Tournaments Smogon Premiere League IX: ORAS OU Discussion


SPL9 is now underway, and with it, lots of exciting ORAS matchups and interesting narratives. As with the other RoA discussion threads, this thread will be for detailing new innovations, interesting matches, trends, etc. I will be updating this thread with matchups, links to replays, and visuals as the weeks come!

ORAS Player Pool:

Tigers: Nintendi, p2, azogue, Eternal Spirit
Scooters: Mounts, FlamingVictini, njnp
Raiders: Gingy, TDK, BKC, -Tsunami-
BIGs: xray, John, Posho
Sharks: Axel, Lednah, Tricking, Nihillie
Wolfpack: Updated Kanto, ABR, Trosko, Rodriblutar
Cryos: CrashinBoomBang, Poek, aim, Sweepage
Tyrants: Get this Money, psychicmewtwo, z0mOG, Analytic, blunder
Ruiners: Hiye, Empo, jacob, Destiny Device
Classiest: Znain, Sabella, Blackoblivion

Condensed Power Rankings [link to full PR here]:

1. Nintendi (2.182) - Tigers
2. Axel (2.545) - Sharks
3. Mounts (2.727) - Scooters
4. CrashinBoomBang (2.909) - Cryonicles
5. Get this Money (5.500) - Tyrants
6. Hiye (5.636) - Ruiners
7. xray (6.455) - BIGs
8. Znain (7.000) - Classiest
9. Gingy (7.364) - Raiders
10. Updated Kanto (9.000) - Wolfpack

Week Matchup Index:
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is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon - This game happened earlier today and I'll try to break it down as best I can.

Teams Analysis:
CBB's most threatening Pokemon against Mounts appears to be Specs Keldeo because it kinda blows through the team after Tar Pursuit traps Latios by spamming Secret Sword/Focus Blast (depending on current situation Metagross can also bust through Mounts's team if Keldeo can get significant damage on Mega Scizor with Focus Blast or Hydro Pump. On the other hand, CBB also has to worry about the Keldeo on Mounts's end since the Amoonguss is physically defensive and thus can't reliably beat Keldeo, especially if it gets burned. Additional threats on either team include the Life Orb Tornadus on Mounts's team if he can Toxic Zapdos with Heatran. Curse Gastrodon can also potentially be very problematic if played correctly as it can just fuck up the team if CBB's Amoonguss gets compromised or heavily weakened somehow.

Game Summary:
CBB gets a key Toxic off on Mounts's Torn on the first turn, which makes it get chipped quicker throughout the rest of the game and is overall super detrimental for it and leaves Zapdos less pressured to check it in future turns. Then, Zapdos loses its Leftovers and as a result is significantly more pressured by a potential Toxic from Heatran and ends up heavily weakening Torn with Discharge, leaving it heavily pressured throughout the remainder of the game. After that, CBB got rocks up to further pressure Torn and more or less neutralize its Regenerator in conjunction with Poison. Then, Heatran gets up rocks to pressure Zapdos for Torn and Amoonguss for Gastrodon but unfortunately misses a Toxic that would've left Zapdos much more pressured in the early stages of the game. Then, various switches and healing occur until an Earthquake from Gastrodon forces CBB to sack Garchomp vs Keldeo, as Amoonguss can't switch into Keldeo after the damage its taken, especially with rocks up. Then, CBB pressures Mounts's Keldeo with his own and makes an aggressive double switch into Tyranitar and successfully removes Latios so that Mounts can no longer switch into Keldeo's Secret Sword/Focus Blast reliably in exchange for losing his rocks for the remainder of the game. Then, Mounts wins a speed tie vs CBB's Keldeo in order to weaken it into the range of being taken out by many of his other team members as CBB removes Mounts's Keldeo, which was huge since it was the biggest threat to CBB's team at the time. Then, Mounts gets his rocks back up and successfully Toxics CBB's Zapdos for Torn, which makes CBB have to play more carefully around it for the remainder of the game. Following this, CBB removes rocks as Mounts reveals that his Gastrodon is curse and thus can potentially win the game. Mounts uses Earthquake on the obvious switch into Amoonguss in order to pressure it and CBB correctly predicts the incoming Torn and doubles into his Zapdos, gaining an opportunity to heal for later in the game. Then, CBB and Mounts pivoted between Amoong/Zap and Torn/Gastro a bunch of times during which CBB continually pressured Torn by Sludge Bombing it with Amoonguss until CBB eventually brings in Metagross on a Mounts double switch and brings in Amoonguss on the predicted Mega Scizor. Then, some more pivoting and pressuring the Torn happens until CBB doubles into Keldeo on the predicted Mega Scizor and manages to KO it with double Focus Blast, basically sealing the game for Metagross/Amoonguss to win the game.

