Metagame np: Stage 1: New Rules (Vivillon quickban post #173)

[Chloe]

Hi everyone! We finally have SV PU after waiting for
almost four months!! Finally it's our turn to have fun. The list of Pokemon beneath are Pokemon that got under 4.52% usage in NU last month, and hence available in PU. Feel free to discuss any happenings, trends, or notable mons in this thread!

PU Legal Mons

+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon | Percent |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| 44 | Hattrem | 4.509% |
| 45 | Rabsca | 4.463% |
| 46 | Carkol | 4.244% |
| 47 | Haunter | 4.233% |
| 48 | Glimmet | 3.998% |
| 49 | Houndoom | 3.892% |
| 50 | Camerupt | 3.844% |
| 51 | Morgrem | 3.805% |
| 52 | Cacturne | 3.762% |
| 53 | Crabominable | 3.556% |
| 54 | Perrserker | 3.506% |
| 55 | Oricorio | 3.467% |
| 56 | Rotom-Frost | 3.461% |
| 57 | Magneton | 3.457% |
| 58 | Skuntank | 3.423% |
| 59 | Pyroar | 3.153% |
| 60 | Indeedee-F | 3.147% |
| 61 | Sawsbuck | 3.013% |
| 62 | Quaxwell | 2.910% |
| 63 | Tinkatuff | 2.836% |
| 64 | Jumpluff | 2.704% |
| 65 | Eiscue | 2.515% |
| 66 | Squawkabilly | 2.222% |
| 67 | Flapple | 1.941% |
| 68 | Dugtrio | 1.811% |
| 69 | Gogoat | 1.801% |
| 70 | Leafeon | 1.576% |
| 71 | Ampharos | 1.545% |
| 72 | Vivillon | 1.532% |
| 73 | Lilligant | 1.516% |
| 74 | Toedscool | 1.438% |
| 75 | Falinks | 1.303% |
| 76 | Scovillain | 1.264% |
| 77 | Rotom-Fan | 1.221% |
| 78 | Electrode | 1.192% |
| 79 | Raichu | 1.178% |
| 80 | Flareon | 1.175% |
| 81 | Dedenne | 1.142% |
| 82 | Banette | 1.128% |
| 83 | Luxray | 1.062% |
| 84 | Fraxure | 1.061% |
| 85 | Murkrow | 1.052% |
| 86 | Misdreavus | 0.982% |
| 87 | Glaceon | 0.955% |
| 88 | Lycanroc-Midnight | 0.901% |
| 89 | Persian | 0.893% |
| 90 | Tropius | 0.885% |
| 91 | Sudowoodo | 0.774% |
| 92 | Frogadier | 0.760% |
| 93 | Wugtrio | 0.697% |
| 94 | Sneasel | 0.674% |
| 95 | Golduck | 0.660% |
| 96 | Pikachu | 0.656% |
| 97 | Wigglytuff | 0.650% |
| 98 | Delibird | 0.643% |
| 99 | Oricorio-Pa'u | 0.589% |
| 100 | Mareanie | 0.554% |
| 101 | Stonjourner | 0.551% |
| 102 | Dunsparce | 0.514% |
| 103 | Pincurchin | 0.496% |
| 104 | Swalot | 0.489% |
| 105 | Slaking | 0.473% |
| 106 | Beartic | 0.466% |
| 107 | Gabite | 0.380% |
| 108 | Raboot | 0.376% |
| 109 | Dragonair | 0.361% |
| 110 | Zweilous | 0.354% |
| 111 | Grumpig | 0.304% |
| 112 | Kricketune | 0.296% |
| 113 | Pachirisu | 0.293% |
| 114 | Gothitelle | 0.282% |
| 115 | Greedent | 0.274% |
| 116 | Seviper | 0.261% |
| 117 | Shroodle | 0.218% |
| 118 | Vigoroth | 0.216% |
| 119 | Pupitar | 0.216% |
| 120 | Oranguru | 0.199% |
| 121 | Hippopotas | 0.198% |
| 122 | Girafarig | 0.193% |
| 123 | Snover | 0.177% |
| 124 | Marill | 0.154% |
| 125 | Gumshoos | 0.143% |
| 126 | Flittle | 0.142% |
| 127 | Floragato | 0.108% |

https://www.smogon.com/stats/2023-02/gen9nu-1630.txt

 

[Eve]

First

Ok we all know Oricorios and Vivillon are silly and Haunter had no right to drop, I wanna talk about more interesting stuff


Crabominable @ Assault Vest
Ability: Iron Fist
Tera Type: Fairy (or whatever else you feel like)
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe (or whatever else you feel like)
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Hammer
- Close Combat / Earthquake
- Thunder Punch

This guy is just very silly to be honest. Way too hard to KO and way to easy to KO literally everything with it. To me, this is up there with the Oricorios and Vivillon as one of the big brokens. I haven't used him yet but from what I've seen he's been destroying everyone and winning every game so yeah use him with pivot support for free wins I guess.


