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Pet Mod Nerfmons - NeverUsed Pet Mod [Slate 3: Mythical Mayhem + Quickdrops!]

G-Luke

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Approved by Ludicrousity
Original thread by Whydon


NERFMONS
Tired of all those Pet Mods doing the same thing: buff stuff for OU? Well this Pet Mod takes that idea and turns it on its head - take stuff from the higher tiers and nerf them flavourfully so they can successfully (or not) fit in a SS NU environment!

Nerfmons is a Community Project, so we will need some help from the community in order to make this happen! How will we make Pokemon NU viable? Well, whatever we can do, really. Change stats, add/delete moves, change abilities (and even come up with some of our own!), pretty much anything that will nerf a Pokemon!

Name:
Nerfed Stats:
Removed Moves:
New Typing (If Any):
New Ability (If Any):
New Moves (If Any):
Justification:
Competitive Insight:

The slates would be done with four Pokémon per slate, usually two from OU, one from UU and one from RU, unless specified otherwise. Ubers may sometimes get a spotlight.

Voting Phase
Voting phase lasts for around a day. In the voting phase, users vote for their preferred submissions and the winning submissions are added to the role compendium and spreadsheet.
The voting format is as follows:

Role in question: 1st preferred option, 2nd preferred option, 3rd preferred option.
Note: These self voting rules and the explanation are from good user lyd, slightly adapted to fit this pet mod
If you want to vote for yourself now, it gets slightly more complicated. You can always keep voting for yourself as second, but you can change the order a bit, for as long as the number of self-votes equals 2x the number of submissions you made. Let's use some examples to make it more understandable:

Stallbreaker: Yoshiblaze, Exploudit, Ludicrousity
Special Wall: Ludicrousity, Exploudit, Yoshiblaze
Defensive Pivot: Ludicrousity, Exploudit, Yoshiblaze

So this voting format is good, cuz' i voted for myself as second three times, and when you add everything up, I gave myself 6 votes, which is fine, as it is exactly the number of submissions I made for the slate x2. However, say I liked my Stallbreaker submission a lot, and I really want it to win, I can play around with my votes a little bit:

Stallbreaker: Exploudit, Yoshiblaze, Ludicrousity
Special Wall: Ludicrousity, Exploudit, Yoshiblaze
Defensive Pivot: Ludicrousity, Yoshiblaze, Exploudit

So to make my Stallbreaker first vote, I moved my Defensive Pivot self-vote to last. Makes sense, right? And when you add up the votes, 3 + 2 + 1 = 6 which is exactly what I want. Let's say that I like my Special Wall and Defensive Pivot submissions more, and I didn't like my Stallbreaker submission too much. I can do this:

Stallbreaker: Yoshiblaze, Ludicrousity, G-Luke
Special Wall: Exploudit, Ludicrousity, Yoshiblaze
Defensive Pivot: Exploudit, Ludicrousity, Yoshiblaze

3 + 3 adds up to six, so I'm good to that. Small note that this can't be done if I made no Stallbreaker submission because if that was the case, the number of submissions I made x2 would actually end up as 4, which isn't enough. Also, had I only made a single submission, I'd always have to self-vote as #2 or lower because making only one submission gives me only two self-vote points. I hope that was clear, if you had any trouble to understand this, feel free to PM me and I'll explain it as best as I can.
In case of a tie, a tiebreaker will be held. The two users in question cannot vote for themselves in this, but they're perfectly free to just not vote ;)

Resources for Reference
NU Viability Rankings
NU Metagame Discussion Thread
Spreadsheet of Nerfed Pokemon (Coming Soon!)
 
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Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: Unchanged
Removed Moves: Bulk Up, Body Press
New Typing (If Any): Flying
New Moves (If Any): No Change
Justification: Steel typing is the real rub here. It was a flying pure type before evolving anyway.
Competitive Insight: Do I even need to explain!? Steel is the reason it was so good. Now it’s way worse. All it 'gains' is a resistance to Fight type and losing a fire weakness in return for losing a layer of resistance to almost everything else and is now weak to SR. Unlike other common birds it doesn't even have a secondary Normal type for backup STAB. Losing Bulk Up and Body Press is a serious hit to coverage and long term durability.
 
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I've been waiting for this for a long time.

Name: Clefable
New Stats: 95 / 80 (+10) / 73 / 85 (-10) / 90 / 60 (483)
Removed Moves:
Moonblast, Dazzling Gleam, Teleport, Stealth Rock
New Typing:
Now pure Normal.
New Moves:
None.
Justification:
Primarily, the only reason why Clefable, a mon with only subpar stats, is it's typing. And with that removed, it basically goes back to the subpar mon it was. The removal of Fairy-type moves are also to prevent it from hitting Fighting and Dark-types super effectively easily, Teleport to remove her fancy phasing tool, and Stealth Rock just so it's a bit more limited on support options. Special Attack as also been reverted to pre-Gen 6 results, but to keep it's BST normal, it's been added to Attack, making it a bit more of a Mixed Attacker.
Competitive Insight:
Without it's Fairy typing to save it's defensive butt, it's not back in NU in it's rightful place. Now without it's excellent resistances and immunity, it's now back to being hit neutral with everything, and Fighting-types can finally snack on it again. A bit less firepower also hurts it, but Teleport also massively hurts it since it can't easily switch out anymore to another Pokemon in need. Stealth Rock is less of a loss then the other moves, but it can't function as a hazard setter as well. But it still what made it great in other departments, it's abilities. Unaware and Magic Guard still remain as great abilities and with a slightly better Attack, it can maybe run Meteor Mash a bit better.
 

