ORAS Ubers Primal Groudon Offensive ORAS

[#1 Rotom]

The Team




Thundurus @ Magnet
Prankster
Timid
252SpA 252 Spe 4 def
Thunder Wave
Taunt
Volt Switch
Hidden Power Ice
​

I wanted to build my team around groudon so I needed a switch in to ground types moves and Pokes so I thought of HP ice Thundurus. It's fast and powerful and has a ground immunity as well as being able to be used a fast pivotOK. I use thundurus as basically as an anti-lead by first using its awesome priority taunt. Once its done that, if there are no opportunities to deal some decent damage or cripple anything with Thunder Wave, I use Volt Switch to pivot out, usually to deoxys-D. I then bring it out later to eliminate any checks to Primal Groudon especially Primal Kyogre. I maximised Special attack to deal as much damage as possible as once it is finished as an anti lead, I then use it to remove any other checks to Primal Groudon quickly, thus having maximised speed and stop enemy sweepers.
(see below)




Deoxys-D @ Mental Herb
Pressure
Calm
252HP 236SpD 10 def
Taunt
Spikes
Stealth Rock
Thunder Wave

I needed to support Primal Groudon with entry hazards and LOTS of them. Multiple Spikes layers combined with Stealth Rock make it much easier for Primal Groudon and my other pokes to eliminate the enemy, possibly turning 2HKOs into OHKOs. EVs and moveset speak for itself. This is my entry hazard setter and just that. Taunt can be used to cripple enemy leads and likewise with thunder wave. It has enough bulk to set plenty of hazards for my sweepers. I may lead with Thundurus or Doexys depending on team preview.

Groudon @ Red Orb
Drought
Naughty
252 atk 252 Spe 4 spd
Fire Punch
Rock Polish
Precipice Blades
Stone Edge


The star and sweeper of my team. Once I have sufficient entry hazards and possibly worn down its checks with the rest of my team, I set up rock polish as soon as possible and OBLITERATE the other team. Stone Edge his Ho-oh and any other annoying flying types.Maximum atk is required to deal as much damage as possible and 252 Spe makes Groudon faster than everything in the game after a boost. Fire Punch turns Skarmory into roast dinner and has good coverage and base power doubles in harsh sunlight. I usually spam Fire Punch and for any rock, steel, or fire or specially defensive threats that resists the other moves, I use Precipice Blades.



Latias @ Soul dew
Levitate
Timid
252 Spe 180 Spa 76Hp
Healing Wish
Psyshock
Draco Meteor
Ice Beam/surf/roost (i dont which one!) dont have HP fire


Latias is perfect for supporting groudon as its ground immunity is perfect. Healing Wish gives Groudon 2 lives and psyshock smashes special def pokemon and draco meteor smashes anything else except steel types which get destroyed by Groudon. Groudon and Latias, in my opinion, are perfect together.
Ice Beam or surf is to check ground types that annoy groudon. Roost can give latias recovery but I really need them damn ground types out of Groudon's way. Soul dew boosts spa and Spd To give latias more bulk.



Klefki @ Leftovers?
Prankster
Careful
252 hp 236spd 10 def
Toxic
Spikes
Thunder Wave
Foul Play/ Play Rough (not sure on this one).

Klefki is great and has good synergy with Latias and absorbs Toxic aimed at Groudon or Latias and cripples sweepers or anything to be honest. Steel types wall this thing which is why Groudon and Klefki are also good partners. Spikes is for if my entry hazards are spun or defogged away. Foul Play or Play Rough can be used to chip away at the enemy. Its amin purpose is to spread status to make sweeping for Groudon easier.







Gengar @ Gengarite
Levitate
Timid
252 Spa 252 Spe 4 def
Sludge Bomb ( dont have wave)
Destiny Bond
Taunt
Focus Blast


Gengar can trap and eliminate anything that threatens my sweeping opportunities and can taunt defoggers and spinblock. Perfect for my entry hazards. Anything that is a serious threat to groudon and kills anything on my team, I can take it with Destiny Bond if I need to. Sludge Bomb smashes sylveon and has good STAB power and focus blast removes dark, steel or rock types. This thing traps and destroys anything in groudons way. (hopefully)





Threats

Mega Kanga:
This thing destroyed my team last time I battled against. I


​

 

[8-BIT Luster]

I'm assuming this is an in-game team? I got this as you said you "don't have HP Fire."
I'd be happy to drop a full rate, and ik this could be considered minimodding, but you should add some more text to each description. Not only does it give me better context for your decisions (what you have is OK but it would be cool to see a bit more) but not having enough is going to get this thread locked, and quite a few threads that do get locked don't reopen.

