np: SS UU Stage 7 - Hungry Like the Wolf (DLC2 plans - see post #42)

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After thinking about checks to lycan I realized that there is honestly only 1 mon in the entire tier that can come in on it safely no matter what it clicks.
Tangela @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Sleep Powder
- Leech Seed
252 Atk Life Orb Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 90-107 (26.9 - 32%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 87-103 (26 - 30.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Terrakion Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 110-133 (32.9 - 39.8%) -- 99.9% chance to 3HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 94-110 (28.1 - 32.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Mimikyu Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 130-153 (38.9 - 45.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Mimikyu Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela on a critical hit: 153-181 (45.8 - 54.1%) -- 47.7% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Guts Obstagoon Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 117-138 (35 - 41.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Iron Fist Golurk Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Tangela: 136-162 (40.7 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Tangala also has access to regenerator which is the most broken ability in the game so it can just shrug off those hits like its nothing. While also being able to fire back to most of those mons with either an ohko or 2hko with leaf storm or take their item because it has access to knock, even though its not as good as wishpass tangela can also use leech seed to help heal its teammates
0 SpA Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Lycanroc-Dusk: 396-468 (136 - 160.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 SpA Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Terrakion: 306-360 (94.7 - 111.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 SpA Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mimikyu: 135-159 (53.7 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 SpA Tangela Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Obstagoon: 166-196 (50.7 - 59.9%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
Not the first one to think of tangela but I would definetly want and like it to be more explored in the current UU. Its like chansey but can actually come in on terrak and lycan but w/o the instant healing (Soft Boil). A short post but I hope I got the message across that even when lycan gets banned tangela will still have a niche in UU, thanks for reading and have a good day.
Yeah I was saying this about Tangela a couple weeks ago. It's a perfect check to Lycanroc and Terrakion. Checks other physical attackers like the ones you mentioned too, although not as great. Needs Eviolite though, so too tough to switch in to Krookodile because of Knock Off. And also too many things that devour it like Scyther, Darmanitan, Noivern, and any special attacker really (even Weezing-G).

I think once Lycanroc gets banned it will drop off in viability, just like Magneton dropped in viability once Skarmory and Jirachi both left around the same time. But it's a very good add right now with Lycan roaming about.
 

Wanka

is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
UUPL Champion
Haven't done uu reqs in like 3 years so this was cool.

This noob Freeroamer might convince me to vote no ban, but dog is pretty lame. I just used the AoA set throughout my run and it core shreds pretty much any team comp bar Tangela goonery. Only case I think you can make is that it is somewhat prediction heavy against common slowbro + geezing + steel cores. At the highest level of play I'd say that's a pretty healthy notion, but it absolutely decimates offense and at the same time I do believe there are still good options at the tiers disposal to be able to break down balance (bisharp, rose off the top of my head are rlly nice rn). Anything with knock is amazing against those builds too since nothing fat in this tier rlly appreciates knock. I definitely had a way easier time just using the thing as opposed to the 3 games I tried to use stall and got owned for 2 of my losses. HO and BO will still definitely be hella good if it leaves so I don't rlly see a reason to buff balance as an archetype.

Sorry this is a pretty shit post, ban seems pretty self explanatory here.

1600743932427.png


Oh yeah sharpedo is really fucking good.
 

Freeroamer

The greatest story of them all.
is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributor
Haven't done uu reqs in like 3 years so this was cool.

This noob Freeroamer might convince me to vote no ban, but dog is pretty lame.
I should clarify this came from a conversation on discord where I was saying I'm not a huge fan of the tier's development towards very formulaic Slowbro+Noivern+Zarude+Sylveon/Weezing+Steel+Filler teams and how often they're used, with my concern being that the removal of Lycan might push the tier even further that way. This isn't really the kind of logic we should be applying to decide how we vote in suspects though, as it's speculation at best and we should be focusing purely on whether the suspect is broken within the current metagame. Not only that, there's been some very well reasoned opinions in this thread and on discord explaining that the existence of Lycan might very well be a big reason for this style of team's popularity and that without it there might be a greater variety of viable team structures to be used. Long story short, don't let speculation about what'll happen after the suspect distract you from whether the suspect is actually broken or not.

The majority of what the ban posts in this thread say is absolutely correct, short of using stuff like Tangela/Mudsdale/Vileplume the dog has the ability to threaten OHKOes on a number of tier staples and 2HKOes on pretty much everything without ever really needing to divert from the set Adaam posted on the first page. That said, I'm still of the opinion that it plays out scarier in theory than in practice at times. You're obviously never getting this in for free outside of sacks/pivot moves/doubles which sounds like a lot of options but can be surprisingly difficult to execute multiple times in a game. Even once it's in, there's a lot of scenarios where it absolutely has to click the right move in order to force progress, anything but Iron Head into healthy Weezing or anything but Crunch into Slowbro and it's forced back out again being examples. This obviously doesn't really spell out adequate defensive counterplay but are points worth noting all the same. Even with these points considered I still think Lycan exerts too much pressure within the teambuilder, forcing the use of otherwise suboptimal pokemon to be able to come into it safely or reliance on cores it can break with one correct prediction. This wouldn't be so bad if we had reasonable options to pressure it offensively, but outside of rock resistant (or zarude) scarfers there's nothing which is what tips it over the edge for me and is why I'll be voting ban.
 
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Luirromen

:]
is a Tiering Contributor
OUPL Champion
Hi there, long time to dont post on a metagame forum, got requs some days ago and after those games and some few extra time on ladder just to test teams I finally decided what to vote on this suspect test.
It has been pretty dificult to decide, since Im agree with arguments from both sides about Lycanroc.
:ss/lycanroc-dusk:
Lycanroc-D biggest buff this generation was by far get a real fighting coverage on Close Combat to beat bulky steel types and also as a strong neutral coverage to spam, besides of that, has an amazing speed tier to offer against most of the metagame, and also can not be revenge killed by the best speed control on the tier, Noivern, due to have stab super effective priority against it, however, this mon already had good coverages moves that also can shine on the actual metagame, Crunch for Slowbro, Slowking, Doublade, Jellicent and Palosand, Iron Head for G-Weezing and Sylveon and the rare Psychic Fangs that also hits G-Weezing but also Tentacruel and Vileplume.

What is the best set for Lycanroc-D?
I guess everyone agrees that the best set on Lycanroc is the All Out Attacker, since it lets it use all its coverage movepool and keep the check list with less options, Sword Dance sets are fine, however they can be pretty easily walled by Sylveon and G-Weezing in most cases (since it runs Accelerock, Close Combat and Crunch) but they can be deadly in some match ups, Accelerock/CloseCombat/Crunch are mandatories on AoA sets, last move can be what mostly need or want to hit, I find Iron Head as the best option here since G-Weezing is prob the most common switch to Lycanroc actually and aslo hits Sylveon that since Jirachi bann and Hatterene rise it gained popularity again.

