VGC Rain HO with Frosmoth (VGC 2020).

Which Gigantamax user are you hoping Game Freak legalises for VGC next?

  • Grimmsnarl

    Votes: 5 12.8%
  • Charizard with Solar Power

    Votes: 5 12.8%
  • Machamp

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Gengar

    Votes: 3 7.7%
  • Kingler

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Lapras

    Votes: 7 17.9%
  • Garbodor

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Orbeetle

    Votes: 3 7.7%
  • Coalossal

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Flapple

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Appletun

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Toxtricity

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Alcremie

    Votes: 5 12.8%
  • Copperajah

    Votes: 1 2.6%
  • Duraludon

    Votes: 2 5.1%

  • Total voters
    39
Hello everyone! As Game Freak finally decided to lower the barrier to Competetive Pokemon, I've decided to enter VGC for the first time. So I've spent some time making a team. It's been doing well for me so far, as I've hit Master Ball tier with it in game. However, it would be nice to have some constructive criticism, and I feel it could be better.

At a glance


A deeper look:


Pelipper @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Hurricane
- Protect
- Tailwind

Pelipper is the cornerstone of my team, proving both Rain and Tailwind support. I decided to go with a defensive spread with no Speed, so if it's sent out at the same time as Tyranitar I can win the weather war. It used to hold a Power Lens, but then I discovered that if people wanted a Sand setter that could work on Trick Room they'd just use Gigalith instead. Scald and Hurricane are good STABs that benefit Rain, with a power boost and an accuracy boost, respectively. Protect lets me scout moves, block Fake Outs and stall out Trick Room / Tailwind turns. Tailwind helps Frosmoth and Toxtricity, and also lets me match opposing Tailwind setters.
Possible changes: Drop Scald for U-turn, run Wiki Berry or Eject Button instead of Damp Rock.


Ludicolo @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Energy Ball
- Ice Beam
- Fake Out

Ludicolo is one of my Rain Sweepers, and it's the one that's been the most consistent for me so far. It's the standard set - Hydro Pump is Ludicolo's most powerful STAB, especially in Rain. Energy Ball is a reliable STAB for when I can't afford to miss - it also hits opposing Water types hard, OHKOing Gastrodon and 2HKOing defensive Rotom-W. Ice Beam hits the Grass and Dragon types that resist Luciolo's STABs hard, though I have to be careful using it when Dynamaxed as it takes away the Rain. Fake Out is useful pre DMax to score a free hit, and possibly allow Frosmoth to set up. The EVs are self explanatory. Life Orb is by far the best item for Ludicolo, as its Special Attack isn't that high and it needs the boost. EVs are self explanatory.
Possible changes: Might drop Fake Out for Protect or Rain Dance, and I might swap Energy Ball out for Leaf Storm.


Frosmoth @ Focus Sash
Ability: Ice scales
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Quiver Dance
- Ice Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Protect

Frosmoth has been the biggest surprise of my team. While it's not the Volcarona-Galar I was hoping for, it's still a very solid Pokemon, and can check a lot of stuff Rain teams struggle with, like Rotom-C, Rotom-W and opposing Ludicolo. Quiver Dance gives it enough Speed to outrun 120s at +1. Ice Beam and Bug Buzz get STAB, and hit extremely hard at +1. Protect lets Frosmoth dodge an Attack in a pinch. Focus Sash lets it set up safely. EVs are self explanatory. Ice Scales is an amazing ability, letting it use most opposing bulky Water types as set up fodder. I have fallen in love with this thing, and am not swapping it out.
Possible changes: Might replace Bug Buzz with Hurricane so it can use Max Airstream.


Barraskewda @ Choice Band
Ability: Propeller Tail
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Liquidation
- Close Combat
- Crunch
- Poison Jab

My team's main physical wallbreaker and cleaner, Barraskewda's job is to hit hard and fast. Liquidation is the STAB, hitting very hard in Rain. Close Combat wrecks Tyranitar, Snorlax and Ferrothorn. Crunch hits the likes of Dragapult and Dusclops hard. Poison Jab hits opposing Grass types, giving me a reliable way to OHKO Whimsicott and opposing Ludicolo out of Rain. The EVs are self explanatory. Propeller Tail is used to bypass Gastrodon's Storm Drain and Follow me from Togekiss and Indeedee. It doesn't need Swift Swim, as it's fast enough already.
Possible changes: Might run Expert Belt or Mystic Water instead of Choice Band.


