Pokemon Sword & Shield Discussion RD: 15/11/2019

Luna Fantasia

formerly Tyrell D. Barnes
While I said before I don't think it'll have much affect on gameplay, I am still curious to see how much detail they give the Poke Jobs mechanic. This is a chance to really expand the Pokemon world by mentioning all sorts of ways companies and institutions use Pokemon in way we obviously can't in real life. What sort of businesses and research can be done and accomplished with elemental creatures as one's fingertips?
I'm with you on this one.

Worst-case scenario: It'll be about as intuitive as Isle Aphun, wherein you simply send your Pokémon off to an "adventure", and they just bring stuff back within 12-24 hours. Honestly, if a feature is being implemented, it may as well be fleshed out as much as possible (not so much as to detract from the focus of the game, of course); but, this is just me speaking out of my mind.
 

Codraroll

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Consider that Gigantimax forms will only be available from mons captured in raids, so unless you are able to actually do raids during the main story, this is something that you're not going to be able to work out.
I'm pretty sure raids and Gigantamax formes will be available during the main story. It's a major new feature, so it will be placed front and center for players to enjoy early on, instead of tucked away so late in the game that impatient players have already given up. XY had Mega Evolutions before the third Gym (and you got your first Mega Stone halfway to the second Gym, even disregarding the event Torchic that gave it to you from the start), SM showed its Alolan forms halfway through the tutorial area and had Z-moves displayed prominently right around the first trial. I think players will be railroaded right into a Gigantamax encounter before the game is one quarter through the story.
 
I'm pretty sure raids and Gigantamax formes will be available during the main story. It's a major new feature, so it will be placed front and center for players to enjoy early on, instead of tucked away so late in the game that impatient players have already given up. XY had Mega Evolutions before the third Gym (and you got your first Mega Stone halfway to the second Gym, even disregarding the event Torchic that gave it to you from the start), SM showed its Alolan forms halfway through the tutorial area and had Z-moves displayed prominently right around the first trial. I think players will be railroaded right into a Gigantamax encounter before the game is one quarter through the story.
Dynamaxing is main game for sure, but I'm only mostly sure about Gigantamaxing being main game. Ultra Beasts were advertised as a major part of Sun and Moon, but only Nihilego was seen in the main game.
 

Pikachu315111

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Dynamaxing is main game for sure, but I'm only mostly sure about Gigantamaxing being main game. Ultra Beasts were advertised as a major part of Sun and Moon, but only Nihilego was seen in the main game.
Now that you mentioned it, it does feel like they had more planned with the Ultra Beasts during the main game. First they established that Ultra Wormholes can appear anywhere, having one even randomly appear above the Dimensional Research Lab. That plot point goes nowhere, every other Ultra Wormhole is intentionally summoned. Then after Lusamine used Nebby to open up a ton of wormholes we see scenes of the Ultra Beasts being unleashed and the Island Kahuna & Guardians doing battle. But once we're able to leave Aether Paradise everything seems to be fine, the Island Kahunas and Guardians were able to beat back the Ultra Beasts until post game. We finally got the Ultra Beast storyline in the post game for SM (which they then removed for USUM meaning the majority of the Ultra Beasts have role in the story whatsoever), but at two points it felt like they had story ideas for the UBs but didn't do neither yet still kept their "hook" as part of the story:

1. For the random Ultra Wormhole appearing above the Dimensional Research Lab, feels like it's a hint throughout the story other wormholes would be appearing around Alola releasing an Ultra Beast. We'd then have to find and battle this Ultra Beast (though probably unable to catch them, they'll work like how Nihilego did when we first encountered it, it's name being "???"), and after so it'll run back into it's Ultra Wormhole causing it to close-up. This would also probably be where the Aether Foundation initially become more involved and there being a reason for the Ultra Beasts codenames which were otherwise pointless. Maybe after dealing with the first Ultra Beast (probably either Buzzwole or Pheramosa), the Aether Foundation would be impressed and invite us to Aether Paradise and we'd be asked to help with cataloging other Ultra Beasts, thus the codenames. Then post game, maybe after getting an item to open up Ultra Wormholes, we could return to where we encountered the Ultra Beast and open the Wormhole again but this time able to catch the Ultra Beast and permanently close the wormhole. Now able to catch them, it's then we'd be able to go to Wicke who would give them their official names and tell us about them.
This could have been the initial idea but when time became stricter and the story needed to become more tighter I could see how they decided to chop this idea as it would require coming up with additional story events that was deemed unnecessary.

