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NP: UU - Silent Night
- Thread starter reachzero
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I know I'm destroying this wonderful conversation, but does anyone use Raticate?
I use an SD Guts set, and it sweeps teams. It's incredible.
I use an SD Guts set, and it sweeps teams. It's incredible.
Quick Feet Jolly Ursaring does the same thing, but better IMO. Its slightly faster, you get the jump on Mismagius, Scyther and Dugtrio, and it gets Close Combat, so you aren't hopelessly walled by Steel Types.
can we please stop talking about shitty nu pokemon and talk about trends in the metagame and how to capitalize on said trends and so on? nobody cares that you got to 1500 with a team that had pidgeot on it.
OKAY here are some super sexy pokemon that i am loving in this metagame:
WEEEZING: holy shit weezing + milotic is the best core for any team right now. weezing by itself is close to jesus, but weezlotic is a really amazing glue for offensive and defensive teams alike. milotic easily covers half the metagame, and what it doesnt cover (grass) is easily beaten by weezing. it obviously has its weaknesses (manectric, exeggutor, mismagius), but they can be covered by another member of your team rather easily. choice band spiritomb also works pretty well with that core. weezing is also the only full stop to all venusaur. the spread is calm 252 hp 252 sdef, of course, and you'd be surprised at what it can stop; virtually all bulky pokemon can't break through it (milotic, registeel, spiritomb, clefable). rest / sleep talk / sludge bomb / will o wisp and the aforementioned spread is the only set you should be using, since it absorbs venusaur sleep powders like a pro. a lot of top players have been utilizing weezlotic to great success.
MiLtAnK: fuck what a beast of a pokemon. make sure hitmons and rhyperior are dead and you should be having a field day. make your opponent think his rock / fighting type is useless (pack pokemon that capitalize on whenever said pokemon switches in.), then send out miltank late game. i use 252 hp 252 sdef careful, just to make it harder to ko me with some curses under my belt; lo timid venusaur is managing only 70% with leaf storm, and milotic is only doing a meager 25%. she is also great to support a team that has trouble with status, or carries multiple restalkers, because heal bell is a really great asset. though i really prefer to save it until late late game and then bring i out, lest they try to save their miltank counter.
exeggutor: this thing hits hard as fuck. 383 special attack, and a 140 bp stab mean that you are going to have a tough time switching in. that's doing 85% to clefable and ohkoing spiritomb. psychic is also ridiculous, ohkoing fire types and grass types easily. hell, it's even doing 80% to mismagius. the best part is that every time they bring out their bulky water (save ice beam milotic with 210 or more speed), free switch, free nailing of something. same goes for hitmontop or lee. registeel is a pretty hard counter to it, but registeel is a free switch and fodder to a ton of pokemon-rhyperior, hitmonlee, arcanine, etc.
mismagius lead: can you say "great anti lead"? easiily beats all the pixies through taunt + shadow ball, can burn half a team or take a free ko with will o wisp and destiny bond respectively, beats all spike leads (payback + ice shard glalie?), and can be an offensive force mid game. i use life orb, you can use whatever the hell you want. i posted the set in qc, so check it out there if you want, but damn is this a great lead. pair it up with arcanine or something because missy does a great job at stopping rocks and luring in registeel (who i like to taunt first, then burn; if i'm carrying destiny bond, taunt, thunderbolt until i am in the kill range of another iron head, destiny bond.) try out this lead-it won't disappoint.
also i suggest toxic on registeel as your status of choice; nail donphan / rhyperior / hitmonlee as they come in, thus making them far less effective. thunder wave just isn't that great.
OKAY here are some super sexy pokemon that i am loving in this metagame:
WEEEZING: holy shit weezing + milotic is the best core for any team right now. weezing by itself is close to jesus, but weezlotic is a really amazing glue for offensive and defensive teams alike. milotic easily covers half the metagame, and what it doesnt cover (grass) is easily beaten by weezing. it obviously has its weaknesses (manectric, exeggutor, mismagius), but they can be covered by another member of your team rather easily. choice band spiritomb also works pretty well with that core. weezing is also the only full stop to all venusaur. the spread is calm 252 hp 252 sdef, of course, and you'd be surprised at what it can stop; virtually all bulky pokemon can't break through it (milotic, registeel, spiritomb, clefable). rest / sleep talk / sludge bomb / will o wisp and the aforementioned spread is the only set you should be using, since it absorbs venusaur sleep powders like a pro. a lot of top players have been utilizing weezlotic to great success.