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/70/80/97/80/100 (-23 Spe) (BST: 512)
Justification: The main thing that allows Noivern to be dominant in UU is its blistering 123 Speed. A major nerf to its speed greatly reduces its viability. In NU, it is outpaced by Frosslass, Rapidash-Galar, and Scarfers like Arctovish and Rotom-Frost, while speed tying with Mr. Mime-Galar. Noivern would likely still function as a stallbreaker/hazard control pivot, as it retains access to Taunt, Defog, and U-Turn. It still outspeeds Gourgeist-Small, Togedemaru, and the Silvally forms, and has options to hit all of them (Hurricane/Flamethrower for Gourgeist, Flamethrower for Togedemaru, and Draco Meteor/Hurricane for Silvally forms).
 
Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68/64/60/91/60/107
Removed Moves: Toxic
Justification: Toxic was one of the only reason it's good, now it's stuck with Poison Gas.
Competitive Insight: Corrosion is 99% useless now, so it can run hyper offence to poke some holes in teams. without a good ability its pretty bad.

Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: 98/87/75/53/85/87
New Typing: Dark/Flying
Removed Moves: Brave Bird, Heavy Slam
Justification: Gifted it the Dark type to utilise Roost/Bulk Up/Power Trip/Body Press sets.
Competitive Insight: Probably outclassed by mandibuzz in the future.

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/87/90/87/98/103
Removed Moves: Hurricane, Air Slash
Justification: More bulk, Less speed, Less Firepower.
Competitive Insight: Bulky Defogger, and maybe hyper offence, but it will be worse than before.
 
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Name: Clefable
Nerfed Stats: 95 / 100 / 73 / 70 / 90 / 60
Removed Moves: -Teleport, -Stealth Rock
New Ability (If Any): -Magic Guard, +Victory Star
Justification: Since Clefable would have no reason to be used over Clefairy other than Unaware, which likely would not do so good in a meta with Poison-types, I made it more physically inclined to carve its own niche. Add to that a loss of hazards and pivoting, and you have a pokemon with less defensive utility than before. Victory Star was chosen to replace Magic Guard to not be too OP while also allowing it to use inaccurate moves with fewer chances of missing.
Competitive Insight: I imagine Clefable would make a pretty good Fairy-type physical attacker, using moves like Drain Punch against steels and Zen Headbutt against poisons to prevent them from simply KOing it.

Name: Corviknight
Removed Moves: -Roost, -Bulk Up, -Body Press
New Typing: Steel
Justification: Removing the Flying type means that Corviknight is now weak to Ground and Fighting-types, and while it can still hurt them with Brave Bird, it won't do a lot of damage now due to lack of STAB. It also lost reliable recovery, as well as being unable to defeat other Steels with Body Press, and being used as a wincon with Bulk Up.
Competitive Insight: While Corviknight seems to be outclassed by Ferroseed, it still has a couple niches, such as its higher attack, ability to pivot, and coverage against Fighting-types, however, I think it may be a niche pick.

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85 / 70 / 80 / 97 / 80 / 113 (-10 speed)
Removed Moves: -Flamethrower, -Focus Blast,
Justification: The loss of these two moves mean Noivern will now be consistently walled by Steel-types, and a small decrease in Speed makes it a bit easier to revenge kill with Choice Scarfers.
Competitive Insight: Noivern will definitely be using its utility sets more, as the loss of its two main coverage options will leave it consistently walled by Steels, and it still retains various moves such as Taunt and Defog, which it can use against the multiple hazard setters in the tier.

Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 91 / 60 / 117 (-20 SpA)
Removed Move: -Nasty Plot
Justification: With a nerf to Special Attack and the loss of its only set-up move, it will not be able to break many walls that do not mind Toxic. Combine that with its pathetic bulk and weakness to many common offensive typings, and you have a pokemon that will simply not be fit for offense.
Competitive Insight: However, Salazzle does still retain an important niche in Corrosion, which, combined with its blistering speed, means that it can stall out any Pokemon in the entire tier, even Steel and Poison types. Therefore, it should fit on balance and stall teams as a powerful status spreader.
 
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Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68/64/60/100/60/100 (0/0/0/-11/0/-17)
Removed Moves: Disable, Protect, Knock Off
New Typing (If Any): None
New Moves (If Any): None
Justification: Salazzle is best known for its Substitute sets and the ludicrous speed at which it's able to get these subs up, outspeeding various unboosted threats. With this nerf, it's still very fast for the meta, outspeeding unboosted threats such as Silvally and Unfezant, but still cannot outspeed a handful of potential counters, the first coming to mind being Dugtrio-Alola and Rapidash-Galar. Nasty Plot sets are hit even harder, being unable to reliably deal with those that outspeed Salazzle.
Competitive Insight: This nerfed Salazzle can still function as a Substitute user, capable of taking advantage of gaps in an opponent's pressure in order to get a Substitute up to use Toxic or Nasty Plot, but it can no longer reliably stall out its opponents with Toxic for so long without help, acting more to support its team than to single-handedly cripple an opposing wall.
 

G-Luke

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1590366311534.png

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85 / 70 / 80 / 87 / 80 / 100 (-10 SpA, -23 speed)
Removed Moves: Focus Blast
Justification: 123 speed made Noivern the fastest Pokemon in the tier, in combination with its threatening STAB and coverage made it a menace to face. With a speed nerf, Noivern is now notably outpaced by both Rapidash variants and Persian-Alola. In addition, losing Focus Blast makes makes Steels have a better chance at walling it.
Competitive Insight: Noivern will largely do what it does in UU, with utility Boots and Choice Specs be equally threatening. Choice Scarf is also an option with its solid speed tier and strong STAB moves.

