Metagame np: PU Stage 3 - Monster House (mid-December Tier Shift)

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MZ

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https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/usage-based-tier-update-for-mid-december-2020.3674893/
PU has received 68 new Pokemon (don't miss Ditto dropping from RU and Politoed going to ZU thanks PlusC), plus another 8 dropped back to PUBL and should be free soon. Go nuts.

e: We have also unbanned all 31 Pokemon in PUBL including every Silvally. Heat Rock is also unbanned.
If you're trying to keep track, that's a total of 99 new Pokemon (counting all Silvally forms separately) + Heat Rock

e2: Here is a possibly convenient paste of all 99 Pokemon in alphabetical order. At least they're all in one place. We're working on a role compendium just for new additions so there's some easier way to keep track of them.
 
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Frankly, I also see Sirfetch'd getting banned from PU, and here's why...

Scrappy

Sirfetch'd used to be in a tier where the ability Scrappy didn't mean much. Sure you'd see a Dhelmise every now and then, an intimidating Arcanine, etc. But he's being moved into a tier where pokemon like Galar Corsola, Drifblim, Sableye, and Trenevant are seen more often than not, and where Qwilfish is commonly used as the only intimidator in the tier. And sure, Miltank and Kangaskhan also wield this ability. However, Sirfetch'd has a much higher attacking stat and a higher Special Defense. Not to mention, it gets STAB from a type that is super-effective against Drampa, and you know how much Drampa is used in PU. So, if and when the next tier shifts come along, it wouldn't surprise me if Sirfetch'd pops right back out of that tier.

On another note, there's an additional Pokemon I'd like to touch on.

Druddigon

For those of you who are in the NU metagame thread, you may have noticed the large message I gave in which I posted a lot of niche sets for NU pokemon. My favorite among the ones I posted is the one I gave for Druddigon. For those of you who haven't seen it, I'm just going to paste it right here:

"WIP NU Druddigon Set
Name: Life Orb/Physical Sweeper
Druddigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Gunk Shot
- Fire Punch
- Crunch

Set Notes:

Druddigon's offensive capability is actually quite high and outperforms most of its tier. When it's run, it's usually bearing the ability, Rough Skin, or even Mold Breaker. However, Druddigon has another very viable ability, Sheer Force. With Sheer Force amplifying Gunk Shot's latent power, it's a good fairy counter, with a boosted Fire Punch to handle Ice-types and Crunch for added coverage, and Dragon Claw for physical STAB, Druddigon serves a viable slot in the OU tier. However, that's not all. The item, Life Orb, further boosts all of these attacks, and due to the ability Sheer Force, it will not take any damage from the Life Orb unless its using Dragon Claw, due to it not having a secondary effect. Using this, Druddigon is a viable Life Orb user that demands more respect from the tier."

This was already quite viable in NU, especially for a niche set. Assuming people get a hold of this strategy, I can see Druddigon coming out of this tier as well.

Scrafty

I'm only going to touch on Scrafty briefly. Dragon Dance + Moxie is pretty viable overall. Not to mention, it gets STAB from moves like Close Combat and Crunch. However, as long as Alcremie and Silvally-Fairy are still in the tier, I don't see much hope for Scrafty escaping. I do see it becoming a viable Pokemon in the tier, though.

Lurantis and Sableye

Seeing these two go into ZU is pretty sad. I mean, they'll still be playable in PU, but I just miss em. I actually just recently started playing both of these, and I've grown to love them a lot. Lurantis' Contrary Leaf Storm and Contrary Superpower have helped me a lot, however, I see why these are both leaving. Lurantis couldn't really take a hit from anything, even when its defense was boosted by Superpower, so...its run pretty much ended whenever something faster than it showed up. Similarly to Scrafty, the fairy types definitely give Sableye a hard time, since it lacks bulk. So, I'm sad to see these go, but I understand.

What I see for the future

NU will definitely not be played as often as it was, since it lost most of its Pokemon. If it is, it will definitely have to draw a lot of Pokemon from PU in order to be playable like how it was before. As an NU lover, I have to say F in the chat for all that we've lost, but as a PU lover, I'm excited to have a FAR vaster amount of Pokemon to play with.

