Metagame NP: NU Stage 1- Criminal (Drought Banned)

Sneasel is really strong. It’s main problem is switching in, but with parting-shot(Silvally), or the rare volt turn user you can get Sneasel in. Once Sneasel is in, it hits like a truck and has very few counters. There is not a single offensive check to Sneasel. The ones which people recommend are extremely shaky and will be 2hko'd on rocks if not outright so.
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Silvally-Water: 137-162 (41.3 - 48.9%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Low Kick (80 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Piloswine: 170-200 (42 - 49.5%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 8 HP / 0 Def Perrserker: 192-226 (67.8 - 79.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
As for balance, Garbodor can only switch in once:
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garbodor: 136-162 (37.3 - 44.5%) -- 2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
However, Balance does have things which can take on Sneasel, although balance is a poor archetype in NU right now.
Mawile and RestTalk Bulky Silvally water can take on Sneasel, and for stall which is unviable Pyukumuku can as well. Remember not to forget that the inner focus buff means Sneasel doe not care for intimidate users that previously could check it such as Qwilfish and Hitmontop. Sneasel's silly fast speed tier means only choice scarf users outspeed it, Jolteon and Ninjask are terrible in NU and Ninjask can be killed by ice shard. Sneasel's lack of pursuit this gen does relieve frail pokemon of that pressure but also allows Sneasel users to have low kick in their moveset which decimates many so-called Sneasel checks. Overall I don't feel Sneasel is very healthy for the tier, if Sneasel was the only offensive mon of this xalibre it might have a chance of staying, but in tandem with other broken Pokemon it becomes too overwhelming to build around.

Haunter I spoke of a bit earlier, and realized that eviolite pokemon are useless against any set with trick. This leaves Haunter with only one offensive check, Skuntank, and a few balance/stall counters such as Stunfisk G, Specially Defensive Pyukumuku (How viable is this set?), Flareon, and Specially Defensive RestTalk Silvally-Poison (Once again, how viable is this set?). Skuntank is shaky, previously it was infamous as a Haunter check due to pursuit but now it can only switch in once.
252 SpA Life Orb Haunter Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Skuntank: 155-183 (44.6 - 52.7%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery
Haunter suffers from the same issues as Sneasel in its abysmal bulk, but has many more immunities and two 4x resistances. Normal, Fighting, Ground, Bug, and Poison all are possible switch ins for Haunter, particularly if the latter two are from defensive mons. For example, balance staple Garbodor:
0 Atk Garbodor Gunk Shot vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Haunter: 57-68 (24.6 - 29.4%) -- 100% chance to 4HKO
Haunter further restricts teambuilding, but it would be possible to build with just Sneasel and Haunter without the latter mon I'm about to mention. Teams would be constrained and repititive if built defensively but the last Pokemon, Toxicroak really takes it over the edge.

Now Toxicroak is underestimated with people not taking into full account the extent of its movepool. One of the most commonly said checks for both nasty plot and swords dance sets is Garbodor, however there is coverage which Toxicroak has to deal with even Garbodor.
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Toxicroak Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garbodor: 400-473 (109.8 - 129.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Yes, that's right, even Garbodor is completely one shot by SD Toxicroak if they simply choose not to use sucker punch. Of course sucker punch is useful for killing everything non scarfed that outspeeds Toxicroak except Klinklang, Dubwool and Sneasel. However, if Garbodor which is very commonly used is too obnoxious for the Toxicroak user and they'll use Croak as a wallbreaker more than as sweeper they can simply choose to invalidate Garbodor. If they want to make Toxicroak harder to revenge kill and still beat Garbodor they can still be a potent wallbreaker by giving up on swords dance and becoming an All out Attacker with Gunk Shot, Drain Punch, Earthquake, and Sucker Punch. Sucker punch is also significant in that it doesn't let Haunter become a poor man's check to Toxicroak that gets 2hkod on stealth rock by LO gunk shot. Even Physically defensive Pyukumku struggles to check Toxicroak if they have any chip, or get poisoned by the significant 30% chance to poison of Gunk shot. Unlike the other two Pokemon before, Toxicroak has enough bulk to make better use of its resistances, even though its bulk isn't that great it isn't the wet paper bad defenses of the other two not fully evolved Pokemon. Toxicroak on top of that has dry skin meaning it can switch into water type moves and heal, and alongside drain punch can give itself more longevity than Haunter or Sneasel could ever imagine. Defensive Cofragigus is the best check for Physical Toxicroak sets but gets blown apart by the nasty plot sets.

There are zero counters for Toxicroak and based on that I think Toxicroak must be banned. It even shows in the previous council vote that Toxicroak was one vote away from being banned, there were people who could see just how unhealthy Toxicroak is for the tier. As for the previous two, I believe Sneasel is more broken than Haunter, Haunter's trick makes it a one trick pony whereas Sneasel can knock off opponents items repeatedly without losing the boon of its own item, while Sneasel has a much higher speed tier making it significantly tougher to revenge kill, alongside its priority. Haunter gradually kills itself with life orb whereas as long as you keep rocks away Sneasel can use its moves over and over again. Specs Haunter is easier to work around than band Sneasel, once again goes back to the speed tiers. Haunter has an offensive check whereas Sneasel has none. To conclude, all three of these Pokemon should be suspected individually, with Toxicroak first. If we have a deluge of checks and counters drop into the tier we can bring them back but right now they make defensive teambuilding impossible.
 
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Quick thoughts

Rises:

Rhydon was one of our premier rockers, so losing it will definitely shake up the meta in some ways. We have a few other options for Rockers but none as solid a glue as Rhydon.

Drops:

Alcremie has pretty good bulk and reliable recovery and Calm Mind could be a neat combo. Sadly doesn't get Moonblast but hey what can you really do?

Drifblim's primary use now is as a Defogger with Strength Sap which as we all know is an annoying move. Sadly more 'classic' sets like Hex or AcroBlim are kinda outclassed now which a shame. Regardless as a Defogger it serves its role decently well, though its bulk is pretty damn deceptive.

Indeedee sounds kinda busted not gonna lie. Not many switch-ins and quite powerful, with a Ghost immunity which is quite good seeing how good Haunter is. Also worth noting is Healing Wish access which is quite something to say the least. 95 Base Special Attack ain't that great IMO which may affect its 'brokenness' but I'm still holding onto my gut feeling on this one.

Mr. Rime is another hazard remover, trading its pre-evos Speed for better bulk and recovery. Could have uses on some teams but IMO I'd probably still just use Galarian Mime. Also its notable since its one of the few Galar mons that get Toxic because of Mime Jr. Not really worth saying but I just wanted to put that out there.

Quagsire means one thing and one thing alone: Stall. For teams lacking a Grass-type it can be decently annoying but regardless its a solid defensive mon.

slowpoke is lol
 
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Zneon

formerly f is for frens
Okay so as we all know, the uasge stats have been given out, so I want to discuss the potential of these new mons that have dropped, and aditionally dicuss potential winners and losers from this tier shift, let's a go!

