Pokémon Diamond, Pearl & Platinum In-game Tier List Discussion

Unless someone already made this post, we have our next untiered Pokémon:

Feebas: F-rank —> Untiered (DP, but not platinum)

In Diamond and Pearl version, Feebas can be obtained in the Mt. Coronet fog room but only using the Super Rod; the Super Rod cannot be obtained until the postgame (Fight Area). Thus, Feebas cannot be used for a playthrough of Diamond and Pearl.

In Platinum version, all three rods can be used to catch it, so it should stay as is on the list.
This Bulbapedia article says Feebas can be reeled with any rod in all 3 versions.
 
Unown UR —> F tier (Diamond and Pearl)

Self explanatory, only gets hidden power, weak stats, loses to basically everything of the same level

It was ranked in the platinum list but I guess they forgot it in DP
 

Don Honchkrorleone

Happy Qwilfish the nightmare
is a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
Can someone explain to me why Yanma is anywhere above E other that "durr i guess it has 125 Special Attack and is BL on Smogon so it must be good"? I recently used that piece of trash and let me tell: for someone that used unown in gsc and ditto in rb, Yanma is the worst Pokémon I've ever had the displeasure to use. I'm sure that whoever made this thread never used said bug

167898


Let's go to the facts one by one that "define" a Pokémon's viability in dissecting this rotten corpse:

  • Availability: Mid-game in Great Marsh, although only there with a very low chance and Great Marsh is a bitch to get Pokémon anyway.
  • Typing: Bug/Flying is one of the most reviled type combinations for an in-game mon. While almost nothing have Fire moves in Platinum, a lot of stuff tends to have Rock, Electric and Flying. Ice weakness means a huge portion of the game is harsh to it.
  • Stats: Whoever thought Yanmega had any usefulness looked by here, and so did I before deciding to use it, but BOOOOY. The Special Attack is good, but not with a bunch of weak-ass moves. .It's really not good. Defense is alrightish but bad with the typing. Special Defense is terrible. The Attack was enough to net some damage, not kills, with U-Turn. And that is Yanmega. Yanma is much worse in every aspect.
  • Movepool: Part of the thought that passed through the mind of whoever had the bad trip of thinking Yanma had any decency in-game must have come from STAB Bug Buzz and Air Slash, which, admittedly, were good when I got them. But I got them at level 53 and 57 respectively. Before that, you have the wonderful SONIC BOOM (caught at a stage where most stuff can only be 4HKOed at least), the ever useful Detect, Double Team and Supersonic. To relearn as a Yanma, you have Quick Attack and only. Your best bet before getting U-TURN (better as a TM before Canalave) are Air Cutter (didn't have enough shards, and frankly, if a Pokémon is Shard hunting reliant to do anything, then it isn't worth in first place) Silver Wind TM with very bad PP that prevents long battles and usage in areas with distant Pokémon Center, Ancient Power (same problem with Silver Wind but worse since no STAB) and Pursuit. My final set when I beat E4 was Bug Buzz/Air Slash/Ancient Power/U-Turn and let me say that getting to the first movies was a real pain. Even with Tinted Lens, the weak moves were just too weak. Also, in the TM department, you have Giga Drain (which I used on something else), Shadow Ball (same), Psychic (very late and doesn't help with anything else relevant), and Hyper Beam I guess. At least it works as a Defogger though!
  • Major Battles: Based on what you can have at that point (and my experience)
    • Maylene: Sonic Boom and Uproar didn't cut. It was useless, and I tried. Machoke has Rock Tomb and Lucario will kill you before you do. I only managed to kill Meditite with it because Supersonic managed to hit and hax was in my favor.
    • Wake: Same as above but with Silver Wind TM, which doesn't help that much. One may think that Ancient Power beats Gyarados but it doesn't. Yanmega was too weak to kill and was 2HKOed instead by Waterfall + Brine.
    • Cyrus (1st): Everything exists to kill it. I guess if you outspeed Sneasel you get a kill but otherwise don't. I didn't even try against him.
    • Byron: Magneton destroys it and so does Bastiodon with anything it has. ALTHOUGH even Steelix had Ice Fang, I managed to beat it with Tinted Lens Silver Wind.
    • Candice: Tried to kill Abomasnow with Silver Wind. You can guess the result. Everything else is too fast or too bulky for it.
    • Cyrus (2nd and 3rd): See Cyrus, but now everything is stronger and have better moves.
    • Other Galatic members: Didn't use Yanmega against any of them so can't say, probably badly, but I suppose you can beat Saturn if you get Air Cutter.
    • Volkner: Lol
    • Aaron: See this is where I wanted to say that Yanmega was great, but bear in mind that I refused to face the E4 before Yanmega got Bug Buzz, and his max level mon was a Drapion at Level 53. May you go there immediately while keeping Air Cutter, you won't have the same luck for sure. Also FYI his Yanmega has the good stabs at lv 49 probably because he's a cheating bastard.
    • Bertha: If you teach it a Grass move then it can probably dent Wishcash and maybe Golem/Rhyperior outside Sandstorm. I didn't try though, so can't say much.
    • Flint: See Volkner
    • Lucian: Same observation as Aaron. I lead it against Mr. Mime and used U-turn, which killed. It, even at level 57, was outsped by Alakazam and OHKOed by Psychic, but before it did manage to 2HKO Bronzong with Bug Buzz (the second was a crit after Bronzong used CM). If I was in a level or two below, i doubt it would have the same chance.
    • Cynthia: If you have Air Slash and Bug Buzz you can go after Roserade and maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe Spiritomb (didn't do the latter). Yanmega 2HKOed Roserade with Air Slash but was almost OHKOed by Sludge Bomb and would be had it been poisoned.
    • Rival: I mostly used it against Grotle/Torterra as when it was slower than Heracross and everything else on the team can murder it. It did fine enough.