GG,
- Gennie

(P.S. Still clinging on to a hope that Gen 9 Quaggy will be Ubers)
 

MZ

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I have just deleted 7 posts that were single lines that added absolutely nothing to any discussion. Please refrain from making contentless posts.

In other news, here is a role compendium for just new drops. It only has old Pokemon in a few cases in the weather/terrain/trick room section where they're really important, otherwise this is purely to help sort out what all the new things do. Big thanks to termi gum UberSkitty for helping!
 

G-Luke

Sugar, Spice and One For All
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I have just deleted 7 posts that were single lines that added absolutely nothing to any discussion. Please refrain from making contentless posts.

In other news, here is a role compendium for just new drops. It only has old Pokemon in a few cases in the weather/terrain/trick room section where they're really important, otherwise this is purely to help sort out what all the new things do. Big thanks to termi gum UberSkitty for helping!
Not sure, but has Drizzle been banned from the tier? If not, Politoad should be added to the roster of rain setters.

yes drizzle is illegal -mz
 
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Deleted User 350996

Banned deucer.
This must be the biggest change PU has ever known. I don't now where to start to be honest: there are plenty of mons I'd never expect them to drop here. Moreover with all the unbanned mons from PUBL it means we have a completely new tier with almost 100 more mons and I wonder how long will it take until it's more or less stable. The best thing I would ask is: which mons will stay?
First of all, once the New Toy Syndrom will vanish, I assume some of the drops will rise to higher tiers. I look forward the council decisions about the quickban (if it's planned ofc, I'm not sure about the tiering policy right now, if the council plans to ban anything or not).
That's being said, enjoy this as much as you can!
 
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Honestly, I feel like there will be quite a few underrated pokemon that will not move to higher tiers. I mean, I have hope for some (especially Sirfetch'd and Druddigon), but I feel like some won't be moved back. Not because they're bad, but just because no one will realize their potential. I mean, the PU tier alone has 153 Pokemon now (if I counted correctly), combine that with the 98 pokemon from ZU, and all the NFE Pokemon that some users will just drop an eviolite on, some pokemon will be overlooked, maybe even ones with competitive viability. Granted, I still believe that most genuinely competitive pokemon will be put where they deserve, but I'm just labeling a possibility.
 
Yeah I hope sirfetch'd gets banned from nu and pu both, oh that ru quickban it had a while ago was one of the funniest things that happened in the swsh metagame, only being able to dominate ru for one day before being immediately quickbanned. Good times...
 

MZ

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Not sure, but has Drizzle been banned from the tier? If not, Politoad should be added to the roster of rain setters.

yes drizzle is illegal -mz
Followup on this- apparently NU freed Drizzle and Drought at the top of this month, I was not aware. This means that when we freed the "entirety" of PUBL we actually left those abilities banned. I will talk with council about unbanning those but it won't be done automatically like everything else was. I think people can understand why out of everything in PUBL I'm not going to take these abilities deserving another chance for granted. Especially with Kingdra and Charizard.
edit: Ok apparently NU re-banned Drought. You guys seriously need a hub for this like we have x_x anyway we can't free Drought but will discuss Drizzle. I do not expect it to get freed.

edit 2: After a very brief discussion, Drizzle will not be unbanned. Neither Drought or Drizzle are legal in PU or being considered for an unban.
 
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Yeah I hope sirfetch'd gets banned from nu and pu both, oh that ru quickban it had a while ago was one of the funniest things that happened in the swsh metagame, only being able to dominate ru for one day before being immediately quickbanned. Good times...
Honestly, Sirfetch'd doesn't seem like that big of a problem at first glance after using it for a bit. It has a very 'meh' speed tier and its priority can only be used on the first turn out. Furthermore we got a lot of defensive mons alongside sirfetch'd and this makes sirfetch'd seem to rely on prediction a bit too much if it is banded. This is kinda similar to the situation we had with drampa at the start of december, and we didn't ban that, so I'd like to think that our mentality will be quite the same with Sirfetch'd.

P.S I'm hoping to make another post soon kind of running down the meta (in my opinion) seeing as its chaos right now.
P.S.S I don't think we can really make a decision whether mons are broken on paper rn, so let's play for a few more days and get a feel for it so that we can discuss banning etc later instead of from the get go.
 