MiLtAnK: fuck what a beast of a pokemon. make sure hitmons and rhyperior are dead and you should be having a field day. make your opponent think his rock / fighting type is useless (pack pokemon that capitalize on whenever said pokemon switches in.), then send out miltank late game. i use 252 hp 252 sdef careful, just to make it harder to ko me with some curses under my belt; lo timid venusaur is managing only 70% with leaf storm, and milotic is only doing a meager 25%. she is also great to support a team that has trouble with status, or carries multiple restalkers, because heal bell is a really great asset. though i really prefer to save it until late late game and then bring i out, lest they try to save their miltank counter.
exeggutor: this thing hits hard as fuck. 383 special attack, and a 140 bp stab mean that you are going to have a tough time switching in. that's doing 85% to clefable and ohkoing spiritomb. psychic is also ridiculous, ohkoing fire types and grass types easily. hell, it's even doing 80% to mismagius. the best part is that every time they bring out their bulky water (save ice beam milotic with 210 or more speed), free switch, free nailing of something. same goes for hitmontop or lee. registeel is a pretty hard counter to it, but registeel is a free switch and fodder to a ton of pokemon-rhyperior, hitmonlee, arcanine, etc.
mismagius lead: can you say "great anti lead"? easiily beats all the pixies through taunt + shadow ball, can burn half a team or take a free ko with will o wisp and destiny bond respectively, beats all spike leads (payback + ice shard glalie?), and can be an offensive force mid game. i use life orb, you can use whatever the hell you want. i posted the set in qc, so check it out there if you want, but damn is this a great lead. pair it up with arcanine or something because missy does a great job at stopping rocks and luring in registeel (who i like to taunt first, then burn; if i'm carrying destiny bond, taunt, thunderbolt until i am in the kill range of another iron head, destiny bond.) try out this lead-it won't disappoint.
also i suggest toxic on registeel as your status of choice; nail donphan / rhyperior / hitmonlee as they come in, thus making them far less effective. thunder wave just isn't that great.
Thanks. On the Weezing matter, I've been finding Max HP/SpDef Tomb to be a great addition in place of CB, as I can constantly switch into the mons you mentioned, survive attacks life Leaf Storm from Exeggutor (probably the biggest bane of this combo) and KOing it back with Dark Pulse, meaning I don't have to worry all that much if I get burned in the switch-in and not being fodder for anything that resists Dark/Ghost (especially because Absol is rather bitchy to that combo, as Weezing cannot take on Psycho Cut and isn't fond of eating Night Slash with no defensive investment). Also, I think Weezing should be Bold to take on Double-Edge Leafeon and Return Venusaur better.
Milktank's always been a whore, but I never had all that many problems with Haze. Maybe it's time to test it with so many people running Toxic on their Milotics. Finally, Low Kick/Boom are great anti-metagame moves.
Eggy is an effing truck nuff said. being outsped by a fair amount of Milotic isn't that appealing to me though.
Missy's awesome.
Milktank's always been a whore, but I never had all that many problems with Haze. Maybe it's time to test it with so many people running Toxic on their Milotics. Finally, Low Kick/Boom are great anti-metagame moves.
Eggy is an effing truck nuff said. being outsped by a fair amount of Milotic isn't that appealing to me though.
Missy's awesome.
Used that core in the last Metagame and it worked already fantastic there.
Although i think Bold is better than a Calm Nature for Weezing.
Umbreon made that combination perfect and nearly impenetrable.
Now that Umbreon is gone Chansey, Registeel or Spiritomb can be used to eliminate the few mentioned threats to this combination.
@Miltank: I never get why people tend to use a Curse-Set with her. She has 70 SDef AND 100 Basespeed - not very perfect for a Curser. With a Curse-Set you give up her good speed und utilizes her - well crappy - Special Defense.... Thuis just isnt very logical for me.
Cradily or Regirock in Sand or even Venusaur/Registeel should work much better as a Curser from my point of view.
Oh im just wondering but why isnt Regirock used more? I dindt play much in this Metagame but it is a good tank, which provides the ever so useful SR and has some offensive prowess too - a simple Set consisting of SR, Rock Slide, EQ/Hammerarm, Explosion with the item Leftovers/Passho Berry should work wonderful.....
Seconding this (for the XXXth time). No one in their right mind would switch Stuff like Mismagius, Leafon, etc. in Registeel.
