NOC Neighborhood NOC Mafia / mafia win congrats eo lightwolf and rssp1

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Okay firstly, fuck that kill.
Yeah, that was a very sad case. Cancerous was the player I trusted most and he was quite a friendly person.

Secondly, anyone who try to pretend this is a new day so we have to start a new discussion gets lynched. This is last day part 2 and I'm not having anyone delay discussion any longer. This does not mean that people should not be bringing up new stuff previously not discussed, I mean I don't want to see posts bringing up nothing of value while ignoring everything said before.
Alright, I can see your point right here. A new discussion would indeed put all discussion from the last day to waste, which is quite an undesirable situation for us.

To continue where we left off, TIO posted. Firstly I made it clear what makes rssp1 different from meowmixx. Secondly while I'm annoyed by everyone including Eo not having provided any new suspicions since SOMEONE shouted it's mylo, Eo did at least point his fingers at MC(I merely disagreed on him and called out his indecisiveness) so the similarities between him and TIO are minimal, and people not pointing fingers p much goes for everyone. And this hurts because I'd love to lynch people for that but clearly it's not a useful data, so please people nitpick for all I care, go for anything that even remotely seems odd, opinionated discussion is what the game thrives on!(minus opinions about rules, fuck rule discussions).

In the mean time pretend I'm saying the same line as my last post day 1 minus the unvoting replaced by Vote rssp1
Alright, I can see your point right here. A new discussion would indeed put all discussion from the last day to waste, which is quite an undesirable situation for us. Now to continue on the topic on rssp1, I can see your point on him. After rereading the posts from the last day, I have realized that your vote on him is probably more solid than the one on MeowMiXXX. You have more points than simply "not contributing enough discussion and acting dumb" and I understand the lynch on Gale Wing Srock as well since he blatantly fakeclaimed when he was pressured. For this, I apologize for not contributing my thoughts and pushing on an early No Lynch on Day 3.

Now that I've got that clear, I would like to state my issues with simply continuing from Day 3's discussion. A huge portion of the discussion was centered around neighborhood mechanics (something I myself was part of, much to my regrets). If we discount that portion, we are merely left with some points on acidphoenix and rssp1. I do not believe that this will increase our chances on getting the right person lynched today, so I believe some new discussion must be started in addition to us continuing on the points mentioned on Day 3.

Since it is a Lynch-or-Lose situation right now, I believe that it is time for us to pool all our information in order to increase our chances of getting the right player lynched. This includes:
  • Massclaiming, since that would be helpful in getting the right player lynched. We'll all regret it if we lost without ever getting the chance to claim. Do state your previous actions since that would also be helpful.
  • Neighbor claims and neighborhood logs. I'm sure that there is a lot of additional information for us to obtain from the neighborhoods. It would do us some good if we got to see new sides of other players.
  • Reads on other players. Townreads, scumreads, nullreads, doctorreads and whatever reads you have. Do provide updates from time to time in order to incite more discussion in the thread.
  • Opinions you have on your mind. Anything could be useful at this point in the game.
I will currently refrain from posting such information until a decent amount of you agree with this. Seriously, though, we need every form of information available. In the meantime, let's just continue on Day 3's discussion just as LightWolf mentioned.
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
I did say we need new discussions too, duh, I merely don't want people who have yet to comment on already said stuff just get away with it, Steamroll had like one big post, Eo had a single line of discussion, I made my opinion on acid's big post clear already too and I will not repeat the rssp1 stuff again. I really can't come up with new discussion without people actually discussing anything.

As for the suggestions, massclaiming should be a last ditch effort, considering we are at lylo with 3 assumed mafia, using this up now kinda leaves us with nothing for the 2 other lynches we must succeed at. Unless the the power role in question actually has something to lynch on, in which case they should tell us, but only on the last day before the deadline because if we just lynch the obv bad, we back to square one. We need discussion yada yada. Mass claiming is obvious, we shouldn't waste time discussing it, and do it on the last day before deadline if we have nothing till then.

Neighbourhood I see no problem with, besides that I think everyone with math should know the neighbourhoods but whatever. Confirming who is in what is kinda pointless, but the quicktopic shit why not.(spoiler alert I never even posted in mine :P)

Read lists, I really hate read lists, I see them as easy cop out ways of contribution without having to explain too much. For once though, why not I agree with it, if we start such a chain and actually force people to make reads then why not.

So tl;dr no one claim till the fucking last day before deadline and get reads on everyone, there is 6+you in the game, shouldn't be that hard to read all their posts again and make a read(please we had a game that was on page 30 by day 4, this should be nothing). And I mean everyone including those who already kinda did(like phoenix) those are now considered outdated, even if they technically are on the last page...
 
I disagree with massclaiming only on the last day. We're each on different timezones and some players here aren't even active in the game. We might not be able to get everyone to claim if we waited till the last day (/me looks at himself). Anyway, let me post my read list for the time being (I'll post the neighborhood stuff later). Do note that I'm excluding neighborhood mechanics from my reads.

Eo Ut Mortus: Alright, I don't know what to say for this guy. He sort-of pointed his fingers at More Cowbell on Day 3 and then retracted his accusation. He was on Gale Wing Srock's lynch, but Gale Wing Srock was not doing a good job at defending himself, so I can't say much about that. The only thing I find curious is why Gale Wing Srock didn't call out to suspect him. I don't know much about him, so this is a nullread for the time being.

