Research Scarlet & Violet Battle Mechanics Research

Does Mold Breaker have any interaction with Tera Shell? Both on regular Terapagos and if hacked onto a different Pokemon? Also curious how Tera Shell interacts when the user of the ability is Terastalized (since Tera normally prevents Type changes): does it normally change the user's type ala Legend Plate or simply hard code the interaction to 1/2x Damage for NVE?
 

DarkFE

Heal Bells ringing
is a Pokemon Researcher
Hi.

In the past, I know that trace has not worked on quark drive and protosynthesis in the same way that it doesn't trace abilities like disguise. However today I was playing a game and noticed that quark drive got traced. Is this something that changed in the dlc or that was always like this but implemented wrong; or a new bug that isn't supposed to work this way?
This seems like a simulator bug to me, though I could be missing something. Quark Drive is flagged as No Trace according to the Ability data dump posted by Anubis, and in-game footage can confirm that it does not get Traced whether the target be an Iron Crown or Iron Hands. I replicated your scenario in a Showdown replay here as well.

Does Mold Breaker have any interaction with Tera Shell? Both on regular Terapagos and if hacked onto a different Pokemon? Also curious how Tera Shell interacts when the user of the ability is Terastalized (since Tera normally prevents Type changes): does it normally change the user's type ala Legend Plate or simply hard code the interaction to 1/2x Damage for NVE?
Mold Breaker bypasses Tera Shell. Tera Shell doesn't work for Baby Terapagos or for non-Terapagos Pokemon. The Tera Shell behavior is currently incorrect on Showdown I believe, but there's a work in progress fix for it.

It's difficult to test Terastallized Tera Shell in-game, since the only Pokemon that it works with loses the Ability entirely upon activating Tera. Even if you modify Terapagos to have a non-Stellar Tera Type, it still enters its Stellar form upon Tera and gains Teraform Zero to overwrite Tera Shell.

Hope this helps.
 
I apologize if this has already been asked, but I am highly curious.

Is it possible to force a pokemon to be defensively Stellar-type? As far as I can tell it is considered a real type by the game, based on Stellar having unique offensive properties on Tera Blast and Tera Starstorm, so I would like to know what happens. Even if it is just neutrally affected by everything or if it crashes/softlocks the game because it doesn't know how to handle it or something.
 
I tried to search if it was discussed but couldn't find it, but do we know which form of Terapagos is used for calculating Beat Up's contribution damage?
- If Terapagos is not terastallized (Edit: and has not triggered Tera Shift yet), does it use the baby ATK or the Terastal ATK?
- If Terapagos was terastallized, does it use the baby form, Terastal, or Stellar ATK?
 
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I tried to search if it was discussed but couldn't find it, but do we know which form of Terapagos is used for calculating Beat Up's contribution damage?
- If Terapagos is not terastallized, does it use the baby ATK or the Terastal ATK?
- If Terapagos was terastallized, does it use the baby form, Terastal, or Stellar ATK?
Terastal form has nothing to do with Terastallization mechanically, it's just the regular form, it becomes Stellar form when Terastalized. Baby form is like Xerneas's all blue form, completely unusable in battle.
 
Terastal form has nothing to do with Terastallization mechanically, it's just the regular form, it becomes Stellar form when Terastalized. Baby form is like Xerneas's all blue form, completely unusable in battle.
Which is irrelevant to the thing he is actually asking: how does Beat Up treat Terapagos when its in the team.
If it hasn't entered battle yet, it hasn't transformed and should still be sitting in the team as that Normal form. It might otherwise be unusuable beyond Tera Shift, but it's still more in line with something like Minior or Zygarde than it is Xerneas, so it's worth seeing how Beat Up treats its 3 forms across the 2 scenarios.

Though I'd add an addendum to the first test with "has it entered battle yet"
 
Terastal form has nothing to do with Terastallization mechanically, it's just the regular form, it becomes Stellar form when Terastalized. Baby form is like Xerneas's all blue form, completely unusable in battle.
Have we confirmed it though? I understand what you mean, but unlike Xerneas-Neutral, it's the first time we have a "battle unusable" form where it has its own different stats. So if Terapagos is at the back (i.e. its Tera Shift ability has not fired yet), will Beat Up use the ATK of its current form (baby), or will it force Terapagos to Tera Shift at that point? (Maybe Tera Shift actually fires immediately when the battle starts even if it's benched?)
 

DarkFE

Heal Bells ringing
is a Pokemon Researcher
Hi.

Before I get to the replies, I tested something independently that was on my mind: If a Flying-type Terastallizes into the Stellar-type and then Roosts while damaged, it does not lose its Flying-type and thus retains its Ground-type immunity for the turn. This one is actually incorrect on Showdown at the moment, as shown in this replay. Additionally, Double-Shock does not remove the user's Electric-type if the user is Terastallized into Stellar, but this one is implemented properly on the simulator.