Rises


Losing Rhydon is going to shake the tier quite a bit, it was our premier rocker and we lost something that can now check Toxicroak and Unfezant more reliably, I'll be talking about those very good, especially Toxicroak. Now we will probably now resort to Sandaconda, which is still a great rocker I feel that has really valuable role compression but, I don't think has the same effectiveness as Rhydon had.

Drops


Alcremie looks ok I guess? I mean to be honest I wouldn't consider the fairy typing that good honestly because of the fact that Poison-types have gotten better with Rhydon's ban. Toxicroak and Gardobor are already huge metagame presences so I don't know how Alcremie is going to hold up, I feel that it could be used as a since late-game CM sweeper I suppose with Dazzling Gleam, Psychic and Recover but who knows, let's see how this effects the tier.



Indeedee-F could actually be incredibly threatening here, the lower power level along with good offensive stats and Psychic Surge, this mons switch ins would be lacking, I doubt this mon is going to have good switch-ins, not to mention the defensive utility of stopping priority thanks to Psychic Surge, and just the power that would come from its Specs Psychic, I doubt this Pokemon wouldn't make at least a bit of an impact in NU.



Drifblim looks like our premier Defogger, which is absolutely amazing for this tier considering that it revolves so much around hazards due to Garbo just completely dominating the hazard game, but Drifblim's typing and decent bulk might make a splash in the tier, especially considering the fact that there is a complete lack of Defoggers, the only other one being Unfezant which isn't good to begin with, so I doubt this drop won't impact the tier.



Mr. Rime looks pretty solid on paper, it being a Psychic type in a tier littered with great Poison-types is huge, and access to Rapid Spin makes it another great hazard remover. It also does look threatening with Rapid Spin + NP shenanigans but those will be pretty niche, needless to say I think Mr. Rime will be pretty good.


Derp fish nice, Quagsire looks pretty nice. It completely and utterly walls Togedamaru which is huge in a tier where it completely dominates the tier with its Scarf set, Unaware doesn't look too bad especially for something like NP Toxicroak. But since it's purely a defensive mon it only works on stall, which, tbf, doesn't exist atm.


gotta save the best for last, bro slowpoke be looking like a weapon of mass destruction, this mon is so dangerous that all it needs to do is breath, and arceus will be shivering and shooketh down to its core, all it needs to do is glare to all of these foolish mortals, and they will faint at the sheer insanity of this pipsqueak, this thing needs to be slapped into the shadow realm before it completely annihilates everything in this tier by its overflowing testosterone.

Okay with that out of the way, winners and losers

Winners



Sandaconda is obviously an absolutely big winner from this tier shift. This Pokemon has incredible role compression with status and rocks, which are both pretty great. It can also be a somewhat niche set-up sweeper due to its access to coil, and I feel that it will be the go-to rocker that will fill our Rhydon empty hearts.



I'm going to be honest, I feel this going to be unhealthy going forward. Toxicroak is incredibly versatile with SD + 3 attacks, NP + 3 attacks and Scarf being every good sets and each having different counters. Point is, Toxicroak has a lot of different options to work with, and it run different things for different mons, such as EQ For Garbo, Knock Off for just crippling stuff and being generally low risk, and Sucker Punch for bypassing Haunter, this is just in the SD set, that's completely insane. I feel Toxicroak will be a problem going down the line, especially with a great check in Rhydon being gone, its place in NU should be talked about soon I feel.


With Rhydon being gone, this could be the biggest winner of them all, Unfezant really doesn't have any good switch ins now except for Togedemaru, Band Brave Bird is nearly unwallable since its able to 2HKO the vast majority of the tier, not to mention the fact that Unfezant is one of the best Scarfers, losing Rhydon makes its Scarf set go even more hard with Brave Bird late game. Overall I feel this will be a great Pokemon and I feel have a much bigger impact on the tier.
Losers



This is probably the biggest loser by far. Garbodor is probably still going to be excellent just not as incredibly great as it was pre tier shift, the drops look incredibly terrible for it, especially Drifblim and Mr. Rime, both are able to each wall or just kill it with ease, means that there are much less opportunities for Garbo to set up Spikes, which is by far its best attribute. I don't know how far this thing is going to fall, but I don't think it will be as good as it was before.

These tier shifts are pretty nice, and I'm excited to see how these tier shifts move the metagame forward!
 
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quziel

The Scientist is Gigalith
is a Live Chat Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Simulator Driver
Yo, so gonna post some thoughts on the current meta as I've experienced it. Frankly, its very difficult to consistently build anything but HO because of not only the sheer strength of our breakers, but their speed. Between Sneasel, Toxicroak, Haunter, and recently Indeedee, you're sorta forced into a position where IMO the only way to really deal with them is to outrun them, or run very passive answers, which opens up your team to the tier's slower breakers, ergo sorta a loss if they bring like Drampa. As an aside there's a lot of really dumb slower stuff such as Drampa, Abomasnow, Dubwool (more matchup baiting), Cofagrigus (again matchup baiting) that can def just force a win if you forgot your answers or let them in to often.

:haunter: I've spoken about this fairly often, but like, realistically the only way you're dealing with Haunter is either to run specific checks such as Stunfisk-Galar, avoid ever letting it in (its literally the only reason I've been running Payback on Garb despite Toxic providing so much more utility), or predict like a madman to bring in your Dark type on a Shadow Ball / Togedemaru on a Sludge Bomb (note sub sets can potentially make this kinda play moot). A mon sitting at a 95 speed tier, aka quite fast for the meta, really should have more answers than a couple incredibly passive mons, and well, if your team lets it in too often and isn't carrying one of these super specific passive answers, you lose. Honestly, its main drawback is the fact that Sneasel can come in vs it after it gets a KO and well, any time you let Sneasel in is a time when you're losing ground.

:sneasel: This is really my biggest issue. Sneasel hits really damn hard thanks to CB Knock, can utterly cripple a lot of mons, again due to CB Knock, and again, doesn't really have many reliable answers barring literally Defensive Silvally-Water, sorta Physdef Wishiwashi (but not really), and sorta Mawile. This is a very similar thing to the above except its even faster, outrunning literally everything relevant outside of scarfers, Jolteon, and Ninjask, and the latter two are incredibly vulnerable to its Ice Shard. I'd say it'd be more managable if we had something that could heavily abuse it locking into Knock, but again, Silvally-Water and Silvally-Dark are the closest to that, and Silvally ain't generally threatening game off of a single badly timed Knock Off lock in. I've been primarily talking about the CB set, but the HDB set is still very potent, and while it def lacks the ability to get easy KOs, it has way more chances to come in thanks to being rocks immune.

:Toxicroak: This mon is imo the most managable of the above three, but like, lets be honest, you gotta dedicate a lot of team-building real estate to prepping for this mon, or again, you can run HO and outspeed it. Like, 4 attacks LO physical basically doesn't have answers in the tier beyond "switch in cofag, take 40% from knock, get worn down", "switch in drifblim, get knocked, die to 2 knocks after rocks the next time its in" or "Switch in Garb, hope it ain't carrying EQ". Luckily for us Croak's speed tier is at 85, which is far worse than the 95 or 115 above, but like, it also gets way more switchin chances than the above two thanks to honestly great typing and a wonderful Water immunity. And ye, the set diversity this mon has between SD, 4 attacks Physical, NP, and 4 attacks Special is a large part as to why ya gotta prep so hard for it. This mon definitely got way worse due to the tier shifts, notably with its Physical set sorta being forced to drop Sucker for Knock thanks to Drifblim and Indeedee-F, but like, I feel its still a potentially oppressive mon, though I'm unsure if that's due to the influence of the above two.

