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Announcement NP: LGPE OU Stage 01 - DNA. [Mew Suspect Test]

Ezaphs

it was all just a metaphor
is a Forum Moderator
Moderator
s/o Funbot28 for music choice, can't say I'd have thought of this


Hi everyone! The council has decided it is time to hold a suspect test for Mew.

Ever since the meta was first played, it was obvious that Mew was going to be a dominant force in the metagame. Nearly two months later, this is still holds very true. However, Mew's domination seems to some to cause an imbalance in the meta. Its Base 100 stats across the board makes Mew one of the bulkiest and strongest Pokemon in the metagame and paired with its Psychic typing, makes Fighting-types nearly useless. Mew also has access to several utility moves in U-Turn, Will-O-Wisp, and Stealth Rock, all of which can flip a match-up instantaneously. Paired with Mew's bulk and Roost these moves can be free to click in a lot of situations, meaning that the opponent will almost always be playing in the back versus it. Mew can also be an extremely effective cleaner thanks to its access to Nasty Plot and Roost, and even lure its common answers with a less conventional Bulk Up set. Despite these positives it is somewhat vulnerable to status conditions such as Toxic and Paralysis, but Mew is nevertheless able to beat most Pokemon in the meta 1v1 thanks to its bulk and sheer versatility. Mew is one of the most influential Pokemon in the tier thanks to its great stats, high bulk, and breaking potential and is being testing due to its subjective negative effect on the metagame.

There will be no suspect ladder. Instead, we'll be using the normal LGPE OU ladder which will remain open for the duration of the test. A message will pop up at the beginning of ladder games to indicate that the suspect is going on. (Tagging Marty to implement our Pull Request, thanks!) Mew will be legal for the entirety of this suspect test. Anyone who wishes to participate in this suspect test will use a newly-made alt with a suspect-specific tag to indicate that you are trying to achieve reqs. The requirements for this suspect test are the following:
  • All games must be played on the Pokemon Showdown! LGPE OU ladder on a new alt with the following format: "LGT1 (nickname)" For example, I might register the alt LGT1 Ezaphs to ladder with. Don't impersonate other people in your ladder alt to avoid confusion and do not insult other users in your ladder alt or you risk being barred from getting reqs.
  • To qualify for voting, your alt must either play a minimum of 40 games, and achieve a minimum GXE of 80, or play a minimum of 35 games, and achieve a minimum GXE of 82.
You have until Sunday, January 27th at 11:59 PM GMT -5 to meet voting requirements. Feel free to post your stance on Mew and get some good discussion going!

  1. No one liners nor uninformed posts;
  2. No inappropriate / meme posts that would be deemed off-topic.
  3. No discussion on other potential suspects;
  4. No discussion on the suspect process;
  5. You are required to make respectful posts;
Failing to follow these simple guidelines will result into your post being deleted without any prior warning and at the complete discretion of the tier leader.
 

Yoshi

And so the adventure begins.
is a Pre-Contributor
We will also be doing suspect tours as well! Here are the dates we have planned:
  • Sunday, January 13th (6pm GMT-5) (Won by Hayburner)
  • Friday, January 18th (6pm GMT-5)
  • Saturday, January 19th (6pm GMT-5)
  • Sunday, January 20th (2pm GMT-5)
The tours will be hosted in our PS! room which can be found by clicking here. Sign ups will begin 10 minutes before each tournament is supposed to start.
 

Rag

"aaaaaaaahhhh!"
Met the requirements on the account LGT1 eh

lpt1eh.png

Gengar-Mega @ Gengarite
Ability: Shadow Tag
Level: 50
Mild Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb

Gyarados-Mega @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Mold Breaker
Level: 50
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail

Melmetal
Ability: Iron Fist
Level: 50
Impish Nature
- Double Iron Bash
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Facade

Mew
Ability: Synchronize
Level: 50
Naive Nature
- Ice Beam
- Flamethrower
- U-turn
- Earthquake

Zapdos
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
Calm Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Reflect
- Roost
- U-turn

Rhydon
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail

I will vote against the banning of Mew. Metagame is perfectly playable with Mew in it, and that's good enough for me. I'm not interested in limiting an already limited meta further.
 

dahli

no one’s gonna take my soul away
is a Tiering Contributor
met reqs on LGT1 ageofaquaria (btw are those reqs kinda hard to obtain or is it just me and my 0 skill to play this game lmao?)

letsgomewsus.png


However, I thought I was going to vote pro-ban Mew because it looked broken on paper but after nearly 80 battles I changed my mind and I don't think Mew is that broken or unhealthy for an already very limited metagame. The lack of items really play a role on this imo and in a meta where Megazam and Gengar are on nearly every team I don't think Mew has a toxic presence, and it has many other checks (less reliable but still checks) like Alola Muk. I will be voting no ban.
 