I apologize if this has already been asked, but I am highly curious.

Is it possible to force a pokemon to be defensively Stellar-type? As far as I can tell it is considered a real type by the game, based on Stellar having unique offensive properties on Tera Blast and Tera Starstorm, so I would like to know what happens. Even if it is just neutrally affected by everything or if it crashes/softlocks the game because it doesn't know how to handle it or something.
So far I've seen all of Reflect Type, Color Change, Protean, and Conversion fail to cause any defensive adoption of the Stellar-type in-game, so unless I'm forgetting something I don't think it's possible naturally. Always interested to hear any suggestions on that front, of course.

I won't pretend to be knowledgeable enough about the internal workings of Stellar itself to say if it's doable or not with external tools, though.

I tried to search if it was discussed but couldn't find it, but do we know which form of Terapagos is used for calculating Beat Up's contribution damage?
- If Terapagos is not terastallized (Edit: and has not triggered Tera Shift yet), does it use the baby ATK or the Terastal ATK?
- If Terapagos was terastallized, does it use the baby form, Terastal, or Stellar ATK?
Great question. It seems like no matter the current form of a Terapagos in the back of the party, Beat Up is using the Baby's base Attack.

You can see the testing in this footage. I chose Ambipom with Pick Up because of its lack of any STAB or other modifiers. Terapagos-Terastal and Terapagos-Stellar appeared to be giving damage rolls low enough that they could only be possible if the Baby form's base Attack stat was being used in Ambipom's Beat Up calculation.

Of course, it's very easy for human error to slip into tests like these with so many variables especially, and so I've included stats in the footage and always appreciate more eyes to double-check these things. I will update this post as soon as I can if I'm corrected.

No idea as of yet if this would differ for Doubles environments where both Terapagos and the Beat Up user are active, or maybe if it would differ if Terapagos itself was the one using Beat Up. I may check these alternative scenarios out late this month or early next month if nobody else feels like doing them first, but I'll be taking a short break for winter festivities.

Hope this helps.
 

Mario With Lasers

Self-proclaimed NERFED king
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
Hi.

Before I get to the replies, I tested something independently that was on my mind: If a Flying-type Terastallizes into the Stellar-type and then Roosts while damaged, it does not lose its Flying-type and thus retains its Ground-type immunity for the turn. This one is actually incorrect on Showdown at the moment, as shown in this replay. Additionally, Double-Shock does not remove the user's Electric-type if the user is Terastallized into Stellar, but this one is implemented properly on the simulator.
Just to be sure: if a pokemon Terastalizes into Flying and uses Roost, it doesn't lose its typing either, right?
 
So far I've seen all of Reflect Type, Color Change, Protean, and Conversion fail to cause any defensive adoption of the Stellar-type in-game, so unless I'm forgetting something I don't think it's possible naturally. Always interested to hear any suggestions on that front, of course.

I won't pretend to be knowledgeable enough about the internal workings of Stellar itself to say if it's doable or not with external tools, though.
Ah yeah, I wasn't expecting it to be possible naturally in-game, I'm pretty sure they would have made sure it's impossible by any method. I figured the only way to test it would be to hack it in somehow. Thank you for the response!
 
Great question. It seems like no matter the current form of a Terapagos in the back of the party, Beat Up is using the Baby's base Attack.

You can see the testing in this footage. I chose Ambipom with Pick Up because of its lack of any STAB or other modifiers. Terapagos-Terastal and Terapagos-Stellar appeared to be giving damage rolls low enough that they could only be possible if the Baby form's base Attack stat was being used in Ambipom's Beat Up calculation.

Of course, it's very easy for human error to slip into tests like these with so many variables especially, and so I've included stats in the footage and always appreciate more eyes to double-check these things. I will update this post as soon as I can if I'm corrected.

No idea as of yet if this would differ for Doubles environments where both Terapagos and the Beat Up user are active, or maybe if it would differ if Terapagos itself was the one using Beat Up. I may check these alternative scenarios out late this month or early next month if nobody else feels like doing them first, but I'll be taking a short break for winter festivities.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the initial testing! That's a bit surprising, but good to know. Do we know if this is the same behavior with Minior and Zygarde in previous generations?
 

DarkFE

Heal Bells ringing
is a Pokemon Researcher
Hi. Dropping in for a few replies.
Just to be sure: if a pokemon Terastalizes into Flying and uses Roost, it doesn't lose its typing either, right?
Yeah that's correct. I tested this here back when SV released and I've seen it happen in-game since the last patch too. Showdown does implement this one, and it even prints a hint in the battle chat.

