Announcement National Dex UU Suspect 10: Monster Mash (Melmetal Suspect)

Status
Not open for further replies.
:melmetal:

:ss/melmetal:

Just replace every mention of "mash" with "bash". Y'know, because Double Iron Bash. Only two people
suggested anything to me and one was a meme song and the other was an anime OP, so arguably not
mainstream enough. The OP was a banger though.

Given the overwhelming support for some sort of suspect at some point in the near future in the recent survey, and the fact we have come to believe it has reached the point it is too much, we have decided to suspect test Melmetal!

Suspect Reasoning:

Melmetal has been a top threat ever since it dropped, boasting an absurdly powerful Iron Fist boosted Double Iron Bash, fantastic physical bulk and good enough special bulk, on top of just enough coverage to hit most things in the tier. Even without a boosting item like Choice Band or Life Orb, it is capable of 2HKOing all but the bulkiest physical walls, or Pokemon that quad resist Double Iron Bash like Rotom-Wash. This is to the extent that most Melmetal run Protective Pads to negate Rocky Helmet chip instead, and Choice Band is only rarely seen in tour games where the opponent is known to use shaky checks to Melmetal like SpDef Swampert. Revenge killing it is often made tricky by its immense physical bulk, letting it live all but the strongest of STAB super effective hits.

Despite all of this, for a long time, it has been kept in check by a decent selection of Pokemon, like Skarmory, the Rotoms, Moltres, PhysDef Tangrowth, PhysDef Hippowdon, and, either in a pinch or with a PhysDef set, Swampert. In addition, due to its poor speed and lack of recovery, it finds itself quickly worn down and struggling to come in on anything due to the sheer number of Pokemon that outspeed it and can threaten to finally bring it down. It also initially struggled to run Leftovers due to the number of Rocky Helmet Pokemon that were prevalent for a long time and the nature of Double Iron Bash as a multi-hit contact move, exacerbating the issue.

As time progressed, however, new Melmetal variations and sets emerged that jeopardised the effectiveness of its checks, and meta shifts have been more and more favourable to Melmetal – Thunder Wave Melmetal, in tandem with Double Iron Bash having an effective 51% flinch chance due to each hit having a 30% chance to flinch, allowed it to paraflinch down the likes of Skarmory, Moltres, Defensive Buzzwole and Tangrowth, ordinarily solid checks, and often still leaving enough PP for Double Iron Bash to obliterate a few Pokemon after. Protect + Toxic sets, or ProTox sets as they’re called, allowed it to spread Toxic against several checks more easily, come in on certain Pokemon like Nihilego more often, and let the passive recovery of Leftovers more easily offset Rocky Helmet chip damage. The more recent double status set allows it to bypass the issue of it struggling against checks immune to one or the other of its status moves, at the cost of having to pick between hitting either Celesteela, Slowking and Skarmory, or Aegislash.

Additionally, thanks to the rise of Protective Pads Taunt Urshifu-Rapid-Strike, and the fact that most Melmetal ran Protective Pads anyways, Rocky Helmet usage has taken a significant hit as it simply isn’t as useful as it once was. Celesteela also generally usurping Skarmory as the defensive Steel/Flying of choice due to its special bulk simply being more relevant has also made Skarmory, an already shaky check to Melmetal but one of the better shaky checks, generally worse, narrowing the pool of defensive counterplay significantly as it was formerly its by far most splashable one.

This has generally resulted in the rise of niche Pokemon like Gligar (though it at least also walls Aegislash and Nihilego), generally regarded to be the closest thing to a true Melmetal counter thanks to its immunity to Toxic and Thunder Wave, while also being naturally faster. It can also lead to awkward scenarios where one either has to focus on pressuring Melmetal offensively or run multiple defensive checks if Gligar doesn't fit on the team, which is frequently.

However, Melmetal is still not flawless. Most Melmetal sets have to pick between one set of mons or another entirely different set of mons to annoy or beat. Its low speed and the fact its typing is one of the single most targeted defensive types in the game means it struggles to come in safely far more than its defensive stats would imply, though this is less present for the ProTox set. This means that Melmetal can be pressured more easily than most and often needs pivoting support to come in, but given two of its best pivoting partners are in A+, it's debatable how much this is a downside.

Additionally, while it can paraflinch checks down, it still comes down to a series of chances, and Double Iron Bash only has 8 PP, meaning even parad checks may end up beating it anyways in the long haul (though if the check is weak to a coverage move, this reduces the number of flinches needed dramatically). The odds are still in Melmetal's favour, however. Overall, we believe Melmetal is more than deserving of a suspect test at this point in time.

