waiting for it, only russian i saw once trying to give their side of the history sounded like the psycho communist garbage (not saying putin government is communist but it sounded like that) that would try to defend venezuelan goverment from everything they have done after 20 years on my country
Yeah, I was reading those too. So so so cringe... and racist...
Hate on her all you like. I do if I ever watch a vid of theirs' that's terrible-- but then go on to feel embarrassed that they are much much more closer to your position on this issue (as am I...) and much much more informed about this issue than the majority of big lefty commentators or big swaths of the Online Left. If you despise that, either start your own leftie channel (that's in favor of hot war with Russia? That would certainly be new on Breadtube) or donate to people you genuinely like. I'm going to guess odds are that they are smaller than Breaking Points or Hassan or TYT.
Just Re. British media, I feel like it's worth pointing out there have been plenty of articles etc similarly celebrating people going to fight in Syria (against ISIS, especially one notable ex-soldier who went to fight with the Kurds) especially in the "trashier" newspapers, for want of a better word.
Russian and Belarusian athletes should be banned. It is a fair decision and it is fair to hold the Russian people to the standard of their President. Image matters and the President is a reflection of the people. It is not the rest of the world’s responsibility to remove Putin from power.
This rhetoric is disgusting. Have you seen ALL the fucking protesting going on in Russia over what Putin is doing and other Russian reactions over other platforms despite their President being a "reflection" of the people (which, by that logic, no American wants Nazification to be outlawed since the American government voted against it)? You're blaming an ENTIRE populace of people who had nothing to do with and actively dislike what their tyrannical leader decided to do for him forcing their military to commit atrocities. I'll put the shoe on the other foot for you since you're JUST as guilty of this kind of shit as an American by this logic. "It is offensive to say Americans civilians are innocent because they just want to live their lives while their military goes out and commits atrocities." But you don't see Americans getting blockaded from the Olympics or having all their technology and entertainment cut off for what their terrible government does. The Russians don't want this happening to their military and families but it's happening anyway and they don't have control (despite you implying they should just up and decide to topple him, which, good luck with that). I'm sure there are some regular civilians who support this but don't clump them in with the people who just want peace and to not be punished and crushed by sanctions and other world reactions because their government did something they didn't want.
Yes, I have seen the protesting. It does not change the fact that a country’s populace is rightfully judged by what their leaders do on the world stage. I did not day “all Russians are bad people” and that is not the intent behind the post. No one thinks removing crackpot dictator Putin from power is some walk in the park however the onus is on the people of Russia to do so.
This approach to the politic is broadly generalizing, though, when we’re dealing with a situation involving civilians in crisis. You use the US and Trump as your reference point, but it’s very difficult to compare a despotic regime of almost 20 years to someone we voted out in 4. The conversation is nuanced and I feel your argument is not, which comes across as provocative for the sake of being inflammatory. You aren’t going to convince people in this thread that we should hold the citizens of Russia any more accountable than anyone already is just by agreeing these athletes (and other applicable parties) should be excluded with a broad, weaponized statement.
Ok, I will now judge every single American for Iraq and voting for no Denazification despite many of them being against it and not having a say in it (no, fucking needing to topple the government isn't a valid response, especially in a dictatorship) and I will also judge every single North Korean for Kim Jong-un holding back food for the general populace and cutting them out of the outside world. You can see why this rhetoric is problematic now? Now, if there was footage of a ton of Russians cheering the Ukraine situation on circulating all the time, it'd be a different story. But that's not the case (if anything, more neoliberals are posting that kinda shit than the Russians themselves).
Saying "the Russian people" encompasses all normal Russian civilians just by writing. Just as saying "the American people" without any added context or wording encompasses all normal American civilians into one big bubble. Maybe you didn't mean it this way, but that's how it reads when writing without any extra context. To be honest, I also hold this belief for Trump with Americans as well, not all of them are at fault for his presidency.
