RBY Lower Tiers (RBY2K10 Tierlist)

[Plasmanta]

approved by Jellicent

RBY (Gen 1) UnderUsed is the younger child of first gen's competitive side. While Smogon didn't develop their uu meta as much as some like, the site RBY2K10 has a full tierlist for RBY UU, complete with a BL tier above it and an NU meta below. If you're new to the tier, said tierlist and BL tier list are found right here:

The main purpose of this thread is for my fellow RBY underused players to discuss tactics, team mates, play styles, etc. One of my favorite topics to discuss is the choice of running Golduck or Poliwrath. This choice usually depends on if you would rather have a mixed amnesia sweeper with access to Hypnosis, or a stronger special amnesia-er with more speed.

General rules for this thread:
-Remember, this is using RBY2K10's tiers.
-Replays / Logs / Warstories welcomed.
-Keep your posts to the point, no one wants to read a long paragraph droning about how venomoth is a good lead, especially when we already know this.

Possible topics
-Your teams
-Which pokemon performs a certain role the best

cheers mates~

EDIT 10 / 25: check post #18

 

[Isa]

Should probably mention that these tiers were developed in a no-Wrap policy environment!

That said I'm working on a guide to this tier and have been doing for a few weeks/months. tl;dr - use Electabuzz on all your teams.

Here's some logs from the NetBattle Supremacy time, back in 2011 - Bo5 sets, all sets going to game 5:
http://rby2k10.proboards.com/thread/984/isa-ww-uu-lf
http://rby2k10.proboards.com/thread/983/isa-zilch-uu-gf (game 4 is a fancy comeback)

I was just a wee lad when these sets were played. Good times.

/2k10 admin


edit: it should also be mentioned that smogon used to have more developed lower RBY tiers, but when PO had to implement RBY tiers two years ago, hipmonlee took the decision to nuke the Smogon BL tier and move it into UU. The difference between the old Smogon UU and the 2k10/PO UU was that Smogon had Charizard and Sandslash in BL instead of UU. Neither are particularly amazing in RBY UU - at least not top 5 material.

also RBY NU is the best tier

 

[Plasmanta]

Looking at 2k10's NU tierlist, omastar seems like a threat to me with the 125 special stat. Is this true or am I just really bad at reading tierlists?

 

[Oglemi]

Isa can you explain why RBY2k10's BL tier is as large as it is? Were those Pokemon banned from UU or is it simply a different classification?

I think, iirc, one of the major motivators behind Hip removing RBY BL from Smogon was because it just didn't make sense, apart from the fact that no one played Smogon RBY UU anymore. Here is the thread anyway http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/rby-uu.3447138/

 

[Isa]

Omastar is a top level Pokémon in RBY NU but has bad coverage. Staryu is great vs. it for example. (The NFE's in RBY NU are really important - Staryu especially, but also Abra, Ivysaur, Weepinbell, Dragonair, Rhyhorn...)

Oglemi, RBY BL on 2K10 is intended to be read as Borderline rather than Ban List. It's meant to be a playable tier. The only Pokémon banned from UU are those marked with a + in the OP image (same story with UU Pokémon, who were deemed too powerful for NU)

 

[Plasmanta]

Wait, if there is an existing rby uu thread, how did Jellicent approve this?

 

[magic9mushroom]

RBY (Gen 1) UnderUsed is the younger child of first gen's competitive side. While Smogon didn't develop their uu meta as much as some like, the site RBY2K10 has a full tierlist for RBY UU, complete with a BL Banlist. If you're new to the tier, said tierlist and BL tier list are found right here:

RBY2K10's tiering system does not have banlists. BL is intended to be a playable tier, as well as a banlist for UU (this is trivially obvious just from looking at it, since it's the same size as the tier you're claiming it to be a "banlist" of). Likewise, UU is intended to be a banlist for NU as well as a playable tier and as such nonviable Pokemon are included in the list you quote.

 

[Bedschibaer]

Wait, if there is an existing rby uu thread, how did Jellicent approve this?

The old thread was started in 2011 and its activity ended in 2011. Necrobumping a thread from 3 years ago would not be really helpful, so a new thread is totally justified. Not to mention that this thread subjects a different banlist than the old thread, since smogon rby uu is basically everything that isn't ou by ages old tiering lists.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

That's a rather large BL...

 

[magic9mushroom]

That's a rather large BL...

