr. Mime fan]

NatDex 1v1?
Could we manage to see that being included?
it’s a natdex OM With a good playerbase that could see some representation here

 

[The Number Man]

Natdex oms would be nice ngl

 

[Ka1xo]

Honestly if natdex mnm is a possibility then id be more than happy to play that and all the other gen7mnm players would love it too, also possible natdex ag oms would be very interesting if possible

 

[Jordy]

I personally like the format that was laid out in the OP the most. The regular National Dex slots are self explanatory. With National Dex UU developping further and ultimately getting its own ladder, I'd definitely like for it to get more exposure with 2 slots. I don't think National Dex AG needs more slots as they just had AGPL. 7 slots seem ideal to me considering the current size of our overall playerbase.

National Dex OMs are fun, but I don't think they're fit for this tournament just yet. Their relative development and playerbase is generally small, which leads me to believe that they wouldn't be very sustainable formats for every team at this point in time.

 

[LORD SAGIS]

• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• Best-of-3 National Dex OU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex AG

I think there are too many OU slots at the moment. Since AG is going Galar Dex soon now would be a good time to make one of those OU slots into a AG slot.

I don't think OM slots are worth it at the moment since they have very small player base meaning trying to find a player for it would be very difficult.

 

[ImperialGamer517]

I think there are too many OU slots at the moment. Since AG is going Galar Dex soon now would be a good time to make one of those OU slots into a AG slot.

I don't think OM slots are worth it at the moment since they have very small player base meaning trying to find a player for it would be very difficult.

Agree with this. I think it is a bit unfair that there are 2 NatDex OU and UU slots, and isn’t NatDex AG more (I think) popular than NatDex UU? Also probably no extra Bo3 since I would count they as a NatDex OU slot.

 

[WolfishOne]

I think there are too many Nat Dex OU slots. While it is the primary format smth like Nat Dex Bh or 1v1 would be cool

 

[Pabloaram]

Maybe 1 more AG or UBER in the place of BO3 OU.. I like this type o variety

 

[Kate]

One Ag Slot to Rule them all, One Slot to find them
One Ag Slot to bring them all and in the darkness bind them

 

[N_Mareanie]

personally think natdex UU deserves one more slot, considering the playerbase is growing and is getting quite some more recognition as of late :)

 

[Guard]

I mostly agree on the format presented in the OP. There's just one thing I'd like to see differently with respect to the best-of-three slot.

To be frank, I don't really see the point in a best-of-three slot that is completely dedicated to National Dex OU. Allotting six out of nine matches to National Dex OU is a missed opportunity for some more variety in the tournament, a concern that has already been voiced in this thread a few times.

My proposal would be to allocate the best-of-three slot to all three of AG, OU, and UU, rather than merely to OU. I believe the slot will wield higher levels of competition that way, be more enjoyable for the spectators, and be ground for more interaction within teammates when it comes to the preparation that comes with it. Moreover, best-of-three slots often historically feature the most skilled players in the tournament. Thus, a 'multi-metagame' best-of-three could be a good way to introduce elite National Dex OU players to National Dex AG/UU and vice versa.

Having said that, I do not think National Dex OMs have the necessary playerbase and development in order to warrant and maintain their own slot, but I'm willing to discuss National Dex BH.

 

[Cold Apple Soda]

I agree with the format, the extra representation of UU is hella lit definitely not biased here cause i'm TL for it It's definitely gonna give UU some much needed help in gaining some exposure.

 

[Solaros & Lunaris]

While I like the format presented in the OP, I agree with Guardsweeper on changing the BO3 format to 1 OU, 1 UU, and 1 AG. In the current format, we get 6 OU games, 2 UU games, and 1 AG game. I don’t think this is a fair portion of games to go by, as OU gets double UU and AG’s games combined. With the format Guardsweeper has outlined, we get 4 OU games, 3 UU games, and 2 AG games. This is a much more fair (imo) representation of National Dex rather than just OU with two side formats. The BO3 format would also let players in experienced in more than one tier not let their knowledge be “wasted”. While AG still only receives 2 games, they also have an AGPL of their own, so relatively reduced representation should be fine.

Edit: I don’t think National Dex OMs are worth adding at the moment. While some like BH and 1v1 have been dove into, they haven’t necessarily been fully fleshed out. I definitely wouldn’t exclude them from next year though, as they will have fully developed by then.

 

[Padstar34]

I would like more UU rep but I'm trash at it so please only do 1 UU game lol.
As for AG idrc

 

[The Number Man]

Actually going to offer some insight now that I've seen what others had to say and had some time to think about this. I know im not a true staff member though, so feel free to disregard this.

1) I agree that there's probably too many OU slots compared to other formats. UU and AG have a large enough playerbase that filling another slot shouldn't be too hard. Also, ND UU shouldn't be hard to pick up for ND OU players anyway.

