Metagame np: NU Stage 10 - I'll Be Home For Christmas

[Raseri]

We got a lot of drops today, and they made it in time for Christmas

Banette, Sceptile, Pinsir, Steelix are all NU
Beedrill, Lopunny, Camerupt, Altaria, and Glalie are all PU but usable in NU


Discuss the meta, i think Sceptile and Steelix will be good :D


no shitposts.

 

[Jarii]

Merry early Christmas NU! (we kept shitting that we didn't got anything last big shift, they were fine! Here jeez no shut your mouth for like 2 months)

 

[shiloh]

I'll just drop some sets that I think will basically become the standard sets for offensive teams since I still think those will rule this meta

sceptile

Sceptile @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Swords Dance

Starting out with bulky SD Sceptile, I feel this set will actually be able to put in a lot of work in the current meta as its really effective at fulfilling its role as a fast sweeper or late game cleaner. This set beats common grass type answers like Vileplume / Magmortar which is really nice for partnering it with things like Lilligant or Shiftry. However this set can't really break past bulky poison types like Garbodor / Weezing, or Steel Types like Klinklang or Ferroseed so support is very mush appreciated from mons like Mesprit, Piloswine, and just other ways to wear down these mons. The EVs outspeed Jolly Sawk which is about as much speed as this set should be running imo.

Sceptile @ Choice Specs
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice] / [Psychic]

Specs Sceptile is also going to be a really cool hit and run kind of attacker, just being able to nuke the tier with its STAB and ways to get around mons that resist Grass in Focus Blast and Hidden Power Ice or Psychic depending on what it wants to hit.

Sceptile @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]

LO Sub Secptile could be another cool potential Special Attacking set, and it plays a very different role as its main job is going to be cleaning late game as opposed to Specs Sceptile which is going to be played more aggresively mid / early game in order to weaken common grass switch ins for its team mates. Options like EQ over HP Ice or Focus Blast also work, as you are able to hit things like Garbodor which otherwise walls this set.

Sceptile
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Standard SD Sceptile, which is still going to be a very threatening set similarly to Bulky SD Sceptile. This set gives up the bulk + sub in order to sit in an amazing speed tier and have the ability to hit steel types and poison types. This set will work much better against fast offensive teams that rely on things like Floatzel / Aqua Jet for they're ways to revenge kill faster mons, which they obviously can't do with Sceptile.

Sceptile @ White Herb
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Im not really sure if this set is even going to be that great, but it is a lot of fun to play with. Use Leaf Storm to nuke things and its a great lure once you've gone for a Physical Move as you can bring in Physical Walls like Steelix and just hit them with a really hard Leaf Storm. A different nature can be used, but not being able to outspeed things like Floatzel and Tauros before using Leaf Storm isn't that great.

altaria

Altaria @ Choice Specs
Ability: Natural Cure / Cloud Nine
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature / Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dragon Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Sleep Talk

SpecsTaria is going to be more like a hit and run attacker with just dropping Draco's as much as possible. Fire Blast destroys common switch ins to Draco like Steelix, Ferroseed, and Klinklang (basically the only Dragon Resists in the tier). However Altaria has no way to deal with Mega Audino, so team support from things like Klinklang are very helpful.

Altaria @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake / Refresh / Cotton Guard

DD Alt is going to be a cool set that will put in work against offensive / defensive teams alike once Steel Types, Mega Audino, and Quagsire have been weakened or killed (in the case of Mega Audino). A lot of teams actually do lack a Dragon Resist, so being able to quickly get to +1 / +1 and then tear through offensive teams is great. The last slot is kind of a toss up, as EQ allows you to hit Steel Types like Klinklang and Steelix, which Refresh cures you of status without having to switch out and use Natural Cure, and Cotton Guard messes with teams that overly rely on Physical Attackers.

steelix

Steelix @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang / Crunch
- Iron Head

This is the only Steelix set I've really thought could work on offense and tested with, but it puts in a lot of work. It sets up on common things like Xatu, Mesprit, Skuntank, and becomes quick enough to outspeed everything 105 and below, missing out on things like Archeops / Tauros, which can't really threaten it that much anyway unless Steelix has lost a lot of HP. Sheer Force + LO combined with Iron Head / Coverage of Choice puts a lot of pressure on teams for either a Steelix sweep or just another partner to come in and clean up whatever is left. Fire Fang hits Ferroseed mainly, while Crunch hits Rotom and is generally stronger, so the choice is basically up to the team it is used on.

So either than the drops, one mon I really wanted to talk about that has gotten a lot better with the drops is Piloswine.

