Smogon Classic V Playoffs - Finals [Won by McMeghan]

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How many of us have actually "done [anything meaningful] for the game" anyway? Lavos hasn't done much, he's known primarily simply for being a good player of multiple generations and he's always been a bit of a pompous jerk about it to boot. He brought this on himself.
I would like to say that while not revolutionary he did a substantial amount of research and testing of in-game mechanics in GSC and ADV, which is more than most can say they've done. Not that it means much but he even won "Best Researcher" in the 2018 Smog Awards.
 
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If your coming from blunder's video to shittalk lavos's comment, just stop. We've had nearly 3 pages of people shit talking it in the last day, it was funny at first but it's just annoying now. Your not funny for quoting it with a 2 word reply. This thread is for smogon classic finals, not your "funny" one line comment that adds jack shit. If your trying to start a discussion about what he said or whatever go for it but replying unfunny shit just drags the thread and adds nothing.
 

trace

daishouri!
is a Tiering Contributor
If you're coming from blunder's video to shittalk lavos's comment, just stop. We've had nearly 3 pages of people shit talking it in the last day, it was funny at first but it's just annoying now. You're not funny for quoting it with a 2 word reply. This thread is for smogon classic finals, not your "funny" one line comment that adds jack shit. If you're trying to start a discussion about what he said or whatever go for it but replying unfunny shit just drags the thread and adds nothing.
FTFY
 
McMeghan VS Soulwind

Expecting a great series here. Mcmeghan holds a clear advantage in adv, and seems the more consistent G/S/C player, but Soulwind holds a clear advantage in DPP and is the best b/w player on smogon, though if anyone can take a set off Soulwind in B/W it would defs be McMeghan. I think this game falls down to R/B/Y, which I'de say falls slightly in Soulwind's favour. It is the weakest tier of both but Soulwind has showed a decent understanding of the tier and is a solid player. Only reason I don't favour either is B/W, If mcMeghan gets good team matchup in B/W he definitely knocks out Soulwind.
 

Zokuru

The Stall Lord
is a Tiering Contributor
McMeghan vs. Soulwind

BW - This should be the most interesting match of the series, McM and SW have opposite styles and they both play the tier at a really high level. Skill wise Soulwind is slightly above, but playstyle / matchup wise I think McMeghan will manage to get some way to abuse Soulwind's consistency and his teams sturdiness. Even.

DPP - McMeghan's least favorite tier out of the 5 iirc, I don't know how knowledgeable Soulwind is in DPP however he's a really good player, and McMeghan doesn't like the tier so Soulwind should get the W.

ADV - This is McMeghan's territory, tier knownledge and experience should get the job done.

GSC - Soulwind didn't make me excited about his GSC games, however, even if he misplay'd versus Lavos, McMeghan have some experience in the tier, and I'm sure he'll manage to pull of a clean game. So McMeghan should take the W.

RBY - McMeghan's showing in semis wasn't as good as we might have expected, however he managed to pull off a flawless endgame after some early inaccuracies, Soulwind plays the tier well too, if both players play at their best this is a game that can go either way, even.
 
Today I sat alone in the train listening to my obscure esoteric ritual ambient music, then two conventionally attractive females joined me in my solitude, they sat in front of me and started having a mundane conversation, it caught my interest how they kept talking and laughing about trivial normie topics instead of contemplating the true essence of life and searching for a purpose within. We make eye contact for a split second but I break it immediately as she carried on the conversation with her friend, she probably thought she made eye contact with a normal awkward nerdy guy listening to his music in peace but in reality she's beholding a man that is enduring the metaphysical struggle of his race, a man with an aristocratic and adventurous spirit that yearns for celestial freedom as his mind is experiencing levitation towards a complete transcendence despite only weighing 120 pounds. I indirectly gazed upon the females with an eye of revulsion, repulsed by their moral disintegration and degenerate lifestyle, then in complete and utter disgust I thought to myself "if only they knew how much of a wise Magian I am?" They would've given themselves to me, to fullfil my carnal desires, to plant my seed and give a chance to my offspring to exist and flourish. But of course they won't as I'm very sure they have decided to pursue this puny empty life, to have sex with the so-called CHAD. It truly is a difficult time for an intellectual like me to exist, it truly is the KALI YUGA.
 

McMeghan

Dreamcatcher
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I wanted to make a post where I would praise SoulWind but I remembered I already did that when we were paired in STour not long ago... Well, I'll add that there is no better feeling that being in the final against not only a good and long friend like him, but also a member of the only social channel (jerk as you'd call them) I frequent for years now. I'm happy we can keep enjoying ourselves and the game like we've been doing and win or lose now, the result will be satisfactory to me.