More Cowbell: More Cowbell never stood out as a very townish figure to me. Despite being a relatively active poster, he never committed any townish action to me (other than telling everyone to not hammer No Lynch on Day 3). However, he has done a great job at pointing fingers (something I suck at doing). I have no idea what to say about him, but he gives a slightly more townish vibe than Eo Ut Mortus. Also, is he still in the Nerds Neighborhood?

acidphoenix: acidphoenix has exhibiting scummish behavior on Day 3. Doing nothing to defend himself other than bringing out MyLo is not what I consider a good attempt at trying to appear townish. As a result, I have a slight scumread for him.

rssp1: Like everyone else alive, rssp1 isn't exactly what I find a townish person. He hardly gave reads on anyone and he claimed to townread More Cowbell when he was pressured. LightWolf has a fairly convincing argument on him so I recommend everyone to reread whatever he said earlier to get a deeper understanding (I myself did that). I have a slight scumread on him.

LightWolf: The player I believe to be the center of the game. Seriously, LightWolf has been such an active player in shaping the game and repeatedly pressured different players when he found the need to. He never seemed to be hesitating when he voted. As a result, many players in the game including my past neighbors (who both flipped town) have decided to townread him. However, never have I once did that. We don't seem to have any powerful investigative roles such as cops in this game. The scum could also choose to appear townish by driving discussions. More importantly, here's my question: Why isn't he dead by now?

Steamroll: A fairly inactive player in the game. Despite that, he seems to be quite eager to contribute to the discussion when he happens to be active (as shown in his read list on Day 3, something I don't expect from an inactive player). I have a slight townread on him.

In a nutshell, here's the order of scumminess I've read from every player in this game (in ascending order):
Steamroll --> More Cowbell --> Eo Ut Mortus --> acidphoenix --> rssp1 --> LightWolf

My skills in scumhunting remain lackluster and I'm prone to changing my mind. Alright, it's time to post your lists, people.
 
I know I haven't posted anything over the last two days, but the overall level of activity in this game is an absolute disgrace. How is it possible that, over the last two days, only LightWolf and TIO posted?

Anyways, regarding massclaims; I don't see why we wouldn't. We don't have much to work with in terms of a lynch (I mean, we mislynched three times now, and I don't see how we're getting a good lynch right now with this abysmal activity), so getting as much info as we can, as soon as possible, would be good. I mean, I'm quite certain we're gonna need all the power role info today anyways, so if we share it now we have more time to work it out, and the mafia has the same information either way.

Regarding my neighborhood: I've left my neighborhood, but sadly have not been invited to a new one (unless Jalmont forgot to alert me).

Alright, onto some reads:

Eo Ut Mortus: neutral to slight scum; has made some sizable posts that sometimes promote discussion and have some direction, but more often than not the posts lack a real conclusion and commitment.

rssp1: scum; hasn't done anything all game, making off with some "well, there's really nothing to add here" posts every now and then. Hasn't added anything to the game besides inactivity. Even when pressured he never attempted to do anything to help the village, so that's a scumread.

The Idiotic One: neutral to town; TIO has been kind of an average player for me so far. Nothing he's done has stood out to me as obvious town (though I must say I agree with his last few posts, overall), but there hasn't been a point where I thought of him as mafia either. Right now he's one of the few people looking to actually do something with this game, so that's good.

acidphoenix: neutral; you all know how I think about acidphoenix. I think he's done a lot of odd things in this game, and he's hardly helped out the village, but his behavior is too stupid to be mafia. Either noobtown or noobscum, but I'm leaning noobtown since I can't imagine fellow mafia members not saying "don't say stupid shit".

LightWolf: neutral to scum; I'm on the fence about LightWolf. As one of the more active players in the game he's been able to steer the game quite a bit, but this is not the scumhunting LightWolf that I know. Besides pressuring me and Eo for a bit, and his push for an rssp1 lynch, I have a feeling he hasn't been doing all that much in the game, instead being quite content with everything slowly fizzling out and mafia winning because of a lack of information. I wouldn't even be surprised at LightWolf and rssp1 being scumparteners; rssp1 is an easy target to lynch, and pushing so hard for a lynch that turns out mafia would pretty much clean LightWolf, allowing him to just ride out the game easily (this is getting WIFOMy very quickly though, so I dunno. Would be a possibility IMO).

Steamroll: neutral; has had incredibly little impact on the game I feel, but the few posts he's made feel okay to me. Not much to go by.

So, in order of TOWN to SCUM I have:

More Cowbell > The Idiotic One > Steamroll > acidphoenix > Eo Ut Mortus > LightWolf > rssp1
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Ough, jalmont give us a LYLO type extension please, we have 3 people who posted meaningful stuff, I have headache and a cold I think and still 4 more people from the seven men alive to write my reads about and it's already 500 words longer than the combined reads posts of MC and TIO combined.

To everyone else, I will finish it like in 15 hours from now by noon my time. Also sorry and stuff.
 