How complicated is to switch on Lycanroc?
Im definitely agree with the argument that despite we have good physical walls on the tier, Lycanroc movepool lest all on the prediction factor when u have to decide what are u gonna sent to take a hit, G-Weezing + Slowbro is probably the best way to check Lycanroc defensively, even tho this core isnt necesary specific to check Lycanroc, since it can handle most of the physical theats on the metagame, Lycanroc can beat this core with correct prediction or even if the Lycanroc user has teammates to wear down Weezing like Incineroar and Mamoswine that can Knock Off and make it less durable to check Lycanroc on a late game. There are also some specific mons that got some popularity recently in order to check Lycanroc, Mudsdale and Tangela being the main 2, Mudsdale thanks to Stamina and natural bulk, and Tangela that is a completely counter with Eviolite (that thing is bulkier than Tangrowth lol), also today I found a mon that can actually check Lycanroc pretty decent and can be durable, and I havent seen anyone here or dicord mention it, and that is Qwilfish, gonna let some toughts and calcs of this guy below this paragraph.
Qwilfish @ Black Sludge/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 Spe
Impish Nature
- Liquidation
- Poison Jab
- Pain Split
- Spikes/Thunder Wave
1600919254103.png

Despite being weak to Psychic Fangs, to be realistic, Psychic Fangs its probably the most uncommon coverage on Lycanroc, Qwilfish has acces to Intimidate, a decent bulk and a decent way of recovery on Pain Split, speed evs allows u to outspeed max speed Neutral Nature base 60 mons (like Sylveon, Grimnsarl and Incineroar), it can come on Lycanroc with ease and can even support the team with Spikes or T-Wave whatever it comes to it, also can OHKO in return after some chip damage, take in count that this is just a gimmick that got to my mind and I wanted to mention since nobody hasnt, here some calcs:
:lycanroc-dusk: --> :qwilfish:
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Qwilfish: 110-133 (33 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Qwilfish: 57-68 (17.1 - 20.4%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Crunch vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Qwilfish: 77-91 (23.1 - 27.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Stealth Rock

Is there good offensive counterplay to Lycanroc-D?
There is offensive counterplay to Lycanroc and also this combined with the poor bulk that it has doesnt make it that difficult to offensively check, however the list of mons that can offensive pressure Lycanroc if u ask me its pretty limited to choice scarf users or priority, as I mentioned before, Lycanroc is an offensive threat that can not be revenge killed by the best speed control in the tier, this lets you with poor options to rk, the best choice scarfers that can take Lycanroc are Krookodile, Mienshao, Keldeo and both Washtom/Mowtom, since they can take an accelerock with pretty easy (in case of Rotom forms they must watch out to be very chipped), priority users are decent checks, Bullet Punch Pangoro, Shadow Sneak Doublade, another Lycanroc and Sucker Punch Bisharp being the best, I want to remarck on Bisharp, while Jirachi was being suspect tested I saw during getting my requs a ton of people spamming bisharp and then that got reflected on the last month usage stats (it got 17.7% usage getting the 7 th place of the most used mons), the reason why Im talking about Bisharp during Rachi suspect test, its that during this suspect test by playing I faced pretty much the same history, a ton of people having to rely on Sucker Punch Bisharp in order to check the biggest threat on the meta, I have to clarify, I dont mean that the unique reason why Bisharp is viable its because of being able to scare Lycanroc, its a pretty good mon that pressure defensive cores with Knock Off, and also prob the second most powerful Knock Off without boost on the meta after Guts Obstagoon. And Lycanroc with SD sets can actually beat Bisharp with its own priority despite being not very effective, there comes a ton of 50/50 plays, after some chip, Lycanroc can beat Bisharp with boosted Accelerock and ignore the fact of Bisharp spamming Sucker Punch, this obviusly can be pretty risky but higst rewarded for the Lycanroc user if it is well played, this alies just for SD sets, since AoA ones in most cases will switch out to a teammate like cobalion.
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Accelerock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Bisharp: 103-121 (38 - 44.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
Also Bisharp comes with the disadvantage that Cobalion is a common Lycanroc partener that walls Bisharp with ease, and can go for Volt Switch to bring back Lycanroc and keep putting pressure on the opponent.
I dont know if hazard can count as an offensive counterplay in this case, Im gonna asume they are a decent counterplay to Lycanroc, as it guarantees at least -22% chip on Lycanroc from every time it comes and attacks, also Spikes on Klefki have been getting some popularity so there it is another way to chip Lycanroc but in most scenarios you are getting at least rocks up, however this is not a big deal as a counterplay unless u have a solid core/mon to check it.
Mons that can take a hit and KO in return aside from the defensive ones, probably just Chople Cobalion, and things that naturally outspeed and can ko are Starmie and Barraskeda but they also have to be aware of dont be in range of accelerock


Has people adapted to Lycanroc-D metagame?
One of the main argument that people that doesnt wanna get something banned is that u have to adapt to the meta with that specific mon, I personally think by playing myself and wathing others that people have adapted to Lycanroc, this is probably just me who feel that, and some people really feel like UU its unplayable with Lycanroc on the tier, Im not going to compare Lycanroc with other past treats that really made the tier being unplayable like Aegislash, but I have seen peolpe really adapt to Lycanroc by spamming solid defensive cores and correct predictions and not neccesary running a very specific mon in ordet to check just that specific threat, even if u predict wrong against Lycaroc u dont automatically lose the match, Cobalion is other of the best mons in the meta and has been running Chople Berry, however chople berry doest just keep in check lycanroc, also the other strong rock type Terrakion has to be aware of chople Cobalion, obstaggon and Zarude with CC, Low Kick Bisharp, all those threats can also be checked by Chople Cobalion and not necesary for Lycanroc, on balanced builds most people opt for at least 2 checks to Lycanroc but those checks can cover a huge part of the metagame too, example the core I mentioned before of G-Weezing and Slowbro, obviusly u are not bringing a team that gets 6-0 by Lycanroc and in most cases that is not the case on most builds, even HO builds or Webs carry something that can support the team and can check Lycanroc like Cobalion or Tsareena. So in general, I find that people has adapted pretty well to Lycanroc

Last toughts and teams I used
After some time to think about it, I came to the decision to vote Ban on Lycanroc, even tho I hugely believe that people have adapted to this metagame, I also feel like ban Lycanroc will put a bit less of pressure on the teambuilding, as it keeps being difficult to switch out against it and can break throught the best defensive cores on the metagame, however I would not feel disgusted if it results to dont get banned, I know people sometimes just come here to steal teams, so gonna post the main 2 I spammed on ladder to get requs asap.
4 Attacks Bisharp + Nasty Plot Mowtom Webs
https://pokepast.es/e8b4b490bbeced4a
Tsareena Screens HO
https://pokepast.es/7151146a92381110

Some quick toughts on other mons on the actual metagame:

:zarude: This thing is probably one of the best pivots on the metagame and a new check to broken Polteageist, Jungle Healing allows to come on any bulky water and not fear an Scald Burn, also benefits from Future Sight support from Slowbro/Slowking as Weezing-G is its main check.