Toxtricity @ Choice Specs
Ability: Punk Rock
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Overdrive
- Sludge Bomb
- Boomburst
- Volt Switch

Toxtricity has been extremely helpful in checking opposing water types like Gyarados, and is just a very powerful Pokemon in general. Overdrive is boosted by Punk Rock and hits both opponents hard if they don't resist. Sludge Bomb is the alternate STAb that gets strong hits on the Grass types that resist Overdrive, and strong single target damage. When Dynamaxed it also boosts my team's Special Attack. Boomburst is a really powerful netural move that hits 182 power factoring in Punk Rock. Volt Switch lets Toxtricity escape bad match ups, though I rarely use it. EVs maximise Speed and power - I run Modest nature as most faster Pokemon either run defensive sets, so I'll outrun them anyway, or positive natures, so they'll outrun me anyway.
Possible changes: Might replace Choice Specs with Air Balloon and Volt Switch for Protect.


Runerigus @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Wandering Spirit
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Trick Room
- Power Swap
- Shadow Claw
- Body Press

While it seems super gimmicky, it has actually done great work for me so far. Trick Room was a huge problem for my team, and with Runerigus I can threaten most Trick Room teams. I didn't go with a Taunt user, as Runerigus can also shut down Magic Bounce Hatterene. Trick Room also lets me turn the tables on Sand teams if I choose not to bring Pelipper, and Runerigus can check both Tyranitar and Excadrill thanks to its amazing physical bulk and Body Press coming off base 145 Def. Power Swap lets me steal Snorlax's Belly Drum or Weakness Poilcy Rhyperior's boosts. Shadow Claw is Runerigus's STAB, letting it hit Mimikyu and Dusclops super effectively. The EVs maximise physical bulk, while a Weakness Policy. Wandering Spirit can also let me steal an ability in a pinch.
Possible changes: Might replace Weakness Policy with a Figy Berry, and Power Swap with either Will-o-Wisp or Ally Switch.

Thanks for reading. As always feedback is greatly appreciated. If anyone wants to battle or trade with me, I'll update this with my Friend Code later on. I have Shield version.

Pelipper @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Hurricane
- Protect
- Tailwind

Ludicolo @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Energy Ball
- Ice Beam
- Fake Out

Frosmoth @ Focus Sash
Ability: Ice scales
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Quiver Dance
- Ice Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Protect

Drednaw @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Liquidation
- Superpower
- Protect

Toxtricity @ Choice Specs
Ability: Punk Rock
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Overdrive
- Sludge Bomb
- Boomburst
- Volt Switch

Runerigus @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Wandering Spirit
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Trick Room
- Imprison
- Shadow Claw
- Body Press
 
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Very cool team. I'd recommend replacing Drednaw with Barraskewda:

Barraskewda (M) @ Life Orb / Choice Band
Ability: Propeller Tail
Level: 50
Happiness: 160
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Liquidation
- Close Combat
- Poison Jab
- Crunch

Under rain, Barra one-shots Hatterene and Propeller Tail protects you from Follow Me and Ally Switch shenanigans. As a result, you may be able to replace Runerigus as Barra handles all the major TR setters.

Hope this helps!
 
Very cool team. I'd recommend replacing Drednaw with Barraskewda:

Barraskewda (M) @ Life Orb / Choice Band
Ability: Propeller Tail
Level: 50
Happiness: 160
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Liquidation
- Close Combat
- Poison Jab
- Crunch

Under rain, Barra one-shots Hatterene and Propeller Tail protects you from Follow Me and Ally Switch shenanigans. As a result, you may be able to replace Runerigus as Barra handles all the major TR setters.

Hope this helps!
Thanks for your suggestion. I’ve given Barreskewda a few runs on Showdown and it’s already proving better than Drednaw. What do you think I should replace Runerigus with?
 
If you're looking for a trick room counter, runerigus can use things like power swap and will-o-wisp to negate any kind of setup. It's so slow that it will probably move first in an opponents trick room, and then you can power swap, will-o-wisp, or click trick room to just negate it. Heck, you can go for even more jank and give it nasty plot or weakness policy to swap boosts to one of your own pokemon, run thief to snatch away held items if your berry is used, or destiny bond.
 