1590366287907.png

Name: Clefable
Nerfed Stats: 75 / 95 / 73 / 70 / 95 / 60 (swapped Attack with SpA, -20 HP)
Removed Moves: -Teleport, -Stealth Rock, -Softboiled
New Typing (If Any): Normal / Fairy
New Ability (If Any): -Magic Guard, +Serene Grace
New Moves (If Any): Bulk Up
Justification: Granting Clefable with Normal / Fairy is a direct nerf, as it loses its valuable Fighting resist. A knick in its HP and removal of its pivoting, most potent utility and recovery also puts a damper on it. Also losing Magic Guard is a amjor blow, as now its much easier to wear down. In order to differenciate it from its prevo Clefairy and Alcremie, I made Clefable a physical attacker.
Competitive Insight: Clefable can use Body Slam and Play Rough in combination with its good coverage to be a competent physical breaker with bulk up. It can also try its hand at Belly Drum.

Clefable @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Ability: Serene Grace
Adamant Nature
- Bulk Up
- Body Slam
- Play Rough
- Knock Off / Fire Punch


1590366347376.png

Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 101 / 60 / 85 (-10 SpA, -32 Spe)
Removed Moves: -Flame Charge
New Ability (If Any): - Corrosion, +Poison Point
Justification: Losing its precious Speed and Special Attack is hard enough, but the real nerf is losing access to Corrosion, making poison types righteous switchins once more. Losing Flame Charge because i do not think NU needs that in its life right now.
Competitive Insight: Salazzle can either go as a Nasty Plot wallbreaker or as Choice Scarf revengekiller.

1590366265858.png

Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: 88 / 87 / 85 / 73 / 85 / 77 (-10 HP, -20 Def, +20 SpA, +10 Spe)
Removed Moves: -Roost, -U-turn
New Typing (If Any): Flying / Steel
New Ability (If Any): -Pressure, +Big Pecks
Justification: I wanted to keep Corviknight's godtier typing, and find a way to balance it in NU. So i god rid of Pressure, gimped some of its bulk, and removed its recovery and access to pivoting. Now its a decently bulky tank that can hit hard if needed with its strong Flying STAB.
Competitive Insight: Corviknight can now either function as a traditional hazard control wall, or can go ham with offensive sets like Bulk Up or even..Nasty Plot!

Also dude lolgod3 127 Speed Salazzle is not a nerf! That Salazzle would absolutely destroy NU. Please think about the tier when doing this please.
 
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G-Luke

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Guys please remember the power level we are nerfing to. Sword and Shield NU is much weaker than that of Gen 7, so keep in mind how strong the top tier wallbreakers are. and how fast the speed tiers are (for reference Rotom-F are good scarfers, and Gourgeist-Small is considered a very fast pick).

Also, after some deliberation with some NU players, Magic Guard + Fairy typing will be banned on Clefable. So submissions please find suitable alternatives if you are going down this avenue.
 

quziel

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Good day, I have been asked to give feedback on some of these submissions as an NU player. To give context I was on the Musharnas this past NUPL season, and in doing that I built roughly 15-20 of the teams used within the NUPL season while playing in 5 out of 7 weeks. Additionally I have played a fair amount of ladder this gen, reaching top 10 at least 6 or 7 times. Furthermore I am on the NU QC team. Covering the first 3 posts in order because I don't wanna pick and choose.

Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: Unchanged
Removed Moves: Unchanged
New Typing (If Any): Flying
New Moves (If Any): No Change
Justification: Steel typing is the real rub here. It was a flying pure type before evolving anyway.
Competitive Insight: Do I even need to explain!? Steel is the reason it was so good. Now it’s way worse. All it 'gains' is a resistance to Fight type and losing a fire weakness in return for losing a layer of resistance to almost everything else and is now weak to SR. Unlike other common birds it doesn't even have a secondary Normal type for backup STAB.
Our best flying type with access to roost is Unfezant, which primarily runs a choice scarf set; this mon would literally just run sub-bulk up and basically run over the tier. I find it doubtful it would be balanced. It should be noted that this hard walls Idef Cofagrigus, and can be ev'd such that its shadow ball does not break its sub. Being a splashable defogger also would basically make this S+++. If this made it in I'd expect every single team style to run a Corv on every single team.

-----

I've been waiting for this for a long time.