Oglemi, RBY BL on 2K10 is intended to be read as Borderline rather than Ban List. It's meant to be a playable tier. The only Pokémon banned from UU are those marked with a + in the OP image (same story with UU Pokémon, who were deemed too powerful for NU)

RBY2K10's tiering system does not have banlists. BL is intended to be a playable tier, as well as a banlist for UU (this is trivially obvious just from looking at it, since it's the same size as the tier you're claiming it to be a "banlist" of). Likewise, UU is intended to be a banlist for NU as well as a playable tier and as such nonviable Pokemon are included in the list you quote.

 

[Jorgen]

Crystal_ wrote a thing about this metagame if anyone is interested. All the sprites are broken links now, though :(

 

[Plasmanta]

Here's to the thread's first rmt:

I was on showdown and bored so I decided to make an RBY UU Golduck team with the idea of spreading status and dealing late game damage. One of the team's greatest weakness is probably letting Poliwrath / opposing Golduck setting up amnesias after Vaporeon goes down. Overall I've had a decent amount of sucess with it and am fairly satisfied. Just looking to get some input from fellow players on how to improve even more and make it the best it can be.

#ATVBitch (Venomoth)
- Sleep Powder
- Stun Spore
- Mega Drain
- Psychic

Venomoth is a crucial part of the team. The fact that is actually has the ability to sleep over Electabuzz's ability to spread paralysis, while still having said paralysis spreading capabilities. Spreading status through the opponent's team allows for more opportunities for me to send in a powerful damage dealer (aka magneton & raticate) or my amnesia sweeper. (Golduck) In the case, my foe does have an Electabuzz lead, I do have Sandslash to pivot to, and no matter how hard you try, Electabuzz will not two shot a Sandslash. Psychic is to get some early game damage on opposing Venomoth as well as other leads.

#Misty'sHusbando3o
Golduck
- Rest
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Amnesia

Golduck is the most dominative (if that's a word ?_?) force on this team. All it takes is 1 amnesia and no presence of Magneton / Electabuzz to let Golduck eat up your team. Surf is your STAB move and hits everything not named Tangela in the tier for neutral damage. Ice Beam over Blizzard for two reasons, at +2, Ice Beam will do more than a +0 Blizzard, and pays off in the odd chance you're put in an amnesia war with an opposing Golduck (which usually comes down to freeze / crits) or Poliwrath (who will probably win due to my lack of a psychic attack) Rest is the point that keeps the

#Sanic
Sandslash
- Swords Dance
- Hyper Beam
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide

As mentioned earlier, Sandslash is my pivot I can send in against Electric types like Electabuzz lead. Also, in a meta where Waters are popular, and consequently, electric types are popular, wouldn't you like to have something to resist those Electric type moves? The reason I chose Sandslash over Graveler is because if I'm spreading paralysis anyways, I would rather have a more powerful, damage dealer over a boom user.

#Threesome
Magneton
- Double-Edge
- Thunderbolt
- Thunder Wave
- Thunder

Magneton's power and bulk is something the team needs to keep the opposing water types in check, as well as the OHKO on Golduck and Poliwrath. While the movepool is really shallow, the strong electric type attacks are the real reason I'm using Magneton, and am not shy about switching over to Electabuzz if someone can convince me it fits this role more.

#Ratitouile
Raticate
- Hyper Beam
- Body Slam
- Blizzard
- Super Fang

Raticate is a true beast. My second sweeper on the team, it's main objective is to lower something's hp down with Super Fang, then bait they're ground type out and Blizzard, which thus allows me to 2HKO the ground type and not worry about getting the hyper beam off again. Body Slam is there if there's a situation where hyper beam won't K.O. and I'd like to get paralysis off or feel it would do more than 25% (this sentence is all about after I get the first Super Fang off)

#AquaMan'sPet
Vaporeon
- Haze
- Surf
- Blizzard
- Rest

Vaporeon's role as a phazer in this tier is very crucial. It easily can come in on Golduck and get rid of the amnesia boosts it has worked so hard to get up, and can usually phaze out Poliwrath without much trouble. Rest is so I can recover and keep deleting those boosts, just incase they have another chance to set up.

 

[magic9mushroom]

Surf is your STAB move and hits everything not named Tangela in the tier for neutral damage.

Poliwrath, Vaporeon, other Golduck? Dragonair and Weepinbell too, if Wrap's permitted.