1.) i am literally just using bad ass theory team now (missy/regi/eggy/miltank/weezing/houndoom) and it works pretty much perfectly. exeggutor is really the mvp of the team and certainly underrated
2.) that being said, i sometimes miss thunder wave, i won't lie - toxics inaccuracy has been a big turnoff lately and twave still has general power just nullifying switch-ins like houndoom/blaziken/moltres if they don't expect it - i know toxic does too, but id rather these dickholes be slowed down than slowly worn out with toxic.
2.) that being said, i sometimes miss thunder wave, i won't lie - toxics inaccuracy has been a big turnoff lately and twave still has general power just nullifying switch-ins like houndoom/blaziken/moltres if they don't expect it - i know toxic does too, but id rather these dickholes be slowed down than slowly worn out with toxic.
hey nice team there bad ass, i tried it but i stink at any other type of team other than balanced spike stacking, so I didn't do to well with it, but nice job, very anti-metagame. But now that you posted that, everyone's gonna run that, so I'm gonna have to stick a mixken on my team somewhere because a mixken with excellent prediction (superpowering miltank, hp milotic, fire blasting everything else) looks to be the best bet for taking down that team. But otherwise nice team.
Oh, and for everyone ragging on awesome pluff, yeah it gets stopped by some stuff like recovery, encore, taunt (if jumpluff got taunt >_<), that's why there's 5 other team members. Pokemon is a team game, and something like mixken could take down half that stuff or more. Now I'm gonna go make me a mixken/jumpluff based team.
Oh, and for everyone ragging on awesome pluff, yeah it gets stopped by some stuff like recovery, encore, taunt (if jumpluff got taunt >_<), that's why there's 5 other team members. Pokemon is a team game, and something like mixken could take down half that stuff or more. Now I'm gonna go make me a mixken/jumpluff based team.
Yeah, I agree with Conflict and Bluewind that Bold is better on Weezing. Min Def is still higher than max SDef, so you get more stat points that way.
I like Weezing; however, I am really frustrated by its unreliability against Swords Dance Venusaur. Against the average player who Sleep Powders first turn, you get three chances to hit with Will-O-Wisp with Sleep Talk before the opponent is at +6, which is further reduced if you wake up early. Against the player who Swords Dances first, you get two. Is it the norm to carry a secondary Venusaur check, or do most people who run Weezing just attempt to stave Venusaur off with it?
Secondly, again agreeing with Conflict, Miltank kind of sucks at taking special hits. Why not use Chansey, Kangaskhan, or Clefable (the latter has Calm Mind if you want to be a stat booster as well)?
That aside, I was surprised by an LO Miltank set. I tested it and found its power underwhelming; however, I've heard of people using it to great effect (and someone used it to KO my Moltres with Rock Slide). Base 100 Speed is great for outspeeding base 95 stuff like Arcanine (one of the main things I liked about it while using it) as well as Moltres, Rotom, etc.
I like Weezing; however, I am really frustrated by its unreliability against Swords Dance Venusaur. Against the average player who Sleep Powders first turn, you get three chances to hit with Will-O-Wisp with Sleep Talk before the opponent is at +6, which is further reduced if you wake up early. Against the player who Swords Dances first, you get two. Is it the norm to carry a secondary Venusaur check, or do most people who run Weezing just attempt to stave Venusaur off with it?
Secondly, again agreeing with Conflict, Miltank kind of sucks at taking special hits. Why not use Chansey, Kangaskhan, or Clefable (the latter has Calm Mind if you want to be a stat booster as well)?
That aside, I was surprised by an LO Miltank set. I tested it and found its power underwhelming; however, I've heard of people using it to great effect (and someone used it to KO my Moltres with Rock Slide). Base 100 Speed is great for outspeeding base 95 stuff like Arcanine (one of the main things I liked about it while using it) as well as Moltres, Rotom, etc.
eo, i think a secondary check is definitely needed, as weezing will also be taking fighting attackers and other sweepers too - i think registeel/weezing is the best combination of defense i have been using since it counters the main threats to any team (just throw in a bulky water or a faster sweeper for fire types).
with just a weezing as your main check to these pokemon, you really start having trouble since they can just sac 1 sweeper to get their venusaur or something fully set up (or vice versa, sac their venusaur to severely damage weezing and then bring in a hitmonlee or something).
with just a weezing as your main check to these pokemon, you really start having trouble since they can just sac 1 sweeper to get their venusaur or something fully set up (or vice versa, sac their venusaur to severely damage weezing and then bring in a hitmonlee or something).