Haters will say it isnt viable

Shroodle @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Encore
- Toxic / Poison Fang / Rain Dance
- Parting Shot

The anti-sweeper until everyone starts running Tera Dark on them and we have to ban them oops. Yes, its stats are bad, but they're just barely decent enough to do the things it needs to do. Encore Shuts down corios and Vivillons for clicking QD or Roost, and the shrew takes Haunter on pretty decently too unless the opponent is brave enough to just click Focus Blast outright. Knock Off punishes obvious switches and Parting Shot enables your own safe switches or forces Hattrem to btfo. Tera Dark makes you a bit less useless against Indeedee and lets you Encore Pa'u's Rev Dance in a dire situation. Rain Dance Shroodle is a cool option for rain teams which are, uh, really really scary. You can also use Murkrow for a similar role.



Wugtrio @ Choice Band
Ability: Gooey
Tera Type: Water / Flying
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Triple Dive
- Aqua Jet
- Stomping Tantrum / Tera Blast
- Throat Chop / Sucker Punch

This is basically a Swift Swim guy. Triple Dive invalidates Substitutes, Sturdy, whatever gimmicks you might try and throw at it, and in general this thing does a lot of damage, especially in Rain (though it's entirely functional and even great outside of Rain too). On Rain it's easy to just spam Tera Water Triple Dive and just claim 6 KOs because a lot of people aren't running a sturdy Water resist for some reason. Run Gogoat btw. This is my last warning.


Magneton @ Choice Specs / Choice Scarf / Eviolite
Ability: Any of them lol
Tera Type: Water / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Tera Blast
Answering Magneton is basically just praying, it's just unreasonably strong and its STABs provide great coverage against basically everything that isn't an opposing Electric (mostly poor longevity) or Camerupt (Tera Blasted gg). Very good breaker that also forms really annoying pivot cores or just brings in another breaker. Easily a top mon.

Other things I like:
Rain stuff. Don't forget the Wugtrio.
This is the tier's #1 glue. Rocks pivot that deals damage and is one of the only Steels is hard to pass up on, especially when it hits hard without investment too.
If you want a real defensive answer to Haunter and you aren't a Shroodle believer, this is probably your best bet. I've heard rumblings about Sp.Def Eviolite Girafarig too.
I'm not so sure about this one but there's a lot of relevant moves it immunes and then heavily punishes the users of, could be fun with a choiced set despite its very mid stats

 

[Pabloaram]

Haters will say it isnt viable

Shroodle @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Encore
- Toxic / Poison Fang / Rain Dance
- Parting Shot

The anti-sweeper until everyone starts running Tera Dark on them and we have to ban them oops. Yes, its stats are bad, but they're just barely decent enough to do the things it needs to do. Encore Shuts down corios and Vivillons for clicking QD or Roost, and the shrew takes Haunter on pretty decently too unless the opponent is brave enough to just click Focus Blast outright. Knock Off punishes obvious switches and Parting Shot enables your own safe switches or forces Hattrem to btfo. Tera Dark makes you a bit less useless against Indeedee and lets you Encore Pa'u's Rev Dance in a dire situation. Rain Dance Shroodle is a cool option for rain teams which are, uh, really really scary. You can also use Murkrow for a similar role

#ShroodleGaming
It's at least good in this HO meta. Maybe useleess whitout Haunter and the tons of setup mons in PU rn.

Volturn is rn one of the best playstile imo.
Perserrker + whatever volt switch user (+ parting shot shrooodle) is amazing with all the insane breakers this tier have.

Inside of the broken Houndoom and maybe Terra dark Falinks look annoying as heck.

 

[Yoshikitty64]

Fun Fact: The only gen 9 fully evolved mons in PU are Scovillain, Oinkologne, Squawkabilly, Rabsca, and Wugtrio.

also I’m so excited for Kricketune to be the only sticky web setter that’ll be so funny

 

[MasterPlayer]

First of all, Magneton, Haunter and Houndoom look broken. Secondly I don't think there's much hazard removal options in the tier outside of Quaxwell and whatever Oricorio form is allowed in the tier... or Delibird if you're desperate

 

[okispokis]

Quick predictions as to what the tier will look like, at least in terms of fully evolved Pokemon. Obviously haven't had a chance to test anything yet (and won't for a bit since I'm busy), but figured I'd underline what jumps out at me.


