Nowhere, it just says they won't be available in SS (the part I highlighted in the screenshot)
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Sword & Shield **Official news only** DLC Crown Tundra 22nd October
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
Is there even a "Well, look on the bright side!" in light of this whole thing involving the possibility that your Pokémon from the older games? I'm not seeing one at the moment...
Quick question. I have seen mentions online that the 3D models in Pokemon XY were future-proofed and created as HD models, and that the limiting factor on the 3DS was its inherent lack of power and low display resolution. Is this true? I have only really seen this on a couple of random forums and haven't been able to find a concrete answer.
You've forgot the 35 Spinda patterns, like I said in my calculation post. This altogether already surpasses the 1000 in Gen7, thus we already concluded that the author of the tweet was misleading the readers with the +forms.
Could've just saved yourself a lot of work by looking at this, which is literally the first page that comes up when you Google "pokemon forms." Forms are an actual thing in the games where you can cycle through each one in the Pokedex, and either way it's common sense that whichever way you count it, once you add the 70 or so new Galar Pokemon there are more than enough Pokemon + forms to push the total over 1000. And of course if you're a developer trying to hype up your game to an interviewer, it's a lot easier to just say there are over 1000 than go off on some crazy nitpicking tangent like you or this guy down here did.
Nope, those are not different forms in the console games. If you're posting in a thread to do nothing but make an obnoxious nitpick, at least make sure you know what you're talking about.
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CTNC
Doesn't know how to attack
As some people have sid before, Game Freak having to make over 800 Pokemon available every generation is insane, so I'm whole heartily in favor of a few hundred being uncatchable every generation. Uncatchable, sure, but untranferable, please no. I'm going to wait until they announce if there will or won't be a patch before I decide on a Gen VIII Game. That said, if there is no patch, I'm willing to accept it and buy a Gen VIII Game anyway... just not SwSh... The third version is sure to have an expanded dex and I really don't like the idea of buying a game that will be a notably worse version of one that's going to come out year or two later.
You know what? This was actually smart. Get folks angry 5 months before release day so that when the games do come out their rage will have subsided and people will have forgotten what they were angry about in the first place.
All pokemon models are stupidly high poly and were compressed for the 3ds games. For example, if you run USUM on the Citra emulator they'll look almost as good as the LGPE models, which are NS games. And if you pay attention to SS's trailers you can clearly tell the models used for older pokemon are the same used in XY, ORAS, SM and USUM.
Spinda patterns don't but Vivillon's patterns do? ...Give me a break. They should be counted as different sprites/models. If all Spinda patterns are a single model, how do they manipulate the algorythm to change the pattern positions to one of the 35 upon wild encounter?
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You're missing the obvious point, which is who cares about exactly what counts as a form. You were the one trying to make it sound like there's some 'fake news' assault against Gamefreak because one of their own developers was quoted in an interview as saying the new games bring the total over 1000, which as it turns out is actually true according to the standards of the people who make the game.
But the spanish tweet I quoted said "(including forms)". The 1000+ is true but the real question is if the forme inclusion to the count (as the spanish tweet said) is real or not:
- If the "(forms included)" part of what the spanish tweet said is true, then we care of counting the formes, and if it surpasses 1000 on Gen7, it's an "ironical captain obvious"-type fake news from GameFreak's part (as "we will" is different from "we already").
- If the "(forms included)" part of what the spanish tweet said is false, then we do not care about formes and it's fake news coming from this spanish tweet. While Gamefreak's 1000+corfirmation is still true.
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No, the idea is for them to patch them in later, maybe three to six months after release, similar to when PokeBank came out a few months after XY. That'd be fine and nobody would care.
Yes, and if you could read at all you'd see that I clearly mentioned that forms have had a pretty specific definition in Pokemon for a few generations now. The Pokedex differentiates between the different Vivillon patterns but not the Spinda patterns. You can scream "DURRR I DONT THINK IT SHOULD BE THAT WAY" until you're blue in the face, but that doesn't change how it actually is.
Such agressive mockery. I think I'm starting to like you.
Now back to the topic: How much formes are there in total? And do they surpass 1000 in Gen7?
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I think I'll also go this way. Until few days ago, I wanted to save for Switch and Sw, and hope I'll make it by then or at least few days after the initial stocks are sold out (especially that I was very big on this for various reasons, like making homage run of Suikoden 2 my big bro is hard fan of, liking the starters enough, the DyRaid), but now I'm feeling apathetic and just thinking to buy so if I have the money by that time, if not skipping it entirely. I think I'll just wait for updated rerelease/3rd version, the patch to include everyone, or just skip the generation if neither are done and I have no enough money.