Eo Ut Mortus

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Alright, here are my thoughts. First, whom I suspect:

acidphoenix: Let's take a look at yesterday when MC proposed to lynch him. I don't think that the fact both his neighbors have died makes him likely to be mafia; we've covered this already. On the contrary, it may be argued that it makes him less likely to be mafia since the death of his entire neighborhood is liable to draw suspicion on him. I believe this is the point Lightwolf made in this post:
LightWolf said:
Only survivor of his neighbourhood, which he brought on himself(correct me if I'm wrong but all his neighbourhood friends were killed), while purposefully voting gale when that lynch was already as good as done. There is too much stacking up there that brings attention to him, negative at that.
I will dismiss this line of thinking, though. UTO, the second casualty of acid's neighbor, turned out to be a power role. UTO's presence in acid's neighborhood may not have even been a determining factor; the mafia could've just as easily discovered his role either through an investigative role or a slip made in the neighborhood (assuming acid is indeed scum).

Now, returning to the time when acid was arguing with UTO, let's note that he was pressing fairly hard for this lynch, but dropped it soon afterwards without any lingering reservations. Moreover, he voted for Cancerous for some unexplained reason:
acidphoenix said:
TEMPORARY, DO NOT FOLLOW, THIS IS PROBABLY NOT MY NEIGHBOR

Eat Cancerous legs
and has not justified this. I asked for a reason for this in one of my posts from the day before, but nothing has been said to explain it.

On its own, I would not find this behavior overlysuspect; however, if we take into account acidphoenix's posting habits since then, he has made only a couple of brief posts since then that are only remotely tangential to the current discussion. See: his unvote Cancerous post (without explanation) in the middle of the Gale lynch and his MYLO announcement / read list yesterday. There's nothing inherently wrong with diverting from current discussion if important point are made; however, he's not exactly fostering any new discussion for anyone to respond to. Whether unintentionally or not, I argue they are actually poised to shut down ongoing discussion. They certainly stand in contrast to his previous
posts, almost as if he has tried to fade back into obscurity after he accused his neighbor and failed to draw enough support to lynch him.

All that said, we've lost two power roles in the past two nights (three if you count Gale's lynch), and I don't think this is a coincidence. I would posit that it is more likely for people in their neighborhoods to become aware of their neighbors' roles, so given this in addition to the behavior I have outlined, the majority of my suspicion is directed at acidphoenix.

LightWolf: TIO raised a pertinent point in his last post regarding LightWolf.
The Idiotic One said:
More importantly, here's my question: Why isn't he dead by now?
I want to reiterate this point and expand on it. Yesterday, LW posted the following two statements:
LightWolf said:
Now to actually clarify, the first line was all sarcasm, so I don't townread The Idiotic One(I town read no one! Everyone is a suspect)
LightWolf said:
Lets be honest all this no lynch will give us is a 3-4 day extension because someone no one really suspects will die, and most know this.
These statements contradict each other. If LW townreads nobody, then the death of any individual is certain to give him more information. From his perspective, everyone's a suspect, so it's a suspect down. There is only one exception to this (again, from his perspective): LightWolf himself is the one who dies. This didn't happen, which means one of the two following:

a) LightWolf's logic was faulty, which is still somewhat suspect because it was being used to push in MYLO lynch

b) LightWolf is mafia and therefore could not have been killed despite it making sense to do so because he was not really being pressured before today.

Given the anomaly I outlined combined with the pressure he added to lynch on MYLO, my suspicions regarding him are raised.

rssp1: I agree with most of what's been posted. He was completely inactive for all of day 2 and then randomly emerged at the beginning of day 3 to post something insubstantial, which makes it feel like he's trying to give the illusion of activity. Not much to add to that, except...

Steamroll: Honestly, Steamroll has said almost as little as rssp1; the difference is that he has barely been pressured at all. I can't say much about him either because of his inactivity. Most of his posts have been reiterations of what has already been said. I can sympathize if he's truly been busy, but I'm unwilling to risk letting him off the hook lest he be mafia trying to fly under the radar.

Moreover, after the whole discussion about neighborhoodless people, Steamroll has not made much of an effort to join a neighborhood, in stark contrast with MC. If he has already joined a neighborhood, he has not mentioned it, at least. This makes me feel he's deliberately trying to avoid attention; you're not really participating in any channels of discussion, so what exactly are you doing right now?

I suspect three out of these four people to be mafia. As for the rest...

More Cowbell: Already discussed my opinion on him at length. Has a high level of activity and I can't say I've found anything in his most recent post that aroused my suspicions.

The Idiotic One: Alright, well, I have to say your post yesterday epitomized your namesake:
The Idiotic One said:
Eo Ut Mortus: Alright, this is an extremely terrible reason to suspect anyone but Eo Ut Mortus has not really been pointing his fingers at anyone similar to myself. Since I'm supposed to accuse someone, I'll accuse you for merely that. My suspicion on him is close to none.
You're not "supposed to accuse someone." You're supposed to use the information available to you formulate a viable suspicion to be used as the basis for accusation. In other words, don't point fingers for the sake of pointing fingers. At any rate, you did admit the flaws in your reasoning and seem to have rectified this.