Suspect Test Information
  • Reading this is mandatory to participate in the suspect test. The voting requirements are a minimum GXE of 79 with at least 40 games played. In addition, you may play 1 less game for every 0.2 GXE you have above 79 GXE, down to a minimum of 20 games at a GXE of 83. Also, needing more than 40 games to reach 79 GXE will suffice.
  • GXEminimum games
    7940
    79.239
    79.438
    79.637
    79.836
    8035
    80.234
    80.433
    80.632
    80.831
    8130
    81.229
    81.428
    81.627
    81.826
    8225
    82.224
    82.423
    82.622
    82.821
    8320
  • You must use a fresh account that begins with the given prefix for this suspect test. That prefix is NDUUMELM. For example, I could signup and qualify with the name NDUUMELM Niadev.
  • You may not impersonate or mock another user with your account name. If there is any slight hesitation, you're probably better off picking a different name. We reserve the right to null your voting requisites if you are found impersonating or mocking another user with your account name. Moderator discretion will be applied.
  • If you are found trying to manipulate voting requisites in any way, you will be met with a harsh infraction. Manipulating voting requisites ranges from faking your screenshot to asking another user to forfeit.
  • The Pokemon that's being suspect tested, Melmetal, will be allowed on the National Dex UU ladder for the next two weeks so that we can properly assess its position in the metagame.
  • This suspect test will go on for two weeks. It will last until April the 16th at 11:59 PM GMT+1.
 
1648926097444.png
 
To be honest I've thought for a while that melmetal is unhealthy for the tier, but having played a bit more I've come to the opposite conclusion. This mon isn't super broken, its definitely a great mon with amazing traits, but there is one MAJOR flaw holding this thing back from true dominance.

1: It is slow. This may seem passable on a defensively orientated mon, but despite this things great defenses and typing as well as access to assault vest it still has trouble taking strong super effective hits like specs/orb nidoking's earth power when even partly chipped. Other common threats like hippo, steela and skarm can also deal with most melmetal sets effectively as well.

I know this is a bit of a brief analysis, so I apologize if it feels like I half assed this, but to be honest melmetal only real downside in my opinion is that its speed really cripples it at times, not to mention the threat of it getting burned. Tbh, I'm open to be convinced this thing doesn't belong in ND UU, but as of now I will be voting to NOT BAN melmetal.
 
Other common threats like hippo, steela and skarm can also deal with most melmetal sets effectively as well.
This is just simply not true. Hippowdon is not a good Melmetal check due to the fact Melmetal is generally faster and will ultimately flinch it down with Double Iron Bash. The Toxic set is an even worse case for it. EQ also just doesn't do a ton to Melmetal because of its gigantic physical bulk

Thunder Punch is standard on most Melmetal, and considering Celesteela never runs Physically Defensive sets, it's not a good counter, especially because it has no reliable recovery.

Skarmory loses to its current best set, being Pads + TWave. Body Press doesn't do enough and you just get ParaFlinched down.

Melmetal's speed is a downside, yes, but having a great typing + good Physical bulk compliments that. TWave sets can also get around this problem, and despite its low speed stat Melmetal often still gets plenty of chances to attack in a game, be it vs pokemon like nihilego or mega altaria.
 
To be honest I've thought for a while that melmetal is unhealthy for the tier, but having played a bit more I've come to the opposite conclusion. This mon isn't super broken, its definitely a great mon with amazing traits, but there is one MAJOR flaw holding this thing back from true dominance.

1: It is slow. This may seem passable on a defensively orientated mon, but despite this things great defenses and typing as well as access to assault vest it still has trouble taking strong super effective hits like specs/orb nidoking's earth power when even partly chipped. Other common threats like hippo, steela and skarm can also deal with most melmetal sets effectively as well.

I know this is a bit of a brief analysis, so I apologize if it feels like I half assed this, but to be honest melmetal only real downside in my opinion is that its speed really cripples it at times, not to mention the threat of it getting burned. Tbh, I'm open to be convinced this thing doesn't belong in ND UU, but as of now I will be voting to NOT BAN melmetal.
A pokemon being "slow" is not a anti-ban argument on it's own. There are plenty of examples where tiers, older or current, where slow pokemon were suspected and banned, or even quickbanned off their other strong, overwhelming or centralizing traits. If it were possible, I would add more reasons why you think it is not unhealthy, such as several valid switch-ins that beat it consistently, or valid revenge killers that punish it for getting a kill. I don't think the tier has these options currently, so simply I think Melmetal should be banned. Most of it's answers lack consistent recovery, so trying to check this thing over the course of a game is a nightmare.
 