I'll list some things here for me to expand on later.
-Deo-D
-Lack of Priority (understandable if you lack an Arceus or something)
-Play Rough over Foul Play
-Grass Knot on Latias if you have it

 

[#1 Rotom]

I'm assuming this is an in-game team? I got this as you said you "don't have HP Fire."
I'd be happy to drop a full rate, and ik this could be considered minimodding, but you should add some more text to each description. Not only does it give me better context for your decisions (what you have is OK but it would be cool to see a bit more) but not having enough is going to get this thread locked, and quite a few threads that do get locked don't reopen.

I'll list some things here for me to expand on later.
-Deo-D
-Lack of Priority (understandable if you lack an Arceus or something)
-Play Rough over Foul Play
-Grass Knot on Latias if you have it

I'm not sure what else to add and I've read the rules on RMT. Any ideas on what else I should put?

 

[8-BIT Luster]

explain the EVs, it isn't a whole lot to say but it should be sufficient

Well I'll just rate right now.

Since it seems to be an in-game team, I'm not sure whether you have access to Arceus or Yveltal. If you do, both would fit as suitable replacements for Thundurus. The reason I'm suggesting replacing Thundurus is that you currently lack any form of offensive priority, and you already have two Taunt users and a Prankster Thunder wave user in Klefki.
- Yveltal provides a solid answer to things like Ghost Arceus and Giratina, and has access to the strongest Sucker Punch in the game, the best offensive healing move in Oblivion Wing, and access to U-Turn to form what is called a TrapTurn core with Mega Gengar. Most sets run Oblivion Wing|Dark Pulse|Sucker Punch|U-Turn or Taunt
-Arceus, specifically the Swords Dance variant, is an incredibly useful sweeper or late-game cleaner. There's two versions I could see you using- the ExtremeKiller Normal Arceus set or the SD Ground Arceus one. EKiller usually runs the following:
Swords Dance|ExtremeSpeed|Earthquake|Shadow Claw or Stone Edge (This is really dependent on your team's needs, personally I'd go with Shadow Claw.) ExtremeSpeed is your priority move, and is incredibly hard-hitting after a Swords Dance. This set is usually run with a Jolly Nature and a Life Orb. Arceus-Ground usually runs much of the same moves, the standard set being Swords Dance|Earthquake|Stone Edge|Filler (usually Refresh, Recover or ExtremeSpeed.) This lets you have a much better offensive check to Primal Groudon, as you have STAB and Earth Plate-boosted Earthquakes, but you lose some of the power provided by the Life Orb.
-If you have neither of these things, Rayquaza could work. I won't go into detail on it however.

Play Rough over Foul Play is a pretty big must on Klefki. Foul Play is pretty situational, and Play Rough hits Xerneas and Yveltal surprisingly hard for something uninvested in Attack. Plus the 10% chance to lower the opponent's attack can come in handy. Leftovers is the preferred item on it.

If you have access to Defog (which you probably don't, I don't own a 3DS so I'm not sure if you can get it,) then I would advise using it in the last slot on Latias, but only if you are using Yveltal. If not, Grass Knot is a nice option that lets you smack around the Primals, Arceus-Ground and Tyranitar without having to suffer the Draco Meteor drops

The Naughty nature on Primal Groudon is something I don't think you can change, it would help if it was Adamant, but if this is in-game I understand. For Rock Polish Groudon, I think you only need 128 Speed to outspeed every unboosted Pokemon in the tier at +2, but you could EV to outspeed Mega Salamence that reach +1, if possible.