It basically beats all the drops that are going to be relevant, with Ice Shard to revenge Sceptile / Altaria, and EQ to threaten Camerupt / Steelix. Its dual STABs keep getting better and better, and is one of the best Stealth Rocker's on offense at the moment. Also with the increase of Steel / Poison Types which will start happening once Sceptile becomes more and more popular, Pilo benefits greatly as it can beat most of the common Poison Steel types with its STAB combination and great bulk.

Those are my general thoughts on this meta and how offense is going to utilize these drops, and I'm curious to see if other people have sets I didn't think of or just other things about this meta.

 

[Machineae]

Early predictions:

Shit: Beedril, Lopunny, and Banette

Mediocre: Glalie, Camerupt, Pinsir (he was just here a few months ago?? I don't think any significant changes have occurred.)

Good: Altaria, Steelix

God: Sceptile (fuck you floatzel)

Meta beat me to the post real hard as I was typing this smh, basically posted everything I wanted to say. Bulky SD Sceptile w/ Sitrus was what I thought was gonna be a secret set I thought I came up with and could post in the creative moves thread to cash in on those sweet likes. I'll probably use that+LO 4 attacks. HP Ice will probably be the coverage move to hit Plume and Altaria, iirc, it has a 90% chance to 2hko Plume after rocks. Spectaria is gonna be pretty cash too IMO. Should probably be running a defensive/lead Steelix set but I have a craving for an offensive steel that isn't Klinklang so I'll probably run some type of LO+3 attacks SF set. I'm hoping Camerupt won't turn out as bad as I think it will.

Things are leaning towards my favorite meta from years ago. Defensive teams will probably get much better. MDino+Lix+Taria is gonna be rough, maybe add in Quagsire??

 

[honchkrow]

I'll just drop some sets that I think will basically become the standard sets for offensive teams since I still think those will rule this meta

sceptile

Sceptile @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Swords Dance

Starting out with bulky SD Sceptile, I feel this set will actually be able to put in a lot of work in the current meta as its really effective at fulfilling its role as a fast sweeper or late game cleaner. This set beats common grass type answers like Vileplume / Magmortar which is really nice for partnering it with things like Lilligant or Shiftry. However this set can't really break past bulky poison types like Garbodor / Weezing, or Steel Types like Klinklang or Ferroseed so support is very mush appreciated from mons like Mesprit, Piloswine, and just other ways to wear down these mons. The EVs outspeed Jolly Sawk which is about as much speed as this set should be running imo.

Sceptile @ Choice Specs
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice] / [Psychic]

Specs Sceptile is also going to be a really cool hit and run kind of attacker, just being able to nuke the tier with its STAB and ways to get around mons that resist Grass in Focus Blast and Hidden Power Ice or Psychic depending on what it wants to hit.

Sceptile @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
- Substitute
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]

LO Sub Secptile could be another cool potential Special Attacking set, and it plays a very different role as its main job is going to be cleaning late game as opposed to Specs Sceptile which is going to be played more aggresively mid / early game in order to weaken common grass switch ins for its team mates. Options like EQ over HP Ice or Focus Blast also work, as you are able to hit things like Garbodor which otherwise walls this set.

Sceptile
Ability: Overgrow
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Standard SD Sceptile, which is still going to be a very threatening set similarly to Bulky SD Sceptile. This set gives up the bulk + sub in order to sit in an amazing speed tier and have the ability to hit steel types and poison types. This set will work much better against fast offensive teams that rely on things like Floatzel / Aqua Jet for they're ways to revenge kill faster mons, which they obviously can't do with Sceptile.

Sceptile @ White Herb
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Leaf Blade
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Im not really sure if this set is even going to be that great, but it is a lot of fun to play with. Use Leaf Storm to nuke things and its a great lure once you've gone for a Physical Move as you can bring in Physical Walls like Steelix and just hit them with a really hard Leaf Storm. A different nature can be used, but not being able to outspeed things like Floatzel and Tauros before using Leaf Storm isn't that great.

altaria

Altaria @ Choice Specs
Ability: Natural Cure / Cloud Nine
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature / Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dragon Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Sleep Talk

SpecsTaria is going to be more like a hit and run attacker with just dropping Draco's as much as possible. Fire Blast destroys common switch ins to Draco like Steelix, Ferroseed, and Klinklang (basically the only Dragon Resists in the tier). However Altaria has no way to deal with Mega Audino, so team support from things like Klinklang are very helpful.

