Well I didn't expect to play any games in NDPL, and if I did, Emoxu9 is the last player I'd want to play against. I only met them when we played in the NDUbers Open, but since then we've chatted a fair bit about the tier and they are an incredibly skilled player who does their research. Their teams so far have been a little bit fishy for my tastes, but unless you have an unlosable matchup they're going to force you to play well to win. I didn't fill out the survey because I don't know half the players in the pool, but Emoxu9 would have been #2. I intially wasn't going to post anything about this game, but ultimately if I'm going to discuss other peoples games I should do my own. I still won't be discussing Eledyr's games going forward though.
Team Preview
Really the only thing I think isn't clear about my team on preview is whether Arceus-Fairy or Primal Groudon is the rocker. Yveltal clearly has Defog given the Rayquaza and Primal Kyogre is likely defensive. On Emoxu9's side the big thing in my mind was whether this was random Defog Arceus-Dark. My assumption going in was some offensive rocks Primal Groudon, Solg Z Necrozma-DM, Dragon Dance Zygarde, defensive Arceus-Dark, and Choice Specs Toxic Spikes Eternatus or defensive. If Necrozma-DM lead off it'd be Rocks Ultra.
Matchup [85-15 for Emoxu9]
Yeah this isn't a great one. Defensive Primal Kyogre doesn't do shit against most Alomomola structures and this one is not the exception. Having Arceus-Fairy + Scarf Yveltal against this is rough. The Necrozma-DM is an issue as everything that threatens it has a good switch-in and I don't switch well into it myself, especially if it is Photon Geyser over Stone Edge. Sure Rayquaza has V-Create, but clicking that is less than ideal in most scenarios. Primal Groudon is offensive mixed RP 3A which does threaten most things on this team, but getting it in against the right mon will be tricky. It is pretty frail v offense w/o much defensive investment. Any path forward is probably through Zygarde because it is semibroken, but what appears to be defensive Arceus-Dark .
Emoxu9's big threat is the Necrozma-DM as I really don't switch into it or frankly much on this team. This Eternatus is mildly annoying if it is Toxic Spikes, but if it is offensive it is going to be an issue late game unless I'm able to exert a lot of pressure as dealing with that + Necrozma-DM is tough. Its just kind of a shitty matchup and yeah in hindsight Scarf Yveltal does not fit on this team. It was mostly put on there for HO as Band Rayquaza + Primal Kyogre should be able to break through most defensive stuff - at least that was the idea.
Game
Yveltal leads off against Alomomola and Mola and I hard switch to Primal Kyogre to not confirm that I'm Choice Scarf. Mola is scared out to Primal Groudon on Calm Mind and the next turn both are revealed to be defensive. I switch out as Primal Groudon sets up rocks which in hindsight is a mistake. Primal Kyogre probably isn't going to get the opportunity to Rest up safely and it is too chipped to handle any offensive Eternatus later on anyways so attempting to trade with Primal Groudon is likely the best bet. Alomomola comes in to absorb U-turn as I go to Yveltal to Defog as Eternatus comes in. I go to Primal Groudon which gets blown up by a very rare LO 3A + Recover set and at this point I think the game is likely over. I'm not the biggest fan of this set, but it got an analysis because it blows up teams like this. Meteor Beam or even Choice Specs is somewhat managable, but the only mon I have that outspeeds this is unable to touch it.
Primal Groudon is sacrificed and Zygarde comes in and scares out the Eternatus as I Tera Ground and DDs and Arceus-Dark comes in. I substitute and lose the coinflip as Arceus-Dark Tera Fairies. This essentially ends up being the game as Zygarde takes out Arceus-Dark with 23% HP and Alomomla comes in. The game is a formality from here.