Melmetal should be banned from National Dex UU.

National Dex UU is, as we all well know, full of offensive threats. These include, but are not limited to Mega Altaria, Urshifu-RS, Aegislash, Moltres, Celesteela, Nihilego, Zarude, Galarian Moltres and ofcourse Melmetal itself. Teambuilding itself can already be quite challenging, and in my honest opinion, a good metagame is when the playstyle Bulky Offense is the most dominant and consistent. It means there's a good balance between offensive and defensive threats and the metagame is relatively stable. Because of the overload of threats residing within the tier, it can be quite challenging to make proper builds. I often experience that when I am done building a team, I always lose to at least one of the top offensive threats. The only time this doesn't happen is when I purposely use the same Pokemon over and over again (since that build is the most consisent) or just choose to ignore the threat that is used the least. This is not the sign of a healthy tier, and Melmetal is the biggest offender of this current problem.

I will elaborate this by breaking down the following two replays:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

REPLAY 1

809.png
807.png
591.png
146.png
Rotom Sprite
260.png
vs
450.png
593.png
893.png
807.png
146.png
809.png

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nationaldexuu-1551746918

This is the Melmetal set in question on my side

Before the match
In this replays we will be focusing on the Melmetal from my side. Before the match even starts, I can see that both Jellicent and Moltres will be used to check my Melmetal. Both resist Double Iron Bash and outspeed me, allowing Sergeant Slowpoke to either burn me via Will-O-Wisp (Jellicent) or put on offensive pressure (Moltres). I do however, also notice a Zarude. Zarude rarely runs Close Combat in the tier, so I know that Melmetal actually gets free switches vs Zarude in this match if played correctly. Since my opponents switches into Melmetal are fairly obvious, I can try to play aggressive.

The match itself, broken down turn by turn
Turn 0
I lead Rotom-Wash as it matches up fairly decent vs the entire team barring Zarude. My opponent correctly reads that and leads Zarude.

Turn 1
Zarude clicks Darkest Lariat. After the match it was confirmed Zarude was Taunt instead of U-turn, and since my team lacks any Dark resists, it was a fairly safe play. Scouting my Amoonguss item, and Zarude has more than enough way to Jungle Healing up later on vs Pokemon like Rotom-Wash and / or Swampert.

Turn 2
Since my opponents team has a fairly weak matchup vs Amoonguss, I expected some Sleep Talk Moltres set. Expecting this, I hard switched into Rotom-Wash on the incoming Moltes. This play worked out.

Turn 3
Predicting the Moltres worked out in my favour here, as Zarude is the only Pokemon capable of dealing with my Rotom-Wash. Zarude is brought out again on the Volt Switch, allowing me a free switch into Melmetal.

Turn 4
I click Thunder Wave on the incoming Jellicent. Thunder Wave was fairly free here. If my opponents went Hippowdon, I get a free Double Iron Bash off since I outspeed and will likely flinch him. He was also Specially Defensive Hippowdon, meaning he would've gotten 2HKO'd by DIB anyway (Hippowdon also needs to be kept healthy for Zeraora). Zeraora can't kill Melmetal and my opponent would just lose a sack. My opponent didn't want to risk Moltres since it's his main way of dealing with Amoonguss, so that's the reason for the Jellicent switch. Since I lose nothing by clicking Thunder Wave, I'm able to paralyze the Melmetal check in this game.

Turn 5, 6 & 7
I then proceed to just flinch down Jellicent completely from full health. I only needed two flinches, as he was then put into range of Thunder Punch. The would be Melmetal check just lost to that exact Pokemon from full health.

Turn 8
My opponent brings in Moltres to get the offensive pressure. My opponent is behind in the game though, and decides to hard read the Rotom-Wash switch, and goes into Zarude. This puts the momentum in his favour again.

Turn 9 & 10
Zarude attacks into Amoonguss, and predicting something other than Sludge Bomb the following turn, the Darkest Lariats again and crits me, forcing me to switch the next turn.

Turn 11
Because Melmetal is at full, I decide to just simply switch it into Zarude hard. Melmetal is in, Jellicent is gone. What will my opponent do now?

Turn 12, 13 & 14
Not wanting to risk Zarude, my opponent switches into Moltres. I click Thunder Wave again, as I felt like I didn't lose anything by doing so (exact same reasoning as turn 4). I paralyze the Moltres, flinch it once with Double Iron Bash and kill it the next turn with Thunder Punch. Another Melmetal check dying from full.