Altaria @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake / Refresh / Cotton Guard

DD Alt is going to be a cool set that will put in work against offensive / defensive teams alike once Steel Types, Mega Audino, and Quagsire have been weakened or killed (in the case of Mega Audino). A lot of teams actually do lack a Dragon Resist, so being able to quickly get to +1 / +1 and then tear through offensive teams is great. The last slot is kind of a toss up, as EQ allows you to hit Steel Types like Klinklang and Steelix, which Refresh cures you of status without having to switch out and use Natural Cure, and Cotton Guard messes with teams that overly rely on Physical Attackers.

steelix

Steelix @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang / Crunch
- Iron Head

This is the only Steelix set I've really thought could work on offense and tested with, but it puts in a lot of work. It sets up on common things like Xatu, Mesprit, Skuntank, and becomes quick enough to outspeed everything 105 and below, missing out on things like Archeops / Tauros, which can't really threaten it that much anyway unless Steelix has lost a lot of HP. Sheer Force + LO combined with Iron Head / Coverage of Choice puts a lot of pressure on teams for either a Steelix sweep or just another partner to come in and clean up whatever is left. Fire Fang hits Ferroseed mainly, while Crunch hits Rotom and is generally stronger, so the choice is basically up to the team it is used on.

So either than the drops, one mon I really wanted to talk about that has gotten a lot better with the drops is Piloswine.

It basically beats all the drops that are going to be relevant, with Ice Shard to revenge Sceptile / Altaria, and EQ to threaten Camerupt / Steelix. Its dual STABs keep getting better and better, and is one of the best Stealth Rocker's on offense at the moment. Also with the increase of Steel / Poison Types which will start happening once Sceptile becomes more and more popular, Pilo benefits greatly as it can beat most of the common Poison Steel types with its STAB combination and great bulk.

Those are my general thoughts on this meta and how offense is going to utilize these drops, and I'm curious to see if other people have sets I didn't think of or just other things about this meta.

For SD Sceptile, as nice as bulk would be you absolutely need max speed for stuff like Archeops, Tauros and Floatzel. If you don't run max speed you're just dead weight against offense if you don't get an opportunity to set up

 

[lolbro]

Pilo beating Lix is weird because speedy offensive Lix gets into creep wars. :/ If lix is faster it wins, but i if pilo is faster it probably doesnt kill and then gets killed. Alt is going to be cool, finally get a cool mon to drop dracos with. Natural cure is cool for shrugging off twave and burns, also toxic on defensive sets. Speaking of defensive, Alt has a nice niche in completely walling busken and mortar, barring randy ass hp variants, as well aa having a very good matchup against pyroar. This will not only take a hit out of fire spam in general, but will relieve pressure off hariyama as being everyone's go to fire resist. Agilitaria is gomma be fun too lol. Sceptile, oh boy, very threatening mon in general, having so many dfferent sets it can run very effectively, especially the bulky SD set, which ia pretty much infamous for l8 game cleaning. Specs sets can be very dangerous, as well as Lorb mixed sets just do to sceptile ridiculous coverage. Glalie is a sick HO lead with taunt spikes fdry boom. Lop is lop, have fun PU. Pinsir is ez rocks for xatu reliant teams. Camerupt is another fire check, but has access to rocks, as well as being a cool rock polish mon, possessing not terrible, but mediocre bulk with its typing. Banette is our second strongest ghost, a cool MDino lure with Gunk shot, sports double priority in sucker and sneak, Cotton guard wisp looks fun for catching skunk and stuff. The rest are like useless lol

 

[DaRizzleTheMan]

Specs Swellow (or even Lord MixLow) is going to be a lot better in this tier because it can outspeed the monstrosity of Sceptile (rest assured it's not hit Unburden) and destroy it with the sick wubz of Boomburst, be able to beat Sceptile, wear down Steelix as there are gonna be a lot of offensive variants in the more competitive side of the tier with Heat Wave, and even Boomburst 2hko's offensive variants of Altaria which is p nice. This also helps Piloswine because if Swellow begins to boost in popularity then piloswine can beat that too.

252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Altaria: 183-216 (62.8 - 74.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Heat Wave vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Steelix: 244-288 (83.8 - 98.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Sceptile: 217-256 (77.2 - 91.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 172 HP / 4 SpD Sceptile: 217-256 (66.9 - 79%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

(using meta's spreads on calcs pls don't hurt meee)

 

[Omfuga]

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Protect

My favorite steelix set from BW RU and early ORAS NU :D

Pretty simple... steelix's dual-stab is pretty good and it gets nice 150 BP vs things like xatu. It hits surprisingly hard and can protect to regain sturdy in clutch situations after a stealth rock switch or simply get more lefties recovery. Last slot can use thunder fang or toxic to shit on Pelipper and Mantine or even Heavy Slam to do 68% on average to Audino opposed to Gyro's 33% :/

It's kinda sucky that gyro can't beat m-audi so yeah heavy slam might be best over protect or maybe gyro (with an adamant nature)

 

[KnightK]

Perfect song choice <3 Seriously though these drops look excellent and have been long overdue.

I want to talk about Sceptile a bit and how I think it will influence the tier. Because honestly I foresee Sceptile becoming A+ Rank and likely in contention for S rank in the future.

