Pokemon Sword & Shield Discussion RD: 15/11/2019

Also, [Sirfetch'd]'s Sword exclusive, huh? Guess I'm getting that game then. Or maybe I might pick Shield for Bea. The exclusives are making it hard to choose for me this time around!
Good news! Bea is the Sword exclusive gym leader, so you can get both Sirfetch'd and Bea! In fact, those version exclusives and typings have lead some to speculate that if Sirfetch'd were on Bea's team, then perhaps the counterpart would be on Sheild-exclusive Alister's team. However, Game Freak doesn't seem to care all that much for a sense of symmetry in version exclusives these days (*cough* totem Kommo-o vs totem Ribombee), so who knows. Similarly, although people are speculating that the counterpart might be Meowth, others have pointed out that if the Affleck leaker knew of Sirfetch'd because he was playing sword, he may not have seen the counterpart unless a trainer has it, so it's hard to say.

I was certainly hoping for a more than just Sirfetch'd, so fingers crossed that the speculation about more Rotom glitches comes true and we get a few more frequent reveals this way. I know lots of people are enjoying how stingy GF is being with reveals this time around, but I so far while I like several of the designs of the revealed mons, I feel less excited than during SM's reveal period because only Corviknight really resonates with me as a team member so far (accounting already for the other obvious reason for deflated enthusiasm ;). I hope this sense of surprise later is worth it :P (j/k, the game will inevitably get datamined before I get my hands on it and I will fail to avoid leaks anyways :mehowth: )
 
So, as many of us suspected, it's indeed Sirfetch'd. I like the design and it shows so much personality, that's quite a nice change from its pre-evolution. But when I think about it, it gaining this form only after intense battles might actually make sense if you consider that Farfetch are rare and a delicatesse if I recall right. Or was that just in the anime? I don't know.

Anyway, maybe we'll learn more about Sirfetch'd in the game. According to the PokéDex, Farfetch'd don't seem to have an easy life since they rely heavily on their Stick, which doesn't grow everywhere. I wonder if the item would affect Sirfetch'd as well. Odds are it might get a new item.. I mean the stick looks quite different from Farfetch'd's one.

As for other things we learned from the trailer, while I'm not quite happy about the low hp and signature move, there is some hope that the bird has something for us in store. Maybe, Steadfast or a new ability might allow a Pkm to not charge again after using a move such as Giga Impact. This would allow Sirfetch to use its Meteor Assault without any negative consequences. STAB + Choice Band sound terrifying as it would turn Sirfetch'd into quite a wallbreaker.

If Sirfetch'd does have to charge after using its signature move, I wonder if its attack has any special effects? Maybe, it can go through Protect and bypass Shell Armor? Or maybe, it's a priority move since it has to charge with great speed?

On another note, Meteor Assault could be also shared by Escavalier! Just look at its lances. It would be definitely a nice addition to it since it lacks a good Fighting move. Imagine Dynamax Escavalier under Trick Room with such a reliable boost! *shudder*

Back to Sirfetch'd. It does seem to be more bulky, but unless GF invest a lot into its defenses, Sirfetch'd would still be somewhat frail. However, it has a shield. Maybe, after using Meteor Assault, it will go into a defense mode where any move against it would only do half damage.
 
Unova should be plus 4 not plus 2, Escavalier requires Shelmet, and thus Accelgor, to evolve.
I am aware that Accelgor is highly likely, but I'm just playing it safe and only recording mons we know for 100% sure will be in the game. If I counted duos, Unova would go even higher with mons like Mandibuzz and Throh added. Besides, GF has changed evolution requirements in the past.
 

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Welp, would give my opinion on Sirfetch'd but, as you probably guess, a new JAPE is in the making. BTW, if you haven't checked them out already, here are all the JAPEs for the revealed Gen VIII Pokemon:
  1. Gen 8 Starters
  2. The First Wild Batch
  3. Mascot Legendaries & Demo Duo
  4. The Object Three
  5. Galarian Formes & Pikaclone Debut
  6. Spooky Tea & Fishy Bird
Also confirmed to be evolution of Farfetch’d.
So no Galarain Farfetch'd, it's just a normal cross evolution. Well, if Farfetch'd is from Galar. Probably can't transfer up your previous Farfetch'd and evolve it (though if that's true I don't see why aside to keep the regional evolution theme. Oh well, at least would make breeding those Egg moves you want easier). Though I do wonder if they'll keep that restriction for later gens or they'll give you a way around it... which means they might as well just lift the restriction completely.

If its only for sword, what does ahield get?
Well, if we were to assume they'd make it a counterpart to Sirfetch'd, it might also be a regional evolution for a Pokemon that's not part of an evolution family.