Bonjour je suis un joueur Français et voici Notre avis à ma communautés et moi :

Mew is manageable Yes, he is strong yes, too strong .... yes too, but abused? no ! The current problem is that in reality, many pokémons are playable and interesting to go out in match But Mew and Melmetal Block all these pokémons who wait in the shade ... If mew and Melmetal come out of the Meta, we can build much more fun and unusual teams. The first thing we tell ourselves when we build a team is: "Can my team survive Melmetal? and what I have enough to remove more than 50 HP on an attack? " When you focus systematically on a single pkm, this can be the case in any other game, because the subject in question is too misclassified.
 

Theorymon

Beyond the event horizon
is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
I made the reqs tonight!

LGPE OU Mew Reqs.jpg


So currenty, I'm leaning towards thinking that Mew should stay. While offensive Mews may be threatening due to their unpredictability, they're pretty easy to revenge kill with Mega Gengar and to a lesser extent, Mega Alakazam, both pretty excellent Pokemon. Now normally, that may seem pretty flismy, but this format is so fast paced that honestly, I don't think Mew is that unique among sweepers being able to cause massive damage. I'll give it that compared to a lot of offensive Pokemon, it's much bulkier than say, Mega Alakazam, but otherwise I don't think its too much for the format at the moment.

Now to address the more reliable Mew, the usual Will-O-Wisp support shenigans. It's damn good, but in addition to having issues with the usual stuff Mew has, it's also extremely vulnerable to Toxic. That isn't particularly unique for most bulky mons, but it helps that a lot of Pokemon can easily fit Toxic into their movesets, especially ones that outspeed Mew such as Starmie or Alolan Dugtrio.

Now I think its pretty obvious here that Mew is top tier, and absoloutly a contender for the most dominant Pokemon in Let's Go alongside Melmetal. However, unlike its bigger, badder clone, Mewtwo (yes I've played with it in candyless before, I can tell amusing stories about that later), I don't think it particularly restricts a lot of what is available to viabily use in Let's Go OU. Something important to remember here is that much like ye olde RBY OU, we're dealing with a low number of Pokemon anyways. This is more of a hypothesis on my part, but when you have such a tiny amount of Pokemon, it makes the dominant, potentially not broken ones seem all that much more nasty. It makes me wonder how say, Snorlax in GSC would be reacted to today...

Anyways, sorry for the little rant. I'm curious to see opposing viewpoints! I'll also still be laddering on my regular account probably too in case I might change my mind for some reason! And also because I really need to practice for that tournament LOL
 

AmirAlexander

used Ally Switch
is a Top Artist
met reqs on LGT1 free mew mew

Schermata 2019-01-16 alle 03.30.36.png
I admit I didnt play much in this metagame but, i agree with what others have already said, i just want to add that I won half of my games by clicking scald with mew turn 1 vs opponents rhydon / aerodactyl / dugtrio. this is why i think that being able to scout the mew set, makes less problematic deal with it.
#free mew mew!
 
reqs.png

I just got reqs.

I posted on here a few weeks ago complaining about how Mew was stupid and should probably be banned. However, in all honesty after playing the meta some more and getting reqs, Mew really isn't that bad, and is quite manageable, so I'll be voting no ban. Yeah, it's among one of, if not THE best Pokemon in LG OU, but being the best in the meta doesn't necessarily equal being broken (look at Landorus-T in USUM OU), and there are plenty of checks to it, as well as viable strategies that can handle Mew while also dealing with other relevant threats in the metagame, so it's not like you need to run some gimmicky nonsense just to beat it.

One of Mew's biggest issues, that also affects a lot of Pokemon in the meta, is its vulnerability to all status conditions, especially Toxic which a lot of Pokemon carry these days. Switching into status moves from Pokemon that it's supposed to check, such as Sleep Powders from Venusaur, or the rare Hypnosis Poliwrath, can also cause a lot of frustration for the Mew user, same goes for Paralysis mons like T-wave Melmetal, (Mega) Gyarados, and Starmie.