This thing is going to be a staple on almost all offensive teams from now on. Base 120 speed is absurd for a tier where Floatzel was just recently rising in popularity due to its ability to outspeed common offensive speed tiers and that was only base 115.

The really only viable mon that outspeeds it naturally without a scarf is Swellow which I see quickly rising in usage because of this especially because Boomburst goes through Sceptile's subs which I imagine many of them will be using. I see scarfers becoming a much more prevalent thing than before where most of them bar a few were honestly pretty bad.

Considering it can go either special, physical, or mixed it can lure in or better handle specific threats with coverage moves like Earthquake this thing can easily adapt to metagame trends and checks that rise in popularity. That isn't even speaking of Unburden which furthur adds onto Sceptile's unpredictability because it has many ways it can activate it like shown above such as Sitrus and Leaf storm White herb and many other ways I imagine will be invented in due time which elimate many would be scarf checks. Probably won't be too good but I'd like to try a Petaya berry Overgrow Sub Sceptile set personally.

Garbodor is going to be just as good as it was before considering Sceptile doesn't have any good way of doing major damage to it besides Earthquake which is a 3hko. And Physical sets without EQ can't really do anything at all to it.

252 Atk Sceptile Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Garbodor: 146-174 (40.1 - 47.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

From what it appears Piloswine definitely got a big viability boost from all this which is funny because it was already pretty good recently. Able to threaten Sceptile and Altaria out with Ice Shard and it deals with poison types like Garbodor and Skuntank as well as Swellow which I also imagine will rise in popularity due to Sceptile's influence.

Two other pokemon I imagine will rise in popularity that I haven't seen mentioned are Ferroseed and Weezing. All Sceptile variants are walled by Ferroseed it provided they don't have either Focus Blast or HP fire and Ferroseed's gyro ball has a 75% chance to 2hko Sceptile. Plus it walls all variants of Altaria that don't have fire coverage.

Honestly though I think Weezing from all of this got the biggest boost in viability. It was already really good considering its one of the tiers primary fighting checks and mega audino checks among other things but it is a great wall against Sceptile able to sludge bomb it or will-o it, it checks Altaria and Steelix, walls piloswine, and beats most poison types 1v1 due to taunt+will-o. Seriously the amount of stuff Weezing can now blanket check is insane I definitely see it rising immensely in usage.

Definitely will be happy to try out the new NU that has been gifted to me this Christmas thank you fellow pokemon nerds.

Edit: Forgot about drain punch still doesn't really help much against Ferro though
+2 252 Atk Sceptile Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 126-150 (43.1 - 51.3%) -- 7.4% chance to 2HKO

 

[lolbro]

Perfect song choice <3 Seriously though these drops look excellent and have been long overdue.

I want to talk about Sceptile a bit and how I think it will influence the tier. Because honestly I foresee Sceptile becoming A+ Rank and likely in contention for S rank in the future.

This thing is going to be a staple on almost all offensive teams from now on. Base 120 speed is absurd for a tier where Floatzel was just recently rising in popularity due to its ability to outspeed common offensive speed tiers and that was only base 115.

The really only viable mon that outspeeds it naturally without a scarf is Swellow which I see quickly rising in usage because of this especially because Boomburst goes through Sceptile's subs which I imagine many of them will be using. I see scarfers becoming a much more prevalent thing than before where most of them bar a few were honestly pretty bad.

Considering it can go either special, physical, or mixed it can lure in or better handle specific threats with coverage moves like Earthquake this thing can easily adapt to metagame trends and checks that rise in popularity. That isn't even speaking of Unburden which furthur adds onto Sceptile's unpredictability because it has many ways it can activate it like shown above such as Sitrus and Leaf storm White herb and many other ways I imagine will be invented in due time which elimate many would be scarf checks. Probably won't be too good but I'd like to try a Petaya berry Overgrow Sub Sceptile set personally.

Garbodor is going to be just as good as it was before considering Sceptile doesn't have any good way of doing major damage to it besides Earthquake which is a 3hko. And Physical sets without EQ can't really do anything at all to it.

252 Atk Sceptile Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Garbodor: 146-174 (40.1 - 47.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

From what it appears Piloswine definitely got a big viability boost from all this which is funny because it was already pretty good recently. Able to threaten Sceptile and Altaria out with Ice Shard and it deals with poison types like Garbodor and Skuntank as well as Swellow which I also imagine will rise in popularity due to Sceptile's influence.

Two other pokemon I imagine will rise in popularity that I haven't seen mentioned are Ferroseed and Weezing. All Sceptile variants are walled by Ferroseed it provided they don't have either Focus Blast or HP fire (meaning all SD sets are walled by it) and Ferroseed's gyro ball has a 75% chance to 2hko Sceptile. Plus it walls all variants of Altaria that don't have fire coverage.

