Yea that makes sense. Thank you!
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Pokemon Legends: Z-A Combat/PVP Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Count Bleck
- Start date
Mewtwo is legal now.
I’d consider this a proper meta shake-up, unlike Zygarde and its already-posted about mediocrity. Base Mewtwo can snipe a lot of stuff with its incredibly wide movepool, with MMY bolstering that prowess further. MMX has potential as a strong screen breaker with fast moves and the ability to still snipe if needed. Their existence also promotes the usage of more niche mons like Absol and Mega Banette; should be a fun one!
There’s also Z Megas and their new “faster cast times -> expend more Mega energy -> shorter battles” gimmick, but we won’t get to see that til S4.
I’d consider this a proper meta shake-up, unlike Zygarde and its already-posted about mediocrity. Base Mewtwo can snipe a lot of stuff with its incredibly wide movepool, with MMY bolstering that prowess further. MMX has potential as a strong screen breaker with fast moves and the ability to still snipe if needed. Their existence also promotes the usage of more niche mons like Absol and Mega Banette; should be a fun one!
There’s also Z Megas and their new “faster cast times -> expend more Mega energy -> shorter battles” gimmick, but we won’t get to see that til S4.
While I do want to still mess with Zygarde (and in fact had a LOT of success with a Sash Zydog / Venusaur or Roserade / Chandelure team recently..)...
From my limited testing, Mewtwo is NUTS, by far the best sniper in the game! To the point where it sorta dampens my Zygarde excitement lol.
Something of note: while Psystrike is fast enough as a projectile that I think its totally usable, I've actually been using Psyshock on LO Mewtwo just because it makes Mewtwo feel like an even more reliable sniper!
Been using Nasty Plot / Psyshock / Thunderbolt / Earth Power, but I legit bet you could go with 4 attacks to steal kills sorta like LO Zygarde does too!
From my limited testing, Mewtwo is NUTS, by far the best sniper in the game! To the point where it sorta dampens my Zygarde excitement lol.
Something of note: while Psystrike is fast enough as a projectile that I think its totally usable, I've actually been using Psyshock on LO Mewtwo just because it makes Mewtwo feel like an even more reliable sniper!
Been using Nasty Plot / Psyshock / Thunderbolt / Earth Power, but I legit bet you could go with 4 attacks to steal kills sorta like LO Zygarde does too!
From the video Serebii had, it seemed about half casting time for double gauge usage
Though might be the case for everything. It does look like any initial frames seem to be skipped. You can see regular MLuc have a split second of charge up before attacking, while MLuc Z lacks that, and a similar ending cooldown
Been playing with the Mega Mewtwos for the past few hours. If you wanted to know what playing with a DBZ character (Freeza) is like in ZA, both of them offer that experience.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite Y
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
- Psyshock / Psystrike
- Some combo of Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Earth Power / Focus Blast / Flamethrower / Shadow Ball / Solar Beam / Hurricane /
Mewtwo has coverage for fucking days. I don't think Solar Beam or Hurricane Mewtwo will ever be a thing, but...they're options lol. I also think Shadow Ball is overrated on Mewtwo. You're just using it to hit other Mewtwo super effectively while boosted Psyshock and its other coverage already chunks Mewtwo pretty hard. However, if there's a time to run it, it'd be now since everyone's experimenting with Mewtwo. I'd just rather hit more of the meta harder.
Whichever coverage moves you opt to run will depend on your team composition. I've been running Calm Mind, Psyshock, Ice Beam, and Earth Power with
to deal with Electric-weaks, and 
(and I'll get to Absol soon, I have to gush about that mon) for opposing Mewtwo, Ghost-types, and Mewtwo checks. Calm Mind or Nasty Plot for your boosting move; CM has the benefit of helping your Xerneas and opposing Special Mewtwo matchup, while Plot holds on to your SpA boost longer. I currently prefer Psyshock's ability to accurate hit its targets, but Psystrike can work if you position and time your attacks properly, giving you a much stronger hit. What's great about MM2Y in particular is that base form Mewtwo works just fine on its own as you gather Mega energy. Turns out, base 154 SpA and a boosting move is kinda good. I've tried 4 Attacks MM2Y and found significantly-less success. Base form Mewtwo wants to boost to pick up KOs, and lacking that just won't cut it.
MM2Y is also hella fast, hence why I think MM2Y is worth it. That extra bit of Speed MM2Y gets puts it in range of a cooldown threshold with a small amount of Speed investment, turning all of its 8 second cooldown moves into the fastest-possible 3 seconds.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant / Brave Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brick Break
- Some combo of Poison Jab / Stone Edge / Earthquake / Elemental Punches / Ice Beam if Brave nature
Physical Mega Mewtwo X, on the other hand, doesn't have as many options compared to its Special counterparts. It lacks Swords Dance, relying on Bulk Up to boost itself, which doesn't hold onto the boost nearly as long as SD would. The Defense boost helps with all the physical threats coming after standard M2 / MM2Y, though.
MM2X took me a bit to get used to. This way of running M2 makes the base form much worse, being stuck with unSTAB'd attacks off of 110 Attack. However, when I found the right team after discussing it on discord -
and 
- I started performing much better. Like MM2Y, the coverage you run alongside Brick Break depends on the team, and with Garchomp covering Ground-weaks and Chandelure taking Skarmory out of the sky, I ran Bulk Up, Brick Break, Poison Jab, and Stone Edge to great success. It also helps that Brick Break destroys the many screens out there right now.
Turns out, all the checks MM2Y has, are mostly weak to MM2X. Dark-types? Bug-types? Never heard of 'em. You're weaker to Xerneas now, but funnily enough, a lot of Xerneas are switching to physical sets using Night Slash and Megahorn, and MM2X is neutral to those moves and has Bulk Up to sponge the hits better. Plus, this is what boosted Poison Jab does to it:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Poison Jab+ vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 191-224 (81.9 - 96.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
If Xern is chipped, it's donezo. Yveltal's not excused from class, either, because it's gonna get this work:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Stone Edge+ vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Yveltal: 236-278 (101.2 - 119.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
While you lose your Psychic-resistance, you actually take on other Mewtwo surprisingly-well. Boosted Stone Edge into Poison Jab kills MM2Y, and has a chance to take regular Mewtwo out, as well.
Overall, while I had lower expectations of MM2X and initially wrote it off, it's actually really strong and should be respected.
Absol @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Night Slash
- Close Combat
- Play Rough
Holy shit, this thing is amazing. It's thriving in this meta right now. Not only does it feast on all the Mewtwo running around, but the Mewtwo counters aren't safe, either. +1 Play Rough+ does 89% minimum to Yveltal, so it dies if it's chipped. +1 Night Slash doesn't even need Plus Power to kill MM2Y, and if it's MM2X, +1 Play Rough+ does 93% minimum. There's a bunch of Tyranitar on the ladder for some reason, which means Absol has been feasting well. Close Combat and Play Rough are nice for the other meta staples, including Excadrill, Garchomp, Glaceon, Mega Gyarados, Dragonite, and Lucario, while Night Slash cuts through Metagross, Chandelure, Delphox, and Gengar, often through screens thanks to the high crit rate.
Another great benefit is that it's fast on its feet. It's able to chase down targets quite easily, and if Night Slash misses, it's not a big loss since it has a quick cooldown. Play Rough and Close Combat also teleport you to your targets, which help with closing the distance.
The main disadvantage is its frailty, but if you practice Guerrilla Warfare with Absol, you'll get results. Blitz cooked with this Absol set!
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite Y
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
- Psyshock / Psystrike
- Some combo of Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Earth Power / Focus Blast / Flamethrower / Shadow Ball / Solar Beam / Hurricane /
Mewtwo has coverage for fucking days. I don't think Solar Beam or Hurricane Mewtwo will ever be a thing, but...they're options lol. I also think Shadow Ball is overrated on Mewtwo. You're just using it to hit other Mewtwo super effectively while boosted Psyshock and its other coverage already chunks Mewtwo pretty hard. However, if there's a time to run it, it'd be now since everyone's experimenting with Mewtwo. I'd just rather hit more of the meta harder.
Whichever coverage moves you opt to run will depend on your team composition. I've been running Calm Mind, Psyshock, Ice Beam, and Earth Power with
to deal with Electric-weaks, and (and I'll get to Absol soon, I have to gush about that mon) for opposing Mewtwo, Ghost-types, and Mewtwo checks. Calm Mind or Nasty Plot for your boosting move; CM has the benefit of helping your Xerneas and opposing Special Mewtwo matchup, while Plot holds on to your SpA boost longer. I currently prefer Psyshock's ability to accurate hit its targets, but Psystrike can work if you position and time your attacks properly, giving you a much stronger hit. What's great about MM2Y in particular is that base form Mewtwo works just fine on its own as you gather Mega energy. Turns out, base 154 SpA and a boosting move is kinda good. I've tried 4 Attacks MM2Y and found significantly-less success. Base form Mewtwo wants to boost to pick up KOs, and lacking that just won't cut it.MM2Y is also hella fast, hence why I think MM2Y is worth it. That extra bit of Speed MM2Y gets puts it in range of a cooldown threshold with a small amount of Speed investment, turning all of its 8 second cooldown moves into the fastest-possible 3 seconds.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant / Brave Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brick Break
- Some combo of Poison Jab / Stone Edge / Earthquake / Elemental Punches / Ice Beam if Brave nature
Physical Mega Mewtwo X, on the other hand, doesn't have as many options compared to its Special counterparts. It lacks Swords Dance, relying on Bulk Up to boost itself, which doesn't hold onto the boost nearly as long as SD would. The Defense boost helps with all the physical threats coming after standard M2 / MM2Y, though.