:mimikyu: I really felted all this time Mimikyu was the main issue on the metagame but Zarude addition + the huge usage of Cobalion and G-Weezing makes easier to keep it in check

:palossand: People has been coming up with this thing as one of the best Lycanroc checks but to be honest I havent seen any Palossand on the ladder and even on some few snake games I watched (prob missed one that got used)

:slowbro-galar: Sorry RU players, but we are almost stealing this guy from u, Assault Vest Variants are pretty damm good :c

:copperajah: Sorry RU x2, but with Jirachi gone we need a new bulky steel type and Copperajah is the best one :c

:rhyperior: Sorry RU x3, but this mon has been getting more usage even in OU, there is a chance that not only RU lose it :c

:klefki: Ok we are definitively not stealing this one, but its a really cool spiker and can work as a semi Lycanroc check

:kingdra: You are not good enought or simply brutaly outclassed


That is all, hope the comunity decides the best for the tier :blobwizard:


 
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After finally spending the time to actually get reqs today, I do understand why Lycanroc is considered a big problem. It pressures the metagame unlike anything else in UU currently. However, I will be voting no ban, because despite the fact that it can shred low ladder teams by itself, I do believe the mid-ladder/high-ladder has adapted well to it and it can co-exist in this meta with everything eelse.

After Jirachi was banned, Lycanroc was a bit out of control. But the rise of so many defensive cores (Weezing-G/Slowbro/Slowking/Sylveon) has allowed the metagame to shift to adapt to its presence. In addition to the defensive play, there is an abdunance of scarf users in UU currently that can pressure Lycanroc back offensively, including any Rotom, Krookodile, Mienshao, etc. And while I have heard people grumbling about Chople Berry Cobalion, it is a very effective play not only against Lycanroc but against the many other things in UU with Fighting SE (Mienshao, Terrakion, or even another Cobalion). While nothing here pressures the entire metagame quite like Lycanroc, it does not have a stranglehold on it like Jirahci did. You can build a very solid team without Lycanroc and still succeed quite well.

I saw someone say this earlier in this thread, but I think it is totally 100% true: Lycanroc is usually better on paper than in practice. On paper it looks overwhelming - it can hit near everything save Tangela/Mudsdale for either SE damage or very strong CC damage. But, in practice (except for low ladder), it never really works out that way. It doesn't quite have enough OOMPH to OHKO anything with moderate to solid defenses. Cannot OHKO Noivern with Accel, cannot OHKO Slowking/Palossand/Marowak-A with Crunch, cannot OHKO Incineroar after Intimidate (obv can't OHKO defensive cores like Slowbro/Weezing/Sylveon). That leaves it wide open to a counterattack that, on most occasions, will kill it dead. While it still does extreme damage to all of these (except Tangela/Mudsdale), the fact that a retaliatory strike wipes it out leaves the rest of the game Lycanroc-free. This is why people usually save it in the back of their team for a late game sweep - it just can't handle trying to take on everything on its own without very good support.

There's also a bit of a prediction game with Lycanroc like no other mon in the meta. Since it hits everything so hard, both sides have to make good predicts. This leaves a lot of things as a 50/50, but if you successfully out-predict your opponent, the Lycanroc will whittle down very easily with orb damage/Rocky Helmet if you have one/or just good switch in to a scarf user that resists the predicted attack. Pokemon, after all, is a big big predict game in itself a lot of times. While it hits everything hard, it also has many things that resist each of its attacks that you can switch into. Again, if you don't have solid defensive cores, this isn't possible. But there's enough to choose from, and I don't necessarily think that hampers the meta that you are forced to carry defensive cores to deal with Lycanroc. It just seems to be the current state of the UU metagame.

In spite of all of this, I am 99% sure Lycanroc will get banned because there is more than enough support here to ban it, and I can't say I'd be surprised or shocked or bothered by it because it is indeed quite good. But it's not The Executioner of UU like some may have thought it was, and it certainly won't be as bad when new DLC causes more things to enter UU to deal with it more consistently. So I hope it is revisited after banning so we can play with the doge again just in time for the New Year.
 
DISCLAIMER: The following post is not an assessment as to the viability of the mons listed. This study is simply about which mons got used, and which didn't. Any comments I make about each mon are mainly just my best rationale as to why those mons got the amount of usage they did. With that out of the way, I hope you enjoy my weird little post.

As you may recall, about two weeks ago I made a post detailing various trends I had noticed on the ladder; one of those trends was the seemingly complete absence of Chansey. I had several reasons for why it might get pushed down, and after some more observation I started to wonder if Chansey might actually drop off because of just how little usage I saw. However, it would take a rather sizeable amount of evidence to back a claim that an A rank mon was going to drop off. At the end of the day, an analytical post can only do so much to grasp all of the trends of the meta; the most effective evidence would be to actually watch a ton of games and see what's happening in reality. So, in order to get that evidence, I sort of went ahead and conducted a little experiment. And by little, I mean that I briefly peaked in at 400 games over the course of these last two weeks, briefly jotting down each mon that got used and how much they got used. And I'm glad I did, because of course the second I thought Chansey might be dropping off she suddenly surges in usage. But, while I didn't find what I was originally looking for, I did find what I got interesting in a different way. So, I'm doing something a little crazy (unexpected from someone who spectated 400 games, I know): I'm functionally making a prediction about what we may see next shift, one not based simply on conjecture (not that I don't appreciate the input of those who do that. This is just kind of going to a new extreme in terms of how I got these results).