One easy, cool combo is to use SD Leafeon with Baton Pass (SD/Leaf Blade/Double-Edge/Baton Pass) with LO Arcanine.
It handily beats the combo (if you BP while Weezing tries to WoW/FireBlast/Flamethrower you) and Arcanine and you're left with a very powerful Arcanine (Extremespeed just makes everything worse for the enemy).
It handily beats the combo (if you BP while Weezing tries to WoW/FireBlast/Flamethrower you) and Arcanine and you're left with a very powerful Arcanine (Extremespeed just makes everything worse for the enemy).
idk about you guys but i agree with eo. sd venusaur is still a bitch to get around too even with specially defensive weezing. i've been packing this core: milotic / weezing / nine / tomb and it pretty much covers top 15. arcanine is there to ensure that venusaur is not going to have a field day on my team once weezing is removed.
this current trend is no where to be seen on the ladder from games i'm playing. i encourage people who dislike the ladder but want to play a more competitive uu game to come in the CAP server. just pm people there to play and i'm pretty sure they'll play a game.
anyway, this metagame trend is easily destroyed by dual special attackers. i've pretty much used lo missy lead + lategame cm zam to wreck these familiar cores i am seeing lately. (i'm looking at weezlotic + tomb). this is why I also run eggy on my other team -- to break apart this annoying core. on another note, sd pinsir can tear apart these cores nicely as well with a handful of support of course. anyways, i'm looking forward to these kind of metagame shifts without having an OU drop. these are the type of shifts i look for.
this current trend is no where to be seen on the ladder from games i'm playing. i encourage people who dislike the ladder but want to play a more competitive uu game to come in the CAP server. just pm people there to play and i'm pretty sure they'll play a game.
anyway, this metagame trend is easily destroyed by dual special attackers. i've pretty much used lo missy lead + lategame cm zam to wreck these familiar cores i am seeing lately. (i'm looking at weezlotic + tomb). this is why I also run eggy on my other team -- to break apart this annoying core. on another note, sd pinsir can tear apart these cores nicely as well with a handful of support of course. anyways, i'm looking forward to these kind of metagame shifts without having an OU drop. these are the type of shifts i look for.
Yeah, a lot of underrated boosters can break apart these new cores with relative ease. My only problem is that setting up is somewhat hard since most of them (pretty much all of them) are frail / can't really find time to set up.
I've been having a good time running Offense Spinner Kabutops. This thing is a serious beast, because nobody expects it to spin, and not only that it can punish a lot of stuff that most spinners can't really say they do. (I lol when Venusaur switch into because 2+ Stone Edge is a clean OHKO) and only fools switch in their ghost types to spinblock me because Stone Edge destroys them.
It also brings the Hot back in Moltres. Seriously does anybody run it anymore? Houndoom has overtaken as the prime UU fire type but Moltres is still one hot customer. I usually run Modest because I don't really care about outspeeding things. Most players don't even keep their common base 80's in on Moltres anyway. (Venusaur, Blaziken etc)
I've been having a good time running Offense Spinner Kabutops. This thing is a serious beast, because nobody expects it to spin, and not only that it can punish a lot of stuff that most spinners can't really say they do. (I lol when Venusaur switch into because 2+ Stone Edge is a clean OHKO) and only fools switch in their ghost types to spinblock me because Stone Edge destroys them.
It also brings the Hot back in Moltres. Seriously does anybody run it anymore? Houndoom has overtaken as the prime UU fire type but Moltres is still one hot customer. I usually run Modest because I don't really care about outspeeding things. Most players don't even keep their common base 80's in on Moltres anyway. (Venusaur, Blaziken etc)
most teams I see don't like the momentum lost when using a spinner, which is why I think so many teams run Arcanine/Houndoom over Moltres(not to mention priority/95speed).
I've been running Choice Band Ambipom outside of a lead role and it's been working great; it plays a lot like a weaker Scyther(U-Turn all over everything, hit hard with STAB) with a better fighting move and more ability to switch in. it also fucks over Mismagius/Rotom, switching in on Shadow Ball then OHKOing with Pursuit. lake of Fake Out limits his ease as a revenge killer versus priority users, but he nets a lot more KOs than a Life Orb equipped 'mon, and by cutting out the recoil he has more opportunities to scout(also Fake Out is lame).