MM2X took me a bit to get used to. This way of running M2 makes the base form much worse, being stuck with unSTAB'd attacks off of 110 Attack. However, when I found the right team after discussing it on discord -
and - I started performing much better. Like MM2Y, the coverage you run alongside Brick Break depends on the team, and with Garchomp covering Ground-weaks and Chandelure taking Skarmory out of the sky, I ran Bulk Up, Brick Break, Poison Jab, and Stone Edge to great success. It also helps that Brick Break destroys the many screens out there right now.Turns out, all the checks MM2Y has, are mostly weak to MM2X. Dark-types? Bug-types? Never heard of 'em. You're weaker to Xerneas now, but funnily enough, a lot of Xerneas are switching to physical sets using Night Slash and Megahorn, and MM2X is neutral to those moves and has Bulk Up to sponge the hits better. Plus, this is what boosted Poison Jab does to it:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Poison Jab+ vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 191-224 (81.9 - 96.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
If Xern is chipped, it's donezo. Yveltal's not excused from class, either, because it's gonna get this work:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Stone Edge+ vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Yveltal: 236-278 (101.2 - 119.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
While you lose your Psychic-resistance, you actually take on other Mewtwo surprisingly-well. Boosted Stone Edge into Poison Jab kills MM2Y, and has a chance to take regular Mewtwo out, as well.
Overall, while I had lower expectations of MM2X and initially wrote it off, it's actually really strong and should be respected.
Absol @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Night Slash
- Close Combat
- Play Rough
Holy shit, this thing is amazing. It's thriving in this meta right now. Not only does it feast on all the Mewtwo running around, but the Mewtwo counters aren't safe, either. +1 Play Rough+ does 89% minimum to Yveltal, so it dies if it's chipped. +1 Night Slash doesn't even need Plus Power to kill MM2Y, and if it's MM2X, +1 Play Rough+ does 93% minimum. There's a bunch of Tyranitar on the ladder for some reason, which means Absol has been feasting well. Close Combat and Play Rough are nice for the other meta staples, including Excadrill, Garchomp, Glaceon, Mega Gyarados, Dragonite, and Lucario, while Night Slash cuts through Metagross, Chandelure, Delphox, and Gengar, often through screens thanks to the high crit rate.
Another great benefit is that it's fast on its feet. It's able to chase down targets quite easily, and if Night Slash misses, it's not a big loss since it has a quick cooldown. Play Rough and Close Combat also teleport you to your targets, which help with closing the distance.
The main disadvantage is its frailty, but if you practice Guerrilla Warfare with Absol, you'll get results. Blitz cooked with this Absol set!
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It's pretty good for hitting Metagross if you aren't running Flamethrower or Earth Power though. Psychic/Ghost/Electric hits pretty much everything at least neutrally.
Right, but as you said, I can get that Metagross coverage with Earth Power, which hits quite a few more Pokemon for super effective, including Ampharos, the grounded Fire-types, Excadrill, Lucario, Pikachu, Tyranitar, etc. That’s way more targets than what Shadow Ball would cover for me. Also, because it’s a ball-move, Shadow Ball has a tendency to miss whereas Earth Power is homing, so even if it’s a neutral hit into Mewtwo, it ends up being more consistent especially from a distance. Psychic/Ice/Ground is equally neutral into just about everything, too.
What’s the ampharos set?Been playing with the Mega Mewtwos for the past few hours. If you wanted to know what playing with a DBZ character (Freeza) is like in ZA, both of them offer that experience.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite Y
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
- Psyshock / Psystrike
- Some combo of Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Earth Power / Focus Blast / Flamethrower / Shadow Ball / Solar Beam / Hurricane /
Mewtwo has coverage for fucking days. I don't think Solar Beam or Hurricane Mewtwo will ever be a thing, but...they're options lol. I also think Shadow Ball is overrated on Mewtwo. You're just using it to hit other Mewtwo super effectively while boosted Psyshock and its other coverage already chunks Mewtwo pretty hard. However, if there's a time to run it, it'd be now since everyone's experimenting with Mewtwo. I'd just rather hit more of the meta harder.
Whichever coverage moves you opt to run will depend on your team composition. I've been running Calm Mind, Psyshock, Ice Beam, and Earth Power with
MM2Y is also hella fast, hence why I think MM2Y is worth it. That extra bit of Speed MM2Y gets puts it in range of a cooldown threshold with a small amount of Speed investment, turning all of its 8 second cooldown moves into the fastest-possible 3 seconds.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brick Break
- Some combo of Poison Jab / Stone Edge / Earthquake / Elemental Punches
Physical Mega Mewtwo X, on the other hand, doesn't have as many options compared to its Special counterparts. It lacks Swords Dance, relying on Bulk Up to boost itself, which doesn't hold onto the boost nearly as long as SD would. The Defense boost helps with all the physical threats coming after standard M2 / MM2Y, though.
MM2X took me a bit to get used to. This way of running M2 makes the base form much worse, being stuck with unSTAB'd attacks off of 110 Attack. However, when I found the right team after discussing it on discord -
Turns out, all the checks MM2Y has, are mostly weak to MM2X. Dark-types? Bug-types? Never heard of 'em. You're weaker to Xerneas now, but funnily enough, a lot of Xerneas are switching to physical sets using Night Slash and Megahorn, and MM2X is neutral to those moves and has Bulk Up to sponge the hits better. Plus, this is what boosted Poison Jab does to it:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Poison Jab+ vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 191-224 (81.9 - 96.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
If Xern is chipped, it's donezo. Yveltal's not excused from class, either, because it's gonna get this work:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Stone Edge+ vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Yveltal: 236-278 (101.2 - 119.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
While you lose your Psychic-resistance, you actually take on other Mewtwo surprisingly-well. Boosted Stone Edge into Poison Jab kills MM2Y, and has a chance to take regular Mewtwo out, as well.
Overall, while I had lower expectations of MM2X and initially wrote it off, it's actually really strong and should be respected.
Absol @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Night Slash
- Close Combat
- Play Rough
Holy shit, this thing is amazing. It's thriving in this meta right now. Not only does it feast on all the Mewtwo running around, but the Mewtwo counters aren't safe, either. +1 Play Rough+ does 89% minimum to Yveltal, so it dies if it's chipped. +1 Night Slash doesn't even need Plus Power to kill MM2Y, and if it's MM2X, +1 Play Rough+ does 93% minimum. There's a bunch of Tyranitar on the ladder for some reason, which means Absol has been feasting well. Close Combat and Play Rough are nice for the other meta staples, including Excadrill, Garchomp, Glaceon, Mega Gyarados, Dragonite, and Lucario, while Night Slash cuts through Metagross, Chandelure, Delphox, and Gengar, often through screens thanks to the high crit rate.
Another great benefit is that it's fast on its feet. It's able to chase down targets quite easily, and if Night Slash misses, it's not a big loss since it has a quick cooldown. Play Rough and Close Combat also teleport you to your targets, which help with closing the distance.
The main disadvantage is its frailty, but if you practice Guerrilla Warfare with Absol, you'll get results. Blitz cooked with this Absol set!
Ampharos @ Shuca Berry
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Charge
- Thunderbolt
The standard set. It's currently the best dual-purpose supporter + sniper, giving you screens while killing mons from far away with Charge-boosted Thunderbolts.
Was that your lead? Or was it Mewtwo?
Ampharos @ Shuca Berry
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Charge
- Thunderbolt
The standard set. It's currently the best dual-purpose supporter + sniper, giving you screens while killing mons from far away with Charge-boosted Thunderbolts.
Ampharos is the lead, since it's there to set screens initially. It's a great way to generate a good amount of mega energy at the start of the match.
Thanks I’ll have to give the team a go
I'm very very interested in this Absol set, as I want to pair it up with my Dragalge to deal with all the Mewtwos, Metagross, and annoying dragons/psychics running around.Been playing with the Mega Mewtwos for the past few hours. If you wanted to know what playing with a DBZ character (Freeza) is like in ZA, both of them offer that experience.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite Y
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
- Psyshock / Psystrike
- Some combo of Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Earth Power / Focus Blast / Flamethrower / Shadow Ball / Solar Beam / Hurricane /
Mewtwo has coverage for fucking days. I don't think Solar Beam or Hurricane Mewtwo will ever be a thing, but...they're options lol. I also think Shadow Ball is overrated on Mewtwo. You're just using it to hit other Mewtwo super effectively while boosted Psyshock and its other coverage already chunks Mewtwo pretty hard. However, if there's a time to run it, it'd be now since everyone's experimenting with Mewtwo. I'd just rather hit more of the meta harder.
Whichever coverage moves you opt to run will depend on your team composition. I've been running Calm Mind, Psyshock, Ice Beam, and Earth Power with
MM2Y is also hella fast, hence why I think MM2Y is worth it. That extra bit of Speed MM2Y gets puts it in range of a cooldown threshold with a small amount of Speed investment, turning all of its 8 second cooldown moves into the fastest-possible 3 seconds.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brick Break
- Some combo of Poison Jab / Stone Edge / Earthquake / Elemental Punches
Physical Mega Mewtwo X, on the other hand, doesn't have as many options compared to its Special counterparts. It lacks Swords Dance, relying on Bulk Up to boost itself, which doesn't hold onto the boost nearly as long as SD would. The Defense boost helps with all the physical threats coming after standard M2 / MM2Y, though.
