Official NU Stage 11 Suspect Voting

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We have finally arrived to the voting stage! The following users have qualified to vote:




This will be a simple vote on both Jynx and Scolipede. Your options are Ban, Do Not Ban, and Abstain.


We will be using a simple majority vote for this test, so an option will only need a 50%+ majority to be banned.

Sample Vote said:
Jynx: Ban
Scolipede: Abstain
It's as simple as that! Though one thing I'm going to requite out of all the voters is that you leave a small explanation of why you are making the decision you are. This can be in bullet points, around 2 or 3 lines. Also feel free to link to your post in the suspect discussion that you feel best suns up your argument. Just enough that people reading this can know why you're making the decision you are. You have until Friday, February 7 at 11:59 p.m. EST to vote. Reminder: Treecko needs to delete his post.

Also if you have voted in four BW or XY Suspect Tests, you are eligible for the Tiering Contributor badge. Please PM Raseri with links to all of your votes (even if it exceeds 4), and I will process them all.
 
Scolipede: Ban

Basically, Scolipede single-handedly makes NU a Spikes meta, and there are pretty much no Pokemon that are good at reliably preventing it from doing its job. Checks to offensive and Sash sets tend to get set up on by bulky sets and vice-versa. More on Scolipede here.

Jynx: Ban

I still don't find Jynx to be so obviously banworthy like a lot of other people do, but in the end, much like Scolipede, it makes the metagame too offensive. Its combination of incredible Speed, great power and coverage, and a fast Sleep-inducing move makes Jynx too much for the NU metagame to handle. More on Jynx here.
 
Jynx: Ban
Scolipede: Ban

Reasoning for Jynx:
  • shaped metagame around her
  • incredible offensive presence due to typing, Speed, and powerful coverage options
  • Lovely Kiss to neutralize checks and counters (compounds her difficulty to be stopped)
  • limits teambuilding as it's essential to run multiple Jynx checks and/or counters
Reasoning for Scolipede:
  • unstoppable at setting up (Toxic) Spikes
  • offensive capabilities prevent opposition from taking advantage of Scolipede's Spike stacking
  • single-handedly transformed the metagame into a huge offensive Spike stack war
  • can easily run a threatening Swords Dance set that can sweep the majority of the tier with Swarm Megahorn alone
 

jake

underdog of the year
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Jynx: BAN
  • Jynx forces every team to run multiple responses to it, for fear that if one gets slept via Lovely Kiss the remainder of the team will get swept. There is not a single faster Pokemon that can switch in without risking getting 2HKOed, and very few defensive options that can handle LK (those that can, such as RestTalk Metang, are very vulnerable to a -lot- of Pokemon like Charizard or Samurott).
  • Jynx invalidates literally a third of the NU tier - any Pokemon that is slower than it and forced out by it (~30 viable Pokemon) forces you to run multiple responses to Jynx, or to create a huge opening for Jynx to take advantage through Lovely Kiss, Substitute, and the threat of it OHKOing your Exeggutor, Torterra, etc. It is not impossible to build around these Pokemon, but it restricts teambuilding and creativity in a very major way because of the attention it garners when you're trying to build your team.
  • While Jynx is not flawless and has some very distinct weaknesses (frailty, Pursuit weakness, weakness to hazards), its positive traits in combination overwhelm the tier and create massive restrictions on teambuilding that were not there beforehand.
Scolipede: BAN
  • Scolipede encourages a metagame centered around offensive spikestacking. Thanks to its speed, decent typing, and bulk, it's virtually impossible to keep Scolipede from laying at least two layers of hazards. Unlike other good Spikes users like Garbodor and Roselia, Scolipede has the offensive presence and speed to scare away any Pokemon trying to take advantage of the turns it takes to set up Spikes (think Gardevoir, etc).
  • Scolipede's ease of hazards carries a very negative influence over a tier strapped for answers to them - in fact, out of a very, very limited pool of Pokemon that can Rapid Spin away the hazards, only Wartortle boasts decent bulk and a typing that isn't weak to Stealth Rock. It also has no room to slip Rest into its movepool (and no other recovery), and thanks to Scolipede's ability to create its own opportunities to set hazards again plus Misdreavus's ability to spinblock so well, it's very difficult to remove hazards once Scolipede has set them.
 

watashi

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World Defender
jynx: ban
- faster than most of the tier
- "accurate" sleep move
- super strong
- impossible to counter unless you guess the set correctly

scolipede: ban
-
sets up at least one layer every match
- typing grants it many opportunities to do what it wants
- can also choose to hit extremely hard with swords dance or life orb
- nu lacks "good" spinners
 

Django

Started from the bottom...
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Jynx: Ban

The effect Jynx has on NU is almost entirely negative. It decreases the pool of viable Pokemon due to the fact that if you run anything slower than it you open up your team to Lovely Kiss and any of Jynx's other moves. The nature of Sleep in BW makes this incredibly difficult to deal with, particularly when you factor in Jynx's great speed tier, fantastic offensive presence and great versatility. Overall, Jynx makes teambuilding incredibly stale as the pool of Pokemon you can realistically pick from is much smaller, and the things you are forced to run to beat Jynx are sub-optimal at best.