Game Analysis:
CBB played very aggressively and many very solid plays on his part ended up paying off. The combination of Garchomp poisoning Torn and doubling into Tar to trap Latios allowed him to heavily pressure Mounts's team with Keldeo/Amoonguss until eventually breaking through. Mounts missing the Toxic early on vs Zapdos was pivotal to not being able to pressure harder with Torn, and not playing more aggressively with Keldeo ended up losing him the game overall because CBB had multiple mons that basically won the game if a single member of his team got KOed following Keldeo falling.
meatgross smol form.png
Recap of Week 1 of SPL9 ORAS:
meatgross smol form.png

  • Dominance of Mega Metagross
    Week 1 of SPL9's ORAS matches saw Mega Metagross as the Mega of choice on 7/10 teams used--an interesting trend that we've been seeing in other officials like Smogon Tour (namely playoffs). Its dominance in SM OU brought light to how potent of a threat it could be, even without the buffs it received in the SM metagame---the most common answers present within ORAS, Mega Scizor and Rotom-W, both have obvious faults a Metagross user can take advantage of (for example, Magnezone can trap Scizor, and Rotom-W can be pressured quickly due to its reliance on Leftovers and Pain Split). In particular, Mega Metagross poses a massive threat to team archetypes reliant on Landorus-T to pivot into most physically-based threats, as it's able to dispose of it with Ice Punch and bypass Intimidate via Clear Body should Lando switchin on the turn it evolves. Players are often forced to resort to tactical pivotry maneuvers in an attempt to play around its fearsome combination of coverage, power, speed, and bulk should they lack definitive switchins like Mega Scizor. Ultimately, Mega Metagross embodies ideal qualities for a staple presence on bulky offense: it has very useful defensive utility through its Steel / Psychic typing and insane natural bulk---allowing it to check threats like Latios and Mega Diancie to a decent defensive capacity; it has the muscle and coverage to threaten common defensive backbones and the best Pokemon in the tier, Clefable; and it has sufficient speed to offensively check a multitude of threats. I expect to only see more Metagross from here on out.
  • Latios remains #1 Keldeo switchin by far
    Admittedly, there is far from sufficient data to say much, but I was surprised to see as much designation of the obligatory Keldeo switchin role to Latios. KeldTar is a very, very, very tried and true strategy and dismantles tons of bulky offense archetypes effectively---not only that, but it forces the opponent to opt for less-than-ideal middlegrounds to avoid suffering major losses. Despite this, Latios saw use as the sole switchin to Keldeo on 7/10 teams and had 8 total appearances (hiye brought an AV Tangrowth in addition to Latios, which alleviates the pressure usually placed on Latios). At the end of the day, ORAS Latios offers near unparalleled role compression, so this is no real surprise.

Week 1 Usage Stats

+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Latios             |    8 |  80.00% |  37.50% |
| 2    | Metagross          |    7 |  70.00% |  42.86% |
| 3    | Landorus-Therian   |    6 |  60.00% |  50.00% |
| 3    | Keldeo             |    6 |  60.00% |  33.33% |
| 5    | Heatran            |    5 |  50.00% |  20.00% |
| 6    | Clefable           |    4 |  40.00% |  75.00% |
| 7    | Tyranitar          |    2 |  20.00% | 100.00% |
| 7    | Garchomp           |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 7    | Zapdos             |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 7    | Scizor             |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 11   | Suicune            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Magnezone          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Diancie            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Volcarona          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Starmie            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Ferrothorn         |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Weavile            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Thundurus          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Amoonguss          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Rotom-Wash         |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Gengar             |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 11   | Hydreigon          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 11   | Alomomola          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 11   | Tornadus-Therian   |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 11   | Gastrodon          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 11   | Tangrowth          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
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I love the ORAS pool this year, some of the games were extremely tense and undecided until the last few turns.

To come back on CBB and I's game, I agree with LL's analysis on the reasons of my loss : I should have played more agressively with Keld, which was a huge threat to CBB's team as his Amoonguss seemed to be phys def. After the Toxic miss, my Heatran was the only thing which could beat the Zapdos/Amoonguss core but I played it rather poorly, SRing in front of the Zapdos being my biggest mistake of the game in my opinion. CBB played very smartly on key turns and his bold moves made it hard for me to make heavy predictions (as when he Discharged on Gastrodon turn 3).