Basic Parameters:
  1. The 400 games observed were the first 400 I saw on ladder following the start of the study. Each check, I recorded the teams of all observable on-ladder games happening at that time.
  2. All observed games were on the ladder. Unranked games were not counted since those are just between friends, so it's not quite the same standard of competitiveness.
  3. All checks of games were spaced apart by at least 1 hour so I wouldn't just be counting the same team over and over.
Now, I just want to emphasize that some of these usage percentages are probably a bit inflated compared to what the actual usage for this month will be. Firstly, while I made sure to space out each check of games timewise, I inevitably ended up counting a few teams multiple times (even I don't have the patience to ensure all 800 players involved with the games were different accounts). Second, as big as this sample is, 400 games is still a small portion of the whole meta. The intent here isn't so much about getting precise numbers for the month ahead of time as it is about providing a general baseline for which mons get used compared to others. While the percentage might not be accurate, I am confidant that this at least accurately shows which mons are popular at the moment. Could there be a major discrepancy or two? Eh, it's possible, but there's nothing really indicating such a thing to me. For my remaining sanity, I am only listing mons that got at least 1% usage, both because anything below that is probably just a blip and because otherwise I'd have to list half the Pokedex. So, without further ado, here are the results:

1. Noivern: 21.375%
2. Duskroc: 19%
3. G. Weezing: 17.625%
4. Sylveon: 17.5%
5. Wash-tom: 17.25%
6. Cobalion: 16.875%
7. Bisharp: 16.75%
8. Slowbro: 16.625%
9. Krookodile: 16.25%
10. Keldeo: 16%
11. Incineroar: 15.125%
12. Zarude: 13.75%
13. Chandelure: 13.375%
14. Araquanid: 12.375%
15. Mimkyu: 12.125%
16. Darmanitan: 11.875%
17. Tentacruel: 11.125%
18. Chansey: 10.625%
Mienshao: 10.625%
20. Roserade: 10.5%
Mow-tom: 10.5%
22. Cloyster: 10.25%
23. PorygonZ: 10%
24. Doublade: 9.625%
25. Mamoswine: 9.125%
26. Celebi: 8.875%
27. Scyther: 8.5%
28. Obstagoon: 8.25%
Talonflame: 8.25%
30. Starmie: 8.125%
31. Flygon: 8%
32. Terrakion: 7.125%
Tsareena: 7.125%
34. Grimmsnarl: 7%
35. Polteageist: 6.875%
36. A. Marowak: 6.5%
37. Palossand: 6.25%
38. Slowking: 5.125%
39. Sharpedo: 4.875%
40. Heracross: 4.375%
41. Espeon: 4.25%
42. Lucario: 4.125%
43. Rhyperior: 3.875%
44. Slurpuff: 3.75%
45. Reuniclus: 3.625%
46. Umbreon: 3.5%
47. Bronzong: 3.375%
48. Indeedee (M): 3.25%
49. Golisopod: 3.125%
50. Kingdra: 3%
Milotic: 3%
52. G. Slowbro: 2.875%
53. Goodra: 2.75%
54. Arcanine: 2.625%
55. Comfey: 2.5%
56. A. Raichu: 2.375%
Salazzle: 2.375%
Zoroark: 2.375%
59. Klefki: 2.25%
Seismotoad: 2.25%
61. Escavalier: 2.125%
Heliolisk: 2.125%
63. Porygon2: 2%
64. Machamp: 1.875%
Steelix: 1.875%
66. Druddigon: 1.625%
Sirfetch'd: 1.625%
Nothing At All*: 1.625%
69. Torkoal: 1.5%
70. Blastoise: 1.375%
Gardevoir: 1.375%
Snorlax: 1.375%
73. Barraskewda: 1.25%
Bewear: 1.25%
Galvantula: 1.25%
Pincurchin: 1.25%
Quagsire: 1.25%
Whimsicott: 1.25%
79. Cinccino: 1.125%
G. Corsola: 1.125%
Mantine: 1.125%
Pyukumuku: 1.125%
Ribombee: 1.125%
84. Charizard: 1%
Dragalge: 1%
Exploud: 1%
Malamar: 1%
Scrafty: 1%
Tangela: 1%
Toxicroak: 1%
Vileplume: 1%
Xatu: 1%
*Slot was empty. Not sure why some people were going with a incomplete team (including one guy who tried to solo a match with Pyukumuku), but to each their own.