I've been running Choice Band Ambipom outside of a lead role and it's been working great; it plays a lot like a weaker Scyther(U-Turn all over everything, hit hard with STAB) with a better fighting move and more ability to switch in. it also fucks over Mismagius/Rotom, switching in on Shadow Ball then OHKOing with Pursuit. lake of Fake Out limits his ease as a revenge killer versus priority users, but he nets a lot more KOs than a Life Orb equipped 'mon, and by cutting out the recoil he has more opportunities to scout(also Fake Out is lame).
That's what Substitute on Missy and Encore on Zam is for. It sucks how bad Registeel fucks over Missy but Zam is still wrecking things as usual. I still like abusing Hitmonlee to weaken the core of Milotic + Tomb + Registeel.
So anti looking at my QC huh?! ^___^
HEY.
yes. I always hated Fake Out and so I never used Ambipom. then I noticed your set and it doesn't use Fake Out.(I actually noticed it stalking your battles, but still...) SUCCESS.
also, Hitmonlee brutalizes a lot of things(I used a Black Belt set and a Life Orb set and both were strong). it's fun to hit Mismagius with Stone Edge as they sub then Sucker Pawnch on the Thunderbolt.
oh, and I have three or more priority users at all time on my team, to take care of frail, beastly sweepers such as Alakazam/Sceptile/Swellow/Ambipom.
NEVER EVER WoW with Weezing as your first attack if you havent scouted your opponents Team properly - its just stupid.
Oh and can you guys please stop mentioning Weezing? Last period i was one of the few users who utilized him (i knew that LadyBug did too) and that to great success. Even more annyoing you guys startet to popularize the Resttalk-WoW-Set with Sludge Bomb. Now people will start to prepare for this Weezing-Set. :(
Well you can run physical defensive Weezing alongside of Chansey. If your Opponent Weezing is a special attacker you can absorb the first attack with Weezing (and heal later with Wish/Rest/whatever) and then switch the next time to Chansey who can easily shrug off any of Special-Venusaurs attacks. Well this would only work with Stall though.....Eo Ut Mortus;2814305I said:
Venusaur is a bitch due to the many sets it can run in combination with Sleep Powder. He is even better than Roserade in the offensive Department (although Roserades best Set in any case was the Spikes one). The best thing you can do is to have consecutive checks to Venusaur who can semi-check him (some of his sets) and moreover check other threats for your team.
So, you use Thunderbolt. Great, you did lots of damage to Arcanine.
The point still stands: i just used the fire attack as a example because it activates Flash Fire.
Ah right. I was referring to defensive versions though. Offensive Versions take
(75.7% - 89%) from Stone Edge, and (15% - 17.9%) so making that guaranteed KO with rocks anyway.
No way, you make a good point. (That's why I almost always run encore on Raichu for that free setup time) it's just that without those Encore, sub or whatnot usually (in Zam and Raichu's case) it free's up a slot for strong moves like Focus Blast. I mean a full out offense boosting set and wreck stall teams, but without encore setting up is hard. (But I guess Zam forces out a lot more stuff than Raichu with his epic
Your Hitmonlee set is still pretty killer.
Bluewind what's that Spiritomb moveset, I must have it.
(I'm assuming
-Dark Pulse
-Will-O-Wisp
-Shadow Sneak / Sucker Punch ?
-Rest?
Why should anyone run Thunderbolt? Thunderbolt is in my opinion one of the worst attack moves for Weezing in UU. Weezing should run Sludge Bomb as his attacking move (and maybe Hidden Power [Water] as the second if you use the Painsplit-Variant).
Sludge Bomb hit most Pokes Weezing is meant to check for neutral damage (and hit most Switch-Ins like Houndoom/Arcanine very hard) . It doesnt hit Rhyperior for enough Damage to break a Sub though so you have to run a good Rhyperior-check or Hidden Power [Water].
Sludge Bomb hit most Pokes Weezing is meant to check for neutral damage (and hit most Switch-Ins like Houndoom/Arcanine very hard) . It doesnt hit Rhyperior for enough Damage to break a Sub though so you have to run a good Rhyperior-check or Hidden Power [Water].
It's mainly a thing of the past that people try and latch onto. Since the 3rd gen it was used to kill Gyara and shit, even this gen when Weezing was OU.
I guess it could be useful if you prefer getting rid of Gatr and Azumarill as fast as possible, but I don't really see its use much.
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