Name: Clefable
New Stats: 95 / 80 (+10) / 73 / 85 (-10) / 90 / 60 (483)
Removed Moves: Moonblast, Dazzling Gleam, Teleport, Stealth Rock
New Typing: Now pure Normal.
New Moves: None.
Justification: Primarily, the only reason why Clefable, a mon with only subpar stats, is it's typing. And with that removed, it basically goes back to the subpar mon it was. The removal of Fairy-type moves are also to prevent it from hitting Fighting and Dark-types super effectively easily, Teleport to remove her fancy phasing tool, and Stealth Rock just so it's a bit more limited on support options. Special Attack as also been reverted to pre-Gen 6 results, but to keep it's BST normal, it's been added to Attack, making it a bit more of a Mixed Attacker.
Competitive Insight: Without it's Fairy typing to save it's defensive butt, it's not back in NU in it's rightful place. Now without it's excellent resistances and immunity, it's now back to being hit neutral with everything, and Fighting-types can finally snack on it again. A bit less firepower also hurts it, but Teleport also massively hurts it since it can't easily switch out anymore to another Pokemon in need. Stealth Rock is less of a loss then the other moves, but it can't function as a hazard setter as well. But it still what made it great in other departments, it's abilities. Unaware and Magic Guard still remain as great abilities and with a slightly better Attack, it can maybe run Meteor Mash a bit better.
Even without Stealth Rock, and without Fairy typing I don't think this mon would be balanced in NU. It should be noted that DPP UU, a tier with an arguably higher power level than SSNU has normal type Clefable (with strictly worse stats than that, as it got a spA buff in gen 6, and you gave it an attack buff as well) in the A ranks. I am unsure how NU would break CM sets, and honestly physical LO sets would also be very viable given the newly buffed attack, double edge, and knock off. Its worth noting that LO DE hits as hard as Sawk's CC. Ye, it gets walled by Cofa fairly well, but like, it can tech around that with Knock Off and Shadow Ball while also just 2hkoing it after a CM with LO sets.

----


Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/70/80/97/80/100 (-23 Spe) (BST: 512)
Justification: The main thing that allows Noivern to be dominant in UU is its blistering 123 Speed. A major nerf to its speed greatly reduces its viability. In NU, it is outpaced by Frosslass, Rapidash-Galar, and Scarfers like Arctovish and Rotom-Frost, while speed tying with Mr. Mime-Galar. Noivern would likely still function as a stallbreaker/hazard control pivot, as it retains access to Taunt, Defog, and U-Turn. It still outspeeds Gourgeist-Small, Togedemaru, and the Silvally forms, and has options to hit all of them (Hurricane/Flamethrower for Gourgeist, Flamethrower for Togedemaru, and Draco Meteor/Hurricane for Silvally forms).
While this is def closer to balanced, I still think its problematic. You're still faster than 95 speed, still have access to Hurricane, Draco, Taunt, and Flamethrower, and NU is not a specially bulky tier. For reference you soundly 2hko Piloswine with Draco Meteor, which is realistically gonna be one of the bulkier mons on an offensive team (64.6-75.3 with specs), and the tier's special wall, aka clefairy can barely 2hko uninvested sets.

-----

I probably should cover a Salazzle post, but keep in mind that NU has very few great fire resists, often relying on stuff like Wishiwashi (91 spA does 63.6 min with a +2 Sludge Wave, which is about the max I'm comfortable with honestly), generically bulky stuff (Sanda just dies), or revenge killing to deal with our current ones. Lanturn does exist, and would probably jump into prominence if we ever get a special fire-type, but its worth noting its quite bad atm.

----

I think I should note a few things. 95 speed is basically the SSNU equivalent of SMOU's 110 base speed, that is, the speed where all the super potent threats lie thanks to the Silvallys. The tier really isn't specially bulky at all, with our main defensive wall being literally Clefairy, Stunfisk-Galar, and well, Wishiwashi. Our walls in general all have crippling flaws from lacking reliable recovery (Sandaconda, Cofagrigus, Wishiwashi), lacking offensive presence (Clefairy, Stunfisk-G), or mismatched stats/typing (Alcremie's fairy typing makes it want to take physical hits, but its got legit 65/75 bulk), or just being weird (see Quagsire as a ground type without SR). So anyone introducing a proper defensive mon with recovery should keep that in mind.

As for offensive threats; if you're faster than 95 you should probably have a significant flaw, eg Rapidash's complete reliance upon HDB, general frailty, and a recoil causing stab, Mime-G's issue's with 4MSS, frailty, and awkward coverage, or Ninjask's inability to run HDB, functional 2 move coverage (Acro+U-turn), and frailty. Also if you're going against the general stereotype of your typing, be wary; all of NU's fire types are physical (literally all of them), so special fire resists are rare (Wishi invests in Physdef, Drampa has meh bulk). This may come up in the future, but I'd expect ya to have a lot of freedom when designing Ground-type SR mons, as we got a lot of those already.

----

Important Speed tiers (bolded are very important):

30: Cofagrigus, Wishiwashi, etc. (generally uninvested, may creep for Clef)

35: Clefairy, Quagsire (generally uninvested)

36: Drampa (generally either full invest, or just creeping Piloswine)

50: Piloswine (uninvested generally), Perrserker (invested)

60: Abomasnow (Max speed timid)

85: Toxicroak, Sawk, Indeedee (Max speed positive nature)

86: Rotom-S, Rotom-F (Max speed positive nature)

95: Silvally-Formes

96-100: Togedemaru (96), Gourgeist-Small (99), Mr Mime-Galar (100) (all run max speed)

105: Rapidash-Kanto (galar is bad) (Max speed positive nature)

115: Persian Alola (Max speed or outrunning dash-Kanto)

160: Ninjask (generally max HP)
 
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I probably should cover a Salazzle post, but keep in mind that NU has very few great fire resists, often relying on stuff like Wishiwashi (91 spA does 63.6 min with a +2 Sludge Wave, which is about the max I'm comfortable with honestly), generically bulky stuff (Sanda just dies), or revenge killing to deal with our current ones. Lanturn does exist, and would probably jump into prominence if we ever get a special fire-type, but its worth noting its quite bad atm.
Is that so?


Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 54 / 60 / 87 / 60 / 97
Removed Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Heat Wave, Overheat, Flare Blitz, Fire Lash

Still fast, and still strong with Nasty Plot, but its special movepool now consists of Sludge Bomb/Wave, Dragon Pulse, and Incinerate (basically Hidden Power Fire). I considered also making it pure Poison, but I figured that would actually help it, as it wouldn't be weak to Stealth Rock.


It seems I overcompensated when quziel said that NU was lacking in Fire resists and SpDef walls. Salazzle was already RU, so completely gutting it wasn't necessary. It's just weaker and slower now, but still quite fast by NU standards and still packing a punch with Nasty Plot.
 
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G-Luke

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is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributor
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Is that so?


Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 54 / 60 / 87 / 60 / 97
Removed Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Heat Wave, Overheat, Flare Blitz, Fire Lash

Still fast, and still strong with Nasty Plot, but its special movepool now consists of Sludge Bomb/Wave, Dragon Pulse, and Incinerate (basically Hidden Power Fire). I considered also making it pure Poison, but I figured that would actually help it, as it wouldn't be weak to Stealth Rock.
I hope this is ironic / a joke post so i know when to delete it. There is a diff between nerfng to make it viable in NU and just nerfing it into non existence. (Why would I use a Fire type with no STAB in any Tier?).

Anyways, I didnt make it clear, submissions end on Wednesday!
 
I hope this is ironic / a joke post so i know when to delete it. There is a diff between nerfng to make it viable in NU and just nerfing it into non existence. (Why would I use a Fire type with no STAB in any Tier?).

Anyways, I didnt make it clear, submissions end on Wednesday!
Oh, I suppose I went too far...
 
Our best flying type with access to roost is Unfezant, which primarily runs a choice scarf set; this mon would literally just run sub-bulk up and basically run over the tier. I find it doubtful it would be balanced. It should be noted that this hard walls Idef Cofagrigus, and can be ev'd such that its shadow ball does not break its sub. Being a splashable defogger also would basically make this S+++. If this made it in I'd expect every single team style to run a Corv on every single team.
I have removed Bulk Up and Body Press. Without Bulk Up, it can't sit around and boost and as a Brave Bird/Rooster it is slower than Unfeazant though still more durable. It just lacks the punch of the other bird does and in the off chance it weren't enough, removing Body Press off of 107 Def might be too much to ensure Steels (of which I'm sure some will drop tiers) and rocks have a niche against those who don't pack Iron Head (which it might due to a far weaker movepool.)
 
First time trying this kind of thing, but here we go:




Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 91 / 60 / 97 (-20 SpA, -20 Speed)
New Typing: Poison
New Ability: Keen Eye, HA: Oblivious
Removed Move: Fire Blast, Overheat, Heat Wave, Flamethrower, Flare Blitz, Flame Charge, Fire Lash
Justification:
Imo, the fire type has never been that obvious to me on salazzle, and a few comments have been made towards the lack of fire type resists in the tier. Even without it's fire type, it's ability to use Corrosion to great effect on mons such as Toxicroak, Stunfisk-G, Garbodor and Skuntak warranted the removal of it's ability. I believe that a nasty plot sweeper is still an important characteristic to it, so to keep it I lowered it's base Spa. It's speed was also lowered to not absolutely destroy the metagame, with it's new speed sitting right under max speed Gourgeist and Galarian Mr. Mime.

Competitive Insight:
Without Corrosion, Salazzle's role will mostly fit that of a standard poison type, with access to toxic stall other pokemon but still having acces to will-o-wisp, to hinder some steels that can come in on it. But apart from that, Salazzle is completely helpless to most of the steel types and having a very bad matchup against most grounds. While it can also use nasty plot to attempt a sweep, it is now outsped by a few mons that hard counter it, such as galarian Mr. Mime, Galarian Rapidash and Alolan Dugtrio.
 

G-Luke

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Voting Time!

vote for your favourite subs
Clefable
I've been waiting for this for a long time.

Name: Clefable
New Stats: 95 / 80 (+10) / 73 / 85 (-10) / 90 / 60 (483)
Removed Moves: Moonblast, Dazzling Gleam, Teleport, Stealth Rock
New Typing: Now pure Normal.
New Moves: None.
Justification: Primarily, the only reason why Clefable, a mon with only subpar stats, is it's typing. And with that removed, it basically goes back to the subpar mon it was. The removal of Fairy-type moves are also to prevent it from hitting Fighting and Dark-types super effectively easily, Teleport to remove her fancy phasing tool, and Stealth Rock just so it's a bit more limited on support options. Special Attack as also been reverted to pre-Gen 6 results, but to keep it's BST normal, it's been added to Attack, making it a bit more of a Mixed Attacker.
Competitive Insight: Without it's Fairy typing to save it's defensive butt, it's not back in NU in it's rightful place. Now without it's excellent resistances and immunity, it's now back to being hit neutral with everything, and Fighting-types can finally snack on it again. A bit less firepower also hurts it, but Teleport also massively hurts it since it can't easily switch out anymore to another Pokemon in need. Stealth Rock is less of a loss then the other moves, but it can't function as a hazard setter as well. But it still what made it great in other departments, it's abilities. Unaware and Magic Guard still remain as great abilities and with a slightly better Attack, it can maybe run Meteor Mash a bit better.
(This will lose Knock Off and Calm Mind if it wins.)