:Indeedee: This mon is new, and really does a great job at preying on the weird pseudo-frail BO builds that are in the tier atm due to the sheer strength of its Psychic (aka you're either Stunfisk-G, Ferrothorn, Type:Null, or you're immune to this if you wanna avoid a 2HKO), and like, I'm unsure if its feeling overbearing due to the influence of the above mons, but it def feels like it could become a problem in the future. I don't know if I want immediate action taken here, but like, its def a potentially spooky mon, and the playstyles it enables are just one more forme of HO for the tier. Set diversity is also a major benefit of this mon as it has viable Scarf, Specs, and LO 3 attacks sets, and all require different answers, though luckily you can scout them out pretty quick.

Those are the 4 mons that I really think are choking up building in the tier the most, and I'd like opinions on whether or not I'm just being a bit crazy. (Also screw Togedemaru and its insane luck in the late game)
 
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Tier Shifts happened and everyone is freaking out. (not really)
I looked at our new toys to play with and tried my best to sum up all the possible viable sets (since we don't know what the meta will shift into) to make it easier for all of you to give your thoughts on the Tier Shift and the specific mons we got.

To start of I looked at the, imo, most fearsome and powerful of the five (six if you count Slowpoke-Galar), Indeedee-F:Indeedee-F:
:Indeedee-F::Choice Scarf:
Indeedee-F (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Mystical Fire
- Dazzling Gleam
- Healing Wish / Hyper Voice / Trick
Choice Scarf is probably the best use for Indeedee-F. With a base speed of 85 it outspeeds the whole unscarfed/unboosted meta and speedties with Choice Scarf-Sawk and due to Psyschic Surge disabling priority it can be tough to revenge-kill. Psychic / Psyshock boosted from Psychic Surge hits incredibly hard if you aren't immune or resist it. The coverage in Dazzling Gleam + Mystical Fire is almost perfect and helps with Steel-types like Stunfisk-Galar, Togedemaru, Klinklang and Ferroseed (I think that is what quziel meant ;) ) and Dark-types like Sneasel, Malamar, Skuntank, Silvally-Dark and Liepard. Healing Wish + Choice Scarf is insanely good for one-time healing your weakened win con or wallbreaker or what ever you want and is especially helpful for offensive builds. Trick is like Knock Off almost free to click except on the Silvally-formes holding a type-memory. Hyper Voice's only purpose is to have a STAB that you can lock in more freely, if your opponent has a Dark-type, but keep in mind that this doesn't cover Steel-types.
:Indeedee-F::Choice Specs:
Indeedee-F @ Choice Specs
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire
- Trick / Hyper Voice
The moves don't really change that much for the Choice Specs-Set. I removed Healing Wish since 85 base speed isn't that ultra fast so it would be more difficult to actually get the Healing Wish off than it would help and it doesn't fit the purpose of this set. The purpose of this set is clear; it's a wallbreaker. Your last slot is almost every time a filler since the only thing you really wanna click is Psychic / Psyshock or Coverage. I think it's ok running Modest to increase your damage output, just keep in mind that you now speedtie with Jolly Malamar. Don't really have to add much to this set.
:Indeedee-F::Life Orb:
Indeedee-F (F) @ Life Orb / Colbur Berry / Terrain Extender
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire
You trade speed and immediate power for the ability to switch up moves while battling. I personally don't see the room for other moves than these three. Life Orb would be your main item of choice to further boost your power while also having the ability to switch your moves depending on what's in front of you. Colbur Berry seems like an odd choice but I think it can have it's use against Scarfers like Sawk that try to revenge you (I can't look up calcs atm, I hope you life this since your physical defense is a bit weak). Elias PSY mentioned Terrain Extender, so you don't have to take chip damage that would hinder your set up opportunities.
:Indeedee-F::Light Clay:
Indeedee-F (F) @ Light Clay / Terrain Extender
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Healing Wish
- Psychic / Psyshock
Hyper Offense is really good atm and Indeedee-F makes a great Screen-setter for those builds. What Indeedee has over other Screeners is Psychic Surge. With Terrain Extender Psychic Surge lasts eight turns instead of five. This helps speed boosting or natural fast set-up sweepers like Silvally-forms, Swords Dance-Sneasel and Klinkklang and makes them harder to be revenge killed. Healing Wish is Indeedee-F's only way to "gain" momentum, but it can be useful on offensive teams. Light Clay is obviously preferred when you want more turns of screens instead of Psychic Surge.

The next candidate is the purple balloon Drifblim:Drifblim:
:Drifblim:

Drifblim @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe / EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Strength Sap
- Shadow Ball
- Defog
- Thunderbolt / Toxic / Will-O-Wisp / Knock Off / Magic Coat / Thunder Wave
Im actually pretty hyped about this one. Drifblim has such a big utility movepool, it's not even funny. Defog + Shadow Ball + Strength Sap are must-haves imo. The last move varies on your team and preferences. Knock Off is great utility in general while Thunder Bolt allows you to hit Unfezant. Strength Sap is an annoying move and helps to keep Drifblim healthy, since it's lacking roost, while also lowering the opponents physical attack. The EV spread an be more offensive or defensive depending on what your team needs.
:Drifblim::Flame Orb:
Drifblim @ Flame Orb
Ability: Flare Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick
- Strength Sap
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
This one is more of a meme set, making use of Drifblim's signatur ability Flare Boost. Flare Boost gives you a virtual Choice Specs. Trick is really nice to cripple walls or physical sweepers / breakers. Shadow Ball + Thunderbolt is your coverage to go, since Drifblim really lacks some good moves. Strength Sap purpose is again to keep yourself while lowering the opponents attack.
:Drifblim::Weakness Policy:
Drifblim @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 72 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 180 Spe or EVs: 160 HP / 252 SpA / 96 Spe
Modest or Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Strength Sap
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
With access to Calm Mind and Strength Sap + pretty weird bulk, Drifblim can perform an okay Weakness Policy-set. The combination of Calm Mind to increase your own SpD and Strength Sap to lower your opponents Atk is really annoying if you don't have status on your team. The big hold back to all the Drifblim's that are some sort of set-up is there weakness to Sucker Punch AND Ice Shard, making them really vulnerable to common offensive threats like Sneasel, Toxicroak and Suntank. The speed evs allow you to outseed Choice Scarf-Togedemaru after Unburden kicks in. Overall I think it's outclassed by Orbeetle as a Weakness Policy-sweeper.
:Drifblim::Leftovers:
Drifblim @ Leftovers
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe / EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Disable
- Hex / Shadow Ball
- Strength Sap / Will-O-Wisp
SubDisable is one of my favorite strategies to be an asshole. It functions like all the other SubDisabler like Haunter or Gourgeist with the only benefit in having reliable recovery in Strength Sap. Hex can be used with Will-O-Wisp (giving up Strength Sap or Toxic Spike-support from your team. Shadow Ball deals overall consistent damage. It's the slowest of the SubDisabler with most notably Stunktank to be faster than you. Strength Sap also allows you to infinite wall Dubwool.
:Drifblim::Power Herb:
Drifblim @ Power Herb
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Acrobatics
- Phantom Force
- Explosion / Fly
- Knock Off
It's only getting more meme when you try to make Drifblim-sets that aren't Defog. This set is purely outclassed by Ninjask but I wanted to include it anyway. Simple idea; get your Unburden-boost by using Power Herb in combination with Phantom Force or Fly to sweep with boosted Acrobatics. This set can be hard to pull of and it will be even harder to outright sweep, but with our premier Flying-resist this shouldn't be to hard lol.