Skipping ahead a bit, RocketSurgery suggested that Sirfetch'd could be Bea's ace (both being Sword exclusive) which could mean that the Shield counterpart could be a Ghost-type for Alister. A very plausible idea and would make sense why we didn't see either's ace yet.

So, what could it be? Eh, there are too many to candidates (also none of the Ghost-types really match, like Sirfetch'd it would probably get the Ghost-type as the Type change/addition).

Hmm, you know, many are speculating that Sirfetch'd, among other things, may be a remade version of a possible scrapped evolution for Farfetch'd in the Gold & Silver beta. If GF are remaking the scrapped GS Beta Pokemon, then maybe that's where we should look for a possible counterpart. That automatically knocks us down to Gen I & II Pokemon. I'm going to remove the Legendaries and ones who have Mega Evolution as I'm still hoping those get used as Gigantamax so would be strange for them to get a new evolution. That leaves Tauros, Lapras, Ditto, Unown, Girafairg, Dunsparce, Qwilfish, Shuckle, Corsola, Delibird, Skarmory, Stantler, Smeargle, & Miltank.

Now already I know what some of you are thinking: DUNSPARCE! Or Yung Dramps (and I know one other Youtuber) would love Delibird one. The leak did mention a Lapras Gigantamax, could they have mistaken it for a Galarian Forme or evolution? Well, remember I'm looking for a Pokemon which had a scrapped evolution in the GS Demo. Fun Fact, this would mean Ditto and Qwilfish (which evo looked to have then been made into Whiscash). HOWEVER there is one other Pokemon here which had an interesting beta design: Girafarig. Originally it really was a symmetrical Pokemon, except its back black head has a sinister expression and I believe it was Dark/Normal (it even had a pre-evolution but that's not important). Now what if they brought back this idea but as an evolution AND instead of Normal/Psychic they made it Normal/Ghost! Why Normal/Ghost? Well I'm assuming the developed head is the Normal-type and the undeveloped tail-head is the Psychic. If they're remaking the GS beta design then the tail-head would change into a full developed head thus would be the one to get the Type change.

So, yeah, that's my guess. Girafarig will be the Shield counterpart (Girafgira?) and become Normal/Ghost so it could be Alister's ace like Sirfetch'd is being predicted to become Bea's.


Farfetch'd has base 52 HP. Incidentally, a Level 60 Pokemon with base 52 HP, 0 HP EVs, and 20 HP IVs has 144 HP. Therefore, Sirfetch'd most likely has base 52 HP, the same as Farfetch'd. The most it can have is base 62, if that Sirfetch'd in the picture has 0 HP IVs and EVs.
Well that's disappointing. Maybe most of the stat increase went into Attack and Defense? But now makes me wonder what they're going to do about Speed, is it going to decrease now that it's holding heavier equipment or give it a boost since it does joust which needs speed and it's not increasing it's HP. As always they can increase Special Attack to give them some extra points to put elsewhere.

https://swordshield.pokemon.com/en-us/website-glitch/

I like how the implication is that the IT team was a bunch of trainers who had to probably beat rotom out of the system. Wonder if the mischievous rotom will return
Now I want it to return and make the next revealed Pokemon look SUPER AMAZING (though there will be some glitchiness to clue us in things aren't as they seem) only for the IT Trainers to chase it out and reveal it's actually a normal Pokemon. :bloblul:

Hmm...you know, normally people would scoff at hyper beam esque moves but gen 7 and max moves have taught me they all have a place. The Max Move variant will turn into an extremely powerful fighting type attack that boosts its attack, so its not we should just discard it by virtue.
Except that can't happen with Dynamax Pokemon, it'll just turn into the Fighting-type Max Move. BUT if it gets a Gigantamax Form it's new move could be given a G-Max Move.

Keep in mind that Farfetch'd only gets First Impression from Smeargle.
irrelevant as you can transfer a first impression Farfetch'd from USUM via home and evolve it
Nothing saying they can't also spread First Impression to other Pokemon.

A bulky physical attacker with high crit chance moves (due to Stick, which I assume would work because Alolan Marowak was compatible with Thick Club) and access to recovery could find a niche in the right metagame.

What I'm wondering is will Farfetch'd with Eviolite be able to find a niche in the lower tiers as a good utility mon.
Forgot about its signature item, Stick. In that case, I can maybe see it getting Cross Chop. Also working with Stick would be Leaf Blade, Night Slash, Psycho Cut, & Slash (all wish Farfetch'd get already).

Huh, Farfetch'd with Eviolite... I don't think will do much for it. 110 Defense and 124 Special Defense is nice but still has 52 HP. People who play competitive, that good/okay or not?
 