I... just feel my hype crashed. On the upside, I should now be able to get few things like Popplio plush and other stuffs I have been holding over due to uni student allowances limitation which Sw took part of savings of.
And now I'm worried of the long run of this decision. I could only pray Arceus blesses them, although I'm worried of the direction they're going to.
BTW, few hours ago their Treehouse interview reached more than 2:1 dislike ratio. Not that it is indicative of GF caring much, but this is still kinda sad. Oh, and we can drop model quality from arguments if this is to go by https://imgur.com/PxH0QA5
As Pikachu315111 said, they made themselves a big mountain to climb. Or to make it relevant, uncontrollably Dmaxed Donphan in the room.
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Just had another thought as I tried to go to sleep: People who have ribbon project Pokemon are potentially going to be royally screwed. If a Pokemon who you've brought up through the generations is not going to be in the Gen 8 dex, you can't transfer them in and thus they'll be forever incomplete and you've effectively wasted your time :/.
Whelp, I hope anyone who had long term ribbon projects chose wisely ;-;.
Whelp, I hope anyone who had long term ribbon projects chose wisely ;-;.
Mostly leaving aside the disappointment of cut Pokemon*, it'll be sad if Mega Evolution is gone for good. I still remember posting about it in one of the XY equivalents of this thread, and it's never gotten close to the potential I saw in it back then. What I liked so much about species-specific powerups was the possibility that any fully evolved Pokemon could get one, and be given a way to be usable in battles even if the base Pokemon sucked.
Can't remember whether I ever posted this, but the example that was at least in my head was Sunflora. If someone really liked Sunflora, but avoided using it because it's just terrible in battle, then Mega Evolution could have given them away to make it at least usable, if not strictly competitively viable. I don't even particularly like Sunflora, but it was the example of a weak Pokemon that popped into my head, and I've been waiting for Mega Sunflora ever since.
I guess Dynamax could be a more efficient way to accomplish the same goal, but:
1) That's iffy assuming you can just choose any Pokemon in your party to Dynamax, instead of having to choose to bring a Sunflorite ahead of time.
2) It's just not nearly as cool or interesting.
Meanwhile, Mega Evolution seems to have just been handed out some mostly-already-cool Pokemon and then ignored in favour of a new gimmick in each new generation. What a waste.
*I will quickly mention that there are a few Pokemon I've been transferring forward since my original Sapphire playthrough, and I'll be extra upset in the likely event that at least one of Sceptile, Latias, and Flygon isn't in SwSh.
Edit: Lol immediately after posting I found this quote:
Can't remember whether I ever posted this, but the example that was at least in my head was Sunflora. If someone really liked Sunflora, but avoided using it because it's just terrible in battle, then Mega Evolution could have given them away to make it at least usable, if not strictly competitively viable. I don't even particularly like Sunflora, but it was the example of a weak Pokemon that popped into my head, and I've been waiting for Mega Sunflora ever since.
I guess Dynamax could be a more efficient way to accomplish the same goal, but:
1) That's iffy assuming you can just choose any Pokemon in your party to Dynamax, instead of having to choose to bring a Sunflorite ahead of time.
2) It's just not nearly as cool or interesting.
Meanwhile, Mega Evolution seems to have just been handed out some mostly-already-cool Pokemon and then ignored in favour of a new gimmick in each new generation. What a waste.
*I will quickly mention that there are a few Pokemon I've been transferring forward since my original Sapphire playthrough, and I'll be extra upset in the likely event that at least one of Sceptile, Latias, and Flygon isn't in SwSh.
Edit: Lol immediately after posting I found this quote:
Still lame.
I’m mostly very disappointed by this news though I am excited to see what this would mean for balancing. I just don’t like the idea of waiting for months to know whether or not my more obscure favorites will be scrapped over the more popular Dragons and other fan favorites.
My bigger worry or complaint is that given that there will be a limited Pokedex, it still seems like they’re going to be adding a ton of useless unviable filler Pokémon which just seems pointless to me. I’d rather have my old ones than another weak grass flower or Pikaclone. Also it would be nice to having more unique or fairly unique dual typings, which so far we haven’t really seen yet among the new mons. And this Poke Purge is very scary to me because they haven’t really established if in future games the missing Pokémon will be brought back or rendered completely unusable.
Also, for all of their struggles with animating Pokémon the ones that they have animated don’t look that great imo. I much prefer 3DS’s more 2D rendered art because I feel like so much detail is lost in these models. Looking at the illustrations on Serebii a lot of the new Pokémon I dislike in their game form I actually do like when illustrated. I don’t play video games outside of Pokémon so I’m not sure if my wording is correct, but I just don’t see why they even changed the rendering so much when at least to me it looked better before.