The only really over powered things right now from my extensive 30 minutes of play is terrain teams. Not so much Raichu A, who is surprisingly manageable (like with swift swimmers, just stall out the terrain or revenge kill it) more the various Unburden abusers ; Sceptile and Hitmonlee being the main abusers. Once they're set up they don't care any more and you have either phase them or revenge kill them.

Otherwise Indeedee is a bit ridiculous but I haven't seen it too much. The Silvallys, Fighting types and weather abusers seem fine. Utility Charizard is a really cool addition to the tier.
 
Honestly, Sirfetch'd doesn't seem like that big of a problem at first glance after using it for a bit. It has a very 'meh' speed tier and its priority can only be used on the first turn out. Furthermore we got a lot of defensive mons alongside sirfetch'd and this makes sirfetch'd seem to rely on prediction a bit too much if it is banded. This is kinda similar to the situation we had with drampa at the start of december, and we didn't ban that, so I'd like to think that our mentality will be quite the same with Sirfetch'd.
True, but once again, this is if it's banded. Generally speaking, if it's run with Leek or Life Orb, then it can avoid the prediction issue entirely. Although, people with Band will definitely be punished.

P.S. Something else I wanted to touch on with Sirfetch'd and I might as well say it in this post. Sirfetch'd has access to one of my favorite moves, Grassy Glide, which gets priority in Grassy Terrain. And thanks to Thwackey being moved down to PU as well, we have plenty of that. I can see that becoming another possible niche strategy. Maybe even giving Sirfetch'd Grassy Seed to increase its defense. But yeah that's all I'm touching on for now.
 
True, but once again, this is if it's banded. Generally speaking, if it's run with Leek or Life Orb, then it can avoid the prediction issue entirely. Although, people with Band will definitely be punished.

P.S. Something else I wanted to touch on with Sirfetch'd and I might as well say it in this post. Sirfetch'd has access to one of my favorite moves, Grassy Glide, which gets priority in Grassy Terrain. And thanks to Thwackey being moved down to PU as well, we have plenty of that. I can see that becoming another possible niche strategy. Maybe even giving Sirfetch'd Grassy Seed to increase its defense. But yeah that's all I'm touching on for now.
I'll touch on this first, and then I'll move onto a different mon. Non-band sirfetch'd doesn't get the immediate power it usually wants, SD sirfetch'd is too weak on the defensive side, Grassy Glide sets for priority rely solely on the ability to play Thwackey well, and non-priority makes sirfetch'd slow and there are more than enough offensive checks in the current meta to deal with it. Every single fetchd set has a fatal flaw. Again why do we want this banned? Also sirfetch'd has not been getting as much usage from what I've seen as something like Archeops (which is in somebody's team every darn game ffs). Let's not ban a mon until the whole community has had a decent experience against said mon and they mostly agree that its broken. I understand that Sirfetch'd is a cause for concern and I agree it is really powerful in the current meta, but with all these arguments in mind, it's not qb worthy right now.

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:ss/Archeops:
Next topic: Archeops. If we aren't banning this we probably need a suspect test once we've settled down. The thing is crazy. It has a bonkers speed tier for PU, both its offensive stats are crazy as well (140 and 112), which means you can run either Band, Specs, Scarf, Meteor Beam Power Herb, Mixed LO. Plus the thing has ground+rock coverage on both physical and special sets. And U-turn.

If you aren't convinced that this thing isn't at least semi-broken, then you're probably thinking about how Defeatist affects that mon. But that's bypassed by Boots Roost, which runs Uturn, Edgequake or Dual Wingbeat (which just happens to break subs so that's nice). It gets recovery and therefore gets to keep its crazy offensive stats. And that thing isnt crazy frail mind you. Its not like Kadabra - 75/65/65 is fine for an offensive Roost mon in PU.

So let's recap. It has about 6 sets all of which are viable, its stats are crazy and its speed tier in PU doesn't make it any better. It has U-turn so it can just do that if you're slower and 'beat' it. And defeatist doesn't affect it as badly as you may worry about if you just run Boots Roost. I personally think this is a bit broken, but right now I'm not sure people on ladder are using it to its full potential, but even so it feels like its still really hard to deal with. I think we should wait a bit before banning it but we should 100% keep an eye on this because this is probably broken to bits.