MM2X took me a bit to get used to. This way of running M2 makes the base form much worse, being stuck with unSTAB'd attacks off of 110 Attack. However, when I found the right team after discussing it on discord -
Turns out, all the checks MM2Y has, are mostly weak to MM2X. Dark-types? Bug-types? Never heard of 'em. You're weaker to Xerneas now, but funnily enough, a lot of Xerneas are switching to physical sets using Night Slash and Megahorn, and MM2X is neutral to those moves and has Bulk Up to sponge the hits better. Plus, this is what boosted Poison Jab does to it:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Poison Jab+ vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xerneas: 191-224 (81.9 - 96.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
If Xern is chipped, it's donezo. Yveltal's not excused from class, either, because it's gonna get this work:
+1 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-X Stone Edge+ vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Yveltal: 236-278 (101.2 - 119.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
While you lose your Psychic-resistance, you actually take on other Mewtwo surprisingly-well. Boosted Stone Edge into Poison Jab kills MM2Y, and has a chance to take regular Mewtwo out, as well.
Overall, while I had lower expectations of MM2X and initially wrote it off, it's actually really strong and should be respected.
Absol @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Night Slash
- Close Combat
- Play Rough
Holy shit, this thing is amazing. It's thriving in this meta right now. Not only does it feast on all the Mewtwo running around, but the Mewtwo counters aren't safe, either. +1 Play Rough+ does 89% minimum to Yveltal, so it dies if it's chipped. +1 Night Slash doesn't even need Plus Power to kill MM2Y, and if it's MM2X, +1 Play Rough+ does 93% minimum. There's a bunch of Tyranitar on the ladder for some reason, which means Absol has been feasting well. Close Combat and Play Rough are nice for the other meta staples, including Excadrill, Garchomp, Glaceon, Mega Gyarados, Dragonite, and Lucario, while Night Slash cuts through Metagross, Chandelure, Delphox, and Gengar, often through screens thanks to the high crit rate.
Another great benefit is that it's fast on its feet. It's able to chase down targets quite easily, and if Night Slash misses, it's not a big loss since it has a quick cooldown. Play Rough and Close Combat also teleport you to your targets, which help with closing the distance.
The main disadvantage is its frailty, but if you practice Guerrilla Warfare with Absol, you'll get results. Blitz cooked with this Absol set!
Alright, time to bring some negativity into the picture! I'm gonna bring up what I believe to be among the worst/most outclassed Megas in this game, and see if you can convince me otherwise or if there are even some that are worse than I thought.
Even before a certain Genetic Pokemon entered the picture, I already struggle to see reason to dedicate this Mega to a team. Sure, Nasty Plot-boosted Psychics off 175 SpAtk can definitely put in work, but the reality of the matter is that those Psychics don't actually oneshot all that much outside of the occasional Poison-type running around (since even the Fighting-types you do see on Ranked can be a tossup as to whether or not they're actually weak to Psychic). More often than not, Mega Alakazam's most common way of securing OHKOes would be to Focus Blast or Shadow Ball whatever happens to be rushing it down at the time, like an Excadrill or Metagross, but those moves definitely do not cover everything, and between Mega Zam's poor defensive typing, bad bulk, and lack of solid quick startup moves, Mega Alakazam almost always loses to nearly any non-Fighting-type that manages to close the gap. Other similarly frail, glass cannon Megas like Gardevoir, Gengar, and Delphox at least have the resistances (like Dragon, Fairy, Steel) to not be as vulnerable to everything that rush them down and can actually function as emergency defensive pivots, and simply sport better STABs/coverage for superior oneshot potential and better combat the rest of the format than rely purely on unSTAB coverage and rarely meaningful Psychic-STAB. It's not that Mega Alakazam can't work; I just don't think Mega Alakazam's advantages are worth its sheer inflexibility, and all this is not even accounting for the existence of Mewtwo now.
Much like Mega Alakazam, Mega Sharpedo suffers from two key flaws: it's not bulky, but it doesn't have the raw OHKO power to make up for it. Except unlike Mega Alakazam, which at least has the (slight) raw power advantage over its contemporaries, the primary competitor Mega Gyarados happens to get nearly all of the same moves you'd want to run on Mega Sharpedo, and does it all on a stronger and tankier build. To rub salt in the wound, Mega Sharpedo doesn't have a reliable boosting move to compensate; it does get Focus Energy, but Mega Greninja has Swords Dance so even on the angle of a boosting Mega Water/Dark type, Mega Shark is not the best choice, and Swords Dance Mega Greninja is already not very appealing compared to Nasty Plot variants. Mega Sharpedo is rather pigeonholed into running the two most distinguishing features it has over its brethren; Close Combat is good coverage but I usually end up favoring other CC Dark-type Megas like Mega Scrafty or Mega Absol which have better stats and toolkits (aka boosting move) to take advantage of this. Flip Turn is an interesting move to complement Mega Sharpedo's above average movement speed + hit-and-run playstyle (and has room to fit it unlike Mega Greninja), especially with its ability to let Mega Sharpedo potentially dodge moves, but the timing needs to be near frame perfect for that, and with Flip Turn's unimpressive startup time, this is pretty difficult to execute consistently, plus Protect is probably just better for the faster startup and longer invulnerability period. Not to mention, why go through the mental gymnastics of trying to perfectly time invincibility frames when you can just have Mega Gyarados simply tank the damage and unga bunga its way through a crowd anyway (and it still can Bounce anyway to dodge moves for good measure).
Mega Pinsir is an unfortunate mon on several metrics. It has pretty nice coverage with Earthquake, Stone Edge, Close Combat, and even Outrage, but it lacks Megahorn which leaves it considerably lacking in raw power compared to Mega Heracross and Mega Scolipede. Mega Beedrill and Mega Scizor may also lack Megahorn, but their alternative STAB at least makes up for this by letting them slay Fairy-types (aka Xerneas) which Mega Pinsir flops against. Meanwhile, Mega Pinsir's only Flying STAB in this game is Aerial Ace, so all its Flying-type does is let itself get sniped by Thunderbolts and Ice Beams for basically no benefit.
So when are you actually going to Mega this thing? Sableye basically plays like the Grimmsnarl of ZA in that its best (only) role is to set up Dual Screens and Parting Shot away to neuter the hell out of anything trying to KO you, because lord knows a non-Mega Sableye can achieve fuk all otherwise. This means that there is almost no value in trying to Mega a Dual Screens Sableye; if you try to build a moveset tailored around Mega Sableye specifically (like say, Bulk Up + Recover), non-Mega Sableye will likely just end up being a bench sitter since it can't win jackshit 1v1. Mawile suffers from similar issues but at the very least Mega Mawile is remotely worth the payoff; you can't really say the same about this gremlin.
As far as I can tell, the most interesting thing Audino has going for it is that it has the second largest Wish in the game, which isn't really saying a lot when Audino's 105 HP Wishes aren't too far apart from Vaporeon's 118 HP Wishes and Umbreon/Sylveon's 101 HP Wishes. Considering Wish has constrained value in a format where the amount of switching you can do is limited per life, and this is already not a particularly bragworthy niche (especially since Vaporeon barely even uses the move either). Not only that, but Vaporeon, Umbreon, and Sylveon are VASTLY superior Pokemon than even Mega Audino, much less the utter fodder that is base Audino that threatens literally nothing without the aid of 4x effective coverage (aka BoltBeam is pretty much mandatory on this). Since that coverage is unSTAB, you're never OHKOing anything off that pitiful 60 base SpAtk in a format where everything and their mothers run max HP EVs; you'd even struggle to 2HKO those targets if you don't have an effective follow-up attack. If I'd rather consider a non-Mega Clefable over this, you know this is a dire case for Mega Audino, never mind the fact that base Audino is absolutely not worth putting up with. Speaking of Pokemon that are not worth putting up with in general...
Do I even really need to explain why this is here? Malamar can have all the coverage it wants: Dark Pulse, Night Slash/Knock Off, Psycho Cut, Psyshock/Psychic, Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, Close Combat, Liquidation, Poison Jab, Rock Slide, etc., it doesn't change the fact that both Malamar and Mega Malamar simply do not have the stats to abuse this coverage. The combination of mediocre power, subpar bulk, and awful defensive typing all culminate together such that Mega Malamar will only ever reliably pick up KOes against weakened enemies or foes that have their backs turned against it, giving it "Spy is the worst class in TF2" syndrome. If the opponent spots you and god forbid lands the first hit on you, good luck winning that fight unless they're somehow frail enough to get oneshot. At least Mega Audino's bulk jumps up to the point where it can try to facetank its opponent; Mega Malamar doesn't even have that going for it.
These are about the worst Megas I've had the displeasure of experiencing off the top of my head; even other disappointing Megas can have some niche carved out for them (for example, Mega Pyroar's Work Up-boosted Hyper Beam is technically the strongest attack that a special attacking Fire-type Mega can do against a Garchomp that outranges its Earthquake, so that's still something). Are there other Megas that you can't seem to justify using?
Even before a certain Genetic Pokemon entered the picture, I already struggle to see reason to dedicate this Mega to a team. Sure, Nasty Plot-boosted Psychics off 175 SpAtk can definitely put in work, but the reality of the matter is that those Psychics don't actually oneshot all that much outside of the occasional Poison-type running around (since even the Fighting-types you do see on Ranked can be a tossup as to whether or not they're actually weak to Psychic). More often than not, Mega Alakazam's most common way of securing OHKOes would be to Focus Blast or Shadow Ball whatever happens to be rushing it down at the time, like an Excadrill or Metagross, but those moves definitely do not cover everything, and between Mega Zam's poor defensive typing, bad bulk, and lack of solid quick startup moves, Mega Alakazam almost always loses to nearly any non-Fighting-type that manages to close the gap. Other similarly frail, glass cannon Megas like Gardevoir, Gengar, and Delphox at least have the resistances (like Dragon, Fairy, Steel) to not be as vulnerable to everything that rush them down and can actually function as emergency defensive pivots, and simply sport better STABs/coverage for superior oneshot potential and better combat the rest of the format than rely purely on unSTAB coverage and rarely meaningful Psychic-STAB. It's not that Mega Alakazam can't work; I just don't think Mega Alakazam's advantages are worth its sheer inflexibility, and all this is not even accounting for the existence of Mewtwo now.
