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Pokemon Sword & Shield Discussion RD: 15/11/2019 **Official news only**

so im kinda not sure where to put this

i've had a sneasel spawn on route 8 and then chase me into circhester (the entrance, sorta) before i triggered the encounter with the sneasel. when i caught the sneasel the location shows as met in circhester :blobthinking:
figured it was noteworthy enough to put this somewhere since there are no wild pokemon in circhester, so i guess this is probably only relevant for legality checks and shit? didnt stop nintendo from banning level 36 bisharps though iirc lol
There are a number of places you can get this to happen in the Wild Area too. Even some dens can be used from different sides in different areas. I don't think it'll matter for legality until Gen 9 transfers happen.
 
One smaller aspect I'm slowly realising is that since these DLC areas are digital-only, it's far less likely that they'll get leaked and datamined a month beforehand; breaking that cycle we've had since ORAS.
Someone responded this with a sad emoticon, so I've gotta make it clear: I'm EXCITED about this!! SwSh pre-release was hell for me as I was trying like heck to avoid spoilers for about a month; including avoiding social media sites and keeping away from certain private chats, and while the memories are vague now I recall having similar situations for Gen 7 and ORAS too. Not having that and just being able to go into a game and experience it fresh is so, so, so much more preferable; finding out the full lists of all the new pokemon and stats and formulas and yadda yadda can come later, right now I just want to play the game!
 

Pikachu315111

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I am assuming the 20 other mythics are back too, but those wouldnt really count towards their number either.
Hmm, that is a good question. They mention most of the Legendaries are back but what of the Mythicals? Like I agree would be a good idea for them to add a batch in as "Foreign" Pokemon if only so they have to them to giveaway as Events (maybe even make them special Raids). But I have this feeling that, even if they do that, they'd probably still wouldn't add in all the Mythicals. The likely suspects would be added in: Manaphy (& Phione, though would be hilarious if they forgot), Deoxys, Shaymin, Darkrai, Arceus, Victini, Meloetta, Diancie, & Magearna. However Genesect, Hoopa, & Volcanion I can see being put on the wayside. Heck, maybe they'd hold back adding in Deoxys, Darkrai, and Arceus due to how polarizing they are compared to the other Mythicals like the Mew expies, Diancie, & Magearna.


Were AAA games ever released that way?
TvTropes calls them "One Game for the Price of Two".

Sword and Shield take first and second place respectively on the 2019 download rankings.

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/software/feature/package-ranking2019.html
Pokemon SwSh takes both the 1st and 2nd place position with Fire Emblem Three Houses taking 3rd, yet it's the main character from FE: 3 Houses that gets added to Smash while there's no Gen 8 Pokemon yet (not even as Poke Ball Pokemon). I see your bias Nintendo...

I was thinking the same thing but now that we've said it, some how, some way, the dlc will leak out
Only way I can see it is if they let your pre-download it.
 
I'm going to assume it will be download only. I assume it will work like regular DLC and not be a standalone expansion since there are two planned at different dates. Maybe after the 2nd expansion is released they may do a cartridge release with both included, but I am doubting that.

Which means datamining will probably be impossible. Which is too bad, because that seems to be the only way to actually get information about these games without actually buying them.
 
yet it's the main character from FE: 3 Houses that gets added to Smash while there's no Gen 8 Pokemon yet (not even as Poke Ball Pokemon). I see your bias Nintendo...
Technically, they did add several Gen 8 Pokemon to Smash as Spirits...

Only way I can see it is if they let your pre-download it.
No, predownloads can never be hacked unless you get all the supercomputers in the world plus 60 billion years or so. (Not even a quantum computer would help that much. Unlike standard Internet security which is why people are scared of quantum computers, the difference here is that the recipient of the pre-download is not intended to be able to read it.)

The way I see it leaking is something akin to they give download keys to news sites for articles & reviews and then Oops! All Leaks!
If I understand Switch software updates correctly, this seems unlikely. When a game releases DLC alongside a version update, everyone who updates downloads the complete content of the DLC. Purchasing the DLC only tells the game to unlock this content, which is why it takes only a few seconds while a version update can take several minutes.