Glad that Barra is working for you! Like Akinohi stated, you could keep Runerigus as a niche pick! If you're looking for other options, support Grimmsnarl could be great to help Frosmoth set-up. Runerigus can also accomplish this through Ally Switch, and you could even utilize support Dragapult. Another popular choice is Follow Me Togekiss.
 
After some experimenting on Showdown I have decided to replace Drednaw with Barreskewda. It took forever to find one with its Hidden Ability, but it has been a darling so far, especially against Trick Room teams. If the TR teams don't have a Fake Out user (many don't atm), I send it out with Toxtricity and Dynamax, either using Max Darkness (against Dusclops and Oranguru) or Max Ooze (against Mimikyu and Hatterene) and have Toxtricity click Overdrive, which usually results in a double KO.

After deliberating I have decided to keep Runerigus, as it provides a useful Electric immunity and can also help against Tailwind teams, as it can cancel their Speed boost. I have replaced Imprison with Power Swap (thanks Akinohi ) and given it a Weakness Policy. It's nowhere near as gimmicky as you might think - before, Belly Drum Snorlax could beat this team pretty easily, now I can stop it before it even starts. With Weakness Policy I can also give a teammate a psuedo Swords Dance and Nasty Plot, although Runerigus is still very slow.
 
Hi ! Thanks for sharing.

I'm very new to VGC, still in the Poke Ball tier, and I have few questions : ]

If you're playing against a Trick Room team, which pkmn do you start the battle with? I suppose Runerigus is one of them. And what's your overall game plan against such teams?

I've been recently struggling with Snorlax / Clefable and Hatterene / Indeedee teams, so any advice is welcome.

(pokepaste of my team here : https://pokepast.es/992a6ced76842054)

Thanks !
 
Hi ! Thanks for sharing.

I'm very new to VGC, still in the Poke Ball tier, and I have few questions : ]

If you're playing against a Trick Room team, which pkmn do you start the battle with? I suppose Runerigus is one of them. And what's your overall game plan against such teams?

I've been recently struggling with Snorlax / Clefable and Hatterene / Indeedee teams, so any advice is welcome.

(pokepaste of my team here : https://pokepast.es/992a6ced76842054)

Thanks !
Barraskewda has been massively helpful against Trick Room teams. If i’m facing a trick room team then I usually lead with it. If they are using Indeedee + Hatterene/Togekiss, then I pair it with Toxtricity - Barra uses either Poison Jab or Max Ooze on Hatterene, ignoring Follow Me thanks to its ability, while Toxtricity uses Overdrive, hitting both opponents. If they use Snorlax + Mimikyu, I lead with Barraskewda and Runerigus. I have Barra use Close Combat on Snorlax while Rune can either use its own Trick Room to cancel it out or break Mimikyu’s disguise with Shadow Claw. With Dusclops or Bronzong I use the same pairing as with Indeedee and Hatterene, only I always Dynamax Barraskewda and use Max Darkness, lowering their Special Defence so Toxtricity can get the KO. Usually my game plan is just to take out the trick room set u usually my game plan is just to take out the trick room setter before it has time to set it up. It’s not a foolproof strategy, but it’s been working well for me so far.

With your team I would suggest ditching Excadrill. Excadrill shines as a physical sweeper, and does not appreciate trying to be made into a tank. I would suggest replacing it with Assault Vest Duraludon, using a moveset of Draco Meteor, Flash Cannon, Thunderbolt and Dark Pulse. Thanks to Dauntless, it ignores Follow Me and the 4 attacks I listed give it SE coverage or STAB on all the common Trick Room setters. Grimmsnarl could help you out too, as it can waste a TR turn with Fake Out, set up dual screens to help you ride out the 4 turns, or use priority Taunt to stop Snorlax setting up.

Hope that helps
 
Thanks ChrystalFalchion, that helps a lot : ]

You're right, I've already thought about Duraludon with Flash Cannon to KO Fairy types. I'll try with it instead of Excadrill, thanks again for all the advice.
 
Thanks ChrystalFalchion, that helps a lot : ]

You're right, I've already thought about Duraludon with Flash Cannon to KO Fairy types. I'll try with it instead of Excadrill, thanks again for all the advice.
No problem I hope it helps. You could also try Copperajah, as that can hit Mimikyu and Hatterene, and its low Speed means it loves Trick Room.