Name: Clefable
Nerfed Stats: 95 / 100 / 73 / 70 / 90 / 60
Removed Moves: -Teleport, -Stealth Rock
New Ability (If Any): -Magic Guard, +Victory Star
Justification: Since Clefable would have no reason to be used over Clefairy other than Unaware, which likely would not do so good in a meta with Poison-types, I made it more physically inclined to carve its own niche. Add to that a loss of hazards and pivoting, and you have a pokemon with less defensive utility than before. Victory Star was chosen to replace Magic Guard to not be too OP while also allowing it to use inaccurate moves with fewer chances of missing.
Competitive Insight: I imagine Clefable would make a pretty good Fairy-type physical attacker, using moves like Drain Punch against steels and Zen Headbutt against poisons to prevent them from simply KOing it.
View attachment 248650
Name: Clefable
Nerfed Stats: 75 / 95 / 73 / 70 / 95 / 60 (swapped Attack with SpA, -20 HP)
Removed Moves: -Teleport, -Stealth Rock, -Softboiled
New Typing (If Any): Normal / Fairy
New Ability (If Any): -Magic Guard, +Serene Grace
Justification: Granting Clefable with Normal / Fairy is a direct nerf, as it loses its valuable Fighting resist. A knick in its HP and removal of its pivoting, most potent utility and recovery also puts a damper on it. Also losing Magic Guard is a amjor blow, as now its much easier to wear down. In order to differenciate it from its prevo Clefairy and Alcremie, I made Clefable a physical attacker.
Competitive Insight: Clefable can use Body Slam and Play Rough in combination with its good coverage to be a competent physical breaker with bulk up. It can also try its hand at Belly Drum.

Clefable @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Ability: Serene Grace
Adamant Nature
- Moonlight
- Body Slam
- Play Rough
- Knock Off / Fire Punch
Corviknight
Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: Unchanged
Removed Moves: Bulk Up, Body Press
New Typing (If Any): Flying
New Moves (If Any): No Change
Justification: Steel typing is the real rub here. It was a flying pure type before evolving anyway.
Competitive Insight: Do I even need to explain!? Steel is the reason it was so good. Now it’s way worse. All it 'gains' is a resistance to Fight type and losing a fire weakness in return for losing a layer of resistance to almost everything else and is now weak to SR. Unlike other common birds it doesn't even have a secondary Normal type for backup STAB. Losing Bulk Up and Body Press is a serious hit to coverage and long term durability.
Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: 98/87/75/53/85/87
New Typing: Dark/Flying
Removed Moves: Brave Bird, Heavy Slam
Justification: Gifted it the Dark type to utilise Roost/Bulk Up/Power Trip/Body Press sets.
Competitive Insight: Probably outclassed by mandibuzz in the future.

Name: Corviknight
Removed Moves: -Roost, -Bulk Up, -Body Press
New Typing: Steel
Justification: Removing the Flying type means that Corviknight is now weak to Ground and Fighting-types, and while it can still hurt them with Brave Bird, it won't do a lot of damage now due to lack of STAB. It also lost reliable recovery, as well as being unable to defeat other Steels with Body Press, and being used as a wincon with Bulk Up.
Competitive Insight: While Corviknight seems to be outclassed by Ferroseed, it still has a couple niches, such as its higher attack, ability to pivot, and coverage against Fighting-types, however, I think it may be a niche pick.
View attachment 248649
Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: 88 / 87 / 85 / 73 / 85 / 77 (-10 HP, -20 Def, +20 SpA, +10 Spe)
Removed Moves: -Roost, -U-turn
New Typing (If Any): Flying / Steel
New Ability (If Any): -Pressure, +Big Pecks
Justification: I wanted to keep Corviknight's godtier typing, and find a way to balance it in NU. So i god rid of Pressure, gimped some of its bulk, and removed its recovery and access to pivoting. Now its a decently bulky tank that can hit hard if needed with its strong Flying STAB.
Competitive Insight: Corviknight can now either function as a traditional hazard control wall, or can go ham with offensive sets like Bulk Up or even..Nasty Plot!

Also dude lolgod3 127 Speed Salazzle is not a nerf! That Salazzle would absolutely destroy NU. Please think about the tier when doing this please.
Salazzle
Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68/64/60/91/60/107
Removed Moves: Toxic
Justification: Toxic was one of the only reason it's good, now it's stuck with Poison Gas.
Competitive Insight: Corrosion is 99% useless now, so it can run hyper offence to poke some holes in teams. without a good ability its pretty bad.

Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 91 / 60 / 117 (-20 SpA)
Removed Move: -Nasty Plot
Justification: With a nerf to Special Attack and the loss of its only set-up move, it will not be able to break many walls that do not mind Toxic. Combine that with its pathetic bulk and weakness to many common offensive typings, and you have a pokemon that will simply not be fit for offense.
Competitive Insight: However, Salazzle does still retain an important niche in Corrosion, which, combined with its blistering speed, means that it can stall out any Pokemon in the entire tier, even Steel and Poison types. Therefore, it should fit on balance and stall teams as a powerful status spreader.
[/QUOTE]
Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68/64/60/100/60/100 (0/0/0/-11/0/-17)
Removed Moves: Disable, Protect, Knock Off
New Typing (If Any): None
New Moves (If Any): None
Justification: Salazzle is best known for its Substitute sets and the ludicrous speed at which it's able to get these subs up, outspeeding various unboosted threats. With this nerf, it's still very fast for the meta, outspeeding unboosted threats such as Silvally and Unfezant, but still cannot outspeed a handful of potential counters, the first coming to mind being Dugtrio-Alola and Rapidash-Galar. Nasty Plot sets are hit even harder, being unable to reliably deal with those that outspeed Salazzle.
Competitive Insight: This nerfed Salazzle can still function as a Substitute user, capable of taking advantage of gaps in an opponent's pressure in order to get a Substitute up to use Toxic or Nasty Plot, but it can no longer reliably stall out its opponents with Toxic for so long without help, acting more to support its team than to single-handedly cripple an opposing wall.