I would suggest switching Deoxys-Defense to Deoxys-Speed or Attack (if you can, again, unsure of the limitations of in-game,) as Deoxys-D really isn't too great, and is outclassed as a hazard setter by the others. For Deoxys-S, I would give it a Focus Sash with Taunt|Stealth Rock|TWave|Knock Off,and Super Train in HP and Speed. Looking at the nature, I can understand why Deoxys-D would seem like a better choice, but I feel like it's just too slow. If any other raters disagree, I would probably listen to them on this, as this is the thing I'm the least sure about. Deoxys-Speed almost guarantees Rocks, and is far better at shutting don opponents from setting p their own rocks than Deo-D is. In addition, you no longer need the mental Herb, as Deoxys-D needs to run it because it's slow, whereas Deoxys-S is the fastest Pokemon in the game. If you want to go really offensive, Deoxys-Attack with a moveset of Stealth Rock|Psycho Boost| Knock Off|ExtremeSpeed could work as well. The ability to KO lead Xerneas with Psycho Boost + ExtremeSpeed is really sweet, but unfortunately, you lose out on utility in exchange for power. You don't need Spikes on Deoxys IMO as you already have an excellent mid-game Spiker in Klefki.

Hope this helped, and if you aren't able to implement any of these suggestions, let me know, and I'll be happy to figure out something else.

PS: If you want, you can use Protect over Taunt on Mega Gengar, as this lets you safely mega Evolve vs. EKiller, and allows you to check it with Destiny Bond.

 

[#1 Rotom]

explain the EVs, it isn't a whole lot to say but it should be sufficient

Well I'll just rate right now.

Since it seems to be an in-game team, I'm not sure whether you have access to Arceus or Yveltal. If you do, both would fit as suitable replacements for Thundurus. The reason I'm suggesting replacing Thundurus is that you currently lack any form of offensive priority, and you already have two Taunt users and a Prankster Thunder wave user in Klefki.
- Yveltal provides a solid answer to things like Ghost Arceus and Giratina, and has access to the strongest Sucker Punch in the game, the best offensive healing move in Oblivion Wing, and access to U-Turn to form what is called a TrapTurn core with Mega Gengar. Most sets run Oblivion Wing|Dark Pulse|Sucker Punch|U-Turn or Taunt
-Arceus, specifically the Swords Dance variant, is an incredibly useful sweeper or late-game cleaner. There's two versions I could see you using- the ExtremeKiller Normal Arceus set or the SD Ground Arceus one. EKiller usually runs the following:
Swords Dance|ExtremeSpeed|Earthquake|Shadow Claw or Stone Edge (This is really dependent on your team's needs, personally I'd go with Shadow Claw.) ExtremeSpeed is your priority move, and is incredibly hard-hitting after a Swords Dance. This set is usually run with a Jolly Nature and a Life Orb. Arceus-Ground usually runs much of the same moves, the standard set being Swords Dance|Earthquake|Stone Edge|Filler (usually Refresh, Recover or ExtremeSpeed.) This lets you have a much better offensive check to Primal Groudon, as you have STAB and Earth Plate-boosted Earthquakes, but you lose some of the power provided by the Life Orb.
-If you have neither of these things, Rayquaza could work. I won't go into detail on it however.

Play Rough over Foul Play is a pretty big must on Klefki. Foul Play is pretty situational, and Play Rough hits Xerneas and Yveltal surprisingly hard for something uninvested in Attack. Plus the 10% chance to lower the opponent's attack can come in handy. Leftovers is the preferred item on it.

If you have access to Defog (which you probably don't, I don't own a 3DS so I'm not sure if you can get it,) then I would advise using it in the last slot on Latias, but only if you are using Yveltal. If not, Grass Knot is a nice option that lets you smack around the Primals, Arceus-Ground and Tyranitar without having to suffer the Draco Meteor drops

The Naughty nature on Primal Groudon is something I don't think you can change, it would help if it was Adamant, but if this is in-game I understand. For Rock Polish Groudon, I think you only need 128 Speed to outspeed every unboosted Pokemon in the tier at +2, but you could EV to outspeed Mega Salamence that reach +1, if possible.