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:ss/Arctovish:
Admit it, Arctovish is a pain to deal with. Snow Warning + Slush Rush is crazy right now, and Icy Rock isn't banned so it has more than enough turns to kill all 6 of your mons. Also there's 3 Snow Warning mons that dropped (Aurorus, Aboma and Vanilluxe) so there's more than one setter, plus Aboma beats Vaporeon for you. It reaches 418 even when Adamant in hail, which is hard to deal with, even more so if it runs Substitute, which punishes a bunch of switches.

If I have to be honest Arctovish isn't the problem itself, more so hail. Maybe we could take a look at banning Icy Rock like we did Heat Rock if Hail teams become too much of a problem with Arctovish running around.

That's it from me, feel free to continue this argument, because what we need right now is the community's viewpoints so we can move forward with this gargantuan meta. Peace out!
 

ManOfMany

I can make anything real
is a Tiering Contributor
It's wayyyyy too early to be thinking about what is banworthy / non-banworthy yet. 99 mons just got introduced into the tier and no one has a concept of what the metagame really is and no one will have that concept for at least a few weeks. It's impossible to know which pokemon will shine in the new meta and which pokemon will be too much to handle. Archeops may seem too good to you now, but it may be only a matter of time before someone scrolls down the massive list of drops and finds some top-tier counterplay. I encourage everyone to abandon all previous concepts of what they think PU is and just enjoy testing out all the new toys we got.
 
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Deleted User 350996

Banned deucer.
I won't be surprised if sun/rain/hail get lot of usage even with Drizzle/Drought banned. Mons like :kingdra: :charizard: :poliwrath: :omastar: :kabutops: or :shiftry: might be spammed on ladder. So naturally here what I could suggest to (partially) counter them:

:gigalith: Gigalith @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge / Rock Blast
- Toxic
- Protect

Here some calcs:
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gigalith in Sand: 302-356 (80.7 - 95.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Charizard Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gigalith in Sand: 192-228 (51.3 - 60.9%) -- 93.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gigalith in Sand: 266-314 (71.1 - 83.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Kabutops Liquidation vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Gigalith: 222-264 (59.3 - 70.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Feel free to use a different EV spread but this one works decently. You automatically cancel opponent weather while being quite tanky to take some hits. I used this set back in early Gen8 RU when :Torkoal:/:Politoed: were everywhere and I had decent results.
You even might be interested to pair :gigalith: with :Sandslash:/:Lycanroc: to make use of sand as much as you can.

Also, I would like to nominate my favourite core right now:

:archeops: Archeops @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Defeatist
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Dual Wingbeat
- Head Smash / Stone Edge / Rock Slide
- Roost / Knock Off / Taunt

:galvantula: Galvantula @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Compound Eyes
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch / Sticky Web
- Thunder
- Bug Buzz
- Energy Ball

This Volt/Turn core is working well for me at the moment and they somehow cover each other checks. Archeops gaining Boots mean you can switch anytime you want without being afraid of SR. Head Smash + Roost is fine especially because you technically save some HP with Boots. Same goes for Galvantula which will hit bulky Ground/Water/Rock types (:sandaconda: :rhydon: :quagsire: etc.) that want to counter Archeops. I don't particularly need Web but it's a good option to consider as well, depending on your team.

See you around!
 
With almost a hundred pokemon added to the tier I had to completely scrap my previous team. I agree with Blue Wolf that it feels like RU from last gen particularly due to some of the drops being staples from there. This isnt necessarily a bad thing as now all these new mon have an environment to thrive in. But being a guy who plays in the lower tiers so they can use 'non-optimal' mons this hurts a fair bit. I cant wait till half the tier is forced into ZU so that becomes stacked as well.

Actual thoughts on the drop mons themselves. Terrain and Weather look strong and potentially the dominant strategies. Machamp is an amazing mon and I am both surprised no one is mentioning it and that it fell down here to begin with, though Roserade dropping is even more nuts to me. I do hope they both find themselves a niche as I would hate to see them in ZU when 100+ mon drop
 
After some playing in the new and (not so) improved PU, here are my thoughts on some of the new drops.