I'll predict the final as if I was an outsider for the hell of it:

RBY: edge to SW for displaying great consistency in the tier by making it to the final of the cup last year and then winning it, while I don't rly have results for myself there
GSC: edge to myself for good success in cups throughout the years, while SW hasnt shown much there
ADV: edge to myself as Cup winner + history in the tier
DPP: edge to SW, he has played some important SPL games there and also recently won one of those cash/amazon card tournament while I haven't done much here since pretty much the tier was in Tour rotation. I also have been doing poorly in the cups so far
BW: our flagship tier, probably slight edge to SW for being THE historial and consistent powerhouse of the gen in many settings

Ofc I fully trust myself to be able to beat anyone in any tier, and I'm looking to take this home, so I'm excited to play this final :)
 

Pearl

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A little uncharacteristic of me I guess, but I thought it'd be fun to do this for once, since both finalists are people who I immensely respect, both in and out of this game. These are my predictions for this series:

BW: Though it can be argued that SoulWind's (yes, I'm capitalizing the W) team choice in semifinals wasn't the wisest, as seen by the glaring weakness to tier staple Ferrothorn, he still managed to play one of the most breathtaking games of the whole tournament, taking ABR down in match that ultimately came down to two Gliscor and two Gastrodon chipping away at each other. On the other hand, McMeghan somehow keeps pulling wins out of his ass with the boys™, as he affectionately calls the 2012 rain throwback he's used against his last two opponents. Funnily enough, I feel that Scizor is a pretty solid call in the current BW metagame, and even though that is a story for another day, it correlates with my thoughts for this game, as sometimes I feel that in his teambuilder insanity and late "prep", McMeghan ends up stumbling upon some gems that not even the most seasoned veterans would be willing to whip out on the big stage. With that in mind, I feel like in spite of SoulWind's status as the undisputed GOAT of Black & White, there is a very high chance this ends up being the game that decides the whole tournament, and I believe that its outcome will depend heavily on what McMeghan finds himself picking. Playing wise, it is hard not to favor SW, and considering that there is also a chance of Ro handicapping himself with some bogus technology, I would say that SoulWind should take this most of the time, assuming he doesn't get caught off guard by Ditto or Xatu or worse: TyraniBOAH.

DPP: Heavily SoulWind favored, in my opinion. Trained by PokeSpain's fiercest behemoths, I can't help but feel like this man's prowess in this generation tends to fly under the radar most of the time, as seen both by his results in DPP when it was in Smogon Tour and his incredible tiebreaker games in SPL, and I would even risk saying that it is SW's second best generation, even if he's had more success in RBY throughout this tournament. Plus, and this is probably what makes him as scary as he is, SoulWind strikes me as somebody who knows what works and what doesn't on a very profound level, and he isn't a person who would miss out on a chance to Iron Head things till they faint in classic DPP fashion, or even use some nasty NidoClef stall build and run away with the game that way. Lead Gyarados aside, McMeghan doesn't really seem to me as if he has found his mojo in this realm. Last time Forretress and Celebi were good Pokemon, obi (do not mistake with the Snake Draft manager and jerk connoisseur) and Kevin Garrett were the best stall players (joking, I'm not knowledgeable enough about Pokemon history statements like this one, but you get the idea). It's not like being a cheesehead to a fault in this tier is a bad thing in itself, as showcased by players such as Void, but when it starts bordering on ridiculous extents, it just doesn't pan out very well.

ADV: Slightly McMeghan favored, assuming his Salamence can do more than 30% to a Celebi at +1. A motivated McMeghan is easily one of the best players of all time, and this translates onto what he can do in the teambuilder. Considering how much he likes the tier at the moment, as seen by his result in ADV cup, and even after the disaster that was his game last round, I'm a believer that he will bring a polished team that he is comfortable with and proceed to showcase his prowess in this generation. A very sinister thing about McMeghan in tiers that he has taken a liking to is that a lot of times he doesn't end up abiding by the metagame's rules (as silly as that sounds), and a lot of his preferred teams showcase this, such as Vaporeon + Steelix and that Porygon2 + Calm Mind spam squad that looks like it could be a 2010 Golden Sun team. With that said though, SW is no slouch in ADV either, and he can definitely give his opponent a run for his money, but my gut says that his more standard and humble approach is prone to getting dissected by Smogon's most successful crackhead in his comfort zone.

God Silver Crystal: Big edge to McMeghan in my opinion. In spite of having a bunch of hiccups that ultimately ended up costing him his GSC match last round, he still managed to bless us with one of the best games of the whole tournament, going toe to toe with the most successful GSC player in recent times and almost pulling it back after some misplayed sequences in the Cloyster Spikes war (plus, lets not forget just how powerful the early game showing was as well). While it is unfair to criticize SW's GSC prowess, considering how limited his opportunities to show it have been, I can't help but feel like both his team choices and his playing can be a little uninspired in high stake GSC matches. Unfortunately, I don't find my gen 2 knowledge to be good enough for me to say anything insightful, but in my eyes this should be a Ro win as long as he stays away from the Nascar Cow.