View attachment 248652
Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 101 / 60 / 85 (-10 SpA, -32 Spe)
Removed Moves: -Flame Charge
New Ability (If Any): - Corrosion, +Poison Point
Justification: Losing its precious Speed and Special Attack is hard enough, but the real nerf is losing access to Corrosion, making poison types righteous switchins once more. Losing Flame Charge because i do not think NU needs that in its life right now.
Competitive Insight: Salazzle can either go as a Nasty Plot wallbreaker or as Choice Scarf revengekiller.
Is that so?


Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 54 / 60 / 87 / 60 / 97

It seems I overcompensated when quziel said that NU was lacking in Fire resists and SpDef walls. Salazzle was already RU, so completely gutting it wasn't necessary. It's just weaker and slower now, but still quite fast by NU standards and still packing a punch with Nasty Plot.
First time trying this kind of thing, but here we go:




Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68 / 64 / 60 / 91 / 60 / 97 (-20 SpA, -20 Speed)
New Typing: Poison
New Ability: Keen Eye, HA: Oblivious
Removed Move: Fire Blast, Overheat, Heat Wave, Flamethrower, Flare Blitz, Flame Charge, Fire Lash
Justification:
Imo, the fire type has never been that obvious to me on salazzle, and a few comments have been made towards the lack of fire type resists in the tier. Even without it's fire type, it's ability to use Corrosion to great effect on mons such as Toxicroak, Stunfisk-G, Garbodor and Skuntak warranted the removal of it's ability. I believe that a nasty plot sweeper is still an important characteristic to it, so to keep it I lowered it's base Spa. It's speed was also lowered to not absolutely destroy the metagame, with it's new speed sitting right under max speed Gourgeist and Galarian Mr. Mime.

Competitive Insight:
Without Corrosion, Salazzle's role will mostly fit that of a standard poison type, with access to toxic stall other pokemon but still having acces to will-o-wisp, to hinder some steels that can come in on it. But apart from that, Salazzle is completely helpless to most of the steel types and having a very bad matchup against most grounds. While it can also use nasty plot to attempt a sweep, it is now outsped by a few mons that hard counter it, such as galarian Mr. Mime, Galarian Rapidash and Alolan Dugtrio.
Noivern

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/70/80/97/80/100 (-23 Spe) (BST: 512)
Justification: The main thing that allows Noivern to be dominant in UU is its blistering 123 Speed. A major nerf to its speed greatly reduces its viability. In NU, it is outpaced by Frosslass, Rapidash-Galar, and Scarfers like Arctovish and Rotom-Frost, while speed tying with Mr. Mime-Galar. Noivern would likely still function as a stallbreaker/hazard control pivot, as it retains access to Taunt, Defog, and U-Turn. It still outspeeds Gourgeist-Small, Togedemaru, and the Silvally forms, and has options to hit all of them (Hurricane/Flamethrower for Gourgeist, Flamethrower for Togedemaru, and Draco Meteor/Hurricane for Silvally forms).
Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/87/90/87/98/103
Removed Moves: Hurricane, Air Slash
Justification: More bulk, Less speed, Less Firepower.
Competitive Insight: Bulky Defogger, and maybe hyper offence, but it will be worse than before.

Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85 / 70 / 80 / 97 / 80 / 113 (-10 speed)
Removed Moves: -Flamethrower, -Focus Blast,
Justification: The loss of these two moves mean Noivern will now be consistently walled by Steel-types, and a small decrease in Speed makes it a bit easier to revenge kill with Choice Scarfers.
Competitive Insight: Noivern will definitely be using its utility sets more, as the loss of its two main coverage options will leave it consistently walled by Steels, and it still retains various moves such as Taunt and Defog, which it can use against the multiple hazard setters in the tier.
View attachment 248651
Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85 / 70 / 80 / 87 / 80 / 100 (-10 SpA, -23 speed)
Removed Moves: Focus Blast
Justification: 123 speed made Noivern the fastest Pokemon in the tier, in combination with its threatening STAB and coverage made it a menace to face. With a speed nerf, Noivern is now notably outpaced by both Rapidash variants and Persian-Alola. In addition, losing Focus Blast makes makes Steels have a better chance at walling it.
Competitive Insight: Noivern will largely do what it does in UU, with utility Boots and Choice Specs be equally threatening. Choice Scarf is also an option with its solid speed tier and strong STAB moves.
Remember to check out the OP on how to vote! if you are familiar with the Clean Slate system you should be secure!

Clefable: Ticktock, G-Luke, Demon Dragon
Corviknight: Dilasc, Demon Dragon, G-Luke
Salazzle: G-Luke, Dr. Pumpkinz, Demon Dragon
Noivern: lolgod3, G-Luke, Squawkerz
 
Last edited:
Clefable: G-Luke, Ticktock, Demon Dragon
Corviknight: G-Luke, Demon Dragon
Salazzle: M24, Adou (SV), G-Luke
Noivern: G-Luke, Squawkerz
 
Clefable: G-Luke, Demon Dragon, Ticktock
Corviknight: G-Luke, Demon Dragon, Dilasc
Salazzle: Adou, G-Luke, DrPumpkinz
Noivern: Squawkerz, Demon Dragon, G-Luke
 
Clefable: G-Luke, Ticktock, Demon Dragon
Corviknight: G-Luke, Demon Dragon
Salazzle: M24, G-Luke, Adou
 

G-Luke

Sugar, Spice and One for All
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributor
Moderator
Winners!