So if TPC or Nintendo were to make download codes for SwSh's DLC allowing people who have the code to purchase it for free, they'd have to release the version update to everyone first. Then any dataminer in the world could get at it easily. I'm not aware of any mechanism that would allow version updates to only go to some people instead of everyone. Someone with more knowledge of how Switch software updates work under the hood might be able to provide a better answer.
 

Pikachu315111

JAPE Judge!
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Also, I'm going to be honest here: I'm not expecting much story from the expansions. Or what story we get will be pretty much backstory for characters and the region, filling in gaps which may help understand them and the world better.

The Isle of Armor: The most obvious story bit to be told here is about the Galar League history. Some questions from that:
  • Was there one before Rose made it a huge spectacle? How was it like?
  • How did Rose come in to radically change it? Were there any problems? Did he have some resistance?
  • We know Mustard is an ex-Champion, are there any more? How many?
  • Leon probably wasn't the one who defeated Mustard, so who defeated Mustard? Was it the same person Leon then defeated?
  • How was Leon like when he was training with Mustard? How did his training go, was he a good student? BONUS: Was Sonia also here?
  • Who are Klara and Avery? They're not Gym Leaders but wear Gym uniforms, so are they Gym Trainers?
  • Assuming Opal's method of choosing a successor isn't the norm, how does one become a Gym Leader in Galar? Does each Gym Leader have carte blanche to choose whoever they deem worthy? Can you become one without needing to be associated with the Gym?
  • Assuming Klara and Avery do have a connection with the Gym, who are the Poison- and Psychic-type Gym Leaders? Are they retiring soon? Were Klara and Avery told to train with Mustard or was this their own decision to better their odds of being picked to be the next Gym Leader?
  • What is the deal with Kubfu? Why does it no longer live in Galar as it once did? Was there a reason or an affect on it in the far away mountainous region they all went to (did they always practice Wushu or was that a skilled gained in the mountains)?
  • Why is the player entrusted with a Kubfu? Will Klara and Avery also get a Kubfu?
  • What is the deal with Urshifu's Gigantamax forms? Will they play a part in the story?

As for the Crown Tundra, I'm sure there's more details to be revealed but here are ones I can think of now:
  • Who is the leader of the Den Exploration Team we join? Is it that character we saw who shares a resemblance to Rose? Is that character related to Rose, notably the younger brother who Oleana was trying to contact during the Darkest Day event? If so, will we also learn more about Rose and his families backstory and the families thoughts and feelings about Rose's actions (rise to power, changing Galar, almost ending the world)?
  • What is the history of Calyrex's reign over Galar? How did it end? What is it doing now? How did these events shape Galar from what it was to what it is now?
  • Will we learn anything more about the original Darkest Day? About the two heroes who teamed up with Zacian and Zamazenta? Learn more about the two wolves and also Eternatus? If we learn more about Eternatus would we also learn how Rose discovered it?
  • What's up with the two new Regis? The original three Regis were made to act as keys to lock away Regigigas as people feared its power and then shipped off to a foreign region (but apparently they also made spares to keep nearby and there was also other Regigigas?). Where do these two Regis factor in? Are they too manmade? If so, for what reason that a temple was seemingly built based on them?
  • What's up with the Galarian Legendary Birds? They seem to have a connection with that out-of-place red tree in a middle of a frozen tundra, is that the cause of their transformation and why? What's that tree doing there? Is there also a Galarian Lugia?

While there are certainly questions to be answered that brings light elements of the main story, it does not change the story nor really add more onto it. While I'm happy to get any more information to expand our understanding of the characters and region, for these DLC what I'm excited for is the exploration as well as added features. I'm hoping now they've done their "proof of concept" with the Wild Area the Isle of Armor and the Crown Tundra's maps will be much more interesting and give us plenty of nooks and crannies to discover new places, characters, and activities (and maybe a few mysteries).

So if a leak is somehow to happen and reveals very little is revealed, well I'm actually already expecting that. It's sad and I would be demanding more should be done (BTW the stuff I mentioned above is what I would consider the bare minimum for us to be told. It wouldn't even evolve any major cutscene or accompanied artwork (though that would be nice), just talking with a character), but for these expansions I'm expecting more exploration from them. Because, as we all kept saying, this all feels like third version add-ons except we don't need to start a new game file and only have to pay half the price of a full game.