Much like Mega Alakazam, Mega Sharpedo suffers from two key flaws: it's not bulky, but it doesn't have the raw OHKO power to make up for it. Except unlike Mega Alakazam, which at least has the (slight) raw power advantage over its contemporaries, the primary competitor Mega Gyarados happens to get nearly all of the same moves you'd want to run on Mega Sharpedo, and does it all on a stronger and tankier build. To rub salt in the wound, Mega Sharpedo doesn't have a reliable boosting move to compensate; it does get Focus Energy, but Mega Greninja has Swords Dance so even on the angle of a boosting Mega Water/Dark type, Mega Shark is not the best choice, and Swords Dance Mega Greninja is already not very appealing compared to Nasty Plot variants. Mega Sharpedo is rather pigeonholed into running the two most distinguishing features it has over its brethren; Close Combat is good coverage but I usually end up favoring other CC Dark-type Megas like Mega Scrafty or Mega Absol which have better stats and toolkits (aka boosting move) to take advantage of this. Flip Turn is an interesting move to complement Mega Sharpedo's above average movement speed + hit-and-run playstyle (and has room to fit it unlike Mega Greninja), especially with its ability to let Mega Sharpedo potentially dodge moves, but the timing needs to be near frame perfect for that, and with Flip Turn's unimpressive startup time, this is pretty difficult to execute consistently, plus Protect is probably just better for the faster startup and longer invulnerability period. Not to mention, why go through the mental gymnastics of trying to perfectly time invincibility frames when you can just have Mega Gyarados simply tank the damage and unga bunga its way through a crowd anyway (and it still can Bounce anyway to dodge moves for good measure).
Mega Pinsir is an unfortunate mon on several metrics. It has pretty nice coverage with Earthquake, Stone Edge, Close Combat, and even Outrage, but it lacks Megahorn which leaves it considerably lacking in raw power compared to Mega Heracross and Mega Scolipede. Mega Beedrill and Mega Scizor may also lack Megahorn, but their alternative STAB at least makes up for this by letting them slay Fairy-types (aka Xerneas) which Mega Pinsir flops against. Meanwhile, Mega Pinsir's only Flying STAB in this game is Aerial Ace, so all its Flying-type does is let itself get sniped by Thunderbolts and Ice Beams for basically no benefit.
So when are you actually going to Mega this thing? Sableye basically plays like the Grimmsnarl of ZA in that its best (only) role is to set up Dual Screens and Parting Shot away to neuter the hell out of anything trying to KO you, because lord knows a non-Mega Sableye can achieve fuk all otherwise. This means that there is almost no value in trying to Mega a Dual Screens Sableye; if you try to build a moveset tailored around Mega Sableye specifically (like say, Bulk Up + Recover), non-Mega Sableye will likely just end up being a bench sitter since it can't win jackshit 1v1. Mawile suffers from similar issues but at the very least Mega Mawile is remotely worth the payoff; you can't really say the same about this gremlin.
As far as I can tell, the most interesting thing Audino has going for it is that it has the second largest Wish in the game, which isn't really saying a lot when Audino's 105 HP Wishes aren't too far apart from Vaporeon's 118 HP Wishes and Umbreon/Sylveon's 101 HP Wishes. Considering Wish has constrained value in a format where the amount of switching you can do is limited per life, and this is already not a particularly bragworthy niche (especially since Vaporeon barely even uses the move either). Not only that, but Vaporeon, Umbreon, and Sylveon are VASTLY superior Pokemon than even Mega Audino, much less the utter fodder that is base Audino that threatens literally nothing without the aid of 4x effective coverage (aka BoltBeam is pretty much mandatory on this). Since that coverage is unSTAB, you're never OHKOing anything off that pitiful 60 base SpAtk in a format where everything and their mothers run max HP EVs; you'd even struggle to 2HKO those targets if you don't have an effective follow-up attack. If I'd rather consider a non-Mega Clefable over this, you know this is a dire case for Mega Audino, never mind the fact that base Audino is absolutely not worth putting up with. Speaking of Pokemon that are not worth putting up with in general...
Do I even really need to explain why this is here? Malamar can have all the coverage it wants: Dark Pulse, Night Slash/Knock Off, Psycho Cut, Psyshock/Psychic, Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, Close Combat, Liquidation, Poison Jab, Rock Slide, etc., it doesn't change the fact that both Malamar and Mega Malamar simply do not have the stats to abuse this coverage. The combination of mediocre power, subpar bulk, and awful defensive typing all culminate together such that Mega Malamar will only ever reliably pick up KOes against weakened enemies or foes that have their backs turned against it, giving it "Spy is the worst class in TF2" syndrome. If the opponent spots you and god forbid lands the first hit on you, good luck winning that fight unless they're somehow frail enough to get oneshot. At least Mega Audino's bulk jumps up to the point where it can try to facetank its opponent; Mega Malamar doesn't even have that going for it.
These are about the worst Megas I've had the displeasure of experiencing off the top of my head; even other disappointing Megas can have some niche carved out for them (for example, Mega Pyroar's Work Up-boosted Hyper Beam is technically the strongest attack that a special attacking Fire-type Mega can do against a Garchomp that outranges its Earthquake, so that's still something). Are there other Megas that you can't seem to justify using?
Ooh I can answer this one.
As someone who’s used mostly everything in this game, I agree w/ the above list, especially stuff like Mega Zam / Pinsir who not only felt painful to use, but I have seen exactly ONCE in nearly 700 battles. Ironically, I think Mega Malamar is the most usable of the bunch here: its bulk isn’t the worst, and it can skirmish off against the legion of Mewtwo / MMY and come out of most of those interactions fine. My friend labbed it more than me, and he has some nice clips with it! It’s felt better than other competing Dark-type Megas like Mega Scrafty or Mega Absol too, but even then, those mons aren’t strictly “bad”. Still wouldn’t seriously recommend it, tho.
I will, however, share a mon I’ve labbed extensively, and have had the misfortune/displeasure of using.
Oo boy, where do I begin with Mega Chesnaught?
On paper (and in a turn-based format), this thing is absolutely demonic and has the stats to back it up. It’s super tanky, it’s strong, and has a cool typing that gives it some awesome defensive attributies. And hey, Chesnaught is raw as fuck and super cool, so why WOULDN’T you want to use this?
Jesus fuck, this thing is agony. Slow movement speed out the gate is bad, and it gets sniped by a lot of stupid shit in this game (primarily Heat Wave, Ice Beam, and Psyshock/Psychic). Its movepool is devoid of fast options and gap closers, with Close Combat, Dig, and Giga Impact largely being its only “real” options - CC doesn’t hit a lot SE, and neuters its nice bulk, Dig is super telegraphed, and Giga Impact doesn’t hit anything SE and leaves it wide open for a snipe after it gets casted. Grass STAB? Fuck. Do you know how many Vaporeon and Clawitzer WALKED AWAY from my Wood Hammers after I predicted an Ice Beam with Spiky Shield? You can’t even chase them LOL this thing is so slow. I even tried VINE WHIP because it’s fast and… it’s obviously Vine Whip. Rollout, Stone Edge, EQ, Bulk Up… seriously I gave this thing everything, and changed up teammates to support its glaring shortcomings. In MOST of my (competent lobby) games, its teammates not only got more kills combined, but contributed more defensively than Chesnaught ever did. The best I ever got to do with it was claim random kills on people not noticing it, or Spiky Shield -> follow-up KO with like Vine Whip or Rollout, and not only was this uncommon, it’s something that many other Pokémon can do without feeling like you’re lugging a sack of shit that expends Mega Gauge and prevents you from plusing moves.
And mind, I tested this pre-Mewtwo release, where it struggles with everything I said above… in a Xern meta (giga loses to this lol). Now, add Mewtwo to the fray… yea.
Horrific, fraudulent mon. If DLC gives it non-shit Grass STAB, and bans like half of the top tier in a future season, then this thing can maybe do something.
May its glory be restored in Champions.
As someone who’s used mostly everything in this game, I agree w/ the above list, especially stuff like Mega Zam / Pinsir who not only felt painful to use, but I have seen exactly ONCE in nearly 700 battles. Ironically, I think Mega Malamar is the most usable of the bunch here: its bulk isn’t the worst, and it can skirmish off against the legion of Mewtwo / MMY and come out of most of those interactions fine. My friend labbed it more than me, and he has some nice clips with it! It’s felt better than other competing Dark-type Megas like Mega Scrafty or Mega Absol too, but even then, those mons aren’t strictly “bad”. Still wouldn’t seriously recommend it, tho.
I will, however, share a mon I’ve labbed extensively, and have had the misfortune/displeasure of using.
Oo boy, where do I begin with Mega Chesnaught?
On paper (and in a turn-based format), this thing is absolutely demonic and has the stats to back it up. It’s super tanky, it’s strong, and has a cool typing that gives it some awesome defensive attributies. And hey, Chesnaught is raw as fuck and super cool, so why WOULDN’T you want to use this?