Mons that are not part of an evolution family, no megaevo, with less than base 430 stats, from Gen V or earlier.
Smeargle, doubtful, the gimmick is too strong.
Ditto, same.
Delibird, I could see it. 330 base stats, a design that you could expand on, similar to Farfetch’d visually, and Present feels like something GF might want to revisit.
Luvdisc, again I could see it. It’s been a joke forever, just a piñata filled with heart scales, and fixing that would be interesting.
Unown, yeah no.
Chatot, doubtful. It feels mostly complete in a way some other mons really don’t.
Dunsparce, everyone else has already talked about this. If GF remembers it exists, it’s probably a safe bet, but that’s a big if.
Castform. I love this mon, and clearly someone at GF shares my love for underrated Gen III mons since Zigzagoon is getting love, so maybe...lol no, not happening.
Not many options there. And once you get any higher than 420, you start seeing mons that have actual possibilities already. Kecleon, Tropius, and Girafarig aren’t good, but they’re not trash, and giving them an upgrade similar to Sirfetch’d will either break them or leave Sirfetch’d too weak to be useful.

The other option is giving something that’s Lapras-level a regional form instead of an evo. I would prefer that, tbh, but it would be odd from the perspective of keeping both games similar.

And of course, this is all wild speculation, so we’re probably all missing the mark.
 
As long as we’re speculating on base stats and Shield counterparts, the question I’m considering is how will this evolution be treated. In my mind, there are two precedents:

1) The Scizor Treatment: Sir keeps the same base stat total as his pre-evolution but with different stat values. I would expect buffs to Attack and Defense at the cost of Speed, SpAtk, and maybe SpDef. Think something around 52/110/95/30/60/30 would be apt.

2) The Lickilicky Treatment: Sirfetch’d gets a base stat total increase of ~130 (though since they buffed the Atk of Farfetch’d by 25 in SM it’s probably going to be closer to ~100). This gives us more to work with so maybe 55/130/100/65/67/60.

Obviously the second treatment would be preferred but who knows which way it will go.

As to the Shield counterpart, I honestly have no idea what GF will do. We can speculate from base totals and what not but this is the same company that gave Rhydon and Electrabuzz/Magmar evolutions but ignored Farfetch’d till now. As far as we know Alistar’s signature mon might be Polteagiest.

However, if we are wishlisting, then give me Galarian Parasect as Bug/Ghost.
 
They could go for the Mega Beedrill route with Sirfetch'd as well and lower its Special Attack, then distribute it to other stats, seeing how it only learns like 4 special moves as Farfetch'd from either Level Up or Breeding. Beedrill for the record could learn more from TM's.

500 BST should be the bare minimum, but I hope for a bit more. Looking at past cross gen evolutions that didn't end up as a 3-stage line, or didn't get a pre evolution.
Learning a required move evolutions:
Lickitung (385) --> Lickilicky (515)
Tangela (435) --> Tangrowth (535)
Aipom (360) --> Ambipom (482)
Yanma (390) --> Yanmega (515)

Stone evolutions:
Murkrow (405) --> Honchkrow (505)
Misdreavus (435) --> Mismagius (495)
Snorunt (300) --> Froslass (480)

Hold item evolutions:
Gligar (430) --> Gliscor (510)
Sneasel (430) --> Weavile (510)

So Farfetch's is 52/90/55/58/62/60 = 377.
For Sirfetch'd at least 123 BST should be usable to make it 500 BST. 52/130/105/58/95/60 = 500. This is without touching the Special Attack and Speed.
Now what if we reduce the Special Attack, as well as the Speed, and also make it 515 BST? 52/140/128/30/125/40 = 515 BST. This way it could take a hit despite the low HP, and retaliate back hard. If it gets Roost, it's even better.
 
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There's really no reason to run Meteor Assault for DMax shenanigans when every other Fighting move does the same and is useable for more than 3 turns without a horrible drawback.

Unless the base power increase is so massive compared to whatever it will normally run as a STAB, it doesn't need to waste a moveslot like that when it has so many good options already.
 
There's really no reason to run Meteor Assault for DMax shenanigans when every other Fighting move does the same and is useable for more than 3 turns without a horrible drawback.

Unless the base power increase is so massive compared to whatever it will normally run as a STAB, it doesn't need to waste a moveslot like that when it has so many good options already.
"A horrible drawback" has not stopped some Pokémon running Z-Moves off Hyper Beam or Giga Impact, and they had even less usability than MAX Meteor Assault.

Considering its second-strongest STAB looks like it would be Sacred Sword (which will have a little more than half of Meteor Assault's Base Power, unless it has more than 150 BP like Prismatic Laser) it could actually have decent use on Max-intended sets. I mean, even though it loses its Flying STAB, Fighting/Flying has really good neutral coverage; very few Pokémon resist both. It could run something like Meteor Assault/Sacred Sword/Brave Bird/Roost if it so much needed it.