2. Lusamine unleashing the Ultra Beasts could have been their second attempt to keep the other Ultra Beasts relevant to the main story. Instead of spreading the Ultra Beasts events throughout the story they'll instead have you battle a batch of them all at once. After the events on Aether Paradise you'll go to each island and help the Kahuna and Island Guardian to battle an Ultra Beast that's now on the rampage. By the time you're ready to be sent out Wicke would tell you the UBs that have been spotted, each one being given a codename, and then after you beat them they'll be forced back into the Ultra Wormhole and it'll close-up. Then post game you could go back, open the wormhole, and catch them & close the wormhole permanently. Wicke would then tell you their official names and additional info.
So what could have happened? Well they could have decided this was too much of a pace killer, at that point in the story they wanted to focus in Lillie's development and the player needing to go on a quick Ultra Beast hunt would push her in the background during part of the story she's taking the forefront. Also time restraints once again could have meant even this decrease in scale was still too much work, these games had to be out by Pokemon's 20th Anniversary so chop chop.

Thus we got what we got in the post game of SM. And instead of maybe putting any ideas they had back into the story for USUM they instead tried to shove more characters & story into a story they had made airtight which results in not a more complete story but rather many incomplete stories.


That said, Ultra Beasts & Gigantamaxing are two separate things. Ultra Beasts were their own Pokemon, them not being used in the story is just them not placing an event relating to them into the story. They only needed the one (Nihilego) to setup the main conflict while the others were treated as additional mysteries for the post game.
However Gigantamaxing is closely related to a mechanic we've seen being used predominately, Dynamaxing, and it's likely we'll have some of the really notable trainers using a Gigantamaxed Pokemon (Leon cause Champion, maybe the rivals (mainly Bede and Marnie though Hop getting one could be used to show character growth for him), Rose if you ever battle him; I wouldn't put past maybe a few Legendaries getting a Gigantamax if not the main mascots). While they'll probably save some for post game, at the same time they'll probably make a batch available during main game much like they did with Mega Evolution.

Could very well just be another red herring, but hey, it's something. Perhaps new anime season news?
When did they make the announcement for the Sun & Moon anime?

Probably the debut of a new Pokémon. Going by TPC's track record, I'd say it's Impidimp.
OR, they could do what they did during Black & White and have a guess character from the new region appear with a batch of new Pokemon.

Here's what I'm thinking: seems coincidental they introduced the Galarian Pokemon and then this announcement. Why? Because Samson Oak's expertise is Regional Variants! He would very much be interested in Galarian Pokemon. So, getting into contact with Magnolia, she would send her granddaughter Sonia to Alola with Galarian variants (and maybe some other new Pokemon) in hand (I'd also imagine maybe Magnolia & Sonia having interest in the Totem Pokemon since they're bigger than normal Pokemon). And, much like they did with Alexa in BW, this would alert Ash of the Galar region, aka his next destination (as a bonus they could maybe also have Sonia upgrade Rotom Dex to the Rotom Phone).
 
Dynamaxing is main game for sure, but I'm only mostly sure about Gigantamaxing being main game. Ultra Beasts were advertised as a major part of Sun and Moon, but only Nihilego was seen in the main game.
It's very possible that a few Gigamax are available during the main game with most however requiring postgame (either due to being in high level areas / raids, or actually unavailable until then).

Both gen 6 and 7 games had part of the megas / Z-crystals only available in the latest part of the game or postgame (due to story zone blocks or requiring TMs) so I can see a pattern there.
 

For real, GF sure took the complaints about a huge amount of trailers spoiling too much of the game to heart, huh? I don't mind spoilers and hope we get some more trailers soon, but I'm glad those folk finally got their wish.