Additional Thoughts
I'm fairly frustrated with myself for what I loaded. With hindsight there are definitely core issues with the team, but I'd made a bunch of stuff the previous week and posted 3 teams I thought about using and went with this. These teams had some heat on them and I wish I'd had more confidence in myself to load them. I also disccussed the game afterwards with Emoxu9 and they said they didn't see how I won. The only way I see a win being possible is getting that coinflip of Sub v Thousand Arrows right against Arceus-Dark. Even then it is a little frustrating looking at this game in hindsight as Arceus-Dark got a literal max roll followed by a very high roll and Zygarde being able to sub after KOing Arceus-Dark would have very likely won the game on the spot. My Zygarde OHKOes everything but Emoxu9's own Zygarde and Alomomola, neither of which can break the sub at this point. Crits and Dragon Tail misses can happen, but outside of that I'm not sure how Emoxu9 wins. Thems the breaks, it doesn't compare to AM's luck in NDFL.
On a side note, I was actually a bit concerned about seeing Palkia-O given the degree to which Emoxu9 seems to nail their prep but LO 3A Eternatus is pretty much the same thing. It is a bit frustrating to lose in this way when I could have won against someone who is a much better player than I am.
Lastly, DD Zygarde might be broken beyond this is ubers, everything is broken, but in a way that justifies tiering action. Without the bad luck in this game it would have won the game with just one free turn. However, the caveat is that it is tera, and more specifically tera ground that breaks it. That damage boost really matters and is the main reason why it is so hard to justify Tera Fairy or Dragonium-Z. Dragon Dance Zygarde is pretty frail and does not have much defensive utility, the damage boost is absolutely massive because it allows Zygarde to be a threat at +1. Otherwise it isn't OHKOing Marshadow, Arceus formes and defensive Primal Kyogre become proper counterplay. You don't see a frail Zygarde beating a Foul Play Arceus-Dark despite giving up 18% of its health for free. The same applies to defensive or Choice Scarf Yveltal. I'm not sure where I stand at the moment, but have been thinking about it recently.
I've yapped on for long enough, but one last thing, and I can only speak for myself, but part of the reason I've been using this set a lot more recently is Gothitelle. Even if the mon doesn't show up a single time its presence in the builder is always felt if you're not using HO.
Team Preview
I did not catch this live, but when I clicked Skyview's post and saw this team just at preview I don't see how it wins if MMY lacks Focus Blast. Even then you can say at preview that this team probably needs it for stall. A quick aside, MMY feels amazing to use when you run into the 10% teams it does something against. The team appears at least to be a weird Deoxys-S HO. Double Dance Primal Groudon, DD Arceus-Ground, MMY with Focus Blast, Life Orb Yveltal, probably TB Ground Zacian-C, but I wouldn't be shocked to see double STAB + Wild Charge.
Zuzhouwawa appears to be running the old
sample stall, but shows to have at least made some changes during the game. I didn't like that team when it came out and I don't like it now, but maybe they've changed Giratina-O to something other than Tera Steel which was my main issue with it.
Matchup [80-20 for Zuzhouwawa ]
Again this is made with the assumption that you're looking at the game at preview. With full information it is quite difficult to see Skyview losing. This looks like a team that says fuck it I don't care about stall in the slightest if it is loaded ggs. While not a building philosphy I subscribe to, realistically you probably do win more games than you'd lose. Dondozo walls every member of this team if the typical sets are used bar Focus Blast MMY and Yveltal, but Yveltal nearly universally runs Sucker Punch on HO which makes it decent instead of godly v stall. If it is Tera Flying this is somewhat alleviated given that it has more positive interactions with Ho-Oh and Chansey.
Game
Deoxys-S leads off v Arceus-Dark and Taunts it while setting rocks before going down and getting in some good Rocky Helmet chip. Zacian-C comes in and Dondozo comes in to absorb a Wild Charge and Curses as MMY comes in. It then Nasty Plots as Eternatus Tera Darks and Toxics it as it misses a Focus Blast (some things never change). +2 Psystrike then does about 90% to Ho-Oh. Chansey switches in as MMY reveals Grass Knot. Then Giratina-O comes in and takes 2/3 from Psystrike. At this stage MMY has two attacks left and Zuzhouwawa gets a prediction right as Arceus-Dark absorbs Psystrike before going down to Grass Knot.