Honestly though I think Weezing from all of this got the biggest boost in viability. It was already really good considering its one of the tiers primary fighting checks and mega audino checks among other things but it is a great wall against Sceptile able to sludge bomb it or will-o it, it checks Altaria and Steelix, walls piloswine, and beats most poison types 1v1 due to taunt+will-o. Seriously the amount of stuff Weezing can now blanket check is insane I definitely see it rising immensely in usage.

Definitely will be happy to try out the new NU that has been gifted to me this Christmas thank you fellow pokemon nerds.

nice essay nerd. But anyway, felt like you covered a lot of what scep will do, but SD Drain punch isn't exactly "hard-walled" by Ferro :/

 

[DaRizzleTheMan]

nice essay nerd. But anyway, felt like you covered a lot of what scep will do, but SD Drain punch isn't exactly "hard-walled" by Ferro :/

Drain Punch means you either have to lose Acrobatics or EQ, which are the two optimal coverage moves for Sceptile, and EQ has the virtue of hitting shit like Garbodor, whilst Acrobatics helps you break past Vileplume and Gourgiest, and EQ hits pretty much everything Drain Punch would hit, apart from Dark types but Skuntank or Pawniard can't stomach an EQ and you wouldn't really stay in on Shiftry, but even then Acrobatics hits it anyways. Drain Punch just seems a bit mediocre to me when you're only hitting Ferroseed harder and wasting opportunity on other things.

 

[ryan]

Note: Raseri originally had the Bing Crosby version of I'll Be Home For Christmas. I have since corrected his mistake and used the Whitney Houston version instead.

 

[GyRro]

I can see stall being a little more viable now with Altaria and Lix coming along, but still think offence will be the way the meta will turn (like it has been recently).

Pinsir= rip drilbur
Sceptile and Steelix should be the most used from the drops since there are several viable sets for both mons. Mixed scep seems like it could be cool and I am trying it out in different teams. This is the set I've been using in case anyone is interested-

Sceptile @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 36 HP / 252 SpA / 220 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Giga Drain
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Substitute

Eq is mainly for Magmortar and 2ohkos without any investment which is nice. And the speed investment is to creep Floatzel. Should be fun to see how the meta will settle in the coming days/weeks.

 

[Cheryl.]

Articuno is something that has gotten better with the drops as well. It can check Sceptile really well (Unless Rock Slide Sceptile ;-;) kill Altaria, and it can 2HKO Steelix on the switch with LO Ice Beam. Ice is just a really good offensive type right now, as demonstrated with stuff like Jynx and Piloswine. It also can check a lot of other stuff, like Swellow in a pinch or Grass and Bug types like Scyther. And remember, it's still got Hurricane and that hits hard as fuck, Freeze-Dry for Waters, good defensive stats and good support moves, and a neat speed tier. Overall, while Cuno still needs support such as hazard removal, I feel like it's gotten even better with the drops and should be given some attention in terms of viability.

Here's the set I've been using with the God Burd:

Articuno @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Ice Beam
- Freeze-Dry
- Roost

Now to talk about new drops:

Sceptile's gonna be REALLY good, with that 120 speed and good mixed attacking stats. It has great coverage like Focus Blast or EQ, and with Unburden outspeeds EVERYTHING. Only problem is it's frailty, but it's nice to see an offensive grass that's also really fast. Definetely predicting A+ or even S for Sceptile.

Steelix is also gonna be really nice, as it has that stupidly high physical defense and a good typing to go along with it. Only problem I see is that it's a little weak and faces competition from Rhydon, but it's definetely gonna be cool.

Posting a fresh Steelix set:

Steelix @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpA
Brave Nature
- Hidden Power Fire
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Neat offensive rocker set that hits pretty hard and can lure stuff like Ferroseed to get bopped by HP Fire.

I'm loving this new meta rn, especially with sutff like Sceptile and things getting better like Articuno. Yay NU!

Also this is my last post until tomorrow when I post my 500th post RMT!

 

[ryan]

I think Earthquake is pretty much going to be a necessity on Sceptile. Hitting Garbodor, Skuntank, and Magmortar without missing coverage against Klinklang is too important to pass up. Because of this, Swords Dance will probably be common, but GyRro's set or something like it will probably be pretty good too. The only mandatory moves for a mixed attaching set are pretty much just Giga Drain and Earthquake. Aside from that, Leaf Storm, HP Fire, HP Ice, Focus Blast, etc. all seem fine. One of Focus Blast or Leaf Storm will probably be necessary to hit Tauros hard too.

Sceptile's return to the tier probably mandates more usage of Rosella. The only real coverage it has to hit Roselia is Acrobatics, which it can't really afford to run on an all out attacking set because you can't feasibly drop Life Orb and still be useful. SpDef Xatu might finally see some usage unless HP Ice becomes staple, which could happen if Altaria sees any notable usage. Although it doesnt beat a whole lot other than Sceptile, it can take on Lilligant more reliably and probably checks Vivillon (on mobile; can't do calcs).