Next up I looked at our new fairy Alcremie:Alcremie:
:Alcremie::Leftovers:
Alcremie (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Acid Armor
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Dazzling Gleam
We finally got a good offensive Fairy-type. And the first set Im offering is … this. What looks like a baby Reuniclus really is … exactly that. With Calm Mind boosting your SpA and SpD and Acid Amor boosting your Def you can get really annoying to deal with. Recover gives reliable Recovery an Dazzling Gleam is your STAB of choice (as if you have one). Just watch out for those strong Poison- and Dark-types. Alcremie in general doesn't like the rise from Rhydon since that opens up Poison-types like Toxicroak or Silvally-Poison.
:Alcremie::Life Orb:
Alcremie (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Recover / Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire / Psychic
This is probably the best set that Alcremie can run. Calm Mind boosts your offensive power and Recovery ensures some longevity to set-up more often. Dazzling Gleam is your best STAB and Mystical Fire + Psychic allows you to hit Steel-types and Poison-types, which would resist your Fairy-move. Life Orb boosts all your attacks so you have an easier time to wallbreak. Pretty self explanatory overall.

He really be vibin'; Mr. Rime:Mr. Rime:
:Mr. Rime:

Mr. Rime @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Screen Cleaner
EVs: 248 HP / 124 SpD / 136 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rapid Spin
- Slack Off / Nasty Plot
- Freeze-Dry
- Psychic / Psyshock / Focus Blast / Toxic
Mr. Rime loves the rise of Rhydon but will hate the rise in usage of Dark- and Steel-types due to the impact Indeedee-F will have. It's overall a pretty mediocre Rapid Spinner. It traded more bulk and Recovery for some speed. I made this set faster than Adamant Golurk. If you want to run Rapid Spin + Nasty Plot I'd recommend running 252 Spe with a Timid Nature to be as fast as possible. Freeze-Dry is an amazing move that hits water-types too. I also want to mention that it also got Healing Wish but let's not take this to far. Focus Blast allows to hit Steel- and Dark-types for super effective damage. Like Melons-N-Soda mentioned it also gets Toxic, so yeah, that's that.

And last but not least Quagsire:Quagsire:
:Quagsire::Leftovers:
Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Scald
- Toxic
- Recover
Surprised to see this drop. Really nothing special, like the most standard and predictable set / mon we have in the tier. Unaware lets you wall set-up threats like Toxicroak, Sneasel, Drednaw, Crustle, Togedemaru and so on. With Toxic + Recover to stall on all these threats weaken them to get killed by Earthquake or Scald. I think it has a nice place here. The only problem is that Quagsire is mainly passive and is a free Sub against SubDisable Haunter (and Drifblim lol) and it's special side is almost paper thin making it vulnerable for special breakers like Drampa, which switches in almost for free, which then can run havoc. We will see how this will play out.

Im sure this list isn't completed yet and you are encouraged to add your sets to this discussion. If I made some unforgivable mistakes (no grammar!) please let me know, since Im also still learning.

With all that been said, thanks for reading. Stay healthy.
 
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:Indeedee-F::Life Orb:
Indeedee-F (F) @ Life Orb / Colbur Berry
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire
Calm Mind - Description You trade speed and immediate power for the ability to switch up moves while battling. I personally don't see the room for other moves than these three. Life Orb would be your main item of choice to further boost your power while also having the ability to switch your moves depending on what's in front of you. Colbur Berry seems like an odd choice but I think it can have it's use against Scarfers like Sawk that try to revenge you (I can't look up calcs atm, I hope you life this since your physical defense is a bit weak)
I'd rather use terrain extender>lo to benefit for longer psychic terrain.
At +1 you hit as hard as specs and lo recoil is really annoying when you are supposed to take some hits to setup
 

poh

Rushing Back
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
With NUPL coming closer and a last voting round from the council before the start of the tour I'd like to share my thoughts on some problematic elements in the current meta.




Writing about this mon feels kinda memey at this point ever since we tried to ban it twice last gen. I've been enjoying the meta so far but I think, like a lot of other people in the community, it's time to get rid of some stuff. I think Sneasel is too much for our tier as it has way too many positives going for it and far less negatives. Clicking CB Knock has never been so free, so spammable, so low risk/high reward, so.... you get it. All of its checks either don't have recovery or get chipped hard. Not to mention it ignores Intimidate now so something like a Mawile is less effective against it. Its speed tier is also very high for current gen standards meaning that when it comes in a free Knock is inevitable. Even though Sneasel was an issue last gen, we had tools to handle its Knock Off spam which we lack now, mainly Z-Moves and I guess Megas. Another reason why I think Sneasel is overbearing is this years powercreep or rather the opposite of that. Yes, Sneasel lost Pursuit, which could be a reason why it got worse, but since this gen NU got way weaker in general, Sneasel just thrives. A last reason why Sneasel is hard to deal with can be the fact it can bluff a choiced set with HDB or Eviolite but i think the CB is the most difficult one to handle. Some negatives for it are ofc frailty and rocks weakness but the main one is obviously it losing Pursuit. It losing Pursuit means you can't no longer run it as your sole Ghost check which ties in with the next mon i wanna talk about.



Haunter has hit its peak performance. It's relatively fast, strong dual stabs and not needing to worry about getting trapped anymore. Again, like Sneasel, its positives far outweigh its negatives. I'll talk about the sub set first as I think it's the most difficult one to deal with. Subdisable Haunter is almost unfair to play against lmao. Your Haunter check needs to have 2 moves to hit; if you only have 1 you get disabled and now you have a Haunter chilling behind a sub ready to dish out attacks. Like quziel mentioned in his post "predict like a madman to bring in your Dark type on a Shadow Ball / Togedemaru on a Sludge Bomb (note sub sets can potentially make this kinda play moot)". Beating Sub Haunter involves prediction but not like 50/50, more like 35/65. Letting in Haunter isn't as easy as other mons but due to its good typing and Levitate you can get it in vs a bunch of mons, force them out, get the sub up and you're good to go. Not to mention it quadresists U-Turn so good luck trying to break its sub that way. Choice Scarf is a waste on it I think but Specs is also quite threatning. We have little Ghost switchins so everything gets blown back or chipped basically.


That's about it really. Personally I think Croak is fine, yes it has a lot of sets but as of right now I think it isn't as problematic as the 2 NFEs i just discussed.