Nintendi - Axel showed how powerful Volcarona is in ORAS, it has very few counters and is extremely threatening in a metagame where Talonflame tends to be less present. I loved Gingy's use of Gengar as well, it's a fantastic mon but hard to use given the huge presence of Pursuit in the tier. Latios is almost mandatory as its power and resistances enable it to check and threaten a lot of stuff at the same time so its usage is not a surprise.

I'm really looking forward to watching the games this week, again I love how stacked the pool is. Have fun everyone!
Week 2 Recap:

  • Mega Diversity
    Week 2 saw tons of interestingly varied Mega choices, ranging from borderline unseen megas like Sceptile, to niche options like Altaria, to usual ORAS staples like Scizor and Diancie. This is a clear departure from last week, where Metagross was used 7/10 times possible. Whether the player pool felt like Metagross would be overprepped for come week 2 or perhaps they felt other megas would serve them better is up in the air, but regardless, seeing things like Sceptile and Gallade get use in ORAS is a welcome breath of fresh air.
  • Additionally, week 2 saw usage of a few notable niche Pokemon outside of megas, which I'd like to highlight:
    • Jellicent: CBB opted to roll with Jellicent this week in his match vs. Nintendi---an interesting choice that worked well vs. the Starmie balance Nintendi brought. Alongside denying passive Starmie completely, Jellicent serves as a solid Keldeo switchin that can run Colbur + Wisp to workaround KeldTar builds. All things considered, Jellicent was a wise pick from CBB, as Nintendi decided to run the same build from week 1, which struggled immensely with Jellicent preventing spins.
    • Volcanion: Volcanion is one of ORAS' many threatening, lower usage breakers that pop up every now and then due to their ability to melt certain builds. Updated Kanto brought a Specs Volcanion in his week 2 game alongside Tyranitar sand, allowing him to remove Lati@s from play via Pursuit and then go to town with Volc (like KeldTar cores). Volcanion + Pursuit greatly threatens builds that rely mainly on Latios as their water resist, but also has the duality of bypassing Grass-type water resists like Amoonguss or Ferrothorn. Unfortunately for Kanto, Mounts brought a sturdy Water with accessible recovery, something Volcanion cannot reliably break. Had Mounts opted for a more generic bulky offense build with Rotom-W as the dedicated Excadrill/Talon check, Volcanion would have been able to muscle through everything once Latios was removed.
    • Crawdaunt: Crawdaunt is another lower-usage but threatening breaker that cropped up around 2016's OLT, mostly for its ability to break through a wide variety of stalls + being an overall solid holepuncher. Axel opted to use it alongside Mega Alakazam, Magnezone, and Torn-T, which can all provide support to it in a few different ways (Alakazam and its high speed threaten offense, which Crawdaunt will have trouble finding footing vs., Zone can trap Ferro, and Torn-T generates momentum via U-turn + switches into grasses like Amoonguss). Oddly enough, Axel did not even send out Crawdaunt in his match, likely because of the lack of true "fat" on the opposing side.
    • Klefki: While Klefki-centric builds are certainly less used now than in the past, its amazing typing in tandem with Prankster spikes end up proving useful to certain teams appreciative of its support. Znain brought it alongside anti-offense 'mons like Weavile, Talonflame, and Sceptile, which all appreciate the pressure Spikes places on their respective answers. Sadly, Axel brought Magnezone and Defog, which allowed him to trade his Latios for Znain's Klefki and remove the threat of spikes layers.

Week 2 Usage Stats

+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Landorus-Therian   |    9 |  90.00% |  44.44% |
| 2    | Keldeo             |    4 |  40.00% |  50.00% |
| 3    | Latios             |    3 |  30.00% |  66.67% |
| 3    | Heatran            |    3 |  30.00% |  33.33% |
| 3    | Starmie            |    3 |  30.00% |   0.00% |
| 6    | Tyranitar          |    2 |  20.00% | 100.00% |
| 6    | Amoonguss          |    2 |  20.00% | 100.00% |
| 6    | Talonflame         |    2 |  20.00% |   0.00% |
| 6    | Weavile            |    2 |  20.00% |   0.00% |
| 6    | Diancie            |    2 |  20.00% |   0.00% |
| 6    | Ferrothorn         |    2 |  20.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Alakazam           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Crawdaunt          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Magnezone          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Tornadus-Therian   |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Medicham           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Garchomp           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Skarmory           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Alomomola          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Gallade            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Jirachi            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Tangrowth          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Excadrill          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Scizor             |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Volcanion          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Hydreigon          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Jellicent          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Metagross          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 12   | Sceptile           |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Klefki             |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Altaria            |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Mew                |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Rotom-Wash         |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Kyurem-Black       |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Slowbro            |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Thundurus          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 12   | Volcarona          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
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Updated Kanto

Banned deucer.
I believe Volcanion is fairy underrated, as it hits hard with Steam Eruption and also allows for possible burns to break through or 2hko certain mons, for example If I had gotten a burn on Mount's slowbro it would have no longer been a switch in and he would have had to rely on letting mons like latios and keldeo take extremely heavy hits which would put him in an awful position as killing latios would mean he'd have to sack another mon to sleep and getting rid of keldeo makes it easier for me to sweep the late game with mega scizor as knock off + pursuit ttar would have been able to slowly whittle down heatran.