Having said this, I don't suspect TIO as strongly because he does genuinely seem more like an uninformed villager than anything; he started his recent string of posting without being prompted, so it doesn't seem to me like he was purposely trying to fly under the radar. It could all be an act, though, so he's not cleared of all suspicion in my mind; however, I don't suspect him as much as the four I mentioned initially.
 
Thanks for the extension, jalmont. We really need it.

Alright, here are my thoughts. First, whom I suspect:
Steamroll: Honestly, Steamroll has said almost as little as rssp1; the difference is that he has barely been pressured at all. I can't say much about him either because of his inactivity. Most of his posts have been reiterations of what has already been said. I can sympathize if he's truly been busy, but I'm unwilling to risk letting him off the hook lest he be mafia trying to fly under the radar.

Moreover, after the whole discussion about neighborhoodless people, Steamroll has not made much of an effort to join a neighborhood, in stark contrast with MC. If he has already joined a neighborhood, he has not mentioned it, at least. This makes me feel he's deliberately trying to avoid attention; you're not really participating in any channels of discussion, so what exactly are you doing right now?
I wish to answer that question in his stead, since he doesn't seem to be very active at the moment. First of all, Steamroll was recruited into the Not-so-friendly Neighborhood (which happens to be my neighborhood) on Day 2. Secondly, I'm not sure what he is doing at the moment, since he is equally inactive in the neighborhood. My suspicion on him has also increased slightly, due to a post in the neighborhood quicktopic made by Cancerous before he died which I'll post once we start massclaiming. It still isn't very strong, though.
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Okay lets try my hand at a list with a brand new blank start from page 1.(fair warning a good chunk of this was written before my post, so read it like it's from the PAST!!!)

Eo Ut Mortus:

His first post was on page 3 after the meowmixx lynch started, and then the next post took him till the next freaking day, with no input into the day 1 lynch at all. And to add to that it took him till his fourth post to point at a person for real, which was what I initially jumped on the following day. Then he votes Gale, yada yada. Normally I'd have a problem with this, but this was really just a common theme of day 1. Till page 3 most discussion was wasted on discussing the rules and the phoenix "slip". The Meowmixx lynch literally happened over a single page worth of content, and like half of that was just me an MeowMixx's posts, Meowmixx mostly even then, if we add More Cowbell's to that we get like 3/4 I think. I'd love to lynch people based on that but if most contribute a single short comment or nothing to the day's final lynch I can't just claim it's a scum thing.

He returns the following day on his soft pushing on MC, I make my big post outing this, then he replies in an unsatisfying manner as I point out in reply to his last and 9th post in the game. To which he still hasn't replied, so I will requote the point:
Onto Eo, I mostly see your points, can't say much more, I forgave MC himself for more, but you clearly misunderstand a point I still distrust, your first quoted line doesn't question the point's validity you brought up, it questions the way you did it right after people(people being me) said to stop talking about the setup, and you kinda sneakily trying to force it back in, all innocent like. I can understand if you really thought it's helpful, the way you did it certainly wasn't
His behavior, the lukewarm way he put everything was suspicious and he failed to try to address my actual problem at all in a fairly huge post. This makes him someone I'd be willing to have a vote on at the end of the day.


The Idiotic One:

Yay 19 posts, that's more than double the stuff from Eo! He claims his neighbourhood and to be VT, stuff related to that happens and I call him out on things, go after some early points to spark some discussions and all. We agree to disagree. Now in this discussion at a point he reveals his plan of indeed trying to boycott neighbourhoods due to his belief that mafia will use it for trickery and hold all the info we don't. This at the time frustrated me to no end, alas I choose to stay silent because saying it outloud would defeat the point, as I had my own plan, which was exactly to make mafia attempt to use the neighbourhoods. Having the mafia act like mafia is a thing the village's dream come true! Making mafia act more within a limited space they might feel safer was anything but a detriment to us. But I resisted bringing it up at the time because if I spell that out mafia would just cancel any such plans in the first place, and I couldn't really think of a reason why a mafia would inherently find the neighbourhoods dangers and go that far to shut them down, so in the end I dropped discussion with TIO.

More neighbourhood rules discussion... Prefers a Meowmixx lynch over Cancerous lynch in the wifom situation because he considers Cancerous to be more of an asset, fairly standard even if I at the time disagreed. Then votes Meowmixx. Day ends, admits his agreeing with me agreeing with neighour #1 of Cancerous, was essentially him agreeing with himself. Hm I actually do not quite understand his reply to phoenix in #95, I mean it sounds like he says he sorta agrees with phoenix's neighbour who suggested phoenix was halting communication within the neighbourhood, which seems slightly hypocritical considering TIO huge previous stance on having neighbourhoods essentially demolished. But in the context I don't really see how that would work with the rest of the sentence so I'd love some clarification there from TIO.

