Other Overrated, Underrated, Fitting [SURVEY RESULTS POSTED]

[Chou Toshio]

Alright guys, so I closed the survey after about a week (been busy, sorry all!). Anyway, while I wasn't paying attention, we got 1629 responses (damn...).

This makes the data incredibly stable imo, and I believe to be representative of community opinion (at large).

Anyway,

Here are the raw results:

https://qtrial.qualtrics.com/CP/Report.php?RP=RP_eM6oMueAbTnPdSB

Only Former Suspect Voters:

https://qtrial.qualtrics.com/CP/Report.php?RP=RP_9nyMINUl6cXBOm1

Only Players who consider themselves "Tournament Players":

https://qtrial.qualtrics.com/CP/Report.php?RP=RP_9AXPUkCFW2zFppb

Hi everyone!

I'd like you all to take an online survey, looking to collect data on how Pokemon in XY are rated (used) relative to their "perceived power", or "estimated real power."

For those familiar with "viability rankings," you know that a Pokemon is not always used in proportion to how good it actually is. This survey will survey to get an idea of how players perceive Pokemon's current rankings relative to perceptions of power.

Please take the Survey: https://qtrial.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_88nuSaDwf8omSUJ

Also feel free to discuss the topic here as well! When I have 200-300 responses, I will close the survey and post the results.

Thanks!

Chou

 

[CarbonTheSecond]

Question of how to fit New Pokes in general appears twice on Page 1 of Questions, question of Goodra's perceived fitting appears twice on Page 2 of questions. Is it possible to fix this?

 

[Thorhammer]

This is really neat, although I feel like it could use a "don't know" option for Pokebank-only Pokemon, for those of us who only play Kalos OU. I was forced to guess on all of them, which has got to throw off the results.

 

[GCSChris]

While I originally felt that it's a bit early for something like this, when I saw the question I realized that it's also a great tool to see what people think of these new pokemon, even though just about everything on the survey is subject to change because we don't even really have Bank OU anyways.

Great survey as usual! :]

 

[Chou Toshio]

^GCSChris-- Thanks! Thing about this subject is that it's repeatable. Obviously, there will be great value to do this again a month after Pokebank officially opens.

CarbonTheSecond-- thanks, spotted the issues and fixed them. The survey was showing goodra question twice, new pokes twice, and didn't show the question for mega evos. Hopefully this is fixed now.

Thorhammer-- the demographics questions will let us sort out responses of those who do play pokebank and those who don't.

 

[Mozilla Fennekin]

Thanks for giving me something to do this morning. c:
Not much for me to discuss, though I'd like to point out that the only Pokemon I've seen a moderate amount of times that was demoted to OU are Blaziken (before the quickban) and Excadrill.

 

[Shiruba]

Alright, so with the second section of Megas, I am aware that it wants to refer to Megas, but is it solely the Megas that we are to rate, or the Pokemon as a whole? Considering that several of these Pokemon were already OU before their Mega formes were revealed, or play completely differently, I feel that it's worth mentioning.

 

[masterful]

It's weird answering some of these questions, cause you kinda have to guess the usage. I don't play often enough to see the trends of usage, other than fucking Rotom-W and Genesect being on EVERY GODDAMN TEAM, so a lot of the choices were basically "fittingly rated" by default.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Shiruba, answering that question may skew the results from my intentions, so I'm going to hold off on answering.

masterful, I want players to use their gut based on what they've seen. If they haven't played many games, we can see that based on how they answered the demographics question as well. Also, you can check the usage stats. If the number seems too low for how good you think the Pokemon is *cough*manaphy*cough*, you'll have your answer.

 

[Ryolain]

It's weird answering some of these questions, cause you kinda have to guess the usage. I don't play often enough to see the trends of usage, other than fucking Rotom-W and Genesect being on EVERY GODDAMN TEAM, so a lot of the choices were basically "fittingly rated" by default.

Agreed, it might be helpful to know where these Pokes stand in usage when saying if I think it's fitting or not. I had to kind of base my answers on just what I've seen, but I don't know if that's representative of play at higher levels since I've been stuck around the 1700 rank.

 

[Psylink]

In my opinion, this was very early for taking a survey like this, as lots of us (not including myself) haven't exactly been PokeBank a lot. When does the metagame officially open for things like C&C (not Previews, the actual anaylises like last gen)?