:sirfetch
To be honest, I don’t know about this mon. On one side, it has excellent coverage, a great attack stat and decent physical and special bulk. Scrappy is also a worrisome ability as well. On the other side, SD sets lack immediate power and CB sets risk locking themselves into a bad move. A 'meh' speed tier doesn’t help it either. I wouldn’t call for the banhammer yet, but we should be keeping an eye on it as of now.

:exploud:
Hoo boy, this thing. As we all now, Specs Boomburst rips through everything that doesn’t resist it (and even that might not be enough, considering that resists are crippled upon switching in and considering its coverage). While it may have mediocre bulk, a bad speed tier, and many revenge killers to send it to its grave, I really don’t like this thing and I can see a quickban for it soon.

:arctovish:
Once again, this is a pain to switch in to. CB Fishious Rend hits hard outside of water resists while Ice Fang and Psychic Fangs make sure to punish grasses and Poliwrath respectively. It gets worse under hail; as BulbaBrain said this mon hits 418 speed under hail while running an Adamant nature and Substitute punishes a lot of its usual switch ins. I can possibly see this getting banned if not suspect tested.

:machamp:
The BEST Guts abuser right now, period. It’s a shame that this isn’t used more, as Guts boosted CC destroys anything that isn’t a ghost or resist. Could this be banworthy? Idk, I’d like to see it more in action before deciding on it.

:roserade:
Surprisingly, I haven’t seen much of this in action. STAB Leaf Storm and Sludge Bomb hits hard and it’s fast. There isn’t much else to say about this, but it’s a good partner with Thwackey due to Grassy Terrain benefiting it in every way.

:scrafty:
Like Rose, this is surprisingly underrated. The only thing that can hit it super effectively is Fairy, Flying, and Fighting. After a Bulk Up, it both hits and tanks for a good amount of damage and can even recover with Drain Punch. The only bad thing I can see is that it has a bad speed tier.

:mesprit:
The queen of SM PU has gotten back to its domain! Scarf or rocks, it does it’s job well enough to warrant a spot on a team. It’s basically the same since it was last banned, so make out what you can from that.

:archeops:
Yeah... this concerns me. With the addition of HDB, it no longer has to be wary or rocks dwindling its HP. And once again, what BulbaBrain said is very true, the amount of sets it can run is insane. Very worrisome for the moment.

That’s all I got for you folks. There’s some other stuff that merits discussion, but that’s for another time. Ciao!
 
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Ehmcee

A Spoopy Ghost
is a Pre-Contributor
After some playing in the new and (not so) improved PU, here are my thoughts on some of the new drops.



:scrafty:
Like Rose, this is surprisingly underrated. The only thing that can hit it super effectively is Fairy, and Scrafty has Poison Jab to deal with those. After a Bulk Up, it both hits and tanks for a good amount of damage and can even recover with Drain Punch. The only bad thing I can see is that it has a bad speed tier.
Fighting+Flying also exist
 

Eve

Bzzt!
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Community Leader
I'm here to slow things down a little and talk about defensive stuff in this meta. But first, let's talk about Sun HO. Trust me, there's a point to this.

Sun, to put it lightly, is absolutely insane. That's mainly because of :charizard:, which OHKOs the majority of the tier and 2HKOs even most special walls. Defensive teams that are chipped or improperly equipped will just lose instantly and offense loses something without fail every time it hits the field against a slower opponent, often even outside of Sun and especially when considering how good Zard's Speed tier actually is. :shiftry: and :vileplume: are amazing abusers too, of course, providing the sweeping potential to complement Charizard's raw breaking power. :sableye: and :whimsicott: are the main setters I've seen, and for good reason- Prankster is obviously a massive boon for manual weather setters as always, and both can pack other useful utility options to support the abusers or handle dangerous threats. :regirock: can reliably set up Stealth Rock and Sun while also being quite a good pivot to the annoying Gigalith, so it's probably quite potent on the archetype as well.