My bigger worry or complaint is that given that there will be a limited Pokedex, it still seems like they’re going to be adding a ton of useless unviable filler Pokémon which just seems pointless to me. I’d rather have my old ones than another weak grass flower or Pikaclone. Also it would be nice to having more unique or fairly unique dual typings, which so far we haven’t really seen yet among the new mons. And this Poke Purge is very scary to me because they haven’t really established if in future games the missing Pokémon will be brought back or rendered completely unusable.
Also, for all of their struggles with animating Pokémon the ones that they have animated don’t look that great imo. I much prefer 3DS’s more 2D rendered art because I feel like so much detail is lost in these models. Looking at the illustrations on Serebii a lot of the new Pokémon I dislike in their game form I actually do like when illustrated. I don’t play video games outside of Pokémon so I’m not sure if my wording is correct, but I just don’t see why they even changed the rendering so much when at least to me it looked better before.
This whole balancing "excuse" confuses the hell out of me because the National Dex is usually acquired during the post-game, when the story mode is completed. What's so important during the post-game that requires Pokemon to be excluded to "preserve balance"? They could have also just limited the VGC '20 roster to solely being Galar dex mons like they've done for just about every first metagame of the generation.
Retroactively cutting Pokemon does nothing to enhance the game, in my opinion.
Retroactively cutting Pokemon does nothing to enhance the game, in my opinion.
Good news for you, at least Flygon is confirmed to be there already.
....I'd be pretty confident the other 2 won't, though.
We never had other gen starters aside gen 1s in the regional Pokedex before (in SM/USUM they were catchable via island scan, but still werent in the Pokedex), and similar thing can be said for other gen legendaries.
press F
Looks like the debate over the reduction of available Pokémon has become pretty heated over the past few pages, to the point that we mods considered to lock the thread. But since news are still fresh, and there are plenty of things to discuss that are not related to the Pokédex, we've decided to keep the thread open. However:
No more discussing the Pokémon roster, please. We hope you understand.
No more discussing the Pokémon roster, please. We hope you understand.
I wouldn't bring Fifa, 2K, Diablo as comparisons of pro (or anti) consumer attitude, nor would I include SW Battlefront 2, Fallout 76, Anthem and early Destiny 2, for one simple reason: bad can always get worse.
I actually am a business developer (though in a very different industry), and I gave Bungie and Activision all I could to to share my distaste in a very similar situation: Destiny 2 was extremely content-limited at launch, the hardcore fans like myself were ignored and played around for a year, the game was outright a shell of himself (I am talking a 78% player base drop disaster at some point) so I really made up my mind and did all I could after they didn't listen: I abandoned the franchise for good, a decision a lot of Pokemon players (the vocal minority if you will, I'll give you that) seems open to now whilst they'd never have considered skipping the game before this announcement.
All of the above just to reiterate one thing I said earlier: I still fail to see any negative correlation, trade off or conundrum if you will, between Pokedex size and Regional focus/development. That is, outside of self-imposed corporate time constraints and what I call the "yearly release flu", which are corporate decision every IP has every right to take, but in this case such a path is both anti-consumer and reputation-threatening (maybe not the latter because of the specific IP we are talking about but the point stands).
This is absurd to me: we are discussing about two unrelated topics that don't fundamentally detract from one another, it's THAT straightforward. I understand people wanting well thought regional focused games, game-specific mechanics and immersion. Guess want? We ("complainers" if you will) want the same, actually! And every Pokemon. Both can be done, just in due time, in my opinion.
I seriously don't grasp while we shouldn't aspire to have the best possible game released, especially if the trade-off for missing features is simply a cash-grabbing rushed release against a complete game few months later. Who would want the former? Game Freak, if sales number are comparable, certainly not players.
I actually am a business developer (though in a very different industry), and I gave Bungie and Activision all I could to to share my distaste in a very similar situation: Destiny 2 was extremely content-limited at launch, the hardcore fans like myself were ignored and played around for a year, the game was outright a shell of himself (I am talking a 78% player base drop disaster at some point) so I really made up my mind and did all I could after they didn't listen: I abandoned the franchise for good, a decision a lot of Pokemon players (the vocal minority if you will, I'll give you that) seems open to now whilst they'd never have considered skipping the game before this announcement.
All of the above just to reiterate one thing I said earlier: I still fail to see any negative correlation, trade off or conundrum if you will, between Pokedex size and Regional focus/development. That is, outside of self-imposed corporate time constraints and what I call the "yearly release flu", which are corporate decision every IP has every right to take, but in this case such a path is both anti-consumer and reputation-threatening (maybe not the latter because of the specific IP we are talking about but the point stands).