First big thing: Fire types are really strong and there are not a lot of resistances without Tera. Houndoom is probably the scariest because this tier is really pressed for Dark switch ins. Pyroar packs a really strong speed tier that lets it naturally scare out most offensive Pokemon. Scovillain under Sun was able to destroy my Goodra back in NU, and PU does not have a Fire resist as bulky as Goodra, plus Grass STAB invalidates everything bar other Fire types. Oricorio does Quiver Dance, potentially a mirror of its better forms in NU but with more exploitable weaknesses. Or..


That is, if the two Oricorio forms weren't literally the only fully evolved hazard removers in the tier! .. Literally the only fully evolved hazard removers in the tier! I wasn't convinced of Defog Oricorio back in NU because of how good Quiver Dance is, but here you might have to run Defog Corio just because of how lacking the options are. If you want Spin, your options are Quaxwell or Carkol, though the latter might actually be legit solely because of 4x Fire resistance. Finally, Hattrem can prevent hazards from getting up at all but has to run from Houndoom.


With these Fire types running around, there's only a handful of Water types. Of these, I'd say Golduck is definitely the best, especially since Cloud Nine can mess up manual Sun teams and brutalize Hound and Roar through Sun. Also gets Nasty Plot, which is nice. However, I think Wugtrio might actually be passable thanks to its speed tier, priority Aqua Jet and ability to bypass SturdySash.


So, PU literally only has two fully evolved Ground types left. That makes Electric spam very scary as the fast Raichu and Electrode can potentially spam Volt Switch; Raichu packs Surf to fold the rare Ground type that does exist, while Electrode naturally outspeeds everything. Now for the two Grounds, they look to be not that bad. Dugtrio's speed lets it set up fast Rocks or revenge kill things without boosted speed, while Camerupt gives you an extra Fire resist.


These two to me look like the best dedicated leads as both can set multiple types of hazard (Rocks + Spikes for Wood, Spikes +TSpikes for Cacturne), as well as priority in Sucker Punch. Sudowoodo can self-KO easily and thanks to Sturdy has the ability to run Custap, while Cacturne packs stronger Sucker and Water immunity to prevent Wugtrio from cheesing through its Sash.


Dedicated Fire killers are very important, and Lycanroc looks to be a fairly strong Scarfer in the Houndoom/Pyroar meta to revenge kill with perfect Stone Edges and other strong moves like CC in case the Fire type tries to Tera Steel or whatever. Also the most specially bulky Rock type, meaning it could MAYBE take a Fire move in a pinch. Sawbuck meanwhile can guarantee outspeed all Fire types in Sun and potentially revenge with Double-Edge or Tantrum, though it doesn't switch it at all obviously.


Thick Fat pretty much makes Grumpig the best Psychic type in the tier by default, leveraging Fire moves to set up Nasty Plot. Of course, Dark weakness does still hold it back, so probably want Colbur for sweeping sets. Though Indeedee-F isn't far behind as it can use Terrain to invalidate priority for sweeper teammates, and packs potentially key utility between Healing Wish and Trick Room.


Oh look, the only bulky Dark resist without Tera; Crabominable also resists Dark, but it's really only good versus Houndoom if the dog in Choiced. Rocks are nice utility and Wish means this guy is probably mandatory on bulkier teams.


If you just want to spread poison. Skuntank has priority and extra resists, though it's not really a Psychic answer anymore since Grumpig has Earth Power now. Swalot meanwhile packs more overall bulk, retains a Fighting resistance for Falinks and Crab and can use Encore to shut down sweepers.


Not much to say, I just think these three look pretty strong offensively. Want to beware the Fire types, but otherwise each one has solid attributes.


These guys all have potential but might need some tier adjustments to hit their peak. Being weak to Fire right now is not ideal, and Lilligant and Vivillon both need to be careful of Oricorio, though Lilligant could potentially make use of Scarf or Cholorophyll thanks to Healing Wish and Sleep Powder in the meantime. Perrserker, on top of the Fire weakness, generally doesn't match-up too well against a lot of the top threats, but it's Steel typing and movepool should give it a solid role once things calm. Revival Blessing means Rabsca will see some use, but it does need to be very careful of the Fire types. Stonjourner is a decent physical wall, but its non-existant special bulk means you're not using it as your Fire resist.


Also these two look a bit scary, won't dispute that.