 

[Colonial]

For the "Overrated/Underrated" questions, I was unsure what exactly you meant. Did you mean their rankings on the usage lists, how often I see them on teams, public opinion towards them, or something else? Also, why no Gliscor or Garchomp on the "Old OU rating" page? Did I miss them somehow? I've been seeing those guys everywhere. Either way, fairly well designed survey, I hope the results are informative!

 

[thedeafelectrician]

For the "Overrated/Underrated" questions, I was unsure what exactly you meant. Did you mean their rankings on the usage lists, how often I see them on teams, public opinion towards them, or something else? Also, why no Gliscor or Garchomp on the "Old OU rating" page? Did I miss them somehow? I've been seeing those guys everywhere. Either way, fairly well designed survey, I hope the results are informative!

I also really thought I would see that one.

I'm actually really interested to see how the results end up, especially with one-dimensional stuff like gavulanta and smeargle that I swear I've seen on 33% of teams.

 

[babaGAReeb]

i think mega gengar is underrated cause some ppl actually think hes not OP
gengar doesnt need mega form to kick ass

 

[TheEvergreenChameleon]

TBH I personally feel that grouping on the basis of actual usage is increasingly looking to be an outmoded method of tiering.

 

[Thorhammer]

TBH I personally feel that grouping on the basis of actual usage is increasingly looking to be an outmoded method of tiering.

If we were to tier them based on other criteria, we'd need to overhaul the whole idea of them being "overused" as a definition for tiers.

 

[sparktrain]

If the question was concerning a pokemon I really hadn't seen much of, I answered with "fittingly rated," unless I actually felt that they should be used more.

Cool survey! Can't wait to see the results.

 

[TheEvergreenChameleon]

If we were to tier them based on other criteria, we'd need to overhaul the whole idea of them being "overused" as a definition for tiers.

I agree, and that would be challenging, but I feel that in the long run it would be well worth Smogon's time. The problem is that we've entered an era of greater participation, both on simulators and outside of them, and to compound that problem, we're also faced with the introduction of new Pokemon (Megas) whose usage must come at the expense of other Pokemon.

 

[Thorhammer]

I agree, and that would be challenging, but I feel that in the long run it would be well worth Smogon's time. The problem is that we've entered an era of greater participation, both on simulators and outside of them, and to compound that problem, we're also faced with the introduction of new Pokemon (Megas) whose usage must come at the expense of other Pokemon.

Well, with that comes another problem. You've noticed how challenging it is just to decide if something is broken, right? Imagine how much harder it would be to decide for every single Pokemon which tier it "belongs" in. It'd be a nightmare, and even harder to objectively quantify.

Usage statistics work well enough for their intended purposes, which is creating a variety of metagames, without creating an enormous amount of unnecessary work.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Holy crap, I have 230 responses already. I remember it took me about a week to get that many for my BW surveys. Well, it's a new gen, and this is an easier survey to finish. I'll at least let this go for a few more days, aiming for a minimum of 500. The more the merrier right? lol

 

[Lazybeef]

Good survey. However, I would think that it would make more sense to wait for this month's usage statistics.

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

*bump to makes sure this doesn't go to the second page*
This survey I think would have been better if it had a) come out after this month's usage stats, or b) asked how good a pokemon is in and of itself rather than how good it is in proportion to its usage. Sense we don't have reliable usage statistics yet, it is hard to gage whether or not something is being used more/less than it deserves. This won't be an issue with future surveys of XY OU, but that might be something to keep in mind for Gen 7.

 

[JustLetMePlay]

I'm actually quite interested in the results of this survey. Good job on really drilling home what you mean by 'Overrated', 'Underrated' and 'Fitting'.

We should have a survey ranking pokemon in OU from best to worst if possible. Also definitely have surveys every 2 months or so with the new metagame.

While I agree that tiering based on usage is a bit archaic, using subjective terms like 'best' and 'worst' is even worse. There are too many confounding variables in Pokemon for a survey like that to hold any meaning.

 

[Jaroda]

It was hard to judge based on usage alone, so I kinda mixed my answers with what other people's impressions have been about the various mon. I believe most mon have been represented fairly accurate of late in terms of usefulness and little in the ways of novelty remaining since the first few weeks.

 

[SergantGold]

Those demographic questions made me feel like a noob because I never went to try to compete in tournaments/tiering discussions before.

*little voice in head yells "NOOB NOOB NOOB"*