Looking forward to the new meta and hoping it brings some more diversity to the tier!

 

[honchkrow]

so i tried out DD Altaria today and failed miserably.

+2 252+ Atk Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 199-235 (68.3 - 80.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after 2 layers of Spikes

^ pretty self explanatory. I guess the purpose of this post is to say defensive Altaria is the way to go. The damage output from offensive Altaria is just sad

 

[Punchshroom]

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Protect

My favorite steelix set from BW RU and early ORAS NU :D

Pretty simple... steelix's dual-stab is pretty good and it gets nice 150 BP vs things like xatu. It hits surprisingly hard and can protect to regain sturdy in clutch situations after a stealth rock switch or simply get more lefties recovery. Last slot can use thunder fang or toxic to shit on Pelipper and Mantine or even Heavy Slam to do 68% on average to Audino opposed to Gyro's 33% :/

It's kinda sucky that gyro can't beat m-audi so yeah heavy slam might be best over protect or maybe gyro (with an adamant nature)

I don't see Gyro Ball being too useful in this meta; it only manages to hit its peak power against something as fast as Tauros. Heavy Slam's more consistent power and greater PP makes it the far greater Steel STAB to fall back on.

is a very welcome readdition to the tier. It is far bulkier than Mawile, and isn't a huge momentum suck like Ferroseed is, or it can try more offensive builds such as Sheer Force Rock Polish, or perhaps Custap Explosion; this makes Steelix very splashable as a bulky Steel-type. It also very effectively covers two of the most fearsome / annoying bulky boosters in the tier in Barrier CM Musharna (if Steelix has Toxic) and Mega Audino, making it an even greater asset to most teams.

Don't need to sing too much praises about

when so many other people already have: incredible Speed, respectable power, wide coverage, and strong attacks make Sceptile a noteworthy threat to basically any kind of team. Rock Polish Rhydon won't leave home without a Jolly nature now, and I expect Weezing to rise substantially in usage to keep Sceptile in check. The relative scarcity in Scarfers is also huge for Sceptile, so for the most part it hardly needs to bother with Unburden in this meta at all and just keep the benefits of Overgrow.

iplaytennislol already demonstrated how pitifully weak offensive Dragon Dance is and how u shouldn't consider it over Fraxure, and I doubt bulky DD sets will get very far either considering the prevalence of Steel mons, MAudino, and Ice attacks in this meta. That leaves defensive cleric sets and Specs as the remaining appealing options (I mean you can try Draco Meteor + Power Swap shenanigans if you really want @_@). Defensive sets have a variety of support moves such as Perish Song, Roar, and Heal Bell + reliable recovery in Roost, and it is one of the tier's few dedicated specially bulky walls, though the SR weakness does hampers it substantially when it comes to walling threats. It's also annoying that the main offensive Grass-types like to carry Ice coverage, but Altaria has a significant niche in being a Magmortar counter, though I still have my doubts on that lasting long once Mortar realizes it now has a notable reason to ditch HP Grass for Focus Blast and just carry HP Ice instead :P

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Edit:

Steelix @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang / Crunch
- Iron Head

This is the only Steelix set I've really thought could work on offense and tested with, but it puts in a lot of work. It sets up on common things like Xatu, Mesprit, Skuntank, and becomes quick enough to outspeed everything 105 and below, missing out on things like Archeops / Tauros, which can't really threaten it that much anyway unless Steelix has lost a lot of HP. Sheer Force + LO combined with Iron Head / Coverage of Choice puts a lot of pressure on teams for either a Steelix sweep or just another partner to come in and clean up whatever is left. Fire Fang hits Ferroseed mainly, while Crunch hits Rotom and is generally stronger, so the choice is basically up to the team it is used on.

Btw meta, did you know Steelix learns Taunt? Now you can screw with both Ferroseed and Gourgeist in one slot!

 

[lolbro]

I don't see Gyro Ball being too useful in this meta; it only manages to hit its peak power against something as fast as Tauros. Heavy Slam's more consistent power and greater PP makes it the far greater Steel STAB to fall back on.

is a very welcome readdition to the tier. It is far bulkier than Mawile, and isn't a huge momentum suck like Ferroseed is, or it can try more offensive builds such as Sheer Force Rock Polish, or perhaps Custap Explosion; this makes Steelix very splashable as a bulky Steel-type. It also very effectively covers two of the most fearsome / annoying bulky boosters in the tier in Barrier CM Musharna (if Steelix has Toxic) and Mega Audino, making it an even greater asset to most teams.