Eternatus comes in and Toxics Arceus-Ground as it SDs and unleashes a +2 Tectonic Rage that sends Eternatus back to the Digimon server it came from. I'm a bit puzzled at why Zuzhouwawa opted to stay in there. MMY wasn't preserved so the last move is probably Taunt not Healing Wish. At this point Dozo should easily wall everything other than the Yveltal which they should want to keep Eternatus for so it can land a Toxic. Eternatus and Dondozo can probably win from here and Tina-O is at 20% so that seems like a good sac and Dozo isn't taking much from a Tectonic Rage anyways. This ends up happening as Dozo is brought in and switched to Giratina-O to scout Taunt. Arceus-Ground then Earthquakes Dozo and allows it to rest as Arceus-Ground succumbs to Toxic. Yveltal reveals Knock Off and deletes Chansey switching in and that is the game.
Additional Thoughts
A couple of months ago Eledyr and I were discussing Grass Knot on MMY as a means to make it do something against Tera Water Zygarde and hitting Dondozo was a benefit. It is still quite funny that a mon with 194 Special Attack has a very real chance to lose to Dondozo if it opts for Ice Beam over Focus Blast. Game wise, Zuzhouwawa is rolling the dice hoping to minimize the damage MMY is going to spread going down. However, even with MMY heavily chipping a the team, the storm seemed appropriately weathered. Knock Off shouldn't be expected on these sorts of structures, but the game was still very winnable. MMY was the major threat to this team and it wasn't a foregone conclusion that Skyview would be able to break what was left.
When I woke up and saw the game I asked Bob if Grass Knot was chosen with Dozo in mind and about the Deoxys-S. Apparently the Deoxys-S was because Skyview wanted to use it. There isn't really any point attempting to figure out more. I don't like the team, but there is a difference between someone saying fuck it lets ball and using whatever this team is because it is good. Loading MMY and not seeing whatever you don't have coverage for, Marshadow, Zacian-C, ect ect sounds nice. I'm happy it paid off.
This match kinda sucked personally because someone has to win. I don't know ShieldPoke, but all of Adem, Entro, and R8 are friends. Hence, I decided to put aside my project of getting Adem kicked off the NDUbers council and just hoped for a good match. This week has been kinda funny as throughout the course of filling out the strategy dex different people have different opinions about where the bar is for how niche is too niche. Two of those sets - Drag-Z and LO 3A both made an appearance this week. I thought Drag-Z was a bit too niche and Adem thought likewise about LO 3A.
Team Preview
I'm struggling to write this section as I mostly made Entros team and Adem posted the paste of ShieldPokes team and I saw that and the game when I woke up. As the game unfolds it is quite funny to see the similar ideas present themselves. Knowing this team is made to face Entro my guess at preview would have been DD Arceus-Ground as that + Zacian-C + Scarf Yveltal would be good against the webs teams Entro likes. On a team that involves Adem you know there is a pretty good chance Eternatus is coming, but the set can be anything - it is a flexible mon and she takes full advantage of its versatility. The defensive core comes across as a bit flawed in being a bit vulnerable to to DD Zygarde (Adem fit an interesting tech for this) and LO Yveltal although this can be handled offensively. I like ShieldPokes team a lot.
Matchup [idk]
The big question will be Arceus-Ground's fourth moveslot. Whether it is Taunt v Recover will definitely change the dynamic of this game. Although I write these after the fact, I think Adem and I share similar views towards Arceus-Ground - mid except for the DD set which is still good. That is certainly the case here as Edgequake is tried and true Arceus-Ground is a threat to 5/6 mons on paper at least whereas it is struggling immensely if it is defensive or Calm Mind.On the Flip Side Entro's second Ground-type, Zygarde, is also a pretty big threat. Dragon Dance is imposing off the riff and Coil is a very serious long term problem if Eternatus is unable to handle it.