HOWEVER, since it's likely they'll do an Expansion Pass 2 for another 30 bucks (thus making all DLC be a price of a new Switch game) from THAT I'm going to raise my expectation bar. More story (including expanding on the characters such as the Gym Leaders), significant location and feature inclusions (like Battle Frontier, a Pokemon World Tournament, Pokemon Contests, etc.; also would be nice to have Walking Pokemon again, some you could even ride on across the Wild Area), and how about this: adding/changing animations to make them look more dynamic (mainly idle poses & move animations). If you're going to use the DLC to add in locations and features might as well also use the time to fix-up things (if they were smart they'd also make the changed animations free DLC). And that way for the next gen games they'll have these new animations all ready to be ported.

AND if they're going to do an Expansion Pass 3 (aka now the DLC has gone above the price of a new Switch game)... man, thinking about it they may want to stop at Expansion Pass 2 and work on doing little additional free DLC until the next gen comes out cause I can't imagine what the expectation would be on them for that. Like, Expansion Pass 3 would have to be like a B2W2 in terms of what it adds, Expansion Pass 2 just has to make it feel like the DLC is as good as Emerald or Platinum was.

Technically, they did add several Gen 8 Pokemon to Smash as Spirits...
Which probably took them all of an hour to do. :P

As I said, I don't think it's asking much for just some new Pokeball Pokemon.
Corviknight could grab an opponent and fly them to another location on the stage, Nickit could run around taking items laying on the ground or attack fighters with Knock Off/Thief to steal ones they've grabbed, Wooloo could roll around and be an undestructable obstacle, Drednaw slowly moves around but anyone that gets close to it gets grappled in a Jaw Lock, Applin throws around apples before vanishing with most of the apples healing some damage but one of them is Applin which would surprise attack, Cramorant stands aside to do Dive and then spits either a Arrokuda or a Pikachu, Toxtricity rocks out with Overdrive, Polteageist offers tea which will either heal some damage or poison, Stonjourner would power up anyone who is near it as it slowly lumbers around, Morpeko would slowly roll around on Aura Wheel but when it changes to Hangry Form will start dashing around, Dragapult would ghost around and occasionally fire Dreepy at fighter, & Eternatus would use Eternabeam.


But, if they weren't going to reveal a fighter from a new franchise to Smash, I don't think a new Pokemon fighter would have received as much backlash as a new Fire Emblem fighter. My pick would be Rillaboom, we need a Grass Starter fighter (and they seem to not want to add Sceptile) and since they replaced Donkey Kong's Final Smash then Rillaboom could have its Final Smash be it drumming shockwaves and having vines whipping about.

If I understand Switch software updates correctly, this seems unlikely. When a game releases DLC alongside a version update, everyone who updates downloads the complete content of the DLC. Purchasing the DLC only tells the game to unlock this content, which is why it takes only a few seconds while a version update can take several minutes.
Not sure how I feel about that. The DLC downloads no matter what so it's on your system but you can't access it without paying for it? Does the Switch have any way to prevent hackers from getting into this DLC or do hackers have a free pass to all Switch DLC?

So if TPC or Nintendo were to make download codes for SwSh's DLC allowing people who have the code to purchase it for free, they'd have to release the version update to everyone first. Then any dataminer in the world could get at it easily. I'm not aware of any mechanism that would allow version updates to only go to some people instead of everyone. Someone with more knowledge of how Switch software updates work under the hood might be able to provide a better answer.
Can't they give reviewers a micro SD card?
 
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Technically, they did add several Gen 8 Pokemon to Smash as Spirits...

No, predownloads can never be hacked unless you get all the supercomputers in the world plus 60 billion years or so. (Not even a quantum computer would help that much. Unlike standard Internet security which is why people are scared of quantum computers, the difference here is that the recipient of the pre-download is not intended to be able to read it.)