This is absurd to me: we are discussing about two unrelated topics that don't fundamentally detract from one another, it's THAT straightforward. I understand people wanting well thought regional focused games, game-specific mechanics and immersion. Guess want? We ("complainers" if you will) want the same, actually! And every Pokemon. Both can be done, just in due time, in my opinion.
I seriously don't grasp while we shouldn't aspire to have the best possible game released, especially if the trade-off for missing features is simply a cash-grabbing rushed release against a complete game few months later. Who would want the former? Game Freak, if sales number are comparable, certainly not players.
EDIT: saw the discussion warning message as I was about to post, so I am happy to continue discussing about it privately if anyone wants. Still, I would like to keep the above momentarily just to give it a read, as I had already typed everything the moment Codraroll message popped up. Is that fine? Otherwise I will/you can erase everything above and gladly continue the discussion about the below only.
Shifting the discussion to a point that got buried in the Dex controversy, I would like to reiterate how player interaction really appeared fantastic to me. Not only did other players appeared roaming ingame, the game also pops up what they are doing.
That could be very helpful if you're playing semi-blind and see another player catching something you didn't know was available in the area, and now you go look for it, similar to a real life fishing session. This could be great for immersion.
Another thing that I remember is that in Ruby and Sapphire, when you exchanged data with other players (mainly to get secret bases), they could appear as opponents in battle tower with the team they had used at the moment of the data exchange, which I found extremely cool at the time (aside from battling my best friend's absurd team of Metagross, Latios and the dreaded Leech Seed/Sub/Toxic Rain Dance Rain Dish Ludicolo after 7 wins or so already).
I see something similar, but more extended, to happen, as the ground has been set. Given wi-fi accessibility and how the games have evolved, other players interacting with you could be challengers for the Title, competitors in contest, Wild-Area trainer battles (setting them and their team up the moment you see them in your "PPS 2.0")... you name it.
This is a huge pet peeve of mine. After all, one thing we always lacked in game was trainer like us, with elusive starters, good team builds, and special talent (if compared to ingame NPCs) to meet at crossroads (akin to the Anime Pokemon Leagues if I recall, haven't watched an episode in more than 12 years) and be a decent challenge outside of rivals we kinda were always at little prepared given we inherently have a track record of at least part of their teams from previous encounters.
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For the better, I suppose. We're just looping back here and there and it hurts.
Anyway, Max Raid anyone? It seems like the Raid Boss either can attack twice with normal move, or can attack with Max Attack once. Hmm, Steelix seems to be something big, yet it seems to fall to what seems to be Lv20-30 mons, and with them showing Lucario to Lv26, I think it is not level-set (which means go crazy with Lv100 mons you might have, although by that point you might not need to raid anymore unless bored / wanting items).
I have yet to see how they use not-Mist (reverting stat changes) and how that works, counting on half-turn like normal moves or as full-turn as Max Attack.
With various Pokemon of various power/BST (there's Ralts raid invite in the demo), I wonder if there will be raid tiers similar to GO to easily distinguish the raid difficulty. Also, using Multi-attack moves like Tail Slap when the boss activates its shield, how does it work (possible to break each shield with individual attack, or?)
I'm honestly intrigued in this as (ex-)frequent raid hunter in GO (currently thesis hiatus). I wonder how difficult Hydreigon as they show is, especially against full Fairy party which people will definitely be preparing.
There's also choice to not catch the Raid Boss when weakened. What would this give? Extra rewards? Or simply just skipping catch?
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It's difficult to guess how the raid levels work.
The "raid difficulty" and thus the actual Pokemon level could be arbitrarily decided without factoring in the BST of the pokemon (as I mentioned earlier, a slow juggernaut like Steelix which can be debuffed before attacking is going to be inherently easier than a faster one that can 1shot your pokemon before they act), as well as you could also have different movesets (Steelix has Sand Tomb instead of Earthquake for example).
Unfortunately, "Go Raids" which those are inspired by can't really be taken as a reference for how the difficulty will work, as Go raids difficulty is basically only based on the CP of the raid boss itself and there's no actual "added difficulty".
That said, as far as I know today the bigger "article writing" companies are actually getting to play the Demo themselves, so we might have some extra data
True, in GO, the tiers simply act as modifier levels applied to the Raid Boss accordingly to the tiers (Exegutor-A had sat in both T2 and T4). This is too early to tell, but I want to know how they handle this. Ah, looks like I'm hyped on this Raid thing after all. I want to see if deservedly strong monsters like Hydreigon will be still difficult even when bringing Sylveons or not, simply because the raid systems' battle mechanics are already fundamentally different.
I mean, I am also somewhat hyped for them, as some "actual coop PvE" has always lacked from pokemon game aside from Multibattles , and this one time we can do them over internet :)