Looking at the final numbers, I was surprised to see just how stable the meta is right now, at least as the study indicates. Most of the UU mons are seeing quite solid usage, while the fringe picks see decent usage, albeit not to a level where they would rise up next shift. Surveying all the mons, 75% of UU team-slots in this study were given to current UU mons. These numbers seem to indicate that the UU meta has reached a stage where everything is going to see a certain level of usage consistently, barring a sudden, massive shake up (like post-Crown Tundra). There were a few stragglers, but we'll get to them soon enough. But first, a brief rundown of the top performers:
  1. 1600982868148.png
    For all the hype rock doggo has been getting, in this study it was actually the bat- wyvern thing that consistently ruled the roost. Noivern was the only mon in this study to surpass a 20% usage rate. How come? Well, the name of the game is speed, and outside of Scarfers you won't get much faster than Noivern. With utility in Defog and U-turn, and a power level that's just sufficient enough that Vern can rely solely on Draco Meteor and Flamethrower for attacking, and you've got a damn good mon.
  2. 1600982893219.png
    Duskroc
    may have missed out on the top spot, but second isn't too bad. I don't think I need to tell you what this thing does (most of the thread does that job already). As good as it is, though, I think that its usage has seen an artificial spike due to the suspect test- with a likely ban right around the corner, people are unsurprisingly trying to get as much use out of this doggo while they can.
  3. 1600982908050.png
    As powerful as offense is in UU, a lot of the top mons in this study were those who provide a valuable defensive or support role. Geezing managed to just barely inch out Sylveon for the #3 spot, its most valuable qualities being its support options in Defog, TSpikes and Wisp and its solid Defense stat. Still, this thing is no slouch on the offensive threat, with Sludge Bomb and Fire Blast supplying important offensive pressure while also spreading status, with secondary STAB Strange Steam being an okay Fairy move.
  4. 1600982926102.png
    I first scouted Sylveon for my personal team in order to complement Slowbro while also providing Wish + Heal Bell support. As this study indicates, though, there's more to Sylveon than just as a Bro partner. It's likely not a coincidence that Sylveon placed this high when it is basically the perfect counter to the #1 mon in this study, taking minimal damage from Vern's Flamethrower and U-turn. It also bears a respectable offensive presence with boosted Hyper Voice dishing out consistent damage on some of the meta's biggest threats, even on defensive variants. While defensive is best, IMO, Sylv does also have a viable Specs set with just enough coverage to nail most of the tier.
  5. 1600982941069.png
    Washtom
    is Washtom; defensive support, pesky Scarfer, NP cleaner- this thing does a lot of things. Still, its high usage is impressive considering it has to compete for a team slot with Mowtom, who also put up quite a decent showing in this study; over 25% of teams used either Washtom or Mowtom. Placing this high in spite of total competition (you literally can't use both due to Species Clause) really goes to show how great Washtom is.
  6. 1600982952621.png
    Cobalion
    may not be the flashiest UU mon, but it has quite a few pros- the speed tier, being a Fighting type with anti-Fairy STAB, solid support options like Rocks, momentum in Volt Switch- there's quite a number of things Cobal does, and does well.
  7. 1600983027977.png
    Contrary to some fears I had when it first dropped to UU, Bisharp has proven quite a fine addition. As user Luirromen recently pointed out, Bisharp's Sucker Punch is a great option for revenge killing Duskroc (although rock doggo can still play around it at the cost of LO recoil). It also has several reliable tools like STAB Knock Off, anti-Fairy STAB and Defiant to punish the tier's Defog users. However, Sharp likely also appreciated the popularity of Araquanid during this study, as Webs help mitigate its biggest problem.
  8. 1600983010703.png
    I definitely expected Slowbro to do a little better in terms of usage, but it still cracked the top 10, and rightfully so. While Bro's defensive typing isn't as good as fellow physical wall Geezing, it makes up for that with insane levels of recovery and pivoting thanks to buffed Teleport. This dimwit can shrug off some scary physical attackers like Darmanitan and unboosted Terrakion, albeit crumpling to other physical staples; fortunately, Scald allows it to mitigate this issue somewhat. Pretty much the tier's de facto defensive pivot.
  9. 1600983036696.png
    Krookodile
    is kind of in an interesting place right now. A lot of top tier mons can shred it with minimal effort, it's Speed tier is only okay, and it faces some competition with other Dark types (or does it? More on that in a bit) Still, the croc just keeps on chugging, with Intimidate allowing it to help increase its team's physical fortitude, somewhat reliable Rocks and solid STAB combo + CC.
  10. 1600983054065.png
    Keldeo
    carves itself a distinct role as a Special Fighting type, with powerful STABs that more than make up for its lack of good coverage. Whether as a CM sweeper, Scarfer or Specs user, the offensive might of this pony is nothing to sneeze at.
Runners Up
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  • Despite seemingly having to compete with Krookodile, Incineroar has managed to hold its own in terms of usage, probably by virtue of being able to pivot.
  • As hyped up as its been, Zarude ended up falling just a tad short of the top 10 this study (in case you haven't noticed, the top spots have no lack of good Dark types). Still, it's a terrific mon in a vacuum, mainly seen this study as a Choice user.
  • Chandelure is another mon that likely benefits from the prominence of Araquanid, although its devastating Special power is more than sufficient to justify its usage.
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While I obviously don't remember every team formation, I did notice that a few mons tended to get paired together a lot. Araquanid + Bisharp were probably the most consistent core I saw, and it's not hard to guess why; Webs are great for Bisharp, compensating for its low speed and potentially allowing Defiant cheese on Defoggers. Honestly, I think Bisharp partly owes its high usage in this study to Araquanid specifically given how often the pair worked together. Another common core was Incineroar + Keldeo; I'm less sure as to why this core was so popular, although the two do have fairly solid type synergy, with Incin's Grass resist and neutrality to Fairy giving it an edge over Krookodile in the partnership. The defensive spectrum had a solid combo in Slowbro + either Sylveon or Chansey, providing walling potential for both sides of the spectrum. Finally, while not a traditional core, I did notice quite a few "dual-Dark" teams- that is, teams with multiple physical Dark types. You wouldn't think they'd have much synergy, but these cores were surprisingly successful in the matches I observed.

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Terrakion's level of usage initially took me off guard. Given how threatening this thing is, you wouldn't expect it to be hanging back in the usage ratings with the likes of Flygon and Tsareena. Given that the Duskroc test was occurring during this study, however, it's not too hard to figure out why Terrak's usage is so skewed; with Duskroc is probably leaving the tier soon, its usage was naturally going to be inflated during the test as players test it out and/or try to get as much mileage out of it as possible before he's gone. Simply put, most teams don't really need Duskroc and Terrak, and with added incentive to use Duskroc right now, Terrak was probably going to get the short end of the stick. Its usage should probably return to normal after Duskroc leaves.

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Alolawak is a little harder to explain in terms of its (lack of) usage. Sure, it still makes the cut off, but for all the hype this thing got it was easily one of the least used UU mons in this study, being the fifth least used UU mon. I think the problem here is that Alolawak is a more specific mon; to some extent you have to build your team around it. One trend I noticed with Alolawak is that it was usually paired with either a Web setter or on an "Obviously Trick Room" team; with its low Speed, Alolawak truly shines when its opponent has limited control over their own speed. Outside of those two archetypes, Alolawak seems to struggle for usage, possibly because of its weaknesses, mediocre stats and the ease with which it can be revenge-killed. This doesn't mean Alolawak is bad (viability and actual usage don't always correlate), but the study does suggest that the edgy boy isn't the most popular in the current meta.

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When you take into account the possibly inflated numbers, the bottom spots suddenly become a little less stable than the initially appear. Palossand, Slowking and Sharpedo all stand out with considerably less usage than their contemporaries. While I'll contend that Palossand still has its place in UU, it struggles to stand out in a meta where so many other defensive/utility mons have taken precedent, especially hurt by the coming of Slowbro, which is basically Sand but with pivoting and Regen (they both serve as defensive walls with a burning attack and even share several weaknesses). This is also more than true of Slowking; while the King managed to keep up in the early stages of the study, it gradually became clear which brother was the favorite. When you fill basically the exact same role as one of the most used mons in the tier, but are worse at dealing with the more threatening side of the spectrum, it's going to be a bad time for you. Sharpedo, meanwhile, has a much different reason for its low usage, seemingly poised to be a "wobbler": a mon that alternates between proper tier and BL because of the inherent all-or-nothing nature of its niche. Sometimes the meta will be more suited to its talents, sometimes it won't be. Still, at the very least none of these mons were as bad as-

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So, Kingdra was easily the weakest link in the study, having the (dis)honorable distinctions of being the only UU mon to not meet the usage cut-off (even with probable inflation) and the only UU mon to be outperformed by non-UU mons. Then again, this thing was always poised to be the weak link in terms of what dropped last month- without the OU-locked Drizzle, it simply can't compete with its only decent to mediocre stats, its weakness to some of the best mons and the sheer amount of competition it faces from other Water types. Trust me, if any mon falls off next shift, it's going to be Kingdra.