If I understand Switch software updates correctly, this seems unlikely. When a game releases DLC alongside a version update, everyone who updates downloads the complete content of the DLC. Purchasing the DLC only tells the game to unlock this content, which is why it takes only a few seconds while a version update can take several minutes.

So if TPC or Nintendo were to make download codes for SwSh's DLC allowing people who have the code to purchase it for free, they'd have to release the version update to everyone first. Then any dataminer in the world could get at it easily. I'm not aware of any mechanism that would allow version updates to only go to some people instead of everyone. Someone with more knowledge of how Switch software updates work under the hood might be able to provide a better answer.
True, true, I think you're right. I suppose if they did want reviewers to review the DLC (since they're kind of positioned as a separate-but-not-really game) they'd probably have special builds at demo events.

Also, I'm going to be honest here: I'm not expecting much story from the expansions. Or what story we get will be pretty much backstory for characters and the region, filling in gaps which may help understand them and the world better.

The Isle of Armor: The most obvious story bit to be told here is about the Galar League history. Some questions from that:
  • Was there one before Rose made it a huge spectacle? How was it like?
There was, yes. Rose himself participated in the league according to the league card (he came in second), which still had the jerseys judging by some of the background posters in Spikemuth. Presumably Galar's league has always been positioned more as a public sporting event everyone in the region got hyped for, Rose just took it to 11 with the Dynamaxing.
  • What's up with the Galarian Legendary Birds? They seem to have a connection with that out-of-place red tree in a middle of a frozen tundra, is that the cause of their transformation and why? What's that tree doing there? Is there also a Galarian Lugia?
Since they're associted with that tree I have to assume yes, but I don't think there's a galarian Lugia. Normal Lugia is shown with the other co-op mode legends rather than being missing like the galarian birds, regi (who we see in the trailer) or the conspicuously missing Regigigas (& Muskeeeters which...who knows, maybe they are also getting galarian forms?)
 
You could also, you know, wait for it to release and then see what other people say about it.
That would defeat the purpose of getting info before it is released though. Likewise, not a lot of websites provide actual information. Just google "Pokemon Home release date" and you'll find dozens of articles that claim they have the release date. Except none do, it is merely slated for sometime in February. Which narrows it down to 29 possible dates, but no date is given meaning every one of those articles has an incorrect heading.

Filter that down to what kind is included in the expansions or when, and the accuracy will be even more off.

With only a few days left to February it is a bit disappointing to see we don't have a date or any info on what Home will allow for Sword and Shield.

HOWEVER, since it's likely they'll do an Expansion Pass 2 for another 30 bucks (thus making all DLC be a price of a new Switch game) from THAT I'm going to raise my expectation bar.
I'm doubting it. I'm sure the margins are higher, but I don't see them releasing more paid DLC 1-2 years post release. I'd also assume the buyer base will dwindle in that time. A new game gets more attention and will probably obtain higher sales numbers.

I'm going with a remake game for winter 2021, two years after Sword and Shield. By then we should have around 630 or so Pokemon total, and I assume the remake game can introduce the rest. Though this is just my speculation, so I very well may be entirely wrong.
 
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That would defeat the purpose of getting info before it is released though. Likewise, not a lot of websites provide actual information. Just google "Pokemon Home release date" and you'll find dozens of articles that claim they have the release date. Except none do, it is merely slated for sometime in February. Which narrows it down to 29 possible dates, but no date is given meaning every one of those articles has an incorrect heading.

Filter that down to what kind is included in the expansions or when, and the accuracy will be even more off.

With only a few days left to February it is a bit disappointing to see we don't have a date or any info on what Home will allow for Sword and Shield.
Which is fine, but one thing is the release date of Pokemon Home, the other is content of a game (or DLC) that isn't even released.

(Which, if coming from Datamine, is still tecnically illegal btw, and the reason for which sites like bulbapedia or serebii who get access to it in a way or another tend to not post it)

For what matters, almost the entirety of the data available on SwSh was posted on Serebii within 3 days of SwSh release.

If you need to get info of the games before buying it, you might as well just wait for that and watch the reviews as stated.
Quite confident Serebii will have everything you might want to know within 3 days of the DLC release.