Ok, explain how you expect them to save toppling the government that's watching them at all times and when he has a ton of defense with the citizens having no powerful weaponry? The Russian are protesting, which is the most they can do given full context. What else do you want? Also, most of them are not fucking neutral with how even Russian social media accounts are reacting and released footage and even Russian officials apologizing behind closed doors.
Ok, I as a non-black person can have a right to take issue with saying the Black populace is innocent in all of what's happening in the US because some BLM protesters looted and burned buildings in cities. Don't pull the fucking race card btw if you respond to this.
so to be clear, do you agree that if we were to abide by your logic that the people should be held accountable for the actions of the state it follows that US athletes, media, etc, should also be banned from events in the rest of the world due to their current active involvement in Yemen, Syria, and Somalia? or do those countries and wars just not count?
Generalizations are an unfortunate part of the human condition. I agree that it is not a good thing and problematic. However, it is a real thing and it can be a catalyst for change. I did not support Donald Trump at all but still think it is fair to judge Americans by his tenure and it is fair to judge Americans by our imperialism. I thought by including representation and image in my original comment that it would be assumed that “Russian people” and “American people” does not encompass all individual people. We do have a responsibility to protect that image even in the most extreme of circumstances.
Yes. If the major powers of world sanctioned the US for its involvement in those counties it would not only shed light on those situations amongst everyday Americans it would also be a motivator for us to demand change in policy.
are you saying you support sanctioning in not only these but also assumedly other forms, with the logic of it being 'a motivator'?
I want to mention that this, in sport at least, isn't without some precedent. After the two World Wars and according to Wikipedia, Germany wasn't invited by the IOC in 1920 Games and 1948 Games (that were respectively hold in Antwerp and London cities). Japon wasn't invited to 1948 Games, too. AFAIK, this is because starting a full-scale war between two country = persona non grata in sport.
This is a really incredible whataboutism if I've ever seen one.
Yes, same with the World Cup qualifiers. Anyone who had any chance of playing Russia said they would refuse.
Yes. The intent isn’t directly to “motivate” but to apply real-world consequences. Nothing gets civilian attention faster than hits to their pocketbook and way of life. History has shown us that bad actors in government not only know this but prepare for it.
Do you really think so?
The Western view on annexation is kind of odd, on one hand it's bad, while on the other hand it's good, as seen in the annexation / invasion of pretty much most of the Palestinian territory by Israel, despite multiple human rights violations against innocent civilians, especially children, depriving them of their basic rights. Next they do is cry over Russia's annexation of Crimea as if they had enough right to have a say in the matter, quite understandable.
I'm surprised you didn't say anything on Stepan Bandera's national day, so glorifying a figure who was involved with Nazism, and who led an organization widely attributed with the massacre of jews, is a completely normal thing that can go unnoticed without any problem. This was done through the Ukrainian Parliament, and yet you say they have no involvement with Nazism. You might want to look up those photos showing multiple far-right organizations carrying Nazi symbols on flags in the Ukrainian Parliament when Euromaidan.No, the Euromaidan was not led by Nazis. The idea that Nazis have any sort of real political influence is a narrative common to pro-Russian propaganda. Meanwhile Putin sends actual neo-Nazi mercenaries from Wagner Group to fight in Ukraine. If Ukraine was secretly run by Nazis, why is the President the grandson of a Holocaust survivor?
According to such logic, the US would have already isolated itself from the rest of the world.
Yes, let's put everyone in the same boat, not only politicians, who are responsible for making the country's decisions, but also innocent civilians whose actions have had absolutely nothing to do with the current situation, couldn't be more logic. You just commented on racism in one of your previous posts, and now you think this is totally fine, that is straight up hypocrisy.
So.... you're not at all denying that Russian imperialism is the main cause for this war, so this entire "whatabout 'Murica" rant is unfounded. Do you not think that Ukraine should be allowed to choose its own future? As per Putin's own words, he doesn't believe that the Ukrainian state has any bearing to found itself on.
What exactly are you trying to accomplish here? You point out that Avakov was appointed in 2014, but fail to state that Zelenskyy was elected in 2019. Do you expect Zelenskyy to just up and fire people left and right and risk the entire regiment defecting?