Don't need to sing too much praises about

when so many other people already have: incredible Speed, respectable power, wide coverage, and strong attacks make Sceptile a noteworthy threat to basically any kind of team. Rock Polish Rhydon won't leave home without a Jolly nature now, and I expect Weezing to rise substantially in usage to keep Sceptile in check. The relative scarcity in Scarfers is also huge for Sceptile, so for the most part it hardly needs to bother with Unburden in this meta at all and just keep the benefits of Overgrow.

iplaytennislol already demonstrated how pitifully weak offensive Dragon Dance is and how u shouldn't consider it over Fraxure, and I doubt bulky DD sets will get very far either considering the prevalence of Steel mons, MAudino, and Ice attacks in this meta. That leaves defensive cleric sets and Specs as the remaining appealing options (I mean you can try Draco Meteor + Power Swap shenanigans if you really want @_@). Defensive sets have a variety of support moves such as Perish Song, Roar, and Heal Bell + reliable recovery in Roost, and it is one of the tier's few dedicated specially bulky walls, though the SR weakness does hampers it substantially when it comes to walling threats. It's also annoying that the main offensive Grass-types like to carry Ice coverage, but Altaria has a significant niche in being a Magmortar counter, though I still have my doubts on that lasting long once Mortar realizes it now has a notable reason to ditch HP Grass for Focus Blast and just carry HP Ice instead :P

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Edit:
Btw meta, did you know Steelix learns Taunt? Now you can screw with both Ferroseed and Gourgeist in one slot!

you pretty much covered everything? but what grass caries HP ice/ice coverage? rofl

 

[Punchshroom]

you pretty much covered everything? but what grass caries HP ice/ice coverage? rofl

The main specially offensive Grass-types commonly carry Ice coverage; Lilligant carries HP Ice, Ludicolo Ice Beams, Sceptile is expected to carry it (the other Hidden Power option is Fire but that cuts an important Speed IV). Shiftry is also a physical Dark-type attacker so Altaria doesn't make the most solid check to it, so the only other (debatably) "notable" specially offensive Grass-type Altaria walls is Victreebel, albeit it does hardwall Victree nicely due to Cloud Nine which can interrupt SolarBeams. You can consider Roselia an 'offensive Grass-type', though it is really more an offensive Spiker than anything else.

 

[Machineae]

So I've put in a good 50 or so games with a shit team consisting of three of the drops: SpecsTaria, mixed sub Sceptile and LO 3 attacks Lix. I (and everyone) else was right IMO. Although I thought Sceptile would be the god, and it largely is but I'm finding Steelix to pull its weight more (and w/ heavy slam that's a fuck ton.)

So Steelix switchins are still chunked pretty hard if they don't resist w/e move you're throwing at them. I was able to pivot in/out of Lix pretty easily with my team and opposing Weezing, Plumes and ghost levitate mons had a real bad time. Heavy Slam is just so damn strong. Losing sturdy for Sheer force is a bit scary but so far I haven't been outright KO'd but that could be because I ran a super threatening team where every mon forces switches lmao.

Specs Altaria is a monster too. Anything you do not OHKO or 2HKO with dmeteor is best by fire blast or another coverage move with the exception of MDino and Clefairy probably. It also makes an excellent water type/scald switchin assuming they're not one of the mons running ice beam coverage. Physical Samurott should be walled completely tbh

I'm really enjoying the time I'm having rn playing NU and haven't felt this way in a long long time.

 

[ManOfMany]

so i tried out DD Altaria today and failed miserably.

+2 252+ Atk Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 199-235 (68.3 - 80.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after 2 layers of Spikes

^ pretty self explanatory. I guess the purpose of this post is to say defensive Altaria is the way to go. The damage output from offensive Altaria is just sad

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Outrage vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 292-344 (100.3 - 118.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

I wouldn't be so quick to underrate Dragon Dance Altaria's potential. +1 Life Orb Outrage actually hits really hard and OHKOs everything offensive after a boost. Obviously here you have to be locked into Outrage, which sucks, but that never prevented other Dragon Dancers like Salamence from having decent success.

You might say that offensive Altaria is outclassed by Fraxure, but that's actually not true. Life Orb Altaria and Eviolite Fraxure are actually exactly as strong as each other:
+1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Fraxure Outrage vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Samurott: 310-366 (93.6 - 110.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO,
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Outrage vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Samurott: 320-376 (96.6 - 113.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

In addition they are exactly as fast as each other, with Adamant Altaria and Jolly Fraxure both being slightly faster than Swellow after a boost.

Each one has some notable advantages over the other. Here is a list.