Also, the DLCs are coming at same time as free update for everyone who owns the game which adds the new pokemon & most likely region as well in game files, basically a delayed form of "on disc dlc", since the Pokemon and items have to be available to everyone no matter if they own the DLC or not.
 
Also, the DLCs are coming at same time as free update for everyone who owns the game which adds the new pokemon & most likely region as well in game files, basically a delayed form of "on disc dlc", since the Pokemon and items have to be available to everyone no matter if they own the DLC or not.
One thing I did want to note about the items that interests me...

So, obviously, I think it's fairly safe to assume that any items being added to the game will also be added to non-DLC owners' code, even if they don't have a way to obtain it directly within their own game. That way someone could get, say, Slowbro's evolution item or maybe Dialga's Adamant Orb in their game with DLC and trade them to someone without the DLC. Shouldn't be a problem there.

... buuuut... there's two key items in particular that wouldn't be tradeable that are important for things significant to a Pokémon. Namely, the Reveal Glass for the Kami trio's Therian forms, and the Zygarde Cube for, well, Zygarde's forms. In fact, Zygarde seemingly requires having an entire facility to use that Cube with in order to access these forms (though they could potentially simplify it, like with Rotom).

The key items for Necrozma and Kyurem's alternate forms are according to datamining made available to any player who has them in their party at Stow-On-Side, so it begs the question if these key items will be made available to any player, DLC or not as long as they have Zygarde or the Kami Trio in their party when the update hits in November? We've already seen them add a non-paid event via an update in the form of Galarian Slowpoke, so will their similarly be one for these particular things?
 
... buuuut... there's two key items in particular that wouldn't be tradeable that are important for things significant to a Pokémon. Namely, the Reveal Glass for the Kami trio's Therian forms, and the Zygarde Cube for, well, Zygarde's forms. In fact, Zygarde seemingly requires having an entire facility to use that Cube with in order to access these forms (though they could potentially simplify it, like with Rotom).

The key items for Necrozma and Kyurem's alternate forms are according to datamining made available to any player who has them in their party at Stow-On-Side, so it begs the question if these key items will be made available to any player, DLC or not as long as they have Zygarde or the Kami Trio in their party when the update hits in November? We've already seen them add a non-paid event via an update in the form of Galarian Slowpoke, so will their similarly be one for these particular things?
I don't really see why not honestly.

We know the Alola and Kyurem items are obtainable by talking to the rare-item guy in whateverthattowniscalled (I hate galar town names btw), I'm personally betting that all the items are going to work like that.

It's not like "gating" items like those would incentivize people to buy the DLC or not. VGC players and people interested in the story or whatever postgame there is will get them, everyone else will just play on Showdown as they already do.
 
Not sure how I feel about that. The DLC downloads no matter what so it's on your system but you can't access it without paying for it? Does the Switch have any way to prevent hackers from getting into this DLC or do hackers have a free pass to all Switch DLC?
I missed this but this is more or less how a lot of DLC works. They update the game up front and then you essentially buy the activation key. Just as an example, if you were to go buy Smash 3DS, Wii U or Ultimate and downloaded the latest update you'd have all characters, stages, music, trophies, etc sitting in the game.
For games without a multiplayer component (where it's very easy to see why it's all there in the game) I assume there's development pipeline reasons that they just add it to the game rather than as a separate "update" you buy. I'm not a developer so I can't say with certainty the "why" of it.
 
Not sure how I feel about that. The DLC downloads no matter what so it's on your system but you can't access it without paying for it? Does the Switch have any way to prevent hackers from getting into this DLC or do hackers have a free pass to all Switch DLC?
To give you a tiny bit tecnical detail.

"On disc" DLCs (very common lately) are usually present in game files and unavailable unless you have the "license key" for it. They do not require any additional download and are available istantly once purchased, like the charachters in Smash for example.
The "License key" can be added via hacking, so yes, Switch hackers do have access to any DLC (on disc and not) potentially for free, however going online with DLC enabled without having the actual license key is a great way to get a console ban.

In general, marketing wise it's better to have "ondisc" DLCs, (some are actually present from start, some get added via patch later) because they don't require the user to download anything, and thus increase the "satisfaction effect" of buying something and having it istantly available, as well as not requiring to code any "compatibility" between games that own it and games that don't in case of multiplayer.
 