 

[Low-Key]

DAY ONE TEAM WOOOOOOO

https://pokepast.es/da2366316fbd58a7
This is more of a VoltTurn HO team with most of the metagame's popular threats plus some inclusions of my own. The main strategy is again, similar to a VoltTurn team: get Perrserker to set rocks, then pivot into one of your stronger attackers like Indeedee or Crabominable. Volt Switch and U-Turn are always crucial parts of these teams too, so make sure to use them whenever you can. Oricorio is my Defogger cuz it's the only good one so far, having an additional Fire-typing which makes it REALLY useful with Revelation Dance. It's managed to win a few games so far so feel free to steal it if you want. Beware, as it is still a Day 1 team, it does have some issues, like being incredibly weak to Fire-types with huge type overlap, but as long as you manage to play it right and circumvent these issues it can be really strong.

Replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1811859512-7td0bihr6xml7v2gv0lg50h8j15819ypw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1811863417
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1811871640
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1811874390
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1811876753

(Yes, I know, this should be in a Team Bazaar, but since there is none right now I posted it here)

 

[MegaUltra]

Well, the tier came out 5 minutes ago and Viv is already busted. I dont even know what to say. But well, admist all this war, we are trying to have fun, and for that sole reason I came here to share my thoughts on the hottest mon we got: Midnight Lycanroc!

Scarf

Lycanroc-Midnight @ Choice Scarf
Ability: No Guard
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Play Rough
- Crunch

Scarf is faster than most stuff, but might face heavy competition from stuff like Jirachi at home.

Offensive SR

Offensive SR (Lycanroc-Midnight) @ Life Orb
Ability: No Guard
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Play Rough

Pretty good lead overall, hits other rockers pretty well (except for camel), and brings some good LO boosted CCs and Stone Edges into the game. The coverage and sheer power help to break down Mag, and little to no stuff resists Stone Edge

SD Loaded Dice

Lycanroc-Midnight @ Loaded Dice
Ability: No Guard
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Rock Blast
- Close Combat
- Trailblaze

Well, thats pretty much it. With Tera fighting you can trailblaze against some fire types while they use their coverage on you, like Dark Pulse, and you can outspeed then in the next turn. Can also SD on many switches, with its decent speed tier.

Theres also other sets from cool stuff like Dunsparce, Floragato, Leafeon. Have fun!
https://pokepast.es/bdb534242bb4365f

 

[TTK]

Hello fellow PUers, the one and only is back to main this tier again as long as it doesn't go down the route of SS. ANYWAY, ima share some teams and by some, I mean just two but for those who are too lazy for building or any other reason, I'll leave them here. In terms of my thoughts on this meta day 1, seems pretty fun so far. Some mons are certainly overtuned (Oricorio, Crab, Vivillon) but there's room for offence and BO from what I've seen so we aren't starved for variety.


Whoever posted that tier list saying Luxray will be a ZU goon, completely false slander and I will not stand for it. 2nd strongest Guts mon but it's faster than Flareon and is not weak to rocks without tera. I've been advised Trailblaze but truly, once you get an Agility you're pretty much impossible to revenge kill unless there's a Scarf Raichu or above speed tier and Facade kills everything that doesn't resist. Oricorio is Oricorio and Grumpig is my Crabominable copium, though Tera Fairy handles Houndoom pretty well. Overall, Grumpig is a good special wall and has good utility with TWave.


I think the Dragons are definitely under the radar mons rn and no one is considering them too much though it is only day 1 and they could pick up usage as time goes on but Flapple came to my attention since it hits very hard if it lands. Tera Fire screws over Tinkatuff and I am still considering whether to drop Grav Apple for Tera Blast but if I don't tera, Tera Blast is useless but anyway. Typical SV PU goons Oricorio and Grumpig, alongside Scarf Haunter because Haunter also is p good in this tier. Camerupt is one of our only like fully evolved rockers and also is a decent pick rn.

 

[incorolla]

I can't believe I'm saying this but FUECOCO is half decent. I'm terrible and made some bad plays but he's a tough nut to crack. Check out this replay where he brought the game back from 3-1 https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1812001010

 

[Haffling]

Lets goooo! PU Hype time


these guys are broken, and so are the funny qders we got. pau pau might be ok but it can just tera into a good type so we'll have to see.

this guy seems really storng, av sets and tr cb both seem solid.

these dudes are overstorm spaming for days, tera fairy to deal with dragons ig, it not getting sucker punch is kinda a yikes but it can slot tantrum, seed, or willo. kinda slow at only 75.

scary ban plz f miss gives it perfect coverage (ghost / fighting) and if it ever gets the chance to click np its p much over.

gonna leave it there for now, defo gonna make a post about some of the cool utility mons we got.