But then again, it depends on the exact details of Dynamaxing.
 
"A horrible drawback" has not stopped some Pokémon running Z-Moves off Hyper Beam or Giga Impact, and they had even less usability than MAX Meteor Assault.

Considering its second-strongest STAB looks like it would be Sacred Sword (which will have a little more than half of Meteor Assault's Base Power, unless it has more than 150 BP like Prismatic Laser) it could actually have decent use on Max-intended sets. I mean, even though it loses its Flying STAB, Fighting/Flying has really good neutral coverage; very few Pokémon resist both. It could run something like Meteor Assault/Sacred Sword/Brave Bird/Roost if it so much needed it.

But then again, it depends on the exact details of Dynamaxing.
Z-Giga Impact is ran as coverage on Pokemon that need to muscle through checks, like Kartana. When it comes to a STAB Nuke it’s either just your standard STAB used (as wasting 2 slots for the same STAB with only 20 or so more BP isn’t good) or maybe something like Explosion which has post Z/Dyna utility.
 
Z-Giga Impact is ran as coverage on Pokemon that need to muscle through checks, like Kartana. When it comes to a STAB Nuke it’s either just your standard STAB used (as wasting 2 slots for the same STAB with only 20 or so more BP isn’t good) or maybe something like Explosion which has post Z/Dyna utility.
Well, in this case it wouldn't be 20 more BP, but rather 60 (70 if it's instead a Prismatic Laser clone) as I doubt it would get Close Combat. It's kind of... large, but I guess that could be true in regards to the overlapping coverage.
 
Well, in this case it wouldn't be 20 more BP, but rather 60 (70 if it's instead a Prismatic Laser clone) as I doubt it would get Close Combat. It's kind of... large, but I guess that could be true in regards to the overlapping coverage.
Personally I think there’s a fairly decent chance it could get Close Combat and / or Superpower. It could learn them as Egg moves from Staraptor and Braviary, respectively.
 

Theorymon

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While I'm pretty disappointed that Sirfetch'd is pure Fighting, I have to admit it's likely going to have a very unique movepool for a Fighting-type. Roost, First Impression, and Tailwind (well thats for doubles, who knows how they'll treat old tutor moves for transfers this time) are pretty unique tools compared to the usual Fighting-types. Also, since it'll be one of the few Fighting-types to have a powerful Flying-type attack, that might be useful while Dynamaxed to increase speed. Hard to say too much considering we don't know the full stats and hidden ability, but hopefully the stats let it use its unique movepool to the fullest extent!
 
Personally I think there’s a fairly decent chance it could get Close Combat and / or Superpower. It could learn them as Egg moves from Staraptor and Braviary, respectively.
Close Combat is a really safe bet considering the distribution and the Egg Move possibility is interesting, but I'd rather have it be a level-up move for in-game purposes.

Sacred Sword could be cool too, but only if Gallade gets it too. My boy needs justice.
 
Sirfetch'd is the most compelling bit of news I've seen regarding the upcoming games.
It's a cool update of a "joke" Pokemon. The smug facial expression is great.
We've had "smugleaf" now say hi to "Smugleek", lol.

The change to mono-fighting type is unexpected but at least that's a decent defensive (and offensive) typing.
Defensively, its weaknesses are fairly uncommon as non-STAB coverage so you can usually see the attacks coming a mile away.
Offensively, we all know how good Fighting is really.

I'll agree with those who believe Sirfetch'd will fit into the slow, bulky Fighting type archetype (look at that weight, lol).
Making the obvious movepool assumptions, Roost + Defog with a Rock resist is quite cool.
First Impression and U-turn are also interesting moves on something that may attract Psychic types.
It's funny that the biggest movepool question mark is whether it'll have good Fighting STAB.

The ability is kind of "meh", though.
Even Inner Focus would have been nicer on a Pokemon that's likely very slow.
Not sure if HA are even a thing anymore with all the stuff being removed but they're usually better and can sometimes "make" a Pokemon.
My pet idea is like Steelworker but for Flying moves. However anything will be better than a situational almost non-ability like Steadfast.

The Pokemon is definitely a design win though.
It took everything that made Farfetch'd unique and made it more epic.
That what you expect from an evolution.
 
It's funny that the biggest movepool question mark is whether it'll have good Fighting STAB.
Just made a quick look at Farfetch'd's current learnset, and it is able to learn three Fighting-type moves (and one of them is incompatible with the other two):
- Detect (Gen II TM)
- Revenge (Egg Move from Gen V onwards)
- Final Gambit (Egg Move in USUM)

So yeah, Sirfetch'd has a dire need of a learnset expansion.
 
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