Shifts! Losing Rhydon kinda sucks but that's probably one of the least worries right now. The ones I like the most are Drifbim and Indeedee. Alcremie is kinda weird tbh, quag is quag and mr. rime is also weird probably lmao. The ones that rose from PU are also interesting. I've used Ninjask a fair bit on the ladder and it's actually decent. SD + Protect is rly cool cause it can act as a scarfer or as a breaker and adamant acro/uturns hurt, it's also a chipping machine early game. Clef is rly underused I think, can provide teams a lot of support and Moonblast stays broken so :pimp:
NU can only get better from this point onward, after the needed bans, suspects and added drops from DLCs etc.
 
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Eternally

is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis the defending NU Circuit Champion
NU Leader
Hello all, here are the results of the final round of beta council votes! As always, please note that anything banned during these stages is liable to be retested in the future via public suspect testing.



Therefore, through this round of voting: Sneasel and Haunter have been banned from NU effective immediately! Tagging The Immortal so this can be implemented -- thank you very much!


Sneasel was one of NU's best offensive weapons in the early stages. With a superb speed tier and a nearly unchecked dual STAB combination, Sneasel's physical attacking prowess was deemed too much for the young metagame. While some bulkier Water types were able to temporarily withstand its assault, there were very limited counter play options defensively while revenge killing was limited to a small handful of choice scarf users due to Sneasel's high speed tier. In addition, Sneasel synergized very well with pivots such as Clefairy with Teleport, allowing it to get in safely to generate these opportunities and wallbreak with ease.


Haunter has been controversial from day 1 of SS NU; players were quick to realise that the lack of Pursuit in generation 8 opened up a big window for Ghost types like Haunter to finally be top tier threats in NU. From there, Haunter has been an absolute menace to deal with due to strong special attacks. Pokemon like Stunfisk-Galar, Silvally-Dark, or Skuntank can temporarily handle it, but there was not much that was able to counter it in the long haul whereas the pace of the metagame and various pivots being common partners with Haunter allowed for it to get in safely numerous times most games. Due to the overall lack of counter play to Haunter, the NU Council has voted for it to be banned.
 

Punchshroom

FISHIOUS REND MEGA SHARPEDO
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributor
In light of the recent bans, I would like to bring up some interesting threats.


DarkVally is likely going to be the premier offensive Dark-type in the tier, as it doesn't pick up very far from where Sneasel left off. It has very powerful Dark-type STAB in Multi-Attack which is strong enough to 3HKO something like max HP Sandaconda for instance, and it has complementary coverage options in Psychic Fangs, U-turn, and even Iron Head if you want to :blobshrug:, which smack just about everything that wants to resist its Multi-Attack. Oh, and let's not forget DarkVally has the bulk to be able to make use of Swords Dance as well, which only bolsters its offensive threat level further. All this while still occupying one of the best Speed tiers in NU on top of being a solid Indeedee-F check. DarkVally is definitely going to be a rising powerhouse to watch out for. Did I mention this gets Flame Charge too?


With the loss of Sneasel as a check and Haunter as competition, Froslass now has the potential to exert a bit more of its offensive prowess, especially with its Speed tier looking more appealing than ever before. Life Orb-boosted STAB Ice Beam and Shadow Ball are resisted by few in the meta, and Froslass has plenty of disruptive tools such as Spikes, Taunt, Will-O-Wisp, and Destiny Bond to soften up/circumvent foes bulky enough to withstand its assaults. Even WispHex or TrickSpecs could be of some use.


Previously chokeholded by Haunter and Sneasel's domineering Speed tiers, now non-Scarf Mr. Mime has more room to breathe and can better utilize its holepunching capabilities. It has perfect neutral coverage between its STABs & Mystical Fire, while access to Nasty Plot can make pivoting against it very risky. Mime even has the honor of being the best offensive check to Drampa in the tier due to Soundproof and Fairy typing stuffing out Drampa's STABs, making Drampa hesitant on clicking its most dangerous attacks.
 

DarkVally is likely going to be the premier offensive Dark-type in the tier, as it doesn't pick up very far from where Sneasel left off. It has very powerful Dark-type STAB in Multi-Attack which is strong enough to 3HKO something like max HP Sandaconda for instance, and it has complementary coverage options in Psychic Fangs, U-turn, and even Iron Head if you want to :blobshrug:, which smack just about everything that wants to resist its Multi-Attack. Oh, and let's not forget DarkVally has the bulk to be able to make use of Swords Dance as well, which only bolsters its offensive threat level further. All this while still occupying one of the best Speed tiers in NU on top of being a solid Indeedee-F check. DarkVally is definitely going to be a rising powerhouse to watch out for. Did I mention this gets Flame Charge too?
Pls Nu take Darkvally for ZU... I like the bans, and this is becoming a good meta as least for me.
I was using this team for the Core Challenge: Psyquic-Fighting-Steel core and is working nicely
https://pokepast.es/68945c0d7c42e8aa
Rotom-fan destroy stall if not have lanturn and healing wish support is nasty for him.
 
Finally, the tier is defensively playable now. There are still plenty of offensive threats but they feel actually diverse meaning you can actually build teams around them. Rather than seeing Haunter and thinking, gotta have a specially defensive poison. Then Toxicroak and well, gotta have a physically defensive poison. Then seeing Sneasel and you already used up your Silvally slot on Silvally Poison and etc etc. I haven’t checked out Indeedee yet but it should be easier to counter so long as it doesn’t have fire coverage. Scratch that, just looked at it, oh well, we have Musharna down here I think so we should be fine. I still dislike Croak but I’ll take it as I thought at least two of the three unholy trio should be banned. NU is looking a whole lot better after those two left.
Edit: Just saw Indeedee’s sp atk. It’ll be right at home down here, psychic/fairy/fire coverage just reminded me of UU gardevoir who is annoying.
 
I was wrong, after trying to build defensively. Defensive teams are terrible and nearly impossible to build, the best archetype is by far hyper offense. It is simply too hard to counter Nasty Plot Toxicroak, there are only two or perhaps three pokemon in this tier capable of doing so. Specially defensive Silvally poison, Specially defensive Pyukumuku, and sometimes Garbodor(maybe even specially defensive Garbodor but idk how viable that set is. You're always wondering whether it's SD or NP, and if you switch in the wrong counter you're done. You often have to run two counters for Toxicroak since counters to SD(Quagsire, Cofragigus, sometimes Drifblim) gets blown apart by Nasty Plot, and the few counters to NP are either destroyed by SD or All out Attacker. Well, so be it, just wanted to bring up that dilemma. One of the most slept on Pokemon in this tier is Rapidash Galar. It has an amazing speed stat and flawless coverage, it can run scarf, SD, agility, double dance, 3 attacks+Morning Sun and more. In particular double dance is slept on since it has only 1 reliable counter, being Bronzor who is terrible.