I was really impressed with CBB's performance yet again, in regards to using his hydreigon he could have easily spammed dark pulse and whittle things over time but he decided to just go in and fire blast the ferrothorn which really helped shift momentum in his favor and limited ferro's usefulness vs a team with no hazard removal / leech switch ins. Xray has also been on fire, his team choices have been really interesting and he's been playing pretty good making him someone I'm definitely looking to face. I also think it's really interesting that TDK is now ORASing instead of Gingy as its made the pool that much more stacked (if he remains in ORAS). No offense to Gingy, he's a solid player as seen from his aggressive plays in both games he's played but if I had to rank them TDK would be above Gingy.


is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Yo, feel like rambling about ORAS a bit now that my game is done, feel like I got to talk about and comment on it as it stands now.

First of all, Jellicent isn't a niche Pokemon I feel. It counters Keldeo, Suicune (you just barely win the PP war if you play smart), and it's a great check to tons of offensive Pokemon, with Mega Heracross having to click Rock Blast, Medicham having to click Zen/TPunch (or really anything other than HJK which is just as good), Metagross having to click Zen/TPunch, lest you risk losing momentum because Jellicent is in and immediately threatens something. Not a sitting duck either with Taunt/Wisp and Hex/Scald and just enough speed to get the jump on stuff like Clefable. My 3 most used Pokemon this SPL so far are Metagross, Keldeo, and Jellicent, and all for good reason; they're all really, really good in my opinion. I'd rate it up there with Zapdos/Amoonguss in A- material, if not higher, because it really is that splashable and usable. Hope I'll see more of it this SPL!

Keldeo is broken. Yes, I really think that. While Jellicent is one of the few reliable Pursuit + Keldeo answers, there really isn't much else; even stuff like SpDef Amoonguss/Gastrodon is just gonna lose in the long run to a well played Keldeo + TTar/Weavile/Metagross every time. I used to think Metagross was the problem, because it's kinda hard to deal with on an offensive team, but all of those are really just enablers for the Pokemon that beats everything, but only with Pursuit. Not like anything else close to emulates anything Keldeo does even close to its effectiveness, so yeah, the problem is Keldeo and not Pursuit or whatever. It's just an absurd Pokemon, and I feel like it needs adressing in the future.

Not sure why Lando-T or Latios have anywhere near the usage they do; Scarf Lando is pretty cool to give you a good lead/switchin vs stuff like Medicham or Lopunny, but defensive Landorus is really, really bad (probably the wrong word, but I don't wanna spam "overrated") right now. It checks nothing relevant, and really does not much of use I feel. People need to stop using this Pokemon lol. Latios is even worse, on paper it checks half the metagame, but in practice you realize that the best thing Latios does is make your team appear good against Keldeo until you inevitably die to Pursuit and lose on the spot. Awful Pokemon, glad I went 3-0 without using it once so far, way more niche than people make it out to be imo.

Hope Updated Kanto wins this week so we can have a game for 4-0 just before midseason, good luck man! Games I wanna see this season are Axel/Mounts and Axel/Nintendi in particular, but I also wanna catch Updated Kanto/xray games if at all possible because they've definitey proven to be sleeper picks so far. Really stacked season, have fun everyone!
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Going to do a recap for week 3 soon, but for now, here's usage stats for week 3:

Week 3 Usage Stats

+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Landorus-Therian   |    5 |  50.00% |  40.00% |
| 2    | Metagross          |    4 |  40.00% |  50.00% |
| 2    | Ferrothorn         |    4 |  40.00% |  25.00% |
| 2    | Tornadus-Therian   |    4 |  40.00% |  25.00% |
| 5    | Scizor             |    3 |  30.00% |  66.67% |
| 5    | Suicune            |    3 |  30.00% |  66.67% |
| 5    | Latios             |    3 |  30.00% |  66.67% |
| 5    | Keldeo             |    3 |  30.00% |  66.67% |
| 5    | Clefable           |    3 |  30.00% |  33.33% |
| 5    | Heatran            |    3 |  30.00% |  33.33% |
| 11   | Zapdos             |    2 |  20.00% | 100.00% |
| 11   | Amoonguss          |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 11   | Gliscor            |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 11   | Slowbro            |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 11   | Magnezone          |    2 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 16   | Latias             |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Azumarill          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Politoed           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Kingdra            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Swampert           |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Jellicent          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Hippowdon          |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Weavile            |    1 |  10.00% | 100.00% |
| 16   | Kyurem-Black       |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Mew                |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Excadrill          |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Starmie            |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Pinsir             |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Medicham           |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |
| 16   | Garchomp           |    1 |  10.00% |   0.00% |