Have now hit Master Ball tier! 600 BP is mine! Also I’m entering the premier league at Geek Retreat in Milton Keynes on 25th, so might see some of you at my fist ever live action Pokemon event.
 
Congrats for the Master Ball tier.

I'm currently building your team to play some ranked matches ; ) I already have Pelipper, Barraskewda and Ludicolo. Tonight I'll « build » the others. Can't wait to face Snorlax!
 
Just chiming in to say, jolly swift-swim Drednaw outspeeds non-scarf dragapult in the rain, and can OHKO it with a head-smash based max rockfall of 150. The sp.def boost he then gets from the sand can often help him re-start the rain with max geyser. 150 max rockfall also OHKO's most non-dynamaxed Rotom and a host of other things. Drednaw is awesome, and not incredibly frail like barraskewda. I got to master ball using pretty much just him and pelliper, with the occasional assist from dragapult or ferrothorn. Everyone underestimates the snappy turtle and gets crushed. oops, forgot to add I was using life orb too! Probably would not be as good without that.
 
Just chiming in to say, jolly swift-swim Drednaw outspeeds non-scarf dragapult in the rain, and can OHKO it with a head-smash based max rockfall of 150. The sp.def boost he then gets from the sand can often help him re-start the rain with max geyser. 150 max rockfall also OHKO's most non-dynamaxed Rotom and a host of other things. Drednaw is awesome, and not incredibly frail like barraskewda. I got to master ball using pretty much just him and pelliper, with the occasional assist from dragapult or ferrothorn. Everyone underestimates the snappy turtle and gets crushed. oops, forgot to add I was using life orb too! Probably would not be as good without that.
Thanks for sharing : )

With the actual team including Barraskewda instead of Drednaw, I was wondering what's the best way to « counter » Dragapult / Togekiss, with Togekiss using Follow Me turn 1 ?
 
Hi thx for sharing, im very new to this competitive format, im kinda confuse, is this team run on double / single battle format? Sorry to ask this, but there are no explanation on this forum either the team is single/double team format?

I only know that OU stands for overused
And UU is under used, is there any term i need to know? Thx
 
Hi thx for sharing, im very new to this competitive format, im kinda confuse, is this team run on double / single battle format? Sorry to ask this, but there are no explanation on this forum either the team is single/double team format?

I only know that OU stands for overused
And UU is under used, is there any term i need to know? Thx
VGC stands for Video Game Championship. It's the official format that Nintendo run. You can read the full rules here. But the short version is it's Doubles Format, and at the start of the game you and your opponent send 4 Pokemon out of your 6 to battle.
 
After several ranked battles, I'd recommend replacing Damp Rock on Pelliper with the Focus Sash of Frosmoth.

Focus Sash allows Pelliper to use Tailwind even if it's struck by a faster pokemon with an electric x4 attack. Contrary to this, the Eject Button may force Pelliper to switch out too early without being able to use Tailwind, leaving Toxtricity and Frosmoth vulnerable due to their low base speed. To me, winning the speed control battle is very very important with this kind of hyper offensive team, and failing to use Tailwind can be a "lose condition".
 
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After several ranked battles, I'd recommend replacing Damp Rock on Pelliper with the Focus Sash of Frosmoth.

Focus Sash allows Pelliper to use Tailwind even if it's struck by a faster pokemon with an electric x4 attack. Contrary to this, the Eject Button may force Pelliper to switch out too early without being able to use Tailwind, leaving Toxtricity and Frosmoth vulnerable to their low base speed. To me, winning the speed control battle is very very important with this kind of hyper offensive team, and failing to use Tailwind can be a "lose condition".
Alright what item should I give Frosmoth then? Charti Berry or Wiki Berry?
 
I'm not sure yet : ] I need to do more tests.

Currently, Charti Berry and Babiri Berry seem to be good candidates to replace the previous Focus Sash.

With Frosmoth the main threats are fire and rock based attacks, both doing x4 damage but :
  • fire based attacks damage are halved under the rain
  • special fire based attacks are halved once more with Ice Scales
  • rock type pokemons should be handled by leading Pelliper or Ludicolo or Barraskewda
Considering the current meta I think the main threats of Frosmoth in this team are physical Steel based attacks. So, maybe Babiri Berry ?
 
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