I take Clefable and Corviknight!
1590366287907.png


Name: Clefable
Nerfed Stats: 75 / 95 / 73 / 70 / 95 / 60 (swapped Attack with SpA, -20 HP)
Removed Moves: -Teleport, -Stealth Rock, -Softboiled
New Typing (If Any): Normal / Fairy
New Ability (If Any): -Magic Guard, +Serene Grace
New Moves (If Any): Bulk Up
Justification: Granting Clefable with Normal / Fairy is a direct nerf, as it loses its valuable Fighting resist. A knick in its HP and removal of its pivoting, most potent utility and recovery also puts a damper on it. Also losing Magic Guard is a amjor blow, as now its much easier to wear down. In order to differenciate it from its prevo Clefairy and Alcremie, I made Clefable a physical attacker.
Competitive Insight: Clefable can use Body Slam and Play Rough in combination with its good coverage to be a competent physical breaker with bulk up. It can also try its hand at Belly Drum.


1590366265858.png


Name: Corviknight
Nerfed Stats: 88 / 87 / 85 / 73 / 85 / 77 (-10 HP, -20 Def, +20 SpA, +10 Spe)
Removed Moves: -Roost, -U-turn
New Typing (If Any): Flying / Steel
New Ability (If Any): -Pressure, +Big Pecks
Justification: I wanted to keep Corviknight's godtier typing, and find a way to balance it in NU. So i god rid of Pressure, gimped some of its bulk, and removed its recovery and access to pivoting. Now its a decently bulky tank that can hit hard if needed with its strong Flying STAB.
Competitive Insight: Corviknight can now either function as a traditional hazard control wall, or can go ham with offensive sets like Bulk Up or even..Nasty Plot!

Gratz to Adou for Salazzle!

Name: Salazzle
Nerfed Stats: 68/64/60/100/60/100 (0/0/0/-11/0/-17)
Removed Moves: Disable, Protect, Knock Off
New Typing (If Any): None
New Moves (If Any): None
Justification: Salazzle is best known for its Substitute sets and the ludicrous speed at which it's able to get these subs up, outspeeding various unboosted threats. With this nerf, it's still very fast for the meta, outspeeding unboosted threats such as Silvally and Unfezant, but still cannot outspeed a handful of potential counters, the first coming to mind being Dugtrio-Alola and Rapidash-Galar. Nasty Plot sets are hit even harder, being unable to reliably deal with those that outspeed Salazzle.
Competitive Insight: This nerfed Salazzle can still function as a Substitute user, capable of taking advantage of gaps in an opponent's pressure in order to get a Substitute up to use Toxic or Nasty Plot, but it can no longer reliably stall out its opponents with Toxic for so long without help, acting more to support its team than to single-handedly cripple an opposing wall.

Big up Squawkerz for his Noivern!



Name: Noivern
Nerfed Stats: 85/70/80/97/80/100 (-23 Spe) (BST: 512)
Justification: The main thing that allows Noivern to be dominant in UU is its blistering 123 Speed. A major nerf to its speed greatly reduces its viability. In NU, it is outpaced by Frosslass, Rapidash-Galar, and Scarfers like Arctovish and Rotom-Frost, while speed tying with Mr. Mime-Galar. Noivern would likely still function as a stallbreaker/hazard control pivot, as it retains access to Taunt, Defog, and U-Turn. It still outspeeds Gourgeist-Small, Togedemaru, and the Silvally forms, and has options to hit all of them (Hurricane/Flamethrower for Gourgeist, Flamethrower for Togedemaru, and Draco Meteor/Hurricane for Silvally forms).

Next Slate..BL Knights!


Mamoswine is a powerful wallbreaker thanks to its meaty 130 Attack and its powerful dual STAB. Its access to priority to offset its 80 speed allowed it to go toe to toe with offense, and it could get away with being an offensive SR setter. What ultimately pushed Mamoswine over the edge was it gaining Knock Off, allowing to cripple its checks and making it much easier to wear down in the long run. How will you go about balancing Mamo for NU, especially regarding its prevo Piloswine is a notable threat?


Ninetales-Alola's defining niche was that of being hands down the best Aurora Veil setter in the metagame, having high speed, and access to utility options such as Encore and Hypnosis. This was proven too much for UU, and was thus banned. Now, it gets a chance at a new life here in NU, but how will you handle it? Just going to preface by saying Aurora Veil + Snow Warning is banned on Ninetales subs. Aboma already has that niche and we aren't looking to upstage it.


Obstagoon's Guts boosted STAB Facade ravaged UU, with its strong STAB Knock Off and Close Combat for coverage enabled it to smack normal switchins quite well. This coupled with its great bulk for a wallbreaker and tech like Switcheroo, Obstruct and Bulk Up removed most viable forms of counterplay, and led to its quickban. Now that NU is opening its arms to it, will you allow it to have the same fate as its cousin Linoone?


Gyarados is a threatening sweeper with its skyhigh Attack stat backed by superb coverage and the threat of iether Moxie snowballing it through teams or Intimidate giving it ample set up opportunities. Even bulk waters were not enough, as it had great coverage to handle those as well, between the likes of Ice Fang, Earthquake and Power Whip. Gyarados will finally grace NU with its power, but can you prevent it from being too much?

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