Hiye vs. xray

Nintendi vs. Get this Money

Poek vs. Znain

Nihilillie vs. Mounts

Updated Kanto vs. TDK
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the bobby fischer of pokemon
is a Tiering Contributoris the Smogon Tour Season 25 Champion
yo yo, been wanting to make a post like this for a while since there seems to be a resurgence in interest of oras ou (myself included) so i just wanted to talk about some games i liked and some teams/meta trends ive been keeping up with in the meta. i guess this is just a place to throw down some thoughts but i didn't wanna make a video on it, I figured a post would be better. im not trying to analyze each game very in depth so i apologize if any of what i wrote comes off as "wow this was very interesting to me," honestly just wanna get some discussion poppin since theres no oras thread or anything like that so please leave some thoughts / opinions as well.

znain vs gtm from week 1, a replay i really liked watching at the time. gtm's team is pretty similar to what you'd see in spl currently, in fact i used a very similar team twice and i believe he reused almost the same but had amoongus over latios or smth. anyways, i liked this replay because znain brought a pretty old looking oras team featuring thundurus but he played really well and it also did a lot of work, but mainly i wanted to highlight how i do not think builds like znains are optimal anymore. they follow the old oras core of sciz clef keld latios for tanking everything but nowadays with the insane usage of metagross (pursuit) + specs keldeo i feel like teams like this just cant keep up anymore. they definitely ran the meta at one point like back in spl7 i only spammed these types of builds but now with shit like hydreigon on the rise and people using real breakers its getting tough to get away with teams like this. game was good though and it was a v dominating win by znain, i feel like this is the first game that really highlighted how hard it is to take on pursuit + specs keldeo since once the latios got trapped, the keld was taking lives left and right.

liked the uniqueness in teams from this battle a lot. the battle itself was cool but id be lying if i didnt say axel10 outplayed 10 turns straight and sealed the game that fast. still it was cool to see shit like megazam + crawdaunt and offensive sd talon + mega sceptile on both teams. i think mega sceptile is definitely decent depending on how u wanna play your focus blast luck lol but now that most clefs opt for a bold 252/252 spread, its really tough for teams to switch into leaf storm unless you got a av tang or something like that. i think talonflame running an offensive set is a really weak meta pick but i think wisp sd is def underexplored and ill talk about that later when i get to kanto vs tdk later on in the season.

was a huge fan of xrays team here, gtms was cosines old flagship from like 2015 which he brought to stour finals and won with. xrays i was a big fan of because it ran untraditional breakers like gallade as well as specs latios (which i guess isn't super uncommon but is definitely something I feel like people dont opt for as much anymore thanks to the rise in metagross.) nonetheless i was very impressed with this game as xray picked up momentum fast and even gallade was able to do a decent amount of work vs a team of diancie / lando / talon which was cool. this battle actually made me have second thoughts about av tang in oras as im usually a huge tang hater and still am since that thing cannot beat keldeo with sr up which is so frustrating for a grass type and makes me wanna never stray from amoonguss, but knock off as well as the ability to tank shit like non specs latios etc is really nice imo. anyways i liked that xray was able to utilize the old looking build of fat jira offense and get a dominating win off it.

very cool team by kanto here using specs volcanion, abr tested this team vs me a few times and beat my ass and i was pretty unsure at preview when i saw this team since it had sand rush drill + tar which is a core i really hate... BUT i think most can agree that sand rush drill is one of the few consistent methods of hazard removal which is really strong on a team like kantos. the game itself was a little sloppy but this team was refreshing and imo brought a resurgence in scarf tar who made many more appearances in the following weeks. i also liked the way this team played around keldeo as with amoonguss + volcanion it becomes very hard to pick the right move each time since if you scald into volcanion while attempting to burn amoongus you're forced to pick something to switch into specs steam eruption and more often than not peoples backup water resist is a grass type or latios, the first which gets owned by fire move and the latter which is getting owned by sciz/scarftar, anyways awesome team and good playin from kanto