Rapidash-Galar (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Pastel Veil
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Play Rough
- High Horsepower
- Agility

This set is silly good at ripping apart teams, Rapidash's really fast speed tier often means that you can simply SD without any need for agility. Rapidash's typing threatens several defensive mons in the tier such as Appletun and Hitmontop, and even if there aren't defensive mons you can swords dance on pokemon that are threatened by revenge killing such as the plethora of poison types in the tier. I put Rapidash G on the same team as Scarf Mr.Mime this horse is so good to have.
Speaking of some other mons, Alcremia is a decent counter to Drampa if you need one.

Alcremie (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 156 SpD / 100 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire
- Aromatherapy
- Recover

This set allows Alcremia to outrun even timid Drampa, while having enough special bulk to tank the moves Drampa throws at it. Aromatherapy and Fairy/Fire coverage are also cool.
Throh and Sawk are slept on as well, I feel Sawk more-so. Throh destroys teams with guts while having a decent resttalk set which is hurt by the presence of drifblim and cofagrigus.

Throh (M) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Superpower
- Earthquake

Whereas Sawk can run scarf, band, or All out attacker.

Sawk (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Knock Off

Sawk (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Poison Jab
- Earthquake
- Knock Off

Overall these are some Pokemon I feel aren't used as much as they should be. Especially Rapidash-G.
 
X-scissor GIF by gecko428 | Gfycat

Guess I'll be the one to say it, but Toxicroak deserves a quickban. I could mention cofag too but most people seem to agree on that so I'll only talk on Toxicroak and why I've voted ban everytime. (very sad the council didn't agree with me :pirate:)

There's been numerous times that I've been able to sweep through weakened / unprepared teams while also losing to croak myself. Special NP set has no guaranteed switch ins even without a boost (I guess an average 86SpA goes a long way) then +2 shreds through balance/stall. It's then a case of sacking something then revenging with a faster fighting resist. There are some good options for revenge killing but they're rather limited like Scarf Indeedee-F, Rotom Fan, Rapidash, Scarf Toxicroak and fast Orbeetle...? lol which are the only relevant faster mons that OHKO from NU (silvally forms and Mr Mime G can be included too but they need to be kept healthy.)

It's a no-brainer to place on teams since it blends in perfectly while bringing a good amount of utility with important resists. This mon requires little support to function and has a number of sets to play some mind games. ( NP > SD > Scarf > AoA > other sets ) It only needs one turn to take advantage of something passive like Lanturn, Clefairy, choice locked mons and technically even Cofag or forcing out something fearing a super-effective attack for to sweep teams so players need to be careful. Overall, it just strains to the teambuilder too much and ends up being too hard to deal with offensively or defensively so it deserves the boot.
 
Hello everyone, im pretty much an outsider to the NU community but i still wanted to share what i think is the main problem of the tier.

1587070369127.png

In most shapes and forms, i think Silvally is pretty unhealthy for the tier and makes most battles a Silvally War. A lot of viable typings, which is always unknown until they reveal it, amazing movepool to deal with every possible check for every typing, amazing speed tie for the tier and a 120 bp stab with no drawback. I honestly dont even know how to deal with this issues, i think banning a bunch of them will make predicting it a bit easier, but even then i dont think that will solve the problem with this Pokemon.

Rigth now, every viable team has a Silvally. I decided to check and every team without a Silvally in NUPL lost, and there was only one matchup with no Silvally from both side. This Pokemon can do everything and its impossible to stop it from doing it. I think having a centralizing Pokemon is fine, but Silvally has too many tools at his disposal to be definied only "centralizing". I think the tier rigth know has many problems, but trying to deal with this first would help a lot.
 
Hello everyone, im pretty much an outsider to the NU community but i still wanted to share what i think is the main problem of the tier.

View attachment 237741
In most shapes and forms, i think Silvally is pretty unhealthy for the tier and makes most battles a Silvally War. A lot of viable typings, which is always unknown until they reveal it, amazing movepool to deal with every possible check for every typing, amazing speed tie for the tier and a 120 bp stab with no drawback. I honestly dont even know how to deal with this issues, i think banning a bunch of them will make predicting it a bit easier, but even then i dont think that will solve the problem with this Pokemon.

Rigth now, every viable team has a Silvally. I decided to check and every team without a Silvally in NUPL lost, and there was only one matchup with no Silvally from both side. This Pokemon can do everything and its impossible to stop it from doing it. I think having a centralizing Pokemon is fine, but Silvally has too many tools at his disposal to be definied only "centralizing". I think the tier rigth know has many problems, but trying to deal with this first would help a lot.
I feel you man. PU has been having a similar problem, as you can see with all the Silvallies being banned to PUBL. I'd like to say, from the behalf of the PU tier community, you're not alone.
 
Hello everyone, im pretty much an outsider to the NU community but i still wanted to share what i think is the main problem of the tier.

View attachment 237741
In most shapes and forms, i think Silvally is pretty unhealthy for the tier and makes most battles a Silvally War. A lot of viable typings, which is always unknown until they reveal it, amazing movepool to deal with every possible check for every typing, amazing speed tie for the tier and a 120 bp stab with no drawback. I honestly dont even know how to deal with this issues, i think banning a bunch of them will make predicting it a bit easier, but even then i dont think that will solve the problem with this Pokemon.

Rigth now, every viable team has a Silvally. I decided to check and every team without a Silvally in NUPL lost, and there was only one matchup with no Silvally from both side. This Pokemon can do everything and its impossible to stop it from doing it. I think having a centralizing Pokemon is fine, but Silvally has too many tools at his disposal to be definied only "centralizing". I think the tier rigth know has many problems, but trying to deal with this first would help a lot.
:silvally::silvally::silvally::silvally::silvally:

Silvally are without doubt very good, and their high usage in NUPL makes a ton of sense for how valuable they are to so many playstyles. To paint the whole picture, it’s worth noting that some of the best forms right now are because their typings like Dark and Fire are pretty lacking in the tier, or that they are some of the fastest and strongest for their typing like Dragon, Water, and Ground. That 95 base Speed with Haunter and Sneasel gone is probably the most centralizing as it allows vallys to outspeed Toxicroak, Indeedee-F, Sawk, and the Rotoms; all and more being high-usage and viable attackers. The vallys having this edge puts a ton of these aforementioned mons in check, and makes some typings like Poison, Water, and Grass have merit for faster defensive pivot sets. These sets have the bonus of being decent Knock Off switchins for bulky teams, but vallys usually stay to offensive sets for that sweeping potential. Other offensive qualities they may have is Flame Charge so that common Choice Scarf users like Indeedee-F and Toxicroak cannot revenge kill, fitting Grass Pledge as a 4th coverage move to break past Quagsire as a stallbreaker, or being mixed / full special to bait other physical walls while still being very effective. The most relevant forms have little to no problems with coverage, and even if they have to pick between attacks as a 4th move, the rest of the team usually compensates. Fire for example with its SD set can support Multi Attack with Rock Slide, Flame Charge, Dragon Claw, and Grass Pledge, and any of its checks, offensive or defensive, can easily be in hot water if it packs the right attack.