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As for those non-UU mons, none of them managed to reach the usage cut off in this study; still, I might as well highlight the best (as in most used) of them. The most used non-UU mon was Heracross, falling just a bit short of the cut-off; like Sharpedo, I think the beetle might end up being a wobbler. Cross' Guts boosted power or MoxieScarf set are definitely scary, it's just that it needs to compete with multiple top-tier mons as a Fighting type. Espeon was less expected; if I had to guess, I think Espeon's usage was mainly due to Magic Bounce, as Esp is the default best Bouncer without Hatterene around. Espeon is definitely not as good as Hat was due to its pitiful physical bulk and worse defensive typing, but it seems that it has carved itself a distinct niche among certain subsets of players. Lucario is versatile, capable as a SD or NP sweeper and really likes how big Araquanid is to ease its only okay Speed, but its typing forces it to compete with one of the most popular mons in Cobalion. Rhyperior saw a good amount of its usage this study on "Obviously Trick Room" teams, and it is a very good fit on that archetype thanks to great Attack, bulk to take common priority and STAB EdgeQuake; it saw usage outside of that style, but otherwise it was used rather sporadically in my experience. Slurpuff managed to get a little traction on HO screens teams, but I noticed that players especially liked pairing it with fellow BL mon Indeedee for that priority protection. I know some have also been championing Glowbro, but he didn't prove particularly popular during this study. Still, I'll admit my boy Golurk was done dirty in this study. Next time- nonbinary individual, next time.

On a lighter note, I thought I'd briefly highlight some of the more "interesting" picks I saw on the ladder. As was already mentioned in the usage stats, a few teams made the unusual decision to not bring a full team, including one guy who tried soloing with a Pyukumuku (it did not go well). You know how Incineroar and Obstagoon are in UU? Apparently some don't, seeing as I saw both a Torracat and a Ginoone. I witnessed a few hail teams, two of which used A. Vulpix as the setter. But my personal favorite would be a team that included the OP trio of Cubchoo, Seedot and Cleffa. Not Clefairy. Cleffa. .. Is it evil to say I genuinely want to see someone make a successful team with that core now?

Finally, to wrap up this really long (even by my standards) post, I just wanted to give a thank you to everyone whose games were observed in this study. Sure, a good amount of them were low-ladder players, but for as much as I joke the low-ladder is just as much a part of the meta as the more experienced players; contrary to what some might say, the lower-ladder is important to the tiering process because it does still contribute a lot to the actual usage stats. Whatever your choice for a teamslot (as weird as it may be) is, just go with whatever you feel comfortable playing. From experience, I can tell you that any mon could potentially screw you over if the opponent knows how to wield it, no matter how gimmicky it may seem. Except Comfey. UU Comfey is trash.

TL;DR: If this study is to be believed:
  • The UU meta is mostly stable right now, with usage mostly being expectedly divided between UU and not-UU mons.
  • The most likely mons to rise up next shift are Heracross, Espeon and Lucario.
  • Noivern is the most popular choice right now, with the top 10 being filled out by Duskroc, Geezing, Sylveon, Washtom, Cobalion, Bisharp, Slowbro, Krookodile and Keldeo.
  • Terrakion will be ecstatic once the Duskroc suspect is over.
  • Kingdra isn't very good. Sorry :(
  • I'm probably never making a post this long again. Thank you and good- day.
 
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Estarossa

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Very late but wanted to wait until I actually got reqs to post in this, sorry if this comes across as incoherent rambling.

I agree with the point people have made before, that on paper Lycanroc-Dusk is a lot more threatening than it is in practice, while it does get a decent amount of opportunities to get in through VoltTurn, Teleport, and Sacks, most of the time it tends to have to get a prediction right because of its absurd frailty allowing the various checks people are running to easily force it out after . Teams are often loading up on checks in the builder for it, just making these prediction scenarios worse, ie. the team I was using for reqs below, where you have both Doublade and Weezing-Galar, while it cant force out high HP slowbro because of Scald and Celebi has a Colbur if necessary too to stop Lycanroc forcing it out if something like a Bisharp isn't present which is more necessary to keep the Colbur for.

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The reality is that because of this heavy prepping in the builder, Lycanroc might not feel like the biggest deal to your teams a lot of the time, and as a balance player for instance I might find Bisharp or Damanitan way more annoying because I'm just so well prepped for Lycanroc.

There in lies the biggest issue in Lycanroc-Dusk for me though, that while you might not find it to necessarily be an issue a lot of the time thats because its often constricting teambuilding quite a bit by forcing you to run multiple checks to it on pretty much all teams no matter what playstyle, and even then Lycanroc still easily blows through you with good prediction no matter how many checks you load really unless you use niche stuff like Tangela or Mudsdale. The AoA set is definitely the most bothersome for me, with its ability to work around most of its checks and just smack them all with the right move like Iron Head.

This combination of just being one of the fastest Pokemon in the tier that massively pressures offensive stuff while having rather unreliable defensive counterplay that isn't hard to break through with one right turn feels too strong for me, and while it'd remove a powerful offensive tool for checking a lot of the metagame, banning it would really open up teambuilding a lot to remove it in terms of having a much wider range of viable scarfers, instead of just Zarude + rRock resistent ones, and not being forced into very repetitive Weezing + Doublade/Cobalion + Sylveon/Cobalion structures on all teams.

I plan to vote Ban because of this.
 
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So. With the next DLC coming out soon we will most likely be having multiple UU staples of the past couple generations returning among the confirmed mons that are returning. As such I'd like to promote some discussion on them.

The Good.

Nidoking


Nidoking has been a UU staple since gen 5. It does one thing and that one thing really well, it is a phenomenal wall breaker. One that I'm extremely excited to use once more. The two sets I see being uses most are AoA and SR + 3 attacks. This thing is gonna be a great offensive addition to the meta. It'll slam Sylveon, Doublade, Non-levi Weezing and Bronzong. And with its access to sheer force Boltbeam little will wanna switch in on this. I can see this becoming a staple of offense/HO due to it's ability to break so many crucial that stop other competent sweepers in there tracks. A/A+ tier definitely.

Nidoqueen

Nidoqueen will function very similar to King except bulkier, it'll be able to handle the likes of Terrakion, Coballion, Wak-A and such while also being one of the best and most consistent new SR setters in the tier. A- Tier Roughly.

Moltres

Acess to HDB will breath a new life into this mon. While it's cramped on by Terrak. It can run a good offensive set with Hurricane/Fireblast/U-turn that Zard only wishes he could run. Not too mention bulky Talonflame? Please this thing gets access to flame body with the new ability capsules meaning it's basically better than Talon in every single possible way. A-/A tier probably

Metagross

Metagross does what Meta gross has always done. Wallbreak, while also being an incredibly bulky steel type and a decent SR settee. Nice to have a new mon that beats Sylv/Weezing and with Thunderpunch it can do a decent dent to Bro/King as well. Lack of pursuit means also helps it a lot this gen. Not much to say other than its gonna be a solid mon overall. B+ tier.