I GOTTA TALK ABOUT THIS GAME!!!! the game itself was obv a blast for me to see since cbb had a dominating win but really i just liked his team a lot. i was a huge jellicent hater when i first saw this team but thats because i didn't want people finding measures to take on broken keldeo. anyways i love cbbs team here and i used it last two weeks in oras because i am so confident in its ability to take on most matchups in oras. in my experience the only real nuisance is running into fat gliscor spikes since the team lacks defog + a reliable way of taking on gliscor as nothing besides keldeo can ohko it which is really fucked since once sr goes up, gliscor fat is usually going to win. anyways, this was the intro to jelli in the tier which i love since it can take on keld/clef but honestly i don't gotta explain that too much, people know its qualities of what makes it so good in oras. although even with colbur this thing barely beats pursuit + keld lmao since tar just stone edges for like 75 and then u literally get trapped if they double on you which sucks, but on the bright side you do deal with weavile which i like. anyways yeah this team is probably my favorite oras team in the last 2 years since it fits my playstyle and is just a really nice bulky offense team.

love mounts team here, honestly the game itself is pretty decent despite the unfortunate hjk miss which basically lost mounts a game that he should have 100% won. anyways this game is basically what made me start liking gliscor again as even vs ice punch metagross + weavile + keld, gliscor was able to remain such a huge threat to where tdk was scared to switch into it. this game is what made me hate medicham though, honestly look back at oras games this season and look at medichams hjk hit rate, its stupid low, it missed in so many games starting with hiye vs gingy earlier this season, obv that sounds like superstition but im so tired of relying on this mon nowadays when you can run metagross for similar results + defensive utility. oh this game also highlights why i think zapdos sucks in oras, oh my god shit loses to every sr mon besides ferrothorn and gets trapped by weavile + tar and takes sr weakness smh this mon is so bad when it plays a defensive role and i seriously feel like its 5v6 when someone brings this. that being said i believe offensive 3 atk zapdos has utility in oras - first time i saw this was shake vs livio in wcop but damn if you look at both teams it really has the ability to be annoying.

this was a nice bulky off vs bulky off game this spl that i feel went under the radar a little. both played really well and it was a strong 90 turn game that in the beginning i was sure kanto was going to win but nintendi really switched the initiative courtesy of broken gliscor. i really liked both teams here and it was funny to see double slowbro which is cool since thats one of the few mons that is able to decently take on meta + keld. anyways awesome game that really highlighted how important being patient is and both played great.

nintendi's team here is my favorite oras team currently alongside cbbs hydreigon team. i really really love this team and used it myself week 6 vs ricardo. nintendi had protect tran which i really liked since its always super hard to fit tect on tran, but when you can it always does so much more work since you rack up toxic damage, scout pursuits from cb tar, and it also comes in handy vs shit like medicham as we saw here since nintendi was able to play big mindgames with his tran to damage the drill. this game also sort of inspired me to start playing more aggressive with balance teams as nintendi made some big ass plays in the first few turns especially turn 1 which let him instantly get gliscors toxic orb poppin and thus he never had to give af about torn again. weavile in the back to pursuit trap medicham and then the best part of this team is that literally no clef can beat a team consisting of gliscor + amoongus + heatran + sciz. anyways awesome team really love this one. as for the battle itself this one was pretty dominating but ye

a diff take on jellicent, this time using it on a bulkier spikes focused team which i thought was very cool. in fact i debated on bringing kantos team vs cbb week 8 but realized it wasn't the style i wanted. nevertheless i really like this team and it reminds me heavily of omfugas old olt 3 build which was defensive lando-t / lopp / twave spin starmie / spikes ferro / cb tar / cm flame clef. this team def seemed like a more updated version of that by utilizing sd gliscor + pursuit which is such a hard combo to deal with and kanto made some really great plays this game which cemented him the win. again, this game highlights why i absolutely hate zapdos as this thing is so bad at getting rid of hazards without gettin punished. anyways big turns here was turn 25 when kanto put up sr on keldeo which was a savage play that ended up working out and then turn 36 when he won the weavile mindgame which let jelli 6-0. anyways cool game that highlights how annoying jellicent + ferrothorn can be to some teams, especially with people forgoing hammer arm on metagross recently in favor of eq.

this is the game that made me so scared of volc since on paper empos team is just basic good shit, clef meta keld etc and yet znain just had to play patient enough to get his volc in at the right time and just end the game. imo volc should always run qd fire blast / buzz / hp ground since its very easy to chip keldeo and the only other thing you need drain for is jelli and gastro, the first which gets trapped by ttar, and the second which is gonna lose to buzz anyways. anyways znains team is cool as hell and reminds me heavily of mencemeats old flagship which i spammed a lot in tour which was cbtar/talon/lando/starmie/sciz/serp. anyways i dont have much to say for the game since volc btfod this team but damn is volc scary.