Scolipede: Ban

In a tier where all the spinners are shit, something which can set up Spikes with the ease Scolipede can is obviously problematic. It is also very difficult to punish Scolipede while it sets up Spikesbecause of how strong its Megahorn is, how fast it is, and the fact it can also run fantastic Swords Dance and Baton Pass sets. Overall, the negative effects of Spikes (discouraging switching, making even less Pokemon viable, forcing reliance on shitty spinners) far outweigh the positives you could potentailly get by taking advantage of the free turns Scolipede gives you.

Hate to say I told you so guys n____n
 
Jynx: Abstain
  • the arguments for banning jynx haven't necessarily convinced me that jynx is unhealthy for the tier but just that it is really good. from personal experience, i dont find jynx too overcentralizing but maybe thats just because the meta has wrapped itself to cover jynx to such an extent. i cant really say ban or no ban because its not "clear cut" even though its been a part of nu for a while and has been used extensively so im going with abstain as i can't make a definite decision.
Scolipede: Ban
  • the arguments for banning scolipede were much clearer. fast spikes stacking with little to no drawback does not really seem to have a good impact on the tier along with scolipede still being able to threaten mons with good coverage and decent attack. the way scoli spikes stacks is much different than garbo or roselia due to its higher speed tier and offensive presence which allows it to easily support its teammates and heavily cripple most balance and stall teams.
 

ebeast

she's probably sexting nprtprt
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My general reasoning for it is best explained in the suspect thread itself

Jynx: Ban

  • Lovely Kiss combined with its Base 95 Speed give it the ability to remove a Pokemon from the game at practically no cost
  • Restricts teambuilding because of its incredible power + coverage and Lovely Kiss making it hard to cover without taking a big loss
  • Very unpredictable. Lovely Kiss by itself already made Jynx difficult to cover, but with all the options Jynx has for sets, it can get ridiculous

Scolipede: Ban

  • It's very fast and makes Spikes stacking way too easy in a metagame that lacks reliable ways of Rapid Spinning
  • Still very dangerous on the offensive side and it has little difficulty mixing both its offensive and Spiking abilities into a single set
  • Shifts the Speed tiers in NU and makes the metagame overly offensive
 

Cased

Banned deucer.
Jynx: Ban

Jynx so broken, even with defenses like a twig
People using unviable walls like Hypno or Grumpig
Straight lovely kissin', gotta carry two counters
Gyro Ball Wartortle, pray you get a Jynx encounter
Teambuildin' limited, better got a Metang
Ban Jynx, whip it like Pootie Tang

Jynx will blow by your team if you do not have Sleep Fodder + another counter. Every team must have two Pokemon able to beat Jynx, possibly even more depending on playstyle, which is what I mean by limits teambuilding. Jynx's effectiveness has forced certain Pokemon to take away a moveslot that could be beneficial for loads of other Pokemon and situations in order to beat Jynx, showing that Jynx has centralized a tier to an extent. Jynx's unpredictability makes it incredibly hard to play against, forcing the opponent to scout for it every game, making it near impossible to defeat. (Yes this was my original post in the suspect but it's basically a paragraph on why it's broken.)


Scolipede: Ban

Scolipede everywhere, call it a stampede
Scaring little kids, it's a human centipede
Suspected because it lays two Spikes
Grounded Pokemon; and they all yellin' Yikes
Settin up, never seen these Sword Dances
Lemme see a ban...ces...

Although a good amount of Pokemon are capable of being apart of SpikeStack teams in NU, Scolipede's offensive capabilities are far beyond those of the other Spikers in NU. And Scolipede's fantastic Speed allows it to usually get two layers of Spikes down, and since a lot of Pokemon are susceptible to Spikes in NU, it can limit bulky offensive teambuilding to an extent, due to the ability to easily lay down Spikes. Its fantastic Speed and decent Attack also allow it to run an incredible offensive Pokemon, threatening many teams with its Swords Dance set. Its offensive capabilities alongside its ability to set up hazards with relative ease make it broken.


(Glad to be chosen for this, will attempt to post in future XY NU suspects and hopefully get chosen once again)
 
jynx: BAN
Lovely Kiss + 95 Speed means it is always removing one Pokemon, and more often than not 2-3.
Incredibly powerful, and has insane coverage for NU.
High Speed tier leaves very few offensive ways to beat Jynx :(


scolipede: BAN
Free entry hazards in a tier where it is incredibly difficult to remove them is sad :(
It has great offensive presence as well, and can threaten most of the Pokemon that could remove its hazards.
Its Speed tier shifts the metagame a lot towards offense, though that doesn't make it broken in of itself, the offensiveness of the metagame is a part of what makes the Spikes aspect so broken.
 
Alright, we have a majority!

With 9/9 votes, Scolipede is now banned from NU.
With 8/8 votes and one abstain, Jynx is now banned from NU.

Thank you everyone for participating in this suspect test, let's hope NU is better because of it!
 
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