With how powerful Sun is, and Rain also being quite the threat thanks to the addition of Kingdra, players may feel like they have to throw Gigalith on their teams to stand a chance. While Gigalith is definitely good, there's another great option I've been trying out (that also lets you run the superior Regirock):

:ss/lickilicky:
Cloud Nine is an absolute godsend for a defensive Pokemon in a weather-filled metagame. Specially Defensive Lickilicky makes Charizard and Kingdra look like absolute jokes, can be switched in on Solar Beam to force an exploitable charge turn, and even ruins the accuracy of Hurricane/Thunder as a bonus. It's great at sponging outside of these matchups due to its natural bulk, and its passivity is greatly offset by how badly the combination of Knock Off and Toxic can cripple the vast majority of the current metagame. It's especially notable as quite a decent Mesprit check if it isn't NP Psyshock. This Pokemon and its large Wish anchors defensive teams like little else at the moment and I'd definitely recommend giving it a try.
Edit: it also reverts Weather Ball to 50BP Normal, which can be a lifesaver

:ss/aromatisse:
Physically Defensive Aromatisse is my go-to Fighting-type answer, and does the job fantastically. It's not ruined by Knock Off like Clefairy, not weak to it like Psychic- or Ghost-types, and actually has a HP stat unlike Alcremie. Being forced to Wish can be exploitable, but generally you do more than enough damage to dissuade a Fighting-type from trying to exploit that. Aromatisse can also handle many other things in a pinch, as its Special bulk is still pretty great even without investment. Heal Bell is great as always too, especially as Aromatisse can use it against the likes of Taunt/Toxic Jellicent, which often plagues defensive teams, thanks to Aroma Veil.

:ss/regirock:
Alolan Sandslash? Archeops? Gigalith? Tauros? Scyther? Talonflame? Pretty much any physical threat? Regirock has you covered against all of these, while also making for a great Stealth Rock setter. Rock/Fighting is phenomenal coverage for a tank, especially when the latter is Regirock's massive Body Press that 2HKOs the vast majority of neutral targets. I run Regirock specially defensive as investment does hardly anything to its Defense and its offensive presence wouldn't be significantly improved with Attack. It also lets Regirock do cool things like avoid a 2HKO from Exploud's Boomburst (ban this Pokemon). The last slot goes to Toxic in order to ruin the likes of Jellicent and Palossand. Pairs greatly with Aromatisse as it loves Wish support and doesn't really like having to be the Fighting-type response, even if it can take a hit if necessary.

Now, here's what I really wanted to talk about...
:ss/regigigas:
This thing is an absolute monster. Forget about annoying status sets, Sub Protect, whatever you may be thinking of. Power-Up Punch Regigigas is ridiculous.
Regigigas @ Leftovers
Ability: Slow Start
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Power-Up Punch
- Knock Off
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
Regigigas is, to put it bluntly, obscenely bulky. This makes stalling out 5 turns trivial, especially with RestTalk. In this time, it's quite easy for Regigigas to accumulate multiple Attack boosts with Power-Up Punch and then absolutely mow through the opponent afterwards. Knock Off complements PUP perfectly, greatly crippling Ghost-types that attempt to deny its boosts (as well as everything else, Knock is just amazing on fat mons) and generally providing all the coverage you need. I absolutely adore running this Regigigas on stall, for multiple reasons. Firstly, it provides a very clear-cut wincon, which stall really benefits from. Secondly, it functions respectably as a pivot in its own right thanks to its aforementioned bulk, longevity, and Knock Off, and especially excels at messing with other defensive Pokemon which Stall loves (this thing happily 6-0s other stall, like seriously). Lastly, Stall's ability to play the long game means that Regigigas doesn't have to go all-in on a single opportunity- it can be switched out and try again later with how easy burning 5 turns is, especially with good Wish support and Heal Bell curing Rest. This means that Aromatisse once again makes for a phenomenal partner that can also often entirely prevent Fighting-types from making progress, causing them to become much poorer answers to Regigigas as they lose the war of attrition. Regigigas can absolutely snowball in so many matchups and is 100% worth giving a try. It really does feel like you're using an Uber in PU sometimes and I wouldn't be surprised if people get tired of trying to handle it, especially if/when some controversial Fighting-types get axed (looking at Sirfetch'd and Machamp here).
Edit: Grassy Seed sets are pretty insane too, Thwackey seems to fit pretty nicely on fat teams rn so it's not hard to get going. Lefties usually get knocked off anyway so you aren't losing too much

Overall, this meta is ridiculous. I never thought PU would end up like this, let alone so soon after the kind of environment in which something like Stonjourner could dominate. But here we are, and I'm interested to see what comes of it!
 