I would suggest switching Deoxys-Defense to Deoxys-Speed or Attack (if you can, again, unsure of the limitations of in-game,) as Deoxys-D really isn't too great, and is outclassed as a hazard setter by the others. For Deoxys-S, I would give it a Focus Sash with Taunt|Stealth Rock|TWave|Knock Off,and Super Train in HP and Speed. Looking at the nature, I can understand why Deoxys-D would seem like a better choice, but I feel like it's just too slow. If any other raters disagree, I would probably listen to them on this, as this is the thing I'm the least sure about. Deoxys-Speed almost guarantees Rocks, and is far better at shutting don opponents from setting p their own rocks than Deo-D is. In addition, you no longer need the mental Herb, as Deoxys-D needs to run it because it's slow, whereas Deoxys-S is the fastest Pokemon in the game. If you want to go really offensive, Deoxys-Attack with a moveset of Stealth Rock|Psycho Boost| Knock Off|ExtremeSpeed could work as well. The ability to KO lead Xerneas with Psycho Boost + ExtremeSpeed is really sweet, but unfortunately, you lose out on utility in exchange for power. You don't need Spikes on Deoxys IMO as you already have an excellent mid-game Spiker in Klefki.

Hope this helped, and if you aren't able to implement any of these suggestions, let me know, and I'll be happy to figure out something else.

PS: If you want, you can use Protect over Taunt on Mega Gengar, as this lets you safely mega Evolve vs. EKiller, and allows you to check it with Destiny Bond.

Thanks for the advice. I never considered having Deoxy-S. Will I be able to get away with a calm nature on Deoxys-S?and as for yveltal, I do have one with that move set and I actually did have a team with a TrapTurn core. Unfortunately, I can't get Defog on latias but I am SRing Latios on Soul Silver and will trade on to Platinum and teach it Defog but I prefer Latias. Also, I don't have arceus but I do have Rayquaza but I,m not sure about it. I could look for jolly arceus on a trade thread or something but yeah, I don't think I will be able to get one. :( Great advice though thanks again

 

[8-BIT Luster]

Yveltal will work fine
And yeah you can get away with calm on deoxys

 

[#1 Rotom]

Yveltal will work fine
And yeah you can get away with calm on deoxys

Ok then, but now that you mention it, I really want Ekiller arceus...

 

[Lord Wallace]

I don't really play Ubers because I think it's the worst Smogon meta atm, but off the bat I can tell you to use Life Orb on Thundurus, you're not gonna care about recoil since Thundurus will die to everything in Ubers anyway and it needs the power on HP Ice.

Looking at the rest of your team though I don't see why you're even using Thundurus. You already have Prankster Meme Wave on Klefki and a more reliable Ground immunity in Latias (as well as another in pre Mega Gengar but that's w/e), and its not like Water types are doing anything to Primal freaking Desolate Land Groudon to where you need a Thundurus. I don't even think it's viable or used in Ubers so I'd just scrap Thundy entirely, maybe try an Arceus form instead, E Killer sounds fine tbh since you have Latias for other Groudons and Gengar to trap the rest of it's checks.

Looking at the viability rankings I also get the impression Deo-S or A are superior as hazard leads to Deo D, so consider that change as well.

Also consider running a more physically defensive Klefki with Dazzling Gleam so you don't get completely steamrolled by Mence, you already have PDon for Xerneas anyway.

Hope I helped!

 

[8-BIT Luster]

You could use physically defensive klefki, but since PDon is such a blanket check to half the meta, you don't need it, especially considering the naughty nature that pdon has. I believe he gets dropped by a +2 Xerneas Focus blast, even from 100%, so keep that in mind. Dazzling Gleam is a completely fine option, not going to lie, but Play Rough can be used to hit Xerneas for more than 10% after a Geomancy, but the decision is really up to you, as you can paralyze Xerneas, and just set up spikes until it dies. Play rough/dazzling gleam is so you aren't total taunt bait, and lets you get a bit of clutch damage off.

 

[#1 Rotom]

You could use physically defensive klefki, but since PDon is such a blanket check to half the meta, you don't need it, especially considering the naughty nature that pdon has. I believe he gets dropped by a +2 Xerneas Focus blast, even from 100%, so keep that in mind. Dazzling Gleam is a completely fine option, not going to lie, but Play Rough can be used to hit Xerneas for more than 10% after a Geomancy, but the decision is really up to you, as you can paralyze Xerneas, and just set up spikes until it dies. Play rough/dazzling gleam is so you aren't total taunt bait, and lets you get a bit of clutch damage off.

So i just replace thundurus. I'm not really keen on getting rid of deoxys d but if your sure...

 

[8-BIT Luster]

Yeah basically.
deoxys-s tends to perform better against other leads than deoxys-d, but if you really really don't want to change deoxys to deo-s then that's fine.
Do get rid of spikes on it tho