Conclusion: Yanmega is sheer garbage and I do not recommend anyone using it unless they REALLY want to. As this list is supposed to represent a fast run of the game, my claim still stands. On mercy, I'd say put it in E but it's truly a terrible Pokémon enough to F. If anyone wants, I may give insights on the other Pokémon or on the runs I've made in DPPt, as I disagree with most of the placements in there.
 
Conclusion: Yanmega is sheer garbage and I do not recommend anyone using it unless they REALLY want to. As this list is supposed to represent a fast run of the game, my claim still stands. On mercy, I'd say put it in E but it's truly a terrible Pokémon enough to F. If anyone wants, I may give insights on the other Pokémon or on the runs I've made in DPPt, as I disagree with most of the placements in there.
Interesting. As I'm planning to start a Pt run this week, I'd love to hear your thoughts on it if possible.
 
I've been playing through Platinum and I've been using Swinub/Mamoswine for the last quarter of the game. I would like to contest its placement in the E rank, which I find to be too low, even given that it's not available until after the sixth gym. It seems to have extremely good matchups against most lategame trainers and its 130 base Attack stat + STAB EQ and Ice Shard cannot be overlooked.

Availability: Route 217 and Acuity Lakefront, between the sixth and seventh Gyms. You'll catch it as a Swinub, which in just a couple of levels evolves into Piloswine. With a Heart Scale handy you can get Mamoswine at level 36.

Typing: Ice/Ground gives it rather poor defensive typing in many cases but an immunity to Electric. However, Ice/Ground is very good offensively because of the great coverage options it offers.

Stats: 130 base Attack is extremely good, one of the best in the game. 80 Speed is a bit low but not horrible, especially considering that Mamoswine hits fairly hard with Ice Shard. Decent physical bulk, not so much special bulk.

Movepool: STAB Earthquake at level 40 + STAB Ice Shard right from the get-go is the main bread and butter. NeverMeltIce allows a boost to Ice Shard. Mamo can also learn Rock Slide/Stone Edge via TM. Mamoswine doesn't have a huge amount of options as to moves, but it doesn't need many considering its very good coverage.

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Mamoswine_(Pokémon)/Generation_IV_learnset
Major Battles:
Candice: Okay matchup if you have Earthquake
Galactic Grunts: Combination of EQ/Ice Shard OHK/2HK most Galactic Grunt Pokemon
Cyrus: Good against Weavile and Crobat. Can 2HKO Honchkrow.
Volkner: Generally a good matchup, but watch out for Focus Blast on Raichu and Fire/Steel moves on Jolteon and Electivire (Mamoswine can generally take a hit from the latter two)
Aaron: Ice Shard allows 2HKOs on some of Aaron's Pokemon.
Bertha: See above.
Flint: Mamoswine is able to outspeed and OHKO several Pokemon on Flint's team with Earthquake.
Lucian: Not as good of a matchup as the other E4 members, but still usable.
Cynthia: Wins against Garchomp 1v1 in many instances. Also has good matchups against several other mons on her team.

Final Comment: Mamoswine definitely deserves at least D if not C. Despite its late appearance, it has many great matchups against the fairly packed last third of the game. If one is willing to wait until after the sixth gym to catch Swinub, they will be rewarded with a very powerful physical attacker with good type coverage.
 
Towards the end of my Platinum run, I decided to pick up a high-level wild Tentacruel right before the Pokemon League and was quite happy with its performance. It set up Toxic Spikes against everyone except Aaron, which helped weaken some important foes like Garchomp, Magmortar, and Milotic. It was also great for baiting out Earthquake, which helped Staraptor come in for free and stack attack drops with Intimidate. Most people would probably fill that last slot with Giratina or Azelf, but I was pretty happy with Tentacruel given how little I invested in it.

If anything, I think the gap between Giratina and Tentacruel is probably too wide currently. They're fighting for the same teamslot (namely, the one that gets freed up in the lategame when you're done using Bibarel), and in my opinion, poisoning 12/26 opponents in the Pokemon League is at least as valuable as brute-forcing things with a fat, moderately strong Pokemon like Giratina. Notably, it allowed me to deal poison damage to Espeon and Alakazam while shuffling between Houndoom and Tentacruel, eventually putting them in Sucker Punch KO range. It also bought me a lot of time to heal while fighting Milotic. Tentacruel isn't as good as Giratina, obviously, but not the the extent that Giratina should be A while Tentacruel should be E.
 

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