Replies to phoenix's summary of his and celever's hood discussions, not much substance here. The he idles till the next day, with his next post explaining it. I'm okay with this because at times I also like to just wait on my posts to see if without my input the situation changes(spoiler alert, in this game it doesn't). His general points in this scenario seem generally misinformed as it was pointed out later, like suspecting MC or his reasons for dismissing the phoenix lynch, which he thinks is not even on the table anymore. Blablabla his opinion on my rssp1 push changes by his second to last post. He also pushes Eo for a behavior he himself fits as admitted by him and as I think I pointed out later, doesn't really fit Eo(def not on the list of actual problems I have with Eo) as he did albeit weakly point at MC and was on the Gale lynch at least. He also states in both his posts the mylo day how he is not gonna vote or no lynch till someone brings up a good point, or I'm seeing double, felt like he was hammering that in a bit. Brings us today where he opens with suggestions, including 3 ways to deal with our lack of info, two of which I gladly agree with, the other I really really do not, but it's something that he was okay with day 1 and I know it was on everyone's mind, including mine. I stick to my opinions that it's playing our last card and should be left when we have nothing else, not be the first thing we do on this damn day, though we are literally hitting the last day of the lynch with only 3 people having made meaningful posts till now.

So my read on TIO is kinda odd, it feels like he is acting. The way he presented his points on day 1 was just kind of, giving me this odd feeling, like half the time he says something newbie ish then reveals this grand plan, also those insincere sounding compliments to me. It's like every time I didn't like something about his day 1, that seemed scummy, he revealed it to be a ruse, and following day 1 he just ditched this newbieness I felt he had going. Again I can't grab on his lack of pointing fingers, as that is most of the game, and other than that he has 1 or 2 hypocritical moments,, which are not strong enough as one I don't quite understand, and the other seems to stem from his misunderstanding of certain events. The big question I propose to him is, why do his misunderstandings of the game state and people's points exist if as he claims he was keeping up to date on the thread trying to find stuff, there seem to be a few too many oversights for that. As for lynching him, I feel I need to come to terms with my thoughts on his playstyle and his reply to this before I can make the decision, so maybe?


More Cowbell:

Lets sum it up a bit quicker because MC has probably the most posts out of any people. A lot of his early stuff is constant silly mistakes, like unvoting meowmixx into a tie, and when questioned on it not revoting etc. Or his pushing on phoenix's claim on stuff he had no way of knowing was correct or incorrect, yada yada we skip to when I drill him on those. To which he makes another one of those sillies, and by the time we make it to the gist of my question, I can accept his explanation of it being a bad play, since he constantly made some that just don't sit right for a member of the mafia, it felt not only hard but down right self punishing to actually pull that off. This p much resolved my problems with him for day 1 and 2.

Here MC starts a vote on phoenix, mostly due to based on the little we had, phoenix was a decent enough bet, also some stuff about being eh in his hood, but that sounded like nothing concrete to me. I agreed with the bet part, mostly because it's positive whether it fails or not. Now what I never actually noticed is that MC brought up MYLO first, I completely missed that and was convinced phoenix was the first one to bring it up in the thread. I'm actually surprised no one corrected me on that, seems like nearly everyone including jalmont missed it. Then he screws up quoting posts making it even harder to do this, but the post itself is fairly standard, refuting TIO's claims, drilling rssp1 a bit, unvoting phoenix now that it's confirmed mylo. Then he votes no lynch.

Way shorter but that's because I can address most of the things about him in a few sentences, even though he has the most posts. He and phoenix who I haven't talked about yet, are in the same boat for me. There is would be self inflicted stuff about them, that makes them stick out, but then they go and do stuff that contradicts what a mafia pretending to have done that would do. At the moment I rate them the highest, which p much only means I'd not vote MC if he literally posted nothing else for the day, but I'm neither letting him get away with that, nor do I need to since he already, but that'll have to wait till later...


acidphoenix:

His first day starts simple enough, with a full claim, yay so useful! Then the whole lynch on him happens because MC's vote makes him think he missread his role PM which he till then thought said he could leave his neighbourhood. This lynch was proven to be unwarranted as it was proven to be the truth and his reaction made no sense as a scum either. Rest of the day is spent on rule discussion, his only meaningful vote was on celever which he didn't really explain and was right after the RVS. Cutting to day 2, it does get explained, as Celever dies and phoenix after a day finally posts his neighbourhood logs. Frankly I found those logs useless, and they way phoenix acted in them extremely silly, most of it didn't make much sense, and the discussion on it died of quickly.

He then votes Gale and Gale pounces on him. Gale p much pounced on everyone but Eo from those who voted him so that's not very interesting. And then the final post of his is the MYLO post. He tries defusing a possible lynch on him, not only with saying it's mylo, but that if it's not mylo we shouldn't vote because that makes it mylo next day, which is frankly wrong in my book. Screams being desperate in wanting to not get lynched, thing is this desperation as I said before just doesn't sit well with the image of a scumphoenix eliminating all his hood members to potentially attract attention to himself. Even under the assumption UTO was removed due to the likelihood of being a power role from their hood discussion, phoenix had to ok the celever kill from before, especially when he was p set on lynching at least one of his hood mates. He also put out a read list in the same post, didn't like a few of those and addressed it later.