I only got 8 mons wrong on my og predict

bad day 1 team

https://pokepast.es/15379c49e29f75a2

 

[Yoshikitty64]

i don’t care what the government wants me to do i will be using surskit as a sticky webs lead

 

[WilhelmTheOkay]

In the speculation thread I made a post about Sun in PU (which i do think is pretty good). Now that PU officially live, there were some drops I honestly was not expecting that added some really nice stuff to this archetype.


Houndoom @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Bug
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Flamethrower
- Solar Beam / Sludge Bomb
- Nasty Plot

Houndoom is a very powerful special attacker with its 110 SPA, 95 SPE, and access to Nasty Plot. Houndoom also can provide a defensive niche on Sun teams by being able to not just switch in, but set up off of your opponent's boosted Fire moves. Also for Tera options, Grass, Steel, and Fairy are all great options but cmon now, if you have the chance to viably run Bug type you gotta take that opportunity.


Pyroar @ Choice Specs
Ability: Unnerve
Tera Type: Fire / Grass
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower / Overheat
- Dark Pulse
- Solar Beam
- Hyper Voice

Pyroar is faster and physically studier than Houndoom, but both its movepool and abilities are a bit lackluster in comparison. Nevertheless, under the Sun, Pyroar's combination of speed and power is essentially unmatched in the PU tier.


Hattrem @ Eviolite / Eject Button
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Dazzling Gleam
- Nuzzle
- Healing Wish

While not benefiting from Sun in any way herself, Hattrem's inclusion in PU makes Sun teams like an actual possibility because of Magic Bounce. Whether running the Healing Wish set above or a Calm Mind set, Hattrem is a massive boon to Sun teams in PU due to her ability to keep Rocks off, spread status, heal your sweepers, pivot in said sweepers, and oh my gosh she just does so much.


Flareon @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Trailblaze
- Facade
- Tera Blast

Flareon is the strongest Guts user in the tier with a massive 130 ATK and Flare Blitz. Flareon could also fill the defenisve niche I mentioned with Houndoom with Flash Fire but with some very nice special bulk and some useful status moves like Wish, Wisp, and Yawn. Unfortunately, Flareon is still slow and still lacks coverage and while Trailblaze does an admirable job patching those weaknesses, Flareon is still left as a rather slow starter. Also Flame Orb will only work if you Tera out of your Fire type so if you want to save the Tera for someone else, you are stuck with Toxic Orb which kinda does the whole candle burning the brightest dealio.


Also there's Oricorio who does Oricorio things but gets a Sun boost on Revelation Dance, pretty cool.

---
And one final set that's neat, but I don't want to make a separate post for:


Vigoroth @ Eviolite
Ability: Vital Spirit
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Body Slam
- Shadow Claw
- Bulk Up
- Slack Off

A surprisingly fast, sleep immune, bulky setup mon with reliable recovery. Shoutout to Game Freak for a making a middle evolution better than a final evolution despite a 230 BST difference.

 

[zoowi]

good day 1 team

Dugtrio @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Force
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge

get in vs something you scare and sub, if they switch proceed to make them regret life or go straight for the jugular, if they tera'd to tank you, then you made them reveal it with minimal loss to your own side - tera ground for that extra damage on eq to score some KOs that would otherwise handle it

Oinkologne-F @ Assault Vest
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Body Slam
- Stomping Tantrum
- Play Rough
- Thief

LA CHONKA
tired of houdoom making you cry? or pyroar? or something else special - LA CHONKA IS YOUR GIRL
i will let the calcs speak for themselves
252 SpA Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 132 HP / 124 SpD Assault Vest Thick Fat Oinkologne-F: 51-61 (12.6 - 15%) -- possible 7HKO <------ bro? bro u ok?
252 SpA Houndoom Dark Pulse vs. 132 HP / 124 SpD Assault Vest Oinkologne-F: 75-88 (18.5 - 21.7%) -- possible 5HKO

252 SpA Choice Specs Pyroar Fire Blast vs. 132 HP / 124 SpD Assault Vest Thick Fat Oinkologne-F: 76-91 (18.8 - 22.5%) -- possible 5HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Pyroar Hyper Voice vs. 132 HP / 124 SpD Assault Vest Oinkologne-F: 126-148 (31.1 - 36.6%) -- 72.5% chance to 3HKO