Zacian-C is likely to be incredibly limited in this game as it is likely to have a very difficult time breaking through this game and can always be revenged by Deoxys-A. However, Primal Groudon can be a big threat depending on what sets Entro has. It isn't going to sweep, but if Zygarde is Dragon Dance, it can be quite difficult to switch into. Conversely, Entro's Yveltal is a massive threat if LO. Yeah Zacian-C switches in effortlessly, but that shouldn't be hard to contain and Alomomola is going to have a lot of difficulty healing it up. Alo is also likely pretty good here as it should be able to function as an effective pivot though passing wishes consistently may be a bit of a struggle. Eternatus should leave an impact here either through Toxic Spikes or exerting a large amount of offensive pressure if it is the wallbreaker set.
I want to say that Entro is slightly favoured here matchup wise, but it isn't really by much. I've put idk because I'm not sure if my own bias is getting in the way. Both players have multiple avenues to make progress and win. A good old fashioned balance war where both teams have the tools to make progress and set the table is the type of game I find the most interesting in this tier.
Game
ShieldPoke's Alomomola leads off against Entro's Zygarde which Glares as Alo Flip Turns out to Yveltal. It Taunts and Mental Herb Zygarde is revealed and it gets off a Glare and a Coil before being Taunted again. Alomomola comes in and unfortunately misses a Toxic, but lands the second. It switches out and Yveltal is revealed to at least not be Life Orb as it takes a Thousand Arrows. Entro opts to Rest on Zygarde rather fish for a full para and transform. Eternatus comes in and sets a Toxic Spike before going back to Yveltal as Zygarde wakes up.
Yveltal reveals Tera Grass which is an interesting choice. After some back and forth Zygarde's fat ass is still on the field at +5 staring down Alomomola which it KOs. Eternatus comes in and reveals Dragonium-Z which removes Zygarde. Ho-Oh comes in and Defogs and reveals it is offensive and has Earthquake so ShieldPoke opts to preserve Eternatus and brings in Primal Groudon which trades half of its HP to phase Ho-Oh with Dragon Tail and Deoxys-A is dragged in. It then puts Yveltal out of its misery with Psycho Boost.
Zacian-C comes in and Entro switches to Primal Groudon and takes most of its HP with CC. Eternatus then comes in to lay a suicide Toxic Spike before going down to help out Arceus-Ground. It sets up a Dragon Dance, but Entro reveals Dragon Tail and phases it into Shields own Primal Groudon. Deoxys-A comes in and fails to KO with Low Kick and dies itself to Overheat. Arceus-Fairy then sets up a Calm Mind as Primal Groudon is scared out into Arceus-Ground and that is the game.
Additional Thoughts
Adem mentioned that had Arceus-Ground came in and setup on Deoxys-A it would have won on the spot (Stone Edge willing) and she is definitely right. I assumed this was z move, but it is plate. I'd imagine Entro thought the same, though Primal Groudon does survive +1 Earthquake. What I find funny about this game is that if someone used it to nominate something on the VR the reaction would likely be that there is a phsyical Deoxys-A, a Mental Herb Zygarde, Mental Herb Alomomola, and Tera Grass Yveltal....this is just ladder tomfoolery.
The Mental Herb on Zygarde did enable it to paralyze Yveltal, but I'm not sure if the outcome of the game changes unless PokeShield went to Arceus-Ground to setup on Deoxys-A later. Ho-Oh is evd to live +1 Wild Charge and Primal Groudon is Evd to live +3 Tera Fighting CC after a Spike. Zygarde can still Glare Zacian-C and Deoxys-A will still revenge it after chip. The Mental Herb stuff is interesting that was entirely Entro's idea. I'm still not sure what to think about it, but Zygarde is broken enough that it'd probably work. At the same time, if it had leftovers it isn't going to find itself in range of Devastating Drake. I quite like ShieldPokes team. It is creative while still definitely looking like a team that came out of Adem's kitchen.