2 retro lookin builds, especially axel10s which i swear i used to farm wins in smogon tour spring season 2016. xray really dominated in the first 10 turns and basically won himself the game p quickly. again pursuit + keldeo shows just how risky it is to run something like latios as your main water resist and xray is able to come up with keldeo and win the game.

damn this game was pretty weird honestly, but wanted to highlight it since it's the only stall that was used in oras this spl i believe. i think stalls terrible w/o dug and i'd rather just use a balance w win con sd sciz/gliscor similar to the GOAT team nintendi created. hiye def got the luckier end of the stick here with ttars 200% crunch defense drop + zard y but regardless this game was gonna be tough for xray once hiye got the chansey trap right and hiye def played patient enough to get the chances he wanted and the crunch defense drops just expedited the process. stall without trapping is really weak imo and the lack of weavile/tar on xrays team hurt him more than it helped. p curious to see what people think of in this coming tour season since there is definitely going to be some attempts at oras stall.

two very creative teams, especially kantos so i wanted to highlight this game. this game showed how annoying gliscor can b with taunt although sd ice fang or something similar would have had the same effect late game, but taunt came in handy for destroying skarm + clef and basically made tdk lose from early on. i believe the talonflame on this team is also phys def which lets it wall cb weavile which is really really cool for a balance that lacks sciz. i think sr drill sucks but i guess he needs hazard removal with such a spikes weak balance + talonflame so it makes sense that its on here.

liked both teams a good amount here, especially poeks that team is hella aesthetically pleasing. this team made use of subtoxic volcanion which i think is a very strong pick since volcanion forces out a lot of shit and can sub up on annoying mons like sr clef and then punish switchins like jellicent or keldeo or whatever, with scarftar in the back to get rid of latios. this game also featured the worlds bulkiest zard x which i definitely wanna know more about so Hiye i'd appreciate if you could tell me why you picked that specific set for this battle. i really do not like zard x as of late but i have always liked wisp roost, i just haven't ever seen non max speed so curious to know what this walls and your experiences with it. feel like at preview poek should have really owned this matchup but hiye def made some aggresive plays and picked up an early advantage but once gliscor was able to heal it was a wrap, cool game altogether.

cool team by kanto since it features some mons i have not seen in a while, specifically mega gyara and scarf magnezone. i talked with abr recently about cool stuff he likes in oras and he was telling me about how scarf magnezone is a strong pick since it's able to get guranteed chip on metagross which is hella nice. cm psyshock clef was a cool pick here and basically saved his ass vs suicune, although i assume shock was for opposing clef or smth? anyways the gyara on this team is like max hp max speed and man that shit takes no damage, i was playing vs abr and unevolved gyara took 22 from clef moonblast so this is definitely something i think is viable, it just sucks since its mono attack gyara and also bc gyara is weak as hell w no invest. anyways battle wise kanto outplayed to hell n back and sealed this shit even w/ hax, really nicely played game.

the team from nintendi has been around for like 2 years as the classic keld + medi/meta + torn rotom voltturn shit and at one point this style was soooo good.... UNTIL U RUN INTO THE ONE ROOST ZARD X. seriously my one fear with teams like this is running into volc or zard x and lo and behold this man had to run into the one dd roost zard x. i know cbb was thinking about using zard x vs me and i think it's a strong pick in the current meta IF you play patient enough, feel like often times people just throw out flare blitz with zard since its strong enough to do some decent breaking but then its at like 45 and it just gets sacked to get off 60-70% and doesn't really play the role of sweeper which is what people are looking for with this mon.

mounts w classic monoblue ho from 2015 featuring latios azumarill and thundurus and helm chomp damn what a throwback. anyways i think this was like the second bisharp used? bish has always been a strong pick in oras and mounts couldn't have come up on a better matchup for it. bd azu in the back too which is a mon i really like currently as its hard to prep for lategame and all traditional answers get rocked after some sr chip.

alright this game itself was pretty ass espec after turn 1 which basically sealed xrays chances since if he got up sr, skarm is getting trapped by mag, if he knocks kyurem is know walled, and if he twaves kyurem is now walled so the turn 1 really fucked him up. i liked kantos team a lot at preview since it looks creative af but after lookin at it for a few mins i realized it loses to so much, like vinccune, sd sciz, magnezone medi etc and i just really dont think dual steel is that strong of a core in current meta. xrays team was def a bit interesting since he had his fat set up mons and then late game broken bisharp but unfortunately for him his slowbro couldn't do it since skarm had tech tox altho it shoulda been trapped :{|}

hiyes team is a way nicer team to support kyurem imo, double uturn core + shit like serp as a late game win con. i have started to like starmie less and less lately as a spinner but it fits here and somehow also finessed a 1v1 vs weavile. sorry im gettin tired now so not much to write about this, just really like hiyes team.