Turn 15 & 16
My opponent now realizes Melmetal he has no way of killing Melmetal that's sitting at 76%, and desperately tries to get chip in with Hippowdon so Zeraora can pick it off. It doesn't work, since Double Iron Bash cleanly 2HKO's and gets the flinch. Hippowdown then gets KO'd next turn.

Turn 17 & 18
Zarude comes in and reveals he's Z-Move. Z-Move does 50%, leaving Melmetal at 26%. Zarude dies to Double Iron Bash. Zeraora comes in the following turn and kills Melmetal with Plasma Fists.

Turn 19
Swampert comes in and kills the Zeraora.

Turn 20, 21 & 22
My opponents Melmetal comes in and Toxic's my Swampert. It actually managed to beat it because Swampert's Earthquake only did 46% lol.

Turn 23
My Rotom-Wash comes in and kills the Melmetal with Hydro Pump, winning me the game.

This replays showed Melmetal's ability to put itself into positions where it easily takes the upper hand. Pokemon like Zarude give it free switches, allowing Melmetal to play aggressively and literally beating its own checks from full in the process.

REPLAY 2

809.png
807.png
591.png
146.png
Rotom Sprite
260.png
vs
809.png
893.png
450.png
373.png
620.png
Rotom Sprite

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nationaldexuu-1551756974

This replay will showcase the same set as the first match

Before the match
The matchup is definitely more difficult for Melmetal. Rotom-Wash is generally the most consistent and splashable Melmetal check in the tier, and it's pretty much a counter vs the Pads TWave set. My hazard setter is carrying Toxic however, and between that and me having offensive Moltres, Rotom-Wash should not be difficult to wear down. Salamence is pretty threating vs me, and since Rotom-Wash is clearly the Defogger on my opponents team, Salamence is likely carrying either Draco Meteor or Wish in the last slot. If it's Draco Meteor, I can only use my Specially Defensive Swampert to check it, which lacks reliable recovery.

The match itself, broken down turn by turn
Turn 0
My opponents leads Mienshao. Fairly safe obviously, it outspeeds the entire team since it clearly Choice Scarf, and has U-turn to pivot. I lead Amoonguss just like in the first replay, as it matches up nice vs his team outside of Salamence.

Turn 1
My opponent clicks U-turn, and since my opponents knows Spore is coming out, he decides to choose Hippowdon as his sleep fodder. Hippowdon can still switch into Zeraora despite being asleep, and doesn't check much else on my team, meaning that was his best switch there for sure.

Turn 2
I expected Salamence to come in and wanted my Rocks up, so I hard switched into my Swampert. My opponent did indeed go Salamence, as that is his best way of dealing with Amoonguss, since Sludge Bomb was also unlikely to be clicked in my case.

Turn 3
I decide to get up rocks as my opponent switches into Zarude.

Turn 4
I switch into my defensive Amoonguss as my opponent goes for a U-turn, allowing him to get in Salamence and get in offensive pressure.

Turn 5 & 6
Expecting a Hurricane, I decide to pivot into Rotom-Wash first. Wanting to scout for a Draco Meteor, I pivot into my Swampert, which works out nicely.

Turn 7
My opponent brings out Rotom-Wash instead of Zarude, not wanting my Swampert to Flip Turn into Melmetal while he has Zarude in. I Flip Turn into Amoonguss instead.

Turn 8
Rotom-Wash proceeds to click Volt Switch on my Amoonguss and brings in Melmetal expecting me to want to Sludge Bomb his Salamence. This works out in this favour. However, I notice that Melmetal is carrying Leftovers. This means he won't kill me with Double Iron Bash, since he's not Choice Band, and will take Helmet chip, since he's not Protective Pads.

Turn 9
Having the knowledge from turn 8, I decide to stay in and click HP Fire. Double Iron Bash being the stupid move it is however, proceeds to do 63% and flinch me, leaving me with a 26% Amoonguss. Melmetal takes Helmet chip however.

Turn 10 & 11
My opponent knowing I need to save Amoonguss to deal with Rotom-Wash and Mienshao, he clicks Toxic. I proceed to switch into Moltres hoping for a Flame Body burn, but this doesn't work out. My opponent then Protects the next turn, and most of the Helmet chip has already been healed back.

Turn 12 & 13
My opponent switches into Rotom-Wash on the Moltres as I use U-turn, expecting the switch. I bring in Amoonguss to get more Regenerator recovery. My opponent uses Volt Switch and brings in Melmetal. I expect this and use HP Fire, only to do jack shit with 23%. Since my Amoonguss is sitting at 49% and dies to the next Double Iron Bash, I'm forced to switch.

