One of many posts calling foresight ‘fear mongering’ yet if u ask these kids to post elo after claiming to have ‘piloted w ease’ and ‘cleaved thru the ladder’ like greninja guy and other claim, no screenshot above 1700 will be produced I guarantee you. We have already seen a metagame develop into hyper centralized slosh after a former ice dragon got banned, just look at post bax meta with an overwhelming number of lu gking zap clicking momentum moves until eventually gambit swept. Please do not conflate your average player’s lack of foresight and ability to deduce logically with a hopeful curiosity that ‘maybe the meta will get better w more bans’. Notice how sub protect kyurem rose for only a period due to the bea tink cind team with sufficient removal to sustain it becoming popular during cycle one, then my edit of the blim team also became popular with corv cind double removal. However with offense going back on the rise it really snuffed out sub tect kyurem usage because A. It hits too soft and cannot trade with offense and B. Rocks plus a strong mon to force it out once strips it of its bulk advantage. Not to mention several drawbacks such as it requiring tera to have muscle and longevity, and that using protect vs offense is simply one of the most costly things a fat structure can do (this set is difficult to build around and mostly fits on fat). Now for the ban toters flexing their mediocre unoriginal teams such as the one gren guy posted which is standard stall w a rock weak guy for other fat but further exacerbates offense mu, and the ausma team which is basically empo offense with lokix over val, you guys are not making the argument you think you’re making. These structures are established and u can throw a high floor set such as kyurem on there and thrive in the 1500, sure, but let’s see you try that vs any decent player let alone tour player. Kyurem has a very high floor and is easy to use vs players with less experience or awareness on how to gameplan around it, sure, but it also has devastating drawbacks that hold it back from what bax used to to. The special sets need to tera to muscle past special walls such as gking and molt(can’t even muscle), while choiced or non boots sets struggle vs rocks on offense. Bax used to have boots and band had virtually no switchins while keeping priority vs offense, but specs has neither the prio for offense nor the breaking power vs fat. I urge the voters to think for themselves, why has the meta ‘chosen’ new threat upon new threat after each subsequent ban? Could it be that the metagame adapts and each new environment is suitable for a new threat to emerge? Surely banning more mons wouldn’t lead to more bans due to shifts in the meta due to the irreplaceable niches they provide being removed? Notice how the only fire bug type able to resist kyurem’s dual stabs and force it to either run physical and not greedy mixed and completely eradicate sub tect being gone made certain sets seem situationally cheap. But banning more mons with unique niches wouldn’t cause unforeseen circumstances to ‘fear mongering’ mongerers, sure.
The argument to ‘ban the next threat when it comes’ is myopic and irresponsible because you relinquish the responsibility have to think ahead for now and just pile on the burden of discretion further down the line, but as the greatest builder this generation has seen, I’m telling you, I will take on that burden and lay out exactly what would happen with each metagame shift, as I have done for every shift.
Centralization is one of the banes of a healthy meta, and with diversity compromised after the two mostly unnecessary bans post spl where diversity flourished, I fear further bans will lead us down a road of centralization, and this is a visceral, realistic fear, call it mongering if you will.
In addition, to those citing the high rate of approval for the previous two bans: low requirements is something iv always complained about. ‘You may be better than me but that doesn’t make you more right than me’ is not the argument you think it is. The pedestrian opinions of the general public is in fact one of the Achilles heels of democracy, which is why we have representative democracy. In simpler terms, if the collective opinions of average people were so accurate, you wouldn’t go to a doctor for a professional opinion, just ask uncs at the family reunion what their stance is on vaccination.
Here I’m offering expert opinion at your discretion.
Love,
Goat
“One of many posts calling foresight ‘fear mongering’ yet if u ask these kids to post elo after claiming to have ‘piloted w ease’ and ‘cleaved thru the ladder’ like greninja guy and other claim, no screenshot above 1700 will be produced I guarantee you.“
First off, cool it with the elo shaming. Secondly,
Did you not watch the whole replay my G?
Thirdly, foresight is still fearmongering of the possible future. You’re making an educated guess on what will happen after a mon is banned. As
Shaymin Sky pointed out, the DLC1 meta with ZapKingLu is 3 months old, barely any time has passed and it was established late into DLC1. Take a look at DLC2. We started with Skarm/Meow/Ting teams before moving on to Waterpon + Lando offenses, HO has gone through changes, Balance started using Molt, Sinistcha, Tinka, Zapdos, etc that were unthinkable at the start of the meta. DLC2 has gone on for twice the length of DLC1.
If you’re worried about the tier suddenly being overtaken by Fat, don’t. We have plenty of ways to break balance that I mentioned earlier.
“However with offense going back on the rise it really snuffed out sub tect kyurem usage because A. It hits too soft and cannot trade with offense and B. Rocks plus a strong mon to force it out once strips it of its bulk advantage. Not to mention several drawbacks such as it requiring tera to have muscle and longevity, and that using protect vs offense is simply one of the most costly things a fat structure can do“
Oh offense is rising again, I wonder why, maybe its because subtect kyurem and kyurem in general is so ruinous to balance structures that players started gravitating towards offense. Rocks are also not that hard to deal with for Kyurem teams, specially since some rockers like Lando and Tusk are Kyurem snacks. Tera’ing Kyurem is worth it if it means you get 2-3 kills minimum vs slower structures.
“Now for the ban toters flexing their mediocre unoriginal teams such as the one gren guy posted which is standard stall w a rock weak guy for other fat but further exacerbates offense mu“
Ayo, you can say whatever tf you want about my teams, but don’t diss another builder’s skills. Kyurem being so broken vs balance means I can just run 5 stall mons that have a net positive matchup vs offense.
“The special sets need to tera to muscle past special walls such as gking and molt(can’t even muscle)“
And that’s fine because again, Tera Ground is perfect for Kyurem, eliminating its SR weakness while gaining a solid defensive typing. Plus every Grass/Water is afraid of Freeze Dry so who cares? Also yes, Kyurem can muscle past these threats with something called freeze. This is usually a non-factor but Kyurem can generate freeze often because it has a 32 PP and three Freeze Drys have a 27% chance to proc freeze to quote
Pinkacross , close to the same % as Static, Flame Body, and Scald. Those odds are very doable against these walls constantly switching in, and once they do get frozen, you’re unlikely to thaw out and you lose a Kyurem check.
Keep in mind this whole time I’ve only talked about Sub-tect. What if its Mixed DD, or full phys DD, or Specs? In theory you can figure that out through team preview, but now ppl are plopping DD Kyurem onto non-HO structures cause players don’t expect it.
I respect you and it is fine to not want Kyurem banned, but voice your thoughts in a civil manner. Don’t want drama in the suspect thread again.
or 
drop, 
without like 3 boosts, but that isnt a lot since its a bliss, and if 
, but ngl its probs just gonna be mid, since all it does is be another spinner that exists. and is pretty fast.
invalidating anything slower than offense, since only HO and BO can actually do anything to 
/
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is not a valid answer.