Thanks for the initial testing! That's a bit surprising, but good to know. Do we know if this is the same behavior with Minior and Zygarde in previous generations?
It's a great question, and one that some friends on Discord were wondering about too. I did more digging and eventually found this post from Dawoblefet in the Sword and Shield iteration of this thread that I missed in my previous search. This confirms that my previous post's finding is consistent with last generation's Beat Up behavior, as apparently it always uses the base Attack of the form that a Pokemon started the battle in. The more you know.

Hope this helps.
 

DarkFE

Heal Bells ringing
is a Pokemon Researcher
Hi. Found a few minutes to do some light testing today.

It seems Air Balloon doesn't play its "(Pokemon) is floating in the air with its Air Balloon!" message when Tricked around anymore, with or without Magic Room present on the field. Showdown does still play this message when Tricking an Air Balloon in a Gen 9 format. I'm unsure when this would have been changed, but I hear it used to work differently. Very interesting.

Does Terapagos revert to its back to its baby form when fainting, and if so, what happens if it's revived by Revival Blessing? I'm trying to think of any possible way that 5 point increase in base HP could possibly impact things.
Great question that I hadn't even considered! Terapagos-Tera (the middle one after Tera Shift activates) doesn't revert to the Baby form when it faints, but Terapagos-Stellar (the one after Terastallizing) reverts all the way back to the Baby form when it faints. Relatedly, Ogerpon-Tera-Mask reverts to the regular Ogerpon-Mask when fainting, which isn't exactly surprising but was worth a check.

Hope this helps.
 
DLC2 story spoilers:
During the final Terapagos boss fight, it makes your Pokémon de-Tera and allows them to re-Tera, both of which I believe are unique to that fight, and it opens up some opportunities for certain curiosities, although I don’t think they have any relevance outside of maybe some niche interaction in some OM. If you somehow have a Tera-Stellar Pokémon during that fight, does it remember which types of attacks you’ve used if you Tera the same Pokémon twice? What if that Pokémon fainted between Teras? If you somehow have a Terapagos for that fight, is the opposing Terapagos able to de-Tera your own, and if it can, what forme does your Terapagos end up in?
 
DLC2 story spoilers:
During the final Terapagos boss fight, it makes your Pokémon de-Tera and allows them to re-Tera, both of which I believe are unique to that fight, and it opens up some opportunities for certain curiosities, although I don’t think they have any relevance outside of maybe some niche interaction in some OM. If you somehow have a Tera-Stellar Pokémon during that fight, does it remember which types of attacks you’ve used if you Tera the same Pokémon twice? What if that Pokémon fainted between Teras? If you somehow have a Terapagos for that fight, is the opposing Terapagos able to de-Tera your own, and if it can, what forme does your Terapagos end up in?
You can see the answers to these questions in this video (see description).
 
This is probably a stupid question, but given Malignant Chain's description, does anyone know if it affects Steel and Poison Types?:

"The user pours toxins into the target by wrapping them in a toxic, corrosive chain. This may also leave the target badly poisoned."

The only other time I recall Pokemon alluding to corrosion is in regards to the ability, which lets you poison steel and poison types. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but it's interesting they tacked that on.
 

DarkFE

Heal Bells ringing
is a Pokemon Researcher
Hi.
This is probably a stupid question, but given Malignant Chain's description, does anyone know if it affects Steel and Poison Types?:

"The user pours toxins into the target by wrapping them in a toxic, corrosive chain. This may also leave the target badly poisoned."

The only other time I recall Pokemon alluding to corrosion is in regards to the ability, which lets you poison steel and poison types. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but it's interesting they tacked that on.
Malignant Chain cannot affect Steel-type targets and seemingly cannot inflict Poison status on Poison-types. I believe the corrosive comment is something added in the English version of the text, so this is likely a case of flavorful translation rather than anything else.

Hope this helps.
 
How does Supreme Overlord and Last Respects work in Multi Battles? Does it only count if your own pokemon faints or does your ally player's pokemon count for it as well?
 
Was it ever explicitly confirmed whether the tera BP modifier for moves with 60 BP or below applies before or after Sharpness or other non-Technician boosting abilities? Basically wondering whether Kleavor's Tera Bug Fury Cutter is 60 or 90 BP. The calc says 60.

I'm not sure what other abilities this would be relevant to (and I really don't understand how the damage formula works) but maybe things like Sheer Force or Tough Claws? Mega Launcher has no relevant moves. Edit: oops yeah terrain pulse AztecCroc
 
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I posted this in the OU metagame thread a day ago and got told to repost here:


hi everyone. Unfotunately you cant see it in screenshot but i found this interaction interesting and i wanted to see if it was known or not? Showdown Halves the damage of a move when you are burnt. in turn 9 of this battle, I tera ground with excadrill and get burnt by flare blitz. Usually earthquake would be 50bp but its raised to 60 with tera. does cartridge work this way? i know showdown halves the power of a move when you are burnt, is that how it usually works or does cartridge halve your attack stat? thanks
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