+1 252 SpA Oricorio Hurricane vs. 132 HP / 124 SpD Assault Vest Oinkologne-F: 142-168 (35.1 - 41.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

being able to spread status via a 300atk stab body slam is really hard to switch into and it does enough to 2hko (in some cases OHKO) any special fire/QD user you are likely switching into
coverage is crap on her but its enough to get the job done
stomping tantrum will do more to houndoom/pyroar but mainly its for magneton
thief is for the OHKO on haunter... not that i recommend trying to survive focus blast but you can tank 1
tera fairy to tank houndoom dark pulse if necessary because you don't need to tank fire any better then you do, and you can also use it to punish a cheeky crabominable/falinks by tanking in the coming fighting move with tera + bop with play rough
I have yet to try the other oink over this one because this one is serving me so well LA CHONKA - maybe put some speed on it? i dunno
pair with wish

Magneton @ Eviolite
Ability: Analytic
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Volt Switch
- Flash Cannon

secondary check to special threats, primary check to squawk and special threats involving sleep powder, volt to bring in sneasel or oink safely to finish off viv/jumpluff/lilligant - also use this against web leads to volt and bring in quax

Squawkabilly @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Guts
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Foul Play
- Final Gambit
- U-turn
- Parting Shot

meme but very fun meme - firstly, its the fastest mon in the tier bar weather, and final gambit with squawks decent hp (base 82) at full will allow you to trade 1v1 w/ pretty much anything including steel/bulky switchins including - hattrem, gabite, magneton, perrserker, camerupt, etc - the lack of ghosts really helps here - foul play if you need to chip damage something that you don't wanna uturn/gambit - if you start getting chipped uturn/parting shot still allow you to be a menace - copycat is also an option on this set - of additional note is you dont want intimidate because it ruins part of the sets surprise and it lowers the damage of foul play
you could easily trade this with a more usual-ish guts attacker squawk but i like this one for now
as for the tera, ghost is your best bet to tank a facade from some menace and retaliate with foul plays, however i never ended up attempting to do so, so there could be a better tera

Sneasel @ Eviolite
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Icicle Crash
- Tera Blast
- Ice Shard

oh man what to say about this guy
ice/ground stab with actual speed (sorry piloswine) is hideous and you can boost it even further with SD - somehow when sneasel has a type that doesnt suck you realize something: with eviolite it can actually tank hits, even super effective ones - go figure - one cheeky strat is to switch in on hattrem to tank psychic then tera to tank the incoming nuzzle and sd, shard is neccssary to pick off threat and scarfers, ice/ground is enough coverage

Quaxwell @ Eviolite
Ability: Moxie
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Atk / 96 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Rapid Spin
- Aqua Cutter

duck, the best spinner of the tier? certainly the bulkiest - theres not much to say about him besides you want brave bird for sure, liquidation is a fine option over aqua cutter, who really cares, the speed is for general purpose, other quacks, etc
surprising bulk
again i never ended up using tera on him but elec seems fine to tank a zappy zap move in an emergency while not losing to tera flying raichu (who is annoying)

importable
https://pokepast.es/5085bf1092ed74c6

 

[ausma]

prelim thoughts:

shroodle is crazy nice. good typing into the many grasses, and prankster utility between weather setting (rain/sun is near omnipresent), prio toxic/encore, pivoting with parting shot, and knock spam is stupid useful.

weather is pretty oppressive in general though, particularly sun with how many great abusers are around that take advantage of tera, and with how useful shroodle/murkrow are. houndoom has like 0 switch-ins in general and sun exacerbates that.

av crabominable is really useful esp w/ tera water, same with quaxwell. av crab hits like a bitch and can never really be knocked out in one blow, meanwhile quaxwell is great defensively, has spin, and can suddenly be a win condition in the right mus.

haunter feels like it's worse than it should be with all of the shroodle weather running around and how much its speed tier stings. i feel like it has the potential to be dumb later but it's been extremely underwhelming for me atm tbh.

 

[DaemonChop]

what are good sun setters? I know Houndoom and Scovillain are good sun abusers but I'm not sure who powers them well

 

[WilhelmTheOkay]

what are good sun setters? I know Houndoom and Scovillain are good sun abusers but I'm not sure who powers them well

Murkrow and Shroodle because they have Prankster which gives status moves like Sunny Day priority. Of the two Murkrow has the higher stats all-round and access to Haze while Shroodle has Toxic, Knock Off, Encore, and Parting Shot.