Turn 14 & 15
I proceed to switch into my own Melmetal, which I probably should've done initially as well. ProTox Melmetal sets rarely run Earthquake but Thunder Punch instead. Since my own Melmetal has Thunder Wave and Earthquake, it gives me the upper hand. My opponent Protects on turn 15 for more Leftovers recovery.

Turn 16
Since his Melmetal can't do much to me, my opponent decides to switch into Rotom-Wash on the Earthquake and tries to Defog. I Thunder Punch on the switch and do a nice 32%, leaving Rotom-Wash at 28% after Leftovers.

Turn 17
I switch into Swampert, since it was my lowest health Pokemon at the time and I wanted to let Rotom-Wash recover the least amount of health possible with Pain Split. My opponent clicks Defog instead however, leading me to believe he's not Pain Split, but Will-O-Wisp instead (this is indeed the case, confirmed after the match).

Turn 18 & 19
By now my opponent realizes his Salamence is a huge threat and decided to weaken Swampert with Hydro Pumps for Salamence to later clean. Not sure why he clicked Defog on turn 19, since Rocks only hurt Rotom-Wash to begin with, but it allowed me to Toxic the Rotom-Wash, which is great for Melmetal.

Turn 20, 21 & 22
My opponent switches into Zarude as I Flip Turn into my Melmetal. He then proceeds to U-turn into Hippowdon, sacking it in the progress.

Turn 23 & 24
My opponent brings in Rotom-Wash as I switch into Amoonguss. He Volt Switches out into Salamence, putting offensive pressure on my team. I switch in Swampert and take a good amount from Draco Meteor.

Turn 25
My opponent switches into Zarude, and since I realize I don't need Rocks that much, I decide to simply Flip Turn into my Melmetal instead.

Turn 26 & 27
Zarude U-turns, and since Rotom-Wash is sitting at 41% and Toxic'd, it's just not reliable anymore, especially since I still have Moltres. He brings in Melmetal and protects for Leftovers recovery on turn 27.

Turn 28
His Melmetal can't touch mine, and since nothing on his team switches into Double Iron Bash or Thunder Wave, my opponent desperately tries to bring in Rotom-Wash, taking a Thunder Punch to the face and being left on just 10%.

Turn 29 & 30
My opponent Hydro Pumps as I switch into Swampert, unfortunately missing the attack. He then clicks it again into my incoming Amoonguss, dying to Toxic damage in the process. He then brings in Salamence.

Turn 31 & 32
My opponent clicks Hurricane as I bring in Moltres, and he misses again. He kills me with Draco Meteor the following turn however.

Turn 33
Since Salamence's Special Attack is lowered, I can freely bring in Melmetal and click Double Iron Bash. My opponent sacks Zarude and brings in Mienshao.

Turn 34
I just sack Melmetal to Mienshao as I decided I didn't need it anymore. I bring in Amoonguss.

Turn 35 & 36
Realizing Salamence is now the win condition, my opponent stays in with Mienshao and makes it the sleep fodder. He then brings in Melmetal on a Sludge Bomb.

Turn 37 & 38
I switch into Rotom-Wash as my opponent clicks Toxic. He clicks Protect the next turn.

Turn 39 & 40
I Volt Switch into Amoonguss as my opponent clicks DIB, taking Helmet damage. He clicks Protect the next turn.

Turn 41, 42 & 43
My opponent brings in Salamence on the HP Fire and kills me off with Flamethrower the next turn. I bring in Rotom-Wash to force a Draco Meteor and Volt into Zeraora.

Turn 44, 45, 46, 47, 48 & 49
Zeraora cleans the team since Mienshao is asleep, Melmetal is low health and Salamence couldnt OHKO with Draco.

This is a good replay to show that despite there being a Rotom-Wash, Rotom-Wash will oftentimes be tasked with so many jobs throughout the game it just gets overwhelmed. The Melmetal user knows this and plays aggressively, and by clicking Thunder Punch twice on the Rotom-Wash it's at 10% before my opponent even knew it. My opponent also had to resort to his own Melmetal to check mine, and still sacked two Pokemon in the process.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I know these were only two replays, but I just wanted to highlight how easily a well played Melmetal can completely screw over its checks and counter. You pretty much have to play perfect vs Melmetal should you not want to be put in the backseat for the entire game. The second replays also showed that there are pretty much no long term checks to Melmetal, as Rotom-Wash was easily overtasked throughout the game, allowing Melmetal to just click buttons pretty much. Its amazing physical bulk allows it to get free switches vs common Pokemon such as Zarude.