One thing I did want to note about the items that interests me...

So, obviously, I think it's fairly safe to assume that any items being added to the game will also be added to non-DLC owners' code, even if they don't have a way to obtain it directly within their own game. That way someone could get, say, Slowbro's evolution item or maybe Dialga's Adamant Orb in their game with DLC and trade them to someone without the DLC. Shouldn't be a problem there.

... buuuut... there's two key items in particular that wouldn't be tradeable that are important for things significant to a Pokémon. Namely, the Reveal Glass for the Kami trio's Therian forms, and the Zygarde Cube for, well, Zygarde's forms. In fact, Zygarde seemingly requires having an entire facility to use that Cube with in order to access these forms (though they could potentially simplify it, like with Rotom).

The key items for Necrozma and Kyurem's alternate forms are according to datamining made available to any player who has them in their party at Stow-On-Side, so it begs the question if these key items will be made available to any player, DLC or not as long as they have Zygarde or the Kami Trio in their party when the update hits in November? We've already seen them add a non-paid event via an update in the form of Galarian Slowpoke, so will their similarly be one for these particular things?
I've been thinking about that as well. I'm going to assume they will add something through an update similar to the Slowpoke situation. Probably an NPC in a Poke center to keep it simple. There can be a chance it will be gated behind the DLC but I am doubting it. But considering it would technically allow all the Pokemon to be transferred to the base game it wouldn't be contradictory. I don't recall them stating each form will work in the base game, but rather each Pokemon type. So I do suppose they can gate those behind the paid DLC much like Rockruff Dusk was gated behind Ultra Sun and Moon.

But I am going to assume they will just issue those key items as a gift or add an NPC or similar to the base game.
 
So I do suppose they can gate those behind the paid DLC much like Rockruff Dusk was gated behind Ultra Sun and Moon.
They can't.

They specifically stated, their own words, that "All pokemon present in the DLCs will be available to players who don't own them as well via trade or Home".

Would go against their own presentation & commercialization, and I don't think they're stupid enough to do it.
 
They can't.

They specifically stated, their own words, that "All pokemon present in the DLCs will be available to players who don't own them as well via trade or Home".

Would go against their own presentation & commercialization, and I don't think they're stupid enough to do it.
But would the combined forms actually count as separate Pokemon? Don't alternate forms typically not count as new Pokemon? Meaning, they can fulfill this promise by allowing Necrozma, Lunala and Solgaleo to be traded into the base game even if you cannot merge them into the alternate forms. Also you cannot actually trade combined forms as they count as two separate Pokemon in previous games, or at least the last few generations.

I do think they'll go the Slowpoke route, but until they prove otherwise I wouldn't assume the base game can get every form.

Edit: Bit off topic but has there ever been an official name given for the new shiny type introduced this generation? I've seen both ultra shiny and square shiny used, but wondering if there is an official term yet.
 
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Edit: Bit off topic but has there ever been an official name given for the new shiny type introduced this generation? I've seen both ultra shiny and square shiny used, but wondering if there is an official term yet.
I believe there is no official term for them as of now.
 
The rotom rally is (slightly) deeper than it looks. At first glance it's just pushing to the finish line and snagging the balloons, but there are some simple techniques that change the game. They aren't told in the game so I guess you're supposed to learn these from the guidebook or something.

Starting boost: Hold up + B as the countdown's 1 disappears to get a boost.
Spinout recovery: Release the control stick as you hit a pokemon for a shorter stun.
Spinout boost: After any spinout, press up + B when you put your leg down to get an immediate boost. This also keeps a charge active instead of it resetting.
Manual spinout: Spin the left stick around to spin out.

With these in mind, you can get utility out of the usual obstacles and take more direct paths.

This info is from this document, which also has some high scores for each course. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RVCQVJ5_I07RML5JyUDcZ9P44AP-qbbeluKCpz_gkho/edit
Speaking of score, it's all based on time remaining, though I've seen that watts don't exactly match up. Apparently Hammerlocke Hills to Meetup Spot yields the best score.
 

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