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shnowshner

You've Gotta Try
is a Pre-Contributor
Feel like posting about the Pokemon I saw in the PU list which made me laugh the most

:sigilyph:
Out of everything mentioned so far I'm honestly amazed nobody has brought this demon up. For the record NU has previously voted on whether or not it needed banned from that tier (it wasn't), and if NU had trouble with their access to even more Pokemon then what of PU? It's an offensive Flying type that doesn't need to worry about passive damage and gets a free damage boost to all its moves if you run Life Orb. Magic Guard is so good you might forget it gets Tinted Lens as well and can flat out ignore your resists. There's definitely stuff that scares it like out like Sneasel but that can't exactly switch in for free.

:indeedee-f:
Oh God. Even if this alone isn't that strong the stuff it can enable is going to be problematic. Blocking priority for your sweepers is huge and its terrain is the catalyst for all kinds of Psychic Spam. By itself it deals disgusting damage with Expanding Force and has both Psyshock to target SpDef walls and Gleam for any prospective Dark types wanting to come in unscathed.

:machamp:
Name one Pokemon that wants to switch into this. Sirfetch'd may have better Speed and Attack but it lacks bulk and either runs Band, clicks First Impression/CC, and gets forced out immediately, or runs a setup set that sourly misses immediate power. Machamp doesn't need to worry about locking into a move or immediate power. It does lack strong priority but makes up for it by being a terrifying wallbreaker with a great movepool and a better, if slightly less sustainable Choice Band, and it's also a great Knock Off switch-in once statused. If Guts isn't vibing with you, you can run No Guard and recklessly spam Dynamic Punch while packing an unmissable Stone Edge for any Flying-types looking to come in.

:tauros:
Another thing I'm surprised hasn't been talked about. With some great new additions to its movepool this is looking to be a massive threat. Sheer Force LO gives it crazy power and in some cases at no real cost. 110 Base Speed is also pretty nuts for PU standards, especially when factoring just how powerful Tauros is.

:kingdra:
Unsurprisingly this is very good with weather support, and its newfound access to Hurricane and Flip Turn is the icing on the cake. As if Rain-Boosted STAB attacks and Draco Meteor wasn't enough. Even without rain this has a decent spread and great typing that I feel will go a long way in helping it succeed.

:exploud:
Get it in safely and congratulations if you outspeed you win. There's a decent selection of Steel and Rock types in PU but none of them want to come in on its coverage, and some just die to 2 Boombursts anyhow lmao this mon's so stupid

:abomasnow::vanilluxe::aurorus::arctovish::sandslash-alola:
The gang's all here. Vanilluxe imo is probably the best setter since its got the best Speed and hits damn hard with Blizzard/Freeze Dry. Also provides a safe entry for teammates with Explosion, which may seem needlessly risky to throw away your Hail setter, but you can either opt to have a backup setter or just preserve it until late-game when the opponent lacks options. Sandslash obviously tears up after a SD and there's likewise little to say about Fishious Rend 2.

:roserade:
This isn't as good as the others moreso it's probably just going to rise to NU in the next couple shifts so use it while you can. That said if you're not a Steel or Poison type type you kinda just die, and even then it can do all sorts of things as they switch ranging from hazard stacking to shutting down a check with status.

:galvantula::heliolisk:
I laughed because this better be the nail in Jolteon's coffin. It's like Regieleki v. Koko is OU, yes the one is faster and probably stronger but nobody cares when you have no coverage. Galvantula and Heliolisk both have ways around Electric immunities, provide additional utility, and also have good abilities which give them unique niches, unlike Jolteon whose niche is they make it easier to get through low ladder as long you as have a Pokemon which beats it.
 

Ktütverde

of course
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Former Smogon Metagame Tournament Circuit Champion
Hey guys. Just wanted to drop something: a visual (made by me) that should help you visualize what PU should look like in a couple weeks or by the end of January for sure. Reminder: next tier shift on the 1st of January.