Melmetal creates an unhealthy environment where the player that is facing Melmetal has to play perfectly to not lose, even if you know which set is coming, which I personally believe to be undesirable for a healthy metagame. For these reasonings I will be voting ban on Melmetal and I advice all of you to do the same.
 
Last edited:
I'm a bit late, but I feel I ought to give my thoughts on Melmetal, seeing as it's probably the closest Suspect we'd have yet. Ultimately, while it hardly makes the tier unplayable, I believe Melmetal is still a seriously unhealthy force in the Metagame, and thus should be banned.

:ss/melmetal:

Melmetal. The man. The myth. The pain in my ass. Melm is an easy contender for the most dangerous Pokémon in the tier, as while it might not have the versatility of MAlt, it makes up for it with by being absurdly hard to switch into.

Melmetal @ Protective Pads
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Double Iron Bash
- Earthquake
- Thunder Punch
- Thunder Wave / Toxic

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Altaria-Mega: 508-604 (174.5 - 207.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Altaria-Mega Earthquake vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 158-186 (37.4 - 44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

0- SpA Altaria-Mega Fire Blast vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 220-260 (52.1 - 61.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Aegislash-Blade Shadow Ball vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 322-381 (76.3 - 90.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Aegislash-Shield: 192-228 (59.2 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 168+ Def Amoonguss: 276-326 (63.8 - 75.4%) -- approx. 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery

0 SpA Amoonguss Hidden Power Fire vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 108-128 (25.5 - 30.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

252 Atk Zeraora Close Combat vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 174-206 (41.2 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Zeraora: 328-386 (103.4 - 121.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Zarude Darkest Lariat vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 97-115 (22.9 - 27.2%) -- 57.2% chance to 4HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zarude: 266-314 (75.5 - 89.2%) -- approx. 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 Atk Tangrowth Earthquake vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 106-126 (25.1 - 29.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

0 SpA Tangrowth Hidden Power Fire vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 134-158 (31.7 - 37.4%) -- 86.5% chance to 3HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 170-204 (42 - 50.4%) -- approx. 0.4% chance to 2HKO

252 Atk Choice Band Urshifu-Rapid-Strike Close Combat vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 432-510 (102.3 - 120.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Urshifu-Rapid-Strike Close Combat vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 288-342 (68.2 - 81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Urshifu-Rapid-Strike: 230-272 (67.4 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 174-206 (41.2 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 180-212 (42.8 - 50.4%) -- approx. 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Some calcs on "average" interactions with Melm in the tier. Melm both hits like a truck and is capable of taking a beating before finishing it's opponent off. It might not look amazing vs offense, but it's still capable of 1v1ing nearly every offensive threat in the tier. Vs defense, however, it's a complete slaughter. They often do minimal damage to Melm while being Flinched to death. While looking at the VR, there's also something else telling about Melm's influence on the Meta. To show the sheer choke-hold Melm has on the Metagame, nearly every high-ranked defensive staple is capable of checking Melmetal in some capacity. And the best part is they're still extremally shaky checks at best.

Skarmory

:ss/skarmory:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 78-94 (23.3 - 28.1%) -- approx. 91.1% chance to 4HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 132-156 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 146-174 (43.7 - 52%) -- 14.8% chance to 2HKO (Roosted)

252+ Def Skarmory Body Press vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 148-176 (35 - 41.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Skarm is pretty much the best Melm check in the tier. Resists DnB, is immune to EQ, and isn't 2HKOed by Thunderpunch. It even outspeeds any reasonable (as ladder operates on it's own logic) Melm at 0 investment, so it can easily come in. But then comes in Thunderwave.

With TWave, the preexisting 51% chance to Flinch is compounded with the 25% chance to not move anyways. DnB might do jack in damage, but if you get any reasonable amount of luck, Skarm will easily get into TPunch range, so so much for your check. Skarm can still be annoying with Body Press and Roost, but ultimately, it's a losing battle.

Rotom-Wash

:ss/rotom-wash:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 188+ Def Rotom-Wash: 50-60 (16.4 - 19.7%) -- approx. possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 188+ Def Rotom-Wash: 85-100 (27.9 - 32.8%) -- 84.2% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 SpA Rotom-Wash Hydro Pump vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 175-207 (41.4 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Wastom is arguably the next best Melm check. It resists DnB, is immune to EQ, and doesn't mind TPunch too much. It's even immune to TWave. In return, it threatens Melm with a strong Hydro Pump, and a Will-o-Wisp Burn. However, Washtom is a complete sitting duck to Toxic sets. Melm will now lose to Skarm 100% of the time to Skarm, but Washtom is crippled and at the mercy of chip and it's own mediocre recovery in Pain Split. The choice between TWave and Toxic is a hard one, but now every player must respect both options.