2) On the topic of Natdex OMs. Most of the arguments against ND OMs state that these metas just don't have an established enough playerbase to fill out the slots, ie:

Edit: I don’t think National Dex OMs are worth adding at the moment. While some like BH and 1v1 have been dove into, they haven’t necessarily been fully fleshed out. I definitely wouldn’t exclude them from next year though, as they will have fully developed by then.

Having said that, I do not think National Dex OMs have the necessary playerbase and development in order to warrant and maintain their own slot.

National Dex OMs are fun, but I don't think they're fit for this tournament just yet. Their relative development and playerbase is generally small, which leads me to believe that they wouldn't be very sustainable formats for every team at this point in time.

I'd like to offer a counterpoint. I like playing most OMs. I think I'd enjoy playing most natdex OMs as well. But, despite this fact, I mostly get into a particular OM if there's some kind of tour going on as I don't really enjoy OM ladders. The ND OMs room is a week old afaik, so the playerbase obviously isn't very big - I wish I could have participated more but I'm currently busy (so I don't even know if I'm gonna be able to sign up for this team tour, regardless of whether OMs are included or not). But my main point is - maybe being featured in a team tour is exactly what natdex OMs need to actually grow a playerbase. Team tours have a tendency to attract non mains to formats anyway.
Maybe you could do a poll or something, to see if there is actually enough interest in ND OMs to warrant inclusion, similar to how the OM snake final format was determined.

 

[AwakenedG]

Where do i sign up for the ou tourney?

 

[Ainzcrad]

• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• Best-of-3 National Dex OU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex AG

on the tier picks i honestly think that there is a overusage of natdex ou. Seeing that mutiple people here suggested natdex ag as a extra tier of natdex uu is smth i personally disagree, adding another natdex ag forces people more to play the tier they dont want to since there arent as many active for real natdex agers rn as there was. Proof is that based on ag ssnls signups, the natdex ag mains didnt even signup and overall the players a bit weaker then the last ssnls if u ask me. Natdex uu two slots makes the tier more over explored which helps the tier hopefully move forward. That being said i still would think that removing one slot of natdex ou is the way. Tiers like natdex bh has a playerbase large enough to hopefully support good games to watch+players to play/learn and maybe get more omers into the natdex scene. Other options for sure are the other natdex oms but from what i have noticed in cords+ladder is that bh again has a larger playerbase.

That being said i didnt notice the bo3 natdex ou slot but on that all tiers over 3 ou. For more interesting series and giving more chances to overall players to shine instead of again ou 3 slots is already enough 0_0

Forgot to add the structure so

• National Dex OU
• National Dex OU
• National Dex BH
• Best-of-3 National Dex OU,UU,AG
• National Dex UU
• National Dex UU
• National Dex AG

 

[Geysers]

My view on the optimal tier choices is, admittedly, somewhat skewed because I’m an AG main, but I think that the benefit of having a dedicated bo3 ndou slot is kinda nonexistent because players can choose to do a bo3 anyway if they want. To that end, my ideal format structure would be 3 ndou, 2 nduu, and 2 ndag. I understand that signups for the last ag ssnl were underwhelming, but I think that’s mainly because a lot of people don’t need it to qualify for ag circuit playoffs, so they just decided to sit it out.

Ideal structure:

• NDOU
• NDOU
• NDOU
• NDUU
• NDUU
• NDAG
• NDAG

Alternatively, an OU / UU / AG Bo3 slot could be pretty cool too.

 

[pulsar512b]

my ideal (as a nat dex ou main that feels that nat dex ag is so different from nat dex ou i feel it should have a minor role):
Nat Dex OU Bo3
Nat Dex OU Bo3
Nat Dex OU Bo1
Nat Dex AG Bo1
Nat Dex AG Bo3
Nat Dex UU Bo1
Nat Dex UU Bo3

 

[Chessking345]

Biased opinion here but I think NatDex BH is a pretty reasonable format to add, despite the potential lack of a playerbase.
NDBH is easily the most active and well developed ND OM. The tier is well balanced, with a few aspects that are potentially overbearing in terms of balance but not significantly impacting the tier's playability and enjoyableness. It is also thoroughly developed, an advantage it has over the other OMs, but still has lots of possibilities to experiment and explore because of being a BH format as well as the wide variety of mons available. The tier also has fully developed resources, including an actively updated VR, a few sample teams, and a SetPedia making it possible for new players to pick up the tier relatively quickly once they pick up the basic BH stuff. Discussion on the tier is also reasonably active, whether it's on smogon or cord, and the tier has a reasonably active ladder.
I can see a counterpoint being made that NDBH recently had a tour (about to finish) but I think this is a positive as it means that the tier has been further developed through an official tour with decent size.