 

[Magnemite]

some initial thoughts:

obviously the hurricane dudes and houndoom are broken, no real need to say much about them.

magneton is absolutely ridiculous, the only volt immune that doesn't get annihilated by flash cannon on the switch is camerupt, which dies to tera water and also just isn't very good in general imo. it's really bulky with evio but also fast enough to outspeed most of the tier with scarf. it's really easy to get it in and once it's in it's a nightmare to deal with. obscene mon.

i know i'm biased but people are seriously underrating jumpluff. sleep is as broken as always, strength sap is as broken as always, and being a pivot that outspeeds most of the tier including all of the best mons is really useful. also, metas with broken setup sweepers are the best ones to abuse memento in. it's not the easiest to fit on a team since there are so many other good flying types, but it's really useful if you can find room for it.

i was expecting quaxwell to be the standard bad momentum drain spinner that is complete deadweight but it's surprised me with how good it is. it isn't gonna be taking strong neutral hits very well but its bulk is still pretty good, roost is a huge deal, and while it isn't exactly strong you still need to be careful not to let it get too many moxie + spin boosts because liquidation + bb is solid coverage and its attack isn't too bad.

ban vigoroth

 

[Melons-N-Soda]

Vigoroth @ Eviolite
Ability: Vital Spirit
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Slam
- Bulk Up
- Slack Off
- Substitute / Taunt

To piggyback off Mag here, this mon is actually really good. Its a rare mon where its got bulk, decent power, reliable recovery, AND Speed. That combo combined with Bulk Up and Body Slam make it a lot more scary than it might look. With Special Defense investment, Vigoroth can even tank hits that its 55 base SpD might not suggest otherwise. The reduced distribution of Knock Off helps it a lot as well.

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Hex / Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp / Substitute

Another solid NFE. Draining Kiss is a good addition to Missy's movepool that helps its longevity. I like Hex cause T-Spikes with limited removal is dumb and it also comboes with the paralysis also running around (*cough* Sawsbuck *cough*). WoW or Sub depends on what you feel like. Bulky spreads are probably preferred on this but I prefer this speedier spread.

 

[Magnemite]

Vigoroth @ Eviolite
Ability: Vital Spirit
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Slam
- Bulk Up
- Slack Off
- Earthquake

To piggyback off Mag here, this mon is actually really good. Its a rare mon where its got bulk, decent power, reliable recovery, AND Speed. That combo combined with Bulk Up and Body Slam make it a lot more scary than it might look. With Special Defense investment, Vigoroth can even tank hits that its 55 base SpD might not suggest otherwise. The reduced distribution of Knock Off helps it a lot as well. (EQ scares Tinkatuff and Shroodle out anyway)

If you want to not be fodder to Haunter, EQ can be replaced with like, I dunno, Night Slash? This thing also gets Encore and Taunt so have fun with that.

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Hex / Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp / Substitute

Another solid NFE. Draining Kiss is a good addition to Missy's movepool that helps its longevity. I like Hex cause T-Spikes with limited removal is dumb and it also comboes with the paralysis also running around (*cough* Sawsbuck *cough*). WoW or Sub depends on what you feel like. Bulky spreads are probably preferred on this but I prefer this speedier spread.

eq is definitely not necessary. taunt and sub are both much better than running a second attack. they have much more utility and beat the things that you'd want eq for anyway. subbing as shroodle or tinkatuff switch in stops anything they could do to you and also gives you a free turn, and vs a perrserker switching in you can just bulk up twice before it hits you and then slack off and keep setting up on it:

252+ Atk Tough Claws Perrserker Close Combat vs. +2 252 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Vigoroth: 136-160 (37.3 - 43.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

obviously the tier just came out and i haven't really had a chance to use or face it yet but i have trouble seeing how it could stay in the tier longterm. this tier looks to have a similar power level to oras pu where it got banned with 97% of the suspect vote (no this is not an exaggeration this actually happened) and since then it got two pretty huge buffs in tera and the loss of knock off from most mons, but we'll see how it plays out in practice i suppose.

 

[I am New]

Vivillon-Fancy @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Compound Eyes
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Hurricane
- Sleep Powder
- Tera Blast

Vivillon is an absolutely broken mon that needs to get quickbanned. My god. tera ground completly flipps ur matchup vs stuff like perrserker and scarf pyroar and houndoom. it can take a single hit since it loses its weakness vs fires. Also it gets a complete IMMUNITY to electric and can threaten an OHKO vs electrics of the tier- electrode and scarf raichu. Also u just DOMINATE one of its best checks in specs sleep talk magneton unless they tera. Super broken. The tier's special walls are not the sturdiest either. AV perrserker is 66.6 percent chance to get ohkod after rocks and wigglytuff gets 2 shotted easily aswell. Oricorio is good but it has to 50-50 vs sleep and qd. sp.def mag just gets kod by tera blast.