Team Preview
Both of these teams are pretty interesting, or at least a bit more experimental. Fogbound's team is definitely more off the beaten path, but I'll start with Skimmy's. I'm pretty sure I've said what is this random ass Arceus doing on this team in previous weeks, but it makes a bit more sense here. This looks like a pretty standard offense, but with Arceus over the Arceus-Ground that would usually be here. Arceus is an interesting choice due to how it can potentially shake up the movesets you'd typically see on these kinds of structures. The speed control means that a defensive or LO Yveltal can be fit here and that makes it much easier to justify Zacian-C if you care about the stall matchup. Primal Groudon seems likely to be Utility SD, but defensive works. I'm unsure about the Yveltal set, but all three can be justified here depending on Skimmy's priorities with the team. Arceus is Arceus (this is wrong, it ends up being Bulk Up). Eternatus is much more difficult to sus out, it again decides on what Skimmy has prioritized. Meteor Beam or wallbreaker work well, but a defensive set with Toxic Spikes is pretty nice here as well. Offensive Primal Kyogre is a pretty big threat and Eternatus helps cover that in addition to Toxic Spikes + Zacian-C + Ekiller being enough for offense. Solg-Z Necrozma-DM feels to fit best here, but Stealth Rock Ultra or just CM Ultra could as well. Zacian-C probably has Play Rough, but outside of that it depends if Skimmy feels Tera Blast Ground is too commital on this team.
Fogbound's six are quite interesting and a different take on Alomomola structures than we've seen so far. The first thing that stands out is the lack of an Arceus forme. I'm really not a fan of dropping them on Alomomola structures since they tend to be semi required to help shore up what is usually otherwise a bit of a vulnerability defensively on the special side. However, Alomomola structures rarely make use of Ho-Oh so that changes things. Presumably this is an offensive set, hopefully with Tera Ground to cover for offensive Eternatus sets which are a real pain without Calm Mind Arceus-Dark or Thnder Wave Giratina-O. Zacian-C can handle Eternatus if it is reasonably chipped, but it can't deal with a healthy +1 Eternatus unless it teras. Zacian-C + Marshadow help a lot v offense while making sure Taunt Calm Mind Arceus formes don't get out of hand and providing good speed control and strong wallbreakers.
Primal Groudon has hazards and is likely defensive, but with Alomomola it can run anything so long as it hits some defensive benchmarks. Otherwise I'd assume offensive Tera Ground Ho-Oh, CB Marshadow, Specs or wallbreaker Eternatus, and Play Rough CC Zacian-C.
Matchup [idk]
Off of preview this game gives off the impression that there is a reasonable chance it could be determined by a Zacian-C speed tie. At preview my gut is that Skimmy feels slightly favoured due to the lack of an Arceus forme, but not in a meangingful way. Both Zacian-C's are a massive threat, especially if TB Ground. Outside of Zacian-C the biggest determining factor is how Skimmy uses their Eternatus, as it doesn't have to play the mind games that Fogbound's will due to Necrozma-DM. Even if it Meteor Beams into a Tera Ground Ho-Oh that helps out Zacian-C immensely given how carefully this team has to play around Marshadow. The wild card is if this happens to be Ultra Necrozma over DD Solg-Z Necrozma-DM. The latter is better on this team, but in this matchup the surprise of the former could easily run away with the game if it gets a free turn.
Game
We open a big game between big names with Yveltal v Alomomola. Yveltal reveals that it is indeed LO, but Alomomola trades most of its HP to land a Toxic which will put it out of commission long term. More importantly, Fogbound is using nicknames and Skimmy is not so I'm rooting for Fogbound. A double sees Skimmy's Primal Groudon in front of Fogbound's Eternatus. It throws out a Toxic, suggesting Shucca as Primal Groudon sets up Stealth Rock. The Shucca is confirmed next turn as Primal Groudon is chipped down a bit more by Dynamax Cannon. Alomomola comes in to absorb Precipice Blades and Skimmy switches in Eternatus on Protect. Fire Blast is revealed and this Eternatus is definitely offensive and takes out Alomomola with a followup Dynamax Cannon.