Scizor

:ss/scizor:

Not really a defensive mon but still a Mon that can check Melm by coming in.

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 138-164 (40.2 - 47.8%) -- approx. 3HKO

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 129-152 (37.6 - 44.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 116-137 (33.8 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

16+ Atk Scizor Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 72-85 (17 - 20.1%) -- possible 5HKO

16+ Atk Scizor Superpower vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 178-210 (42.1 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 138-164 (47.7 - 56.7%) -- approx. 92.6% chance to 2HKO

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 129-152 (44.6 - 52.5%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 116-137 (40.1 - 47.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Life Orb Scizor Superpower vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 276-325 (65.4 - 77%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor Superpower vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 316-374 (74.8 - 88.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Scizor is an exceptionally shaky check. It really doesn't fear an OHKO from Melm, but has to rely on the risky superpower to break through it. Meanwhile, it's hardest-hitting sets lack recovery and thus long-term checking potential. TWave also borderline ruins it. Scizor can beat Melm, but has to play on eggshells to do so.

Moltres

:ss/moltres:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 84 Def Moltres: 230-272 (60 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 SpA Moltres Flamethrower vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 336-396 (79.6 - 93.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Moltres: 254-300 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Moltres Flamethrower vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 446-528 (105.6 - 125.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Moltres Flamethrower vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 408-480 (96.6 - 113.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

0 SpA Moltres Fire Blast vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 408-482 (96.6 - 114.2%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

0+ SpA Moltres Fire Blast vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 446-528 (105.6 - 125.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Moltres is a strong check, but with caveats. Flamethrower and Fire Blast often OHKO, or can easily do so with a little chip. But TPunch is an existential nightmare Moltres has to deal with, while TWave and Toxic both ruin Moltres as well. Moltres can come in, but lives in constant fear of Melm bringing the Thunder.

Rotom-Heat

:ss/rotom-heat:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Heat: 66-78 (27.3 - 32.3%) -- approx. 4HKO

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Heat: 54-64 (22.4 - 26.5%) -- 25.6% chance to 4HKO

8 SpA Rotom-Heat Overheat vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Melmetal: 420-494 (99.5 - 117%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

Heatom is probably the best Melm check in a vacuum. It has the same perks as Washtom, but it resists TPunch, and can OHKO with Overheat. Even offensive sets are solid long-term checks. However, Heatom is still vulnerable to Toxic, doesn't fit Pain Split as easily, nor is it as splashable on teams as Washtom. A good check, but one that can be worked around.

Deoxys-Defense

:ss/deoxys-defense:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Deoxys-Defense: 168-200 (55.2 - 65.7%) -- approx. 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. +1 252 HP / 4+ Def Deoxys-Defense: 114-134 (37.5 - 44%) -- approx. 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Cosmic Power DeoD is an unconventional but effective check. If it Taunts to avoid status, it can easily PP Stall DnB, somehow turning Melm into setup fodder for Cosmic Power. It isn't the easiest to fit on a team, nor can it easily come in, but arguably the most consistent check here.

Swampert

:ss/swampert:

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 248 Def Swampert: 118-140 (29.2 - 34.6%) -- approx. 100% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 248 Def Swampert: 109-129 (26.9 - 31.9%) -- 39.7% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Iron Fist Melmetal Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 248+ Def Swampert: 108-126 (26.7 - 31.1%) -- approx. 8.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Melmetal Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 248+ Def Swampert: 100-118 (24.7 - 29.2%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 Atk Swampert Earthquake vs. 44 HP / 0 Def Melmetal: 170-204 (40.2 - 48.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Swampert v. Melmetal is like a superhero movie no one wants to see. Pert does a good deal with EQ, but hates taking DnBs and EQs in return. It does win if it doesn't get too unlucky with DnB, but Pert is very easy to wear down and makes a weak check over the course of the game. Toxic is also indeed a moment.

This list is pretty much every defensive Melm check A- and above, and it's clear to see how strong Melm is. These Pokémon are the premier defensive Melm checks in the tier, yet are extremely shaky or rely on whether Melm chooses Toxic or TWave. And this isn't even it's only set.

Melmetal @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 32 HP / 116 Atk / 252 SpD / 108 Spe or 252 Atk / 140 SpD / 116 Spe
Careful / Adamant Nature
- Double Iron Bash
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect

TectTox Melm is really the only other Melm set worth using, and it's pretty self-explanatory. You hyperfocus your MU vs Toxic-vulnerable checks, so you lose harder to Skarm but destroy checks like Washtom and Swampert even harder. Added Sp Def helps as well. It doesn't reinvent the wheel, but it shows that Melm isn't a one-trick pony.