apologies bc i know some of this became rambling, but honestly like i said i just wanna see some oras discussion lemme know what you think and please if you have any opinions at all post!!! thanks for reading


Heating Up
is a Tiering Contributoris a Past WCoP Champion
up and bored as hell so i will share my thoughts on the teams blunder posted here that i had a hand in making


This was the team znain used vs empo. Admittedly this team was deffinately inspired by jams old team with some edits for the current meta. The thought process behind this team was that since now everyone thinks talon is bad volcarona should totally have more chances to set up and sweep bc its not getting hard walled anymore. Scarf lando is generally the top scarfer in oras ou and at plus 1 fire blast ohkos so it made for a very anti meta pick because of how little people are preparing for it. The set on volc was fire blast giga and hp ground. I decided to forgoe buzz bc i only missed on hitting tar and latis and i paired it with scarf tar so that lati could be trapped. The rest of the team is pretty standard helmet lando colbur starmie and the sciz is sd superpower with a bit of speed so that we could counter other sd scizors and also surprise tran and zone on switch ins. The breloom is also a bit odd because it is lansat berry. Before znains game i had been testing this team with star for like 5-6 gives and he kept bring amoongus clef and i had such a hard time breaking through those builds so i threw on lansat berry so that loom could come in on waters and lure in the grass then at plus 2 blow it back. This team isnt perfect and probably a bit keld weak but i think it really opened up a few peoples eye to how fucking strong volc is right now and how with one quiver dance the pace of a game can completely change.

This team was a team xray and I worked on together. I think we both had similar teams sitting in our builder at the time when i used this in a friendly vs him but it was another team that i modeled after an old build. During this past wcop obii had given me a very similar team to use and i believe it had keld > bish, AV zone > scarf and specs > scarf lati. The current version had scarf lati and zone with set up bro, set up glisc rocks clefs and set up bisharp. The concept behind the team was to trap ferro/skarm anything tht can wear down slowbro or wall gliscor so that they can sweep after the counters are trapped. Bisharp is there as a late game dangerous sweeper as well and good mon that alot of people forget to prepare for. I believe xray went with dark glasses vs kanto to avoid the life orb damage, on my version i think i went with lum berry. All in all i think this team had a pretty good matchup for xray cuz his opp was weak as hell to clef and zone but he froze turn 1 and it set him back as hell. This team again isnt another perfect one as its a bit on the slower side and its immediate power is bit lacking but overall its gonna leave with chances to win because of all the set up mons there is.

Screenshot (37).png

I had a few other teams that i made for spl this year but this i think was my favorite one to build and use in tests/practice. Its a pretty standard looking team but I think everything on the team has a purpose because each mons moves support something else on the team. The concept of the team is trying to have suicune pull off sweeps and having azu, gross and zone break through/trap the counters. Zone is to trap ferro for cune and skarm for gross since the gross set was mash zen ice punch and pursuit. Pursuit was also to support cune so that breakers like medicham can be trapped as well as roost lati which would otherwise wall suicune. Azu applies extra pressure to weaken and knock off things like tangrowths av, amoonguss and ferros leftovers as well as being a decent bulky breaker. Scarf Latias was the last mon to give gross/cune another set up chance late game and thats pretty much it. I didnt find myself having any glaring weaknesses and with solid play this team should be able to win most games.

Sorry for the rambling i had alot of fun building oras this spl so i wanted to share the teams i like and why i liked em. All in all looking at alot of the oras teams this spl i like the current meta alot. I enjoy the fact tht spikes are way more viable these days, i think volcarona will be on the rise more and more, and i think even though gross keld is broken as shit we can find new ways to counter it (which is why we see such a rise in jellicent). Another poke that has been on the rise that i think is really good is gliscor. Ive been seeing alot of sd and taunt gliscor both sets being super dangerous. Hazard based teams are where gliscors seems really at home forcing teams to shuffle around their mons with rocks plus a layer of spikes is super annoying and when u can taunt incoming removers it becomes even more difficult to deal with. Sd being equally as dangerous because it just shreds fat builds without a strong water or ice move. Last week i even made something with znain using sd pass on gliscor to pass sd boosts to metagross. This is another decent strategy that can work if executed properly. Here is what that team looked like. I had fun talking about this hope theres more to come good luck everyone.

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