So final thoughts I already spoiled in my MC review. I had a biiiig problem with phoenix's MYLO cries and lies, but discovering that technically MC brought it up first and while I dislike full on defensive play, phoenix's attitude doesn't make sense based on how I think a scumphoenix should act. Also at this point with the day being never ending, we either find a strong suspect or we end up massclaiming, which out weigh the statistical likelihood of being the last of his hood therefore likely mafia. Again I'd likely not vote him if he posts nothing, won't let him get away with not posting, and I'd put him slightly more suspicious than MC.


rssp1:

This should be easy. He literally posts his first non confirmation post after the meowmixx lynch is p much done, completely dodging out of all of day 1. For being fairly huge it also says nothing and most of the space is just quoted text, talking about the setup, what if meowmixx is noobtown, and questioning two of my points, one where he is completely missing the point the other where I don't get why the scenario of both being town mattered, when the point was that they want to lynch each other, and I'd in that case would prefer one over the other. Also literally no posts on day 2.

On day 3 he is pressured by MC into posting, where he makes the post I have latched onto, which is him providing the strict minimum which is an opinion on MC and the one MC is currently lynching, ignoring everyone else in game. As I stated before it feels nearly impossible to null read everyone else, some sort of bias had to have been constructed based on our posts. He then proceeds to make a few posts that are just questions. People feigning activity after being called out, by only asking questions to others is another thing I have against him, though I mostly made this clear in a later post. When called out proceeds to make excuses rather than attempt to rectify it. And when he does go over that days stuff, he asks more questions and hasn't posted since then.

He is my biggest suspect, don't need to really write a longwinded explanations of why I feel that way for once!


Steamroll:

I didn't realise he only had 5 posts... And really the first 4 give nothing. On the pro side it's fairly confirmed he is an actual idler, at least based on his fifth post he was the one called out by jalmont to post. Between that and the fact there is nothing wrong with his final post, this is the only legitimate null read I have. While a completely different case from MC and phoenix, he ends up somewhere between them for that reason, as yet again I want more posts.


LightWolf:

What?! A read on myself? Nah, I'm using this part to address all the accusations that have popped up on this page.

First on the points made by TIO. It's about time I have to make this point, again, that some may be very familiar with(looking at you MC). I do not play as MafiaWolf. Regardless of my WC, regardless of my situation, I will always think and act like a villager and not fear posting due to possible repercussions. So yes your point that I could be pretending to be this helpful villager because roles that can check it don't exist is fair, the context of it, isn't. Your accusation starts with the fact I could get away with it due to there being no investigative role, but this assumption couldn't be confirmed until the death of Cancerous(chances of there being another role besides watcher that can find mafia are close to zero). By extension the part that I could safely do this holds no water, but yes I'd indeed do this 10 times out of 10 anyways.

Your other and seemingly the focus of this, is that I'm not dead yet. This is frankly fair, I do feel I should be dead, and agree this is a WIFOM that is weighted in favour of me being bad. Point is though, the last two kills were power roles, with UTO's case there being a couple of indications of that. The mafia could have been aware Cancerous was a power role, or on the previous days my suspicions were wrong and led to misslynches, or it could be it's because my rssp1 suspicions were either correct or incorrect(I have been previously killed for both) or maybe simply mafia feared the the existence of a protective role and that they'd likely be on me. Also the question works on More Cowbell as well, he has been just as much the lifeblood of this game as me, especially at the times I was either busy or lazy, mostly lazy. I dislike that you try to pin this tail on me only because "no one else suspected me", which is not quite the grounds for suspicion(and has been used against me in the legendary Celever v LightWolf debacle), it's more of a warning sign to possibly look this player over, but then your findings focus on me when they match others.

Next onto MC's accusations. You leave out my early questioning of TIO, me being the deciding vote in the MeowMixx lynch, me being the driving force in the Gale misslynch, and seem to highly undersell how much I spent pressuring you and Eo, which were frankly a good chunk of those days. Heck where we are standing I HAVEN'T even finished, pressuring Eo. You also claim I'm acting differently and that you feel I should be finding more, which feels slightly hypocritical when you personally failed to find nearly anything different from me, most of our reads match to a T, with the possible exception of TIO. You can argue I have done less than in the past, but counter point is, I usually have way more to work with, even active people barely post, because there is so little to reply to. Too many posts discuss rules and setup, too many people post little to nothing, and I'm trying to get them to post something meaningful for once. What have I even not done to suggest I'm just trying to ride this game out on an inactivity win? Also your theory on the rssp1 lynch being bussing contradicts the riding out the wave of inactivity, though that sounded more of a guess rather than a point against me.

In the end your point falters if it's mainly about my work put into the game if they game gives so little to work with, and your own reads prove this.

Finally Eo's stuff. This is probably the most bullsilly reasoning I have seen as of yet, at least the other two have some merit. For one yes, I do not not suspect anyone, I'm not gonna drop someone off my suspect list unless there is hard facts that support it. Doesn't matter if I suspect everyone though, I can't lynch everyone. I will lynch people with a good case against them that I agree with, just like everyone else should. By that definition even if I suspect someone, if there is no case they won't get lynched. Also most importantly I spoke from everyone's view, and as it stands most people have town reads, by extension mafia have a good idea who would likely not be considered for a lynch, which supports my statement. And yes I also highly considered I could be the one to die, which is why I wanted to push as much meaningful discussion out of the mylo as possible.

Now a question to all three of you: Why now? Most of your points are not something that just happened, questioning my living, or me being not suspected is not new news, nor did I just start scumhunting day 3 for MC to make his case against me. So how come all of a sudden I'm in the top 2 of your suspect lists? Are the latter two of you just riding on the first coattail and TIO why are you just making that point now if you never trusted me. I'd love to hear some answers to these.