After seeing all this, it is worth mentioning that, on a game-to-game basis, it isn't the absolute worst. It is vulnerable to hazards, and needs to carefully budget it's health as to not take chip that could lead it to being eventually KOed. However, a well-played Melm is borderline grantee to get at least one kill in a game, something that I find very unhealthy.

Ultimately, I believe Melm should be banned as it is too constraining on teambuilding in the tier, and even after that we need to play perfectly to avoid it scoring a kill. It already 1v1s an large amount offensive threats in the tier, and completely slaughters defense, making switching in basically a game of Russian Roulette. I'm sad to lose Melman from the Madagascar trilogy, but ultimately I feel it's best for the tier.

Now finally, it's worth talking about how the tier would react IF Melm is banned.

In general terms, defense will finally get some room to breathe and could potentially explore other options. Offense would arguably be slightly worse by virtue of it handling Melm better, but would still be strong and could likely have more diversity with Melm gone.

In terms of how the Pokémon of the tier react:

:altaria-mega: -> MAlt's day is made, as Melm was one of it's strongest checks. Neither really wanted to fight the other, but if push came to shove Melm usually won.

:urshifu-rapid-strike: -> Watershifu would suffer slightly as it could check Melm fairley well, but Watershifu wasn't the best Melm check and would still pretty much be the same.

:aegislash: -> Aegi would enjoy this quite a bit, as Melm again never really wanted to fight it, but it would usually win the 1v1 either way.

:amoonguss: -> A major buff, as Melm slaughtered Amogus otherwise. Now we can deal with Spore on even more teams now.

:moltres: -> Big Bird would probably be a good deal worse as it was one of the best Melm checks, but it still remains solid.

:rotom-wash: -> Wastom would suffer as it was fit on many teams almost solely due to it being such a good Melm check. However, seeing as it likely might rise to OU anyways, this might be for the best.

:scizor: -> Maybe slightly worse, but Scizor's niche was not reliant on Melm really.

:tangrowth: -> Better, as now its teams don't have to worry about their physical wall being meh against Melm, and thus they has a major issue gone.

:zarude: -> Way better, as Zarude does like 5 damage and got obliterated in return.

:zeraora: -> Better, as it loses the 1v1 to Melm pretty much all the time.

:celesteela: -> Better, as TPunch usually did more than what it could heal, and TWave crippled it. Even offensive Sets with Flamethrower couldn't break through Melm.

:deoxys-defense: -> Worse kinda, but doesn't really care on it's own. However, the defensive teams it thrives on would likely appreciate this a lot.

:hippowdon: -> Better, as Melm usually broke through it with it's sheer power, and Hippo just couldn't do enough in return.

:nihilego: -> Way better, as Melm was one of it's strongest checks. Nihi is probably the best argument for keeping Melm, as it's already absurdly good and now lost one of it's best checks.

:primarina: -> Better, as while it could hurt Melm, Melm usually wont he 1v1.

:rotom-heat: -> A good deal worse, as one of the main justifications for Heatom is Melm. Heatom is still good, but now is harder to justify on a team.

:salamence: -> Better, as like MAlt it's fire coverage did minimal damage while Melm annihilated it with DnB.

:slowking: -> Better, TPunch can't hurt it anymore.

:swampert: -> Slightly worse, but then again pert never wanted to fight Melm anyways.

:azumarill: -> Pretty much the same, loves to hit hard but hates when it gets hit hard.

:buzzwole: -> A little worse, as while Buzz wouldn't come in easily it did hit super hard with CC.

:krookodile: -> Krook's viability after Melm's ban is slightly worse, as it did hit Melm hard with EQ and weaken it with Intimidate, and thus won the 1v1, but was usually dented so much that it could barely function afterwards. Also gl hf coming in.

:Mienshao: -> Worse, as while CC has a hard time OHKOing, but Mien is still one of the better offensive checks.

:moltres-galar: -> Since Melm could cripple Goltres with Status, and in general as defense since is generally better now, Goltres will likely also be better as well.

:rhyperior: -> Not a massive fan of DnB, so it'll likely greatly appreciate Melm's ban.

:skarmory: -> Still a great mon, but it's huge niche of being a splashable Melm check will hurt it greatly.

:slowbro-galar: -> Generally better since it takes a ton from what Melm can dish out.

Overall, I can definitely see arguments as to why we should keep Melm, but I see a healthier ND UU with it gone. Thanks for reading my post, and have a nice day yall.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top