I'm doing this mostly for new PU players, or people who dont know much about higher tiers and would be trying to make sense of the insane shift we got a couple days ago. Yes, an awful lot of mons are very strong. And no, they're not gonna stay here for long.


1°) So, first of all, based on my knowledge of SM NU and RU, here is what should rise from PU anytime soon:
1608339994910.png
(add Tsareena and Indeedee to the list)
If you know a bit about higher tiers and oldgens, you know this stuff is very strong in either SMNU or SMRU. And given there's been a power decreep between SM and SwSh (lost mons, lost Z-crystals and lost Megas), these guys will at least be in the tier they were last gen. Not much to say, I would be extremely surprised if any of those lasts more than 1 month in PU.


2°) Now, here are mons that used to be SMNU or SMPUBL, and that could probably remain in current PU for a long time or forever. And could as well be NU. I don't know. Depends on what rises, what gets banned from PU, and what doesn't. But I think most of those will define the PU meta very soon:
1608340903191.png

So there are three groups mixed here:
1/ formerly in SMPU and then banned/rose to SMNU;
2/ formerly SMNU due to ladder loving them but very bad in SMNU and SMPU-worthy;
3/ formerly SMNU but could be PU without too much trouble.
-vanilluxe and magneton are kind of an exception, lost hiddenpower and auroraveil is illegal in NU so, could drop to PU.

-First group includes archeops/magmortar/tauros/eggy-alola as PUBL and passimian mesprit miltank as PUs stolen by NU.
-Second group includes Jolteon/accelgor (fast guys, ladder loves those) clawitzer (ability too STRONK) golbat (dunno) and the hitmon bros (ladder loves rapidspin).
-Third group would be rotom piloswine and aromatisse. Don't know if SSNU will need them.


3°) Finally, mons added in SwSh that will most likely remain in PU:
1608340996341.png

Nothing crazy here except coalossal and duraludon. I still kept them in this section because I think they might be ineffective in NU, but I wouldnt be surprised if they rose. The others are 100% staying in PU I think.



I'm really hyped for 2021 PU. Current tier is funny to play but is the biggest mess I've ever seen. Let's enjoy it (what, you don't like clicking boomburst with exploud and getting swept by lead ribombee?) before it evaporates to NU and higher.

Happy christmas in advance!! Peace.
 

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gum

for the better
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
PU Leader
1°) So, first of all, based on my knowledge of preDLC2 NU and RU, as well as SM NU and RU, here is what should rise from PU anytime soon:
as someone who plays a decent amount of nu / watches some ru, i disagree with most of this list. a lot of these mons really aren't that good in nu / ru and suffer from competition, while power creep got to some of these. probably the biggest issue i have with this is basing it off completely different metagames; current swsh ru and swsh nu are nothing like their pre-dlc2 selves

to not make this post completely useless, here are some sets i've been having some fun with!

:ss/duraludon:
pyramids (Duraludon) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Dragon Pulse

nice speed tier + it's a dragon that can hit fairies for very good damage. steels are a bit annoying but the most common ones (steelvally and snowslash) lack recovery, while they still dislike taking a specs draco regardless. tsareena is a pretty good partner for it, bringing it in against stuff like weezing and vileplume and weakening steels.


:sm/whimsicott:
buzzcut season (Whimsicott) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Moonblast
- Hurricane

subleech whimsicott is a pretty fun set if they're not using a talonflame. having a priority leech seed and sub is always nice when facing stuff like arctovish under hail for example, or sun teams. hurricane might seem like an odd choice, but hitting grass-types is really nice for it. i've been using along weezing to set tspikes, which makes it even more of an annoyance.


:sm/ribombee:
butterfly (Ribombee) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Shield Dust
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sticky Web
- Moonblast
- Psychic / Bug Buzz
- U-turn

this mon is actually really good, having an excellent speed tier (still slower than t*lonflame tho) + good typing make it really good at revenge killing stuff like heliolisk and virizion, while also being a huge annoyance thanks to webs and u-turn. speaking of which, webs are really good right now due to the tier's abundance of mid-speed breakers like sirfetch'd and magmortar that are much harder to revenge kill with webs up. definitely a good and cute mon, try it out!

thanks for reading!!
 
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