Is there anything of note anyone would like to discuss? If not, I suppose we can leave this open until some news does drop.
 

Pikachu315111

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Not sure about everyone else, but I'm kind of trying to make it a personal goal to keep this thread open until the next announcement if nothing more than to prove we can keep ourselves conducted once all that has been discussed has been discussed (even if that means this thread goes a few days without a post, at least its still open).

I guess I can try another discussion topic. How about this time we talk about our hopes for the graphics, specifically comparing them to previous games.

From Gens 1-3 we had sprites, from the very simple overworld characters to the in-battle portraits.
Gen 4-5 experimented with still having characters and in-battle be sprites but the overworld used 3D models.
Gen 6 we made the jump to full 3D (in the main series), with the overworld being chibi and in-battle looking correctly proportioned.
Gen 7 everything was correctly proportioned.
Let's Go combined the chibi & correctly proportioned style creating a more cartoonish look (as opposed to a more anime-like style).

Gen 8 we return to Gen 7's correctly proportioned/anime style. But what do you say? What did you like from each style? Your best/worst? What would you like to see from Gen 8's graphics that was done by a previous generation graphics?
 
I actually like the "realistic" correctly proportioned style more.
While I have nothing against Chibi style, it feels a bit out of place due to the contrast between chibi overworld and realistic battle.
Also, with the graphic getting (slowly) more and more detailed+realistic, the chibi avatars start to feel more and more out of place as well.

I think they have made a good choice to stick with the realistic approach (rip pokemon proportions, still) due to the graphical choices of SwSh: since the games seem to give a certain degree of importance to the realism and details of the overworld (except certain trees apparently), a non-realistic human would really feel like a punch in the face.
 
So as posted on the events thread here:-

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/event-discussion.3529649/page-46#post-8222065

SM/USUM are getting a Shiny Lunala and Shiny Solgaleo distribution. This is super interesting to me because support for any other 3DS thing - not just Pokémon, but on a wider scale such as Youtube and even more recently Credit Card support in Europe - has completely dropped, as Nintendo has stopped making and licensing games for the system and has moved completely away from it. Indeed, the last Pokémon event for the 3DS outside of VGC was just under a year ago.

What I'm getting at is: why would they suddenly do an event like this for a system and games that Nintendo and Game Freak have completely dropped any support for and want their consumer bases to completely shift their attention away from... unless the Pokémon you get from it - Lunala and Solgaleo - are able to be transferred to Sword and Shield?

It might be a stretch, but I don't think it's baseless or inconceivable.
 

Pikachu315111

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So as posted on the events thread here:-

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/event-discussion.3529649/page-46#post-8222065

SM/USUM are getting a Shiny Lunala and Shiny Solgaleo distribution. This is super interesting to me because support for any other 3DS thing - not just Pokémon, but on a wider scale such as Youtube and even more recently Credit Card support in Europe - has completely dropped, as Nintendo has stopped making and licensing games for the system and has moved completely away from it. Indeed, the last Pokémon event for the 3DS outside of VGC was just under a year ago.

What I'm getting at is: why would they suddenly do an event like this for a system and games that Nintendo and Game Freak have completely dropped any support for and want their consumer bases to completely shift their attention away from... unless the Pokémon you get from it - Lunala and Solgaleo - are able to be transferred to Sword and Shield?

It might be a stretch, but I don't think it's baseless or inconceivable.
Being it was the last gen I can completely see all Gen VII Pokemon being in the game just so there's a direct connection there. Not to say that means all the Pokemon in the Alolan Dex will be in the Galar Dex, just the Pokemon introduced in Gen VII specifically.

Though at the same time, they could just be giving them out now to let us play with them before it's time to move onto next generation. If they're not in the Galar Dex that just means they'll be waiting in HOME until the next game they are in.
 