Mew's also not that hard to switch into when it comes to offensive moves as its attacking stats aren't all that stellar, even when hitting super effectively. Ice Beam isn't even a guaranteed OHKO vs Dragonite without rocks, for example. Nasty Plot does help with this, though, but I feel that it's not the best set-up sweeper in the meta as many faster threats can revenge-kill it. Mega Beedrill gains nearly-free momentum for its team with its STAB SE U-turn, Mega Alakazam and (Mega) Gengar revenge with Shadow Ball, (Mega) Aero and Alolan Dugtrio can finish off weakened Mew or fish for Rock Slide hax, and Starmie can either get a fast Thunder Wave off, or revenge it with Hydro if it's in range.

Mew has solid defensive answers, as well. Non-Wisp Mew is hard-checked by Alolan Muk, and even if it is Wisp, it'll catch a Toxic if it stays in to use it. Facade Snorlax, Melmetal, and Mega Gyarados actually take advantage of Wisp Mew and gain a much stronger attack once they're Burned. Lastly, many Mew users don't run attacks that hurt Starmie for decent damage, such as Taunt + Wisp or Plot PsyThrower (Mgyara checks this set also), which makes it a good offensive switch in to those variants.
 
I may or may not get reqs on this, I have a busy schedule. I'll be doing a video on this shortly though.

I agree with most people when it comes to a non-ban on Mew, but it's really close in my opinion. It is extremely versatile in it's move options, but it's common sets lately are being dealt with; Nasty Plot is basically walled by Alolan-Muk, it's defensive sets can be Toxic'd and stalled out by many Pokemon, mainly Eevee-S and, once again, Alolan-Muk. That being said, it's the sets that people DON'T expect that really raise the concern of this Pokemon. It's been my opinion that Earthquake Mew is extremely dangerous, especially when paired with Mega Alakazam because it partially breaks Alolan-Muk, clearing the way for Zam to sweep. As also mentioned above, Scald and U-turn provide scary offensive pressure against Ground types as well as getting 30% burns. But can this Pokemon single handedly break the tier, by itself, with no support or better offensive options on a team?

No. No it cannot. The Bulk Up + EQ + Facade + Roost set can be burnt and then walled by Melmetal, or others, or be crippled by Paralysis or Toxic and dealt with by 'Zam and 'Gar (this seriously is its best anti-meta breaking set, y'all should try it). Roost + Nasty Plot, as mentioned above and on other posts, is mostly walled by Alolan Muk, but especially Mega Gyarados. And Defensive sets, while annoying, do not necessarily prevent Toxic from Pokemon such as Zapdos (which either outspeeds or speed ties), which then can proceed to 1v1 Mew.

In summation, Mew is very versatile and good for its teammates, potentially breaking OTHER Pokemon, but it in itself is not broken. If I choose to get reqs, I'll probably be voting NO BAN and again will be laughing as Mega Alakazam + Mega Gengar continues to bring Alolan Muk usage to ridiculous heights, with or without Mew (a problem for another day, I suppose).
 

Rag

"aaaaaaaahhhh!"
2019-01-19.png


Went ahead and got reqs on another alt. Wasn't planning on using it for the vote regardless so no lgt1 tag, was more for the sake of being thorough and confirming my stance on Mew (and I was bored).

And my opinion hasn't changed. In fact,now that I was using a finished team I'm feel more reassured that Mew isn't a problem in the meta now. Its versatility and unpredictability is its biggest strength but unless most sets are organically dealt with by its regular checks. In this meta, you are mostly conserving what you need to deal with the opposing mega in late game. This also means you'll generally have your own mega in late game, and Mew's loses to most of the common megas 1v1. It's worth adding that even if Mew was banned, these megas would still be used just because they check each other well; they aren't common to deal with Mew specifically.

I share most of the views posted by fellow no ban voters, so no need to repeat anything else. Mew is undeniably a good Pokémon, but calling it broken is a big reach.
 

Ryota Mitarai

Shrektimus Prime
is a Pre-Contributor
I think Mew is balanced and is a good addition to the meta. Threats like Dnite and Melmetal are hard to check offensively, which Mew can (soft)check with its NP + BoltBeamBlast (which I consider the best Mew set at this point). I think keeping the offensive nature of the meta is more beneficial than turning this into too bulky meta. Also, most Megas 1v1 it with no problems (see CM Mega Zam with Recover, Mega Gyara that is healthy enough, Mega Gengar, even Mega Bee, though it cannot switch) and it is quite valid that Megas are cores in most teambuilds, so Mew definitely isn't broken if it's perfectly handled by common and good cores.

Also, LGPE OU has only 153 mons, so I'd be happy to keep the number as high as possible, but that's not too relevant so w/e.
 

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