RBY: Even though RBY play tends to be the most formulatic out of any generation, and luck usually finds a way to decide the winner, McMeghan did end up slipping a little in his game vs. Lavos in my opinion, as he failed to properly manage PP on his Ice-type moves and provided way too many opportunities for his opponent to wake up his sleeping Chansey (which, by the way, slept for like 11 turns between both times it was hit by Sing on the first try). On the other hand, SoulWind's Peasounay-inspired approach to RBY has provided him with unparalleled consistency in this tier, to the point where he was comfortable enough to take his series against ABR to a game 5 in it, something that only madmen could ever dream of. With that in mind, predicting a winner in RBY when the gap in skill is so small is a daunting task, but I do believe that SoulWind should be favored to take this one a vast majority of the time on (mostly) even luck. I don't think I've ever seen that man misplay in a high stakes gen 1 game, and that goes a longer way than most people who aren't as familiar with RBY would believe.

However, a glaring issue with this RBY game is that both of these man have been contaminated by the "Lapras is good in contemporary RBY" virus that the Frenchman of RBY has artificially engineered in laboratory. If any of these two uses that Pokemon, I hope that they get lucked as hard as humanly possible. If both of them bring it, I hope that the game ends in a tie and they have to go through the torture that is being forced to play a 2nd RBY game in a Bo5 of Smogon Classic finals.

tl;dr SoulWind's favored (IMO) in RBY, DPP and BW, while McMeghan should take ADV and GSC. DPP and RBY could go either way (insert variance madhouse and luck memes here), while BW is pretty reliant on the team choices the players end up making. Would be swell to see this man finally earn the trophy he's been grinding hard for so long for, but McMeghan is a sweetheart and I could never possibly root against him. All in all, I hope that this ends up being a set for the history books where both players feel satisfied with their showing, even if the trophy can only go to one of them
 
No me había reído tanto desde hacía muchísimo tiempo. Enorme el mensaje de Lavos. Espero que regrese y siga posteando así, máquina, cruck, mostro. Pero no dejes que se te suba a la cabeza, tú a lo tuyo, postea y que la gente opine, ya lo decía Jorge Javier Vázquez "haced lo que queráis que yo haré lo que me salga de los huevos." Eres el puto amo, ya quisiera haber estado así con tu edad. Ahora soy mucho mejor que tú pero claro es que llevo jugando Pokémon competitivo 43 años desde la alpha que me venía con el Amstrad CPC, pero con tu edad no estaba yo así ni de coña, qué cambios, qué predicciones, qué fiftififtis.. Sigue practicando RBY, ADV, muévete con esos scarfrachi en DPPl, no te quemes por los freezes, usa Scald y punto, ponle a tus Pokémon Focus Band, está infravalorada y busca siempre los críticos mákina.
 