Personally, I think this is a sort of "parting gift" to close out the gen with. I doubt it's a hint at Gen 7 legends being transferable to Galar, at least not the primary intent. At least I hope it isn't, I don't want Tapus and UBs ruining the meta... ...Then again, considering the power drought half of them will probably need to be banned anyway, so I guess it wouldn't hurt too much xd
 
My gut assumption was more on the parting gift end of things and that it signaled higher odds of them not being in Galar, as this would be the last time for a few years to offer the shinies available in game, and since shiny locking was implemented I don't think they've waited more than 1 gen to release the shiny box legends? (mythicals, on the other hand...). Of course, they haven't left much time for shiny necrozma, so if its not in SwSh we either need a down-to-the-wire surprise or we'll be waiting a few years.

That said, given that it seems like legendaries and mythicals are least likely to migrate regions, it would be nice if a handful of the Usum crew made it to swsh to give them at least 2 games before being moved out of rotation. (biased opinion mostly due to wanting to use Marshadow more :p)

As for the graphics question: I definitely prefer the more proportional style and am glad they are sticking with it. Using sprites for the party icons etc is a nice touch though that I'm down with them keeping. Otherwise, if there's anything from older gens I'd like to see return, I guess the swords dance animation? I thought the swords looked better in gen 6 than 7. It would also be nice if the idle poses were a little more dynamic like in gen 5, especially during long bouts of players making decisions. :P
 
Unfortunately I do think it's just a parting gift.

I don't think Cosmog's family will be in SwSh (though, could be in whatever 2nd batch of titles comes out next year or the year after), as I have a hard time seeing any realistic connection with Galar so far other than just "let's put them in for reasons".

They probably just wanted to give them out now as realistically speaking it'll be a while before they'd be able to release the shinys in future.
 
The thing about the parting gift idea though - which I do actually agree it is at least that - is that every parting gift in the past has, of course, been transferable to the next game. There was nothing stopping you from transferring up that Volcanion or whatever else to Sun/Moon -- heck, in Volcanion's case in particular, it was even promoted alongside a new Gen 7 Pokémon.

It is entirely possible though that they won't be in SwSh, but I did find it interesting enough to note.
 
I have a theory that this generation we'll get 2 psuedo legendaries, bringing the total to an even 10. Dragonite, Tyranitar, Metagross, Salamence and Garchomp all have Attack as their highest stat. In BW they started breaking that tradition, with Hydreigon having Special Attack as its highest stat, then Goodra having Special Defence in XY, then Kommo-O having Defence as its highest stat in SM. This leaves HP and Speed as the only stats that have not been a psuedo’s highest yet. As a theme of Galar seems to be tradition vs progress, we could have a slow bulky Tyranitar-esque one with HP as its highest stat and a fast frail one with Speed as its highest stat. They could make them Grass / Dragon and Steel / Electric, to represent the power of nature vs technology.
 
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I have a theory that this generation we'll get 2 psuedo legendaries, bringing the total to an even 10. Dragonite, Tyranitar, Metagross and Salamence all have Attack as their highest stat. In BW they started breaking that tradition, with Hydreigon having Special Attack as its highest stat, then Goodra having Special Defence in XY, then Kommo-O having Defence as its highest stat in SM. This leaves HP and Speed as the only stats that haven't been used yet. As a theme of Galar seems to be tradition vs progress, we could have a slow bulky Tyranitar-esque one with HP as its highest stat and a fast frail one with Speed as its highest stat. They could make them Grass / Dragon and Steel / Electric, to represent the power of nature vs technology.
If Duralodon truly turns out to be a pseudo-legendary (since we've seen it fight against other pseudos every time it has had screen time) then it could be the coveted high-speed pseudo you're thinking, especially since we know from other screenshots that it has Gengar-level HP, and thus its other stats may be above average as a result.
 
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My gut assumption was more on the parting gift end of things and that it signaled higher odds of them not being in Galar, as this would be the last time for a few years to offer the shinies available in game, and since shiny locking was implemented I don't think they've waited more than 1 gen to release the shiny box legends? (mythicals, on the other hand...). Of course, they haven't left much time for shiny necrozma, so if its not in SwSh we either need a down-to-the-wire surprise or we'll be waiting a few years.
Well then.

 

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