I just wanted to get everything out there about the vallys because they truly are an integral aspect of the meta, but I don’t think they’re broken. They totally are some of the more unpredictable and hard to build with them in mind, but all of them can be managed. Their biggest problem is how easy they are worn down from residual damage and status, making their sweeps usually short lived. Defensive teams also utilize Protect and other safe scouting measures for figuring out what the vally has, and can be prepared to work around unfavorable types or coverage. Very common phsycal tanks like Sandaconda, Piloswine, and Cofagrigerus all manage most forms and either 1v1 or have their own way to capitalize with Glare or hazards. Physical cores of like Eldegoss, Clefairy, and Quagsire are usually hard to break even with stallbreaking sets, and something like Garbordor usually can take vally down with it.

All in all, I don’t think there’s that much to deal when it comes to the vallys. None are sweeping or breaking teams as successfully or consistently of the other banned mons thus so far. I would say while their coverage is great and unpredictable at times, it still limits their potential, and even with the perfect match up (coverage wise) there are many ways to check them and wear them down.
 
since tier shifts yesterday i thought about possible sets for pkmn which stand out to me in my eyes and are possible strong utility-mons or sweepers/ cleaners.
these pkmn which stand out to me are the following:

:ss/dugtrio-alola:
Dugtrio-Alola @ Leftovers
Ability: Tangling Hair
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch / Toxic / Memento
- Stealth Rock

i think it can act as a stealth rock-setter in this tier with its amazing dual-type-combination and its fantastic speed-tier of 110 which means it is already faster than
the majority of the nu-tier and can play its role as a stealtch rock-setter perfectly.
earthquake and iron head are its stab options whereas the third slot is exchangeable based on the utility your team needs.

:ss/Rapidash:
Rapidash @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- High Horsepower
- Wild Charge
- Low Kick / Megahorn / Will-O-Wisp

rapidash is another mon with a fantastic speed-tier which sits above the majority of the nu-tier hence why it will be one of the fastest scarfers in this tier if you really search for a strong
pkmn with speed-control in your team and flare blitz alongside the coverage-options in high horsepower and wild charge makes it a deadly revengekiller with all around good
attacks. the last move can be either low kick, megahorn or will-o-wisp.

Rapidash @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- High Horsepower
- Wild Charge / Will-O-Wisp
- Swords Dance

another set of rapidash but this time as a physical breaker with life orb as the choosen item and swords dance + flare blitz and high horsepower and the third slot can be
reserved for either wild charge or will-o-wisp. wild charge gives it necessary coverage against the waters in the tier like arctovish and wishiwashi whereas will-o-wisp
can cripple opposing teams.

:ss/Flapple:
Flapple @ Life Orb
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Grav Apple
- Sucker Punch

flapple flapple yeah mh i think this will be the first sets which people might give a try. dragon dance dual-stab with sucker punch. flapple im a lil bit indifferent on because
it can help vs sandaconda 1 of the best mons in the tier but abomasnow seems like a big threat to it and i think a lot of mons in the nu-tier can give it a tough time, especially
abomasnow.

:ss/persian-alola:
Persian-Alola @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Parting Shot
- Taunt
- Foul Play

Persian-Alola @ Black Glasses
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dark Pulse
- Power Gem / Knock Off
- Nasty Plot

persian-alola i thought about 2 sets which can be useful in the tier: the first set is a support one with alot of utility which the rest of its teammates appreciate to have.
stab knock off and also foul play to punish set-up sweeper and parting short to give momentum alongside with taunt is a really cool option.
the second set is nasty plot with dark pulse, thunderbolt and either power gem or knock off, power gem can hit rotoms for better damage and knock off can remove
items in the early-game.

:ss/Linoone:
Linoone @ Figy Berry
Ability: Gluttony
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Throat Chop
- Stomping Tantrum / Seed Bomb

just pair this mon up with a freakin' veil user like abomasnow and you're good to go! we all know what it does.
 
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Dugtrio-Alola @ Leftovers
Just a little side note here (this is a discussion after all):
I'd recommend Focus Sash on Duggy. This is mainly because Duggy is so frail that you don't really need recovery. Also, I see Duggy more as a suicide-lead on HO because on balanced teams Sandaconda outclasses it. With that in mind, Thief is a solid option to run as a third move to at least steal the opposing item.

Rapidash @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- High Horsepower
- Wild Charge / Will-O-Wisp
- Swords Dance
This is also just a side note:
I feel like mentioning that little niche in Power Herb Solar Blade to bop Quagsire, while still having some sort of coverage against ground- and water-types. But I really don't see that to be anything more viable.

Again, this is just an addition to the post, not criticism.
 
I'll join the discussion about the new Pokemon:

:flapple:
Flapple @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Grav Apple
- Sucker Punch
- U-turn

CB Flapple is incredibly strong without needing a DD, and this instant power + good speed makes it super appealing to me.

Grav Apple always drops defense 1 stage, so if you can hit 2 Grav Apples you can break through almost anything neutral.
262 Speed lets you outrun a lot of the tier - almost all non-offensive Pokemon are outsped, letting you get two hits off, and many offensive ones will die to one hit without even needing to click Outrage.

252 Atk Choice Band Hustle Flapple Grav Apple vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Frost: 246-291 (102 - 120.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Hustle Flapple Grav Apple vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sawk: 331-391 (113.7 - 134.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Hustle Flapple Grav Apple vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Togedemaru: 190-224 (70.1 - 82.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Hustle Flapple Grav Apple vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Unfezant: 156-185 (51.8 - 61.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

After spamming Grav Apple to get chip early game, Flapple can clean defensive teams up with Outrage or get a kill every time it comes in with Grav Apple. Only Ferroseed and Mawile can switch into Flapple more than once; after one switch-in, most Pokemon are in range of 2 Grav Apples, which has no drawback besides its accuracy, meaning that it often wont even be forced to lock into Outrage.

It does have drawbacks, however:
- accuracy - misses 20% of the time
- quad-weak to Ice [notably, Pilo's ice Shard]
- slower than lots of common Pokemon, and, for DD set, still slower than all scarfers after 1 boost. Nearly all these scarfers run moves that do lots of damage to Flapple (Toxicroak Gunk Shot, Togedemaru U-Turn, Sawk CC (neutral, but does ~75-90)).

I think Flapple will become a huge offensive threat that either shifts the meta to a more offensive state or forces defensive teams to adopt increasingly passive, niche Pokemon just to deal with this threat [Mawile, Ferroseed, someone mentioned Eviolite Klang in the discord lol]. It is not a perfect Pokemon, but its extreme power will have a huge effect on this meta.



:linoone: pls ban linoone, BD ESpeed is just stupid LOL especially when this tier has very few steels and even the best physical wall and Ghost-type, Cofagrigus takes a ton from Throat Chop. Veil is stupid, and the only way to stop this thing's E-Speeds is to keep Cofagrigus fully healthy and not bring it in for the rest of the game just to deal with Linoone, bring a Ferroseed, or bring your own indeedee for psychic terrain. (Unaware Quag ignores its +6 but is hit y a 4x super-effective Seed Bomb. I guess u could run Unaware P-Def Clefairy but ... man that's ridiculous) <-- it doesn't get this ability s/o to Rabia for pointing that out.
Please get rid of Linoone for a playable, interesting, and non-cheese meta :-)



:rapidash: looks super interesting :D love having another fire type here. I'd run a set a little different from Katy's:

Rapidash @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
- Morning Sun / Swords Dance
- Low Kick / Swords Dance / Flame Charge / Toxic / Will-O-Wisp / Stomping Tantrum

Base 105 Speed, Base 100 attack. and its Fire typing give Rapidash a huge niche in this meta. its two strongest attacks, Flare Blitz and Wild Charge [for waters] give it very good coverage, missing out only on Dragon-types and other Fire-types [basically just Silvally-Fire]. Those both have recoil, so I really like running Morning Sun on it to let it stick around throughout the match. Swords Dance is also valid there, though, to give +2 Attack to a Pokemon faster than the Silvally formes and basically every unboosted mon in the tier.