Jesus fuck, this thing is agony. Slow movement speed out the gate is bad, and it gets sniped by a lot of stupid shit in this game (primarily Heat Wave, Ice Beam, and Psyshock/Psychic). Its movepool is devoid of fast options and gap closers, with Close Combat, Dig, and Giga Impact largely being its only “real” options - CC doesn’t hit a lot SE, and neuters its nice bulk, Dig is super telegraphed, and Giga Impact doesn’t hit anything SE and leaves it wide open for a snipe after it gets casted. Grass STAB? Fuck. Do you know how many Vaporeon and Clawitzer WALKED AWAY from my Wood Hammers after I predicted an Ice Beam with Spiky Shield? You can’t even chase them LOL this thing is so slow. I even tried VINE WHIP because it’s fast and… it’s obviously Vine Whip. Rollout, Stone Edge, EQ, Bulk Up… seriously I gave this thing everything, and changed up teammates to support its glaring shortcomings. In MOST of my (competent lobby) games, its teammates not only got more kills combined, but contributed more defensively than Chesnaught ever did. The best I ever got to do with it was claim random kills on people not noticing it, or Spiky Shield -> follow-up KO with like Vine Whip or Rollout, and not only was this uncommon, it’s something that many other Pokémon can do without feeling like you’re lugging a sack of shit that expends Mega Gauge and prevents you from plusing moves.
And mind, I tested this pre-Mewtwo release, where it struggles with everything I said above… in a Xern meta (giga loses to this lol). Now, add Mewtwo to the fray… yea.
Horrific, fraudulent mon. If DLC gives it non-shit Grass STAB, and bans like half of the top tier in a future season, then this thing can maybe do something.
May its glory be restored in Champions.
I haven't had the chance to test MMY (sorry, MMX, but I'm just not that into you) because of work. I'll probably be able to tonight or in a couple of days. I really want to use Psyshock (sorry, Psytrike, but...), BoltBeam, and Earth Power. Has anyone had luck with 4 attacks after mega evolving or do I really need NP to get those KOs? I figured I'd start off with something that can get my mega energy built up and then either switch to Mewtwo or wait until I go down.
On another note, I think I'm going to give Mega Scizor a shot since it should theoretically handle Metagross and non-boosted, non-Flamethrower Mewtwo well. I'm thinking of opening with LO Garchomp and keeping Mega Scizor and Mega Mewtwo Y back for when it's time to nuke.
I may say "nope" to Garchomp and go for another BoltBeamer with Expert Belt as my opener.
On another note, I think I'm going to give Mega Scizor a shot since it should theoretically handle Metagross and non-boosted, non-Flamethrower Mewtwo well. I'm thinking of opening with LO Garchomp and keeping Mega Scizor and Mega Mewtwo Y back for when it's time to nuke.
I may say "nope" to Garchomp and go for another BoltBeamer with Expert Belt as my opener.
I missed CM/NP, personally, even while Mega. It's especially bad when you're base form Mewtwo because you just don't have the strength to muscle past what you want to, mainly the restricteds. The great thing about setup MM2Y is that base form M2 is strong enough on its own without LO to get kills, making the pre-mega stage not that taxing. Theoretically, 4 Attacks with Psyshock, Ice Beam, Thunderbolt, and Earth Power would make for a great sniper, but in practice, you use it as a kill-stealer against chipped enemies.
My subpar performance might be skill issue, though. I'm just too used to setting up lol
I think Ice Beam+ with a Brave nature may have merit as a coverage option just to entirely KO non-Yache Berry Garchomp with a sliver of chip damage, given its prominence in the metagame. Because it's a sniping move, Ice Beam can also allow Mewtwo to pick off other Ice-weak or heavily damaged targets from relatively safe distances before Mega Evolving and potentially lure opponents into thinking this Mewtwo is an entirely special variant; even uninvested, Mewtwo's Special Attack is equivalent to a fully invested, positive-natured base 107.
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brick Break
- Some combo of Poison Jab / Stone Edge / Earthquake / Elemental Punches
I've used Stone Edge and Ice Beam for coverage with Focus Sash Garchomp and Shuca Berry Chandelure as teammates for 20 matches, ending with a 13-6-0-1 placement rate. This team seems a bit prone to Xerneas and Water-types, so I had to rely on boosted Garchomp's Poison Jab + Earthquake and Chandelure's Solar Beam+, respectively, to have a chance to fend them off.
I had briefly talked about Mega Scizor in a previous post, and in my mission to continue finding viable niche mons, and not use a single Restricted (yet), I took the thing out for a run today. Its overall performance was solid, and imo has a proper niche in this format.
Scizor @ Scizorite
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Lunge
- Steel Wing
- Night Slash
- Swords Dance
This set is what I ultimately ended up with. Straightforward stuff: Lunge is your gap closer, and drops Atk to allow you to better tank shit with your beefy Def, think of stuff like MMX or Chomper. Steel Wing targets Xern and the Icies, and most importantly isn’t Iron Head lol. Night Slash is fast, and is necessary in order to delete the 2 main fires that MZor obviously attracts; it also gives you a 2nd option into Mewtwo if they Mega Evolve to avoid Lunge. SD is how you push said kills.
Unfortunately, moves like Bullet Punch and fighting coverage are not things you can fit. You end up with a worse MZor overall.
Positives:
- Incredible movement speed (matching Xern and co.), allowing it to viably run away from moves like Earthquake or positioning behind poles to avoid beams like Hydro Pump.
- Beefy Def means it loves getting into physical skirmishes, even into things it might have a tougher time with, such as Excadrill or (non-Mega) Gyarados.
- As mentioned above, coverage targets the main 2 restricteds (Xern/Mewtwo) and some popular meta stuff, properly giving Scizor the ability to grab kills.
Negatives:
- Huge Fire weak: you need to abuse the Mega iframes to dodge Heat Waves, and multiple Fire mons makes its life hell (haha). It also doesn’t have guaranteed kills with +1 plus’d Night Slash into Chandelure (base is around 20% chance to OHKO), its Mega, and Mega Phox, so you need to account for that either by letting something chip or, using Lunge into Night Slash. Heat Wave also makes it so you have to be pretty aware of what’s going on outside your circle, which makes this thing harder to use.
- Weak moves: this thing’s moves betray its base 150 Atk, and it’s not doing -too- much to neutral targets, so you’re relying on their speed and Mega Scizor’s own kiting in order to get their maximum value. You also cannot chase with this thing, because you will miss stuff like Steel Wing and Night Slash, and this is a learning curve to using Mega Scizor (not unlike Absol) where you can’t mash buttons for free.
- It’s a Mega: opportunity cost of using other Megas aside, it requires and expends Mega gauge, which naturally lessens your ability to plus moves with your other mons. Itemless base Scizor is also very mediocre given its much lower speed compared to its Mega, and how it misses kills like Lunge on Mewtwo lol (imo why it’s unviable).
- The reward for using MZor is only moderately high. It doesn’t have too many lows, but you gotta build around it to maximize its value, and it can be pretty whatever into lobbies where the restricteds aren’t roaming around.
Pair with teammates that can deal with Fires, and ideally smth for Grounds. I used Sash Megahorn Drill / LO Solar Beam Chandy / MZor for the best version of the team so far; Sash Chomp over Drill and LO M2 over Chandy are things that can be considered too.
Fun mon!
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I've been following this Youtuber (Luxfos) who does a pretty banger job at showcasing the Megas he uses. In Mega Absol's case, its niche is apparently pumping out the strongest Knock Offs + Night Slashes in the game (backed by Swords Dance no less), and since both moves have very quick startup, it ends up 2HKOing most Dark-neutral opponents before they can 2HKO back or even respond, and it is especially effective at dispatching non-Mega Pokemon since Knock Off smashes them even harder. He used Stone Edge on his Mega Absol since Rock is just generally good coverage in the meta, but other coverage like Close Combat and Play Rough have their merit and can be considered.Ooh I can answer this one.
As someone who’s used mostly everything in this game, I agree w/ the above list, especially stuff like Mega Zam / Pinsir who not only felt painful to use, but I have seen exactly ONCE in nearly 700 battles. Ironically, I think Mega Malamar is the most usable of the bunch here: its bulk isn’t the worst, and it can skirmish off against the legion of Mewtwo / MMY and come out of most of those interactions fine. My friend labbed it more than me, and he has some nice clips with it! It’s felt better than other competing Dark-type Megas like Mega Scrafty or Mega Absol too, but even then, those mons aren’t strictly “bad”. Still wouldn’t seriously recommend it, tho.
I will, however, share a mon I’ve labbed extensively, and have had the misfortune/displeasure of using.
Oo boy, where do I begin with Mega Chesnaught?
On paper (and in a turn-based format), this thing is absolutely demonic and has the stats to back it up. It’s super tanky, it’s strong, and has a cool typing that gives it some awesome defensive attributies. And hey, Chesnaught is raw as fuck and super cool, so why WOULDN’T you want to use this?