What Fraxure has:
-No Life Orb recoil and not weak to Stealth Rocks
-Slightly higher physical bulk
-Not 4x weak to Ice (useful for moves like HP ice)
-Not weak to Rocks, allowing it to overwhelm pokemon like Rhydon

What Altaria has:
-Earthquake is amazing coverage, hitting a ton of fire, rock, and steel type pokemon without being locked into Outrage
-Has higher special bulk
-Resists Fighting, allowing it to set up on Sawk, Primeape, and Combusken. In addition, it cannot be revenged by priority Mach Punch
-Immune to Ground, letting it set up on Tank Torterra and Sandslash
-Can bluff SpA sets

Altaria @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 16 SpA / 240 Spe or 16 HP / 252 Atk / 240 Spe
Naughty/Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Fire Blast/Dragon Claw

Fire Blast could be used because it destroys defensive Mawile and Forretress, getting the OHKO after one spike. Dragon Claw is decently strong at +1 without being locked into Outrage, getting frailer pokemon like Swellow and Floatzel.

Below I listed Calcs of pokemon Altaria can kill after one boost WITHOUT being locked into Outrage. The list is actually pretty extensive.

Calcs

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kabutops: 296-351 (113.4 - 134.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Earthquake vs. 104 HP / 0 Def Magmortar: 432-510 (136.2 - 160.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Floatzel: 300-355 (96.4 - 114.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Archeops: 265-313 (91 - 107.5%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sceptile: 265-313 (94.3 - 111.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Aurorus: 408-481 (105.1 - 123.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Swellow: 282-333 (108 - 127.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Earthquake vs. 136 HP / 0 Def Klinklang: 278-328 (94.2 - 111.1%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Hitmonchan: 227-269 (94.1 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Hitmonchan: 227-269 (94.1 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

16 SpA Life Orb Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Ferroseed: 239-286 (81.8 - 97.9%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
16 SpA Life Orb Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile: 252-299 (82.8 - 98.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes

So obviously Offensive DD Altaria should not be entirely written out. It struggles to set up if Rocks are on the field, and struggles against both Steelix and Audino. However it has a nice match-up with a lot of the metagame and is tough to counter, even with that lovely 70 Attack.

 

[tmacbalanced]

I was thinking that maybe a scarf cryogonal could benefit from some of these drops, but then I was like, "what am I stupid? We have Jynx!"
So not much to say but, Jynx will definitely love having sceptile and altaria here. With the sub unburden set for sceptile, I can see that being tough for Jynx to revenge kill against. Like your sets by the way metaphysical.

 

[Gorechomp]

Although I'm fine with the drops (for the most part), I really think Sceptile deserves a suspect. Its seem to fast (fastest in the entire tier next to Swellow) and hits just a wee bit too hard for this meta. Most walls get wittled down by repeated Giga Drains and Leaf Storms, while other special walls like Hariyama, Roselia, and Vileplume run risk of catching Acrobatics or Specs Psychic. Sceptile just doesn't seem like it belongs in NU and would be more suited for RU of BL3. Feel free to reply to me if you disagree.

 

[boltsandbombers]

Although I'm fine with the drops (for the most part), I really think Sceptile deserves a suspect. Its seem to fast (fastest in the entire tier next to Swellow) and hits just a wee bit too hard for this meta. Most walls get wittled down by repeated Giga Drains and Leaf Storms, while other special walls like Hariyama, Roselia, and Vileplume run risk of catching Acrobatics or Specs Psychic. Sceptile just doesn't seem like it belongs in NU and would be more suited for RU of BL3. Feel free to reply to me if you disagree.

Please don't discuss any suspects, it has only been ~2 days since we got the new drops, give the metagame a lot more time to settle in.
Also, Sceptile does not learn Psychic.

 

[Jim E. Russler]

I took some of the weekend to try and get a feel for how the drops changed things up. Sceptile and Steelix, as expected, are the only ones that are really relevant. Apart from what's been mentioned in the thread already, I ran into an interesting, gimmicky yet effective Sceptile strategy several times that I couldn't really do anything about because the team I was using didn't have a Taunt user. I don't know who came up with the idea, so can't S/O.

The wincon is to pass Curse boosts to Unburden Sceptile with Musharna. You're almost guaranteed to get Sceptile in safe between Musharna's natural speed tier and the Curse drops, then White Herb removes your stat drops and powers up Acro. Between Acrobatics, Leaf Blade and EQ you can cover most of the tier, so I didn't see anyone use what was in the 4th moveslot. I'm guessing it's something to get the 2HKO on Ferro, if only to try and avoid getting Twaved.

I have heard some rumblings that Musharna is getting more usage and hype these days, and I've noticed a lot more Taunt abusers with type advantage over it. Maybe CursePass Sceptile wouldn't have been serving me cold sweeps if I hadn't been left behind in the summer's meta, but I thought it was pretty cool either way.

Glad to see some actual changes in NU, but I'm still not feeling this game enough to return to things. I'm not planning to get back into the meta for at least another few months, barring any suspect tests.