Swampert

Bulky Water/Geound type. Good tank with great all around stats both defensively and offensively. Access to SR and not week to fighting/water like Perior. I could see this being one of the premier walls in UU but it still gets shat on by Lisk/Mow and hates the burn from Washtom. B tier

Raikou

The loss of hidden power sucks for Raikou but it also was gifted with Scald of allthings this gen. This means that it's at least not walled by most ground types and a lot of physical attackers don't wanna switch in on it either. I still think Lisk is better but only time will tell + maybe it can pull of a nice calm mind set. B/B+ tier

Crobat

Crobat is back and faster than nearly everything in the tier. Quad resistances to Fighting and bug, access to U-turn, Defog, Brave Bird, Nasty plot, Rssistance and super effective against Fairies. Most of All HDB making this thing an even better pivot then ever before? I could see this thing giving old Noivy a run for its money for most dominant fast flying type/pivot. Look out forthis mon, I could see it being one of the best. A+/S Tier definitely.

The Niche

Entei


HDB are very nice for this thing. It gets access to flash fire with all its moves now and can endlessly spread Sacred Fire to its hearts content. Still think Arcanine is better due to Tele + Intimidate and Arcanine is niche its self. Still I could see this finding its self some use especially on Sun Teams. C+

Articuno

Again HDB breathes new life into this thing and it also gets Hurricane now. With Freeze Dry and Roost + Toxic I could see it doing decent on offense or Stall but I don't see it doing too much. Still could fulfill a nice niche of a new offensive ice type. C tier

Aerodactyl

Fast, good offenses and access to SR and Taunt make it definitely decent. However theres no way it possibly breaks the Bro/Weese cores that plague the tier. Not too mention how frail this thing is. I could see a solid C+ tier.

Registeel

Stall Mon for the stalliest of teams but it'll do its job well. Stealth Rock + Seis Toss and Toxic though no reliable recovery hurts it. Still nice to have a new mon ththaththat can tank Noiv again I see around C+/B-
 
Gengar so close to dropping, but other than that none of the speculative drops were that close (Rhyperior close to rising to UU only though).

I think the metagame remains largely unchanged - Necrozma is a great addition but isn't going to fundamentally change the Sylveon/Slowbro/Zarude meta. I don't see anything too problematic right now, and with DLC around the corner, I think this is the meta that is going to stick for a while. November may have interesting drops since DLC comes out at the end of this month and may influence some fringe OU mons to drop based on end of the month usage, but the full DLC chaos drops won't happen until December.

The only thing I would consider problematic would be Quick Claw/Quick Draw Slowbro-G, since I don't know why that's even allowed, but I'm probably just salty from my loss to hs. But seriously, why is this allowed to be a thing?
 
Gonna do some shitty thoughts
Gengar so close to dropping, but other than that none of the speculative drops were that close (Rhyperior close to rising to UU only though).
None of the speculative drops were close however were closer to getting something like gengar. With 4.8% usage alakazam which will be busted as shit

I think the metagame remains largely unchanged - Necrozma is a great addition but isn't going to fundamentally change the Sylveon/Slowbro/Zarude meta. I don't see anything too problematic right now, and with DLC around the corner, I think this is the meta that is going to stick for a while. November may have interesting drops since DLC comes out at the end of this month and may influence some fringe OU mons to drop based on the end of the month usage, but the full DLC chaos drops won't happen until December.
Necrozma will definitely make terrain a bigger thing which will change the tier quite a bit. however, it will still be iffy due to the overwhelming monkey on every team

The only thing I would consider problematic would be Quick Claw/Quick Draw Slowbro-G, since I don't know why that's even allowed, but I'm probably just salty from my loss to hs. But seriously, why is this allowed to be a thing?
That's not problematic at all its just cheese that's too cheesy it's perfectly fine IMO, and is on the same level of cheese as focus energy/scope lens inteleon and kingdra even tho it's better. The only problematic thing rn is zarude which I definitely feel like deserves a test. Ok thanks for reading sorry for killing your brain cells
 

Moutemoute

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Hey I would like to take a moment to echo to BigFatMantis sentiments about Slowbro-Galar. I'm gonna split this post in two part, one to talk about Slowbro-Galar as a player and the other one as a member of the council. Let's not wait any longer and let's dive into it.

As a player I'll not hide the fact that I really dislike one thing about Slowbro-Galar and it's its ability Quick Draw, which combined with the gimmick item Quick Claw allows it to outspeed any Pokemon (bar priorities) 44% of the time which means on the paper it will move first about half the time. While some players may think that it's something similar to Scald burns (30% of the time) or Iron Head or Air Slash from Jirachi/Togekiss (60% of the time) where you're playing with the odds, I'd like to highlight the fact that moving first without taking into account the opponent speed is something really dumb because you can just lose some games because of this single thing. If you're getting the good odds while playing Slowbro-Galar with Quick Draw + Quick Claw, you can basically sweep a whole team if it doens't have a good way to handle Slowbro-Galar which isn't something easy because it has access to NP + some really wide coverage (mostly Flamethrower and Grass Knot). It also has access to both Psyshock and Shell Side Arm which kinda allows it to break through special walls. I've seen since a few days an increase of the use of Screens offense + Quick Draw-Claw Slowbro-G on the ladder but also on Underused Majors V where multiple games were ended by a Slowbro-G at +2 which got to move first multiple times in a row. I really don't like this part of Slowbro-G because it's definitively a skilless gimmick which can allowed any player to beat anyone as long as he's getting the good odds. Unlike 467 11 11p said I trully think Quick Draw-Claw Slowbro-G isn't something as CritDra or CritLeon because getting crits or moving first are two whole different mechanics which include really different ways to handle them. You can revenge kill Pokemon with Focus Energy with faster Pokemon and this is something you can't really do vs Slowbro-G without priorities if odds are agaisnt you. Obviously it's still considered as a gimmick because you need to get the good odds to make this thing really nasty and that's why I don't think we should act agains't it right now.

However, as a UU council member I can deny that this is something which could definitively be suspected because I trully think it can be considered as "uncompetitive". You can read by yourself this in the Tiering Policy Framework :

"elements that reduce the effect of player choice / interaction on the end result to an extreme degree, such that "more skillful play" is almost always rendered irrelevant. "

I do believe that Quick Draw-Claw Slowbro-Galar can be considered as uncompetitive because it really reduces the effect of player choice when you're battling against it because you may try to do the best play to deal with it / revenge kill it, you can still lose because your opponent got to move first. This issue has been rised and discussed since a couple of days between UU council members. Once again, I think we need to see how this whole thing evolves in the next weeks but be sure that the council has an eye on this possible issue and we don't want the tier to become a place where games end because X player won because Quick Draw/Claw has been activated the right time.