So now we look at "faster" revenge killers. Vivillon outspeeds Electrode after a qd so u need scarfer to outspeed or priority. Scarf slaking pyroar houndoom and sqwaquabily are good checks. however none of them bar sqwaquabily likes to run scarf. pyroar likes the brutal specs houndoom likes boots plot slaking is niche and DOESNT want scarf. even sqwaquabily likes to run the brutal cb hustle or guts flame orb.

Next is Strong priority. we have Banette cacturnr houndoom and skuntank sucker punch. which is pretty good but the best user of them houndoom doesnt really run sucker punch that often. unless its cb tera dark banette or life orb cacturne its not gonna ohko even then its a role vs a mon with quiver dance. its very inconsistent. Priority is very much one of the best ways to stop vivilon from sweeping u.

The last option is to stop it from setting which is a mixed bag. mons like taunt houndoom just deal very well while electrics struggle vs tera ground.


This shows that vivillon is one of the best mons in the tier. Even if it somehow doesnt get banned this month itself. Its a very strong mon. It has flaws but they are minor and even then it CAN adapt vs those.

 

[Fuyuki_Tokyn]

why is my little drakloak out of the list of mons in the tier?
been testing it and it could honestly be the best ghost type in the tier, bulkier than haunter but much more passive too, with so much less damage output
second fastest will-o-wisp on the tier, only losing to pyroar and dragon tail is a good option against the quiver dance sweepers
i feel like negating rapid spin is really important on this tier since there's close to no defog users and drakloak is a really good spin blocker

 

[Skankovich]

Good to be back! Things are obviously a mess right now so I'm just going to dump the first team I've built and been using. I've come around to building TR as my first teams for these early tiers because it preys on the HO that usually dominates at first, and it was particularly appealing here because we got stuff like Crab and Rabsca that offer a lot to the playstyle.

Replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1812279333
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1812263003-3nuixssievzg5xhpec2elkkleu24yq8pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pu-1812259532-inh00kf7b1ztrvit0rpvb6zg86c8qsspw

Crabominable @ Life Orb
Ability: Iron Fist
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Drain Punch
- Ice Hammer
- Thunder Punch
- Close Combat

Obvious first pick is broken crab. Not much to elaborate on lol it nukes everything. Ran a bulk up/amnesia set first but tbh may as well just AOA.


Rabsca @ Throat Spray
Ability: Synchronize
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Revival Blessing
- Bug Buzz
- Psychic

Hit very hard with throat spray'd STABs, set up TR on basically anything neutral with very solid bulk and revive teammates. Revival Blessing along with Hattrem's Healing Wish enables a kind of recklessly offensive approach to your play which is hard for teams to deal with.


Oranguru @ Leftovers
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Tera Blast
- Trick Room
- Nasty Plot
- Psyshock

Fat with few weaknesses, sets up on basically anything neutral, particularly on the special side with 90/110 bulk. STAB Tera Blast makes this a flexible set that's very annoying to answer, especially with tera Fighting flipping your weaknesses and hitting the only resists to normal/psychic super effectively.


Hattrem (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick Room
- Healing Wish
- Psychic
- Reflect

Stops hazards getting up, clicks TR and then healing wish in 90% of matchups. It just does its job like...


Stantler @ Eviolite
Ability: Sap Sipper
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake
- Zen Headbutt

Was very reluctant to try this because base 85 speed on tr is lol but it's actually ended up pretty integral. Its bulk backed with eviolite and only one weakness (crucially no dark weakness that every other setter suffers from) means it's a safe bet to get TR up on near enough anything, hits hard off the bat with Double Edge and EQ is great coverage. ZHB is just there for our floating ghosts and there's nothing else to run really. Oh and Sap Sipper gobbles up sleep powders as well as giving a boost lol! I think this is worth trying on non-TR teams actually, its speed, bulk and immediate power with Double Edge should be cool.


Flareon @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Wish
- Flare Blitz
- Double-Edge
- Protect

Isn't even good but I just wanted something to eat fire nukes and to a lesser extent be a steel resist. Ripe to be replaced!

Here's to a fun and less broken future for the tier!

 

[Wapf]

Considering the best fairy type is wigglytuff, I could see banded fraxure (or flapple if you have balls of steel) being a threat again. Outrage go brrrr.

 

[MasterPlayer]

What safely handles Crabominable? Because both STABs hit incredibly hard and Tera can make it even tricker to deal with