Finchinator

IT'S FINK DUMBASS
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BW: SoulWind (55) vs McMeghan (45) - Both have tendencies to use riskier teams in some important games, but SoulWind's proven to be the top BW player over the years and also has a bit of a 'standard' mode that I think gives him an edge. Yes, this is coming from me -- a guy who spams the living shit out of standard teams in BW. But I really think that one of the reasons why SoulWind suffers few 'surprise' losses in BW, which most other top players do suffer in their tiers, is because of how versatile he keeps himself in important games. He is not afraid to break out Rain offense or even some weird weatherless structures to make his sands a bit less hard to punish. I respect that a lot about his game and I think him being this complete coupled with the results he has as a player, which are second-to-none in BW, means that he is the favorite against anyone rn. McMeghan is not a slouch in BW at all and he has won so many important games in the tier over the years, making it really hard to heavily favor SoulWind here. I still think McMeghan has some sloppier tendencies -- he relies on some Pokemon that I view as not worth the team slot when compared to others, he sometimes forgets to use proper checks to relevant metagame presences (i.e: Keldeo), and he tries to go all-in on some really cool concepts, but they do not always pan out vs every team archetype, which could lead to some lopsided games. I still think that his playstyle makes it so that he can beat anyone on any given day given how good we all know he is at the game, but I still have to give the edge to SoulWind in a battle of two of my favorite BW players to watch.
DPP: SoulWind (60) vs McMeghan (40) - Idk, people say that SoulWind is a very strong DPP player and I take their word for it, but he never has truly stood out a ton to me. I think he is great because he is a great player, but I would not label him as a top DPP player. McMeghan, on the other hand, absolutely hates DPP, but he has played it well in SmogTour over the years and had mixed success in Classic if I recall correctly. I think that his disliking the tier impacts him more than a normal guy as McMeghan is pretty passionate when he is in his zone, but when things start to fall apart or go wrong you can see uncharacteristic performances. As much as I love him as a player, I think that his attitude towards DPP, while perhaps justified in a sense, may work against him here. SoulWind is not one to really hate-on metagames and is always able to adapt faster than most to different playing landscapes, which he has shown in his recent DPP success (he won global and some games in classic). I think both are worse here than BW, but the margin here is a bit more favorable for SoulWind just given what I have seen, but less sure here than the other tiers tbh.
ADV: SoulWind (40) vs McMeghan (60) - McMeghan is probably one of the top 3-5 historic ADVers in my eyes. He always puts up numbers in this tier when he plays it, SPL 7 aside. I think that a combination of his knowledge spanning back many years and his knack for thinking outside the box not only in the builder, but also when it comes to trying to position in the battle go a long way for him. ADV requires a bit more methodical approach than more directly punishing metagames like BW or RBY, especially against someone like SoulWind who is most likely to play a pretty conventional team as opposed to something more unorthodox. I think that McMeghan is favored here given his recent and historic success as well as his playstyle. SoulWind is fine in ADV and has done well there before, too, but his results are not nearly as impressive as McMeghan and I know nothing about his ability to build or understand the common concepts of the metagame, so I am hesitant to give him much more than a 40/60 shot.
GSC: SoulWind (35) vs McMeghan (65) - SoulWind has actually played a decent amount of GSC lately between the WCOP tiebreak and Classic. His results have not been great, but he is at least competent. McMeghan, on the other hand, I feel excels in GSC. Last game, a small mistake turned out to cost him a bit with the lack of Toxic in the Cloy mirror perhaps (or so some others have said -- I do not understand GSC fully and don't want to discredit anyone incorrectly). With that said, he has had a lot of good results in GSC Cup and other tournaments, so I think his advantage in experience and metagame knowledge is probably noteworthy. SoulWind isn't a pushover again, but I haven't seen him win much here either, so I favor McMeghan based on what I have seen.
RBY: SoulWind (55) vs McMeghan (45) - It's hard to give anyone a significant edge in RBY Bo1, but SoulWind has been so good in this tier that he has to at least be the favorite here. Both are great players and understand RBY, so it should be close and who knows what nonsense may decide it.

The thing is that while I favor SoulWind in 3 tiers (BW, DPP, and RBY), I also favor McMeghan more overall (45+40+60+65+45 = 255 for McMeghan whereas 55+60+40+35+55 = 245 for SoulWind). I really think this is neck-and-neck. McMeghan is a good friend and I would love to see him win another tournament and perhaps remain active moving forward, but SoulWind is the most deserving person for an individual trophy that currently lacks one. There is no real bad result here, for me at least. I hope for a good, tight series. GL both and congrats to everyone involved with the last few rounds of this tournament as there have been some very enjoyable series. I think this is probably one of my favorite playoffs in recent memory.
 
"Unfortunate" doesn't begin to describe my series, this game rewards blind luck and nothing else, I am beyond convinced at this point. After getting completely tooled by scheduling with my opponent changing times on me last minute and refusing to provide confirmation prior to the day of the match as to play times, losing this way somehow felt even worse than I had thought possible. My preparation was superior, my play was superior, and I lost, so I don't see a reason to continue engaging in an activity where what is within my control is overwhelmingly outweighed by what is not.

I am done with competitive Pokemon, and you won't get a fond farewell. This community is infected to its roots with a degenerative disease that grows stronger over time but stops short of killing its host. Tournaments used to have a competitive spirit at their heart, this has been transplanted and replaced with an artificial organ that feeds on vitriol and mockery from insecure little boys that heckle by the sidelines and tear each other to shreds over scraps of attention. The environment we fostered has trapped us all like this in a vicious cycle, and escaping it requires acceptance of the harshest reality we all scramble to explain away, that none of the countless straining efforts we put ourselves through here will ever amount to one single shining glimmer of significance. I would make this the end, but World Cup is still ongoing, and I would never leave so many great friends out to dry, so I'll suffer through a few more games for them.

One last thing before I leave you all to react with disdain, ridicule, and self-righteous fervor, before you do everything in your power to minimize my words and thoughts, box them up and shove them to some cobwebbed corner of your memory, and hope they disappear forever as a stain on your finite time ground to dust. From this moment on, nothing you say matters to me. The foulest insults you hurl with intent to wound will calmly settle at the earth before my feet, and the venom you spit will bring all the pain of a warm summer breeze. You are less than anything you can conceive, while I carry on, brimming with joy distilled from detachment.
LOL what is this the Princeton Columbine? Man I'd love to see the day when you take that gigantic stick shoved up your ass out and come down to earth with the rest of society..
 
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