Slowbro-Galar @ Quick Claw
Ability: Quick Draw
EVs: 164 HP / 252 SpA / 92 Spe
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Sludge Bomb / Sludge Wave / Shell Side Arm
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Flamethrower / Grass Knot
 
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There was a bit of discussion in the UU Room today regarding "non-competitive" play. There were three things brought up that people were discussing as whether they should be banned or not. I just wanted to address each one:

1. Quick Draw/Quick Claw - As Moutemoute pointed out in the post above this one, it is very luck based and goes against the Smogon tiering policy framework. I have always thought this was not a strategy that should be allowed, even when Slowbro-G was in RU. Besides using Bisharp it's nearly impossible to counter if the QD/QC procs and there's not much at all you can do about it. The worst part, to me, is that it's not even a good strategy and Regenerator is far better. This means that you will likely lose more often than you will win, but the times you do win because of QD/QC is very unfortunate to the other player. Things don't need to be gamebreaking to be non-competitive - they just need to heavily luck based.

2. King's Rock Cloyster - This was also brought up, as King's Rock Cloyster is sort of non-competitive also. I don't think it's as bad as QD/QC, and I don't really have a strong opinion either way on this. I can see why it is aggravating, but so was Jirachi, and Jirachi was banned because of this PLUS the other things it had going for it. I'm not sure if Cloyster has those other things going for it. It's also different from QD/QC in the sense that you're not doing it solely to be cheesy - a Cloyster behind screens has arguably no better item than King's Rock right now (maybe boots). Again, I don't really have a strong opinion either way on this. By Smogon definition it is non-competitive, but not sure how much.

3. Evasion Items (BrightPowder) - I have no clue why this is allowed. It's so bad nobody even dares to use it (although it's possible you've lost to it on ladder before and never realized it and assumed you just had bad luck with Hydro Miss). If Evasion is banned, I don't know why an item that gives evasion is not banned. But this probably doesn't warrant a big UU discussion as it's not really a UU issue and more of a general Smogon overall issue.
 
There was a bit of discussion in the UU Room today regarding "non-competitive" play. There were three things brought up that people were discussing as whether they should be banned or not. I just wanted to address each one:

1. Quick Draw/Quick Claw - As Moutemoute pointed out in the post above this one, it is very luck based and goes against the Smogon tiering policy framework. I have always thought this was not a strategy that should be allowed, even when Slowbro-G was in RU. Besides using Bisharp it's nearly impossible to counter if the QD/QC procs and there's not much at all you can do about it. The worst part, to me, is that it's not even a good strategy and Regenerator is far better. This means that you will likely lose more often than you will win, but the times you do win because of QD/QC is very unfortunate to the other player. Things don't need to be gamebreaking to be non-competitive - they just need to heavily luck based.

2. King's Rock Cloyster - This was also brought up, as King's Rock Cloyster is sort of non-competitive also. I don't think it's as bad as QD/QC, and I don't really have a strong opinion either way on this. I can see why it is aggravating, but so was Jirachi, and Jirachi was banned because of this PLUS the other things it had going for it. I'm not sure if Cloyster has those other things going for it. It's also different from QD/QC in the sense that you're not doing it solely to be cheesy - a Cloyster behind screens has arguably no better item than King's Rock right now (maybe boots). Again, I don't really have a strong opinion either way on this. By Smogon definition it is non-competitive, but not sure how much.

3. Evasion Items (BrightPowder) - I have no clue why this is allowed. It's so bad nobody even dares to use it (although it's possible you've lost to it on ladder before and never realized it and assumed you just had bad luck with Hydro Miss). If Evasion is banned, I don't know why an item that gives evasion is not banned. But this probably doesn't warrant a big UU discussion as it's not really a UU issue and more of a general Smogon overall issue.
On the topic of Kings Rock Cloyster, theres a meme set with Kings Rock Alolan Persian which utilizes Beat Up. It can 1 (or 6 if you count each hit induvidually) HKO Blissey with Adamant + Technician.
 

Hogg

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Things have been a bit quiet as everyone has been focused on DLC2's release, but I wanted to provide an update. For those who have not been following the announcements forum, we will be seeing a turboshift on November 1 based on post-DLC2 usage, followed by a standard shift on November 15.

From a preliminary look at usage, DLC2 looks to be by far the largest shakeup UU has seen this gen, to exceed even what we saw during Home and DLC1's releases. While we obviously can't know for sure, it's reasonable to expect some really major shifts, with everything from A(egislash) to Z(ygarde-10%) likely to drop.

After discussing this with TDK and the council, we have decided that based on the sheer magnitude of the coming shift, we will essentially treat the period between November 1 and November 15 as a return to Alpha. In other words, on November 1, we will be freeing all of UUBL. In addition, our plan is to hold off on suspect tests and council votes until the mid-November shift. Once the mid-month shifts happen, we will assess the tier fresh from there.
 
Dracozolt Hype time!

Not to mention Scolipede, Primarina, Haxorus Lycanrock and possibly Rachi, Gengar, Aegislash, Venu and more.
Dracozolt got its hidden ability sand rush, so it’s used a good amount on sand teams in OU, I think it’ll rise. Also, Aegi still has a chance to stay OU, but yeah it’ll be nutty to run veil HO with scolipede, gyara, and many other mons. Also, I heard drizzle was getting unbanned, but I’m not too sure so could someone confirm it?
 
Dracozolt got its hidden ability sand rush, so it’s used a good amount on sand teams in OU, I think it’ll rise. Also, Aegi still has a chance to stay OU, but yeah it’ll be nutty to run veil HO with scolipede, gyara, and many other mons. Also, I heard drizzle was getting unbanned, but I’m not too sure so could someone confirm it?
They said drizzle was unbanned in UU Room, and they also did a tournament today with unbans + prospective drops + drizzle unbanned, so I think it's safe to assume it is unbanned.
 
They said drizzle was unbanned in UU Room, and they also did a tournament today with unbans + prospective drops + drizzle unbanned, so I think it's safe to assume it is unbanned.
Hmm? I am wondering, what mons are most speculated to drop from the first November shift? Are there any notable names that might be unexpected, ala Aegislash from the first Isle of Armor shift?
 
Hmm? I am wondering, what mons are most speculated to drop from the first November shift? Are there any notable names that might be unexpected, ala Aegislash from the first Isle of Armor shift?
Personally, I hate speculating too much, because I really truly and honestly don't believe we can say with absolute certainty what is dropping and what is not, but I think we will PROBABLY get some old things like Gengar/Alakazam/Primarina and a lot more that people stopped using in OU, but I think the much of the new stuff is being used more often so it may not drop right away, even though it's not super great in OU.
 
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