It has about a million options for the fourth move, IMO, so I'll try to explain my thoughts. Low Kick has 100 BP against Silv-Dragon and Silv-Fire, two of its biggest obstacles, while also having 100 BP + super-effective coverage against Drampa. SD is SD, and +2 Attack is great for a mon of its speed tier (i.e. faster than Silvally formes). Flame Charge boosts your speed, letting you outspeed Scarf Toge and thus be faster than everything frequently used in the tier. Toxic can cripple Quag and Wishiwashi, Wisp can cripple Garbodor which can be annoying because it makes you take a ton of chip from recoil [if not running Stomping Tantrum] + Rocky Helmet + Aftermath. Finally, Stomping Tantrum lets you hit fires super effectively, which really isn't very important because even with Wild Charge or Low Kick you do more to Silv-Fire than it does to you. Stomping Tantrum lets you win the Rapidash mirror matchup, though.

Enjoy using these mons, I know I will! [the others are kind of meh -- I think these are the big ones -- but I will give them a shot too :D]
 
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Rabia

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(I guess u could run Unaware P-Def Clefairy but ... man that's ridiculous).
clefairy doesn't get unaware unfortunately; it has the legendary ability of friend guard as its ha

on paper I think Flapple and Linoone are easily the two biggest issues from the drops; Flapple really doesn't have much defensive counterplay, with it being limited basically to defensive Mawile, an otherwise poor choice, Ferroseed, and some blanket physical walls like Garbodor and Cofagrigus that can take a hit in a pinch and hope to cripple it for a teammate. meanwhile, as several people have covered here and in Discord, Linoone really has an easy time spamming +6 Extreme Speed to beat teams. our Steel-types don't really handle Linoone well, with Togedemaru even straight up dying to Extreme Speed lol, and our best defensive counterplay having to be both kept at full and be Colbur Berry (+6 Throat Chop murders non-Colbur Cofa after Rocks iirc). both of these Pokemon look to be extremely unhealthy for the tier, and I don't really see a future for them at least right now.

Rapidash is the most intriguing drop of them all for us because it adds another offensive Fire-type and messes with the established Speed tiers a bit, giving us another option that tops out over the Silvally formes. Swords Dance sets should be pretty good; you have the option to run an item like Heavy-Duty Boots or something like Life Orb, which helps set it apart from Silvally-Fire, and your coverage leaves a bit more room for picking and choosing checks I feel, with Wild Charge and High Horsepower both being solid options there. I know lax has hyped up Power Herb Solar Blade, which sounds like a really great way to piss off stall players and is therefore being considered viable in my eyes. Choice Scarf miiiight have fringe viability? It's faster than Togedemaru, but base 100 Attack isn't really that great, and it lacks the utility a lot of our other Choice Scarf users can provide.

I like the Alolan Persian drop too. It basically puts a full stop to sweeping attempts from Swords Dance Silvally variants not named Silvally-Dark, and it provides a shit ton of utility through Parting Shot, Knock Off, and other options. Nasty Plot sounds like it could be fun to toy around with so long as you bring a dedicated Clefairy stopper. This is also another example of something that shakes up Speed tiers, so that'll be worth adjusting to.

I agree with Corthius that Alolan Dugtrio will likely see use as an HO suicide lead; it's now the fastest Stealth Rock setter in the tier and has options like Memento, Sucker Punch, and Toxic to thwart enemy attempts at taking advantage of it. I also think SubToxic sets will have some merit at least, although you're basically shoehorning yourself into using Stealth Rock Clefairy. I can't really see strictly offensive sets taking over because it just seems like a worse option for a Ground-type wallbreaker, but maybe someone'll surprise me.
 

Finchinator

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Recently, we added Sjneider to the NU Council and had a vote on some of the recent drops as well as other controversial Pokemon. The result of this vote is that Linoone is now banned from SS NU effective immediately!

For transparency, we voted on the following Pokemon:
  • Linoone (9 ban, 0 do not ban -- banned)
  • Flapple (3 ban, 6 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Cofagrigus (3 ban, 6 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Toxicroak (2 ban, 7 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Drampa (0 ban, 9 do not ban -- remains NU)
I apologize for the lack of formatting and graphic, but family is over and it has been a hectic weekend for staff. However, I will provide a little blurb on Linoone.

With the ability to function as a Belly Drum sweeper, Linoone was support reliant, but when utilized properly, it was a potent win condition that had a very limited pool of counterplay. Due to this, we deemed it far too restrictive to consistently keep in check later in games. This was a unanimous ban, so the entirety of council believed that achieving a sweep with a +6 attack Linoone was not only very possible to do, but also very challenging for the opponent to stop no matter what they resorted to within reason.

---

Moving forward, I would love to hear what people think about another strong Pokemon we got from the drops: Flapple! It seems like it offers a unique offensive presence to the metagame, but we are all curious to see how it will settle within our metagame.
 
Recently, we added Sjneider to the NU Council and had a vote on some of the recent drops as well as other controversial Pokemon. The result of this vote is that Linoone is now banned from SS NU effective immediately!

For transparency, we voted on the following Pokemon:
  • Linoone (9 ban, 0 do not ban -- banned)
  • Flapple (3 ban, 6 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Cofagrigus (3 ban, 6 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Toxicroak (2 ban, 7 do not ban -- remains NU)
  • Drampa (0 ban, 9 do not ban -- remains NU)
I apologize for the lack of formatting and graphic, but family is over and it has been a hectic weekend for staff. However, I will provide a little blurb on Linoone.

With the ability to function as a Belly Drum sweeper, Linoone was support reliant, but when utilized properly, it was a potent win condition that had a very limited pool of counterplay. Due to this, we deemed it far too restrictive to consistently keep in check later in games. This was a unanimous ban, so the entirety of council believed that achieving a sweep with a +6 attack Linoone was not only very possible to do, but also very challenging for the opponent to stop no matter what they resorted to within reason.

---

Moving forward, I would love to hear what people think about another strong Pokemon we got from the drops: Flapple! It seems like it offers a unique offensive presence to the metagame, but we are all curious to see how it will settle within our metagame.
yeah boi!!!11111 For real tho, linoone is still super good in RU, the only reason it dropped here bc nobody in RU knows how to use Aurora Veil. I personally have used Linoone in NU, and I have no regrets on it being banned, yee haw baby.


On another topic, Cursola is severely underrated, it still can function as a great trick room attacker.

EDIT 1: Lurk more god darn it
 
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