Fogbound switches in Zacian-C and reveals Tera Ground to take out Eternatus. I think the tera is fine, but SD would be a better play if you're going to do that. It is a bold move, but unless Skimmy wins a speed tie with their own Zacian-C the game is potentially over there. Zacian-C lives Fire Blast into Extreme Speed and Skimmy would have to rely on winning a speed tie with their own Zacian-C. Yveltal comes in and successfully bluffs Sucker Punch as Fogbound sacs Eternatus to Dark Pulse. Ho-Oh comes in and Skimmy sacs their Primal Groudon to Brave Bird.
Yveltal comes in and the Dark Pulse chunks Ho-Oh as it Defogs and then dies to Knock Off. Zacian-C comes in and Skimmy reveals that they do indeed have Sucker Punch as it fails due to Swords Dance. Arceus comes in and being in Extreme Speed range, Zacian-C is sent scurrying as Marshadow absorbs it.
I guarantee what happens next is not on anyone's bingo card. Arceus tera flyings and Marshadows Low Kick does such a pitiful amount that I thought it was Focus Sash (apparently it is scarf). It switches out to Zacian-C and comes back in and reveals Wisp which is a very cool tech. Fogbound switches to Primal Groudon as Arceus reveals Refresh. Groudon reveals Swords Dance and Arceus reveals Bulk Up. The first Rock Tomb connects but the second misses which kills any shot that Fogbound had at winning this game if Marshadow has Spectral Thief, but that is probably replaced by Wisp.
Addtional Comments
This game was posted as I was going to bed and I watched it without paying much attention, but that Marshadow damage caught my eye and made me wonder if it was Focus Sash and I found it hard to believe that Fogbound would throw like that. I then remembered that some people like the Z set even if I don't, but Adem said this morning it was Scarf. Fogbound obviously has their reasoning for it, but I don't get it. The main offensive threat that cares little for CB Marshadow + Zacian-C is Dragon Dance Arceus-Ground. This team has Ho-Oh on it so that can use tera and attempt to burn it so I'm really not sure what it is for? Sure this team doesn't love Double Dance Primal Groudon, but Mola + Shucca Eternatus should be enough to prevent it from getting out of hand. Wisp was cool and is something I experiemented with slightly on Banded sets a few months ago, but ended up preferring Pursuit. I do think there is potential in this six, but with Choice Band Marshadow instead.
I'm aware that Skimmy's Arceus set is a thing in SV Ubers, but I don't have anything beyond a surface level understanding of that metagame. A couple of months ago someone was gassing it up in the NDUbers cord, but that was with Tera Fire. You can probably build a team around it, but something like Covert Cloak or Lum + Tera Fire / Poison seems better to free up Recover or Taunt or something to be able to hit Giratina-O with since that is real mon in NDUbers. Maybe the concept works, I'm not sure, but Choice Band Marshadow is at worst a top 2/3 threat to offense and Skimmy is very lucky they didn't run into it. Dragon Dance Z Double Edge / Giga Impact is more often seen because of this (it showed up this week in NDFL). The rest of the team seems designed to enable this and give Marshadow about as little breathing room as it is ever going to get on these types of structures, but it still feels hard to justify over Dragon Dance Arceus-Ground. I'm really not a fan of Tauntless Life Orb Yveltal, but it didn't come into play in this game due to Fogbounds Eternatus being defensive and sacced early.
One of the great things about having great players try out the tier such as Skimmy, Fogbound, Mashing, and ofc the Monotype GOAT ShieldPoke is that a fresh set of eyes combined with their creativity can lead to the discovery of some previously overlooked sets or structures. However, conventions tend to be conventions for a reason and sometimes they don't always hit. The Marshadow set is the best example of this imo. Wisp on Marshadow is something interesting to think about, but not on a Choice Scarf set.
Edit: Add Skyview and im sure others to the list. Emoxu9 has a lot more experience in the current meta, but I dont know they would consider themself a mainer