Jesus fuck, this thing is agony. Slow movement speed out the gate is bad, and it gets sniped by a lot of stupid shit in this game (primarily Heat Wave, Ice Beam, and Psyshock/Psychic). Its movepool is devoid of fast options and gap closers, with Close Combat, Dig, and Giga Impact largely being its only “real” options - CC doesn’t hit a lot SE, and neuters its nice bulk, Dig is super telegraphed, and Giga Impact doesn’t hit anything SE and leaves it wide open for a snipe after it gets casted. Grass STAB? Fuck. Do you know how many Vaporeon and Clawitzer WALKED AWAY from my Wood Hammers after I predicted an Ice Beam with Spiky Shield? You can’t even chase them LOL this thing is so slow. I even tried VINE WHIP because it’s fast and… it’s obviously Vine Whip. Rollout, Stone Edge, EQ, Bulk Up… seriously I gave this thing everything, and changed up teammates to support its glaring shortcomings. In MOST of my (competent lobby) games, its teammates not only got more kills combined, but contributed more defensively than Chesnaught ever did. The best I ever got to do with it was claim random kills on people not noticing it, or Spiky Shield -> follow-up KO with like Vine Whip or Rollout, and not only was this uncommon, it’s something that many other Pokémon can do without feeling like you’re lugging a sack of shit that expends Mega Gauge and prevents you from plusing moves.
And mind, I tested this pre-Mewtwo release, where it struggles with everything I said above… in a Xern meta (giga loses to this lol). Now, add Mewtwo to the fray… yea.
Horrific, fraudulent mon. If DLC gives it non-shit Grass STAB, and bans like half of the top tier in a future season, then this thing can maybe do something.
May its glory be restored in Champions.
The points you made about Mega Chesnaught are fair; the aforementioned Youtuber Luxfos did actually test Vine Whip at one point (and funnily enough did get kills with it lol). It definitely struggles with its movement speed and lack of good gap closers and its typing certainly leaves it open to getting sniped from afar, but I've found that aside from Brave Bird users, barely anything else actually wants to engage Mega Chesnaught in close-quarters combat. UnSTAB Ice Punches just bounce right off, and that Flare Blitz user had better have a Swords Dance and + boost under its belt or it's leaving itself open to getting Stone Edged. That said, Mega Chesnaught does feel bad in that it's a Mega Grass-type that does not try to take advantage of Solarbeam in any capacity, and even in the role of "tanky Fighting-type that you don't want to get close to", Mega Scrafty probably occupies that niche better with less weaknesses and superior coverage.
Another thing I've discovered is that Head Smash is REALLY good. Like, "simply having that move is enough to be worth consideration" levels of good. It is the strongest of all the rushing moves in the game, and coupled with Rock's rather solid coverage, the amount of times I've seen it either oneshot a non-resistant opponent or go 2-for-1 when rushing into a crowd is unreal. I think we know enough about Tyrantrum's prowess to respect it on sight, but even Aggron has its niche for its Fairy & Dragon resistance. While not a truly staple move on these Pokemon, the threat of Head Smash on Mega Emboar/Mega Scrafty/Mega Steelix makes them scarier to deal with since even bulkier Flying-types like Gyarados and Yveltal risk getting oneshot (even a Bulk Up/Swords Dance/Curse-boosted Head Smash without + or Mega is enough to threaten a OHKO), and its sheer power means that if your defensive pivot gets hit by it, it may just get put in range of the follow-up attack anyway. As much as Aegislash gets clowned on in this game, Swords Dance-boosted Head Smash is legit its best saving grace; it has a better effective range than Aegislash's main STABs (lol Iron Head especially) and thus is its both its best initiating attack and its best crowd-engaging tool. Of course if Aegislash's other moves fail (as tends to be the case with their awful range), Head Smash can still be used as a kamikaze attack to pick up a dying KO anyway.
So tonight I'm here to talk about an archetype of mon I've been using a LOT with Mega Mewtwo X (who I have been having a LOT of success with!) I call these...
Greninja @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Spikes
-Toxic Spikes
- Ice Beam / Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse / Hydro Pump
Greninja is so fast it doesn't even NEED investment to spam hazards! It's also got some pretty handy coverage for the current format even if its on the weak side. Greninja's crazy speed also means it's not too hard to run away from frays to keep building up that mega gauge.
Scolipede @ Focus Sash
Adamant Nature
236 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Megahorn
- Poison Jab / Earthquake / Gunk Shot
Scolipede has STABs for both Mewtwo AND Xerneas, which in particular tends to scare Xerneas away, letting you set up hazards to your content. Unlike the others, I like using the alpha for this one too for the big Megahorn, which is perfect for cleaning up weakened crowds if a brawl starts.
Roserade @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Solar Beam
- Growth / Sludge Bomb / Shadow Ball
Roserade takes a different and much more offensive approach than the others, using the plus gauge its already building up to deal some nice snipes with Plus Solar Beam! Growth may seem like overkill, but frankly after a boost Solar Beam can legit snipe resists so I think it's been the best option in my experience!
Meowstic @ Focus Sash or Quick Claw
Calm or Bold nature???
252 HP / 172 SpD / 84 Spe (note: there might be a better EV spread, haven't done serious calcs for this yet!)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Reflect
- Light Screen
Meowstic is the total opposite of Roserade. This thing goes ALL in on support! Since it has dual screens, you can actually get away without Focus Sash... but with all the Megahorns flying around, I still prefer Sash currently! Regardless, Meowstic fits more on teams that have a back-up attacker in addition to a Mega Sweeper. It looks silly but it works shockingly well!
Sample Teams
I have... 2 and a half sample teams of sort to get folks started with this concept! Both are based around Mega Mewtwo X, and I've been getting a whole lotta wins with them!
Mega Mewtwo X + Ampharos! For use with Greninja, Scolipede, or Roserade
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Ampharos @ Shuca Berry
Modest Nature
252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Charge
- Thunderbolt
Ampharos RULES as a dual screener, because its one of the few with some serious bite to it! This does make Garchomp sorta irritating though (which is a reason why I like Ice Beam on Greninja), but honestly going with full greed works because dual screens makes Mega Mewtwo X SO much harder to handle! Plus, when you're just short of filling up your mega meter, Ampharos is pretty decent at being a battery itself!
Mega Mewtwo X + Pyroar! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Pyroar @ Life Orb
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Heat Wave
- Hyper Beam
- Earth Power
- Work Up
Mega Mewtwo X + Camerupt! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Camerupt @ Scope Lens
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Focus Energy
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Overheat
So the two Meowstic teams have a similar concept: pair Mega Mewtwo X with a back up range attacker with a Fairy resist and massive STAB damage against Skarmory. The Pyroar variant has the nice bonus of using that crazy Hyper Beam to potentially steal some kills near the end of the match if you don't have time to set up Mega Mewtwo X. The Camerupt version isn't as good at doing that, but critting through dual screens is great for sniping! I should note normally our resident Camerupt expert Jibaku runs a LOT of Defense investment instead of HP for Earthquake, but since this is on dual screens, I was lazy and maxed HP instead lol.
Overall, I bet these aren't the only good battery spikers, and I have a feeling there are different takes with mega battery tactics like say, hitting your own Substitute, that are worth exploring. I think Mewtwo in particular has made making a mega focused team a LOT more powerful than it was before, so I think it's well worth experimenting with these concepts some more!
Battery Spikers!
The idea here is simple: Spikes and Toxic Spikes has plenty of Pokemon that can reach 135 Speed to get them down to a 3 second cool down. Since they're quick moves, you spam those two moves to rapidly build up your Mega Meter for a monster like Mega Mewtwo X! Note for any Pokemon with Speed investment, it's always to get 3 seconds of cooldown on hazards.
The idea here is simple: Spikes and Toxic Spikes has plenty of Pokemon that can reach 135 Speed to get them down to a 3 second cool down. Since they're quick moves, you spam those two moves to rapidly build up your Mega Meter for a monster like Mega Mewtwo X! Note for any Pokemon with Speed investment, it's always to get 3 seconds of cooldown on hazards.
Greninja @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Spikes
-Toxic Spikes
- Ice Beam / Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse / Hydro Pump
Greninja is so fast it doesn't even NEED investment to spam hazards! It's also got some pretty handy coverage for the current format even if its on the weak side. Greninja's crazy speed also means it's not too hard to run away from frays to keep building up that mega gauge.
Scolipede @ Focus Sash
Adamant Nature
236 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Megahorn
- Poison Jab / Earthquake / Gunk Shot
Scolipede has STABs for both Mewtwo AND Xerneas, which in particular tends to scare Xerneas away, letting you set up hazards to your content. Unlike the others, I like using the alpha for this one too for the big Megahorn, which is perfect for cleaning up weakened crowds if a brawl starts.
Roserade @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Solar Beam
- Growth / Sludge Bomb / Shadow Ball
Roserade takes a different and much more offensive approach than the others, using the plus gauge its already building up to deal some nice snipes with Plus Solar Beam! Growth may seem like overkill, but frankly after a boost Solar Beam can legit snipe resists so I think it's been the best option in my experience!
Meowstic @ Focus Sash or Quick Claw
Calm or Bold nature???
252 HP / 172 SpD / 84 Spe (note: there might be a better EV spread, haven't done serious calcs for this yet!)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Reflect
- Light Screen
Meowstic is the total opposite of Roserade. This thing goes ALL in on support! Since it has dual screens, you can actually get away without Focus Sash... but with all the Megahorns flying around, I still prefer Sash currently! Regardless, Meowstic fits more on teams that have a back-up attacker in addition to a Mega Sweeper. It looks silly but it works shockingly well!
Sample Teams
I have... 2 and a half sample teams of sort to get folks started with this concept! Both are based around Mega Mewtwo X, and I've been getting a whole lotta wins with them!
Mega Mewtwo X + Ampharos! For use with Greninja, Scolipede, or Roserade
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Ampharos @ Shuca Berry
Modest Nature
252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Charge
- Thunderbolt
Ampharos RULES as a dual screener, because its one of the few with some serious bite to it! This does make Garchomp sorta irritating though (which is a reason why I like Ice Beam on Greninja), but honestly going with full greed works because dual screens makes Mega Mewtwo X SO much harder to handle! Plus, when you're just short of filling up your mega meter, Ampharos is pretty decent at being a battery itself!