For now the only way these affect my reads is for Eo, who already seems to have been just jumping on it and adding silly illogical stuff to it to make his points seem more legit and not just repeats. While I have some beef with TIO's and MC's I'm counting them out as self defense bias until they respond.



Finally with my read list done, I give you: Yay we got an extension forever, NOW can we agree to use mass claiming as the damn ace in a hole when we have to make 3 successful lynches in a row and don't want to reveal a potential protective role?
 
Here's a reply to whatever you just said about me, LightWolf.
The Idiotic One:

Yay 19 posts, that's more than double the stuff from Eo! He claims his neighbourhood and to be VT, stuff related to that happens and I call him out on things, go after some early points to spark some discussions and all. We agree to disagree. Now in this discussion at a point he reveals his plan of indeed trying to boycott neighbourhoods due to his belief that mafia will use it for trickery and hold all the info we don't. This at the time frustrated me to no end, alas I choose to stay silent because saying it outloud would defeat the point, as I had my own plan, which was exactly to make mafia attempt to use the neighbourhoods. Having the mafia act like mafia is a thing the village's dream come true! Making mafia act more within a limited space they might feel safer was anything but a detriment to us. But I resisted bringing it up at the time because if I spell that out mafia would just cancel any such plans in the first place, and I couldn't really think of a reason why a mafia would inherently find the neighbourhoods dangers and go that far to shut them down, so in the end I dropped discussion with TIO.
I was unaware of your plan and was not smart enough to deduce what you were trying to do. I am very sorry for that.

More neighbourhood rules discussion... Prefers a Meowmixx lynch over Cancerous lynch in the wifom situation because he considers Cancerous to be more of an asset, fairly standard even if I at the time disagreed. Then votes Meowmixx. Day ends, admits his agreeing with me agreeing with neighour #1 of Cancerous, was essentially him agreeing with himself. Hm I actually do not quite understand his reply to phoenix in #95, I mean it sounds like he says he sorta agrees with phoenix's neighbour who suggested phoenix was halting communication within the neighbourhood, which seems slightly hypocritical considering TIO huge previous stance on having neighbourhoods essentially demolished. But in the context I don't really see how that would work with the rest of the sentence so I'd love some clarification there from TIO.
I believe that this is the post you're referring to.
he literally said "i think acid is scum for trying to block communication and make us lynch each other," also known as "acid is scum for suggesting that one of us might be scum."

Also: Should I publicize everything Celever posted?
That neighbor could be right, though I understand why you're pushing on this. Nobody ever admits they're scum.
I was not picking a side when I said this. Despite my desires to demolish neighborhood, I did not choose to promote such behavior. Here's a simplified version of what I said: "Both of you could be right, actually."

Replies to phoenix's summary of his and celever's hood discussions, not much substance here. The he idles till the next day, with his next post explaining it. I'm okay with this because at times I also like to just wait on my posts to see if without my input the situation changes(spoiler alert, in this game it doesn't). His general points in this scenario seem generally misinformed as it was pointed out later, like suspecting MC or his reasons for dismissing the phoenix lynch, which he thinks is not even on the table anymore. Blablabla his opinion on my rssp1 push changes by his second to last post. He also pushes Eo for a behavior he himself fits as admitted by him and as I think I pointed out later, doesn't really fit Eo(def not on the list of actual problems I have with Eo) as he did albeit weakly point at MC and was on the Gale lynch at least. He also states in both his posts the mylo day how he is not gonna vote or no lynch till someone brings up a good point, or I'm seeing double, felt like he was hammering that in a bit. Brings us today where he opens with suggestions, including 3 ways to deal with our lack of info, two of which I gladly agree with, the other I really really do not, but it's something that he was okay with day 1 and I know it was on everyone's mind, including mine. I stick to my opinions that it's playing our last card and should be left when we have nothing else, not be the first thing we do on this damn day, though we are literally hitting the last day of the lynch with only 3 people having made meaningful posts till now.
Alright, this plan sounds good, so let's stick with not claiming until everyone posts something.

So my read on TIO is kinda odd, it feels like he is acting. The way he presented his points on day 1 was just kind of, giving me this odd feeling, like half the time he says something newbie ish then reveals this grand plan, also those insincere sounding compliments to me. It's like every time I didn't like something about his day 1, that seemed scummy, he revealed it to be a ruse, and following day 1 he just ditched this newbieness I felt he had going. Again I can't grab on his lack of pointing fingers, as that is most of the game, and other than that he has 1 or 2 hypocritical moments,, which are not strong enough as one I don't quite understand, and the other seems to stem from his misunderstanding of certain events. The big question I propose to him is, why do his misunderstandings of the game state and people's points exist if as he claims he was keeping up to date on the thread trying to find stuff, there seem to be a few too many oversights for that. As for lynching him, I feel I need to come to terms with my thoughts on his playstyle and his reply to this before I can make the decision, so maybe?
Unlike you, I prefer to play a little more safely, namely accusing someone when I'm EXTREMELY sure of it. It appears that our interpretations of each other's posts are a little different, so I'll just use that as an explanation of why I've been wrong at times. I've also never "revealed my plans to be a ruse". I am rather quick to admit my mistakes when I play and I always try not to take a solid stance. As for the "I'm acting" part, I'm not quite sure of that myself, to be honest.