It easily can come in on Golduck and get rid of the amnesia boosts it has worked so hard to get up, and can usually phaze out Poliwrath without much trouble.

That's not what "phazing" means. "phazing" = "p-hazing" = "pseudo-Hazing" = moves that are not Haze but remove boosts (e.g. Roar, Whirlwind, and less directly Perish Song). Vaporeon uses Haze itself, so it is not a "phazer" (the only actual "phazing" moves that sort-of work in RBY are Leech Seed, Confuse Ray and stat-lowering moves).

 

[Plasmanta]

thanks for that, but I could I get some actual advice on my team?

 

[Isa]

Your only Electric is Magneton, who has no business dealing damage to either Graveler or Sandslash. Double-Edge doesn't help you vs. Tangela either, and that covers all the Electric counters:
Magneton Double-Edge vs. Graveler: 23-28 (7.3 - 8.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
Magneton Double-Edge vs. Sandslash: 50-59 (14.1 - 16.7%) -- possible 6HKO
Magneton Double-Edge vs. Tangela: 48-57 (14.4 - 17.1%) -- possible 6HKO
Magneton Thunderbolt vs. Tangela: 58-69 (17.4 - 20.7%) -- possible 5HKO

You also have a slight problem soaking up Sandslash Earthquakes. You can obviously not counter a Sandslash with an identical Sandslash of your own. Vaporeon and Golduck are both 3HKOd by Earthquake, so if they're forced to Rest and then get sent out, things will take a big pounding. Gotta be careful there, especially since Sandslash comes in for free on Magneton.

I'd change Magneton for Electabuzz in a heartbeat. If you still wanna run Magneton for some odd reason, either change something else to Electabuzz or use the 1337 pr0 TBolt/Toxic/Rest/Reflect set.

 

[Mr.E]

RBY2K10's tiering system does not have banlists. BL is intended to be a playable tier, as well as a banlist for UU (this is trivially obvious just from looking at it, since it's the same size as the tier you're claiming it to be a "banlist" of).

then why wouldn't they just call "borderline" underused and bump "underused" down to the next name :[

 

[magic9mushroom]

then why wouldn't they just call "borderline" underused and bump "underused" down to the next name :[

Because the model is set up to not distinguish between playable and banlist.

I don't agree with the model, but that's a different matter.

 

[Plasmanta]

So because of all the talk about BL being a tier, I thought about opening the thread to both tiers, then it hit me that nu is such a small tier in terms of playerbase that it doesn't really deserve its own thread. Basically because of this thought I decided to open this thread to all RBY lower tiers (barring LC). As you can see, the title is now changed and there is a picture of the nu tierlist in the op, let me know if you think I should add / change anything.

 

[Isa]

then it hit me that nu is such a small tier

are you kidding, NU is the RBY tier with by far the most viable Pokémon in it

 

[Plasmanta]

are you kidding, NU is the RBY tier with by far the most viable Pokémon in it

I meant playerbase wise, sorry for confusion

 

[Disaster Area]

Thoughts on RBY LC? Recently it's been the most popular RBY variant after OU (on PO)

Edit to avoid double post:

My server at http://bam.psim.us/ is looking into supporting RBY lower gens. I'm mostly speaking with Lutra about it, and now have an RBY UU banlist, but I want to make it clear that we are using a different system to RBY2K10's. I don't really see any reason not to; Ubers is straightforward, and our banlist for UU is simply what's in OU [so everything you'd probably expect to see, victreebell OU, persian, articuno, and jolteon UU]. Lutra doesn't seem to have satisfactory tiering answers for the tiers below this (but the RU equivalent, what Plasmanta and Isa play as RBY UU, is currently lacking in existance) so if anyone wants to help contribute to creating the most accurate and well-explored tiering system for us to implement, it'd be greatly appreciated [this thread is gen 1 only, but if you want to hepl with gen 2/3 that'd also be welcomed] - we also have RBY LC (with either trapping ban or dratini ban) [just for lolz; if anyone wants to help create a proper RBY LC UU tier that'd be cool too, rather than using the daft arbitary tier that was made off of 2k10. The way I gather it LC OU has like 3 mons u must have, 2 mons u almost definitely will have, and 1 free spot with 3 or 4 normal candidates, with ponyta only really getting a mention when partial trapping is permitted)]