Mega Mewtwo X + Pyroar! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Pyroar @ Life Orb
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Heat Wave
- Hyper Beam
- Earth Power
- Work Up
Mega Mewtwo X + Camerupt! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Camerupt @ Scope Lens
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Focus Energy
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Overheat
So the two Meowstic teams have a similar concept: pair Mega Mewtwo X with a back up range attacker with a Fairy resist and massive STAB damage against Skarmory. The Pyroar variant has the nice bonus of using that crazy Hyper Beam to potentially steal some kills near the end of the match if you don't have time to set up Mega Mewtwo X. The Camerupt version isn't as good at doing that, but critting through dual screens is great for sniping! I should note normally our resident Camerupt expert Jibaku runs a LOT of Defense investment instead of HP for Earthquake, but since this is on dual screens, I was lazy and maxed HP instead lol.
Overall, I bet these aren't the only good battery spikers, and I have a feeling there are different takes with mega battery tactics like say, hitting your own Substitute, that are worth exploring. I think Mewtwo in particular has made making a mega focused team a LOT more powerful than it was before, so I think it's well worth experimenting with these concepts some more!
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This is what my current thoughts are with some of the mons in this new Mewtwo meta. S to B are ordered within the tiers (although a lot of what's in the B ranks could go either way).
I won't talk about everything, but here's some mons I want to highlight, for better or worse:
...
Still a top 2 mon, and sometimes I feel it's #1 in the game, but for now, it's here at 2. Sash is better than ever now that Ice Beam Mewtwo is everywhere, and it's still great vs Xerneas with Poison Jab. Could even make a case for Yache Berry if your Sash slot is used up. While I think Pjab is its best coverage move in this meta, it can run whatever it wants for the last move depending on your team (Thunder Fang, Dragon Claw, Stone Edge, etc).
It's Freeza from DBZ. Genuinely unfair mon. Has coverage for days, it's extremely fast, hits stupidly hard, and despite losing Defense, you'd be shocked what you can take at times. OP as shit behind screens. The fact it gets the best sniping options in Psyshock, Earth Power, Ice Beam, and Thunderbolt means you steal a ton of kills. The Mega and Restriced slot seems like a steep cost, but this is what Mega Zygarde wishes it was. It's genuinely worth the "steep" cost, especially with how much easier it's getting to generate Mega energy these days.
Still as amazing as ever. Dual screens are even more valuable now with all the Mewtwo benefitting from it, and it's tough as shit to take down thanks to Shuca Berry and screens. This mon is the sole reason why more mons are running Brick Break. Its respect is absolutely needed.
Shout out to Mega Mewtwo X for proving me wrong so hard. I thought this was not going to be very good, but holy shit it's a demon. One of my favorites to use in this meta. Bulk Up, Brick Break, Poison Jab, and Stone Edge is currently my favorite set. You just beat everyone up with it. Bulk Up is also noteworthy in the Mewtwo matchup because despite losing your Psychic-resistance, you take less from Psyshock and Psystrike thanks to the Defense boost. Also shout out to +1 Stone Edge cleanly one-shotting Yveltal. That shit's cash.
Mega
I'd say it's the best non-restricted Mega still. Great typing, Mega is really fast, Fly gives you protection and forces switches, and Brave Bird and Drill Run put you in choo-choo mode. It admittedly hates all the Thunderbolts, though, but with how easily this fits with teammates like Garchomp and Ampharos, that matchup is easy to cover for.
This would have been A1 before Mewtwo, but now with less Zygarde around, it's not as needed. It appreciates Mega Metagross being in a worse spot than ever, hence why I'm rating it so high rn. If you hate Garchomp, Glaceon will be there for you.
Assault Vest makes it a great tank, and is a good check into special Mewtwo and a bunch of other Pokemon. I like mixed with Heat Wave, Dragon Rush, Fly, and Phantom Force. It also appreciates there being slightly less Xerneas while everyone's still on the Mewtwo newtoy syndrome. However, running Yveltal means you can't run Mewtwo or Xerneas, but I think it's still pretty good.
Probably its best performance in a while, and the second best non-restricted Mega imo. Gaining the Dark-typing is a great way to fight off Mewtwo, especially while removing the 4x electric weakness. Hates MM2X, though. Stone Edge bops regular form, while Brick Break bops the mega, so even if you try to mega to iframe past stone edge, you're still not safe.
Life Orb Mewtwo's a Walmart-brand MM2Y that lets you run another Mega like Skarmory or Gyarados. However, while it's stronger than MM2Y, I wouldn't say it's better. The slower movement speed and constant chip damage hold it back compared to MM2Y, imo. That, and if you're running another Mega, you'll want to use Plus moves and that shit cost.
The Absolution is here. I might be overrating it rn, but Life Orb Absol goes so stupid while the meta is Mewtwo-heavy. +1 Night Slash doesn't even need Plus Power to one-shot MM2Y, and a lot of MM2Y's checks are obliterated by Absol. It also helps that it's fast on its feet, so despite the frailty, you can just run from bad matchups. Once again, shoutout to Blitz for inducting me into the Absolution.
I wanted to put this in B2 tbh, but it's still one of the better Xerneas answers around, I guess. I don't like using this anymore. The base form is ass, and it hates the presence of so many Dark-types, especially Mega Gyarados which can iframe out of Thunder Punch and proceed to take little from Megagross's other moves. This was ironically better in the Zygarde meta.
If base from Charizard wasn't so feeble, I'd put this in A2. It's still a genuinely scary Pokemon when it gets going. Having STAB for Flare Blitz and Dragon Rush give it so much breaking potential. I like Thunder Punch in the last slot to handle Gyarados, along with being a fast move on its own, but you could also run Earthquake, especially if you're Alpha. The Flying-typing while in base form also gives you an entry point vs Garchomp's Earthquake, and then you Mega to dodge the Dragon Rush. That being said, the Mega slot is getting more expensive, and it hates Mewtwo's Earth Power, so along with its bad base form which also hates Thunderbolt, I wouldn't rank Zard X any higher than this, but it definitely deserves your respect.
Listing these together because they share a common goal: being Mega batteries. Theorymon cooked with the spiker batteries. I like Greninja in particular for its Water/Ice coverage alongside the dual spikes. Meowstic is funny, too, setting both spikes AND both screens, and Scolipede is great vs Mewtwo and Xerneas. However, I also want to mention Splash Clefable lmfao, an idea I saw in the discord. That sounds insane, but Splash has a 3 second cooldown, and when used alongside screens, you generate so much Mega energy really quick. I like Ice Beam as my offensive move to take out Garchomp and just be a kill-stealer.
Whenever I need a Xerneas resist that can also deal a ton of damage to it, Flareon has been my go-to. It's Flare Blitz+ when combined with Charcoal makes it stronger than Zard X's, and Flame Wheel and Dig are great gap-closers. Giga Impact's also a funny option. However, it hates seeing Garchomp, Water-types, and Mewtwo's Earth Power.
Please keep using Tyranitar. Give me points lmao. Seriously, though, this thing is cheeks, and that's sad to say because I love Tyranitar as a Pokemon. It's only getting worse as more people are discovering how good MM2X is.
Mega
Same thing with Mega Excadrill. I breathe a sigh of relief whenever I see it. It means I don't have to worry about Focus Sash, and my MM2X one-shots all the Excadrite Excadrills running around. It's got a beefy Megahorn for the Mewtwo, sure, but it's not worth the Mega slot.
One Psyshock is enough to send it to the Shadow Realm. However, if played as an assaassin, and positioned right, it'll nab some kills. Still a pretty good Xerneas answer, too. Just a shame the mega slot is so competitive rn.
Mega
I see potential in this. It's frail as shit physically and has a ton of weaknesses, but it's a decent sniper with Thunderbolt and STAB Ice Beam, and Shadow Ball will hurt Mewtwo. Will need godlike positioning to make it work, though.
Sash 10% Zygarde is the only good set now, in my opinion. 50% is out of a job. Assault Vest does not save it from MM2Y's boosted Ice Beam. Life Orb could probably still work to nab kills with Land's Wrath, but like, the environment is even more hostile to it now than it was pre-Mewtwo. At least 10% dog form can trap something in with Thousand Waves for a teammate, but even that is a steep ask for a restricted slot. Don't even get me started with Mega Zygarde. I saw some semblance of potential for it before Mewtwo. There's no hope left now. Protect doesn't even save it from Mega Mewtwo's plus-powered Ice moves. RIP.
This is all subject to change, especially when the DLC drops and gives us more moves to work with. Thank you for coming to my ted talk lol.
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I love that Xerneas post so much. It expresses how I feel about the deer. lol
Ok, I haven't heard anyone talk about this guy yet, so I thought I would.
I'll get to training and labbing with this guy after I've posted this, but I think he has untapped potential (especially post-M2 invasion):
(But if anyone else has input on him, by all means pitch in! I'd love to hear what you have to say.)
Banette's surprisingly short on coverage (why did Gengar get such a good phys movepool and not this guy?) - BUT, I think he has just enough to be good:
Banette @ Banettite
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Phantom Force
- Shadow Claw
- Gunk Shot
- Swords Dance
His playstyle's about what you might guess: Get the jump on 'em (or dodge) with Phantom Force, finish 'em off with Shadow Claw. And let's not forget the mandatory deer-killer and all-around powerful ranged attack, Gunk Shot.