LightWolf:

What?! A read on myself? Nah, I'm using this part to address all the accusations that have popped up on this page.
lol at this.

First on the points made by TIO. It's about time I have to make this point, again, that some may be very familiar with(looking at you MC). I do not play as MafiaWolf. Regardless of my WC, regardless of my situation, I will always think and act like a villager and not fear posting due to possible repercussions. So yes your point that I could be pretending to be this helpful villager because roles that can check it don't exist is fair, the context of it, isn't. Your accusation starts with the fact I could get away with it due to there being no investigative role, but this assumption couldn't be confirmed until the death of Cancerous(chances of there being another role besides watcher that can find mafia are close to zero). By extension the part that I could safely do this holds no water, but yes I'd indeed do this 10 times out of 10 anyways.
This is exactly why I was calling the attention on you. No one other than Gale Wing Srock has expressed distrust in you prior to today. The fact that you have appeared as strong town previously to both my late neighbors (MeowMiXXX and Cancerous) as well as seemingly Steamroll definitely emphasized that you are very townish. I found this to be very incriminating towards you when combined with the fact that you're still alive, so I decided to accuse you.

Your other and seemingly the focus of this, is that I'm not dead yet. This is frankly fair, I do feel I should be dead, and agree this is a WIFOM that is weighted in favour of me being bad. Point is though, the last two kills were power roles, with UTO's case there being a couple of indications of that. The mafia could have been aware Cancerous was a power role, or on the previous days my suspicions were wrong and led to misslynches, or it could be it's because my rssp1 suspicions were either correct or incorrect(I have been previously killed for both) or maybe simply mafia feared the the existence of a protective role and that they'd likely be on me. Also the question works on More Cowbell as well, he has been just as much the lifeblood of this game as me, especially at the times I was either busy or lazy, mostly lazy. I dislike that you try to pin this tail on me only because "no one else suspected me", which is not quite the grounds for suspicion(and has been used against me in the legendary Celever v LightWolf debacle), it's more of a warning sign to possibly look this player over, but then your findings focus on me when they match others.
The past 3 days has shown that nobody seemed to suspect you (other than Gale Wing Srock, who nobody took seriously since he fakeclaimed even before being lynched, showing that he was untrustworthy even as town). With 3 nights for the mafia to consider killing you, the obvious answer should have been to do so. Cancerous hasn't been much of an impact to the game after he got a mislynch on MeowMiXXX. If you really were such a strong townie to many players, the mafia would definitely choose to kill you as that would be the most optimal choice at the time.

Now a question to all three of you: Why now? Most of your points are not something that just happened, questioning my living, or me being not suspected is not new news, nor did I just start scumhunting day 3 for MC to make his case against me. So how come all of a sudden I'm in the top 2 of your suspect lists? Are the latter two of you just riding on the first coattail and TIO why are you just making that point now if you never trusted me. I'd love to hear some answers to these.
Alright, I admit that only accusing you now is actually a rather selfish act of self-preservation. Due to how much people seemed to trust you previously, I did not want to accuse you since I was afraid I was going to be lynched (or at best, appear untrustworthy and therefore be ignored like Gale Wing Srock). I could have brought this up yesterday, but I was quite afraid of losing Cancerous's trust, something very motivational to me in this game. With today being a Lynch-or-Lose day, I believe that appearing to be trustworthy is not so important anymore, so I decided that now was the time to point my fingers at you.

Finally with my read list done, I give you: Yay we got an extension forever, NOW can we agree to use mass claiming as the damn ace in a hole when we have to make 3 successful lynches in a row and don't want to reveal a potential protective role?
I agree with this. Let's not claim for the time being.
 

LightWolf

lightwoof
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
I really would like people to talk before I reply to TIO, since we have all the time in the world, I will let that happen. I'm not willing to continue discussions till people actually seem to give a mice's bottom about the game.
 
I wouldn't mind if you called the game right now, I don't see much happening anyways. I've had a busy week, and I guess others have too, judging by how there are even less posts than normal. My motivation to actually finish the game is pretty low as well, and if we want to win the game we acually need three more lynches, and I don't see activity getting any better than it is now.
 
I wouldn't mind if you called the game right now, I don't see much happening anyways. I've had a busy week, and I guess others have too, judging by how there are even less posts than normal. My motivation to actually finish the game is pretty low as well, and if we want to win the game we acually need three more lynches, and I don't see activity getting any better than it is now.
I actually had my hopes up when I saw a notification about this. Oh well, I see your point.
 
ok game called

mafia win aka eo, lightwolf, and rssp1

would be willing to postgame since i really liked the game setup and would love to hear thoughts on it, but ultimately thought game just died from inactivity sadly :/
 
I think the game setup was really cool but it got really screwed by inactivity
also me not actually recruiting anyone to the mafia neighborhood and also the general inactivity of our neighborhood made it so we couldn't actually use that.

...I wasn't actually lying when I said I had nothing to add, I legitimately didn't.
 
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