The north wind
I think that Dnite should not be allowed in RBY UU, not really because it is broken in UU (something questionable), but because it is good enough in OU to be considered OU
You probably need to make a case here: RBY OU Viability Ranking - Mark II where it is currently C Rank. B Rank = banned from UU.I think that Dnite should not be allowed in RBY UU, not really because it is broken in UU (something questionable), but because it is good enough in OU to be considered OU
In the teambuilder Haunter is currently in NFE... might want to put in in UU there too (Kadabra is in UU there) to make it more visible that it is not only usable but also pretty viable (just like Kadabra)Also, the tiers in the teambuilder should be fixed now to match Smogon's.
Surprised it's not just
BL is a place to put banned mons from a lower tier. BL is not a tier in and of itself. Why would you automatically exclude a handful of mons from UU like that? You're effectively making them OU in all but name because that would be the only place they could be played.Surprised it's not just
though from what it's sounding like Dnite and Art1 may be going to BL soon in the future.
You're severely overselling it here... I don't want to go for a quote war but almost each of your statements are wrong.I've always used Dragonite in OU, and it really should not be C-rank, and by extension, should not be in UU. It's basically Jirachi from other generations where the opponent must rely on hax to get in a hit. The only counter to Dragonite is Gengar, and even Gengar relies on a miss due to Wrap still immobilizing Ghost types. The infinite PP glitch is also a factor here, so you cannot just PP stall Dragonite. And even when Dragonite eventually misses, he's likely severely weakened the opposing team, making him a great support 'Mon.
Let's also not forget that Paralysis is everywhere in RBY, so with additional Para support, Dragonite also works as an effective cleaner.
Dragonite also works as a check to 3 of the 4 S-rank Pokemon, as it naturally outspeeds Chansey, Snorlax, and Exeggutor. So C-rank/UU is really not suitable for our favorite Dragon.
EDIT: Dragonite also arguably does Cloyster's job better, and Cloyster is OU so...
A COUNTER can switch in. A check is something that can't come in safely, but can come in after another 'Mon faints. And my point with Gengar was mostly just to talk about Wrap's mechanics. Wrap doesn't scare Gengar at all, which makes Gengar the truest counter to Dnite.You're severely overselling it here... I don't want to go for a quote war but almost each of your statements are wrong.
The opponent doesn't have to rely on hax to get it in a hit, it's the Dragonite user who has to rely on hax to make it work, you're spamming a 85% accurate move, misses are normal and expected. If you don't miss it means you're the one really haxing (calculate the odds of that, it's frightening). Gengar doesn't rely on a Wrap miss, it doesn't take damage lol, Dragonite doesn't hurt it, it just loses PP. You can for sure PP stall Dragonite in some situations, and when you can't it's not because of the PP glitch which is avoidable, it's because your team is too much crippled to take all of them hits (meaning you were more often than not already losing despite Dragonite). It's true that sometimes Dragonite does a good job at heavily weakening the opposite team, but that doesn't really make it a support mon or anything, it's just a RNG based mon that NEEDS support and luck to work, it does't support anything. You can't wallbreak with it (too dangerous, counterable etc), so it's more of a cleaner. It's not one "with additional para support" btw, it needs that to work and can't do much without it (Also players avoid paralysis on key mons like Tauros, Starmie, fast ones like Jolt, Zap, even like Cloyster... all these mons make Dnite's life very difficult and it's not set-up, and when it is well... a miss is terrible. It doesn't "check" Chansey Lax and Egg in anyway, a check switches on something, Dnite can't switch on them (well it can switch on a EQ from lax but...), and naturally outspeeding isn't enough since a miss against those can cripple it hard.
Also Cloyster and Dnite don't have the same role at all, Cloyster is a physical wall that can boom when no longer useful and use Clamp as a move mainly to pivot, whereas Dnite just spams Wrap. It's fine in C, and it's normal that it dropped to UU since it sees almost no competitive usage whatsoever.
I don't really think that's true. There's no reason that a BL can't be made; it just doesn't exist now because we freshly re-created UU. In new gens, at least, when the lower tiers are being created, there isn't immediately a visible BL over them until something is banned. Nothing got banned from RBY UU while it was ROA Spotlight, and so there is no BL yet.And since the new tiers aren't usage based anymore, eliminating BL, Dragonite is either UU or OU
Actually, there was a BL, but it was removed and the new tiers are based on viability. Dragonite has historically always been OU, even when BL existed. But since BL means not OU by usage, but too strong for UU, there's no reason to make a BL since the tiers are no longer usage based, so OU encompasses this theoretical BL.I don't really think that's true. There's no reason that a BL can't be made; it just doesn't exist now because we freshly re-created UU. In new gens, at least, when the lower tiers are being created, there isn't immediately a visible BL over them until something is banned. Nothing got banned from RBY UU while it was ROA Spotlight, and so there is no BL yet.
BL would serve to distinguish "This isn't that great in OU but it's too good in UU", which... Is what BL means in a modern sense anyway. BL is not based on usage, so that shouldn't mean anything here. There's no reason to just ignore that the concept of BL exists and can be easily created.
Basically, I don't think it's a binary decision when there are actually three possible places it could go. (OU, BL, UU.)
It was available as the RoA Spotlight ladder on Showdown a few months ago, but it's since changed to Gen 3 UU. Basically there's a limit to how many tiers that can be implemented, and there hasn't been enough of a reason to implement it permanently yet.I may ask something pretty stupid but, why is there no Gen 1 UU format available on Showdown? There are just OU and Ubers :/