Almost nothing in the meta resists Ghost, and +1 Mega Phantom Force + Shadow Claw off of his massive 165 base Atk KO's most things from 100% in 2.5 seconds flat. In fact, see that tierlist two posts above me? Well, here's the list of things from there that survive that combo: (assuming 252 HP and no Def investment)
Skarmory (base form has 12.5% survival chance, mega never survives)
Yveltal
Mega Gyarados
Mega Scolipede (31.2% survival chance)
Mega Scizor (31.2% survival chance)
Pyroar (a rare relevant Normal-type)
Aggron + Mega Aggron
Kangaskhan (the other relevant Normal-Type)
Mega Greninja (43.7% survival chance)
Hippowdon (56.2% survival chance)
Krookodile
Mega Feraligatr (18.7% survival chance)
Mega Houndoom
Tyranitar
Steelix and Mega Steelix
Pangoro
Zygarde (50% has 68.7% chance, Complete and Mega always tank it)
Scrafty
Umbreon
Avalugg
That may seem like a lot, but out of the 82 in that tierlist, that means only 24.3% can survive it and 15.9% are guaranteed to. (You may notice that Fighting and Fairy make short work of most of those, too; that should be easy enough to teambuild for.)
Still, he has his cons; he's pretty fragile even in Mega form and has almost no other moves worth considering, so while he could be a solid dark horse, he's definitely a one-trick pokemon even if he's really good at that one trick.
That's about as much as I can say on him right now; I'll mess with him when I get the chance and edit this to let y'all know how it goes!
(Edit: Bro's cooldowns are slower than sin and he dies fast even behind screens. I'll try him some more but idk about this man)
(Edit 2: Don't use Banette)
Verdict: I'm always the guy to try something off-meta and see if I can make it work (I refuse to sell my soul to Garchomp), but this guy just isn't cutting it. While Dig is nigh unavoidable without I-frames or flying-types, its Ghost counterpart Phantom Force is surprisingly easy to dodge. I assumed a quick and powerful Phantom Force + Shadow Claw would make up for his lack of bulk, but the combo seldom lands and the cooldowns take ages to end. Combine that with a guy who has to enter the fray to deal damage and has very little bulk to survive in said fray, then put him in a meta where everything's scrambling to counter Mewtwo, and in the process counters this guy who has the same weaknesses.
...Yeah. Wrong place wrong time. I'll probably have something to say about something they introduce in the Mega Dimension, so perhaps I'll catch y'all then. Later.
I'll get to training and labbing with this guy after I've posted this, but I think he has untapped potential (especially post-M2 invasion):
(But if anyone else has input on him, by all means pitch in! I'd love to hear what you have to say.)
Banette's surprisingly short on coverage (why did Gengar get such a good phys movepool and not this guy?) - BUT, I think he has just enough to be good:
Banette @ Banettite
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Phantom Force
- Shadow Claw
- Gunk Shot
- Swords Dance
His playstyle's about what you might guess: Get the jump on 'em (or dodge) with Phantom Force, finish 'em off with Shadow Claw. And let's not forget the mandatory deer-killer and all-around powerful ranged attack, Gunk Shot.
Almost nothing in the meta resists Ghost, and +1 Mega Phantom Force + Shadow Claw off of his massive 165 base Atk KO's most things from 100% in 2.5 seconds flat. In fact, see that tierlist two posts above me? Well, here's the list of things from there that survive that combo: (assuming 252 HP and no Def investment)
Skarmory (base form has 12.5% survival chance, mega never survives)
Yveltal
Mega Gyarados
Mega Scolipede (31.2% survival chance)
Mega Scizor (31.2% survival chance)
Pyroar (a rare relevant Normal-type)
Aggron + Mega Aggron
Kangaskhan (the other relevant Normal-Type)
Mega Greninja (43.7% survival chance)
Hippowdon (56.2% survival chance)
Krookodile
Mega Feraligatr (18.7% survival chance)
Mega Houndoom
Tyranitar
Steelix and Mega Steelix
Pangoro
Zygarde (50% has 68.7% chance, Complete and Mega always tank it)
Scrafty
Umbreon
Avalugg
That may seem like a lot, but out of the 82 in that tierlist, that means only 24.3% can survive it and 15.9% are guaranteed to. (You may notice that Fighting and Fairy make short work of most of those, too; that should be easy enough to teambuild for.)
Still, he has his cons; he's pretty fragile even in Mega form and has almost no other moves worth considering, so while he could be a solid dark horse, he's definitely a one-trick pokemon even if he's really good at that one trick.
That's about as much as I can say on him right now; I'll mess with him when I get the chance and edit this to let y'all know how it goes!
(Edit: Bro's cooldowns are slower than sin and he dies fast even behind screens. I'll try him some more but idk about this man)
(Edit 2: Don't use Banette)
Verdict: I'm always the guy to try something off-meta and see if I can make it work (I refuse to sell my soul to Garchomp), but this guy just isn't cutting it. While Dig is nigh unavoidable without I-frames or flying-types, its Ghost counterpart Phantom Force is surprisingly easy to dodge. I assumed a quick and powerful Phantom Force + Shadow Claw would make up for his lack of bulk, but the combo seldom lands and the cooldowns take ages to end. Combine that with a guy who has to enter the fray to deal damage and has very little bulk to survive in said fray, then put him in a meta where everything's scrambling to counter Mewtwo, and in the process counters this guy who has the same weaknesses.
...Yeah. Wrong place wrong time. I'll probably have something to say about something they introduce in the Mega Dimension, so perhaps I'll catch y'all then. Later.
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Is this for 6v6 match-ups? Are spikes and stealth rocks viable?So tonight I'm here to talk about an archetype of mon I've been using a LOT with Mega Mewtwo X (who I have been having a LOT of success with!) I call these...
Battery Spikers!
The idea here is simple: Spikes and Toxic Spikes has plenty of Pokemon that can reach 135 Speed to get them down to a 3 second cool down. Since they're quick moves, you spam those two moves to rapidly build up your Mega Meter for a monster like Mega Mewtwo X! Note for any Pokemon with Speed investment, it's always to get 3 seconds of cooldown on hazards.
Greninja @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Spikes
-Toxic Spikes
- Ice Beam / Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse / Hydro Pump
Greninja is so fast it doesn't even NEED investment to spam hazards! It's also got some pretty handy coverage for the current format even if its on the weak side. Greninja's crazy speed also means it's not too hard to run away from frays to keep building up that mega gauge.
Scolipede @ Focus Sash
Adamant Nature
236 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Megahorn
- Poison Jab / Earthquake / Gunk Shot
Scolipede has STABs for both Mewtwo AND Xerneas, which in particular tends to scare Xerneas away, letting you set up hazards to your content. Unlike the others, I like using the alpha for this one too for the big Megahorn, which is perfect for cleaning up weakened crowds if a brawl starts.
Roserade @ Focus Sash
Modest Nature
60 HP / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Solar Beam
- Growth / Sludge Bomb / Shadow Ball
Roserade takes a different and much more offensive approach than the others, using the plus gauge its already building up to deal some nice snipes with Plus Solar Beam! Growth may seem like overkill, but frankly after a boost Solar Beam can legit snipe resists so I think it's been the best option in my experience!
Meowstic @ Focus Sash or Quick Claw
Calm or Bold nature???
252 HP / 172 SpD / 84 Spe (note: there might be a better EV spread, haven't done serious calcs for this yet!)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Reflect
- Light Screen
Meowstic is the total opposite of Roserade. This thing goes ALL in on support! Since it has dual screens, you can actually get away without Focus Sash... but with all the Megahorns flying around, I still prefer Sash currently! Regardless, Meowstic fits more on teams that have a back-up attacker in addition to a Mega Sweeper. It looks silly but it works shockingly well!
Sample Teams
I have... 2 and a half sample teams of sort to get folks started with this concept! Both are based around Mega Mewtwo X, and I've been getting a whole lotta wins with them!
Mega Mewtwo X + Ampharos! For use with Greninja, Scolipede, or Roserade
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Ampharos @ Shuca Berry
Modest Nature
252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Charge
- Thunderbolt
Ampharos RULES as a dual screener, because its one of the few with some serious bite to it! This does make Garchomp sorta irritating though (which is a reason why I like Ice Beam on Greninja), but honestly going with full greed works because dual screens makes Mega Mewtwo X SO much harder to handle! Plus, when you're just short of filling up your mega meter, Ampharos is pretty decent at being a battery itself!
Mega Mewtwo X + Pyroar! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Pyroar @ Life Orb
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Heat Wave
- Hyper Beam
- Earth Power
- Work Up
Mega Mewtwo X + Camerupt! For use with Meowstic-Male
Mewtwo @ Mewtwonite X
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab
- Bulk Up
Camerupt @ Scope Lens
Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Focus Energy
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Overheat
So the two Meowstic teams have a similar concept: pair Mega Mewtwo X with a back up range attacker with a Fairy resist and massive STAB damage against Skarmory. The Pyroar variant has the nice bonus of using that crazy Hyper Beam to potentially steal some kills near the end of the match if you don't have time to set up Mega Mewtwo X. The Camerupt version isn't as good at doing that, but critting through dual screens is great for sniping! I should note normally our resident Camerupt expert Jibaku runs a LOT of Defense investment instead of HP for Earthquake, but since this is on dual screens, I was lazy and maxed HP instead lol.
Overall, I bet these aren't the only good battery spikers, and I have a feeling there are different takes with mega battery tactics like say, hitting your own Substitute, that are worth exploring. I think Mewtwo in particular has made making a mega focused team a LOT more powerful than it was before, so I think it's well worth experimenting with these concepts some more!